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gatsby
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I don't think making Hag Trap's dissolve when they're too close to hooks, gens or exit gates like Pyramiad Head would hurt anything that actually makes her interactive or skillful to play. She'd still be able to trap strong loops and set up her webs.
It would just make endgame exit gate camping, hook camping and rusty shackles gen grabs never happen again. Which I think the majority of the community would be fine with.
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@TeabaggingGhostface said:
He should be able to store it
Forgot to mention that but yeah. Should be like Oni where you can use it on demand when its charged.
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Also, tinkerering around with the color blind settings brightens things up too
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wouldn't be a problem if killers just took the free trade and didn't get greedy for grabs
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@dspaceman20 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2205114#Comment_2205114
I'm glad you like the changes. Which ones are you neutral on?
Appraisal, Blood Pact, Botany, Built to Last, Breakdown and Calm Spirit.
They're just tiny buffs so I don't really see the difference either way.
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I like or have neutral opinions on all of these changes, which is shocking because of how many perks you touched
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Trickster is alright against average Survivors. But if you get some Rank 1s it feels like you have your hands tied behind your back.
He is a fun Killer on average. But he's a complete joke at any sort of a competitive level.
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@FrostySeal said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2199790#Comment_2199790
I worded that a bit wrong, but what I meant to say was that in order for the Twins to win any match they HAVE to slug, camping and tunneling is just something you can do with them to increase your chances, but not necessary. Due to how long it takes to wake up from Victor and his 5 second stun after hitting just a single survivor you will *have* to resort to slugging. They have a massive time efficiency issue and it's pretty easy to see why.
Lets assume that you decide to use Victor to chase down a survivor. After around 8 to 12 seconds you catch up to them quickly (and assuming you don't miss and get a good chunk of your pressure destroyed) then down them. You wait the 5 second stun then take a 2.5 second stun to wake up. Then you have to walk all the way to wherever the survivor is and then pick them up, then you have to bring them all the way to a hook. Assuming nothing else happens then it will have taken you a total of ~28 seconds for that single hook.
The difference between all those Killers and the Twins is that its a requirement to slug with them. Not slugging with them is detrimental and unless your going up against potatoes you will always lose the match. And yes, despite the fact that they rely on the whole team being injured to snowball you can use that against them. Sloppy Butcher is easily their best perk and I always use it whenever I play them, making it ten times more frustrating to play against. It makes it harder to revive dying survivors and injured survivors will constantly waste precious time, all the while the gens are regressing with ruin and their other teammates are being destroyed.
In theory they should have more counter play then those Killers, but they don't. It sounds simple on paper but when you put perks into the equation and the fact that the Twins player is a good one then they have much less counterplay. Your assuming that all the survivors are sticking to each other, which chances are they won't, especially in solo queue. Victor moves at 150% movement speed and has a massive lunge, so unless the survivor player fully understands the Twins (chances are they won't) they'll get downed quickly leading victor to go on a mass slugging spree usually ending in multiple or all the survivors being slugged on the ground.
I can count on a single hand on how many times I've encountered survivors who fully understand the Twins weaknesses and exploited it against me. Encountering a whole team that knows how to play against them is one of the rarest things I've ever seen, in fact I haven't gotten to even go up against one yet.
Twins are one of my mains and I play them a lot at a high level. That's how I am familiar with their weaknesses and their counterplay.
I know they have a time efficiency issue. But its part of their playstyle. Knowing where to park Charlotte and how to corral Survivors from one Twin directly into the other is a massive part of their playstyle. As well as slugging (trust me I know sloppy is good).
The main reason I love the Twins is that they directly counter the typical "sweat squad" playstyle. Their counterplay is virtually the opposite of most Killers in the game and Survivors can't autopilot against them. Staying injured, prioritizing gens, running Iron Will and using Dead Hard/Sprint Burst as your exhaustion perks will LOSE games against Twins when it wins against 80% of the Killer roster. That is what makes them such a GOOD addition to the game.
The Twins take the typical Killer archetype and throw it in the dumpster. You have to know how to play against them specifically to win and because they're so uncommon most people don't, which is why people think they're so unhealthy for the game.
Spending the entire game split into two duo units and playing safe by healing should be encouraged in a team game. Instead of being as split up and independent as possible.
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@FrostySeal said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2199608#Comment_2199608
The difference between Blight and Nurse bugs is that even if you encounter a bug with them generally it won't matter too much as they can quickly catch up with survivors, however if you encounter a bug with the Twins you can very easily lose the entire game because of one singular bug. I know this because I've mained Blight since the PTB and play Nurse sometimes. Missing with Victor is the most punishing thing in this game so when you have him bug out at the worst time possible it can screw the player over incredibly hard.
It's good that you find the counterplay cool, but mostly everyone I see hates their gameplay. As Survivor coordinating with your teammates is incredibly hard and frustrating so the counterplay of the Twins and the outcome of the match depends on whether your teammates have any braincells or not. And I've only talked about the slugging part of the Twins, they also have another fun part to them, the camping and tunneling part. As a survivor there is absolutely nothing you can do to counter the Twins camping and tunneling you unless your teammate has BT or you have DS and UB. Otherwise your going to get targeted by Victor and slugged. Also with their most recent nerf playing the Twins feel even more frustrating with the full 5 second stun you have to take every single time you down a person with Victor. It makes them even more slug/camp reliant which means that if you want to win with them your going to have to use those strategies.
The Twins don't have to camp at all. I really don't know why people keep perpetuating that stereotype. Especially since the BT buff there's not a ton of advantage to camping because you can't abuse Victor's lack of Terror Radius anymore.
Twins can snowball with slugging but that's hardly unique. Oni, Myers, Billy, Bubba and Nurse commonly do that as well. The only difference with the Twins is that they're horrible with Infectious Fright and rely on the entire team being injured to snowball, which gives them more counterplay to slugging then other Killers.
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@FrostySeal said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2199465#Comment_2199465
I feel that as well, all the Killer's you mentioned are really powerful when used correct but the point of this post is to talk about how the Twins as a whole was a mistake. Because of how they work you constantly have to slug at the bare minimum meaning that the opposing side is going to have absolutely no fun at all, and then you combine that with the fact that because they're so unique they are also consequently extremely buggy. The most recent bug makes it so that if you pounce on a survivor when you've cornered them you'll go right through them and smack the wall leading to you getting kicked. They have many design flaws and stupid bugs that are ingrained into them meaning that it's going to take a while to fix.
The Twins definitely have bugs, but nothing worse than Blight or Nurse when you're comfortable with them.
As for the slugging argument, I actually think the Twins counterplay is sort of cool. It's like reverse Legion. Grouping up and running healing perks/med-kits is ideal. They're really weak to We're Gonna Live Forever, Desperate Measures, Botany Knowledge and Unbreakable. Also, the Twins encourage Survivors pairing up because Victor CANNOT slug two Survivors that are together due to use 5 second downing vulnerability period or latching mechanic on healthy Survivors
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I feel like all the Killers in 2020 were pretty solid. Twins, Blight, Pyramid Head and Deathslinger are all above average from a power level and gameplay perspective.
Nothing like 2021 has been so far with the failed Clown rework and Trickster existing.
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Probably Twins would be scariest. A monstrous demon child and a grotesque lady constantly surprising me and switching would be freaky.
Teammates I'm bringing Nancy, Cheryl and Yun-Jin. They've got a nice mix of perks and I feel like all of them would be pretty hellbent on escaping no deadweight in that team.
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@GannTM said:
Sprint Burst would literally be objectively better than Dead Hard if it was like that.
Ok. Maybe Sprint Burst is activate-able while running and in the healthy state by pressing E. And its still only 2 seconds of 150 haste.
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@Blueberry said:
DH needs to be brought down to their level, not them up to DH. Head On and BL are probably the ideal level.
Head On and Balanced Landing are the worst, most niche exhaustion perks.
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Playing Trickster sometimes gives me massive frame drops on PC with his knives.
I think there’s been some optimization issues since All Kill
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@Phasmamain said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2197068#Comment_2197068
What if all 4 people have it? Or even 2 tbh but that’s where it starts to get really strong
Its Killer dependent at best. A Nurse, Legion, Blight, Twins or Spirit literally wouldn’t care if all four Survivors ran Spirit Burst.
They’d be crying if it was four Dead Hard though
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@Phasmamain said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2197052#Comment_2197052
If a killer walks 30 seconds to a gen and you sprint burst away he gets no value and has to start patrolling again.
If he chases you that’s even more time wasted
It usually doesn’t work that way.
If you’re working on a gen with someone else, Sprint Burst encourages the Killer to chase someone else instead of you, which is bad if you have lower hook states then them.
If you’re working on a gen solo and the Killer got multiple people with BBQ they’ll just Pop your gen and leave to bother another gen that they know is being worked on. It wastes your exhaustion and time. It’s especially bad if its someone like Blight, Twins, Nurse, Freddy or Spirit because they can get to the next gen with little time lost.
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@Phasmamain said:
Sprint burst is still better IMO since it can end the chase before it even starts
why would anyone want that?
it’s beneficial for the team if the killer is hooking and chasing everyone. if you’re discouraging chases then other people are taking them instead and dying early
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I think the real issue is that they gave people enough time to get attached to their preferred characters for the RE Chapter and some people will inevitably be disappointed
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Trickster is really fun. His knives are sometimes unwieldy, but when you get the hang of them he can make plays that rival Huntress, Nurse and Spirit. He has much less counterplay and many more options than people think.
Hillbilly. He seems incredibly fun with all his mobility and one shot potential. But his chainsaw is unreliable and sometimes buggy. When Billy doesn’t have an option to use his saw, he’s just a standard M1 Killer.
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@TGB said:
You know what else is a strange design choice?
Pig's reverse bear traps can only be setup on downed Survs. But it won't actually activate if they're downed or hooked. So it does nothing until they're back on their feet. Not to mention, it does nothing until a gen is activated.
So, her entire ability only activates if you encourage them to recover from bad situations. "I trapped your face. Okay, now go get healed from Dying. Go do that Gen.
"... Please... Please go do these things... I just want one trap kill in my lifetime..."
And now you have to patrol, both, Gens AND Jigsaw stations. But, hey, you move slower if you're utilizing your crouch! So you gained twice the amount of ground to cover, and have the total opposite tool you need to do so.
UGH. I want to like her. But holy hell.
Pig's traps are slowdown. The best course of action is to ignore trapped Survivors because they aren't doing gens.
I really appreciated Pig's traps when I was doing Adept. She didn't have any gen regression perks but it felt like I was running Pop or something because I didn't get gen rushed too hard
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I think its a strange design choice that new players have the worst grind and veteran players with optimal builds that don't really need it can get more than 1 million BP in an hour
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@justad00d said:
Of course, unless you’re playing a 4-man SWF with 5k hours each. You leave the good looper only to waste a minute walking across the map to find the next strong looper. No good solutions vs groups like this.
Those are like once every 20 games at Rank 1. They're so rare they're not even worth talking about.
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Yun-Jin kills it with her default outfit and its recolors. Best female Survivor.
Jake has the most relatable default outfit for me. It’s just an outdoor hiking jacket and some cargo pants. Something I feel like a normal person would wear
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@Kebek said:
Hmm I think I there was some talk there's going to be two killers but that was quickly dismissed by the fact BHVR barely manages to develop 1 functioning killer in 3 months. 2 might be pushing it too hard + the quality would drop tremendously as they'd need to split resources over 2 complex characters.
I'd prefer us getting 1 well developed killer insted of 2 underdeveloped.
New quality Killers for Chapter 20 might explain why Trickster was so awful.
They devoted the resources to Chapter 20 and rushed through Chapter 19 because people were expecting new content. The Devs didn’t even get a map rework done for Chapter 19 and they revealed Chapter 20 earlier than any Chapter has been revealed before. They were obviously working on something else in the background while developing All-Kill
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Quentin does have one outfit btw. It's the DLC bonus and has three unique cosmetic pieces
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I'm using Ruin, Pop and BBQ.
The last perk has been a lot harder to pick STBFL, Discordance and Monitor have been ok
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It's actually a cool idea. The Killer trades a perk slot to neutralize the Survivors items. Sort of like a different take on Franklins
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I think the Devs should just add a "Tier 4" that slightly upgrades an character's unique perks only.
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Lowkey Yun-Jin, screwing over teammates and giving killers sick burns could be pretty fun
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I farmed it with my SWF. They all died to let me get Left For Dead, so it was chill
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@Power_Guy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2159046#Comment_2159046
ANd if the Killer forces a 3 gen; he outplayed the Survivors, who did not pay attention. But since it's the Killer's fault, it's up to him to fix it by giving the Survivors a gen, right?
No. A Killer can literally stay on one side of the map the entire game and ignore generators not in their pre-determined three gen.
Hags do it all the time. The Survivors can 99 gens to make it look like its not a three gen but it won't work because the Killer will literally never leave their area.
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@Power_Guy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2158935#Comment_2158935
I see, 'abusing mechanics' that are in the game, including tactics, a perk, or survivors putting themselves in a 3 gen.
So all that is the Killer 'abusing mechanics', and one of them is the Survivors actively screwing up, but the Killer's fault he acted on it, huh? How dare that Killer not give away generators in a 3 gen situation! A BETTER Killer would have!
Your bias is showing.
I'm not sure how I can have a bias when I play both sides consistently at Rank 1.
A three gen can be forced by the Killer just as easily as the Survivors can put it on themselves. Especially on maps like sactum of wrath, azorov's resting place and suffo pit
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@Power_Guy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2158896#Comment_2158896
Except getting 'screwed over outside their control' is how they lose. It's literally how the Killer wins; he sticks people on hooks, where they can't do anything without help.
Then, he tries his best to prevent that help from happening, or he has to waste more time re-hooking. Time he does not have as more and more gens pop.
That's why I hate 'nerf/punish camping!' threads. It's just people saying 'I don't like losing.'
People don’t like losing by default.
Where the Killer didn’t actually play a very good game but won by abusing mechanics. Whether it be slugging, hard camping, no ed or even a three gen.
A better Killer could have won by playing normally, but instead the Survivors got someone who was compensating for their lack of skill.
It’s literally possible to “win” this game by hard tunneling a player out of the game by camping and winning the bet that the Survivor didn’t bring DS to get them out ASAP.
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@FFirebrandd said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2158572#Comment_2158572
Why?
How exactly does it sound balanced to you that the will of 1 member of a 4 man team can override the will of the only member of the 1 man team? You guys want to force an unhook against a nearby Killer? Get another buddy to help you. Then I'm fine with it.
I get that getting tunneled and camped isn't a good time. I really do. However that's the nature of an asymmetrical multiplayer game. If you throw the only member of the 1 man team into a hard and fast 1v1 against one of the members of the 4 man team... the one member of the 4 man team should get crushed, because he should have teammates to rely on.
You really don’t get it at all.
A camped Survivor is at their absolute weakest with little to no options at all. Everything is up to their team to give them their best chance.
Even in a 1v4 game. The four should still have some degree of autonomy and not be screwed over for reasons completely out of their control.
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@FFirebrandd said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2158229#Comment_2158229
And?
I am well aware that I could have gotten a trade out of that scenario even without grabs. But I ask you this question... why should the Survivors be able to get someone off the hook even when they do it that badly? I would argue that they shouldn't.
And I argue they should get the unhook if the Killer is trying to force a hook state or death because its abuse of the mechanics.
A healthy Survivor, especially one with BT should always at least be able to at least get a trade. Killers trying to force a grab by camping should not be rewarded under any circumstances.
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@FFirebrandd said:
Grabs should not be removed.
Killers are supposed to be threatening. You shouldn't just be able to do stuff for free right in front of the Killer with minimal risk if you're healthy.
Seriously... not too long ago I had a Survivor attempt an unhook less than a second after I threw their friend up on a hook. By a minor miracle, I actually did manage to get the Grab. That's a good thing because that was an incredibly dumb play and I should absolutely be able to punish the Survivors for doing it without having insta downs.
Even in that scenario, you could easily down the unhooker. grabs or not. You hit them to cancel the first grab animation and then the second time right after the unhook animation before they can even get away. It's way better than actually having to chase a Survivor and land two hits on them.
If someone wants to hook trade, the game should just let them. It's still a net benefit for the Killer in most cases. Hook grabs are basically a 'win more" mechanic because if you're in the scenario to get one its already looking pretty bad for the Survivors.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/246823/would-anyone-really-be-mad-at-lady-dimitrescu
We dont even know what her full powers are,so its really hard for BHVR to make a proper killer without all those details I think.
The Devs have said that the license holders are sometimes heavily involved with the Chapter development. Silent Hill is a good example this. I feel like regardless of who the characters are for the Chapter, Capcom will be heavily involved and have had input on what they want the game mechanics and map to look like.
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@Verconissp said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/246764/hook-grabs-should-be-removed
Now this is a pure Survivor Post,
I'd say entitled But then i'll be attacked for my Opinion BUUUUT.
No, =D
This would be 100% Abused.. by every survivor. Especially with the BT changes
I’m Rank 1 on Killer and Survivor. And on Killer I never personally go for grabs because they’re inconsistent. I just hit the unhooker and trade if they wanna hook rush so bad.
I absolutely hate the face campers as Survivor that try to force the grab and you have to keep trying to fake the save a bunch just to avoid being grabbed and still sometimes get grabbed cause of latency. It’s dumb
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I'm bi and I can confidently say that the girls in dbd are hotter than the guys.
Felix is one of the hottest guys but he's still behind the top ladies. Cheryl, Kate, Yun-Jin, Zarina and Elodie are just out of his league.
Felix is maybe Nancy or Yui tier.
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@ukenicky said:
Imagine all 4 survivors bringing this and the killer loads in and sees 1 generator lol
Probably feels similar to seeing three gens pop simultaneously after getting your first hook
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I’m really not sure if your changes would make the Twins better or worse. But it would make them less unique and more similar to other Killers because it would minimize the whole “two Killers” mechanic they have going that allows you to be in two places at once. If Victor self destructs all the time and Charlotte becomes the main Killer with Victor being a more traditional Killer power.
Also, the “teleportation” animation would be nearly impossible for the Devs to create considering it took them over a month to create a “holding the locker closed” animation. And the Twins aren’t one of the “magical” Killers with lots of supernatural powers so teleportation wouldn’t really make sense anyway.
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@PigsEatBacon said:
The second perk idea seems good, it's just seems so situational and so hard to use correctly. The only situation this would be worth using is if you haven't been hooked once and the carried teammate is on death hook. Not only do you need to be extremely close, the killer can slug you and still just go after the other survivor, making it basically only useable once.
Yeah, you’re right it needs some tweaks. Keep the downside as increasing a hook state, but change it from inflicting the dying state to inflicting the Exposed Status until downed and having the negative Aura reveal that Mettle of Man has whenever you’re more than 16 meters away.
The goal behind the perk is to give Survivors a way to balance out hook states if the Killer is tunneling and/or refusing to chase some people.
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@GannTM said:
Dopamine seems to be a worse version of Adrenaline
Could be awesome in a SWF for getting everyone out in endgame.
And yeah its supposed to be a reference to Adrenaline cause he’s Meg’s brother.
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It won't we're just going into the midchapter with a single bug fix patch
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Twins, Elodie, Blight, Yun-Jin, Deathslinger, Trickster, Oni, Jeff and Adam
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- Trickster is fun but he’s still horrifically bad. I struggle to play him at Rank 1 and usually only get brutal Killer with the occasional ruthless Killer.
- Build ideas usually include: Corrupt, Pop, Ruin, Monitor and BBQ. He’s also alright with STBFL because if he’s in a position to M1 he can usually use the Knives close range for the hit as well so avoiding hitting the Obsession is pretty good.
- Use the brown rarity blue/gray outfit and think about stealth when you use him. I know Trickster has flashy cosmetics but they just hurt him. Free hits from having a small terror radius are definitely something you’ll need.
- Trick Pouch is probably one of his better add-ons and its a brown. When you’re leveling him, make sure to stock up on it. The extra knives can make a big difference.
- If the loop is strong and you can get knife angles use them to get an eventual down. At unsafe pallets or pallets with mindgames just M1. In general, if you can get an M1 just take it don’t worry it they have a decent amount of laceration already.
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I used to main Legion because I like zooming around the map and the amount of tracking they can have with their power. Also, I liked the idea of a Killer that is multiple Killers.
Then I met the Twins. Victor makes Feral Frenzy look pathetic in comparison he’s a speedy boi and great at actually getting downs. Plus I love the ability to actually play two Killers instead of having different characters that are just cosmetics and have no effect on gameplay like Legion.
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I like it. I like it a lot
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Personally, I think Cigar Box is super strong to actually incentivize Clown players to use the mostly useless bottle so they remember clown got reworked