Zavri
Zavri
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- Zavri
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@Dehitay said:
@folterung said:
This issue here is that Legion has the movement speed of a snail in frozen molasses. Any good survivor can keep you running around the map for 5 generators to get done. Even if you frenzy again you have to hit 4 times to get a single down. Just wait until you play against decent players... seeing blood won't help you.You do realize how deep wound works, right? They can only run from you for a limited time period. Which is generally shorter than it takes a normal killer to get a 2nd hit.
that is not how it works.
timer is paused in a chase, they are effectively just injured if you aren't in frenzy mode.
if you are in frenzy mode, they are effectively healthy until you hit them enough to drain the bleed out timer to 0, which is 4 hits base, 3 hits with an addon.
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@Dehitay said:
@folterung said:
This issue here is that Legion has the movement speed of a snail in frozen molasses. Any good survivor can keep you running around the map for 5 generators to get done. Even if you frenzy again you have to hit 4 times to get a single down. Just wait until you play against decent players... seeing blood won't help you.You do realize how deep wound works, right? They can only run from you for a limited time period. Which is generally shorter than it takes a normal killer to get a 2nd hit.
all they have to do is START the mending before they get downed and it will be fine. there are no skillchecks on mending and the progress is saved.
if the killer swapped targets, you will get mending off NP
if he is still chasing you, you just loop him like any other 110% killer til he gets his power charged.
he is stupid easy to loop and waste time against.
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@Dehitay said:
All thoughout the ptb, I've heard nothing but how Legion is the worst killer next to Freddy. But I played Legion for the first time today and I seriously have never finished chases faster. The first hit is easier than normal to get cause of Frenzy, and then you just break chase and follow blood trail with bloodhound without initiating, and then they go down faster than it would take to get a 2nd hit with a normal killer.There's 2 possibilities. Either no high rank player has discovered this strategy that was completely obvious to me. Or there's a counter to it that I have not run into yet. But all the discord servers I ask on seem unable to tell me what the counter is. I find it difficult to believe that I thought of something that top players couldn't figure out on their own. So what's the counter to Bloodhound Legion that I haven't run into yet?
you are playing against bad players.
He is worse than freddy against good players.
With freddy you can at least sleep and mind game that first hit and chase as 115% killer for the second hit.
As legion you find someone, hit someone twice with frenzy and you're ######### if you want to swap targets.
Mending takes no time at all, its around 12 seconds.
No healing perks track it.
You have to rely on idiot survivors grouping up to be effective.
Also, freddy downs in 2 hits, legion downs in 3 hits WITH A PURPLE ADDON!
Overall the time from chase to DOWNED is SUPER HIGH on the legion if you need to down someone asap.
The difference is so high it's laughable.
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The legion of bad game design imo
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@MhhBurgers said:
@Zavri said:
LITERALLY, all they have to do is keep mending and chase from pausing the bleed out timer.THAT'S IT!
and SUDDENLY he is a GOOD KILLER.
Like, it doesn't take Einstien to figure that ######### out.
"oh but he can hit me twice and chase til i bleed out!?!"
NO #########? HOW IS THAT ANY DIFFERENT FROM A 115% KILLER WITH BETTER POWERS?
Hell billy can find you offguard in a few seconds, chase you around and 1 SHOT YOU or QUICKLY smash pallets to ONE SHOT YOU in the following 10 seconds of a chase.
How is that ANY WORSE than being hit twice in about 5 seconds AND being chased another 10 seconds to get downed if he focused on you like a billy would.
The answer is the hillbilly is ABSOLUTELY better in every aspect, he just isn't fancy about doing it like the LEGION is.
RE-DO the mending bullshit, and remove the stun when frenzy ends.
After that he will be a good killer.
If those changes prove to be "too powerful" than remove his bloodlust wallhacks off his base ability or reduce the range and or bake it into an addon.
After all that, holy ######### look! he is balanced!
I think the full timer of a deep wound till bleed out should be 60 secs without him hitting you.
The timer almost doesn't even matter if it pauses in a chase, which is the ENTIRE point.
Also, having the timer stop from downing you while mending is dumb. It makes it "seem" scary as a noob but anyone else knows as long as they start mending before 99% they will get it off NP without any issues.
Base bleed out timer should be 45 seconds, halved to 22 seconds on the 2nd hit. The timer should not pause AT ALL to keep in line with the average killer chase being around 40-55 seconds. Which is basically full gen.
Also, being hit a THIRD time during frenzy should be insta down.
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@Condorloco_26 said:
I don't know man, it really looks like Legion was designed for new players only, from both sides. Both killers and survivors will have somewhat a chance at "success" and "fun" as survs won't go down like flies (as usually happens at ranks 15 - 20) and killers will eventually get 2 or 3k's just because there will be a lot of hiding and fooling around involved, and much longer games as a result.because the devs just basically design a killer and barely test it via noobs ( ######### mcote basically ).
it's absurd and INSULTING that they don't employ the help of various community members to help design a killer that put more time into their game then they did MAKING IT
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LITERALLY, all they have to do is keep mending and chase from pausing the bleed out timer.
THAT'S IT!
and SUDDENLY he is a GOOD KILLER.
Like, it doesn't take Einstien to figure that ######### out.
"oh but he can hit me twice and chase til i bleed out!?!"
NO #########? HOW IS THAT ANY DIFFERENT FROM A 115% KILLER WITH BETTER POWERS?
Hell billy can find you offguard in a few seconds, chase you around and 1 SHOT YOU or QUICKLY smash pallets to ONE SHOT YOU in the following 10 seconds of a chase.
How is that ANY WORSE than being hit twice in about 5 seconds AND being chased another 10 seconds to get downed if he focused on you like a billy would.
The answer is the hillbilly is ABSOLUTELY better in every aspect, he just isn't fancy about doing it like the LEGION is.
RE-DO the mending bullshit, and remove the stun when frenzy ends.
After that he will be a good killer.
If those changes prove to be "too powerful" than remove his bloodlust wallhacks off his base ability or reduce the range and or bake it into an addon.
After all that, holy ######### look! he is balanced!
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@Carpemortum said:
ScottJund said:While I'll concede that Legion would be at least decent with normal killer movement speed, it still doesn't address the fact he is the least fun killer in the game for both sides. I originally thought just giving him normal movespeed would at least bandaid him but he's actually completely fundamentally broken. Let's look at the ways to play him and why they are all terrible for both killer and survivor.
Basically the gameplay flow is: find survivor -> feral when close enough -> get free hit -> look around for nearby survivors. If none nearby, hit original target again to bleed out more. If there are survivors in range, tag them until you can't tag anyone else, then hit the closest survivor again to drain frenzy.
From there, you have a few options. The first is go look for someone who is mending, and just chase them as a no-power 110% movespeed killer. As long as the survivors have a brain and used their 20 seconds of bleedout to get to even a remotely safe area, this is painful and unfun for the killer.
You can also just repeatedly hit the survivor, waiting for your power to cooldown (which can be aided by addons). This guarantees you will eventually down the survivor because there's not much you can do to avoid a feral Legion. This is painful and unfun for the survivor.
The other option is to follow a survivor backwards and just cheese the chase mechanics of the game until they either bleed out or get to low enough bleedout to be hit by an unavoidable frenzy hit. This is painful and unfun for the survivor and the killer.
Hell, even people that still like hiding / playing stealthily can't do that.
That's it. Those are the options Legion has to down people. All of them are immensely boring, and not even 115% movespeed will fix these issues. He is fundamentally badly designed for maximum unfun. The developers in charge of Legion absolutely do not understand this, as they thought removing the double stun would be a good fix, when in reality all it does is promote the unavoidable eventual downing of a survivor with no counterplay earlier.
The sad part is even though he can guarantee downs on survivors, he's still awful. It takes a decent chunk of time without addons to either cheese chase mechanic down or just repeat-power use down. This ensures: the survivor being chased eventually has no counterplay, which feels terrible. It ensures the Legion will still lose vs. a coordinated team who spread out and do not waste time healing (because there is no point), and it ensures that the other teammates not actively being chased are either bored mending or bored doing generators.
Every single thing about Legion is bad.
I enjoy the legion. They're fun to play as and against imo. Such hate lately. If its not your killer so be it. Dont try to ######### in my sandwich
you would enjoy playing freddy without sleeping survivors then
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@ad19970 said:
People need to give the devs a break though. They did well with so many of the killer designs before, and they are forced to constantly think of new ideas for the killer. So I can understand why'd they screw up a killer once.
With that said, I 100% agree with you on this post. Exactly why I always knew they couldn't buff him in any considerable way. Your post perfectly summarizes what's wrong with The Legion and why he can't be fixed. Guess we have to just move on and hope for a better killer design next time.The only way to make Legion viable without making survivors quit the game is to rework him. He needs a rework more urgently than Freddy, sadly.
I'm gonna go out on a limb and say ######### the DEVS! They have COUNTLESS knowledgeable players of THEIR GAME knowing the mechanics and how it plays out that they don't even BOTHER to recruit some of them to design a killer power.
It's SO ######### obvious they just design a killer power and test it via the NOOBS they have in the office.
It's so dumb that they basically drive this game towards rank 15-20 balance it's #########.
"i've never played before omg this scary guy hit me i'm gonna die ( doesn't mend )"
vs
"ok so i'm hit twice, my bar isn't gonna drain in a chase so when he breaks off the chase i'll just mend and be fine"
or
"ok hit me twice but i'm basically just an injured survivor looping a 110% killer like the spirit without her power, ggez 4 min loop"
SIGH
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ranking up is bad though. Rip your queue times and enjoyable games.
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the matchmaking system is broken and has been for awhile now.
The lobby system is basically like this:
Killer A makes a lobby: survivors matchmake into this lobby
Killer B makes a lobby: no one will matchmake into this lobby until Killer A's game starts -
on pc at least 360s don't do anything against me. It's not hard to hit them.
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honestly looks like a carbon copy of L4D's multiplayer with a slight twist.
SWF in that game would be even worse than DBD.
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@Navydivea said:
@Zavri said:
wraith is top tier now with addons.base kit is almost bottom tier though.
Kinda crazy they buffed the ######### out of him via addons but didn't do anything really on his base kit. 1 second windstorm doesn't do ######### when his decloak MS was nerfed. Better then nothing i guess, at least we can bodyblock / pallet block with the speed addons.
By that logic the spirit is OP as [BAD WORD]. His add-on are better yes but hardly puts him with Nurse or Billy and not all of us have iridescent add-ons laying around. When reworking a Killer the base power should always be the focus, not things we might have.
The best addons aren't even red. They are purple/green + one combo that involves a common ( brown ).
If you focus points into him it's easy to get.
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The event should just be a max of X vials period. Killer, survivor, doesn't matter.
I disagree with any other changes though. The grind is acceptable for what you get as it is.
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also, chainsaw debuff addons stack btw iirc.
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buff chili boy obviously.
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Each time a Survivor who is not the Obsession is hooked for the first time and is killed or sacrificed, gain a token.
uhh this perk would only activate if 3 people are dead if they went live with this.
That's pretty ######### stupid.
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people really bitching about rancor? really? it does almost nothing.
it's a ######### noed / mori combo for ONE person if you ignore them all game with a short doctor scream per gen done.
bitter murmur is vastly superior for every killer except the spirit ( the location reveal works in phase form )
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you can see traps and also the spots you place them are typically super obvious ( pallets, windows, pallet loops, the corner of a loop, etc )
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wraith is top tier now with addons.
base kit is almost bottom tier though.
Kinda crazy they buffed the ######### out of him via addons but didn't do anything really on his base kit. 1 second windstorm doesn't do ######### when his decloak MS was nerfed. Better then nothing i guess, at least we can bodyblock / pallet block with the speed addons.
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it's fine, it's essentially a dead perk the entire game until the end and it isn't even strong. There is no aura reveal, it's a LOCATION REVEAL like a doctor scream. If it happens during a hook you get no chance to even look around, lmao.
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lorelol
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They reduced the ridiculous stun hitbox so you actually have to be eating the pallet to get stunned.
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he is good with a few addon combos, he will be REALLY good with spirit fury + enduring.
I really like stacking windstorm and playing a sonic wraith, you can very easily run past survivors and bodyblock them from pallets and whatnot.
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I played spirit a ton against trihard swf groups.
Mandatory perks:
Predator, Ruin, Nurses.
You could run BBQ or BM for 4th perk, I opt for BM for winning, BBQ for points.
Predator is mandatory unless they change her. She NEEDS the tracking for phasing since bloodhound and or sloppy butcher aren't going to work with her "bug fix" unless you run the ultra rare.
Ruin is obvious
Nurses is SUPER GOOD, you can get a aura prompt and phase over and smack them without them knowing.
BM or BBQ for more tracking and ambush potential.
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@Global said:
@yeet said:
Global said:@Delfador said:
Doc is far from being OP. His base kit is really really weak. His addons are good but doesn't make him very powerful imo. He is just fcking annoying.
Nurse is very powerful. I know a couple of people on this forum think that she is 'balanced' but I think she definitely needs nerfs. I don't have any problem with Hillbilly, Hag, Myers and Huntress. I think they are balanced. Clown doesn't have much pressure on the map but he is a really good chaser. I don't think he needs to be buffed. Doc's base kit can be buffed. If it is gonna happen, they can even nerf his addons. I wouldn't mind. Freddy, Leatherface, Pig, Trapper are the most desperate ones for buffs I think. Wraith got a buff but I didn't test him on the PTB so I have no idea.
I wish every killer was in the same level with billy because he is the most balanced one imo. I am talking about base kits though. I don't mind if they nerf killers' addons if they are gonna buff their base powers.
billy is probably the most broken he can 1 hit any one and fly across the map with basically no negative effects towards him. He is also the easiest killer to play just get close and chainsaw.
Hillbilly is the most balanced killer in the game.
@Delfador said:
@Global said:
@Bartex said:
@SadonicShadow said:
Killers that need to be buffed would include freddy, wraith, leatherdaddy, pig. I don't think any killer needs to be nerfed tho. I know alot of people advocate for the nurse to be gutted but she is the only killer that can stand a chance against swf death squads and succeed. She translates player skill and experience into real performance that you can see. Nurse as is, is perfectly fine at base. Her addon need to be nerfed/reworked. 4 and 5 blinks should not be a thing since it eliminates almost all counter play for the survivors.nurse is not the only one that can stand, i've played some tournaments, and nurse main killed only one survivor, when the hillbilly main killed full team ;v
Because billy is easy to play skill takes actual skill and no im not a survivor main i am a killer main so have fun coming up with an arguement other than "HA RANK 27 SURVIVOR MAIN GIT GUD"
There is not much thing a billy can do if he faces good survivors. He can be easily looped.
Yes he can chainsaw people easily but you have your tools to fight him. 'If he gets close, he can chainsaw'. Don't let him get close then?
'One way or another he will get close I can't avoid him 5 gens'. True but we also need to remember that you are not the only target there. He needs to do that multiple times. This is not a 1v1 game. As a survivor, you are not as powerful as the killer. At least you shouldn't be.
Being an easy killer or a hard killer is not related to being OP. Nurse can be the easiest killer or the hardest one, it doesn't matter. She is broken, billy is not.
@yeet @Delfador Every killer needs to chase someone multiple times even nurse has to do it multiple times hell i find fighting her easier than billy because once you break line of sight with her just make her think you are going one way when your not simple. He has no draw back to one of the most powerful abilities in the game which is to cut the chase in half. He has immense map pressure and can instantly get to one side of the map to another better than nurse ever can. Yea being an easy killer doesnt make you op but if the easy killer has an extremely powerful ability it does because the more powerful the ability the harder to play the killer it should be. "There is not much thing a billy can do if he faces good survivors." I dont know what you mean here? That he needs his ability to fight the good survivors but in that case so does nurse so how would she deserve a nerf anymore than billy?
nurse can cover the map better then billy with max range addons.
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@ShrimpTwiggs said:
Of all the killers, Freddy is in the most need of a buff. There aren't any killers that are seriously OP, in my opinion, but a nurse with five-blink add-ons is a bit much, I think. If I were to nerf anything, it would probably be that.5 blinks is garbage, the range is stupid short, no map pressure
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no killer should be nerfed.
There are too many buffs to list for each killer but as a conversation starter, freddy should have 4 second sleep timer baseline.
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useless addon tbh.
reduced charge time is much better since the chainsaw is a 1 hit anyways. Why care about broken?
Hillbilly ultra rare should be something like:
Your chainsaw is completely silent and suffers no stun penalty when bumping into objects.
It changes the gameplay and is powerful at the same time.
Leatherface:
Your chainsaw tantrums no longer ends until you hit an object or a survivor, gain increased speed up to a max of X% while chainsaw tantrums continue.
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you know any card game is a better way to chat while hanging out online right? especially VR poker.
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I hosted a dedicated server for <300 people for ultima online.
This was on a Celeron PC back in that day too.
Probably isn't hard to host for what, 50 people right now?
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Why aren't you playing Fifa?
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In about 6-10 hours.
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Start a game and just afk as freddy.
Survivors can't farm off your AFK body so they typically leave.
Takes awhile but you will depip every game.
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it's a meta perk, you should have it.
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@jamesdon18 said:
I play mainly survivorIf you could not avoid getting looped, then you are just bad and thats all
because if you are getting chased and need dead hard or sprint burst, you only got it once a chase if that
Ok mate, nice logic.
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because it's happened for the last 2 dlc releases? PC at least.
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The game is obviously profitable, they aren't going to abandon it anytime soon.
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@Vankruze said:
3 blinks with max range addons is actually stronger then with 2 blinks but without those max range addons 3 blinks is crap.nah, double max range is vastly superior imo.
Max range is worded badly. It's basically extra range in ALL stages of the blink charging. You won't need 3 blinks when you can do your 2nd blink either 1 foot ahead or 30 meters away. It's insane.
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I actually feel nurse is WORSE with 3 blinks vs taking double max range addons.
I much prefer the giant map control and I never needed 3 blinks anyways ( except for maybe the first 10-20 hours of learning her )
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bloodlust wouldn't even be needed if they simply stop allowing maps to spawn 15+ pallets with MOST of them being "safe" pallets.
Make it a hard rule to spawn only 10 pallets per map but make them "safe" and you can remove bloodlust.
EZ fix, not sure why the devs haven't tested this.
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the pig was leaked by the chinese, wouldn't be surprised if this got leaked too. But the DBD build hasn't hit an update on steam yet so it is most likely fake. The pig got leaked only like a week before release because of an updated build posted on steam servers.
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noob3 trolls low ranks on purpose. Although everything except 360s and window baits will work no matter the ranks. Map design is pretty lulz atm.
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I was gonna buy it but after seeing the direction of the game since the first alpha test I'm skipping it.
I want a different style of hunters, not a different style of weapons.
They literally didn't even add 2 "new" weapons. They just copy pasted the same 2 weapons and made them slightly different. Pump vs auto shotty, semi vs bolt sniper. Like....Wow, guys....really creative!
I want to see different hunters like speedy/slow but tracking / normal speed but huge ammo and balance burst mobility/cloaking hunters with melee-ish weapons ( maybe pistols for a ranged attack ), trapping hunters, etc.
It's not hard coming up with interesting hunter sets but they decided to just toss in some "new" weapons to add hunter variety.
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@powerbats said:
I hate to say he's probably got even less of a life than me, which I find hard to believe. But I might be just ahead of him though so gotta prove this old fossil still has it.
So time to CRY HAVOC AND LET LOOSE THE DOGS OF WAR !!!!!
Incoming spam posting in every thread on the forums through 100 pages go !!!!
Joking of course, since I do need my occasional 3-4 hours of beauty sleep, gotta get the mummy wrappings redone every so often.
lol, I visit this forum every single day for at least an hour but I rarely post unless I feel compelled too. I do have a ridiculous fulltime job though ( 60-80 hours ).
My post peener is so tiny, feelsbadman
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How about every devotion level you get a bonus +100 shards for each level up so when you get back down to level 1-30 after doing a full devotion level it doesn't feel like ######### getting 100-200 shards for each level.
It shouldn't bother the store economy considering it takes an INSANE amount of time just to go from 1 to 100 as it is and not everything is purchasable with shards and the price even with this buff wouldn't allow someone to buy everything even if they grinded to level 10.
Like, I've played 150 hours since this level thing came out and i'm only devotion 1/22. Kinda insane.
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Do you even have a job besides trolling this forum? JFC lol.
1.7k posts in 2 months like wut?
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@Vietfox said:
@Tsulan said:
@Vietfox said:
@Tsulan said:
@Vietfox said:
@Tsulan said:
@Vietfox said:
Because this forum is dominated by killer mains.
I can understand the frustration with some skills, but others like self care or borrowed time? Please gimme a break. Also funny the ones who complain when survivors loop pallets. What do killers want survivors to do, run straight till they get caught in a matter of seconds?
Basically everything that makes the match a bit harder for the killer, perk or strategy, will be asked to get nerfed.
Fix something that doesn't work as intended? Ok. Fix something that counters your gamestyle or makes you angry? Deal with it.
There are killer perks or op killers like the doctor (who can make you scream from far away and not even being targered by him) that i personally find quite annoying, but you won't see me asking for them to be removed or nerfed. Sadly doesn't happen the same with some killer mains.Doctor is OP now? So no more Nurse on rank 1? Cool!
Nurse is op too, but everyone knows that and i tried to provide something new. A killer that does that and also easier to miss any kind of skill check when close or huge terror radious.
Also funny when many killers say survivors should play stealthy but Doctor obviously doesn't let you do thatDoctor lets you only scream if you lvl up madness or if you are in madness 3. So it is very much possible to stealth against him. Just watch your feet. If you see a static field, go hide in a locker (you´ll see the field long before you hear the heartbeat).
Or better, being crouched and not moving should be a counter to leveling up madness without being targeted, just the same thing to do to level it down.
So electroshocks don´t work if you crouch...
The secret weapon against tazers!I said when not being targeted, shock therapy would work anytime if hits you
Why nerf the doctor? he is super mid/meh tier right now without a specific build and a specific map that works for it.
Being "found" doesn't even matter, he can't chase multiple survivors at the same time.
You do know that the scream is a one time thing per madness level right? Get into level 2 asap, you will only scream when you hit madness 3.
Outside of illusion addons or perks, he will have no idea where you are after you hit level 2 until you hit level 3.
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as a killer main ( still 300 hours in survivor though ) the pallet change is needed. It's REALLY clunky right now with that long throwing spin animation.
But...given the state of killers right now ( except a few ) they should "slightly" buff breaking pallet speeds and brutal strength should actually break a pallet as fast as bamboozle 3 is for window vaulting so they can be comparable.