mikewelk
mikewelk
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@Mooks said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3577035#Comment_3577035
It’s just there as a fun little discussion, people have different things they care about and want to see improved. No harm being done. You on the other hand come here to drag the thread, the OP and the devs down, being a negative Nancy. There is enough threads to critique the game/how things are handele. This very thread was none of them.
Instead of participating in the thread, you decide to reply to me about how my opinion is dragging people down. I get it, the truth hurts, but DBD 2 is a lost cause. I wish it wasn't, but oh well. I'm not going to falsely hope. Instead of fantasizing about DBD 2, why not ask for improvements mentioned here in the feedback and suggestions threads? If we're going to be stuck in the same game, why not make it as good as possible instead of dreaming about a not even rumoured sequel saving us?
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@Mooks said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3576973#Comment_3576973
Was this comment really necessary in this thread? Like… at all?!
Was this discussion even necessary? All people are going to say is better animations, better diversity, better weather system, etc. All predictable. It's like asking if you could make the perfect DBD, would you improve every element of the game or not.
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No point even considering it. You saw how long they take on the stupidest stuff. Twins rework in 2024 is comedic. The amount of time to rework Dull Merchant just for her to still be boring is pathetic. The method they take to nerf meta perks by oliterating them into a unusable perk is tragic. The list goes on.
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@CookieBaws said:
It's not an airport m8. Nobody cares. Just leave.
At least be original if you're going to comment something like that. Already seen it on a different thread where they didn't provide feedback, they did so here. Also don't write 'm8' just to act cool because it really isn't.
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Yeah, the characters are on the disk but you'll be stuck with the PS4 version of the game. You can upgrade to the PS5 version for free but you lose those characters in the process.
If the disk breaks then I don't really know. As long as you take care of it, nothing should happen at all.
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Lobby dodging would be CRAZY. But, then again, matchmaking shouldn't be so trash to begin with.
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@mizark3 said:
Just revert the nerf and buff back to pre-6.1.0 version of 5% per injured Surv. Alternatively, adjust it to 4.5% per injured Surv, to match the time increase of 5% on 80s gens and 4.5% on 90s gens.
No thanks, Legion games will be a snoozefest like before.
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@crogers271 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3569028#Comment_3569028
Could simply be a on/off button.I think people underestimate what it probably feels like to a developer to consider all of the time investment they'll need to put into an idea, only to be told that many people will just turn it off.
If it would go in, it would have to work for everyone. If we're just talking hypothetically, wouldn't it be cool if, then yeah, most people would probably take it.
To be that one guy though who pokes a hole in the idea: if you care deeply about balance, it would be an issue. A dark map would be a boon to killer's like Ghostface who need to hide, while probably hurting chase killers by making it harder for them to locate survivors.
Which now that I've typed the sentence, I'm all for the idea.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3569623#Comment_3569623
It's only a mere 82 pages! Works great!
😋
They wasted quite a bit of time on the Skull Merchant... ha ha...
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@Xyvielia said:
Would be appealing, aesthetically, and add more dimension to the horror vibe of a new realm, for sure
…tho, recurring Lightning flashes could prove threatening for any players with Photosensitive Epilepsy, potentially triggering seizures and causing harm or death.
Possibly why they haven’t yet implemented such features, idk.
Could simply be a on/off button. It doesn't have to be any crazy lightning that hits the map, maybe off in the distance or something.
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I just unlocked four cosmetics I wanted and called it a day. It wasn't too bad at the start but then it got progressively worse within hours.
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@Gargo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3568230#Comment_3568230
and? usually chains are broken like 1dd2dd3 (d - delay) but this cheater broke them like 123. Which obstacles on the map help to do that?
Every single one. You go around them as a survivor and as soon as the chain touches the obstacles, that's when they break.
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A survivor broke all three chains (probably) after taking advantage of walls/objects on a map? WHAT! remove all obstacles out of the game now! 😡
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It's horrid everywhere. Solo queue needs to inflate kill-rates 😁
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@rvzrvzrvz said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3567150#Comment_3567150
"does it's job" lol, everytime I see someone use it they die 5 seconds later it's incredibly weak, i don't think you can argue with that, tunneling is so free atm
I saw a DS like three-four months ago most recently against a Nurse. They downed them again in one blink...
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@Callahan9116 said:
This was a bad choice on your part. Don't go killer shack vs a good Billy unless its to drop God pallet and run somewhere else. Obviously he's gonna tunnel you if you got hooked like that. What would you do if you were him? If you don't like this happening there are plenty of perks to help, like off the record.
Sorry Callahan9116 😓
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Beautifully said.
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@Skillfulstone said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3564666#Comment_3564666
That is wrong. the devs said they added some things for Bubba specifically to mitigate his basement camping. Now Bubba can't chainsaw a Survivor off the hook twice in the same sweep (sometimes, the mechanic is finicky like most DBD things). They have said it over and over: the AFC isn't meant to prevent camping. Hell just recently I've seen Mandy say it in a thread.
My bad then. Haven't been on the forum for a while after getting insults thrown at me left and right so I wouldn't know what Mandy said. Thanks for clearing it up.
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@bacon said:
thanks all
No problem :)
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You can face-camp all you like once all gens are popped. The feature disables during endgame.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3564606#Comment_3564606
That person had a moment of cognitive dissonance. He couldn’t find a good way to rationalize that Ghostface’s bull crap, so he brought up an unrelated thing to try and like KiLlEr GoOd SuRvIvOr BaD your post. I suggest ignoring/blocking him.
What's scary is the 4,024 posts he has on this forum. I hope he was just having a bad day today and this isn't regular for him... Yikes.
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@Skillfulstone said:
1: As was said by the devs the AFC is meant to counter facecamping and not camping in general. Furthermore, the devs said that the AFC is considerably slowed if the Killer is on a different floor even if close.
2: You spent more than 1 hook state on the hook and one gen was done? Either your teammates were afk, completely lost or close enough to slow the unhook bar.
3: Basement camping, while egregious, will always be a thing simply because certain Killers, either due to their lack of skill or simply the Killer they are playing, almost need it. If the AFC fully worked through floors Basement would have no reason to exist.
4: Hard tunnelling at 4-gens was, is, and will likely always be an issue unless DS is brought back to a worthwhile state. Due to the death of DS there is no reliable counter-measure as basekit BT is laughably easy to work around.
Sadly, the AFC simply isn't made to remove camping as a whole so those kind of sitch will still happen...
Devs said it's meant to counter shack camping due to Bubba being able to just stay by the entrance. And yeah one gen was done. Welcome to solo queue.
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@JustAnotherNewbie said:
I got a similar killer but in IDV ranked. I would throw pallets and they would break them, I would make a mistake of stunning them with my ability power (survivors have abilities that are unique to them) which can actually make them recover from their animation lock. (I mean I didn't expect they'd break every single pallet I dropped lol). Regardless we got 3 out which counts as a win and we all get points, but killer reprimanded me in end chat about how I should learn to play my character and that I should not pallet spam (what does this even mean?)
Probably just angry they had to break pallets and you didn't give them a free hit. If the reason sounds silly, then it probably is that.
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@DemonDaddy said:
Theres not much skill involved in dropping pallets. The devs have made it a braindead tactic for the worst survivor to extend chase. The only time this comes off as skillful is when its against a killer that isnt bound by standard chase rules; prime example like stunning a nurse mid blink.
Using pallets is a braindead tactic now? When was it not? Pallets are pallets and they always have been a key aspect in the game. Are you the Ghostface? I'm so sorry I should just give you a free hit and not use pallets to my advantage as you walk through each one without a care in the world.
Are you implying good survivors don't use pallets? This is just so silly I don't know how you read that and said yeah this is good.
No one was talking about skill and yet you mention it. Was stunning the Ghostface skillful? No, because he wasn't mind-gaming at all. Was it the right thing to do? Yes, because it avoided a unnecessary hit.
Genuinely what is your point here?
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@Lobos said:
Using too many pallets is only bad if it's still very early in the match. If you are still on 5 gens and half the pallets are gone that is a problem.
However, if there are only 1 or 2 gens left, I say drop every single pallet you see while in Chase and buy as much time as possible so those last remaining gens can get finished.
Wasn't early at all. Two gens left and the survivors kept going into deadzones where pallets were used and apparently 'all' the pallets were gone. I don't blame them for going into deadzones because the pallet spawns on that map are rubbish but as I said I only dropped five after three gens were completed. I don't know if some other survivor was dropping them often and Ghostface just got mad at me because I knew how to loop him whilst my team couldn't take chase for 30 seconds.
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@radiantHero23 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3564539#Comment_3564539
Well. That sometimes comes down to the tile in question. They played Ghostface correct? On some maps there are tiles that are legitimately unfair for m1 killers. So. If that's his point. He wants wrong.
He didn't mind-game any tiles that had pallets. Just powered through them. Even for those risky loops. Whole situation is just bizzare.
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@MikeyBoi said:
Shack in the middle I’m assuming you were on Rotten fields (coldwind) As Ghostface you can’t really afford to over commit to a chase for too long because you don’t have any mobility to drop the chase if you can’t get a down on that survivor.
As a billy main, I get frustrated at survivors sometimes when they pre drop pallets when I’m buzz light years away from it. That’s why I made the switch to bamboozle and lopro chains over double engravings a long time ago.
At the end of the day survivors are just using the resources that are provided before them and I’ve always said time and time over and over again if you choose to play a killer with no unique mechanical skill ie: myers, Ghostface, pig, trapper, clown, wraith, legion etc..you’re taking a bit of a gamble towards a winnable game or not..
Yeah it was probably that map. He did over-commit but it was solo-queue so it wasn't too punishing. He only hooked me once because he pulled off a moonwalk on a T-wall which I countered but he stopped mid-way and kept going forward so that got me. My team flopped really badly so I didn't get that second chance. I was really confused when he kept tea-bagging me when I was downed but apparently using pallets is toxic to some.
The last paragraph is a really nice touch because it is the truth. I even asked the guy 'was I meant to give you free hits?' and he didn't reply sadly.
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@radiantHero23 said:
I dislike predropping and pallet camping. It's the most lame gameplay if you play killer.
Sadly it's also one of the most effective playstyles
Yeah it is, shame that even when you don't do that some killers still complain.
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It would be nice to earn a little more XP but I don't really care much about BP at all. 300% is definitely overkill though, as previously mentioned, but 125-150% would be cool. Even with 300% BP I would still prefer playing with friends than going through a solo queue game thanks to the matchmaking.
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@codebibi said:
even i as a survivor main think that the tail attack should not be easily dodge it would make it useless and make it very weak but the hitbox should be change it is god damn awful.
I don't want it to be easily dodged, just possible to react to.
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@Seraphor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3532342#Comment_3532342
Funnily enough if you had continued to read my topic on fair nerfs...
Again you've just completely disregarded my stance to insert your own.
No, the Tail Attack should NOT be something you can easily dodge, because the killer is not designed that way.
Instead, Turrets should be more impactful against killers who can reliably hit them.
Again, you're acting as if I want Xeno to be a toned-down Pyramid Head. I'm not saying it should be easy to dodge the ability. It would ruin the whole purpose of what a killer is. Is Pyramid Head's ability easy to dodge in higher MMR? No, absolutely not. But there's still a chance to react to his attack. Something Xeno lacks.
Sure, we can buff turrets to mitigate the issue. I wouldn't mind at all.
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@dbdthegame said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3532386#Comment_3532386
The M2 is even less reliable to hit the turret with. Not only is the hitbox broken for the turret, the M2 hitbox is also skinny. If you happen to whiff (which can happen quite easily even if you're spot on the turret, if you're looking too far up), you're basically forced out of power for free. Or we could hop in a custom right now, and I'll set up a bunch of turrets, and you can show me how easily you M2 them.
I didn't say corners of the map, I said corners. The intersection of two walls is a corner. Set up a turret around it, moderately far from the wall so it can't be M1'd, and run the killer around that corner going the opposite way. Killer has to decide to either get burned out of power or turn around and destroy the turret, giving you lots of distance.
No, it's not a coin flip. Nemesis' tentacle is easier to hit because 1) it can be buffered 2) it can be dragged for longer 3) it doesn't have a vertical division and instead covers a plane directly in front of him.
Doesn't matter how it feels. What matters is what is actually happening. It "feels" bad to get grabbed by a Wesker from 6 meters past a wall because you have really bad latency, but on his end, he grabbed you properly. This is a ping issue, not a killer issue.
Let me repeat this. EVERY single Xeno I have faced has never missed hitting a turret, whether they M1 or M2.
We suddenly defending the use of VPNs now?
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@dbdthegame said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3532336#Comment_3532336
Tail Attack actually is much easier to dodge than Demo's shred. Tail attack has a very skinny hitbox as opposed to the truck-sized hitbox Demo has, can't be buffered, and doesn't cause the Xeno to move at 460%.
Xeno needs no nerf. He's a B-tier killer at best. Learn to play and stop whining.
Bold of you to say it's easier to dodge when mathematically you cannot react fast enough to dodge the tail attack. Demo has a whole animation and sound cue. He's a B-tier killer according YOU with no imformation to back it up. Learn to argue and stop thinking your tier list is the same for every player.
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@dbdthegame said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3532316#Comment_3532316
You see the tail whip backwards, that is the visual cue. And you hear the whip-like sound of the tail shortly before it shoots out, that is the sound cue. He has a 3 second cooldown after using his tail attack, and moves at 2m/s during that time. Survivor can make up to 6m of distance (as much extra distance as you would have received from a Sprint Burst use) during that time.
Xeno WILL be in an M1 state if you set up a turret and run him into it, and he misses hitting the turret (which happens quite frequently because their hitbox is actually broken, I've M1'd them many times at point blank while they were shooting at me and somehow still didn't break them). Otherwise, the turret forces him to hit it and lose distance and vision of you briefly. You can use this time to make distance and run him into another turret. Or, you can set up ambush turrets around corners and run him into them, and essentially force him to pick between chasing you or breaking the turret.
The hitbox being small absolutely means a lot. Bad ping and VPNs don't change the size of the hitbox, they only change the latency of the hit on both ends. If a Xeno whiffs, they whiffed. And a small hitbox makes whiffing much more likely.
You missed hitting a turret..? Just use M2, all PC players do it and only console players struggle with M2. You simply cannot blame it on the hitbox if all the other Xenos I've faced have zero problem with it.
Xeno will not be in an M1 state if the killer doesn't experience skill issues and is incapable of hitting a stationary object. Once the object is hit, you gain a tiny bit of distance, not even enough to get you to a new loop and Xenos will not lose sight of you that bad that they lose you.
The problem with moving turrets into corners of the map is that survivors are heavily hindered so it would be a bit silly to carry turrets so far.
The hitbox being small is a coin flip. You either hit something you shouldn't have or you miss, just like Nemesis' tentacle. PC players shouldn't have a problem with aiming more precisely, but controller players do unfortunately.
Latency suddenly meaning nothing in the context of absurd hits is a bit sillly. Sure, it doesn't actually change the hitbox, but it sure does feel like the hitboxes are larger.
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@Seraphor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3532351#Comment_3532351
Why are you taking responsibility for everyone? How do you know no one is saying this?
But regardless, what you're asking for IS this very thing. You keep saying you want the attack to be telegraphed, so you can react to it, and dodge it. That's the whole point. If it could be reliably dodged, Turrets would be useless.
Never did I say I was. Also, I know no one is asking to nerf Xeno to that level because there's not a single discussion about it. Common sense.
Oh I'm such a bad survivor main for asking that a M2 ability can have a visual animation and audio cue like every other killer has! 😡
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@Seraphor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3532345#Comment_3532345
I haven't literally said you wanted anything.
Do you think you're the only person calling for nerfs?
Since you made this discussion AFTER commenting on my discussion multiple times, it's safe to assume I had some influence. No one is saying Xeno needs to be nerfed to that extent, you're just acting like it.
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@Seraphor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3532336#Comment_3532336
Then maybe you should read more carefully and realise that's in the context of the Tail Attack being nerfed so that it would not be better than Demo's Shred.
You're not making it easy to dispel the 'entitled survivor main' facade.
You're literally saying that I want the Xeno to have his power nerfed to the ground. I've made it very clear over and over again that I just want Xeno to be punished more for missing alongside many other people.
Yet again, the people yapping about "survivor mains" always exaggerate nerfs.
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@Seraphor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3532324#Comment_3532324
Compare with any other killer and you realise none of these killers have a counter tool to disable that killers power entirely.
The Tail Attack is intended to be unforgiving, so that survivors are encouraged to make use of Turrets.
If the Tail Attack could be dodged conventionally by any skilled looper with a constantly clicking flashlight, there would be no need for Turrets.
Xendritch said it well here:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3532318#Comment_3532318
A single turret doesn't get Xeno out of Crawler Mode. How are you meant to make use out of turrets whilst looping? Would love an explanation. The tail attack should be something you can react to like Pyramid Head's ability. As of now, mathematically, you cannot react to it and just need to dodge based on feelings.
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Tail attack being no better than Demo's shred is all I needed to read to stop.
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@KoreWaPantsu said:
What I find really funny it's survivor mains complain about GUESSING what the killer is gonna do (even with clearly signals aka "animation") while reading - and using - the environment, calculating distance and timing of their own actions.
Welcome to a tiny little part of the killers' side, HF. <3
It's always the people yapping about "survivor mains" that provide the worst arguments.
Are we not meant to complain that we have to guess wether a killer is doing an M2? Every other killer has clear indication of using their special ability, just not this killer. Guessing just leads to lose/lose situations. There is no sound cue or visual cue for this ability so I don't know which game you're playing.
Stop being a silly killer main 😡
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@radiantHero23 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3531859#Comment_3531859
Now that I take as a personal offence.
First you deny me my quality education.
Second, as far as I know, killer mmr spreads across killers. I have a 80% ein ration on my pig so I don't think I'm anywhere low mmr on killer. Sorry.
On survivor, it could be, course I play the role less frequently. However, I solely play soloq and have very decent teammates. Soooo....
Low mmr? I can't say for sure that I'm above low mmr because of the lack of data on my part. But on the same end you can't call me low mmr because of the lack of data on your part.
Sorry mate.
Quality education? You hired a DBD teacher or something?
If you have a 80% win rating on Pig, one of the weakest killers in the game, that tells me all I need to know about survivors you're matched with.
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@Seraphor said:
You get punished for missing the ability and lose distance? His ability has NO cool down. He loses barely any distance so no need for the exaggeration.
Factually incorrect, it has a 3 second cooldown and halves his movement speed during that time.
Okay, compare that to pyramid head. His cool down is way longer than three seconds when they put their blade in early. They also get slowed down whilst in their ability and the camera movement becomes stiff. Xeno doesn't slow down in his ability, recovers faster, doesn't have any camera stiffness, and moves faster after the animation.
Compare that cool down with any other killer and you'll realize that three seconds isn't much for such an ability. They'll also lose the least amount of distance when the ability misses.
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@Merciless_Killer said:
Xenomorph is fine other than turrets being hard to place where you want on some maps.
Okay, explain to me how instead of just saying they are fine. You simply cannot answer the question so you just say blank statements like that.
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@dbdthegame said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3532025#Comment_3532025
There is both a visual AND sound cue to his power, not to mention he CANNOT cancel out of it after buffering it. He has to hard commit to using it. As opposed to say, Huntress, or Nemesis, or Pyramid Head. There is also plenty of punishment to missing. He loses quite a bit of distance. It's not exactly a "strong" chase power. It's more of an antiloop power. A chase power is typically mobility oriented (or at least, allows for hits from very far away), and chase powers typically counter W holding, which Xeno can't. He does have a mobility aspect to his power (tunnels), but his tail is an antiloop, not a chase. And I'm not even sure if I would call it a "strong" one. In terms of antilooping, it's about on par with Nemesis (minus pallet breaking and with less range) and Pyramid Head (minus hitting through walls and range).
Good thing about his counterplay not being very strong. We're not talking about an exceptionally powerful chase/antiloop power like Singularity's, that needs to have some form of hefty counterplay. The guy is literally an M1 killer without it, and is a sidegrade to Nemmy/Phead with it. Not to mention neither of them have any particular counterplay to canceling out their power.
I have about 6k hours in DBD. The hitbox for his tail is probably one of the smallest and tightest in the game. As far as being hit over tall obstacles, it's due to the nature of the hitbox (it angles down). It's an extremely hard maneuver to pull off because you typically hit without LOS, but it's incredibly rewarding to hit.
Visual and sound cue? Since when?
You get punished for missing the ability and lose distance? His ability has NO cool down. He loses barely any distance so no need for the exaggeration.
Xeno is never in M1 state unless you're going against a SWF with good turret locations. No point even mentioning he's an M1 killer.
I do not care that you have 6k hours. It's completely irrelevant in this subject.
The hitbox being small doesn't mean anything. If the server is laggy, absurd hits will happen no matter what. Why do you think killers use VPNs?
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@MrPenguin said:
What are you using for your balance point?
For the average potato player, yeah they might be a bit strong but that's not saying much.
For really good players I don't believe it's Nurse Blight level which is necessary to compete.
For above average players they're probably fine since that's where A tier is "balanced" I believe and most people seem to put the Xeno in A tier.
Your belief doesn't mean anything and contributes absolutely nothing here. Tell me why you believe that because, you know, that's how arguments work.
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@dbdthegame said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/390022/peoples-perspective-on-xenomorph
How is the tail attack unbalanced?
Ummm. If this isn't satire, go onto my previous discussion.
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@lukesebb said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3531874#Comment_3531874
Resilience be getting more customers lately LMAO
I'm one of them 🤑
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@Frumpbeard said:
It has a pitiful 4.8m range, stops the moment it hits an obstacle, and no additional utility. Pyramid Head can go through walls and hit multiple Survivors at a range of 8-10.5m. Nemesis can break pallets and get 6m range, and the attack doesn't stop when it hits something so you can strafe around objects mid-swing.
When Xeno uses the tail whip, it curls upward and moves back slightly and makes a sound. I went through frame-by-frame and from hitting the button to the Survivor getting injured took around 0.7 seconds. For Nemesis, it takes 0.8 seconds including the charge time and 0.4 seconds excluding it. Nemesis can start his attack while hidden behind a wall which can give less than 0.4 seconds to react. All your complaints are invalid.
Even if you perfectly time the tail whip while coming around a corner as Xeno to try and do the same thing, your body is pointed sideways while strafing so they can see your head coming around the corner.
All my complaints are invalid huh? I doubt you explained all my points in 3 silly paragraphs but lets dive in.
4.8m range is far from pitiful, especially combined with the speed Xenomorph has. Weak argument.
Pyramid head has a whole animation + sound cue. You can react to his ability, something you cannot do with xeno. Again, weak argument.
Why are we suddenly getting into Nemesis statistics? Get to the point.
Xeno's tail whip has a sound AFTER it strikes, not before. Stating false assumptions doesn't help.
Conclusion: you proved absolutely nothing.
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@Boons123 said:
I agree with everything. I don't know why all this is a lethal defense that I haven't seen in any other killer
I was expecting name-calling but this was next level. This forum just doesn't promote healthy discussions anymore.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3531874#Comment_3531874
I think it is even worse than before. At least for female Survivors, I dont think there is much difference between a fast vault and a medium vault when it comes to distance after vaulting.
Could definitely be possible. I'm playing on and off because of how annoying Xenos are to face 24/7 so I'm not 100% sure.
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They reverted the vault fix. Male survivors also still vault further than female survivors...