zonkednb
zonkednb
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@cogsturning said:
More of Hillbilly, Deathslinger, Pyramidhead, Vecna, Demogorgon. So basically the same as your last results.
Less Legion. Had three in a row recently and wanted to die. Absolutely the most obnoxious killer in the game. I actually don't see that much of Ghoul. Unsurprisingly, the killer I'd currently like to see less of is Jason. I haven't played survivor in almost 2 weeks, the longest I've ever stopped playing the role since switching over from being a killer-only player, because of him. If every killer is like this going forward and that's all I see I won't be seeing any killers but the ones I play because survivor will be about dead for me.
Those three legions in a row completely flipped my perspective on Legion. I was a friend to all Legions, now I roll my eyes whenever I hear their admittedly catchy TR.
Right now, I wanna see less dash Myers. Had a fair few recently and seeing him come screaming around a rock at 500mph, shredding every pallet and never being out of power is boring. Every chase feels like slowly being zoned by break after break until you have to take the OHKO. Not OP, just dull.I'd like to see less Plague in the event too. It's kinda boring having the event essentially be shut down, and Plague with an anti-loop power (poison throw) is brutal when you're one-shot the whole game. Plus, teammates in the event love to instacleanse. So much red puke.
As for who I wanna see more? Demo and Henry have been rare lately and I enjoy both of them. Huntress would be nice (no Iri head) and I'm always down for a Billy game. -
@ArkInk said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4097878#Comment_4097878
Why is Jason so strong as a 115% ranged killer? Clearly the game is killer sided!
Why is Cross Examination so powerful despite being free in loop? Clearly the game is survivor sided!
Wait they nerfed Cross Examination and now it sucks? The game was actually killer sided the whole time!!
Hold the phone, Jason's perks also suck? Well the devs must've really been survivor sided and throwing us off the scent!
Totem builds are in and Jason is great at defending them? The devs must have timed this to torment survivors! The event gives many powerful effects to survivors whilst hardly giving the killer anything? You just know this was the devs sending us killer mains a message.
Everything is evidence of a vendetta. Every change is made with malicious intent. The devs are nefariously scheming about how to make your matches worse this very second. This legitimately feels like the attitude of half the people here.
This was so gratifying to read.
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If I don't have a game plan in mind, then my default is Deja/Lithe/Plot Twist with one random perk that I swap out.
However, I prefer bringing specialist builds and making my objective using them. Taking Empathic Connection/Autodiadact/Lend a Hand makes healing feel more active, and the aura from EC helps guide solo queue teammates to me for heals, when they want them, instead of me chasing them around with Empathy for 45 seconds until the realise what I want. -
@Domicci said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4097699#Comment_4097699
The problem still stands whos fun are you bashing this off or is it just in general because again the survivors woukd have to much input being 4 times the number of killers. You need to balance around both fun and data because somthing can be fun and not good or not fun and bad.
I agree! I'm not saying don't consider the data, I'm saying don't claim that because a killer is at exactly 60% KR that we should never look at them. I'm not saying pure democracy because yes, it's a four-to-one imbalance. Consider input from both sides, consider the expected skill expression from both sides, and work to balance these as much as possible.
Say a killer is a 4/10 on the fun scale to face, but 9/10 to play. The game would be better if it was 7/10 on both sides. It's never going to be a perfect science, but if we don't ever make adjustments with fun in mind, the game will have annoyances, frustrations and unhealthy things forever. -
@Domicci said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4097685#Comment_4097685
The only problem i have with this hot take is whos fun do you use to balance for. Sense if you pick the majority then killers fun no longer matter sense they make up so few of the players only needing 20% of players to be killers.
Both sides need accounting for. The main issue is people knowing a killer is fun from one side, so being resistant to change that might make it a bit less fun for one, but overall more fun for both. People also presume any change that considers the fun for one side is some kind of automatic proof that the 'other' side is getting coddled and preferential treatment.
Ghoul is the posterboy for this. Ghoul isn't OP, so people calling for change get a lot of resistance from the camp that claim because he is relatively balanced, he shouldn't ever be touched again.
I get that there's a degree of mistrust in the community over how an unfun killer should be handled. I know enough about the Skull Merchant saga to sympathise, but we can't just not allow changes to a high-tier-but-balanced killer just because it has gone badly before. A killer being balanced purely by strength is not automatically in a good place.
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Fun is an important consideration when balancing the game.
People forget we're balancing a game, not a spreadsheet.
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I am in the pit of bad mindset for killer right now. I seem to have gotten it into my head that it's not something I can play to unwind, and with work killing me lately, the heatwave keeping me from any kind of consistent sleep and the attitudes of people in the game being worse than usual, that's kind of nailed on.
My killer gameplay lately has been loading up my killers, getting some cakes onto a couple that I played regularly, staring at my loadout for a few minutes, then deciding to go play survivor. I've been on a massive losing streak on survivor too, but at least I don't get stressed out there.
Every logical part of me knows this is a dumb ritual. It's just a game. It doesn't impact my life. I play anon mode anyway, so if I embarrass myself it's not like the survivor players are going to show up to my place of work and bag me from the car park IRL. None of it leaves the confines of the single match, but I still stunlock trying to play killer. What's worse is I know I generally enjoy killer more when I play it, but somehow that knowledge does nothing in the face of queuing into a game.
I know this comment isn't really providing advice or helping OP. Just venting that I feel the same way at the moment. -
As killer, I rarely pick perks I don't like to go against when playing survivor. It's rare I'll take Pain Res or DMS outside of trying to buy time when experimenting with a killer I'm unfamiliar with. I prefer trying to make silly things work, or just bringing chase/carry perks to keep the game clean and efficient. I also think I will never ever bring Ruin. Ruin is currently my least favourite effect in the game to go against.
As survivor, sadly I'm a hyporcrite. While yes, I'll often go without any exhaustion, no DS and no genrush, such as a pure totem build or pure altruism/healing build, I will switch to DS/Plot/Lithe/Deja if I've been losing too much. So yeah, I try not to bring stuff I hate facing, but fact of the matter is they're just too useful. -
@Rokku_Rorru said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4097380#Comment_4097380
Yeah exactly, there is a lot more of a focus on altruism which results on not very much gen pressure in most matches, sure I'd love more variety on killer side like maybe contributing to the tables yourself (so you can force the heal early and get benefits for yourself and points to foil the survs plans). having a power for each menu would definitely make the event on killer side have more variety. While I love getting long ranged shots of the poison, maybe it could be for the haste menu? two different powers for the other two perhaps.
Like it's close to being a fun event for both sides, there is just glaring issues especially on killer side like Legion ruining the event for survivor (they just need a rework at this point) and the like.While I love getting long ranged shots of the poison, maybe it could be for the haste menu? two different powers for the other two perhaps.
If a poisoned morsel is added to the table, when the global buff is triggered, the killer gets a buff too, scaling with the proportion of poisoned meals added. Running around as temporarily invisible Bubba would be a fun reward for keeping on top of poison management, and make it so just throwing the poison in chase isn't the optimal choice in 99.9% of situations.
Like it's close to being a fun event for both sides, there is just glaring issues especially on killer side like Legion ruining the event for survivor (they just need a rework at this point) and the like.
Yeah, legitimately people are so quick to claim something is unsalvageable, then they entrench in this view and actively avoid acknowledging any elements that are fun.
My view on Legion is shifting quite a bit. I liked them for a while but I'm slowly getting enough hours to become sick of mending.
Plague basically switches the event off as well. The team heal is gone, making sitting on gens the best use of any survivor's time once again.
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Me when I'm staring at the bottom of the hook bubble hoping to catch sight of some killer toes before my face catches a Jason spike.
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This forum was an absolute mess when the event came out, with people being absolutely certain that the event favoured survivors to such a degree that the event was unplayable for killers. I'd say at least 50% of it was overblown.
It's a decent event, with some specific combinations that can be rough, such as rolling the unbreakable pallet meal when trying to play an M1 killer into a map with a lot of strong pallets. However, every single killer, M1 or not, got extremely strong anti-loop potential from the poison, which can hit directly or linger on a resource, all but guaranteeing a hit.
Spreading injuries/slugging doesn't work, but by focusing on getting quick downs in a single chase (made much easier by the poison), survivors are not going to get a decent value trade-off if they hold the 4th plate for a team heal, and most (not all) maps are laid out where getting a full table set to trigger the buff is a decent time investment, time spent not doing gens. The safety of a team-wide heal also seems to make survivors try to force value by body blocking, which yes, extends your chases, but also is a further example of survivors not being on gens.
It balances out, being disappointing for killers more due to lack of variety than the actual strength of survivors in the mode. Whether or not that results in a fun or frustrating event is a different debate and I'd say there's more steam there. The event absolutely can be twice as frustrating as the normal game, on both sides. I feel like the surge of public figures in the community decrying that the event super favours survivors has caused a lot of killers to uber-sweat, which makes the silly mode less fun.
Aesthetically, I like the event. The meals are suitable gruesome and the tables/dining carts ooze kitsch gothic horror. It's very cheesy and cute.
This is my first anniversary event, so I've not got much perspective on the cakes. I'll trust in the community on this one, though. It really feels like BHVR tried to limit the hell out of them and I'm not sure why.
The rewards aren't great though. Dwight looks great in a suit and the Huntress axe looks sick, but the masks are ugly and a great axe on Huntress is less great when it clashes with most of her cosmetics.
Overall, it's a 5/10 event. Not bad, but not great. The best part is the loading screen testimonials. They're very cute. -
@ONSAN said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4096884#Comment_4096884
It's just a difference in perception—you know, between a low-tier rat and a high-tier rat. So don't worry about it! Maybe some of the others got what I meant. Sorry, my English is just terrible.
For sure, since posting that I've had people tell me they see rat as someone 'ratting out' their teammates, working with the killer to a degree, so there are inconsistent meanings everywhere.
If a stealthing player is better than me and helping their team win, I wouldn't call them a rat. I'd just accept they're better than me. -
@ONSAN said:
A 'rat' is a survivor who is better than you, someone you can't find or catch. In the first place, because they’re good at looping, they get the time and experience to naturally master everything else—like repairing, rescuing, and stealth. No one actually thinks 'rat' means a bad player... right?
Rat isn't synonymous with bad, I don't think anyone claims that, and the description you gave is not of someone 'ratting' as far as I've experienced.
A rat is a survivor who relies on stealth to preserve their own escape at the expense of everyone else. Think like, only doing corner gens when it's absolutely safe, causing a late game 3 gen, hiding even when their entire team is on death hook instead of trying to take the killer's attention and prolong the match long enough for gens to be done, or playing for hatch even when the match is still ongoing and there's a chance for a 2-4 escape. -
Well, Deltarune Chapter 5 just came out so I marathoned that, but it's not a play-every-night kind of game.
My current timewaster is Mewgenics. It's essentially a synergy builder rogue-like, where even having completed the game more than once and churning my way through the challenge difficulties, I'm still discovering brand new ways to create a build. I don't think there's anything quite like it out there at the moment. It's a bit juvenile in its humour, but that's the entry fee for anything by Ed McMillen. -
@Rokku_Rorru said:
I have to agree with this thread, I thought I enjoyed him when he came out but as time went off him and Ghoul being the most popular, I'm really not happy with them being so popular, it's making survivor really exhausting.
Story of my life. I was a Jason defender; see my comment history. I argued that he has counterplay in the form of giving survivors control over who takes chase and where they take chase, which is super strong (and true)
However
Should that level of coordinated counterplay be expected in a game like this? It demands all survivors be good at/built for chase. Jason's 'weakness' of frontloading all his strength in chase is cushioned way too hard with the duration of his haste and how quickly he can reset with OE. Reloading is either too fast or too easy to do without taking a detour. So the whole idea of forcing out his M2 and surviving long enough for him to be a 4.4 M1 killer never comes into play.
You can pick who takes chase at any given time if you cooridnate but Jason is the kind of killer that can afford to spread hooks. And I haven't even got to the pain of a slowdown + hex + thrill Jason. It's outright gross.
I was so excited about Jason. He is really fun to play as and my first survivor experiences against him were atmospheric, fun and not impossible. I still don't want his gameplay loop altered too much because he has such a unique feel and I think the design team were very close to a homerun.
Start by making his Haste half its current duration, then work from there. -
I don't play enough Huntress to have an idea whether or not this is too much. I mean, it's a rework in the sense that she is buffed in every capacity.
I'll touch on them from a first impressions basis and if I'm missing the thinking let me know.→ Decrease maximum capacity of hatchets to 4
This obviously changes her entire gameplay loop when you consider her hatchets are multipurpose in this rework. I'd say it's too punishing if it weren't for the next thing.
→ Huntress gets 15s cooldown once all 4 hatchets are thrown, no longer has to reload at lockers. During that time she moves at 120 %
This is faster than Chag when out of hatchets. It's only 15 seconds but it's 15 seconds of being the best M1 killer in the game. I feel like givng her this kind of speed is a pure revenge fantasy for being abused on a tall rock over and over.
→ Huntress no longer emits lullaby and has 24m range TR
→ Huntress can throw hatchet to any surface to emit a 40m wide lullaby
→ Survivors within lullaby range build up scared meter that can't be removed and takes 30s to fully activate and stays acitve for 60s. Survivors with fully charged scared meter periodically trigger killer instinct for a few seconds map wide
These are all together as this is the crux of your rework idea. You want Huntress to hunt, having a power that shows this. This would give her a really powerful info power that, at 40m from where thrown, would be unavoidable. With her now being able to teleport as a form of mobility via throwning a special hatchet (how would this look?) She'll be omnipresent. The idea of managing a lullaby is very interesting, so even though I'm not sure how this would look in game and definitely think some aspects are overtuned, I enjoy the concept.
But, that's easy for me to say. I don't play Huntress. I don't like playing Huntress. I'm not her audience and by the look of @NeverSolus' comment, at least one member of that audience is skeptical.PS: KI might be a bit much. Given it cannot be countered and some people still like to play for stealth, having it map wide for a full minute, especially when the way its applied is pretty much unavoidable, will rub some folk the wrong way.
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Mikaela Reid.
I like her glasses.
I have an internal bit where whenever she pulls her book out in the lobby I'm saying her legal name like it's a command. -
@ColonGlock said:
If you are not interested in paying attention the match, I would focus on perks that help you in chase. Play the killer you like the most.
Oh I do like a good "sit up straight" kind of game generally, but sometimes work has kicked my ass to a point where it's either survivor or chill killer games. Problem is my chill killer games are super limited because I only really have one chill build, which is enfury + hubris on any M1 (alongside a dash of hope that the survivors don't learn to predrop too early in the game)
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@Skillfulstone said:
Nemesis (Depleted Ink Ribbon, Zombie Eye or Marvin's Blood) or Wesker (Lab Photo, Unicorn Medallion or Video Conference Device)
Enfury, NTW, Bamboozle or FTTE.
Not very optimal builds, but versatile and easy to use during normal gameplay, not to win.
Enfury is in my "I short swing every pallet" build specifically because it's so brain off. Do you ever sub FTTE for BBQ is you're relying more on power?
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Also, sometimes I will pivot my attention to someone doing a lot of sabos/saves, because they are taking those actions.
That's not because those actions are making me mad and I need to show 'em what for. It's because they're disrupting the hell out of my other chases/hooks and I'd get more pressure by putting them in timeout then getting some downs without having to worry about their intervention. Usually helps that I've already identified a couple of their perks that I know won't help in chase, and they're often hovering around me, which makes it easy to get a free hit.
This also caused me to incidentally bleed an Ace out. 2 survsl eft, Dead Dawg, Ace died in a hook-free area. Was at like 75% wiggle progress when Jane sabo'd the only hook I could make, so I had to put him down and chase her. She had a stealth build so I lost track of her, and my only play from there was to leave Ace on the ground. Poor guy bled out from an almost full timer. -
Started with Wraith on the advice of others. Simple power, very easy to pick up and use without having to learn both a clunky/complex power as well as general killer play. Also a great way to get M1 fundamentals down.
Played a custom game with some friends within that same week, bought Springtrap as a joke because some of them didn't know he was in the game and our little group had a lot of ironic love for FNAF. Accidentally realised I really loved how he played and his goofy personality.
Stuck with Springtrap because his unique projectile lets me arc throws over loops as well as his switch from 4.4 to 4.6m/s letting me consolodate on that skill-shot in decent time. It made for a nice feedback loop of dopamine that also progressed the game.
Nowadays I enjoy him simply for always having options. He's not especially fantastic at anything (aside from camping hook with his axe but I don't do that anyway), but that flexibility gives him mind games of his own.
He can hit and run, commit chase, spread pressure or focus it, anti-loop or pallet munch, play a stealth/fake TR game with cheeky tricks, predict survivor paths and entirely invalidate a whole jungle gym with his M2, play Chess by Daylight by securing the gens with the best doors/worst resources… None of these strats consistently result in wins, but even with dedicated builds for them his base kit is capable enough to allow you to switch it up depending on your opponents.
Sadly. I see ST mains becoming rarer with the advent of Jason. While Jason isn't 1-1 a better Springtrap, he is capable of almost all of the same stuff and better at most of them too. -
@Rokku_Rorru said:
It probably doesn't help that dissolution works so well with her, have you tried that?
that way you can punish a bodyblock if you have to go into m1 form, for an easier down possibly.
I think I'd take nerfs to her spit like a longer CD like Unknowns for a stronger head form honestly, but that's just me.I've said this as well. Make head form stronger, but make her spit actually take skill to land. Remove the auto-aiming projectiles that scatter from where she hits and force it to be a single bounce or direct hit only.
Would it be too much to give her head form a short swing? -
@Linkdouken said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4092406#Comment_4092406
Great answer. I like to think I'm the same but in reality I do feel more victorious if I've made it through that gate
Definitely, I just can't place it as my most important thing. It's the goal, but it's not what I boot up DBD and queue survivor to do.
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I know it's cheesy but having fun. I always try to escape but my fun comes from how close I get to that and how much I contributed to other people's escapes, not just the act itself.
BP are neither here nor there. Regularly hit the cap, not a big BP investor for items/offerings. -
Haywire:
This perk got killed due to how it interacted with other killers such as Singularity. Right now it works as an anti-99 perk but I feel 99ing gates is not that useful in most situations these days. I only ever see a use when trying to prevent Blood Warden value when you already have a teammate in chase/about to get hooked.
Revert the regression and then buff it again. Make it regress all the way to 33%, but tie it to a hex that ignites the first time the exit gates are touched. That way it'd get to keep its great synergy with certain killer but also provide a means to remove the effect.
Help Wanted:While I like the whole idea of ensuring killer input to get the benefit of this perk, it's not strong enough to be worthwhile. If it was purely passive, i.e the only condition is when any generator completes, it'd still be bad. @DNet89 had a great idea of making it permanent in endgame, which could be worthwhile.
I think having it work like Fire Up for successful basic attack cooldowns would make it more interesting. Keeping the kick requirement to offset the potential for more consistent value from the perk.Phantom Fear:
The most useable ST perk imo. It's a nice passive bonus to tack onto a scream build. Right now it's very inconsistent. Its long cooldown often causes it to proc when you don't need it, and be on cooldown when you do. It can't reliably harasss totem cleansing either.Maybe remove the cooldown but have survivors only scream once. Upon hooking a survivor, the effect resets. That'll make it predictable and potentially allow killers to be more deliberate in how they get value from it.
Increasing the aura read duration by a small amount would be a nice addition as well.
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This is so much better than the current spikes. As it stands the spikes appear super early, and are not super clear when they are full.
Sure, could be a skill issue with me not keeping count super effectively, but a clear indicator would be a lovely QoL change. -
Not AI, just not particularly attractive.
@Chomperka said:
Its obvious AI. I expect Terrifier chapter to be fully or mostly AI generated by BHVR to test the waters. They took unpopular license on purpose so no one would really care about it, so backlash wouldn't be that big. Still ,we must boycott behaviour when that happens because…
using AI for Art is unacceptable!
I agree with your final statement, however this is just conjecture.
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More specifically, the ability to rotate really quickly to something that is a higher priority. I'd say mobility but I actually hate playing Ghoul/Nurse/Blight, so teleport it is. Playing Dredge, Springtrap or Unknown feels better to me.
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@not_Queef said:
When the killer is a turbo sweat quad slowdown best addons comp wannabe s-tier main and gets 0 kills (even better if they complain - without irony or self-awareness - about survivors trying hard).
When a survivor teabags and then immediately step in a trap.
Thank you for giving me your 1000th post!
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@HoodedWildKard said:
I live for the close fought games. They are few and far between but those games where the killer and the survs are matched so equally that thebgame always hangs in the balance right up until the last second. Usually a 2 k with a kill at about 1-2 gens left and another in the end game.
And who doesn't get a solid dopamine hit as surv when you pallet save, a killer whacks the vault etc
Mhm, those games are my favourite to be honest. So long as it's not too sweaty to tie it up like that. A stomp in either direction, in my favour or not, is the least fun version of DBD. I don't expect to ever hit the highest level of skill the game has to offer, because quite frankly, the game at the very tippy-top feels like it'd be joyless.
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@Rokku_Rorru said:
When I get off meta perk value, I was running a chest build today and I found a sabo toolbox and saved someone who was being tunneled, I was really happy with myself.
Last Stand saves are another of my fav when I get them, or head on saves on randoms, I love solo Q altruism.
As for Killer, I love chase builds and getting value, recently rampage has been so much fun.Off meta perk value is my jam. I've been doing it less lately but instapicking a slug with 5 stacks of Autodiadact makes me feel like I'm cheating (and got me accused of it once too).
Haven't had much luck with chests just yet. Whenever I bring a chest perk I feel I lose too much time opening them just for a fog vial :(. Shoulda just sat on the gen. -
Abusive chat.
Taking actions with the primary purpose of making someone else's experience worse. -
@Habaneropeppah said:
Why aren't we seeing comments like this from survivors? "Oh, I am having so much fun playing against Jason. He jump scares me, hits me with his spear 90% of the time, regresses my gen that I cannot pop, and pressures us on both gates simultaneously. I hope my next match is against Jason again!"
@mecca said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4090062#Comment_4090062
The game is only all about killer and so killers are the only ones having fun.
Local man arrested for having fun.
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I'm in the camp that his counterplay takes longer to pick up than his gameplay loop. I don't think he's OP, but he definitely power creeps some other killers.
You essentially get to choose who he finds and where he finds them as a survivor. You can deliberately bait him by staying on a gen while he's in OE if you know you've got a strong set of tiles to work with, or if you have no hooks while the rest of your team has plenty.
Jason can ignore you to try and tunnel or go for a better target, but the better target can just crouch walk until OE passes, usually because Jason is forced to take an unfavourable chase or lose a gen.
Jason games are going to take longer. They require a more methodical approach from survivors instead of focusing entirely on efficiency at all costs. It makes him unique.
Nerfing him too quickly might remove a unique, team-based way of dealing with a killer from the game and I'm not for that.
I think the problem with him right now is he checks harder than most killers whether the survivors are all on the same page. -
Yeah…
I originally was pushing back on the idea that Jason is just better ST and I still believe there are some differences worth noting, particularly with the orbital potential. However, that's a niche, clip-farm kind of play that isn't often the most optimal choice. I kind of have to accept that anything you want to accomplish with ST is available to Jason, and easier to do to boot.
The KI aura on the axe when embedded in the map is now all ST has in normal play (and Jason has a Temu version of this via addons). Even the more unique ST addons that create interesting build opportunities, such as those that mess with his TR, can be recreated and executed arguably more efficiently with Jason. ST is less punished for taking longer chases, but burst potential is better than sustain in a game where time matters, and Jason's entire loop hinges on that burst potential.
I'd settle for them changing the cloned addons in Jason's kit so ST has unique options again at a minimum.
I'll likely continue maining ST just because I find him aesthetically fun and his gameplay is still enjoyable to me, but it kinda sucks knowing I'm essentially nerfing myself. -
@Rokku_Rorru said:
Like you I play with a friend who has issues, but his is Nystagmus, Doctor's skillchecks going around the screen are still a huge issue.
While it's part of his flavour I do have an alternative request for BHVR: Let us make the skill check ui bigger, would help so much with that kind of issue for him. it's way too small especially as we've gotten higher and higher resolutions.Absolutely! UI scale should be standard in all games.
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I mentioned this in another thread. The biggest potential counter is a bit of bravery. Check your surroundings, the resources and ways out you can go. If you're in a position where you have a route to get a decent loop, be the one who gets on gens while he OEs. Teammates in less safe positions can hold off until he emerges.
Either he jumps you and you bolt for the resource he isn't at/towards the safe loop you saw, or he jumps someone else and you've just had a bunch of free time on the gen. Whenever he has committed a chase it's 100% safety to crack on as with any other killer. The survivors essentially get to choose who he finds first.
I'm not claiming this is direct counterplay that guarantees a win, and I'm going to spend some time in the next few days trying this mentality out further to see just how much success I see. -
I'd take it. Quite frankly I find myself reloading at hooks more than piles anyway, as hook spawn logic tends to have them conveniently near every major loop.
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Most tierlists presume a level of looping ability. Both of these killers can be looped quite effectively, this is why they don't tier well. When you're fairly new/inexperienced, tier lists matter quite a bit less.
Some general takes if looping is hard:- If Pig crouches in a tall loop and starts charging her ambush, just leave. Turn 180 degrees away from where pig is and hold W to the next loop. 8/10 times you'll just make her waste time.
- Legion out of power is just Trapper without traps. If they cancel on your head, they're confident they can get a quick down on you. Best you can do is predict if they're considering that. Do they hit you with frenzy then keep following you? Means they're eyeing up coming out of power to down you. Get to a resource.
I'm not the best looper. I have my moments where I can hold my own but I'm pretty bad if I get caught off guard or start to get stressed out, but generally I don't find these two particularly intimidating.
Another thing to remember is that every second you keep a killer in chase is you winning. The more seconds, the more winning you're doing. If they down you after a full minute, you've afforded your team a lot of time. Being downed at the end of a chase, even by low-tiers, is not a sign you messed the whole thing up. Maybe, after a thousand opportunities to mess up, you finally did, or maybe you just ended up forced into a lose/lose situation after enough resources were burned/bloodlust was accrued.
- If Pig crouches in a tall loop and starts charging her ambush, just leave. Turn 180 degrees away from where pig is and hold W to the next loop. 8/10 times you'll just make her waste time.
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My experience with Jason on both sides has been interesting.
Yes, he's strong. Yes, his kit is bloated. He's still sinking in so I'll not conclude too much.
Playing as him, he just feels satisfying to play. Not much to elaborate on here because I feel most people find him fun to play as, especially now I've had games beyond my one lag-fest PTB experience.
Against him is where it's interesting, because this is where there's more varied opinions - although the forums are definitely leaning more towards the negative. The biggest issue I can see with him is just how long games against him are if he's not winning. I think this ability to stall with high map pressure plus counterplay that forces people off gens has led to the real problem here.
No matter how good you are against Jason in chase, he has far too many chances to get you or a teammate. I've picked up a bit of a knack here or there. One of the main ones is sticking your gen during OE if you have two resources you can make should he arrive. Yes, you'll end up taking chase, but you're the teammate with the best shot at getting away or delaying him significantly. The rest of your team on less safe gens can then keep working. I tried this a few times to pretty decent success.
The problem arises from how forgiving it is to rotate as Jason. So many times I'd make it to a decent loop, and Jason would just drop me. Many other times Jason would drop multiple chases until he found which survivor he was most confident he could two tap, then just did that. Meanwhile, every instance of OE was causing gen slowdown because people have now learned the counterplay but don't seem to be applying it in moderation.
I maintain that he's not OP in a vaccuum, but he's a significant skill/knowledge check to the entire survivor team, so if the team has a weaker link, it becomes very hard to win. I do enjoy playing against him, but even me, a survivor who's honestly not that good, find myself losing less because I'm being taken out, and more because one or two people on my team are getting picked off fairly early.
If anything was to be nerfed, it would be increasing the CD on OE. I think I could handle that as it would force Jason to somewhat commit to the chases he gets. It should at least be about as long as his haste. -
Polished off some final prestiges, saved a chunk for cakes. Probs just gonna be at the 5mil cap for cakes.
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@Habaneropeppah said:
I totally agree with the original post. I want a menu when I queue up for a match that lets me ban killers and maps from my matchmaking experience. As a newer player, it’s really frustrating to get destroyed by killer after killer just because I have no idea what the killer does and how to play around their unique abilities. Let me choose to start with a handful of killers, learn them, then expand to additional or more complex killers as I become familiar with how the game works.
Unfortunately, there's no real way around the brutal difficulty curve of starting as survivor. The game is old with a fairly competent player base and in general, a 0 hour killer is going to win against a 0 hour survivor, as survivor checks your knowledge much harder than killer does in the beginning (these checks even out later).
The best thing you can possibly do is play killer yourself, those that you have trouble against especially. If they're paid/licensed watch some content creators gameplay (specifically gameplay, not opinion pieces, you do not want to go down that rabbit hole). -
@Wezqu said:
There is several points where survivor can look at the killer skin quite much. Like when you are being carried or when you get hooked etc.
They look at me when I stare at them in miserable disbelief through the window they vaulted after I wasted a Coup token and didn't get the hit.
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Yeah
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@Xendritch said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4088250#Comment_4088250
I not all pigs wanna meme and going against hex pigs that just overload you with things to do can be rough but when your killer is kinda ahh in chase I get it.
I have no problem with Pigs that try. She needs to be let out of the pen once in a while.
I'm specifically talking about players using Pig's reputation to their advantage. It's technically all fair in love and war and all that, but it feels like a betrayal every time. -
@Xendritch said:
I feel like if you did spectrum of red flag/green flag for killer mains Ghoul would be the tip of the red end and Pig at the tip of the green end. Pig mains always seem chill (except for the ones that just tunnel people with party hats but they're not that common).
I feel Pig has major red flag potential. There are those, we shall not call them Pigs, but Swines, who pretend to be memesters, and use it murder people.
Coming across a Pig player these days feels like a game of Among Us. She could be an imposter. -
This is honestly a sentiment I really like and want to rally behind. I'm newer to the community than many and have only the waxings of oldheads to help me understand the culture of the community and what has brought us to where it is now. I see a lot of negativity and grim forecasts, people calling the game dead/dying or stating it's never going to go back to the golden age. It sucks to arrive to a game as it's dying and being told over and over that is the case really takes the wind out of my optimistic sails.
I have my gripes, but I genuinely think DBD is a gem, a rough one, but a gem, and if all that is promised, or even most that is promised, comes around, I predict a new breath of life. -
I've not even been playing the game that long and I already have certain sound effects/voices burned into my head. While I love the idea of hearing Dwight talk and have actual personality beyond the lore description and player stereotypes, I fear any changes to the screams and grunts.
Hearing a Dwight go down across the map is almost a comfort noise to me. Makes me feel at home. -
I'm gonna be a bit of a defender here:
The new animations/models are not going live for some time yet, the uncanny stuff we saw before is effectively pre-alpha demo footage of the new animation system. So expect it to be a bit less uncanny, especially when not in smooth test lighting.
I can appreciate if it makes you feel squeamish, but they are not reworking the gameplay loop into a torture simiulator. You chuck people on the hook and they do the scream and make the face, same as now, just that the face will look a bit more expressive. I imagine moris will be similar. The wording used was supposed to sell it as scary, not promise you a bunch of discomfort.
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I'm hoping for a custom game creation system, akin to what Overwatch has. People made entirely new gameplay systems within it.
Being able to drag and drop tiles to make a functional new map, then sharing that, would be great. TF2's best and most balanced maps came from hobbyist mappers and were eventually incorporated into the game officially. DBD getting the same treatment would sure be something.