Aven_Fallen
Aven_Fallen
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Personally, I am not a big fan of this. I think Spine Chill(or Alert) is a Perk which is not good enough to actually get nerfed by this. I mean, lets face it, the real problem is Object of Obsession. And instead of changing Object of Obsession, they came with such a mechanic.
I mean, I could not care less, since I am not using Spine Chill, but still, I feel that Perks do not need to be weaker, just because one Perk is the problematic one.
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Would be only possible for Ash, since his Head and Body are one piece.
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Only BT should work vs Freddy. Otherwise he is in a really good spot, would be happy if other Killers released would be at his Level.
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@NuclearBurrito said:
Why do people keep bringing up the Legion update?
He wasn't nerfed. Legion went from being a bad Killer to being a bad Killer for different reasons.
Honestly, this is the best description of the Legion Rework that I have read here.
Here, take my +.
And my Axe.
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The only way I can play Legion atm is a huge Slowdown Build. PGTW, Sloppy Butcher, Thanatophobia and Dying Light. And honestly, it is not going that bad, but the games are really long with a lot of going back and forth and it is not fun to go against this.
I dont think he is the weakest Killer, but Legion needs some Buffs, even tho I am not sure how they want to do that, without making them as unfun as old Legion.
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I am up for a number Buff. I would have been ok with the Number Buff before they scrapped it, but that was with old Legion being around, and it is kinda dumb to buff Thanatophobia with a Killer around which makes healing meaningless.
I am always up for a Number Buff. I would not include Dead Survivors, because a Survivor Dead is already bad for the Survivor Team. If someone dies early, it can be gg already for the Killer, no reason to lower the chances of Survivors even more.
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I would go for 2 Hatchets. This would be something in the middle (in fact, 2 is the middle of 1 (without Infantry Belt) and 3(with Infantry Belt).
But I like other Ideas, like this one:
@HexDeadByMoonlight said:
Iridescent heads should just refill your hatchets each time you miss/hit survivor with your power.
This would be really cool, ngl. Something to stop wasting the time to get new Hatchets, while still let them remain fair as they are.
This Clip is from 6 months ago tho. Could already be scrapped.
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@NoShinyPony said:
@Aven_Fallen When you try to trivialise unfairness by saying "fairness is such a subjective thing", then there is really no point here.
If you go for exactly 6 words out of my posting, yeah, there is no point.
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Seems like the Japanese DBD Community is really active on Twitter. The German Trends are way different (fun fact: a few days ago "Boobs" was the Number 1 German Trend. But I got disappointed when clicking it).
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Clearly OP. Survivors have OP Stuff as well, but this also needs to be looked at. And Ebonies get even more OP, when equipped on a strong Killer. Like, yesterday I faced a Doctor with an Ebony, was not even mad, because he is playing a bad Killer, so let him have his Ebony to win (even tho, this does not make it balanced). But if I see a Prayer Beads Spirit with an Ebony, and I get grabbed from a Gen at the start and afterwards morid, I am not that happy about that.
And I feel they are not that rare. I have way more Ebony Moris on my Hillbilly than Ivory Moris. Maybe it is because Hillbilly does not have pink Add-Ons, but from my experience they are not that rare.
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@NoShinyPony said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/744073#Comment_744073
Survivors at high ranks bring the good stuff either simply because they can or because they wouldn't stay at high ranks without.
And you are derailing. The question we are discussing is: Is it fair that killers have to equip perks + add-ons while survivors don't? If you think "yes, I want it to be that way", just say so and we'll move on.
Fairness is such a subjective thing.
I mean, from the point of: Survivors dont need Items/Killers need Add-Ons, sure it would not be fair. But other things in this game are also not fair, like, why should I need certain Perks to go against certain Killers?
But when we take into account that Killers earn more BPs AND have BBQ, which leads to even more BPs by simply doing the Objective, there should not be any problem for Killers to equip Add-Ons. Like, even a mediocre game will get 25k BPs, make that 50k with BBQ. This is one Bloodweb at Level 50. So Add Ons are easily affordable.
What is not ok are Add-Ons which are basically needed for the Killer to be playable. I gave examples for that. And no, I dont think that Nurse will go into this category. She will use Add-Ons in the future, but I guess this is fine, with the amount of BPs Killers can earn during their games.
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@FireHazard said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/744080#Comment_744080
Seriously, if that's true than it's quite odd to have that mind-set...
Don't you think?
I mean, it looks like that. And you cannot deny that not everyone is writing such a long, analytical post like you. But I feel that sometimes a little bit of testing would be good, before jumping on conclusions, but it is how it is.
LIke I said, the same happened with Freddy. Some people thought he would still be weak, some others said that he is OP. He is neither, he is basically in a very good spot (in fact, if every Killer released would be around Freddy-Level, I would be quite happy).
And I can ensure you that after 3 matches on the PTB, people would still claim that Nurse is OP. While others, who played 1 match and did not get a 4K, would say that she is Legion-Level.
In the end, only after a few weeks on the Live Server, a real judgment about Nurse can be made.
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Because it always happens.
When Freddy got reworked, he was both still weak (some said even weaker than before) and OP. Now you only hear some poor souls claiming he is OP (which he is not).
Instead of testing, start crying out as loud as possible. Thats the DBD-Community.
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@NoShinyPony said:
@Aven_Fallen "Add Ons exist for the reason to use them. It is bizarre to think it is ok to have a Killer who does neither need Add Ons nor Perks."
It is bizarre that this should only apply to killers and not survivors.
I dont see that many Survivors with Meme Builds or no Perks in Red Ranks tbh.
And it is a strange logic to say that Killers need more BPs than Survivors, because they need to use Add-Ons, but than they are not willing to accept that the one Killer who does not need Add-Ons and is the best for years will get nerfed.
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I plan on getting all Nea-Cosmetics, even tho there are many I would not consider using at all. Dont have anything similar for any Killer, since I am not maining someone (maybe Billy, but I dont like the fact that almost every Cosmetic for him is a Joke-Cosmetic).
And I also would like to have all Survivors and all Killers on P3-50 with all Perks, long way to go to achieve this.
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@NoShinyPony said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/742024#Comment_742024
Weird that you think that it's healthy for the game when killers depend on strong perks + add-ons while survivors can run whatever fun build they want or go perkless without problems.
If I misunderstood and you think that all killers should be viable without perks and add-ons, correct me please.
Add Ons exist for the reason to use them. It is bizarre to think it is ok to have a Killer who does neither need Add Ons nor Perks. How can you balance around that when one Killer does not need this stuff, but others highly depend on using Add Ons?
I doubt that Nurse will be in a state that you have to use certain Add Ons to make her work (like you have to do with Killers like Trapper(Bags) or Wraith(Windstorm/Swift Hunt Combo)), but that different Add Ons give her some different options during the game(like Freddy).
And well, I hope for all Killers to be at roughly the same Level. This is not possible with current Nurse. Maybe it is now better to balance the game, when there is not that one Killer, which has outdated design and breaks the game.
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Temporary answer. I can say for sure that I think THAT changes to her Add-Ons and Basekit are fine. But I cannot say for sure that THIS changes to her Add-Ons or Basekit are fine.
I guess it will take some time to find this out, people need to get used to Nurse again on the Live Version.
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@Emhyr said:
Well guys calm down, i do agree with the nerf of Nurse. She was excessively strong without any add-ons and perks even if i'm main killer and love playing her she needed a nerf. I'm just questionning myself about the 3sec cooldown for each teleport, with a speedmove at 3meters/sec she would be easy to run i think but they can change her before the release on official servers...
In the same time, if they are chaging so much killers i expect they will make something about the genrush problem : as a killer at redranks you can encounters swf teams who rush gens in 5min and this is too strong. We really need something to slow down the genrushing if BHVR is nerfing all top tiers killers. Because at red ranks we needed strong killers like nurse to counter this rushes
What I hope that might happen now:
Before the changes, you were not really able to balance. You cannot bring every Killer to Nurse-Level, this would be insane. But now with a lower level, they might be able to buff all other Killers OR change the way the Survivor Objective works. Not really possible to balance around something when there is the Nurse, who simply does not fit into the game (like I said earlier, she is outdated design).
So I would guess that the Nurse-Nerf is something in a bigger picture.
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Yep, hyped for it. I am always up to some goals while playing. Gets me way more excited than the ST Chapter (or basically all the content since Plague, since I am fed up with licensed Characters atm).
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@SteelDragon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/743843#Comment_743843
Haddonfield, infinites, large maps like temple of purgation, the nurse nerf called "slight changes to basekit", insta heals, keys, gen rushing, un-mindgameable pallets. want me to go on?
Healing Nerf, upcoming Change to Medkits (I dont know about you, but I highly doubt that this is a Buff), Exhaustion Nerf, many Pallets removed, Moris, Prayer Beads, Iridescent Head, Mint Rag/Rusty Shackles, PGTW-Buff, Freddy Rework, Badham Rework, NOED. Want me to go on?
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@PickCollins said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/742024#Comment_742024
And every other killer except Spirit and Billy isn't viable at the highest levels of play without add-ons.
Do you not hear yourself?
Killers: Of course we deserve more Bloodpoints, we need Add-Ons.
Killers: Complain about using Add-Ons.
And yes, I think it is justified that Killers use Add-Ons. But some Add-Ons are way too needed, but this is not something the Nurse will suffer from I guess (e.g. Trappers Bags, you basically need them).
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I hope for Insta Heal Nerfs or Reworks, but not Nerfs to standard Medkits.
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Were those manual DCs or Gamecrashes? When there is no sound, it is a gamecrash.
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Or the Nurse can simply burn an Autohaven-Offering. At least this is what I would do when using this Add-On.
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@coppersly said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/742024#Comment_742024
I, and many like me, have been using Nurse as the template for what killers should be.
Should could use her power whenever she wanted without some stupid cooldown getting in the way and making her an m1 killer while on cooldown, and it rewarded your skill each use. You could not get a hit unless you were trying, that is rewarding skill (dumpstered because you'll never catch up to them now)
She could be used without addons and perks and still stand a chance. When there is no perks or items in a tournament like setting she was pretty much the only viable killer. Now it will be a breeze to walk over any killer with or without addons (de-pip squad style)
ALL killers SHOULD be red rank viable. Devs have made it clear they don't care about that though and are fine with a few killers being unplayable in higher elo. Nurse was one such killer that only worked in high elo anyway. GONE.
"stand a chance". She was the best Killer BY FAR for many years. Sure that there will be some Nerf at some day. Nurse is simply outdated Design, if she would have been released today, she would have had such things like a Cooldown or any other Downsides to her Power.
While I agree that more Killers should be Red Rank viable (for me, more Killers are viable in Red Ranks than Nurse or Spirit anyway, but all should be viable), Nurse is over the top. I mean, I faced a Nurse with only Ruin and BBQ yesterday, which just shows how much Bullshit Nurse is, when she only needs two Perks, while other Killers need to think which Perks they want to use (e.g. I want to use my Whispers, BBQ, Enduring and PGTW on my Hillbilly. I would love to use Nurses as well, but would either need to get rid of another Tracking Perk or my only Chase/Slowdown-Perk), while Nurse is fine with only using Tracking and Slowdown Perks... And not even those are needed with her.
I dont think that she will be super-weak with the changes, but can only say something after some testing. At least I hope that many Nurse players will play the PTB so that I can see how it is to play vs the new Nurse.
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Funny thing how you assume that a Killer, who can play without Perks or Add-Ons can be good for the game, when every other Killer (except maybe Billy) needs Add-Ons (and all of them need Perks).
I mean that Nurse can use Perks like Deerstalker to slug Survivors speaks for itself, every other Killer does not have the luxury of wasting a Perk Slot for something like this.
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Usually I kill them. Thats what I am supposed to do, and I also want my BBQ Stack. But I wont slug anyone, so if they find the Hatch, I am fine with it.
I give them the points at the Exit Gates tho.
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@Bravo0413 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/740655#Comment_740655
How is it that way though?..... if a killer is having trouble with lunge distance or having trouble hiding red glow, playing pallets effectively a new "good pair of headphones just isnt going to boost your skill to effective level play you need... that just doesnt make sense. That's like saying "get a better keyboard and you'll be better at your office job because you'll type faster" or "get this brand of controller and you'll have faster reaction time on COD or overwatch"
That just doesnt make sense at all
You dont need to do the stuff that other Killers have to do. You dont need to learn how to play structures, because you can just follow the Survivor while being invisible.
Pallets? Just stand there. If the Survivor vaults it, hit him. If he moves, phasewalk behind him. A normal M1 Killer would need to break the Pallet (if its a safe one, obviously), allowing the Survivor to get Distance.
A M1 Killer would need to hide his Red Glow. You dont need to do that with Spirit, you are invisible.
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Usually Medkits, if no one is around. If I am bringing a Medkit at all.
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@Bravo0413 said:
Oh man.... why didnt I think about getting a nice pair of headphones when I wanted to git gud at any other game.... I didnt realize that headphones were the ultimate answer ascending my skill level.
To all those saying headphones are the answer.
Not for other games. And not for DBD in general. For Spirit Headphones are enough. It is surprisingly easy to do well with Spirit, considering how strong she is.
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@anarchy753 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/740506#Comment_740506
1 year ago was Spirit. That brought us Spirit Fury, a top meta perk, Haunted Grounds, a strong but niche perk. Then Legion brought Discordance and 2 junk perks, Plague brought hot garbage, Ghostface's are literal jokes, and then Demo has Surge which is alright.
Yeah, I'd say you're pretty accurate there.
Corrupt Intervention is solid and Infectious Fright godlike on Nurse. Ghostfaces Perks arent that bad, but they get killed by their Cooldowns.
Funny thing is: This person you quoted is saying that they cater Survivors more, because they buy more cosmetics. This would lead me to the conclusion that he is thinking that Survivors get better Perks. Meanwhile, the most common used Perks by Survivors are from 2016.
Killers do not have it that bad when it comes to new Perks. Mostly it is one good Perk, one niche Perk and one bad Perk.
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@Larisa said:
If I'm playing Myers and its Laurie I let her go
Thats not how it works. D:
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None of the ST Perks is good enough to have an impact on the game.
And the majority of them is outright bad.
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Do you have good Headphones? Yes? Congratulations, you are a successful Spirit Main from now on.
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Just because someone has to be that guy - if you would increase the Survivor Movement Speed to 105%, it would be 100% again. Because the percentages are based on Survivor Movement Speed while running (which is classified as 100%).
To your idea itself - nope. You would totally need to rebalance the whole game and all of the Maps for that.
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Never using them. If I dont have any BP Offering, I use a Hook Offering. I also see them rarely used by Killers.
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The game is competitive, but has quite a low Skill Level.
Also, the low price is a thing -. the less you have to pay for a game, the more likely it is that the community has some garbage individuals.
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The Moon Offerings will not come back, it is way too much work to design different Lightnings for each Realm/Map, which is not really justified.
Overall, the game can be darker again, it is basically played at Daylight currently. Killers should also be able to see the Survivors, it is not that bad as some people are claiming it is.
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@BunnyTheHutt said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/738998#Comment_738998
After how many years of begging? Stop being snarky.
Same for you. Poor mentality to spread lies like Killers dont get Buffs.
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@BunnyTheHutt said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/737486#Comment_737486
This would work, if the devs actually buffed Legion. They refuse too buff killers because, IMO, they fear the backlash for it. They just need too balance the game for red ranks and buff weak killers like Legion and Bubba.
So the Freddy Rework never happened I guess?
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@Huntress4Life said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/738129#Comment_738129
Usually the killer Mains are correct on the assumption though, 80% of the survivor community seems to act like strong characters should be nerfed so they have easy games. No one seems to want a challenge in the gaming community as a whole.
Sad thing is, it is not really a challenge at all. A Challenge would be something you can do stuff about. This is not the case with Spirit.
The Survivor is forced to act in a certain way, while Spirit has all the ability to act and react. Like a Spirit standing still at a Pallet always has the advantage, if the Survivor is vaulting back, she can hit. If he is moving, she can react and move the same way. And if in doubt, she can bump into the Survivor anyway.
So yeah, not really a challenge, simply a guessing game.
Just to give a comparison:
To people who have played Dark Souls, those are challenging games. And then there is the not so good little brother Dark Souls 2. There is one part where you get attacked by a big enemy who crashes trough a door, which can result in you being dead. There is no way to see that this is gonna happen, and this is not a challenge at all during your first playthrough.
You can compare that with Spirit - you dont know what to do, you can only guess. And if you guessed right, it is only this - guessing right. You did not even outplay the Spirit at this point, because this would mean that you actually knew what is gonna happen.
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Besides the fact that cleansing 5 Totems for something the Killer does not have, NOED punishs Solos more than SWFs. In a SWF I can simply tell everyone when I cleansed a Totem, and eventually, when Endgame is near, we can split up so that one person is searching for Totems, two are doing Gens and one is being chased.
As Solo, this is not possible. I dont know how many Totems my Mates cleansed. And when I decide to go Totem Cleansing near Endgame, I have no guarantee that the rest of the Team is actually doing something useful. When I am on a Gen, I know that at least one person is doing Gens.
And last but not least - try to find 5 Totems while your Team is Dying on new Badham or Hawkins...
Just get rid of its Hex-Status and make it a Perk that scales with the progression of the Killer - the more he has done during the game, the more will NOED do for him. Tired of Killers failing all game, just to get their easy Insta Down and 4% extra Movement Speed, which renders every Loop useless.
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Better more Nerfs than too less Nerfs. This way they can start buffing Legion.
Old Legion is one thing I will never miss. He was not even good, he was able to chase one person down, while losing the game because it took so long and he had no Map Pressure at all. He was basically a Nurse in one aspect (ignoring Survivor Defenses), but thats it.
I also think that removing FF on a Miss was a good thing. It was not scary at all, it just looked dumb. And it was kinda braindead to have like Unrelenting over 9000, to be able to miss like 5 times to get Hit Number 6 in.
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If you want the Cosmetics, Prestige. If you dont want them, dont prestige. It is as simple as that.
The luck (if there is any) is not worth it at all.
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@Leonardo1ita said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/93166/object-rework-when
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Do you really think that people are gonna remember how the depip squad of marth completely broke the game, even against red Mori nurses? This is not gonna happen. People are basically main survivors, and don't play both. They're never gonna understand how uncompetitive the gen Rush is
Thats not the point. Besides that, bringing up the Depip Squad all the time is quite weak.
@Topic:
I mean, Object surely needs some Rework. But this will probably not happen. The new Status effects which are for Stealth Killers, are basically the Counter to Object of Obsession - even tho they also counter other, much weaker Perks, which did not really need a counter.
So I doubt that anything is happening to Object anytime soon.
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If you look at the Flashlight, you can still drop the Survivor. But could also be a Dedicated Server Issue.
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@Drazen said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/737299#Comment_737299
the problem is the map design are really ######### every pallet is non mindgameable and u can literally go 1v1 most of the killers which makes nurse and spirit the only option to end chases fastest some other killers are viable too but nowhere near as spirit or nurse
"Every Pallet is non-mindgameable"... Yeah, sure.
There are some Bullshit Loops, but you can mindgame a lot of Stuff. Look at Haddonfield, almost every Pallet is playable (except the Indoor Ones) for Killer. Or Hawkins, nearly every Pallet is unsafe.
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There is no counter.
Its all about fun and totally skillbased mindgames.
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@FrenziedRoach said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/737280#Comment_737280
Pretty much 90 percent of the Iri addons in this game are bullshit, your point?
And if you don't like him, don't watch him. But when you play both sides, you have to be willfully closing your eyes to not see how much more effort the killer puts out vs a survivor at the same level of play.
I play both sides. So your "argument" is invalid I guess?
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@FrenziedRoach said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/737254#Comment_737254
I know right, it's so hard to just stick around and get a feel for what your facing before throwing in the towel the moment things hint they might be hard.
Tru3 play's both sides - he just recognizes how much less effort it takes to play survivor well than it does to play killer - like most of us who play both sides.
But I guess that doesn't fit into your own biased viewpoint, amiright?
I cannot blame anyone for DCing vs Iri Head Huntress. I dont do that, but I cannot blame others for that. This Add On is pure Bullshit.
And yes, he plays both sides - you can now argue like him and say that you have objective facts or whatever, but in his Stream he is constantly complaining, while still getting 4Ks with weaker Killers. He is not watchable for me since the Emblem Chance, since it looks like putting more effort into the game to get to Rank 1 kills his mood.