Haddix
Haddix
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I've never seen good survivors have much of an issue working around it, so I think it's alright. Just something you have to adapt to in the match. Killer can't always attack multiple tinkerers at once if you have good gen pressure on them.
Not something I like using, though. Tinkerer feels really cheesy to me.
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trick blades are not at all useless
if they ever removed this addon, i would ######### strangle someone. that addon is so useful and so much fun.
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@QwQw said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2251084#Comment_2251084
They both infect survivors, infected survivors become weaker, infected survivors get some way to cure the infection.
The only difference is that Nemesis' infection is overall weaker, because he has
Punish of the Dammedhis tentacle attack to make up for it.Infection is just what it's called, but the actual infection mechanics are completely different. The infection system for nemesis is a downside to his power, whereas the infection system for Plague is to her benefit. Plague's infection breaks you once you're fully infected, has no downside for Plague, spreads to other survivors and onto the environment, and cleansing it benefits Plague. Nemesis's infection meter is just a way for them to limit how strong his tentacle/zombies are. That's literally it. They didn't want the tentacle downing you in 2 hits, and they didn't want zombies downing you in 2 hits. If they removed the infection mechanic, it would buff Nemesis.
Besides the puking animation being the same, they have no similarities.
btw, his tentacle has a 0.35 second charge time and instantly flies out. POTD has a 1 second charge time with around a massive delay and cannot be flicked like the tentacle. they're very different powers, tbf. lol
but that just says more about pyramid's power being more of a zoning tool than a reliable ranged attack, lmfao. nemesis can guarantee a tentacle hit every time, which is awesome.
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@QwQw said:
He's pretty balanced, must of his add-on's suck, and his power is kinda just a rehashed version of Plague and Pyramid Head in my opinion.
I think William Birkin, Jack Baker, or Karl Heisenberg would have been a better pick for an RE killer.
he has almost no similarities to plague though
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@woundcowboy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2249605#Comment_2249605
Yup, you’re right: survivors should render the killer’s power meaningless with strong loops that actually have no counterplay. Sounds like a recipe for super fun killer matches.
I feel like people in this game forget that in almost every single kind of 1v1, you rely on predicting your opponent, hoping they ######### up, and hoping you make the right move. If that 1v1 is mechanically/physically demanding, then you rely on them just being worse than you. If they're an equal skill level, you rely on them ######### up and you hitting enough shots/hits/etc. This is not only applicable to video games, its applicable to card games, board games, sports, etc. What I'm describing is what balance is. What would ever be the point of a guaranteed 100% reliable counterplay to your opponent's abilities in any type of 1v1?
Not to mention, this game is also a 1v4...
I think players are WAY too used to DBD's original gameplay, where survivors COULD actually run to almost every structure in the game and be safe/waste minutes of the killers time. It's hard for people to give up on that, but they need to. That's not how PVP works.
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@MadLordJack said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2249579#Comment_2249579
Okay, first of all there is a ######### ginormous distinction between the terms "majority" and "a lot", so don't put words in my mouth and pretend I said that Blight can't play the majority of tiles. Second, counterplay isn't guessing. There's no skill to a guess, that's why it's called a guess and not "Knowledge". Counterplay is doing something meaningful to prevent the killer from hitting you, it's not hoping the killer ######### up. All this BS about 50/50's is exactly the same nonsense people scream about with Spirit, it's not ######### counterplay, it's the Blight sucking dick.
Counterplay is doing something meaningful to prevent the killer from hitting you, it's not hoping the killer [BAD WORD] up.
That's not how any balanced 1v1 is supposed to be designed, though.
In a balanced 1v1 scenario, as the killer is hoping the survivor ######### up and makes the wrong move, the survivor is also hoping the killer ######### up and makes the wrong move. That's what versing a human being is all about, given that they both have the same chance in the fight. In DBD's case both sides use mindgames to force each other into vulnerable positions where they have to guess in order to get a hit/get to a vault.
Will the survivor vault the window or fake it? Will the killer double back? Will the survivor double back? Is the killer moonwalking and hiding their red light, or are they actually changing direction?
These are all scenarios where predictions have to be made, and the right prediction will grant you safety/a hit. If one side could always make a play that 100% guarantees safety no matter the input from the opponent (in the case of DBD, eventually the killer IS supposed to hit you, but you should always be able to waste time beforehand. That should be your guarantee as a survivor, not that you can avoid being hit for the entire match), then that's not counterplay ideal for a PVP game - especially for DBD. So...counterplay IS guessing. Counterplay is predicting your opponent's next move in a 50/50 scenario they force you in. If you could ALWAYS know what's going to guarantee safety for yourself, then your opponent wouldn't have counterplay to you. That would make any type of competitive game that doesn't require much mechanical skill extremely boring.
This may not always apply to a game like a shooter because mechanical skill is where counterplay can lie. In this game, ideally, the best player comes out on top not by their mechanical skill, but by the predictions they make, which is the majority of it, and, in some scenarios, dodging an attack. You can predict Blight. He can predict you. Whoever predicts the other's move wins. There's nothing wrong with that.
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@MadLordJack said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2249552#Comment_2249552
The only way to play short loops with Lethal Rush against good survivors is by exploiting.
And yes, counterplay is turning the killer into a basic m1 killer. That's what Oni counterplay is, that's what Billy counterplay is, that's what Blight counterplay is, that's what Huntress counterplay is, that's what every single bit of meaningful, reliable counterplay in DbD - forcing them to not be able to effectively use their power in certain situations.
It depends on the short loop, though. There are definitely some short loops that you can use your Rush in.
Even then, you said, "Forced to run a lot of tiles..." When you say that, I think of EVERYTHING, not just filler pallets which he's typically weaker at (until the pallet is dropped)
that's what every single bit of meaningful, reliable counterplay in DbD
If I'm understanding what you're getting at, I wouldn't entirely agree, personally.
You initially said the developers DESIGNED Blight to be an M1 killer in the majority of tiles, which is what gives him counterplay. I don't think this is true. The counterplay to Blight is the different moves that you can make to potentially throw him off in his power and make him waste his power usage. As I said, LOS breaks, obstructions, predicting his rush pathing, double vaulting, etc. HE can counter this if he makes the correct read on you (and you can counter this if you make the correct read on him, so on, so forth until one of you is put in a situation where you've lost the 50/50s and are forced to eat a pallet/take a hit), and that's why Blighted Rush is a great example of a power that has a very balanced amount of counterplay. I wouldn't ever say that the aspect of Blight that gives him counterplay is that he's an M1 killer, as M1 killers don't have counters to smart survivors at stronger loops, like jungle gyms. That wouldn't be counterplay, that'd be guaranteed safety. At junk tiles or something though, sure. Then I can sorta get what you mean.
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@MadLordJack said:
Except Blight is forced to run a lot of tiles as a basic m1 killer due to the intentional limitations on his power, thereby giving him actual counterplay that is voided only by exploitation that the developers themselves are trying to remove.
huh? you don't need any type of exploit to run tiles with blighted rush. that's not true at all.
on top of that, implying that a killer being a basic M1 killer gives them actual counterplay is odd. there's a reason killers have anti-loop. basic M1 killers aren't made to run the majority of tiles in game.
blighted rush itself has counterplay. countering his bump positioning with your own positioning, predicting where he's going to go, using LOS breaks, double vaulting to punish him for hard committing, and hiding behind obstructions to avoid hits is his counterplay. not that he's an M1 killer lol.
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@Phasmamain said:
She is completely outclassed by wraith in terms of stealth and anti loop and her traps are mediocre at best
on top of that, a hit and run wraith applying sloppy over and over to a team + getting fast stealth downs and applying pop to gens is far better slowdown than anything her traps can do IMO.
he's just overall better at pressuring the entire team/slowing down the game, stealth, lunge capability, and mobility. there is almost nothing she does better than him.
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@FrndlyChnswSalzmn said:
Because she can put a kind of pressure on Survivors they have no control over. Survivors hate losing control, because losing control means they have to do something other than hold shift + M1 to win.
This is a casual party game, so it caters to the casual party crowd: Survivors.
....what? this has nothing to do with the question. you just brought up an entirely new, unrelated topic for no reason.
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No, the "lullaby" sounds exactly like his outer terror radius. Tested it in a KYF, and it basically sounds like he has around a 32-meter terror radius.
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Old freddy needs to return :)
The rework was a failure. Way too easy to use, super uninspired, and not fitting to Freddy Krueger at all.
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@Northener1907 said:
Still better than The Game map.
i would take gideon over swamp any day tbh
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@Predated said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2241617#Comment_2241617
"All of the things above were created in a time where the developers lacked an understanding of their game's balance."
Just like Dead Hard was able to be used mid-air FOR DISTANCE, which, mind you, is no longer possible even though killer kept that ability.
Dead Hard is fine.
"Dead Hard was created during this time (2016-2018) and applies to this."
See the previous statement, where Dead Hard has been adjusted in the following ways: The speed curve has been altered to match the animation(the animation used to finish before Dead Hard was finished, meaning Dead Hard was nerfed mechanically). Removed the distance made mid-air, also nerfing Dead Hard as Dead Harders used to be able to Dead Hard through certain windows mid-air. Windows that a lot of killers are still able to go through mid-air.
Dead Hard is fine.
"So...it's free, but then it's not free? Pop rewards you for a hook. I don't see the connection to Dead Hard's condition of being hit by a killer, which is the killer doing their job properly."
Dead Hard isnt free either, it requires you to be injured. You cannot get injured for free. You literally have to get hit by the killer to make Dead Hard work, which is part of a survivor's job. If you never get hit all game, you're most likely sandbagging your teammates. Prayer beads didnt have a cost of use, there was no penalty. Omega Blink Nurse didnt have a cost, there was no penalty. Dead Hard HAS a cost of being injured. Preferably, survivors dont want to be injured if that option arises. Survivors want to be uninjured over being injured. It's just that in quite a lot of cases, there is no time to heal up if you want to win a game, thus staying injured is more preferable.
"No, once again, you get rewarded for a hook by BBQ. "For free for hooking" makes no sense at all. You're contradicting yourself."
Just like you need to get injured as a surv to use dead hard. Dead Hard doesnt work if you're instadowned, Dead Hard doesnt work against a Bubba, Dead Hard doesnt work against a Plague with Red Vom, Dead Hard doesnt work against a killer that baits it. Dead Hard doesnt work against a Nurse. Dead Hard doesnt work against a Pig, Dead Hard doesnt work against a Wraith, Dead Hard doesnt really work against Demo unless used for side stepping quickly, Dead Hard doesnt work against Trickster, Dead Hard doesnt really work against Blight, Dead Hard doesnt really work against Doctor(you cant do anything for 2.5 seconds after each shock). Let alone that survivors are exhausted after using Dead Hard. For all intents and purposes, it's a 1 time trigger per individual hook. Which is why I compared it to Pop in the first place. Add exhaustion inducing addons or perks in the mix, and they cant even use Dead Hard. So if you consider Dead Hard to be free, even though you're an instadown at that point, I will consider Pop to be free. Being injured is sacrificing a health state for a dash that can be baited. You dont have to do anything special to trigger BBQ or Pop after hooking a survivor, it literally comes for free while you hook someone.
"Uh, if you don't think you can counter slugging without an anti-slug/healing perk, I'm not sure what to tell you mang. Getting mass slugged is on your team."
Nope, plenty of examples where mass-slugging just happens out of killer momentum being able to chain together. Nurse Infectious Fright slugfests are pretty much the most common Nurse encounter. Nothing you can do about that as a survivor. You NEED anti-slug perks to counter that, no vanilla mechanics to do so.
"yep, which is why I also hate camping and tunneling. should not be in the game. both things are, as I said with dead hard, available to do because they weren't prevented by the devs during a time where they lacked an understanding of their game's balance. both of these things are extremely unhealthy and require 0 skill and do not belong in an online pvp game."
Except that like Dead Hard, sometimes you need to camp, sometimes you need to tunnel. You cannot nerf these 3 things in the game, unless you want to nerf lunges, nerf gens to death and give all killers access to instadowns in a vanilla way. Which gives more reason to keep dead hard in the game, which gives more reason for people to find ways to rush gens, which gives more reason to camp and tunnel. You can dislike these things, that doesnt mean they're broken. Worst case scenario, you could add a punishment to them, but that doesnt really solve the issue you personally are having.
"Incorrect. Ruin rewards gen pressure and can be completely destroyed at any moment in the match. Pop rewards hooks. Make Your Choice is not a perk design I'm a fan of at all, but its effect is not as strong as Dead Hard"
Lets go back to what you stated before: "Dead Hard is not a base mechanic, thus, the game is not balanced around survivors having a powerful dash completely for free." Pop is not a base mechanic that you completely get for free. As for "rewards the use of vanilla mechanic X", let me remind you that you're not really losing a chase as a survivor for getting injured. The game is literally designed to guarantuee hits for killers. Survivors cannot remain uninjured all game as a whole. So getting hit is not "losing the chase". You "lose" a chase based on the time it takes to get a hit. Dead Hard rewards survivors for distracting the killer succesfully, not for losing a chase. Otherwise I could say that any instadown in the game rewards the killer for not being able to keep long chases. Pop punishes survivors for not succesfully finishing a gen/pushing the wrong gen. Dead Hard punishes a killer for not succesfully ending a chase/unsuccesfully baiting Dead Hard. Both can really hurt the game for the opponent if they are used in an optimal way, both are really annoying to deal with, but both can be baited quite heavily and barely have any impact if done so. I have sometimes left gens on 50% on purpose, knowing that the killer would waste his Pop on that, while I finished a gen that was at 70% 16 meters further. Sure, 20 seconds of my time were "wasted" on that 50% gen, but in exchange, another, more crucial generator was finished. Same logic can be applied to dead hard. I've forced survivors to dead hard, then leave the chase, only to come back 30 seconds later while they were distracted and working on a generator in a dead zone, without dead hard in their arsenal, they were just easy pickings.
Yes, the perk is annoying to deal with, but annoying isnt really a reason to nerf something. I rather see more exhaustion inducing perks(Mindbreaker is really nice against Dead Hard. They have to stand still or walk for 5 full seconds if they want their Dead Hard back. If they are already injured, they wont have enough time to remove their exhaustion). Preferably a hex that adds exhaustion on survivors for 90 seconds if triggered. But other than that? Exhaustion perks are fine. I'd argue that Sprintburst is far more broken than Dead Hard. Anything Dead Hard can do, Sprintburst can do better.
"Killer basekits are balanced around their addons, as confirmed by the developers, so that's not correct either." Again, my point was that because it's not a basemechanic, it's a thing they get for free just by applying it.
"And that failed. Lunges do not counter Dead Hard unless it is used improperly."
If you're touching a survivor, you can start a lunge, and still hit a dead harding survivor. So yes, I'd argue they DO counter dead hard. In the same way that Dead Hard counters a lunge. But if you're out in the open, the best Dead Hard will do is buy you 2 more seconds before you're downed. Because Dead Hard slows you down at the end. It's curve goes from 250% MS, to 200% MS, and at the end drops to 80% MS(walk speed) for a few frames. Meaning survivors need to start running again, and running itself is a speedcurve. This is why you cannot Dead Hard and speed vault a window if you dead hard too late. You need some distance to go back to 100%.
"by pressing a SINGLE BUTTON, nothing else. How fun is it to make 5 perfect blight rushes, go for a swing, just for them to press a button and completely undo your outplay. Crazy.)"
Ah, yes, as if Blight didnt close distance regardless of Dead Hard, as if Blight doesnt regain tokens back quick enough to close that distance and still get a hit. All Dead Hard does against most killers, is extend the chase with a few seconds. In the case that Dead Hard would extend the chase massively, it might not be worth to keep on chasing. Decisions are a big part of being a killer. Exhaustion remains for 40 seconds if they stop running(again, if you run Mindbreaker, they literally cannot work on a gen for 40 seconds if they want Dead Hard back), you could return within 30 seconds and catch them off-guard, in an area they didnt want to be, not having access to their perk. Just by 1 single decision you make. Imagine that, you get downed very quickly because the killer made 1 SINGLE DECISION, nothing else. How fun is it to loop a killer well into a good bait and keeping looping momentum, only for them to deny your momentum by leaving you alone for 30 seconds, making it feel safe enough to work on a gen, only for them to down you quickly while they have the upperhand.
Again, Dead Hard is fine.
"You do not design a game around players not having a dodge ability, then add a dodge ability and create nothing that actually counters it."
You do realize pallet vacuums were essentially what Dead Hard is? The game was balanced with pallet vacuums in mind. Later they removed it, because having both dead hard AND pallet vacuums was a bit too much. Dead Hard has plenty of counters. Again, Mindbreaker is your best friend.
"rewards survivors for getting INJURED (you compare this condition to getting hooks? really?)"
ahem Rewards survivors for DISTRACTING THE KILLER. Which, yes, is compared to hooks. It's part of the survivor's job to distract the killer and be chased. If being chased wasnt part of the survivors' job, there would be no looping mechanics at all.
"It destroys killer abilities"
Inconveniences killer abilities, but yes, just like all other exhaustion perks. Let alone that killer abilities tend to inconvenience survivors too. I mean, literally, try avoid getting hit during an entire chase. Seriously, try it. I doubt you'll be able to avoid getting hit at all, meaning all you can do as a survivor is lose a chase. There is no "winning" a chase if the killer keeps chasing. All there is, is distracting the killer away from your teammates.
"and completely breaks chases when used properly. It doesn't belong in DBD, sorry man."
I mean, killer abilities being used properly can completely prevent chases. Wraith can literally down you before you can loop him. Does that mean Wraith doesnt belong in DBD? Billy can bodyblock you in a corner and down you without chasing you, does that mean Billy doesnt belong in DBD either? Huntress can do damage to you across the map without ever chasing you, does that mean Huntress doesnt belong there either? Doc can prevent you from dropping pallets and vaulting windows, Trickster can use his knives to down you quickly after already hitting you, Trapper can literally down you by placing down a trap and ignoring it all game, Hag can prevent people from unhooking without mass slugging. I can go on. There are many, MANY killer mechanics in the game that are much more powerful than Dead Hard is, and much more uncounterable than Dead Hard. Yes, Dead Hard can be really annoying to deal with, but it does belong in DBD. It's been in the game for over 4 years. It has been a meta perk for 4 years. The devs definitely have balanced killers with Dead Hard in mind. They have balanced perks with dead hard in mind. They cannot balance YOUR decision to keep chasing a survivor that used Dead Hard to reach an unused area of the map. That mistake is on you. Sometimes it's best to quit a chase and interrupt other survivors and push them into area's the previous survivor has used for easy downs, rather than chasing the same survivor for another 30 seconds. If Dead Hard is one of your most hated perks, start running Mindbreaker. If you think it's so broken and needs a counter, use a perk that actively counters it. If you dont think Mindbreaker is worth a slot, you're simply agreeing that Dead Hard isnt as much as an issue as you claim it to be.
See the previous statement, where Dead Hard has been adjusted in the following ways: The speed curve has been altered to match the animation(the animation used to finish before Dead Hard was finished, meaning Dead Hard was nerfed mechanically). Removed the distance made mid-air, also nerfing Dead Hard as Dead Harders used to be able to Dead Hard through certain windows mid-air. Windows that a lot of killers are still able to go through mid-air.
And it's still problematic, so that didn't fix the perk at all.
Dead Hard isnt free either, it requires you to be injured. You cannot get injured for free.
Yes you can. You can literally just run up to the killer and get hit for free. Being injured is NOT something you work for, unlike a hook. A hook requires you to chase a survivor, successfully down them, and place them on a hook. You cannot just get a free hook. Being injured is something the KILLER works for, not you. This makes LITERALLY no sense.
Dead Hard HAS a cost of being injured.
No, no it doesn't. There is no cost at all. You just have it. NO MITHER has the cost of being injured because it literally forces you to be injured, but Dead Hard has 0 cost. It is a straight benefit from basekit survivor. I don't know why you're trying to spin being injured as something that you have to work for. Do you even believe in your argument?
Just like you need to get injured as a surv to use dead hard.
...something the killer has to do. You do NOTHING to get injured. I think you need to give up on this one.
Dead Hard doesnt work if you're instadowned, Dead Hard doesnt work against a Bubba, Dead Hard doesnt work against a Plague with Red Vom, Dead Hard doesnt work against a killer that baits it. Dead Hard doesnt work against a Nurse. Dead Hard doesnt work against a Pig, Dead Hard doesn't work against a Wraith, Dead Hard doesnt really work against Demo unless used for side stepping quickly, Dead Hard doesn't work against Trickster, Dead Hard doesnt really work against Blight, Dead Hard doesnt really work against Doctor(you cant do anything for 2.5 seconds after each shock).
Dead Hard is an extremely effective perk against literally every killer you've listed. Dead Hard is Nurse's most hated perk. Pig has ZERO counter to dead hard - she's an M1 killer. Dead Hard's I-frames literally prevent you from getting hit by 3-4 of the trickster's knives. You dead hard along a wall, turn the corner, all his knives miss and he's slowed down because you pressed a button. Doctor HATES dead hard. Imagine looping a pallet, and Doctor shocks, shocks, shocks, times it perfectly every time, you continue looping and are about to go down after his next shock, as he's close enough to shock and hit you. He shocks, you press a button on your keyboard to dead hard the shock, drop the pallet, and ALL of the work that he just did to down you was undone because you pressed a button and did NOTHING to earn it. Great game design. The game is definitely designed around that.
Being injured is sacrificing a health state for a dash that can be baited
You cannot bait dead hard for distance to a pallet or window. It is completely uncounterable unless you have range and they bottleneck themselves/lock themselves in animation. This is why against killers like Huntress, Trickster, or Slinger, instead of dead harding one of their hits, which you can still very well do, you can also just dead hard into a structure, break LOS, and extend the chase, denying them of a potential down 30 seconds earlier because you pressed a button.
Nope, plenty of examples where mass-slugging just happens out of killer momentum being able to chain together. Nurse Infectious Fright slugfests are pretty much the most common Nurse encounter. Nothing you can do about that as a survivor. You NEED anti-slug perks to counter that, no vanilla mechanics to do so.
Of course, that's probably the strongest pub build you can run. I cannot deny that 99% of teams will go down to this because this is the most extreme form of slugging that you could present to me. That's a nurse argument, not a slug argument.
Except that like Dead Hard, sometimes you need to camp, sometimes you need to tunnel. You cannot nerf these 3 things in the game, unless you want to nerf lunges, nerf gens to death and give all killers access to instadowns in a vanilla way. Which gives more reason to keep dead hard in the game, which gives more reason for people to find ways to rush gens, which gives more reason to camp and tunnel. You can dislike these things, that doesnt mean they're broken. Worst case scenario, you could add a punishment to them, but that doesnt really solve the issue you personally are having.
Ah yes, this game's playerbase sure does love being camped and tunneled. Great game design. Totally just my own personal issue.
Didn't mention nerfing. I wouldn't remove camping or tunneling without incentivizing killers to do the opposite of that through a new mechanic. I would much rather play survivor games against killers that aren't camping or tunneling me at the cost of some new strength for killer. Pretty tired of that #########.
let me remind you that you're not really losing a chase as a survivor for getting injured. The game is literally designed to guarantuee hits for killers. Survivors cannot remain uninjured all game as a whole. So getting hit is not "losing the chase". You "lose" a chase based on the time it takes to get a hit.
Yes, this is all true, and I apologize if my wording suggested otherwise. However..
Dead Hard rewards survivors for distracting the killer succesfully, not for losing a chase.
Distracting the killer successfully would be a condition like "Chasing with the killer for x amount of seconds while injured activates Dead Hard." THAT would be a proper condition that REWARDS you for performing well in your chases and *succesfully distracting the killer.* Being injured does not fit that at all. Again, you have to drop this part of your argument. This makes literally no sense.
. Otherwise I could say that any instadown in the game rewards the killer for not being able to keep long chases.
Depends on which it is and what the conditions are + how strong it is.
Dead Hard punishes a killer for not succesfully ending a chase/unsuccesfully baiting Dead Hard.
You're punished for injuring survivors. You admit this by arguing that DH does not work if you're one-shot. You're not punished for "unsuccessfully baiting Dead Hard." You cannot bait a DH for distance. They will always get value out of it.
I have sometimes left gens on 50% on purpose, knowing that the killer would waste his Pop on that, while I finished a gen that was at 70% 16 meters further. Sure, 20 seconds of my time were "wasted" on that 50% gen, but in exchange, another, more crucial generator was finished.
Smart strategy as long as that time spent on the other generator doesn't cost you. I applaud you for your strategic thinking.
Same logic can be applied to dead hard. I've forced survivors to dead hard, then leave the chase, only to come back 30 seconds later while they were distracted and working on a generator in a dead zone, without dead hard in their arsenal, they were just easy pickings.
Mmm, so a perk that you have to do nothing to obtain and press a button to get value out of can delay your death by 30+ seconds OR cost the killer that entire chase that they HAVE to give up because...you pressed a button, even though they were in distance to finish the chase.
You're also describing best case scenario here, which is strange. If someone DH's, I leave them (again, wasting a TON of my time because they outskilled me with an E press), I come back...they could've very well left, healed up by now, found a teammate, start working on a gen with a pallet/window loop nearby, and if none of these things apply, at the very least, they're gonna be reacting to my terror radius. You don't just leave a survivor for 30 seconds, come back, and they just continue working on the gen in a deadzone, allowing you to down them. If they simply just hold W to the corner, they can waste 15 more seconds. By the time you down them, pick up, drag to hook, and hook them, that survivor has effectively wasted a minute of your time because they pressed a button. Not sure if you know this or not, but 60 seconds is an insane amount of time.
So, let's entertain the scenario that, after leaving that survivor, you DON"T return to them, and go to pressure other survivors. First of all, as the survivor, you win that entire chase because of Dead Hard. The killer now has zero map pressure, and they got absolutely nothing out of that chase with you. Not only did the killer just waste their time chasing you for it to not lead to a down because of Dead Hard, but they also have to waste time going back int the map, finding more survivors, THEN chasing them.
In either scenario, the killer has negative map pressure because...you pressed a button.
If you're touching a survivor, you can start a lunge, and still hit a dead harding survivor. So yes, I'd argue they DO counter dead hard.
Please, go ask to 1v1 with one of the comp players as Pig. Tell them to play it as if it's a normal, solo queue match where you have to conserve resources. Throw some Bills and Clauds in there to work on gens, if you'd like. Let them run DH, and show me that big Dead Hard counter that Pig apparently has with her amazing M1 lunge. I would love to see it.
Ah, yes, as if Blight didnt close distance regardless of Dead Hard, as if Blight doesnt regain tokens back quick enough to close that distance and still get a hit. All Dead Hard does against most killers, is extend the chase with a few seconds.
It extends the chase by a few seconds, but your counterplay to it is wasting 30+ seconds to trick the survivor into working on a gen in a deadzone, downing them, then dragging them to a hook a minute after you would've done it if it had not been for them pressing E on their keyboard. Right.
Imagine that, you get downed very quickly because the killer made 1 SINGLE DECISION, nothing else. How fun is it to loop a killer well into a good bait and keeping looping momentum, only for them to deny your momentum by leaving you alone for 30 seconds, making it feel safe enough to work on a gen, only for them to down you quickly while they have the upperhand.
Huh? The killer having to leave you for 30+ seconds, coming back, downing and hooking you a minute later than you would've been if you hadn't been running Dead Hard somehow denies your momentum? Uhhh...in a 1v1 scenario...sure? DBD is a 1v4 game though mang. The killer taking 30+ seconds to down you because you pressed E is extremely good momentum. There is net time loss for the killer in this situation. This forced comparison of the killer making the decision to abandon you and then reengage does not equate at all to dead hard, lol. I don't really think this argument is working very well. I'm not convinced at all.
You do realize pallet vacuums were essentially what Dead Hard is?
......yeah, and everybody loved those. just like everybody loves dead hard. lol.
I'd think if you'd wanna prove something is healthy for the game, you wouldn't say it's basically the same thing as another extremely awful mechanic that was removed for being busted.
Again, Mindbreaker is your best friend.
just like spirit is fine because iron will, and NOED is fine because of small game. /s
as much as I actually really like mindbreaker because it's a simple, mid-strength passive perk, and do run it, no. I don't agree.
It's part of the survivor's job to distract the killer and be chased.
again, this would make sense if dead hard activated after X amount of time in chase. currently, it just activates even for shitter blendettes that get hit for hiding in a tiny bush. that blendette isn't being rewarded for anything lol.
Does that mean Wraith doesnt belong in DBD? Billy can bodyblock you in a corner and down you without chasing you, does that mean Billy doesnt belong in DBD either? Huntress can do damage to you across the map without ever chasing you, does that mean Huntress doesnt belong there either? Doc can prevent you from dropping pallets and vaulting windows, Trickster can use his knives to down you quickly after already hitting you, Trapper can literally down you by placing down a trap and ignoring it all game,
all of these things that you've listed are either missplays on the survivor part or outplays on the killer part. it's also a little interesting that we're comparing a little survivor perk to entire killer power capabilities.
They cannot balance YOUR decision to keep chasing a survivor that used Dead Hard to reach an unused area of the map. That mistake is on you.
it's not my mistake for injuring a survivor. this makes no sense. i injure someone as pig, recover fast with stbfl (a perk that I have to actively work for in order to be effective), am back on them again, about to lunge at them at a pallet, and they dead hard and stun me. woops, outplayed. guess that was my bad that they have a dash for free. should've known that! don't worry, I can bait it later for the exact same result, I just won't get stunned that time because I know that they're literally invincible for no reason.
If you think it's so broken and needs a counter, use a perk that actively counters it.
when i think things are broken and uncounterable, the last thing I think is acceptable is being forced to run perks just to make up for bad game design. running old enduring for old DS didn't suddenly make DS ok.
It has been a meta perk for 4 years.
decisive strike was meta for 4 years too.
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@Predated said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2232487#Comment_2232487
Except that lunges used to be smaller and were movementspeed dependend. It's actually Dead Hard that made Lunges a set mechanic. So they are linked. Besides, Dead Hard is part of the game, everyone has access to it. End of discussions.
"Almost all of the killers on the roster are countered by dead hard for distance - a PERK that you're given for free WHILE being injured, which means you're given the perk for losing in your chase."
Mechanics that killers have access to through perks: 25% regression for free that you get for hooking(which you're supposed to do anyway). Aura readings that you get for free while hooking. Aura readings that you get for free when survivors do gens. Instadowns that you get for free by letting survivors unhook teammates.
Then lets add on the VANILLA mechanics that killers have access to that cannot be countered by VANILLA survivor mechanics: Slugging multiple survivors, camping, tunneling, their abilities(which, unlike survivor items, they dont need to refresh).
"It is literally impossible for Dead Hard to NOT be unbalanced."
Well, with your logic: Ruin is not balanced, Pop is not balanced, Make Your Choice is not balanced, killer addons are not balanced. BBQ is not balanced.
The game has been balanced with Dead Hard in mind. Again, Lunges were BALANCED around Dead Hard when Dead Hard was released. Do you want old lunges back? Because old lunges were not able to reach through windows or across fences.
Essentially, all killers were given a basekit Dead Hard to deal with Dead Hard.
"Besides, Dead Hard is part of the game, everyone has access to it. End of discussions."
Yeah, just like how Prayer Beads was part of the game. Just like how old Omegablink was part of the game. Just like how old Tinkerer instasaw was part of the game. Just like how old Iri head was part of the game. Just like how old BNPs were part of the game. Just like how instaheals were part of the game. Just like how infinites were part of the game. Just like how old DS was part of the game. Just like how old Tinkerer instahatchet was part of the game.
All of the things above were created in a time where the developers lacked an understanding of their game's balance. NONE of these things would've been created today, with the closest thing to this stuff added in modern-day DBD being old Undying which was ######### atrocious. Dead Hard was created during this time (2016-2018) and applies to this. As it literally gives survivors an entirely new mechanic in chase that the game was not designed around (lunges are not a counter to dead hard, dead hard is a free counter to a lunge, which is complete bullshit), it would not have been added today. No risk or condition, extremely high reward.
"Mechanics that killers have access to through perks: 25% regression for free that you get for hooking(which you're supposed to do anyway)"
So...it's free, but then it's not free? Pop rewards you for a hook. I don't see the connection to Dead Hard's condition of being hit by a killer, which is the killer doing their job properly.
"Aura readings that you get for free while hooking"
No, once again, you get rewarded for a hook by BBQ. "For free for hooking" makes no sense at all. You're contradicting yourself.
"cannot be countered by VANILLA survivor mechanics: Slugging multiple survivors,"
Uh, if you don't think you can counter slugging without an anti-slug/healing perk, I'm not sure what to tell you mang. Getting mass slugged is on your team.
"camping, tunneling,"
yep, which is why I also hate camping and tunneling. should not be in the game. both things are, as I said with dead hard, available to do because they weren't prevented by the devs during a time where they lacked an understanding of their game's balance. both of these things are extremely unhealthy and require 0 skill and do not belong in an online pvp game.
"Well, with your logic: Ruin is not balanced, Pop is not balanced, Make Your Choice is not balanced, killer addons are not balanced. BBQ is not balanced."
Incorrect. Ruin rewards gen pressure and can be completely destroyed at any moment in the match. Pop rewards hooks. Make Your Choice is not a perk design I'm a fan of at all, but its effect is not as strong as Dead Hard, thus I just think it's terribly designed rather than unbalanced. However, Make Your Choice still requires you to hook, so it still has a condition that you must fulfill, and actually encourages you to target multiple survivors rather than tunnel, so I'll give it that much credit. Killer basekits are balanced around their addons, as confirmed by the developers, so that's not correct either. BBQ rewards you for getting a hook, once again, and encourages killers to not camp, which promotes very healthy gameplay.
"Lunges were BALANCED around Dead Hard when Dead Hard was released."
And that failed. Lunges do not counter Dead Hard unless it is used improperly.
"Essentially, all killers were given a basekit Dead Hard to deal with Dead Hard."
No, survivors were given a direct counter to lunges AND killer abilities through Dead Hard (by pressing a SINGLE BUTTON, nothing else. How fun is it to make 5 perfect blight rushes, go for a swing, just for them to press a button and completely undo your outplay. Crazy.), which has a massive impact on chase gameplay. You do not design a game around players not having a dodge ability, then add a dodge ability and create nothing that actually counters it. It destroys killer abilities, rewards survivors for getting INJURED (you compare this condition to getting hooks? really?), and completely breaks chases when used properly. It doesn't belong in DBD, sorry man.
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holy #########, if you didn't slow down when pulling out knives, moved at 115, AND only had to hit 6 knives, trickster would EASILY be worse than old legion. that is an AWFUL suggestion. and that's not even mentioning all of the other changes.
what could you possibly do against that in chase beside just accept fate and eventually die? lmfaoo what the hell.
unless you're suggesting doing only one of these, then I misunderstood. but all of those changes combined would make for easily the most unfun killer to play against in dbd history.
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@CLB198 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2241356#Comment_2241356
Unable to see survivors but can still attack.
Vast limit to information for a drastic increase in speed.
125% is clown antidote speed though (actually a little less). that's really damn slow.
but if it was really fast, then she'd still be problematic because she'd be a killer that constantly moves very fast and can see your location at any time by briefly slowing down.
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Eruption only triggers on basic attacks as well.
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@Almo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2238666#Comment_2238666
Pig isn't weak; that's a misconception among a lot of the players. She's not the strongest, that's certain. But she shouldn't be described as "weak", either.
I recommend playing a Killer you have fun with, and don't worry about whether they're "top tier" or not. Previous recommendations of Wraith, Ghostface and Pig all make sense given what you've told us. :)
I think when the community calls Pig weak, it's more so because modern killer power design has strayed away from the design of killer powers made in her era, where you guys didn't focus on giving every killer some form of a reliable chasing tool/efficient stealth. Look to original Doctor when he had no stun AND before his rework, original Hag, original Bubba, original Freddy, etc. The fact that her ambush doesn't begin to compare to the majority of the cast's chasing abilities, and that her stealth significantly slows her movement speed, is why she's viewed as a lower-tier killer. Pig has one of the least intimidating 1v1s in the game, if not the least, but she does have quite the 4v1 if you have a weak link or two in a game.
We all know her traps are effective, and that's why she's up there in your kill rate statistics. Solo queue teams are already very disorganized and not very challenging to beat, and her traps basically double that discoordination. Even if you've got 2 extremely good survivors in a game, Pig targeting the other 2 weaker links and ignoring those better survivors allows her to massively slow down the game for the whole team, which can snowball into a win because you simply can't handle losing 2 teammates for a good amount of the match no matter how good you are. I suspect this is the reason why she's, according to you, effective against low and higher-skilled survivors compared to other killers.
With MMR being introduced, and it being more likely that you're going to have 4 solid survivors in one game, I do wonder if this will change.
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what? why would you ever want to not down someone with your chainsaw? this doesn't make any sense to me. it's just objectively a flat downgrade to your power.
this is like giving oni the option to only single hit someone in his blood fury. there's no situation where you'd rather give someone broken and deep wounds instead of just instantly downing them and getting slug or hook pressure.
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@Saltjar34 said:
First of all, how did you make the text look like that
Second, I agree. Clown's yellow bottle should at least last long enough to have map-traversing abilities as they were intended. Not just another chase tool
I don't think they were ever intended to provide map mobility. I'm pretty sure they were just created to compliment the Tonic's effect in a chase.
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@Warcrafter4 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2234534#Comment_2234534
Wraith's power is unchanged and in fact with his best add-ons he was EVEN BETTER BEFORE THE CHANGE!
He had the same speed with add-ons but the add-ons never actually had a downside(The Value at all tiers was set to zero).
So not only was he as fast with as many strong add-ons he was even faster uncloaking then he is now.
Ps. Before you talk about the post stealth lunge: Its completely unchanged from the previous wraith to the current one.
the post stealth lunge is 100% changed. having played wraith frequently before and after the buff, there is a very significant difference in what you can do with the lunge.
being invisible from range is a huge benefit
and having windstorm basekit is huge for running other addons.
you are correct, the old windstorm addons actually had no downside despite one being listed, but old wraith, with addons, was NOT better than current wraith. current wraith's lunge and ranged invisibility was massive for him, and the fact that he can run other strong addon combos without windstorm makes him even better. that slight uncloak speed nerf that they gave him literally means nothing dude.
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@Predated said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2232042#Comment_2232042
You cannot bait out a dead hard if they are smarter than you*.
And yes, if its used at a loop, they will need to drop a pallet for their dead hard to have any real value. If they can use dead hard to keep a pallets standing, you're the one doing somethign wrong.
And so what if they can do it as a hail mary? You know what else is done as a hail mary? Lunging when a pallet is being dropped. Sometimes it hits, sometimes it doesnt. Just like Dead Hard.
"Good survivors will use it to make distance and get to a pallet and drop it to extend the chase"
Just like good killers will use a lunge to close distance if they are dropping one way to shorten the chase. Just like good killers will use a lunge to bait a pallet being dropped that they want gone ASAP.
Works both ways. Want to get rid of dead hard? Get rid of lunges too.
A lunge is part of the base mechanics of the game. Dead hard is not. End of discussion.
Almost all of the killers on the roster are countered by dead hard for distance - a PERK that you're given for free WHILE being injured, which means you're given the perk for losing in your chase.
A dash is something that you design the base mechanics of the game around. Dead Hard is not a base mechanic, thus, the game is not balanced around survivors having a powerful dash completely for free. It is literally impossible for Dead Hard to NOT be unbalanced.
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Here come the "It only works half the time! I don't get it!" comments.
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@TheClownIsKing said:
Because the increased FoV also gives more information, and more information is an advantage. An advantage should take up a perk slot.
Shadowborn literally reduces the effectiveness of many survivor hiding spots.
then why do I never see this perk run?
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@[Deleted User] said:
delete overheat return old engravings return spark plug ez fix.
i believe engravings are the same, but I do think there could easily be 1 charge time addon and it would be fine.
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I think they just need to adjust some of the crazy windows/pallets, make a few of the useless pallets a little more useful, and MOST importantly, tighten the gen spread.
I love this map visually, and I think it'd be really lame if parts of it were cut off because it IS really ######### cool to traverse a map of this size in DBD (and it being the RPD makes it even better), but the gen spread can be crazy considering how big it is and how many floors there are with a limited way to travel to them.
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@Chocolate_Cosmos said:
Sad fact: Even without cooldown / hex, it would still be bad perk. It needs range increase as well.
should just have no cooldown, little more range, and pallets should be blocked until the hex is destroyed.
on top of that, would be nice if it destroyed all dropped pallets within a larger radius, like 32m. so it blocks uprights within 24, destroys dropped in 32.
it needs to be really strong to warrant being a hex, so I think this would work.
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@[Deleted User] said:
Was Autohaven Wreckers reworked?Because it doesn't seem like.
how was it not? it's insanely different looking compared to before lol
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I would prefer it to just straight up keep those pallets blocked until the totem is cleased.
On top of this, any dropped pallets within 24m of the attack are immediately broken.
No cooldown.
I'd like the basic attack condition removed, but it's BHVR.
There you go. Hexes should be OP.
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@vladspellbinder said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2218798#Comment_2218798
Which wiki? Because the wiki I use (https://deadbydaylight.fandom.com/wiki/) only tells you the in-game text of the add-ons and not what "slightly": et-all actually means. Like, how much movement speed do I get from using Tacky Earrings? What do I move at while stalking with them on? Without them? The wiki doesn't tell me the numbers, just what I've already been told in game. And what I've been told in game isn't as helpful as it should be.
uh no, the wiki tells you numbers. hover over the "slightly increases" part. it tells you 10%.
the wiki has literally every number in the game for everything. it even has an entire movement speeds page where you're given every possible movement speed in the game, like when x killer is charging x power, canceling it, survivors under x effect while walking/running/crouching, Michael while stalking and passively stalking, etc.
don't be so confident with your answers at first. start asking questions before that.
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yep, pretty much. the vast majority of this community is one big echo chamber of parrots.
this all started once blight's POV fix suddenly "made him playable." lmfao
POV fix was nice, but man, people overexaggerate how much it did for him. got content creators to finally call him a top tier killer though, so that's nice.
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@BrokenSouI said:
Survivors are rarely in position to actually get use out of dead harding for distance. Non issue. Moving along
i have no problem with that. i think that's just on you...
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@Pulsar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2208411#Comment_2208411
The example OP gave is someone using a stretched resolution and graphical filters in order to gain an advantage where there should not be one.
How is this fair to vanilla players or to people who play on Console?
Nobody said that if you use them, you are automatically a cheater. What we have said is that, in this case (and most cases) they are being used to gain an advantage.
just sharing my personal opinion, which is unpopular.
when playing against them, I wouldn't be able to tell. I lose the game, oh well, I didn't suspect a thing and don't care. I move on to the next match. A blatant cheater that's increasing their speed/repair times or something? Yeah, that's literally hacking. but this, I don't care. especially not the filters part. they barely give an advantage, it's mostly just stretched that will.
even then, if filters were bannable, that would be unfair to anybody that has a visual impairment or issues with headaches. I really don't care that timmythegamer in 1/100000 games that I'll play will have a slight visual advantage over me because he's got a filter if that means that people who literally wouldn't be able to play the game without filters can freely use them.
if stretched was bannable, cool. if it's not, cool. i don't really think it matters that much. i'd wager that an insanely small amount of people that play this game actually use it.
"What we have said is that, in this case (and most cases) they are being used to gain an advantage."
what would you like done about it?
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i honestly could not care any less about stretched. if someone wins a chase against me because they can see me a little more around the corner, oh well. i wouldn't know. it visually looks awful and so i choose not to use it because i don't care enough, but i really don't mind if someone else is using it.
I use filters because my eyes are strained without them and i get headaches. am i a cheater now?
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@MadLordJack said:
If they're looping around a rock you play it like Huntress would: hold W after them and m1.
Or you could learn to time your knives and pelt them.
Whaaat? You can't just play a couple games of a new killer, do awfully as him, refuse to change up your strategy and improve from game to game, and use your losses not as a way to learn, but as a lazy way to justify having a misguided opinion you've already decided that you're not gonna change? Hmmm...
We love the popular opinion. We love echo chambers.
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@Luciferr_2nd said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2204042#Comment_2204042
What about killers who dont have a power for chase? Legion, pig, wraith?
Without bloodlust the chase would never end against a good survivor, even tho a killer shouldnt over commit to a chase like this, bloodlust is fine i think.
stop chasing with wraith! wraith is a stealth killer.
even THEN, wraith's new speed boost with his uncloak DOES give him chase strength anyway.
either way, exclude wraith from the "m1 killer" example. he's not meant to be chasing.
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@TruffleTurtle said:
So before their nerf I would see them every now and then. Not particularly common but not extremely rare. Now I have yet to see one since the nerf. I wonder if they are one of the lowest picked killers. I'm still holding strong on them but I feel like the 5 second wait period has alot of people turned away from learning them
since the nerf, no. they feel very slow and clunky. used to love them, played them a ton for several months, got very good at them, and still do enjoy them, but having to feel so slow every time I get a down gets boring.
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This challenge is dumb, but it's dumb because you could literally rename it "Camp the hook with Corrupt Purge as The Plague" and it wouldn't make a difference. How this challenge wasn't thought out is baffling. There is literally no other way to reliably complete this challenge. Thanks, devs. Can't wait to be camped.
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@papichulo said:
Spirit's add-ons aren't really going to be nerfed. Number one: Both of her pink add-ons are at most mediocre. The first one: Mother Daughter Ring allows you to gain a extreme speed boost however with a deathly cost that if your not careful of could cost you the entire game: no scratch marks while phasing. With the fathers glasses it is sloppy basically. If you run perks that overrule bleeding then your fine. Number TWO: The add-ons dont need a nerf and if they do please explain. Number THREE: In order to counter her yanking you off the gen with that speed boost all you have to do is lift your hand off the button when you hear her iconic moaning/gasping noise. (It is not hard, I mean you can hear her noises) NUMBER FOURRR: Just be extra cautious with her. You load into a game and you see spirit you just have to cope with it. This IS coming from a spirit main that is experienced as well as a survivor main. Spirits Add-Ons dont really need a nerf. Theyre just fine.
there is nothing mediocre about MD Ring. you don't track survivors in phase with scratch marks. that addon is one of the most insane, impactful addons in the game. easily.
"if you run perks that overrule bleeding, you're fine"
like what? no mither? lucky break, for 45 seconds? right...
i think you've got a bit of a bias here my mang.
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@Jivetalkin13 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2200739#Comment_2200739
Basically, if the survivor is injured you can down them with Feral Frenzy. However, if they have the Deep Wound status effect, you can't down them with Feral Frenzy.
there is nothing skillful about this idea. literally would require no brainpower to down survivors in this case.
frenzy strike is not difficult to land at all, that's why OG legion was a problem.
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pyramid.
baiting my power, while it's the better play (which is what I dislike) is not fun at all. it's far more fun to go for shots, but going for shots is the bad play.
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@CoalTower said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2200659#Comment_2200659
So you can actually turn now??? Awesome:)
yes! console blight is much better right now
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Freddy Rework #2 that brings back his old kit :)
and a new gamemode. I have a feeling we're going to see that on this roadmap.
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@ill_Boston_lli said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2200483#Comment_2200483
Its odd for me on series X I feel like he has a lot more "slack" now.
his camera and lunge/rush control was adjusted to be much smoother and stronger for controller.
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Twins are up there. Terrible, oddball addons all throughout the set. Barely any stackable addons.
Toy Sword - Amazing addon. But it's....a brown? A 25% charge time addon is a brown? Nice.
Tiny Fingernail - Pretty useful. One of their better addons. Dropping Victor faster is neat.
Soured Milk - BARELY useful. You don't need Victor sitting around with a larger shriek radius.
Cat Figurine - Useless
Madeline's Glove - Like soured milk, BARELY useful. Simply just not worth using.
Ceremonial Candelabrum - 0.15 seconds onto the kick time. Are you kidding me?
Cat's Eye - Who the ######### thought of this addon? Worthless. You move at an extremely slow speed with your pounce charged.
Bloody Black Hood - Very meh (0.5 seconds), and the only addon that gives the effect of faster charlotte transition. Why?
Baby Teeth- Blindness for 15 seconds...after taking off Victor. Are you ######### kidding me?
Weighty Rattle - 20 seconds of broken. Meh. Just not worth using, but could've been decent with a longer timer. Pretty trash.
Stale Biscuit - Actually nice, takes off 0.5 seconds off of your cooldown. However, only one of these, once again.
Sewer Sludge - Worthless. You want people to take Victor off. This addon is terrible and has a negative effect.
Rusted Needle - Haemmorrhage. Nice for tracking, but overall, not worth an addon slot. If it added Mangled too, that would've been great.
Madeline's Scarf - More Victor speed, great addon.
Victor's Soldier - Aura reading after they kick a dormant Victor. #########? Worthless.
Spinning Top - Meh. If they have some items, sure. But overall, using an addon slot to counter their items isn't worth it. Trash.
Forest Stew - Amazing addon. More speed, always useful.
Drop of Perfume - Oblivious in Victor's shriek radius. Really? Pointless, and not worth the addon slot. You're far better off using the Ultra Rare.
Silencing Cloth - Actually good. 20 seconds of undetectable for free, always nice. Not their best, but decent.
Iridescent Pendant - Used to be 12 seconds of exposed after kicking victor, which was laughable. Now it's just slightly less trash. Could've had a far more imaginative UR addon. You don't want Victor being kicked, you want Victor around the map pressuring survivors.
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@Brokenbones said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2198309#Comment_2198309
It was probably a balance decision to compensate for the buff they gave it
Not gonna lie though, I would not want to face a Twins using Knock-Out if it worked on Victor
Which would be kinda ridiculous considering the buff was very insignificant and their intentions were to increase its pick-rate, so giving it a basic attack condition is completely counter-intuitive.
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@Brokenbones said:
Because if they worked for special attacks, they would become too strong on certain killers.
Exposed for example, imagine if Blight could insta-down people with Lethal Rush (without the ultra-rare) or if Oni could slug people using Knock-out. Pyramid head's POTD triggering various effects
The only exception seems to be Nurse and I'm not 100% sure why, maybe because her power is also how she moves/the only viable way to attack with her
I'm not talking about status effects like Exposed though, just perk activation conditions specifically.
Oni used to be able to slug people with Knock-Out before the perk was nerfed, and I don't think it was ever an issue.
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@Northener1907 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2196142#Comment_2196142
I do not know your teammates but when i face againts him, building and walls destroying him. Most of them i face trying m1. Imagine you have one of the fun powers but you have to use m1 because your power is not strong enough. My easiest games always against him, i think i died 2 3 times to him.
And i still have not Adept Trickster because when i touch him, game starting to be painful.
gotten merciless countless times with the trickster at this point.
just play him, dude. he's fine. still needs some buffs, but either way, you're gonna perform very well if you know how to play him, even in the big scary totally not overrated red ranks.
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glad to see The Game in A tier. it's actually a really fun blight map IMO.