thesuicidefox
thesuicidefox
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@LegitAdventurer said:
Sounds like the Legion you faced was dumb to not break pallets. Every single killer should always break the pallet. Unless they are extremely proficient with mind games.No I looped him for 2 minutes before dropping a single pallet. Then I dropped it and looped for maybe another minute before they decided to break the pallet (because it was an infinite). When they did I managed to get away and hide, so all he would get from breaking the pallet early is time. He wouldn't catch me. And I've played several good Legions who tried to chase without Frenzy, and it's the same sort of thing every time. They get looped for a long time before they catch me, and in a good chunk of cases they don't even do that because I manage to hide.
If you are chasing a good INJURED survivor around a loop, you have to Frenzy hit them. If it's a bad loop, or just a bad position in general, you don't need to but if it's a good loop you do. Otherwise you will get looped for a long time and the others will gen rush. If you don't Frenzy hit then you have no pressure on the survivor with your slower movement speed.
Healing against Legion is a waste of time because of how frequently you will be injured by Frenzy. If you Frenzy hit me, then change targets I just mend immediately and rush a gen while you hunt down other survivors. I'm not going to waste that time healing, and if you find me again and don't Frenzy hit me while I'm injured I can punish the ish outta you.
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I agree, killer is a bit busted right now. A lot of issues, some general, some killer specific. I've been playing Trapper mostly since the update because I can't play Spirit, Huntress, or Nurse. I could play Hag but I'm honestly wanting a normal speed killer. Still, Trapper's traps are bugged. You can pick survivors up from the trap, you have to hit them first. If you pick them up you glitch in place.
It seems like a lot of animations were broken too. There's the very common skateboard bug when a survivor drops a pallet. But also Trapper's trap, Billy's saw, grabbing in general, etc. It's like the game is trying to reference an animation but the link is broken. I've seen a lot of T posing too, mostly in lobbies.
Hope the next patch addresses all this stuff. It should be top priority to get the game into working condition.
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FREDDY HUNGRY NOM NOM NOM NOM
Really though, Distortion is a very powerful perk. Freddy is a very weak killer. Don't nerf him, at least not yet. Wait for the rework THEN complain about it.
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The only thing is that, unless you do have BL the drop thing most likely won't matter. You have a rather long stun time and it's very rare to do it in such a way the killer loses sight of you for long enough. For a window/locker you don't NEED Lithe to get benefit. See what I'm saying? I'd be for the change because I use BL all the time but, if you don't have it I feel like the change wouldn't make a difference.
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Not a Pig main but I play a solid Pig.
Best add-on combos:
1) Video Tape/Combat Straps - Let's you use ambush to mind game at most pallets/loops. Also let's you play more stealthy more of the time. Generally the top choice because it's cheap and gives you the most options.
2) Tampered Timer/Annotated Plan (purple) - This is if you want trap kills. 5 boxes, 2 minute timer. Survivors need to be very optimal in their pathing or get very lucky and get the trap off on the first or second one. My friend and I tested, if you are perfect with pathing you can do all 5 with about 15 seconds to spare. That means if you catch them running to a box and chase them in the other direction, then leave them there is a high chance they will die to the trap.
3) Face Mask/Slow Toxin - Blindness and Exhaustion. Both very powerful and makes survivors panic.
4) Stacked Gears - Increasing time to search boxes. Good to make them waste a bit more time, especially if you don't have Ruin.My perk build is Whispers, Ruin, Nurse's Calling, and Blood Warden.
Whispers is great overall perk, and very good on Pig because she is stealth. Simply walk near a gen/totem/box/gate while crouched and if it procs they are there. Let's you know survivors are doing something without going all the way up to it, which means you can take a less obvious path to surprise them from an odd angle.
Ruin because slow the game JUST A LIL BIT. My general rule of thumb is to not use a trap until Ruin goes down or a gen pops. Exception if I catch the obsession, screw that dude he gets a trap right meow.
NC you could probably swap for BBQ, but the idea is that while stealth you can sneak up on people healing. This one you can take or leave really.
Blood Warden is, IMO, an absolute must on Pig. Always save 1 trap for endgame. When the gates power, find someone and down them ASAP. Ignore the doors, just focus on getting that guy down so you can proc BW. Put your trap on them, and if the gates aren't opened yet you can leave them slugged since they can't escape anyway. Doing this you can always be sure to proc BW by hooking the guy with the trap (or even better if you catch a second survivor hook them to proc BW, let the trap guy worry about his trap).
Ultimately perks are up to you though.
Biggest DON'Ts would be:
1) Don't always be crouching. When you need to get somewhere just go there. Only crouch around if you know you have the time.
2) Don't spam your traps. Spread them out. Like I said, wait until Ruin/1 gen before first trap. Save the next for when the next gen pops. Save 1 for endgame. If you spam all your traps, survivors won't do gens and take the traps off with no pressure. Then you lose because once you are out of traps/Ruin it's gen rush time.
3) Please for the love of Jebus, don't tunnel the guy with the trap. I see so many Pig's do this and lose because of it. If the trap is active you can leave them alone. Maybe chase them away from a box, or slug them. If you legit just find them and stuff sure take the hook. But if the timer is going and they just got saved go after someone else. All you do by tunneling the guy with the trap is signal to the other 3 survivors to gen rush, and they will and you will only get that 1 guy (sometimes you might not even get them too).
4) Don't be surprised if survivors aren't falling for ambush. Good survivors are hard to surprise, especially because Pig makes a very audible breathing sound. If survivors seem like they are always aware of where you are, there is a chance they have Spine Chill/Prem. You won't surprise these guys. Also examine your own pathing. You may feel stealthy but you will be easily spotted by survivors. Case and point, wide open areas don't even bother with crouch. Around buildings and stuff though, yea use that ish because you have more stuff to block their line of sight. -
@LegitAdventurer said:
I'm just going to comment on this part, because i hear this a LOT from survivors. PLEASE don't heal against me as Legion. I'll be the happierst Legion alive and just one shot everyone to death. You'll just be loud ass moaning and groaning meat targets just praying to get M1'd. That would be the easist game of my life.Trust me, if you do that to a survivor like me I will just run to the strongest loop in the game and you will chase me for a solid 2 minutes unless you Frenzy. Did it to a Legion last night that refused to Frenzy chase if you were injured. I ran into Ward (already injured from a Frenzy attack earlier) and looped him for 2 minutes, dropped the pallet (which he refused to break) and did an infinite loop until he lost me/gave up. Sadly, the rest of my team insisted on healing to full every time so all the time I bought in my chases was wasted. If there were 3 other survivors like me that don't heal, that's an easy gen rush 3-4 gen chase.
If you don't Frenzy chase expect to get looped super hard. You are better off using Frenzy in those situations. The only survivors you will catch with your normal speed are the potato ones (which is most of the survivor population but I digress).
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@GraviteaUK said:
I hate him simply because the creators lacked imagination when creating him.When i saw a snow map being made i thought Omg "Abominable snowman" "Yeti" "Wendigo"
What did we get? a dude in a hoodie a mixtape and a knife, very inspired......
To be fair, his knife is one of the coolest looking weapons in the game.
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My game bugged over a month ago and I had no HUD for an entire trial. I will tell you a perk like this would be beyond OP. I was basically useless. The only thing I could do was get the killer's attention and run. Couldn't do gens. Couldn't heal. Didn't even know the progress of the game. Didn't know who was downed or who was an obsession (if there was one). Didn't even know if my Exhaustion was gone. Thankfully I could still see auras so I could make saves and stuff. No notifications or anything, so I had no idea if Hexes were in play or if I was Exposed, or if the killer had something like Sloppy or Thana. I managed to escape because the other survivors were actually good and I did a good job of running from the killer during the game.
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I don't mind it if I'm a Hag or Trapper because I can make the pantry incredibly unsafe. Any other killer though it is rough depending on what windows/doors spawn, and if the basement is there or not. As Huntress I want to say I generally like the map because you have a lot of high ground positions you can hatchet from and there's not a lot of good cover in the middle of the map. But then the pantry itself can be a nightmare in a chase because you are slow and there are no good sight lines.
As survivor I generally always like this map because it's good survivor map. Except when I'm facing Hag/Trapper, then I will usually stay away from the pantry.
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@anarchy753 said:
I think it boils down to the biggest issue of flashlights. It isn't that they can force the killer to drop a survivor, possibly repeatedly if you get unlucky with where walls are, it's that most blinds come at a point where the killer is locked into an animation and has no ability to control their camera to avoid it. It's a mechanic designed to be highly punishing but counterplayed by looking away, and most of the time that counterplay just isn't available.Yea because if there was no locked animation its would be super easy to avoid a FL. It's already pretty easy to avoid. Look at a wall, or just in the opposite direction from the FL guy. Don't just pick up someone if you know there is another survivor with a FL, check the area first. Mash the drop button when they run out, even if they get the blind you will just sponge it and drop them. Land a hit on the FL guy and they will be less likely to FL you. Really I never get FL and think "OMG these things are broken please fix". I think "I messed up I should have expected that/counter played". Sometimes it's a legit surprise, when they find it, but then it's like, well played dude. He got me once now I know to be more careful. If he gets me again it's no one's fault but my own.
Survivors can be screwed by an animation lock too. Slow vault is the best example I can give. If you know it will be a slow vault, then you don't vault, because doing so is a definite grab/hit. You are better off trying to juke/360 in those cases. There is also the unhook animation lock, which you can cancel now but doing so cancels the unhook too. If you want to actually unhook you are stuck in the animation.
It's a matter of "you can't do that because I can punish it". Take away the "you can't do that" and you take away the punish too. Like when I chase a survivor near a fake pallet (fake as in there is no mind game and killer wins, eg. the pallet by the car on Haddonfield, or the pallet at the parallel walled jungle gyms) and they try to mind game me I just say to myself "you can't do that, I can punish you". Then I chase and bait the pallet drop but go around the wall/tree/whatever and hit them just as they finish dropping the pallet. A smart survivor would KNOW they can't mind game those pallets and either drop it early, or drop it when they are sure I will swing through the pallet.
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When I was little my mother used to beat me with a wooden spoon.
Until one day she hit my ass so hard the spoon broke. Then she just used her fist, and was extra mad I broke her spoon.
True story bro.
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Jingle Bells
Trapper Smells
Myers stalks your way
Bing Bong Boi
Lost his toy
Survivors got away HEYJingle Bells
Spirit Yells
When she swings her blade
Huntress throws
And Freddy knows
That he's the worst made HEY -
I guess no one saw my previous post I'll type it in big letters...
@thesuicidefox said:
They mentioned something like this on the last stream. Pretty much this exact idea.
I don't heal against Legion unless I'm on my last hook or I need to make a risky save or something. Otherwise you are better just being injured. Had a Legion last night that wouldn't Frenzy chase if you were injured and I was able to loop him for a while several times around pallets he wouldn't break either. I was in an SWF group that INSISTED on healing though, even when I told them don't bother, they still did. We only just barely got 2 gens and I managed to hatch. If they listened to me they could have finished all the gens while I was getting chased by a 110 killer on Ward (and I had BL, he chased me for a solid 2 minutes) I'm sure at least 3 of us would have gotten out. Sent GGs to killer after the game and said my team was dumb for healing every time they got hit. He was saying that it works for him because then he can down you faster if he finds you again, to which I made the point that because he refused to Frenzy chase me when I was injured I was able to infinite him in the main building. Little debate back and forth, but the short of it is that if you play Legion and get survivors that will always heal before doing something, chances are you will 3k/4k because they just waste a lot of time. Get 4 survivors like me that use IW and Adren and stay injured, we rush gens and loop you because you are slow, forcing you to Frenzy chase at certain loops.
I think Legion needs a rework already. Between this and the potential exploit of Bloodhound moonwalking chase cheese Legion is not very well designed.
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@SirMurphAlot said:
@thesuicidefox yeah your right there is no consistency thats why the experiment fails because of how consistent it is. Same perks and same players (besides the random killers) Why not take the .1% of killers and play against them, but no they used what @AlwaysInAGoodShape has said to be the broken rank system to do there experiment. Yes you can get better at this game just like any player survivor or killer but what i compared was the percentage of it, that was my point. You say killer is weaker because the .1% of great survivors beat the other 99.9% of players, thats a joke of a reason and why its not an experiment because you can control it.You understand that in order for an experiment to be valid, it needs to show consistent results right? It would actually be less valid if they reduced the consistency.
You don't seem to understand how meta works. Meta is basically optimal play. If all players do the perfect thing for every situation, what are the results? The results would be that the survivors have the advantage. You can argue that no one plays perfectly, and you are right, but when we talk about balance & design this is how you have to look at it. If you look at it where everyone always does the wrong thing for every situation, then there is no consistency to the results. It's just a random jumble of outcomes. You can't balance around random outcomes.
If a chess game started both players with completely random set of pieces, you can't balance that because there's no consistency. You would have no idea which are the better pieces, or tactics, because it's all chance. But start everyone with the same set of pieces and no you can systematically find where the design problems are. Which pieces are too strong/weak (and by result how many each player should get) and which tactics are the superior ones (or broken in some cases).
You also keep point to this 99%/1% thing and saying that you shouldn't balance the game for all based on a few players. But if those few players are playing the game as it should be played, in it's most optimal state, that's the only thing that matters. Again because the 99% aren't playing optimally there is no consistency to balance around. They are objectively playing the game wrong, and as such outcomes don't make sense.
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@Speshul_Kitten said:
They should also remove ‘lessening the mist’ for survivors. Better yet, they should allow you to burn offerings/add-ons for a small rebate on bloodpoints. I have HUNDREDS of add-ons and offerings that I will NEVER use.To this I say no. I offer clear fog if I've been going against a lot of baby killers or if the killer in previous games had a rough time. Kinda of like a peace offering to the killer.
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@Emeal said:
Nah man!
Fog is hella good for Wraith.Good survivors will still see you. You're just making it harder for you to find them. I've never had trouble tracking a killer. Wraith, Myers, Pig, Freddy. Doesn't matter if you understand what a killer is doing and how they path they are easy as hell to spot. I can count on 1 hand how many times a stealth killer got the jump on me in the last like 6 months, and most of them were tier 1 Myers with M&A.
Thicker fog always hurts the killer more. There really is no valid reason to ever use them.
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@RabidWabbitz said:
@thesuicidefox said:
IMO the reboot was good. It made him more scary and wasn't so cartoony with the violence. The old movies were fun too, but people hate on the reboot and it wasn't really all that bad.
I agree the reboot Freddy was great and I think if they didn't make it so blatantly about child molestation it would have been a hit because I loved the way Jackie Earle Haley portrayed Freddy. It was a great take on how scary Freddy could be. Also I believe one of the best lines came from the Reboot "Why are you crying? I haven't even cut you yet!" Awesome!!
I personally would love to see another reboot where Freddy is portrayed more like Hat Man (Google it "shadow people Hat Man") as a more psychological/paranormal horror movie than previous films. Make it super scary, in a similar vein of Insidious or Conjuring but R rated instead of pg13.
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IMO Trapper is the very middle of the tier list. While it's generally easy to avoid his trap, all you need is like 1 or 2 trap hits to sway the game. If he basements you he can make it near impossible to save on some maps. He can also semi-permanently shut down certain loops or safe spots by placing a trap, and if you have either of his iridescent add-ons it becomes actually permanent. He's the only killer that can make the safe spots in the game unsafe.
Huntress is better than Clown and Myers. She IS the best killer in a chase right after Nurse. She's the only killer than can down multiple survivors quickly outside of LF chainsaw (which sucks in comparison actually).
I also think Spirit is better than Hag only because she is much harder to beat in a chase. Hag is more about map pressure but she can't chase where she doesn't have traps. It's close but I think Spirit is a bit better.
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@Poweas SB/BL have counterplay in some situations. Huntress and Nurse specifically can beat them by predicting your path. Billy can chainsaw sprint and not let go when he gets close if he expects it. Clown and Doc can inflict exhaustion on you (Huntress too).
I'd also rank DH as number 2, because even though it can be countered by simply waiting as killer, there are some times where there is no counter, such as if they run through a pallet or to a window. Then you almost have to swing and let them dodge it with DH or else they gain distance and keep the DH.
SB/Lithe would be the worst only because their only real use is to avoid the chase or break the chase respectively, both of which won't really work against a good killer. Only time it would is if you gain enough distance that the killer CHOOSES to break the chase. Also Lithe with DWM is quite powerful, so I would say SB is now the worst exhaustion perk. Good for beginners but ultimately useless against good killers.
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They mentioned something like this on the last stream. Pretty much this exact idea.
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@FayeZahara said:
Last streams i checked his change is coming sometime soon next year. There working on his prototype they also explained when they have to change almost everything it takes time. Its kinda sounding like his is getting rebuilt. He turned alot of freddy lovers away when not only was he the reboot but also didn't play like freddy. He needed time to be really researched and worked on and hope they give that. Cause if his power is new and i don't feel like freddy. I think im done and won't be back til hear candyman is in the game xD
They need to be thinking can i say the freddy ######### line and feel like i [BAD WORD] with the survivors and were there worst nightmare. If he can't do that he might as well be gone and replaced with a sandman killer replacing his body.IMO the reboot was good. It made him more scary and wasn't so cartoony with the violence. The old movies were fun too, but people hate on the reboot and it wasn't really all that bad.
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@SirMurphAlot said:
@GodDamn_Angela how is that not the same the smallest % is what you people are trying to go by, the .1% of dead by daylight survivors are why you are saying killers are weak.Because you can get better at the game and become that 1%. You can't change your blood type.
Also the best players play the game how it supposed to be played, in the most optimal form. Any flaws in the design are magnified at this level. Low level play is too chaotic to balance because there is no consistency.
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@Nickenzie said:
Hangman's Trick:
Unique modifications to your hooks make them deadly. Whenever a survivor sabotaged a hook, it will repair itself 50/75/100% faster than normal. Additionally, sabotaging is dangerous; healthy survivors will take one state of damage upon sabotaging a hook.HT should really repair in a time not at increased rate. It would still take like 60 seconds to respawn a hook, not useful if someone breaks it as you are carrying. The second part is a good addition though.
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A 3 gen Doc is by far the absolute worst thing to go against as survivor. I'd rather get Insidious LF basement camped 5 games in a row than escape 1 game against 3 gen Doc.
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Defeats the purpose of the perk though. You start the trial injured, and there are several perks tied to being injured.
Also if you face the common NM problem of never being slugged it's because you're not doing it right. If the killer finds you alone, you are just like any other injured survivor to them and they will chase/hook you. What you want to do is wait for the killer to be chasing SOMEONE ELSE, someone that they really want to catch (an obsession maybe) and right before they do you jump out and sponge the hit. Most killers panic when you do that. They get so focused on the other guy they will slug you to keep chasing. If you do it right you can basically force the killer to tunnel you and they will get frustrated that they can't catch other people. They will slug you trust me.
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Also odd that 0 isn't an option. If everyone dies but it was a solid game and we all pipped, that's still a win for me.
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@Wolf74 said:
@danara said:
Wolf74 said:How many meta perks is a non meta build allowed to include?
I don’t mind some meta perks just trying to stay away from ds, adrenaline and such. Self care should be fine as its almost mandatory when playing solo but also don’t mind bond. As for exhaustion perks I don’t mind as I usually run bl/deadhard but am open to using lithe, I just dislike sb though I know some people don’t use exhaustion perks at all
If a build has 2 of the hardcore meta perks, it should not include any runner ups, if you ask me.
Hard meta = SC/SB(BL/DH/Lithe)/DS
Runner ups = Adr, Bond, BT, Emp, IW, NM, UE, We#ll make it, WGLFJust MHO
LOL, NM isn't a meta perk. Get outta here wit dat.
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NO MITHER FIGHT CLUB
-No Mither
-Resilience
-Borrowed Time
-KindredPlay to DIE. Rush gens, saves, Hex totems, and heals. Literally don't ever walk unless you are doing it to avoid the killer. Take hits/hooks for other players. If it's a Pig, you are no allow to take off the trap just gen rush until you die. If it's a Myers do your best to sponge that tier 3/tombstone if someone else is getting chased. If the gates are open and the killer doesn't have a kill you must offer yourself as a sacrifice to them. Bringing items or game altering offerings is forbidden. You are only allowed to escape if at least 1 other player is dead. And if anyone needs a save YOU MUST SAVE even if it means you die instead.
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@Master said:
Just upgrade your console, put a better gpu and cpu in it
Funny. Except that even if we could the game locks the frame rate, and the code isn't at all optimized for our platform so it wouldn't make a lick of difference. My Xbox One X is probably more powerful than your PC (I can run Gears 4 in 4k at 60FPS, can your PC do that? And if it can, how much did you pay? .... although I admit I don't own a 4k TV :'( point still stands) and almost every game I play now runs amazingly. DBD though... I feel like I'm playing on my n64 sometimes.
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@scorpio said:
@thesuicidefox said:
I think we haven't heard anything because it's difficult to come up with good solutions to his problems. Wraith, Trapper, and Hag reworks were all pretty straightforward. Mostly involved reworking add-ons and slightly tweaking the power (base Windstorm for Wraith, sped up trap placement for Hag/Trapper).Freddy's power is more intricate. If you just boost numbers he would actually become very overpowered. So they probably need to rework his power from scratch which takes more time.
They said he is the next killer to get a rework. We just don't know when. Patience my young Fredward.
If all they did was shorten the time it takes him to bring people into the dream world he would be sooooo much better and I don't think overpowered at all because he would still need to bring people into the dream world to injure them just like now, but as it stands it takes way too long.
See this wouldn't really fix anything. You can still have people do stuff right in your face and you can't stop them. It might be a bit harder to do, but still possible. Waking up is also way too easy right now, this doesn't fix that either. And survivors get frustrated playing against him because he is invisible when awake and can see your aura when asleep. Lower transition time doesn't fix any of that. A 7 second transition wouldn't be an issue if the transition phase blocked you from repairing/healing/gates/cleansing. In fact the longer transition might be beneficial in this case. We need more interesting and less lazy solutions.
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No. Freddy is special when it comes to auras. Stuff like OOO actually benefit him. Rancor is great for him because the obsession probably won't even know until the last gen pops. Take that away and you take away a major part of his kit.
That said, whenever we get a rework, as I'm sure he will be more powerful as a result, I'm fine with allowing survivor aura perks to work on him when awake. Rancor, however, should stay as it is. It's a very unique interaction that shouldn't be lost.
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I think we haven't heard anything because it's difficult to come up with good solutions to his problems. Wraith, Trapper, and Hag reworks were all pretty straightforward. Mostly involved reworking add-ons and slightly tweaking the power (base Windstorm for Wraith, sped up trap placement for Hag/Trapper).
Freddy's power is more intricate. If you just boost numbers he would actually become very overpowered. So they probably need to rework his power from scratch which takes more time.
They said he is the next killer to get a rework. We just don't know when. Patience my young Fredward.
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KNIFEY STABBY TIME
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As killer: multiple DS's, frame drops, Haddonfield.
As survivor: laggy connections, anything Doctor, killers that get tilted when you outplay them and resort to lame tactics as "punishment" for just playing well.
As both: players that DC. Survivor or killer. Just take the L and move on. Also players that blame everything on other players or the game when in reality they just suck.
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@Dehitay said:
The original post isn't taking into account that those parts of it that are valid only mean that the killer is stronger than an individual survivor. You're up against 4 of these things. Sure, I can benchpress 100 pounds with ease. Doesn't mean that 100 pounds is so ignorable that I can benchpress 400 pounds easily.These things? Hey buddy we aren't "things" okay. We are cockroaches. GET IT RIGHT!
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@ReneAensland said:
@HatCreature said:
@Rebel_Raven said:
HatCreature said:@Onionthing said:
sometimes i wish there were no chat options in this game ... killer side or survivor side. One of the things I loved about the "souls" games ... people had to go out of their way to trash talk, otherwise most people didnt feel it was worth it..
You should play on console then, no chat there.
Oh, that's not really the case.
Swfs are usually in party chat, and can invite you on the fly to join if you aren't in the SWF.
And unless you have access blocked, they can still message you.I always thought it was weird when Survivors would message me before the match started, when I'm the Killer. How do you find out who the Killer is before the match even starts?
On console?
Press and Hold Home.
Go to Dead by Daylight.
Who I'm Playing With.
If the names don't match the survivors you're with, it's the killer.This must be a PS4 thing because on Xbox the killer doesn't show up in recent players until about 2 minutes into the trial.
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Yea it's rough for killer. I'm getting juked not because of skill but because I press RT and get frame drops. Refusing to play Spirit until they fix the sound, Huntress/Nurse until they fix the frame rate, and Doctor because he is cancer and I will never play that POS.
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You best get dat ass out dat trial ASAP.
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........7
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Survivors need a song too. Like this one
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LACbVhgtx9I -
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@The_Crusader said:
Dribbling isnt a counter. What do I do if they're too far to dribble? Oh thats right nothing. Something which is so situational is not a true counter. Also they can counter that "counter" with flashlights, instaheals or body blocking. They have enough time to set up for it too.Enduring helps but DS can still guarentee a free escape even with it, and they can still get a free escape, make it to a pallet and loop more.
Yes you're right counter play matters, hence why DS needs to go. Thanks for agreeing.
LOL "this thing that counters this other thing... yea not a counter". Dribbling does indeed counter DS. I dribble DS users all the time to counter DS GASP. If there's no hooks nearby I slug them, also a counter because now someone has to come save them and waste time.
You also seem to think that counter play means "to defeat" when it can also mean "to mitigate". Something doesn't have to be completely countered for there to be counter play. Reducing the effectiveness of something is counter play too. For example, you can use TINH to counter Ruin. It doesn't outright remove the effect, but it does make it easier to hit great skill checks an minimize it's impact on the game.
And I told you to stop putting words into people's mouths. I said DS has counter play. Therefore I don't agree with you.
@powerbats said:
@thesuicidefox said:
@powerbats said:
AD is very situational and requires you not to be dead or on the hook when the gens pop. Balanced Landing is great if you're on say Gideons Haddonfield etc but on Autohaven you're screwed.Sorry, AD?
Adrenaline sorry.
Ok, just really quick want to point out that if you are hooked when the last gen pops and you get saved, Adren procs the moment you are saved. I use Adren often and know this for a fact, it's a major reason why it's such a powerful perk. The only time it doesn't proc is if you have Deep Wounds, since it can't heal that.
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@Well_Placed_HexTotem said:
If someone breaks my totem at the start of the match before I can even make my way over to it, they’re getting hooked and hard patrolled.If I know you‘re SWF and I chase some off my totem and then immediately after while I’m still chasing, a SWF buddy breaks it, they’re getting hard patrolled.
If you break my totem in front of me, it’s probably a face camp depending on how the match is going. If there are 4-5 gens left and I can spare some time, it’s the face camp.
LMFAO By this logic, if you are a Doctor or Wraith I'm going out of my way to troll you and take your game hostage. God forbid someone just plays the game right?
The Dead Sea called. They want their salt back.
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@powerbats said:
AD is very situational and requires you not to be dead or on the hook when the gens pop. Balanced Landing is great if you're on say Gideons Haddonfield etc but on Autohaven you're screwed.Sorry, AD?
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@The_Crusader said:
Does it matter if theres no counter play? Theres none to DS and no dribbling doesn't count because its very situational and survivors will often run to areas with no hooks to trigger it.I'm tired of these double standards on the survivor side.
1) There is counter play to DS. Dribbling is counter play, why you dismiss it is beyond me. Enduring also makes DS far less impactful, and therefore can be considered counter play. Slugging is also an option. Just because someone has DS doesn't mean there is absolutely no way to play around it. Sometimes counter play is situation dependent. There is 0 counter play to Myers tapping tier 3 while directly behind you. But when it's not that situation there is counter play.
2) Counter play matters because if you can't counter it then it just becomes either an overpowered or trolly tactic. If you can counter play it then it's not an exploit.
3) Stop putting words into people's mouths. Stop assuming because someone disagrees with you it automatically makes there points survivor/killer sided whatever the case may be. And stop with the "well the OTHER side can do this this and this" as if that justifies something. That's called a tu quoque ("you too") fallacy. -
@The_Crusader said:
Legion struggles to build pressure by moonwalking.It takes too long and he often has to walk too far. Survivors can win as a team easily. No problem.You seem to be confused.
Stating that Legion moonwalk chase MIGHT be an exploit is not the same as saying it IS an exploit. The crux of the argument falls on whether or not there is reasonable counter play. Currently no one knows how to counter it. If, in 3 months, this is still the case then chances are there is no counter play and it is an exploit. Whether it is exploit for major gain, minor gain, or no gain doesn't make a difference.
I'm sitting on the fence, though I am more inclined to believe it's not an exploit and that counter play will be found, simply based on my own experience with these sorts of things.
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@redsopine01 said:
DwightsLifeMatters said:What's so special about lagswitching on console?
It's supposed to be impossible as the consoles record and then the respective party's ban lagswitchers
It depends on the game. Games with dedicated servers (which is now most multiplayer games on Xbox at least) you can't. But a game like DBD you can because it's p2p.
In fact modding is actually possible on consoles too. Maybe not so much the current generation, but here's a video of some modders in Gears of War 2 on Xbox 360:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mERbP8fNcoJust so you know, the guys on the other team were the modders. They got host and because of that were able to modify the game. See how I have like 100000 ammo for everything and my bullets insta-down. I thought my Xbox was going to red ring when I started to spam the smoke grenades. I pulled my Ethernet cord to leave the game just to break the connection, to be sure they weren't doing other even more nefarious things.
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I'd rather they just lock survivor builds at 45 seconds and let the killer adjust up until the last second. The timer should go all the way to 0 before locking out the killer.
Knowing the killer before the game starts will just make people dodge. Plus, knowing that and just getting to change 1 perk is MASSIVE. Everyone would run Calm Spirit against every single Doc they face. UE against every Hag. Spine Chill/Prem against every Freddy/Wraith/Pig/Myers.
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@The_Crusader said:
And like I said there are plenty of videos out there humiliating bad or inexperienced killers. Noob3 made a name off it.IF SOMETHING WORKS AGAINST BAD OR INEXPERIENCED PLAYERS THAT DOES NOT MAKE IT AN EXPLOIT
By this logic literally everything is an exploit because bad players will fall for anything. Like seriously, learn how to spin your camera. It's not rocket science.
The fact 360 has counter play, very easy counter play actually, means it's not an exploit.
Legion walking backwards to cheese the chase mechanics may or may not have counter play. Currently no counter play is known, but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist. If it does, then it's not an exploit. If it doesn't, then it's an exploit and should be fixed.
"So what's the counter play?!" I don't know. It's possible there is none, but like I point out things can change in the future. Considering I don't ALWAYS play against a Legion, and when I do they don't ALWAYS do this tactic, it may be some time before I find proper counter play. The video posted earlier had an Adam that was actually doing a decent job of countering it by waiting at a pallet to drop on the killer then forcing a chase when they go to break.
I'm not jumping on the bandwagon that it's an exploit just because RIGHT NOW there is no counter play. Like I keep saying I've seen this sort of thing before. Case and point Halo 2, I actually know the guy that discovered the noob combo (Plasma Pistol > BR instakill). He was a high school friend that introduced me to tournament organizing many years ago. When the game came out, he was running a tournament for the game at a local LAN shop. He was also a semi-pro player in Halo CE. I was a regular there and already ran tournaments for Smash, so he invited me to be his teammate for the 2v2. He showed me the noob combo and we destroyed everyone. So many people were quick to cry fowl and say we were cheating, but it was just a simple dynamic discovered in the game to insta-kill. Skip 6 months and people found ways to play around noob combo. It was still quite powerful, but not unbeatable. Really the best counter play is to just bait the PP shot and dodge it by going behind a wall, or tossing a nade at their feet to force them to jump away and mess up the BR follow up shot. What seemed like an exploit at first wasn't later on.
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I've seen a lagswitcher on DBD for Xbox before. He was a Doc too, I'm wondering maybe it was the same guy.
He did it to both me and my friend several times across multiple games. Things would be totally fine, but if you hit him with a FL suddenly the game becomes super laggy and when it stops you are either on a hook or being carried to one. I confronted him about this one time it was kinda obvious. I said "did you just lag switch?" and his response was something like "I wanted to do it the easy way, but then you hit me with a FL" hinting that yes he did indeed do it. He also rage quits if you destroy his Ruin.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZpIog7e-R4