gatsby
gatsby
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If you really want a Spine Chill counter, they do exist believe it or not.
Try using Spine Chill against a Nurse, Spirit or Freddy. They can all get across the map quicker than most Killers so the advance warning doesn't help so much. Nurse and Spirit don't even traditionally loop so the vault speed doesn't really matter. Freddy can flat out prevent fast vaults with snares.
Also, Freddy, Spirit and Nurse are all in the Top 5 best Killers in the game and a common sight at high ranks. Spine Chill OP. eyerolls
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@SirCracken said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1354602#Comment_1354602
There is not a single killer perk that is comparable to Spinechill in terms of power level. Name one, if you can.
Yes, it gives survivors a head start. Contrary to popular, (and objectively incorrect), belief, hiding is not a waste of time since every moment the killer is searching for someone is a moment that they aren't chasing them. Effectively giving your team more time to do gens. And guess what Spinechill helps with?
If you get a gen with progress and start searching for the survivors then Spinechill has already done it's job. Instead of starting a chase the moment you get to a gen you're wasting time searching for the survivors.
As for 36 meters not enough time to leave without scratch marks, I'll say it again, it's not about completely evading the killer. It's about making them waste time not chasing people and instead looking around. But even so, on certain maps the notification is often enough to get away scot free.
I'm a Rank 1 Killer. The only thing Spine Chill does is waste my time slightly and prevent gens grabs when I play Pig and Ghost Face.
If one of my perks tells me a Survivor is there, I'm going to find them. Like I know the maps and geometry too well to spend more than 10-15 seconds without finding them. (immersing doesn't even save them time either because when I find them I get a free hit)
It's a good perk for Survivors to have awareness to get to safe looping positions. And in the vault speed build with Resilience it can help in chase, but its not overpowered. At least not against halfway decent Killers that are sentient
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Surge and Blood Echo's cooldowns rarely come into play in a negative way.
Surge doesn't re-apply to gens already regressing, so the odds that you have a down, hook and then leave the area to go to new generators and win a second chase in 40 seconds are pretty low. Maybe Freddy could do it if he teleported to the other side of the map and his next victim was already injured but 90% of Killers wouldn't care.
Blood Echo makes people exhausted for 45 seconds, which Survivors will take much longer than that to recover unless they're sitting on gens or afk. It's already kind of annoying on Legion and Plague, but it'd be oppressive if it kept re-applying with zero chance to recover.
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Killers have tons of perks to track Survivors. Spine Chill just gives Survivors some advance notice to maybe get a head start or waste my time by hiding.
If I saw a generator light up with Discordance and no one's on it when I get there, I'm not going to leave. I'm going to check those bushes and rocks for the Claudette with Spine Chill and find her. 36m advance notice isn't enough to leave an area without scratch marks, the Killer should still be able to find you if they're somewhat sentient
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Meme Queen
- tap into your exhaustion bank to backflip and avoid damage. phasing through the killer stuns them for three seconds
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@Todgeweiht said:
but it does not work if you are the obsession.
It lowers your chance to be the Obsession like For the People. And I've never been the Obsession at the start of the match running For the People.
Just don't run Blood Pact with another Obsession Perk and you're good. Unless the Killer has Nemesis or Furtive, but even then the Obsession will be switching a lot so it wouldn't be de-activated long.
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@Mooks said:
I also thought about a vanilla killer but that is way too late in the game life time, it should have been there from the beginning, now they can’t really advertise it and not many would be interested
They could use the low effort Killer to have a Chapter where most of the Dev time went to maps, perks and reworks. It could be a major patch overall just with a vanilla Killer.
Imagine the hype for 3 new maps at once, a bunch of meme perks becoming meta and Killers like Bubba and Clown getting well done reworks that meaningfully changed their gameplay. It could be really good.
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The power isn't movement speed. It's a stackable slowdown per hit.
They just have 120% and 24m default stats.
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It makes the perk need to be combo'd with something like Bond, Blood Pact, Empathy or We'll Make It. If you're cool with that, Second Wind is alright. The requirement just makes it useless stand alone
If the Devs wanted to make the Perk meta, the requirement would be "finish a heal on yourself or another"
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/FK0XXJIQH0QS/image.png
I don't see it often enough to care about, or at all...
Imagine you are healing a survivor 99%, suddenly another one appears and taps the guy, now Second Wind did not activate because you needed the other 1% for yourself
The easiest way to use Second Wind is paired with We'll Make It. Just play it like Deliverance and don't be the first one downed.
Helps your teammates and helps you. I'm also planning on running Second Wind with Blood Pact since that Perk makes you the designated heal simp for the Obsession.
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@Demogordon_Ramsay said:
Don't compare Spirit to Legion. That implies Spirit is bad. Or that Legion is good.
Both statements are blatantly untrue.
It implies they have similar designs and one is executed better.
Try avoiding a hit from a Legion with Frenzy while healthy or a Spirit with Haunting while injured. Its probably not gonna happen
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@Shocktober said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1352410#Comment_1352410
I would never take legion into a game without chase perks. As an M1 killer, you can get run to the god windows and back with absolutely no answer. Against most pick up groups sure, that build is adequate. But against some of the best in the game? No chase perk M1 killer is not going to cut it. I don't consider rank 1 an indicator of skill.
The new ruin is a huge risk, huge reward. Any game going moderately well; it will seal the fate of the survivors, similar to devour hope (but it works instantly).
Blood echo is probably my favorite perk in the game since it negates dead hard, but only a few killers can really use it effectively. Legion is one of them.
I usually play for a three gen (or four if possible). Chase people in my territory to create dead zones and let the far away generators go early. The Survivors usually back themselves into a corner where everyone is injured, there's nothing to work with and every time someone goes down the generators lose 33%+ progress. Even SWF teams struggle against that. You win by getting them in a scenario where the simply can't finish their objective and they slowly lose the war of attrition.
Legion is only really good when you get a small map or use generators to gradually shrink the map. If you let teams spread out, you pretty much lose by default since you don't have the map pressure of other Killers.
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@Shocktober said:
It still boggles my mind to this day that people think legion is weak. The legion power is the most free hit in the game. All it takes is 1-2 chase perks on him/her and you are an M1 monster who instantly exposes anyone you see.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/XBALTRFTP39L/legion-png.png
i'd put this up there as one of the best builds you can run in the entire game. You could swap out BBQ with something else.
At Rank 1, I tend to run Pop/Surge/Corrupt/BBQ on Legion. It's one of the most consistent builds you can run. Corrupt gives you early game slowdown to start chaining Frenzy without getting gen rushed. Surge hits the nearby gens for regression and Pop is for the gen you see with BBQ.
I can see the value of Blood Echo and Ruin on Legion, but they're more Map/Survivor dependent. If you get a big map with easy totem spawns like an Autohaven, Ormond or MacMillian you'll lose Ruin in the first 30 seconds and won't be able to keep people injured because they're too spread out to chain Frenzy.
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Spirit has never been amazing at getting the first hit... she's only god-tier at downing injured people (with stridor)
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@BattleCast said:
I don't mean to brag, but I can play a pretty nasty Clown.
I can also play Legion, Pig, and Wraith decently well.
That's really impressive. I can barely get a 2k on clown when I have a daily with him and I have to bring No ED.
Timing those bottles right and knowing which loops you can get hits on and which you have to pallet break takes serious skill
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Unbreakable is a "meta perk" and almost one runs it because its too situational to get value every game.
Soul Guard will be similar. It can be extremely strong or it can get no use all match and waste a slot. Survivors generally value consistent value above all else when making their builds. There's a reason that the same list of 10 perks have always been the best in the game, the original sets of perks were designed to be simple and useful. The perks from the last 2 years have been designed to be complicated and risky.
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I suppose. DBD gives me something to take my mind off stuff and its a lot more casual and less toxic than most other online games I'e played. Glad I found it back in late December
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@LordGlint said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1343357#Comment_1343357
Of course you need to get downs, but spreading pressure and injuring ppl helps slow the game and keep ppl off gens. To use your example of Legion...it would be incredibly stupid to only use your power to injure 1 person and then swap it off to chase as an M1 killer rather than use your power to injure everyone you can before picking someone off. This is the most basic of things for newbie killers to learn is to avoid getting tunnel vision and losing sight of the rest of whats going on.
Sometimes that's the right call on Legion. My favorite build is Cold Dirt+Joeys Mixtape to reduce the Frenzy fatigue by 25% because it works on every map and against every playstyle. Getting a borderline free hit and following them to trap them at a loop and continue the chase good value.
Injure multiple people if they're grouped, but if its a big map or they're playing split its much better to commit than try to chase someone you see with Killer instinct at the edge of the range. That's a call you have to make. When you could chase other people, but you realize that committing to the down is more important then getting greedy and potentially losing all your pressure.
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@LordGlint said:
Feel like this is just troll advice. Telling people that skilled killers get tunnel vision on 1 survivor at a time is just untrue.
If it was troll advice, Legion would win the game using Frenzy only because they can pressure multiple Survivors even if they're not getting downs.
Its not. Committing to chases and focusing on downs wins games, not injuring everyone. You'll never get rolling with perks and momentum otherwise.
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I worship Inner Strength and its probably my most used perk. I've memorized most of the totem spawns at this point.
I also regularly use builds with For the People. It counters slugging pretty well and has good synergy with Dead Hard. The main draw is that it creates an Obsession since Rank 1 Killers respect Decisive whether or not you run it most of the time
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@Tunnel_Me_Please that's kind of the point. Killers like Freddy, Clown and Doctor will get natural value. And syngergies with perks like Deathbound and Infectious Fright could be interesting.
Not for every Killer or every build. But very strong when its in the right niche
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@TransverseCaster said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/159037/playing-a-well-liked-killer-lowers-toxicity
"I'm still winning games regularly at Rank 1"
I almost believed you until you said this. Nice try, survivor main.
Oh no I've been exposed as secret entitled Survivor main that's a Rank 20 Killer
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@Dead_by_Gadfly said:
I think it really depends on the situation largly. If i walk up on a gen that has 3 people on it everyone is catching hands.
If an injured survivor is managing to stay just oit of reach for a couple of tiles im breaking chase and going after someone else.
I think good killers do whatever is best for the scenario and are good because they can recognize the situation
That's true, different situations have different outcomes if they give you free hits take them. My point is that at some point you have to commit. Especially early game, you're gonna lose a lot of generator progress regardless of what you do so getting the first down to get your perks rolling is important. When I run Corrupt Intervention, my goal is always to have the first two downs before the perk runs out. It keeps me honest with my performance
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It's a way for players who refuse to buy Auric Cells to get the perks from licensed characters. It would take a lot of time, but it gives the cheap players the option and doesn't force them to spend more money
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The real question is why is a Legion using their power on an injured person in the first place?
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@SnakeSound222 said:
This lasts for the entire chase? I think that's too long and could be hell for newer players.
It works similarly to Play with Your Food from the Killer's perspective. They would want to start a chase and then break it quickly to counterplay
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@Madjura said:
That's like Sprint Burst, but worse. If you are using this against the Nurse you auto-lose.
The idea behind the perk is that you can infinite Killers with this exhaustion perk until they realize and purposely break chase (which makes them lose all progress towards bloodlust).
Even once the Killers know you have the perk. You get 3-5 seconds of 10-15% haste head start because they have to break chase, which takes a couple seconds. It'd be one of the most subtle and potentially devastating exhaustion perks
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@PrettyFaceKate said:
This kind of arguments can be concocted just about every decent perk in the game, regardless of side.
We get it, someone got you with DH. It's not the end of the world, you'll come back from it.
Actually, it's the opposite. Playing against good Survivors was a master-class in using Dead Hard. It totally helped me up my Survivor play
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I bet you're right. The Obsession switching around seems pretty normal to me, but before the Decisive rework it wasn't a thing.
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@shwag said:
The whole game is skill sided. The person with the most skill and the least amounts of skill win.
Seen rank ones owned by a rank 12 killer with no perks.
Escaped a bunch of ranked one killers in my time as well.
Perks and maps can help but at the end of the day it comes down to skill.
Not really. Maps matter a lot more than you give credit for. A Ghost Face that has everyone pre-drop pallets on The Game will lose at high ranks because the chases take 2 years and you lose 3-4 gens. A Doctor who can prevent pallet drops and Static Blast people on both floors will have an absolute field day and probably get his first down within the first minute of the game and continue to snowball.
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@Dolls said:
I want to do this "boop the snoot" I keep hearing so much about.
...but I'm afraid...
😨 how would I go about it ....safely.....😞
If you see her crouched in stealth and boop instead of running away most will accept it, you just have to do it the second you see her.
Most will let you boop and give you a head start. Or hit you let you boop and then let you run away for a few seconds
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I'm not saying I don't chase Survivors with traps if I run into them. But I don't like actively look for them or go out of my way to check puzzle boxes.
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@LordGlint said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1333806#Comment_1333806
While it's true that headtraps are slowdown... Pig's addons which give exhaustion effect and all that is there for a reason.
There are a couple add-ons that change her playstyle like the exhaustion, amanda's letter and amanda's secret. But those aren't the standard playstyle. Most Killers have add-ons like that.
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The proper way to play pig is to use the traps as game slowdown. I won't actively seek out trapped Survivors because they're not doing generators, healing or saves usually they're just running around to boxes wasting time.
That being said. If I randomly find someone trying to get a trap off, I will target them because they're usually pretty easy to get a free hit on (I want those STBFL stacks). The traps and boxes are noisy so its relatively easy to hear even if I'm in a chase with someone else or patrolling generators. It's nothing personal just business
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@Frankie said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1329089#Comment_1329089
If you've never heard of the grind being an issue, you obviously don't pay much attention. No offense intended; but it's talked about quite a bit how they go on and on about the "new player experience" yet, the grind exists.
The majority of players are Survivor and in general the Survivors have very good base perks. Hence why the Devs don't feel the need to change anything. The vast majority of the Survivor meta perks have existed since 2016.
Killers are a completely different story, but they're a minority and giving them bad non-DLC perks means new Survivor players have easier games.
There's a method to the madness.
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@Frankie said:
ANOTHER tier of perks? The grind is one of the biggest and most criticized issues in the game. We don't need a whole other tier of perks.
This is an awful idea. Tiered perks should be removed, not made into more. At the very least, once you hit prestige 3, only tier 3 perks should be on the bloodweb.
Prestige isn't part of the grind. It's an extra way to show off with your favorite characters. Tier 4 Perks would be part of that.
Is a 30 second exhaustion Sprint Burst worth prestiging Meg for if you're not a dedicated Meg main who will use it a lot? Not really.
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@Johnny_XMan said:
It's meta because it counters the two things that are possible in this game as any killer which require no perk/add ons: Camping and Tunneling.
As long as these are options for a killer without any other counter for them. People will still bring them.
Bad teammates just add to it, but I never bring DS because of bad teammates. I bring it because when I don't I get tunneled (for whatever reason) and I wish I had it. It's the price that non-tunneling killers have to pay because of these forums trying to sell DS strictly as a "Anti-Tunnel" perk.
There is no rule that says a teammate has to do x|y|z, if a killer really wants to take you out of a game, they will figure out a way. I've seen killers downing the person who took 2 hits and STILL go after the unhooked person. Again. Not trying to complain or say that is bad, but it is just the fact that it is always available and why not? They are there to kill. Still, doesn't take away from the fact that it only makes perks like DS more frequent.
Good Killers will not chase unhooks mainly because it isn't time efficient. Hitting the person who's going for the unhook and taking that chase is a lot more reliable than chasing someone who might have BT, Decisive and has a fully restored exhaustion perk.
If you can find another target other than the recently unhook, it's in your best interest the majority of the time. You can soft tunnel the recent unhook after your next down if you really want an early kill, but straight tunnels just don't pay off usually unless they're being farmed and an easy re-down because of bad teammates.
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@1nsignia said:
Nah that doesn't scare me. The only thing that scares me is when you patrolling and out of nowhere a survivor drops a pallet on me, then I jump. God I hate that.
being fed a free pallet? and having a survivor reveal their location?
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/158092/how-to-scare-every-killer-main
Add in streetwise for extra spice
Four Survivors load into a match with Commodious Toolboxes, Prove Thyself, Streetwise and a BNP.
The Killer might not even be able to look at the generator before it finishes
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@johnmwarner said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1322252#Comment_1322252
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1322263#Comment_1322263
Here’s the thing I agree with Gatsby. You don’t need to do these 10 lap loops around one pallet, faking pallets and finally burning Dead Hard to get 5 more laps... there are so many pallets on most maps!
If you drop pallets safely and force the killer to commit to kicking before you run off you can waste so much time. If all 4 survivors simply play safe while looping, and do gens while someone else is being chased the math is almost impossible for the killer. Luckily survivors love to stealth and otherwise waste time, they also camp pallets and end up eating hits as they drop tjem.
So true. If pallet camping didn't result in free hits through pallets sometimes, the game would be completely unplayable
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@Shocktober said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1322263#Comment_1322263
There is no skill to reach rank 1 as survivor. You make 1 save a game, do a single generator, and run the killer for 30 seconds and you reach rank 1. You have to get massacred as survivor to depip. But as a killer you have to 3-4k every single game to rank up.
Being awesome at looping involves way more map knowledge than most people I see at red ranks. I see tons of people who don't even try to loop jungle gyms or the shack at rank 1-2.
There isn't enough time to physically break every strong pallet on a map and stop the generators.
So you have to rely on winning mindgames or getting lucky with Survivors not knowing where dead zones are. The Survivors that drop everything on the first go and force me to break or bloodlust make me want to scream.
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@Shocktober said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1322248#Comment_1322248
I don't think the top ranks in the entire game, in theory, should be people who just throw the best pallets without even attempting to loop them. You can run a new killer for the length of the entire match off that one pallet alone, and you are telling me a rank 1-2 can just stand at it and toss it and that makes them one of the best players in the game?
If a Survivor knows how to chain loops and use every pallet, they can hit Rank 1 easily. Even if there's no real looping or much mindgaming. It's way more about having good pathing on a lot of maps to not get caught in a dead zone than actually being awesome at looping.
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@Shocktober said:
Corrupt is a band aid to the insane gen speeds. But a worse band aid than ruin. The overwhelming majority of survivors, even at high ranks, are super boosted due to the ease of the pipping system.
You can hit rank 1-2's who will camp the shack pallet, arguably one of the best in the entire game. Against a good team or SWF, corrupt is going to buy you around 30-40 seconds, assuming they do some worthless dull totems and don't just run at generators. There are still plenty of un-counterable safe loops and god windows depending on what killer you are playing.
That's just how the game is. Gen speeds go so fast that it's more punishing to the Killer to have a long first chase than it is for the Survivors to have a bunch of pallets wasted.
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@Dead_by_Gadfly said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1322199#Comment_1322199
I agree unbreakable is overrated, but so is For the people and for the exact same reason really. If I sluggdd someone its to slow the game down, using for the people doesnt help that much cause now youre broken and very likely going down too. Half the time I see it they do it when im very close and they both end up slugged.
I'm not suggesting For the People is a meta perk. It's not amazing in solo queue and only sightly better than Unbreakable in a SWF.
I think both of them are kind of mid/low tier perks and there are lots of games where they didn't even get used at all and just eat a hole in your Survivor build.
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@ShrimpTwiggs said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1322199#Comment_1322199
Unbreakable not only allows you to get up once from being slugged but it increases the rate at which you recover. Pair this with a coordinated team and you usually won't be on the ground long if the killer decides to slug. It's definitely a strong perk with DS.
I still think a SWF with For the People and Flashlights would do a better job picking up and saving teammates than all using Unbreakable.
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@Raven014 said:
I wouldn't call Unbreakable overpowered at all. I call it strong when paired with DS since they both cover each other’s weaknesses, but that is about it.
If anything, a killer that needs to slug is losing, since they need the extra pressure of a slug.
At red ranks, they're usually slugging with Infectious Fright at above 3 gens. A really good nurse, billy or oni will just eat the unbreakable and continue chaining downs.
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@ShrimpTwiggs said:
Unbreakable is extremely powerful when paired with DS because it weakens one of it's counters.
No Killer who's slugging for Decisive expects them to still be on the floor 60 seconds later. They're just doing it for slowdown.
And even in that scenario, For the People is faster and doesn't give the Killer as much time to come back so it gets more net value
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@Saucynuggets43 said:
When I’m a killer and the survivor throws downs god pallet for no reason when I’m 10 feet away. That really bothers me because their just giving their teammates a harder time and giving dead weight. Another thing is when I get hooked at the beginning of a match because the killer spawned like 20 ft away and that one useless teammate decides to crouch all the way to you although the killer is on the other side of the map chasing someone else. And when they finally get there the killer starts chasing them. I’m looking at you NEA.
I'm the opposite. When Survivors throw pallets early especially on maps that aren't mindgame-able it totally wrecks my early game because its so much harder to get a kill and it makes me lose 2-3 gens before they even start to be affected by the dead zones
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@Tricks said:
@gatsby Play a Killer your confident with and can easily 3-4k with (for me that's either Freddy or Legion)
Let the Survivors know you want to farm
Once they know its safe to be around a gen with you, grab them and let them go till you have the gen grabs done. It's how I did it on the last rift before this one. Worked pretty well.
Got it ;)
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@Raven014 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1316617#Comment_1316617
Most killers have counterplay built into them as their core concept. The main exceptions I can think of are: Nurse, Spirit, Legion, and now PH. Most of those got nerfed/are generally disliked by survivors. I wonder why?
Maybe it is because they like the ability to deny a killers power? Just a thought.
Legion IS counterplay. 4 second stun to leave power (double the length of a pallet stun). Hitting a Survivor normally halves the Power Gauge. Deep Wound is basically just slowdown and non-threatening.
Keeping everyone injured isn't just a Legion thing either. In high ranks, running sloppy butcher will make Survivors quit healing and just slam gens. Half my Ghost Face games are just everyone staying injured because they're paranoid about Nurse's Calling.