Rebel_Raven
Rebel_Raven
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Trying to figure out why on earth a killer should just willingly go into a toxic game.
Problem is killers have no idea which SWFs are toxic, which aren't, and which will lie about not being toxic when they actually want to make the killer miserable anyhow.
I get it. Give SWF a chance.
Thing is, we have, and that's why we're here, and others blew it for you.
Until this game is balanced around 4 survivors communicating and coordinating (and it's not), prepare to be dodged. -
I do gens, watch, and wait for an opening.
If I can get an opening, I'll wave the survivor over, and heal them, or go heal them.
If they're being camped, there isn't much I can do. -
But if you want that, or not, that is probably what will happen with your time penalty.Nickenzie said:
@Rebel_RavenRebel_Raven said:Nickenzie said:
@Rebel_RavenRebel_Raven said:
Super! Punish me because I don't want to get curb stomped when I pop on for a few, hopefully fair games.Nickenzie said:
Increase re-queue times when you dodge or leave a lobby.RWoodrow said:
@Nickenzie What would prevent survivors from re-queing into the solo que over and over again until they got into a room with their friends like they did prior to the introduction of the SWF option?Nickenzie said:
I can't take all the credit, some of my ideas have been inspired by @weirdkid5 because I REAL feel like his suggestion will work to be honest!DelsKibara said:@Delfador said:
There are many very useful and beneficial threads but they get lost in this mess unfortunately.I do know stuff like @Nickenzie 's threads gets washed up in a sea of complaints, when the stuff he has proposed would be amazing for the general QOL of the game.
SWF Changes:
Basically, we need two party queues for the solos and SWF. SWF cannot join solos queues and vice versa to keep things simple. Solos will have an easier time reaching their pip zone while SWF will have to do a little more to reach theirs because they are expected to do better with voice communication. The killer will be rewarded with more BP whenever they are going against a SWF to compensate for the potentially increased difficulty.
Done and queues will remain the same as normal because we aren't directly splitting the player base in half.
First: 15 seconds
Second: 30 seconds
Third: 1 minute
Fourth: 5 minutes
Fifth: 10 minutes
Etc etc etc...
Basically force me into mixed rank SWFs with a not even passable array of perks and addons so an SWF can feel oooh so accomplished when reds, purples, and greens stomp a casual.
Huzzah.
Let's punish everyone that just bought the game so they gotta face smurfs looking for easy games.
Translation: (Histrionics => English)
"Every SWF is a commando unit waiting to waste me including the SWF who just wanna chill with their friends. Furthermore, I'll get bullied by every SWF even through some of those games might be my fault due to my mistakes and not because they are a SWF. Nickenzie is a dirty tryhard sweaty survivor who wants smurfs to bully lower ranked players and want killers to suffer so he's also @SenzuDuck follower, ignore him!"
To recap: (Unpopular opinion) Not every SWF is a commando unit so please stop with the exaggeration that every SWF is one. Furthermore, I lose on average 1 in 10 SWF games (depip) because the majority aren't the depip squad. Lastly, I obviously don't advocate smurfs to bully lower levels so please do not put words into my mouth. If you disagree, perhaps tell me some things you'll change to make it better instead of assuming the absolute worst about me.
And you complain about me putting words in your mouth? Wow.
Just gunna disregard the first part as having taking this personally when I didn't intend it to be.
Sorry.
Not trying to be a dick, just willing to realize when I'm about to be screwed over, and say something about it.
Problem is figuring out which 1 of 1000 SWFs aren't sweaty swat teams.
Playing Russian roulette isn't so much fun when there's 5 chambers loaded, and you have to pull the trigger 6 times.
And let's not forget that most SWFs look for easier matches in low rank killers so they don't have to be quite the sweaty swat team.
And that the big issue is communication, and coordination and most any SWF can, and often do abuse it which is still a gigantic advantage no matter how much people want to down play it.
Oh wow, you don't have problems with SWF? How many lvl 3 perks do you have to pick from? How many high end addons, and offerings?
Got that great loadout, or two waiting?
You haven't been taking in my point if view.
It's a totally different experience vsing SWF when you're prepared compared to when you aren't, or can't be prepared.
It's like Tru3 playing perkless. Even he struggles. If a pretty good killer like him struggles with a less than adequate loadout, where the heck do you think the people who aren't as good are?
Are you overlooking the similarities in SWFs seeking easier killers to deal with vs killers depipping to look for easier survivors?
What do you think forcing players to play SWFs will do?
It will force killers to endure teams that are looking to bully less prepared killers. The gamble is really high, and not in favor of the killer.
So indirectly, that is advocating letting SWFs bully less prepared killers via basically forcing killers into games lest they get punished.
Some 70 percent of games have a SWF. Has lobby times at rank 1 sped up any? If not, then that means most SWFs are in lower ranks.
And since most of them want killers in their teens of rank, most of them are going to be closer to 15 than 5.
You want to stop dodging? The sooner killers are on par with communicating, and coordinating SWFs, the better.
If you need solo to be on par with SWF first, then hurry up on that.
If killers are going to be on par with SWF they need time to do the things they have to do, or to be more efficient at it like:
better tracking ability in general. Maybe bake in whispers? Make scratches, blood, and sound more useful? Instead of them being constantly damaged.
2 hooks to kill instead of 3, maybe?
Able to end chases faster. Faster bloodlust, maybe?
Fix huntress' hatchets to allow for more leniency in throwing over obstacles, or beside them.
Maybe appeal to people's inner mercenary, and give them bonus BP for the difficulty spike? I mean bare minimum, that?
Funnel SWFs into red, and purple ranks?
Increase mori frequency?
Increase high end addon frequency?
Lower stun duration, and/or weapon wiping time?
Let's get rid of the gaping huge safezone that is an open gate, or even the hatch.
Let's make killer perks a bit easier to get so people can build proper loadouts sooner? Less odds of people who are already at end game suggesting perks killers don't have.
There's always that secondary, well third objective since totems are usually secondary. The speed a coordinated group moves at is too damn fast, and the secondary is often optional.
I'm just spitballing here. Not super serious, but I don't ever remeber seeing you propose ideas on closing the gap between killers and swf.
Honestly, I was hoping you would give it some thought which is why I usually mention it in your threads on catching solo up to swf. You seem actually interested in making the game better, and I respect that.
You're not someone that just sits there telling people to git gud, or insulting people for not being good.
Doesn't mean much when they have RPGs to kill tanks with, and the people they're ragging on has squirt guns.
At least I'm not demanding the removal of swf, though?
Our DBD killers are pretty shite at killing people, bluntly. Especially when even the weakest of SWFs can have free aura reading, and map.
All the extra steps they have to take, all the time they need is the problem.
In short, to boost killers, we should look at games that have SWF, and Voice, and their killers. What do they have that ours don't?
Jason is basically all our best killers in one, and then some to deal with the speed of voice chat, and dealing with the distances necessary to travel.
And they just now got close to balance with the game.
Our killers need to be closer to where he is. Not completely there, but, well, killers have to be better killers.
You cannot force people to play a game that isn't fun/rewarding. You can't punish them into it.
You have to make it fun and/or rewarding again.
About the first part, I didn't mean that to be offensive in anyway, I was just summarizing everything you said about this quote below."Super! Punish me because I don't want to get curb stomped when I pop on for a few, hopefully fair games.
Basically force me into mixed rank SWFs with a not even passable array of perks and addons so an SWF can feel oooh so accomplished when reds, purples, and greens stomp a casual.
Huzzah.
Let's punish everyone that just bought the game so they gotta face smurfs looking for easy games."
Basically your whole statement was exaggerated is my point and did you notice the same thing when I summarized everything you said? I basically said that not everything you mentioned is reality because that is the truth (more on that later). About the putting words in mouth thing, I don't know why but this statement probably hit me in the wrong way. "Let's punish everyone that just bought the game so they gotta face smurfs looking for easy games." I thought you was implying that I WANTED this to happen even through I obviously don't, so I took it as aggression. However, if you was not saying that, my apologies because I honestly thought you was saying that I wanted this to happen.
Now, about your quote, I'll say a few things! I'm not saying I never had a problem with SWF but I will say not as much as everyone else. I feel like the amount of SWF people lose to could have been prevented by simply learning why you lost (mistakes) than blaming something else. I use to do this a lot and once I realized this isn't the why to go about things, I started to improve my killer gameplay. Yes, there will be games where you're completely powerless because you're facing the depip squad but that's not every SWF game, get over it. You see where I'm coming from? Just try your best, learn, have a growth mindset and not fixed one, and improve your play style to get better at the game overall. Not saying your not good, I'm saying that you could get BETTER than what you're currently are, that's all. Now, if you have already done this... I'm really surprised by the amount of depip squads you run into because I rarely even do at rank 1. Finally, I did make some proposals but a lot of people got salty about it such as giving everyone voice communication, built-in Kindred, seeing auras of survivors who are in a chase, and etc. I'll post a few links of my proposals so you can take a look:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/30419/the-gap-between-solo-survivors-and-swf#latest
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/43880/there-is-only-one-way-swf-solo-q-survivors-gap#latest
Swf is common. The odds of the time penalty going high enough and running into an SWF are not in the killers favor.
Especially on lower ranks.
Sooner or later the killer will have to settle on an SWF, and it could likely be a toxic one.
That is why I severely dislike your idea of stacking punishments for dodging.
A killer could dodge 3 toolboxes and a 2x2 swf group to end up with 4 meg swf with flashlights and no Franklin's demise.
Or a group with instaheals.
Maybe if we had some realistic way to tell how big of a threat a group is? I mentioned the SWF warning badge. Not so much as to tell who is SWF, but to give an idea of how sweaty they are.
It doesn't necessarily take a depip squad, you see. I don't have a huge arsenal to fight with, personally.
A lot of killers in the teens won't either.
It's why SWFs like targeting killers in the teens. We don't all play like tru3, or Monto, and we certainly don't have their arsenal. Easy easy games for them, but they sure take it seriously.
Again, Tru3 struggled when he went perkless. We aren't all as good as he is, and we usually have to make due with what ever perks we have.
It's not a matter of me losing, it's how much of a chance I really had, and how often I have a realistic chance.
All I want, all I ever really want out of DBD is fair trials.
Can we not pretend that an SWF using comms to coordinate is particularly fair?
I mean the SWFs I commonly run into are mixed colors, and use comms to their advantage.
I don't play hardcore.
Partly because SWFs are generally stacked, and there's not a whole lot of learning when they're thorougly immersed, or coordinated. Pretty sick of the imbalance. There's not a lot of learning in the imbalance.
Partly because I don't have time for it.
Getting good enough to bust SWFs with my limited arsenal isn't something I have time, or drive for.
Hell, I don't believe anyone would want to be in my shoes.
I don't have a full array of perks, the time/drive to grind them, etc.
I can do ok against a group of solos, and I certainly feel better about losing to them, but a coordinated SWF? Not so much. Expertly trading hooks, conga lines for taking hits, running to eachother for saves, having high rank ringers.
It's like I'm an unwitting participant in their combat training, and their grind for more BP at the cost of any fun I might have. It's just too much hassle. Even if I do good, I don't really feel good.
P.s. also taking a look at your threads/ideas! -
Swf don't have to worry about potato survivors, and killers are more counting on it, some becoming those super hungry killers.thesuicidefox said:I don't get why people derank anyway TBH. You just get matched with more potato survivors or super hungry killers and the game is actually less fun.
Surviving at lower ranks is somewhat easier imo. More likely to run into killers that are new, or don't have the doctor's club wedged up their butts.
Yeah, there's the depipped that just want to bang out a 4k as quick as possible, but I think you're more likely to run into those as you rank up. -
You basically told me what's fun and isn't fun in telling me to just play them anyhow.Carpemortum said:
That novel though. Games really not that bad. If SWF are so terrible, play them and move on. You cant win every game. Even if prepared.Rebel_Raven said:Nickenzie said:
@Rebel_RavenRebel_Raven said:
Super! Punish me because I don't want to get curb stomped when I pop on for a few, hopefully fair games.Nickenzie said:
Increase re-queue times when you dodge or leave a lobby.RWoodrow said:
@Nickenzie What would prevent survivors from re-queing into the solo que over and over again until they got into a room with their friends like they did prior to the introduction of the SWF option?Nickenzie said:
I can't take all the credit, some of my ideas have been inspired by @weirdkid5 because I REAL feel like his suggestion will work to be honest!DelsKibara said:@Delfador said:
There are many very useful and beneficial threads but they get lost in this mess unfortunately.I do know stuff like @Nickenzie 's threads gets washed up in a sea of complaints, when the stuff he has proposed would be amazing for the general QOL of the game.
SWF Changes:
Basically, we need two party queues for the solos and SWF. SWF cannot join solos queues and vice versa to keep things simple. Solos will have an easier time reaching their pip zone while SWF will have to do a little more to reach theirs because they are expected to do better with voice communication. The killer will be rewarded with more BP whenever they are going against a SWF to compensate for the potentially increased difficulty.
Done and queues will remain the same as normal because we aren't directly splitting the player base in half.
First: 15 seconds
Second: 30 seconds
Third: 1 minute
Fourth: 5 minutes
Fifth: 10 minutes
Etc etc etc...
Basically force me into mixed rank SWFs with a not even passable array of perks and addons so an SWF can feel oooh so accomplished when reds, purples, and greens stomp a casual.
Huzzah.
Let's punish everyone that just bought the game so they gotta face smurfs looking for easy games.
Translation: (Histrionics => English)
"Every SWF is a commando unit waiting to waste me including the SWF who just wanna chill with their friends. Furthermore, I'll get bullied by every SWF even through some of those games might be my fault due to my mistakes and not because they are a SWF. Nickenzie is a dirty tryhard sweaty survivor who wants smurfs to bully lower ranked players and want killers to suffer so he's also @SenzuDuck follower, ignore him!"
To recap: (Unpopular opinion) Not every SWF is a commando unit so please stop with the exaggeration that every SWF is one. Furthermore, I lose on average 1 in 10 SWF games (depip) because the majority aren't the depip squad. Lastly, I obviously don't advocate smurfs to bully lower levels so please do not put words into my mouth. If you disagree, perhaps tell me some things you'll change to make it better instead of assuming the absolute worst about me.
And you complain about me putting words in your mouth? Wow.
Just gunna disregard the first part as having taking this personally when I didn't intend it to be.
Sorry.
Not trying to be a dick, just willing to realize when I'm about to be screwed over, and say something about it.
Problem is figuring out which 1 of 1000 SWFs aren't sweaty swat teams.
Playing Russian roulette isn't so much fun when there's 5 chambers loaded, and you have to pull the trigger 6 times.
And let's not forget that most SWFs look for easier matches in low rank killers so they don't have to be quite the sweaty swat team.
And that the big issue is communication, and coordination and most any SWF can, and often do abuse it which is still a gigantic advantage no matter how much people want to down play it.
Oh wow, you don't have problems with SWF? How many lvl 3 perks do you have to pick from? How many high end addons, and offerings?
Got that great loadout, or two waiting?
You haven't been taking in my point if view.
It's a totally different experience vsing SWF when you're prepared compared to when you aren't, or can't be prepared.
It's like Tru3 playing perkless. Even he struggles. If a pretty good killer like him struggles with a less than adequate loadout, where the heck do you think the people who aren't as good are?
Are you overlooking the similarities in SWFs seeking easier killers to deal with vs killers depipping to look for easier survivors?
What do you think forcing players to play SWFs will do?
It will force killers to endure teams that are looking to bully less prepared killers. The gamble is really high, and not in favor of the killer.
So indirectly, that is advocating letting SWFs bully less prepared killers via basically forcing killers into games lest they get punished.
Some 70 percent of games have a SWF. Has lobby times at rank 1 sped up any? If not, then that means most SWFs are in lower ranks.
And since most of them want killers in their teens of rank, most of them are going to be closer to 15 than 5.
You want to stop dodging? The sooner killers are on par with communicating, and coordinating SWFs, the better.
If you need solo to be on par with SWF first, then hurry up on that.
If killers are going to be on par with SWF they need time to do the things they have to do, or to be more efficient at it like:
better tracking ability in general. Maybe bake in whispers? Make scratches, blood, and sound more useful? Instead of them being constantly damaged.
2 hooks to kill instead of 3, maybe?
Able to end chases faster. Faster bloodlust, maybe?
Fix huntress' hatchets to allow for more leniency in throwing over obstacles, or beside them.
Maybe appeal to people's inner mercenary, and give them bonus BP for the difficulty spike? I mean bare minimum, that?
Funnel SWFs into red, and purple ranks?
Increase mori frequency?
Increase high end addon frequency?
Lower stun duration, and/or weapon wiping time?
Let's get rid of the gaping huge safezone that is an open gate, or even the hatch.
Let's make killer perks a bit easier to get so people can build proper loadouts sooner? Less odds of people who are already at end game suggesting perks killers don't have.
There's always that secondary, well third objective since totems are usually secondary. The speed a coordinated group moves at is too damn fast, and the secondary is often optional.
I'm just spitballing here. Not super serious, but I don't ever remeber seeing you propose ideas on closing the gap between killers and swf.
Honestly, I was hoping you would give it some thought which is why I usually mention it in your threads on catching solo up to swf. You seem actually interested in making the game better, and I respect that.
You're not someone that just sits there telling people to git gud, or insulting people for not being good.
Doesn't mean much when they have RPGs to kill tanks with, and the people they're ragging on has squirt guns.
At least I'm not demanding the removal of swf, though?
Our DBD killers are pretty shite at killing people, bluntly. Especially when even the weakest of SWFs can have free aura reading, and map.
All the extra steps they have to take, all the time they need is the problem.
In short, to boost killers, we should look at games that have SWF, and Voice, and their killers. What do they have that ours don't?
Jason is basically all our best killers in one, and then some to deal with the speed of voice chat, and dealing with the distances necessary to travel.
And they just now got close to balance with the game.
Our killers need to be closer to where he is. Not completely there, but, well, killers have to be better killers.
You cannot force people to play a game that isn't fun/rewarding. You can't punish them into it.
You have to make it fun and/or rewarding again.
Also you cant tell people what is or isnt fun. I enjoy a challenge. It's fun to see your shortcomings and learn new things/ways to play.
But some people just want ez mode.
You do not get it. SWF is alarmingly common. There's no occasional game, it's more often than not.
I want a fair game, not an easy one.
And it's pretty ironic trying to call me out on wanting an easier game when SWFs generally get those by default, and game the system to get even easier games.
SWF is often not fair because the game isn't balanced for them abusing things like SWF to make voice chat easier to set up, and coordination.
I'm not telling you to stop playing SWFs. Hell, I'm not telling you how to play, nor do I give a damn
You're the one looking to tell me what to do. -
@Nickenzie
Continuing from my previous post:
Hell, in addition, maybe we can make a way to sort how sweaty SWFs are?
Maybe make am SWF badge/emblem?
Survivors in SWF get a badge based on how quick the game goes, or how well they score, or both.
It persists.
This leads into a badge average. The killer can see this. If the badge average isn't appalling, they play. If it is, they dodge.
Less dodging, and less odds of the killer getting mauled.
Killers can get a badge based on their scores against SWFs, and it could become behind the scenes match making.
Sure, SWFs would have to find some new way to bully low rank killers, but it would lead to more even matches.
-
Nickenzie said:
@Rebel_RavenRebel_Raven said:
Super! Punish me because I don't want to get curb stomped when I pop on for a few, hopefully fair games.Nickenzie said:
Increase re-queue times when you dodge or leave a lobby.RWoodrow said:
@Nickenzie What would prevent survivors from re-queing into the solo que over and over again until they got into a room with their friends like they did prior to the introduction of the SWF option?Nickenzie said:
I can't take all the credit, some of my ideas have been inspired by @weirdkid5 because I REAL feel like his suggestion will work to be honest!DelsKibara said:@Delfador said:
There are many very useful and beneficial threads but they get lost in this mess unfortunately.I do know stuff like @Nickenzie 's threads gets washed up in a sea of complaints, when the stuff he has proposed would be amazing for the general QOL of the game.
SWF Changes:
Basically, we need two party queues for the solos and SWF. SWF cannot join solos queues and vice versa to keep things simple. Solos will have an easier time reaching their pip zone while SWF will have to do a little more to reach theirs because they are expected to do better with voice communication. The killer will be rewarded with more BP whenever they are going against a SWF to compensate for the potentially increased difficulty.
Done and queues will remain the same as normal because we aren't directly splitting the player base in half.
First: 15 seconds
Second: 30 seconds
Third: 1 minute
Fourth: 5 minutes
Fifth: 10 minutes
Etc etc etc...
Basically force me into mixed rank SWFs with a not even passable array of perks and addons so an SWF can feel oooh so accomplished when reds, purples, and greens stomp a casual.
Huzzah.
Let's punish everyone that just bought the game so they gotta face smurfs looking for easy games.
Translation: (Histrionics => English)
"Every SWF is a commando unit waiting to waste me including the SWF who just wanna chill with their friends. Furthermore, I'll get bullied by every SWF even through some of those games might be my fault due to my mistakes and not because they are a SWF. Nickenzie is a dirty tryhard sweaty survivor who wants smurfs to bully lower ranked players and want killers to suffer so he's also @SenzuDuck follower, ignore him!"
To recap: (Unpopular opinion) Not every SWF is a commando unit so please stop with the exaggeration that every SWF is one. Furthermore, I lose on average 1 in 10 SWF games (depip) because the majority aren't the depip squad. Lastly, I obviously don't advocate smurfs to bully lower levels so please do not put words into my mouth. If you disagree, perhaps tell me some things you'll change to make it better instead of assuming the absolute worst about me.
And you complain about me putting words in your mouth? Wow.
Just gunna disregard the first part as having taking this personally when I didn't intend it to be.
Sorry.
Not trying to be a dick, just willing to realize when I'm about to be screwed over, and say something about it.
Problem is figuring out which 1 of 1000 SWFs aren't sweaty swat teams.
Playing Russian roulette isn't so much fun when there's 5 chambers loaded, and you have to pull the trigger 6 times.
And let's not forget that most SWFs look for easier matches in low rank killers so they don't have to be quite the sweaty swat team.
And that the big issue is communication, and coordination and most any SWF can, and often do abuse it which is still a gigantic advantage no matter how much people want to down play it.
Oh wow, you don't have problems with SWF? How many lvl 3 perks do you have to pick from? How many high end addons, and offerings?
Got that great loadout, or two waiting?
You haven't been taking in my point if view.
It's a totally different experience vsing SWF when you're prepared compared to when you aren't, or can't be prepared.
It's like Tru3 playing perkless. Even he struggles. If a pretty good killer like him struggles with a less than adequate loadout, where the heck do you think the people who aren't as good are?
Are you overlooking the similarities in SWFs seeking easier killers to deal with vs killers depipping to look for easier survivors?
What do you think forcing players to play SWFs will do?
It will force killers to endure teams that are looking to bully less prepared killers. The gamble is really high, and not in favor of the killer.
So indirectly, that is advocating letting SWFs bully less prepared killers via basically forcing killers into games lest they get punished.
Some 70 percent of games have a SWF. Has lobby times at rank 1 sped up any? If not, then that means most SWFs are in lower ranks.
And since most of them want killers in their teens of rank, most of them are going to be closer to 15 than 5.
You want to stop dodging? The sooner killers are on par with communicating, and coordinating SWFs, the better.
If you need solo to be on par with SWF first, then hurry up on that.
If killers are going to be on par with SWF they need time to do the things they have to do, or to be more efficient at it like:
better tracking ability in general. Maybe bake in whispers? Make scratches, blood, and sound more useful? Instead of them being constantly damaged.
2 hooks to kill instead of 3, maybe?
Able to end chases faster. Faster bloodlust, maybe?
Fix huntress' hatchets to allow for more leniency in throwing over obstacles, or beside them.
Maybe appeal to people's inner mercenary, and give them bonus BP for the difficulty spike? I mean bare minimum, that?
Funnel SWFs into red, and purple ranks?
Increase mori frequency?
Increase high end addon frequency?
Lower stun duration, and/or weapon wiping time?
Let's get rid of the gaping huge safezone that is an open gate, or even the hatch.
Let's make killer perks a bit easier to get so people can build proper loadouts sooner? Less odds of people who are already at end game suggesting perks killers don't have.
There's always that secondary, well third objective since totems are usually secondary. The speed a coordinated group moves at is too damn fast, and the secondary is often optional.
I'm just spitballing here. Not super serious, but I don't ever remeber seeing you propose ideas on closing the gap between killers and swf.
Honestly, I was hoping you would give it some thought which is why I usually mention it in your threads on catching solo up to swf. You seem actually interested in making the game better, and I respect that.
You're not someone that just sits there telling people to git gud, or insulting people for not being good.
Doesn't mean much when they have RPGs to kill tanks with, and the people they're ragging on has squirt guns.
At least I'm not demanding the removal of swf, though?
Our DBD killers are pretty shite at killing people, bluntly. Especially when even the weakest of SWFs can have free aura reading, and map.
All the extra steps they have to take, all the time they need is the problem.
In short, to boost killers, we should look at games that have SWF, and Voice, and their killers. What do they have that ours don't?
Jason is basically all our best killers in one, and then some to deal with the speed of voice chat, and dealing with the distances necessary to travel.
And they just now got close to balance with the game.
Our killers need to be closer to where he is. Not completely there, but, well, killers have to be better killers.
You cannot force people to play a game that isn't fun/rewarding. You can't punish them into it.
You have to make it fun and/or rewarding again. -
No such thing as a good killer, or a bad killer.
You either find some enjoyment, or you don't.
No one can tell you how to play but you. -
Don't survivors get an automatic 5k when a killer disconnects, plus the points they accumulated up to that point, though?
I don't ever DC by my own hand, mind you. Any depipping I do is rank reset. -
It's really all just Disney music.
Let it gooo-*stab* Let it gooooo! *stab*
*feral frenzy* Can you paint with all the colors of the wind -
-
It feels like people don't look at the big picture when it comes to the issues SWF generates.
That SWFs aren't looking for red rank killers for the most part. They're looking for brown rank killers. The teens.
I mean, hello? Complaints about wait times in high ranks? It's because people aren't there, and that means the 70 percent of groups with SWF aren't there.
They're looking for the easy games against killers who don't have the SWF killer loadouts.
To BS, wait, typo, VS killers unaware of the sheer bullshit an SWF can put them through, or those that aren't as prepared to face it.
To look at a killer player and imagine them with dozens of addons and offerings to kill SWFs with and able to use your SWF killing loadout is just... not the reality here.
Like I said, most SWFs are looking for people who are still trying to get to where a lot of people that have less to no problems with SWFs are.
And while it is the communication and coordination that is the biggest problems, don't forget that these people are also smurfing, and depipping without having to actually depip.
It's akin to a depipping killer looking for easier matches. Infact it's basically the same, except a killer actually has to depip, and survivors can actually benefit a little when they do.
I don't approve of either unless there's ample amounts of chill involved. Holding back to a make use of your skills to put on a good show. I mean if you're that good, you don't have to go flat out, and rush, right?
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Super! Punish me because I don't want to get curb stomped when I pop on for a few, hopefully fair games.Nickenzie said:
Increase re-queue times when you dodge or leave a lobby.RWoodrow said:
@Nickenzie What would prevent survivors from re-queing into the solo que over and over again until they got into a room with their friends like they did prior to the introduction of the SWF option?Nickenzie said:
I can't take all the credit, some of my ideas have been inspired by @weirdkid5 because I REAL feel like his suggestion will work to be honest!DelsKibara said:@Delfador said:
There are many very useful and beneficial threads but they get lost in this mess unfortunately.I do know stuff like @Nickenzie 's threads gets washed up in a sea of complaints, when the stuff he has proposed would be amazing for the general QOL of the game.
SWF Changes:
Basically, we need two party queues for the solos and SWF. SWF cannot join solos queues and vice versa to keep things simple. Solos will have an easier time reaching their pip zone while SWF will have to do a little more to reach theirs because they are expected to do better with voice communication. The killer will be rewarded with more BP whenever they are going against a SWF to compensate for the potentially increased difficulty.
Done and queues will remain the same as normal because we aren't directly splitting the player base in half.
First: 15 seconds
Second: 30 seconds
Third: 1 minute
Fourth: 5 minutes
Fifth: 10 minutes
Etc etc etc...
Basically force me into mixed rank SWFs with a not even passable array of perks and addons so an SWF can feel oooh so accomplished when reds, purples, and greens stomp a casual.
Huzzah.
Let's punish everyone that just bought the game so they gotta face smurfs looking for easy games. -
Not likely with ps4.
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SWF.
Both keeping the game alive, and killing it at the same time. -
At least she isn't on a motorcycle.
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I like trains!friendlykillermain said:@Rebel_Raven said:
I like trains.i like eggs
https://youtu.be/hHkKJfcBXcw
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Min.
Lone wolf gen jockey playing towards stealth. So is Min.
Cosmetics are cool, too.
-
I like trains.
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You're Welcome.friendlykillermain said:@Shad03 said:
We're putting songs now? I gotcha homie!Well, Tamatoa hasn't always been this glam
I was a drab little crab once
Now I know I can be happy as a clam
Because I'm beautiful, baby
Did your granny say listen to your heart
Be who you are on the inside
I need three words to tear her argument apart
Your granny lied!
I'd rather be
Shiny
Like a treasure from a sunken pirate wreck
Scrub the deck and make it look
Shiny
I will sparkle like a wealthy woman's neck
Just a sec!
Don't you know
Fish are dumb, dumb, dumb
They chase anything that glitters (beginners!)
Oh, and here they come, come, come
To the brightest thing that glitters
Mmm, fish dinners
I just love free food
And you look like seafood (seafood)(After Maui comes in)
Well, well, well
Little Maui's having trouble with his look
You little semi-demi-mini-god
Ouch! What a terrible performance
Get the hook (get it?)
You don't swing it like you used to, man
Yet I have to give you credit for my start
And your tattoos on the outside
For just like you I made myself a work of art
I'll never hide; I can't, I'm too
Shiny
Watch me dazzle like a diamond in the rough
Strut my stuff; my stuff is so
Shiny
Send your armies but they'll never be enough
My shell's too tough
Maui man, you could try, try, try
But you can't expect a demi-god
To beat a decapod (give it up)
You will die, die, die
Now it's time for me to take apart
Your aching heart
Far from the ones who abandoned you
Chasing the love of these humans
Who made you feel wanted
You tried to be tough
But your armour's just not hard enough
Maui
Now it's time to kick your
Hiney
Ever seen someone so
Shiny
Soak it in 'cause it's the last you'll ever see
C'est la vie mon ami
I'm so
Shiny
Now I'll eat you, so prepare your final plea
Just for me
You'll never be quite as
Shiny
You wish you were nice and
Shinywhy
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If I had to guess, it's because people use SWF as a way to depip without having to actually depip like a killer has to.DelsKibara said:@SenzuDuck said:
Don't worry about it - all the decent killers who don't care are playing the game.It's only the bad ones on the forum complaining about it honestly.
That is something I noticed as well in the Steam forums actually.
People who often cry about SWF being a problem often don't have the Rank 10 Killer or Survivor Achievements.
Like, we get that you are frustrated, but why are you complaining about a feature in the game when you haven't even played enough to get the Rank 10 achievements on both sides?
They aim for people who haven't even reached rank 10 for easier games. Easy games even easier.
This makes them way more common than in the people beyond 10.
This makes it more difficult for people to get BP to get the arsenal people take for granted when facing SWF.
I mean even good, or great killers struggle without the right perks against SWF. What happens when someone is just average without the right perks?
And because SWF can abuse matchmaking to get easier games, people woefully under prepared continually have to vs people with stacked loadouts, the advantage of voice comms (aka numerous free perks), coordinated maneuvers, and so forth.
Iirc, currently 70 percent of lobbies have at the minimum, 2 man SWF.
The game is not balanced for SWF, but SWF is extremely common.
I think frustration might be an understatement.
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1, gen rush is usually best done with people separated doing 1 gen each.ToxicFengM1n said:@Meme said:
I get it, you are insecure about your own skills as a survivor,but always doing swf is so sad. Like my god can someone please tell me what the point of playing killer is if I'm versing 4 perfectly coordinated survivors.at least during the event I can dc so they don't get there 25 lunar points.People want to play dbd with there friends, if you don't like swf dodge, but its not worth it, swf is easily countered by running discordance for gens
2, discordance is only good until they realize you have it. Then they either will do gens individually, or use discordance to bait around the killer. Kinda like that distraction perk.
First time I ran legion that's exactly what they did.
I mean they are going to notice the killer going right for gens lit up by discordance -
If SWF played like 4 solos normally would all the time, I doubt anyone would have a problem with them.
Thing is, they don't, usually.
It's not SWF in and of itself, it's all the enhancements to their gameplay survivors love to tack on. -
Might happen when we get dedicated servers some time this... summer was it? Pretty sure later this year.
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I generally don't camp outside of end game, but I can see a few reasons why they would.
Without seeing the match, there's going to be a lot of variables.
Kinda amazed that they got 2 kills first off.
Maybe the camped person was being toxic? Or hard to catch? Or both? If a person is being annoying, they just up the chances of being camped.
Then there's the camping of the person hooked when the gens are done.
Let's not act like leaving the hook when the gates are being opened is a smart idea.
Especially with the huge safe zone gates provide.
So secure the kill, maybe fight survivors and make them trade places a few times.
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It's not always about getting better, though.TheBean said:So at rank 15... You are facing the big bad SWFs.... Yeah wait till you get a bit higher in the rank when you want to complain about SWF.
You are get mostly at 15 is a bunch of smurfing. Usually one or two good survivors with a couple of potatoes. Try to find the potatoes and focus on them. Once you get them out of the way, you have a good shot at the good ones if they left gens up.
I find the good ones in those groups are trying to do most the work and won't be on gens so much as trying to help out teammates.
Sure there are SWFs in rank 15 that go full try hard.. but you gotta play them and get better. You'll only get better if you face players that are better then you.
For me, it's about grabbing a few games here and there, and hoping they're fair. Most SWFs aren't fair.
I don't have time to sit, and play the game 5 to 10 hours a day. I'm lucky to be able to get that in a week.
SWFs and "better" don't belong in the same sentence with me.
They're practically breaking the game to get a win, thus have no place talking to me about skill.
They are breaking matchmaking for easier games, so view it the same way you see depipping killers.
Voice comms are easy to use. Especially on ps4.
They play with a massive handicap, plus having greens, purples, or even reds in their team, plus voice chat, and coordination. The game isn't balanced for it.
Meanwhile I'm just trying to get a decent score so I can get decent perks and offerings on my killers.
Even some of the best killers will struggle with less than useful/ideal perks/offerings.
That said, consider people who aren't the best killers who can't pack a stacked loadout. -
Maybe if they earn somewhere between 3k, and 5k points in the match.
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I want to see Mins default down style but longer, and less volume.
Less poodle, I guess. -
Unfortunately they probably will not touch SWF.
70 percent of games have at least a 2 man SWF.
They certainly cannot go and offend the survivors.
SWF is a pain in the ass, and communication is what really puts them there. It's a ton of real time information, and that allows them to coordinate far too well.
Lower rank killers probably have it the worst. They're who get targeted for easy games, same as depipping killers.
The low rank killers generally end up facing greens, purples, and even reds.
They don't likely have a huge arsenal of perks or moris to counter the SWFs either.
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A 3 man swf can be a huge pain in the butt, too. That means the solo gets unlucky.malloymk said:I think dodging SWF is cheese, but I understand why weaker players would want to do that. Dodging any lobby with a solo player is so lame.
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Wouldn't ace in the hole pair well with pharmacy? Ot only do you get a med kit, but addons?
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I don't see why not?
The devs said something along the lines of not every killer can be rank 1 viable, but the ones that are usually rank 1 viable, nurse, and Billy, can be played as from the get go. Rank 20 to 1.
Not a killer main, though. -
From the window. To the balls.
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I've heard it used as a call to rescue, but I see it as a warning that the killer is near.
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It needs to come with a super hero costume so you can be particle man.
Particle man. Doing the things a particle can. -
Min.
Lone wolf gen jockey here.
The new cosmetics don't hurt either adding g to some good stuff she already had. -
Dude, dog/wolf mask is already exclusive as is stuff from that year.
Or it will be for the next decade and change until year of the dog rolls around again.
Pig will probably follow suit.
Unless I missed something?
Friggin'A.
I don't have time to sit and play 10 hours a day.
Even if I did, I'm not looking forward to spending too much time putting up with the headaches of either long survivor lobbies, or long bouts of putting up with survivor BS as a killer.
The devs would be stupid to turn down money from people like me.
Also, pretty bitter that year of the dog is exclusive since I was born on the year of the dog, though last one was the shittiest year of my life. -
I might be for assorted reasons.
Basically trying to put together the gaming trinity of having time, energy, and mood. 2 of the 3 is easy.
Hopefully I can punch through for one outfit, then maybe buy another.
All in all it depends on what happens when I can finally play, but I almost just gave in and bought everything. Then I came to my senses and wondered how I would enjoy the rest of the event with a bunch of useless points. -
Agreed. She really could do with more cosmetics.
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Kinda sorta.
It doesn't seem like it runs like hallowed blight where the 2 objectives are separate so both sides can get stuff done.
Back in hallowed blight I got my hooks, then let people go, you see. Like Trick or Treat.
Doesn't seem as feasible here since both teams are after the same resources.
Seems survivor sided a little, but we will see how easy it is to break a vessel after leaving the hooked survivor. They're probably going to be rescued quick.
We'll see how it goes, though. -
Doesn't matter, it should never have happened.HavelmomDaS1 said:Solo or SWF?
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Let's not forget that SWFs allow for higher ranking survivors to play against lower ranked killers.
It bypasses any need to depip, like killers generally have to do (not that I endorse it), and let's them complete the goal of an even easier game.
This leads to the irony, if not outright hypocrisy leveled at Killers when people complain they just want an easier game when they dodge.
Yes, I argue SWF is even worse when you're newer, and trying to get set up.
People who have played longer, and especially stay in high ranks keep suggesting builds, and perks that newer killers may not have.
It's like people forget that other people don't have all perks rank 3, if they even have the perk at all.
The higher ranks maybe taking a step back, and considering what SWF would be like if they couldn't run their preferred builds, or their backup, or their backup to that might help put things into perspective.
It's no good to suggest running an Omega blink nurse to someone who doesn't have the addons for it, after all.
Newer, less equipped killers are in the ranks a lot of SWFs want to target so they are far more frequent.
Worse still is these SWFs generally decide they want to annihilate the killer and act like they've accomplished something even though they purposefully aim for easier games. This absolutely ruins the experience of the killer, imo.
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It's an idea that is long overdue. I'm not sure why the devs hadn't applied it.
Surely survivors wouldn't protest so hard as to prevent the option? -
Let's not forget that SWFs allow for higher ranking survivors to play against lower ranked killers.
It bypasses any need to depip, like killers generally have to do (not that I endorse it), and let's them complete the goal of an even easier game.
This leads to the irony, if not outright hypocrisy leveled at Killers when people complain they just want an easier game.
Yes, I argue SWF is even worse when you're newer, and trying to get set up.
People who have played longer, and especially stay in high ranks keep suggesting builds, and perks that newer killers may not have.
It's like people forget that other people don't have all perks rank 3, if they even have the perk at all.
The higher ranks maybe taking a step back, and considering what SWF would be like if they couldn't run their preferred builds, or their backup, or their backup to that might help put things into perspective.
It's no good to suggest running an Omega blink nurse to someone who doesn't have the addons for it, after all.
Newer, less equipped killers are in the ranks a lot of SWFs want to target so they are far more frequent.
Worse still is these SWFs generally decide they want to annihilate the killer and act like they've accomplished something even though they purposefully aim for easier games. This absolutely ruins the experience of the killer, imo.
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Swf has multiple people on a gen, and notices the killer comes right for them. They try again. Same thing happens. They realize the killer probably has discordance, then never has more than one person on a gen at a time.Mr_Myers said:How does it ruin discordance?
Or they are facing legion, and just assume they're running it.
Heck, if an SWF feels like a killer has Discordance they can use it for mind games.
2 hop on a gen at one end of the map, and trigger it. It lasts upwards of 12 seconds.
The killer would likely go there, leaving an area so the SWF can work in relative ease. -
Not surprised.
Still not buying a killer I don't want to play as.
Do not want leatherface rituals. -
If a killer isn't moving for a bit, they probably won't at all until the kill is secured.Broosmeister said:
Jezus Christ, i expected that killers don't camp a guy when there is only 1 other survivor left with 2 gens to go. That's just useless. Even if the guy gets unhooked, there is no way we can get 2 gens done and it's so easy for billy to just go back to the hook and follow the scratchmarks.Rebel_Raven said:Sorry if I come off a but much here, but...
Why the hell are you there that long??!!
If the killer is camping that hard, and you can't draw them off, just go do something else! #########'a!
Break totems. Do gens. If there is a gen in visual of the killer, do that. Break a totem in visual range!
Further our progress to escape so either my sacrifice isn't in vain, or I don't have to survive any longer than I have to!
The killer might even know you're there! Why would a killer that hasn't left before, leave all of a sudden?
If i left my position, i was out in the open. I literally couldn't leave so i was just hoping for the best.
Billy probably forgot to slug to prevent the hatch play on top of that.
Speaking of, you couldn't go for the hatch? I'd want you to go find the hatch if it were me hooked and being secure kill camped.
If you play stealthy you're going to be hard to find. Killers have terrible eyesight. You might be surprised at what you can get away with.
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Sorry if I come off a but much here, but...
Why the hell are you there that long??!!
If the killer is camping that hard, and you can't draw them off, just go do something else! #########'a!
Break totems. Do gens. If there is a gen in visual of the killer, do that. Break a totem in visual range!
Further our progress to escape so either my sacrifice isn't in vain, or I don't have to survive any longer than I have to!
The killer might even know you're there! Why would a killer that hasn't left before, leave all of a sudden?
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Only if it's the survivors decision.
Killers would abuse the hell out of it if it was theirs.
Probably why most heart beat modifiers with killers are offerings. -
It's all good. I'm not one to want to tell people what to do, so you do you.Vietfox said:
Wait, i call myself survivor main because i play more as a survivor than as a killer, but it's just 60/40.@Rebel_Raven said:IMO, it's entirely possible to not be a main.
Mains, IMO, play one role the overwhelming majority of the time and likely do not appreciate being on the other side.
I play about the same. Usually what the rituals are when I catch up since my schedule gets in the way.
I don't consider myself a main.
I like survivor play because it's less stress.
I like killer for the stuff leading up to the hooking.
https://youtu.be/H4hd6YKFTzQ