NuclearBurrito
NuclearBurrito
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@Luigifan64 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/344014#Comment_344014
So you’re saying you’d rather run the current Vigil over SC, Lithe, BL, Dead Hard, Prove Thyself, Deliverance, UE, Q&Q, BK, Unbreakable, etc. etc. Vigil’s usability is very limited, and no, only reducing 8 seconds of exhaustion while outside of a chase is not worth it, not to mention the 20% decrease just has a small effect on any of the killer addons that actually get used (mainly the mangled ones). It also doesn’t help against exhaustion addons that much because of how busted they currently are, a common huntress addon can completely disable a perk because you no longer can recover exhaustion while running. There are way better, more effective, and more fun perks to run over Vigil, so yes it would be sacrificing a perk slot for it and for the buffed version I proposed. It needs a buff, along with all of the Nightmare on Elm Street perks because they all suck and need more care and love put into them.
I'd absolutely take this Vigil over some meta perks. For example out of the perks you listed I would take it over: Prove thyself, Deliverance, Urban Evasion, Botany, Borrowed time and Unbreakable.
You don't give a ######### about the 8 second out of a chase. You take the perk because it brings the cooldown IN a chase from FOREVER to 32 seconds. Or in other words if you can use sprint burst and then maintain a 32 second loop, which a lot of survivors can, then you can get a second sprint burst making it possible to sustain the chase for much longer since you can do it a 3rd time
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Spirit. As a Spirit there is always some action you can do to counter anything a Survivor does.
As a Survivor there is almost always some action you can do to counter anything a Spirit does.
It all comes down to mind games rather than just ignoring everything or waiting for a mistake.
If a God Spirit goes against a non-God Survivor she will win. If a non-God Spirit goes against a God Survivor then the Survivor will escape. Or in otherwords the better player wins.
Spirit is one of the only killers where almost no one ever feels helpless. There is always SOMETHING you can do with or against her phasing.
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Yes but he can see you enter the locker (assuming you aren't in his terror radius) so it doesn't matter.
It blocks the aura but he can see the animation of you entering the locker in the first place
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- Spirit
- Huntress
- Wraith
- Hillbilly/Nurse/Nightmare/Pig (exactly 1 game)
- Everyone else (0 games)
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How would you counterbalance the Legion changes?
As unfun as he is he isn't OP, closer to UP. So a nerf needs to be counterbalanced with a buff in order to be fair
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Spirit can now see survivors while phased
Jk. Make leatherface's chainsaw not canceled when hitting a non-survivor object like a pallet or wall
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MSTI stands for "Most Stupid Team Imaginable". We all started together on Blood Lodge. Gen next to us, nice. Finish it in record time just disrespecting Hex:
Interesting how you are ON the MSTI.
Meaning I supposedly can't imagine a team where the 4th member is worse than you were
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I'd tone down Fire up so that each token is 5% at tier 3. Having 30% bonus action speed is just too much considering that includes vaulting. 25% is good enough to make the perk an excellent end game tool.
Also I know this isn't a thing currently either but I feel like blood warden should be able to activate when the gates are POWERED instead of OPENED. Since when they are opened it is too late unless you have god like timing
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@Troman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/342031#Comment_342031
"Winning" is not the same as escaping. Especially solo you escape 1 game out of 8-12 games. Don't confuse piping with escaping. I doubt any killer would be satisfied 0k and pip. It's the same with survivors.
The games tutorial begs to differ (In that Winning DOES = Escaping)
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@MhhBurgers said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/342922#Comment_342922
Dont mend if he has sloppy
You mean don't heal right? You still want to mend
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Spirit for the win! Rancor is so fun, Spies from the shadows is really good on spirit assuming you get the right map and you can use ToTH + Haunted grounds for the sweatiest totems ever
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@MhhBurgers said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/342940#Comment_342940
And you certainly don't see a problem with Billy and Nurse being only the 2 killers able to outplay almost perfect survivors and having to balance the game around them instead for 70% of the other roster. Are the other killers just there for show just to be worse in everything else?
Of course not. The other killers are under powered and need buffs
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@MhhBurgers said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/342832#Comment_342832
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r_JdvSFQ6Qs&t=0m45s
For example a LF cannot do this.
He can do all of what was done in loops. The rest is survivors caught in the open.
Counterplay to billy? Stay out of the open, he needs a roughly straight path in order to sprint over to you so never give him one. He has terrible stealth so it is entirely plausible to do this consistently.
Idk if you know this but leatherface actually does get a movement speed boost from using his chainsaw. Not nearly as fast as billy obviously but still enough to matter in a chase.
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Beast of Pray. Make it activate faster
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Spirit. I consider mind games to be the pinnacle of PVP. Noting when someone doubles back on phasing and standing still for them to come to me was the most satisfying thing ever.
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It's only toxic if it is to the exclusion of strategy. Any action taken with the intent to win is never toxic. It does not matter what the action is.
If someone has a reason to think that Tbagging will provide a strategic advantage then it is fair game to do so. Flashlight squads? Fair game.
Exception is actual cheating. I wouldn't call it toxic but it wouldn't be fair game.
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@Bloodartist said:
What is the context of the question? Did someone say this game is difficult? Are you referring the difficulty levels in the killers profiles? What?
This is a PVP game where you play against other human beings. Therefore the difficulty is directly proportional to the skill of the person on the other side. You may have easier time because you yourself are that much more skilled than your opponent..
Basically in order to make designs that encourage skillful play I need to know what that even means. In order to do that I need to know in a broad sense what exactly makes a good player better than a bad (but not stupid) player. Since none of the individual actions are particularly hard to do it isn't really obvious.
I personally consider mind games to be the best kind of pvp conflict, since mechanical precision based gameplay means there is a point where you can win regardless of what the other player does, whereas with mind games there is always an action to counter any other action thus requiring predictions.
Strategy is a bit different but is generally the same idea but on a larger scale.
However none of these are obviously emphasized across the board, especially for survivors. Some killers have different emphasis (Spirit = Mind games, Trapper/Hag = Strategy, Nurse/Huntress = Mechanical Precision. Not saying these killers exclusively do these things, just that they emphasize them) but for example a killer like Freddy or Wraith I'm not sure how you would go about improving.
And survivors just seem to be: Find gen, hold M1 until the killer comes to you or hooks someone, if the killer finds you run in loops, if someone is hooked save them if no one else is and if the killer is gone.
None of that is particularly hard outside of mindgames in a chase and the initial map memorization
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@bannerlemur said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/341357#Comment_341357
I enjoy the challenge of Solo so I will keep at it! I was just shocked today with that Mori crap or whatever it is that Michael has...I hadn't seen that until today after 4 months of play! I thought for sure it was a cheat but it is even more annoying to see it ISN'T! He can freakin' kill all the survivors the 1st time he catches each of them? Wow...lame for sure
It's an addon called tombstone. It lets Myers outright kill a player at tier 3 (like you just saw) however it makes it MUCH harder to build up to tier 3 and it reduces his movement speed.
In order to use it on all 4 survivors back to back he would need another addon that decreases his movement speed even more and makes it even harder to get to tier 3. So yes he can kill you the first time he catches you... after like 5 minutes straight of just stalking... and only IF he can catch you
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@bannerlemur said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/341318#Comment_341318
Idk I have played solo 100% of my games. Never chatted with another survivor...ever. Not my thing. Maybe you are correct and that is the prob and that explains why I, as a Survivor main, don't get why Killers complain? Hmm thx for that...gives me a diff perspective to think about.
Yes that would do it. Solo's are meh against killers due to lack of coordination. SWF are OP AF.
I'd say Solo's vs Killer is slightly in the killers favor while SWF vs Killer is MASSIVELY in the favor of the survivors. This is because Solo's don't have enough information to even attempt optimal play without using all of their perk slots on it. SWF however get all the information they need and more without needing to spend a single perk or item on it.
Thus perkless SWF is still much stronger than Solo's with the best perks and items.
Basically, game is balanced around the idea that survivors won't have enough information to play optimally. With solo's this is true and works. With SWF this is false and breaks the game as a result. Imagine if you knew everyone's role from D1 in Town of Salem, this is a bit like that.
The only reason social deduction games don't have this issue is because out of game communication is both provable and bannable. That won't work here so we need an alternative solution.
You can't directly nerf SWF but you can directly buff solo's in ways that are redundant for SWF groups such as giving action icons that say what each survivor is doing (that the Killer can't see). From there you can buff the ######### out of Killers to handle the now omnipresent level of coordination (still less than SWF but once you take out the extra raw data they get you are left with teamwork which is a fair reason to win a game).
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@bannerlemur said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/341215#Comment_341215
You are forgetting Altruism (both in the game and in real life). If I see a fellow survivor hooked, my 1st thought is trying to Unhook...not gen rush. But maybe that's just me. So I hate seeing camping because ultimately I try to save the poor survivor from a crappy game and then I get hooked 😝 but oh well...gonna keep trying to get those OG unhooks from right under Killer's nose lol!
I am not forgetting it. If you are camping a smart person is not going to go for the save and we don't balance around the idea of 1 person being stupid and the others being smart.
If the Killer ISN'T camping then altruism applies (and that fact is the biggest reason not to camp) and you will likely take the time to unhook them.
Now you could of course rightly point out that unless the Hooked survivor has Kindred you aren't going to know if the Killer is camping in order to do gens. However SWF throws that right out the window. In fact most of the balance issues with this game (not all) boil down to SWF making an otherwise balanced mechanic either OP or useless.
Why can you not camp the hook? SWF. Why are flashlights so strong? SWF. Why is NOED so easy to counter? SWF. Why are bond and empathy wasted slots? SWF. Why is looping so effective at buying time? SWF (unless it's the obsession. The point is that the others need to know about the chase to take advantage of it)
If you can give solo's the tools that make SWF strong then you can start to resolve those issues for real in order to make the game more balanced for everyone.
Just remember that right now if everyone played perfectly (including the killers) then Killers would never do better than a 1k.
Besides Nurse and Billy maybe. They might be fine given perfect play
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Oh yeah sure they can camp to secure a kill... and watch as the other 3 escape no problem if they are smart and did gens during that time.
The amount of time it takes to bring a person from first hook to death is 120 seconds. During this time if you are camping the other 3 survivors will be doing generators which take 80 seconds each.
Over that time the 3 survivors can do 4 complete generators and be half way done with the 4th. And that's assuming they had 0 progress before you started, they will likely be done with all 5 generators before the sacrifice is finished.
The games where survivors have a gun to attack the killer usually also let the killer instantly eliminate the survivors (Deceit and Friday the 13th work like this). Here the Killer has to find each survivor 3 times to reliably kill them without letting them get the gens done like in the above situation. And that's assuming you win every chase you start which while the Killer is very likely to win each chase eventually the amount of time it can take means he can't afford to need the tools that make catching up inevitable. This is why looping is a problem. The survivor won't get away without help, but he will keep you busy and make it so you don't have time to camp them, combine that with perks like adrenaline which let you escape to the gates once you have bought all the time you are going to need and you have a very survivor sided game.
The reason you don't see survivors winning every game isn't because Killers are OP. But rather because survivors don't generally give it their all every game. If they did we wouldn't have the term gen rush, it would just be standard play.
Look up the depip squad for video's of survivors actually trying to win. Note how quickly they can win even though these are high ranked killers who know what they are doing.
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I’m leaving the legion life so I can learn spirit it has been nice knowing you friends.
This is the objectively correct decision
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@Tucking_Friggered said:
@not_Queen said:
Thanks for the report.
What I can see from our bug database is that it has been fixed for the next update. We just tested our internal build and it's not reproducible on it. Keep us posted if it still happens after the next update goes live.The sad part is when the change was announced Behav10r was told precisely how it would be exploited. I don't understand the policy of having the information ahead of it clearly laid out and ignoring it only to have to fix it later.
I remember on a stream one of the devs, Mathieu I believe, saying if it becomes a problem we will handle it. I mean did anyone seriously believe it wouldn't be exploited? You do it with 4 people you have three great games and sacrifice 1 for the group rotating through the team.
Here is one laid out for you well ahead of time. If you put a totem counter in the game, every game all of the totems will be destroyed. Not some of the time, not occasionally, but all of the time. It's a clear reminder to all of the survivors go kill off the hexes for an ez win. It removes any confusion from the circumstances which a killer is reliant on. It turns solo queues into efficient adhoc SWF members for 2-3 man groups. It turns 4 solo queues into a 4 man SWF. Particularly considering you want empathy as a base kit.
Do you understand what Depip squad does with no VOIP and simply understanding and playing to maximum efficiency? You are considering adding UI elements that make doing so easy. One of your moderators, Peanits, watched the same stream where one of the best players in your community threw the game versus them because he knew there was no way to win. He feigned it not mattering because they are not there to have fun.
Newsflash, no one is here to have fun in that sense. It is a competitive asymmetrical game and fun comes in the form of embarrassing and destroying your opponent for 99% of the player base.
Now is it necessary to watch this unfold for a few months first? Do we need to witness the kill average drop from every killer facing a SWF every match before we spend months deciding on how to somehow boost the baseline of killers to compete? Do we realize how limiting that is going to be to future perk creation when whatever perk you release has to be completely immune to VOIP or a "please insert brain here UI element"?
Either you guys simply don't care or you need to hire someone who can pose these questions to you when you sit around discussing what to add next.
The whole point behind doing that is BECAUSE it makes solos like an ad-hoc SWF group.
This then allows you to buff Killers so that they can handle a SWF group without screwing over solos (since they would be buffed too with changes like these).
From the PoV of SWF no additional information or power is added thus the optimal survivor will be exactly as effective, however if we then give the Killers buffs while making it plausible for Solos to play optimally we can make it so that optimal play is equally strong for both sides.
Basically lets say a team of solos is a 1.
A team of SWF is a 4.
Right now Killers are a 2. So they have a big advantage against solo's but a HUGE disadvantage against SWF.
If we make Killers a 4 then SWF is balanced but then suddenly Solos are #########
If we make Killers a 1 then Solos are balanced but Killers are ######### against SWF
Thus in order to balance the game we first must make Solos as strong as SWF somehow. Totem UI's are one way to do that.
Basically take any info that SWF would communicate to everyone 95% of the time "I just cleansed a totem, I'm doing gens, Gah I'm being chased!" ect ect ect and give it to solo's. And then buff Killers to have the power to deal with that level of coordination and you will make the game MUCH more balanced
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The Acolyte - A cultist who can get permanent power boosts by giving blood to the entity
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/48451/killer-idea-the-acolyte
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@AshleyWB said:
Who's Denise?New Survivor obviously
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Oh I was wondering what the new killer was going to be like
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If you aren't in a chase then you have little reason not to do gens.
The killer can only chase 1 survivor at a time and thus until that survivor is hooked there will be 3 survivors working on generators.
Most killers can be stuck in a chase for greater than 40 seconds given both a high skill survivor and a high skill player. In the event of a lower skilled killer it can last much longer, in the event of a lower skilled survivor it will likely last much shorter even if the killer isn't high skilled (note that the survivor's skill matters more than the killers here).
The exceptions to the above are: Nurse, Billy, Huntress, Spirit, Clown
Trapper and Hag can sometimes do good in the case of them running into a trap, however this is too unreliable to make them unloopable
Freddy, leatherface, Doctor, Myers, Wraith, Pig and Legion (just because his down is easy doesn't mean it won't take forever) all can be reliably stalled
Breaking chase with the survivor when they are good at the chase means that you lose the chance to get that 1st hook (meaning the survivor efficiency stays at 100% that much longer) AND it means there will be a whopping 4 survivors working on generators until you can find another one.
If all 4 survivors are good at the chase and you aren't playing as one of the 5-7 killers I listed above then you lose. It doesn't matter how good you are if you are mathematically going to lose if the other side does not make a mistake.
Ideally if everyone played perfectly the game would come down to it's random elements. Right now perfect play is a survivor win every time
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Challenge accepted.
surgically removes eyelids
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New DS isn't any better at endgame than current DS.
If you just don't use your DS in the early game then the current DS resolves like new DS but with extra stun time
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@PigNRun said:
>
2) I can go after the survivor and wait only 40/50/60 seconds for a new strike <- This is a pro. Do you really not see how much of a waste of time this is?
No that's a minus. That 40-60 seconds are as opposed to unlimited
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Warning: Opinions stated like they are facts below
I want another mind games killer.
Like seriously. Mind games are the most interesting player interaction you can really have.
If there is an objective best answer then it either becomes a puzzle game or it becomes "is your muscle memory good". Strategy requires uncertainty and that means there can't be a best option, however randomness is boring and uninteractive. Thus the Uncertainty should come from the players and your ability to manipulate, predict and fail to be predicted by them.
I do consider spirit to be the best Killer (In terms of fun. Not power)
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I'd say it would be best if chases were short with the main problem for killer not being losing time but rather losing the chase as a whole.
Or in otherwords, less ways for survivors to buy time in a chase. More ways for survivors to break line of sight in order to actually END chases. In theory both sides should be trying to end the chase as fast as possible. With survivor doing it so he can go back to doing gens, guarantee he won't get hooked ect and Killer so he can secure the hook
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To be fair. How exactly will seeing the survivors change how you play? It only does when altruism is involved (which to be fair is often)
Seeing the Killer however means you know your immediate next move and can know which gens are safe to do, if the killer is near the hooked survivor and thus you should or shouldn't go for the save, or if you should be hiding because you are about to be in their terror radius and it's a doctor
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@Tarvesh said:
Janick said:I do
Curious why we don’t see your opinion on what we come up with sometimes.
Most devs don't state it normally. That is hardly unique to these guys
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I mean I like the free wins. So in that sense facing Nurse is much worse than facing Freddy OR Legion
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@Janick said:
I doApparently he does
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Screw you guys. I want legion 3.4
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You can't balance around the assumption that Killers are using rare items since that obviously isn't a true assumption. Just like how you can't throw perks at a problem and call it solved, you can't throw Moris in the game and say that it solves SWF issuesThe_Crusader said:See this is the problem.
Survivors complain about moris, iridescent heads, Noed etc ruining their fun and personally I would agree with them.
But then you yet groups like those above and it exposes the hypocrisy and you realize that some of the OP things the killers have are there to balance it out. -
naaa. He should be in the survivor category silly
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@Gemasuda said:
So far 20 yes 8 no - Keep voting and share this with friends, we get enough participation maybe we will get a mod response. Thanks to all those who have already voted!You mean a SECOND mod response right?
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Remember that you can send a discord invite in the pregame.
And if we remove pregame then they could use their steams and DM them a discord invite ect ect ect.
Thus we cannot assume that everyone using VC will be in SWF so balancing by changing the game when SWF is used is futile
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@HazeHound said:
If you give survivors too much informations literally everyone will be genrushed.
Focus generators, use kindred, you don't need anything else.And then you can balance around the assumption that the killer will be gen rushed. Since right now that situation is survivor sided the solution is to give killers buffs.
If everyone is playing 100% perfectly the game should always be a stalemate (or decided by the games RNG)
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You already never get a speed penalty
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Pro tip: Make it start at 0 and count up rather than the other way around.
Having a unique noise when one is destroyed would be a similar effect.
You don't have to do it but it would make it closer to a QoL compared to counting down from 5 (since dull totems can be effected by things besides destroying.
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@Shad03 said:
Unfortunately ain't gonna happen. It's a random chance, and that random chance says no BBQClearly he didn't sacrifice enough survivors
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@NuclearBurrito said:
I kinda want to see a mode that removes ALL UI, aura tracking, heartbeats, scratch marks, audio notifications ect.Only keeping skill check UI.
Maybe even forcing perkless too.
Definitely would be somewhat interesting
@Maj33y said:
There needs to be a Mode like this with no Terror Radius , Scratch Marks , All notifications disabled including finished Generator locations , Hex Totems .. that'd be the ultimate Hardcore mode for the most experienced playersHmmm.....
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This is a nerf. If you instead waited for you to be hooked and unhooked before using current DS then the difference is that he gets stunned for longer now compared to before.
In any other situation current DS could be used while New DS can't be.
It is a straight nerf
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I kinda want to see a mode that removes ALL UI, aura tracking, heartbeats, scratch marks, audio notifications ect.
Only keeping skill check UI.
Maybe even forcing perkless too.
Definitely would be somewhat interesting