fluffybunny
fluffybunny
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@Mc_Harty said:
@fluffybunny said:
NOED carries weak killers the same way DS carries weak survivors. I personally don't hate it so much as getting annoyed by how it can encourage and pardon poor plays.Basically this. There's also no way to tell if the killer has NOED or if a non-obsessed survivor has D-Strike. They're both badly designed.
To be fair, you can usually assume NOED if the killer is weak (resorts to camping/tunneling, does poorly in chases) or if the character is weak (hi, Freddy). Non-obsession survivor D-Strike isn't as bad as it once was, but that perk still needs a rework imo.
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NOED carries weak killers the same way DS carries weak survivors. I personally don't hate it so much as getting annoyed by how it can encourage and pardon poor plays.
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It could also be possible to include short phrases like Identity V has where you can tell people to do stuff or even mention what you're doing. It could be in the icon feature you suggested. If solo play was buffed to be on the same level as swf and killer was given tools to address both (or just flat buffs), I think that would be ideal.
I think that the killer should be allowed to change a totem's position, would that be OP? For instance if you start off and see it's in a bad position, you can hit a button and change its position at random. If swf sees a totem, you can just move it to someplace else with a button press and so on. It would have a cooldown and can't be used if someone's on it as that'd be weird to be on the totem and it to randomly turn into a dull for instance. If you hit someone off, you can just press the button as you initiate the chase. What do you guys think about that idea?
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@Boss said:
So far it's all negative though.
Time for a change of heart and give up on this.
I know when i'm beat.
I still think Killers could do something with Chests though, but maybe have them have an effect without needing the Killer's attention, like hurting them once they're done searching.
I like the booby trapping chest idea, too.
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@PubStar87 said:
THE. PERK. IS. TOO. POWERFUL.And it doesn't prevent Killers from camping at all, all they do is Prox Camp, every single one of em.
Most they should get is a boom notification, not 4 seconds of aura
You can tell me about the counters to it for the rest of eternity, it's not gonna change my mind
K?
The perk really isn't all that powerful. Survivors are strong while in chase. Even if the killer is informed on where a survivor is, they still need to find and catch them. It's meant to encourage switching targets with a new person to find. If the killer doesn't see anyone with BBQ&C, they'll often think all of the survivors are nearby, just waiting to go in for the save (which sometimes they are). The perk has plenty of counters and is only really strong for survivors who decide not to react to it properly. You may be entitled to your opinion, but we're entitled to our reason.
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Sometimes I'll bring in something to help me live, but most of the time killers have franky's or you just don't live, so can't keep your item. I usually don't bring anything.
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@Tsulan said:
@fluffybunny said:
@Tsulan said:
@fluffybunny said:
@Tsulan said:
@fluffybunny said:
@Tsulan said:
@fluffybunny said:
@Tsulan said:
And who did i name&shame?
In your post, didn't you call out someone? The one you pointed to earlier as your reason for being banned.
Can you link please?
I'll quote you so that you can find it easier. One sec.
And that is name calling where?
I miss the name.Naming and shaming is also calling people out. You @ ed someone on a new thread post that you were in an argument with (or something like that?). I was surprised to see another person jailed, but that's something I see them getting after people for all the time (like when they post something about someone and you can see their stream or whatnot). I believe it's to make conversation more civil.
Again, i didn´t call anyone out.
The @ is not name shaming its linking someone and giving that person a notification. Just like answering to someone is.Also, if it would have been considered name shaming, the mod who closed the thread would have removed any names.
Wait, then why did you get in trouble? Are you allowed to mention? I'm curious.
I´m not allowed to discuss it. But the reason was that closed thread. Since it has only been closed but not deleted, i´m not sure on how to proceed.
Okay, I wouldn't want to get you in more trouble, then. The jail thing's a temp ban, right? I would say just be careful not to do what they got after you for and it should be fine. I'm surprised to see so many people getting jailed.
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@Tsulan said:
@fluffybunny said:
@Tsulan said:
@fluffybunny said:
@Tsulan said:
@fluffybunny said:
@Tsulan said:
And who did i name&shame?
In your post, didn't you call out someone? The one you pointed to earlier as your reason for being banned.
Can you link please?
I'll quote you so that you can find it easier. One sec.
And that is name calling where?
I miss the name.Naming and shaming is also calling people out. You @ ed someone on a new thread post that you were in an argument with (or something like that?). I was surprised to see another person jailed, but that's something I see them getting after people for all the time (like when they post something about someone and you can see their stream or whatnot). I believe it's to make conversation more civil.
Again, i didn´t call anyone out.
The @ is not name shaming its linking someone and giving that person a notification. Just like answering to someone is.Also, if it would have been considered name shaming, the mod who closed the thread would have removed any names.
Wait, then why did you get in trouble? Are you allowed to mention? I'm curious.
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@fluffybunny said:
@Tsulan said:
@fluffybunny said:
@Tsulan said:
@fluffybunny said:
@Tsulan said:
And who did i name&shame?
In your post, didn't you call out someone? The one you pointed to earlier as your reason for being banned.
Can you link please?
I'll quote you so that you can find it easier. One sec.
And that is name calling where?
I miss the name.Naming and shaming is also calling people out. You @ ed someone on a new thread post that you were in an argument with (or something like that?). I was surprised to see another person jailed, but that's something I see them getting after people for all the time (like when they post something about someone and you can see their stream or whatnot). I believe it's to make conversation more civil. EDIT: I didn't realize there was an ed lmao
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@Tsulan said:
@fluffybunny said:
@Tsulan said:
@fluffybunny said:
@Tsulan said:
And who did i name&shame?
In your post, didn't you call out someone? The one you pointed to earlier as your reason for being banned.
Can you link please?
I'll quote you so that you can find it easier. One sec.
And that is name calling where?
I miss the name.Naming and shaming is also calling people out. You @ ed someone on a new thread post that you were in an argument with (or something like that?). I was surprised to see another person jailed, but that's something I see them getting after people for all the time (like when they post something about someone and you can see their stream or whatnot). I believe it's to make conversation more civil.
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You can still pip and get points if you go for saves when the noobs drop like flies. When you pip, you'll get out of those ranks where there's a lot of newer players who don't know what to do.
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Depends on rank and killer, I guess. Nurse and Billy generally don't need ruin. At higher ranks, you should expect ruin. It's needed to slow down the game.
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@Tsulan said:
@fluffybunny said:
@Tsulan said:
And who did i name&shame?
In your post, didn't you call out someone? The one you pointed to earlier as your reason for being banned.
Can you link please?
I'll quote you so that you can find it easier. One sec.
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@PubStar87 said:
1. Before it existed Killers had to do their own dirty work and go find usPretty sure there was a massive issue with camping and that was part of the reason it was created.
@PubStar87 said:
3. You're taking away time that all 3 other survivors could have been doing something else, now we have to hide in lockers, which by the way are rarely right by a GENYou don't need to hide in lockers. You can stay on a gen and not go hiding, especially if you're next to a decent loop.
@PubStar87 said:
5. Yep, there's a perk to counter, that hasn't been in the Shrine yet, way to force people to pay to winBBQ&C is only obtainable with real money. The newest character can be acquired with shards.
@PubStar87 said:
7. It makes for a very un-fun game for those of us that don't get caught but keep having to jump in lockers every 30 seconds because teammates- So what did Killers do before BBQ&C existed? Oh yeah, work for their score
Good survivors aren't going to be jumping into a locker every time BBQ&C might go off. Back before the recent de-buffs, you had to fake out your direction or hope you hid well enough behind a gen. By your logic, everyone was inept back then and games were unfun, but they're largely the same.
Killers camped more often. BBQ&C was created to encourage leaving the hook.
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@Tsulan said:
And who did i name&shame?
In your post, didn't you call out someone? The one you pointed to earlier as your reason for being banned.
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Naming and shaming is against the forum rules.
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A killer shouldn't be pressuring chests. Someone who's going into a chest for an item is typically wasting time. It's more keen to just ignore people on chest unless you come across one and hit them or pull them off if you do. I highly doubt anyone would include a perk that gives chests notifications on their build and it would nullify the searching quieter part of Quentin's perk.
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@Peanits said:
We do check them. If you happen to have a recording, that's fantastic and it'll speed up the process, but it's not necessary. If you don't have a video or you're just unable to record, reporting them in-game will be good enough.If you're looking for recording software, Windows 10 will have a built in recorder, as powerbats mentioned. You can press Windows + G to open up the overlay and start a recording. It can also record your gameplay automatically in the background and delete the footage you don't end up saving, making it even easier. That way if anything does happen, you can just press a button save the past couple of minutes. It's way easier than starting a recording every time.
Each console has the same feature built in as well, and depending on your graphics card if you're playing on PC, you'll probably have either Shadowplay or ReLive as well. I've seen a couple people say that the built in Windows 10 recorder causes performance issues for them, so if it's not working out for you, you might want to check out one of those.
Thank you for responding! That's good to know. c:
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We should include things to give killers a better experience, too. Like taking points away for tbagging/taunting at pallets or in the opened door and so on.
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@Nickenzie said:
fluffybunny said:@Delfador said:
This is definitely not a lag switch, if it is, then I am really surprised.
When lag switch happens, it looks like the very fabric of the universe has been violated. Crazy things start to happen.
Also, I don't think that you can easily lag switch like this and then quickly go back to your normal internet connection. That was something like a second lag spike either from killer or survivor, and I believe that it is from the survivor but I am not sure.
Is it possible it was a graphical glitch, too? It looks like even though he looked to be going to the side, he was actually moving forward. With lag switches, you're like flying through the ceiling and stuff. xD
If it's as bad as you guys are making it out to be, then I never been lagged switched before to be honest lol.
Something was weird about the clip you showed, too, but from what I've experienced everyone will run in place. I've even had my character fall through the roof, I was lagging so bad.
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@powerbats said:
I use windows built in one for it, Windows key + G starts it and i mute my mic.I remember something about that when I was starting up some of my games, but couldn't remember the command for the life of me. Thank you! c:
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Isn't one a killer perk and the other two survivor perks?
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@Delfador said:
This is definitely not a lag switch, if it is, then I am really surprised.When lag switch happens, it looks like the very fabric of the universe has been violated. Crazy things start to happen.
Also, I don't think that you can easily lag switch like this and then quickly go back to your normal internet connection. That was something like a second lag spike either from killer or survivor, and I believe that it is from the survivor but I am not sure.
Is it possible it was a graphical glitch, too? It looks like even though he looked to be going to the side, he was actually moving forward. With lag switches, you're like flying through the ceiling and stuff. xD
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I believe that's the case of the mystical teleporting clown. He really doesn't like it when people use pallets.
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You can hide in lockers, behind generators, and there's a perk to counter it up to three times now. BBQ&C encourages killers to leave the hook by giving them their next place to pressure. You really shouldn't be complaining about it.
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@Doc_W__HOLLIDAY said:
fluffybunny said:@Doc_W__HOLLIDAY said:
fluffybunny said:
@powerbats said:
@Doc_W__HOLLIDAY said:
fluffybunny said: @Doc_W__HOLLIDAY said: Did they have Play With Your Food OR noed active? There wasn't even two done and he was walking faster than the normal walking while carrying survivors. Oh damn. That is very suspicious. I have yet to run into that.
I've had it quite a bit lately as well and it's been Trappers usually it's like they've got BL3 active at the start of the match. As far as your question fluffy yes they look into it but i almost always start recording at the start of the match and if nothing's there just delete it. If you do find something suspicious use the support link and follow the steps.
https://support.deadbydaylight.com/hc/en-us/requests/new Do you have any recommendations on what to use to record? I haven't come across a cheater like that before, so I haven't bothered with recording before.
Do you play PS4, PC, or Xbox?
I'm on PC and I have an Alienware and Window's 10 I believe.
Oh darn. I can't help you in recording software then, unless you want to buy a capture card.
I don't think you need a capture card for PC.
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@Doc_W__HOLLIDAY said:
fluffybunny said:@powerbats said:
@Doc_W__HOLLIDAY said:
fluffybunny said:
@Doc_W__HOLLIDAY said:
Did they have Play With Your Food OR noed active?
There wasn't even two done and he was walking faster than the normal walking while carrying survivors.
Oh damn. That is very suspicious. I have yet to run into that.
I've had it quite a bit lately as well and it's been Trappers usually it's like they've got BL3 active at the start of the match. As far as your question fluffy yes they look into it but i almost always start recording at the start of the match and if nothing's there just delete it. If you do find something suspicious use the support link and follow the steps.
https://support.deadbydaylight.com/hc/en-us/requests/new
Do you have any recommendations on what to use to record? I haven't come across a cheater like that before, so I haven't bothered with recording before.
Do you play PS4, PC, or Xbox?
I'm on PC and I have an Alienware and Window's 10 I believe.
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@powerbats said:
@Doc_W__HOLLIDAY said:
fluffybunny said:@Doc_W__HOLLIDAY said:
Did they have Play With Your Food OR noed active?
There wasn't even two done and he was walking faster than the normal walking while carrying survivors.
Oh damn. That is very suspicious. I have yet to run into that.
I've had it quite a bit lately as well and it's been Trappers usually it's like they've got BL3 active at the start of the match.
As far as your question fluffy yes they look into it but i almost always start recording at the start of the match and if nothing's there just delete it.
If you do find something suspicious use the support link and follow the steps.
Do you have any recommendations on what to use to record? I haven't come across a cheater like that before, so I haven't bothered with recording before.
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@dannyfrog87 said:
@fluffybunny said:
@Doc_W__HOLLIDAY said:
Did they have Play With Your Food OR noed active?There wasn't even two done and he was walking faster than the normal walking while carrying survivors.
could of had agitation?? you go faster with that when carrying i use it to stop body blockers other than that cant comment lol
It was much faster than agitation is.
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@Doc_W__HOLLIDAY said:
fluffybunny said:@Doc_W__HOLLIDAY said:
Did they have Play With Your Food OR noed active?
There wasn't even two done and he was walking faster than the normal walking while carrying survivors.
Oh damn. That is very suspicious. I have yet to run into that.
I've seen it in videos before, but that was the first time I've come across something like this. I'm worried about getting another game with this person. Cheaters aren't fun to face.
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@Doc_W__HOLLIDAY said:
Did they have Play With Your Food OR noed active?There wasn't even two done and he was walking faster than the normal walking while carrying survivors.
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@Theluckyboi I believe back then I would crouch everywhere 'cause I was afraid of leaving marks.
@Mr_Myers When I first started, I thought sabboing was super mean and didn't mess with it at all. I think I had heard from somewhere that it really upset killers and I didn't want to really upset anyone. MYERS GOES AFK, that's adorable.
@MegMain98 I think a lot of people don't know about scratch marks when first starting off. I only knew of them thanks to watching people play both sides (I used to watch dlive a lot, but he's a bit too salty now for my taste).
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I like this idea! Also, did you make the picture? It looks really nice.
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@BlackReaper said:
@HavelmomDaS1 said:
I just watched this match and I can absolutly confirm this situation as beeing totally unfun and stupid. Wiggle DS is the strongest thing survivors can have and I really don't know how the devs thought this is fine or balanced. One wiggle DS can make you lose the match, no matter how good you played it.It's the first chase so there is no real need for a time stamp I guess.
DS must be overhaul, but you guys are blind? the real problem here is not DS, is how fast the game end, DS is not a problem if you have time to chase them again, "ok he DS and now i have to caught him again", yeah thats kinda sucks but it's ok unless you get the 5 gens done already, in the process. At least is what i think about this.
We shouldn't be making the argument to make the game longer to account for multiple DS users. If we did that, it would make people feel as though they have to bring the perk to balance out the time. We should just be tweaking the perk's affect so that it doesn't give a free escape.
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@NoShinyPony said:
@fluffybunny said:
@NoShinyPony said:
@fluffybunny said:
@NoShinyPony said:
@fluffybunny said:
@NoShinyPony said:
@Watery said:
Do keep in mind that syringe and stryptic are very rare items and cost a lot of bloodpoints. Insta-heal has its downsides- you lose the medkit, making it one time use.These add-ons may be rare in theory but you find them in every bloodweb on lvl 50. Spending bloodpoints is not a downside gameplay-wise. And of course, insta-heals are one-time-use? If they weren't, nobody would need to play this game anymore.
When losing a brown medkit is the only argument somebody can bring up, then you know there really is no argument.
We have talked about these points several times already in this thread.
If they're in "every" bloodweb, where is it? I can go multiple bloodwebs without coming across one. Even if you say the percentage is high, it's not. Out of all my characters (I have all but 2 and 8 of which are level 50), only 2 have anything to do with the insta-meds on their webs and one of which is a rank 40 I'm bound to never play again unless I actually waste points at ranking him up and getting better perks (or, y'know, daily). I'd be up for the argument of limiting the type of medkit to green or higher, but saying it appears every bloodweb on lvl 50 is an outright lie and you know it. They are rare. That's the point of them. You're bound to go through 4+ looking for them. It may not feel like it is, though, 'cause we have cheaters among us who can just give themselves an unlimited supply.
I like how you chose to ignore the entire balance issue and instead post a screenshot of a bloodweb where you don't have an insta-heal.
We already established that spending bloodpoints, the cost of items/add-ons etc. have nothing to do with gameplay balance.
Just shows to everyone that you very well know that these add-ons are unbalanced freebies for survivors and you don't know which point you could bring up to justify keeping insta-heals as they are. Which is understandable, since there just is no valid point.
Nah, I'm just pointing out holes in your argument. I've already approached with my opinions of what's being pushed and you've willfully not acknowledged or dismissed it. Exaggeration doesn't really help your case, like pretending survivors just are fed points for existing and therefore always have a ton of extra BP to spend.
It's not a hole in my argumentation. We are not talking about the cost of add-ons.
You refuse to talk about the topic of the thread which is the balance of insta-heals. Instead, you try to distract with talking about how often these add-ons appear in bloodwebs, how they are so expensive... It's like writing in a NOED discussion thread "My character is on lvl 40 and still no NOED".
If you don't want to talk about the topic of the thread, that's totally fine. Just stop writing here. But stop trying to disctract and acknowledge valid arguments.
The first post indicated a change should be done to insta-heals. While I agree the item/add-on should be weakened, I don't think the change should be as abysmal as "you're exposed when you use it" since that would make it relatively unusable. It's supposed to be an ultra rare item and those should help you win. They do on the killer side. Why should they get in the way and actually screw over the person using it when used on the survivor side?
Giving the exposed status effect would not "screw over" the person using the insta-heal. It would in many cases prevent insta-heals from being used in front of the killer, for example in a chase. But it would not make the insta-heal unusable at all since it would still save the survivors a lot of time.
And sure "It's like writing in a NOED discussion thread "My character is on lvl 40 and still no NOED"." would be valid if your argument against people saying it's expensive and therefore shouldn't be useless wasn't that you can get every bloodweb. Going back to you saying "These add-ons may be rare in theory but you find them in every bloodweb on lvl 50." The point in my post is to point out how much of an exaggeration that is. And maybe "Spending bloodpoints is not a downside gameplay-wise." is true for you, but it isn't true for someone who's still leveling up their characters, getting new perks and so on.
That spending bloodpoints is not a downside gameplay-wise and therefore not something that has anything to do with the balance of insta-heals is a fact. A fact is not anything you can have an opinion on. Like the earth is not flat. That's a fact and not something you can have an opinion on.
"But stop trying to disctract and acknowledge valid arguments." In this case is the same as saying "agree with me," right? Because you don't find the argument "valid" and therefore it should be dismissed.
It's not about you having to agree with me. It's about that when you have a discussion with other people they expect you to bring up valid points and when you don't but instead try to distract, then they'll notice and say something about it.
People aren't going to equip an item that'll give them an exposed affect. What times do you see insta-heals used? If someone's being tunneled off hook and you try to insta-heal them, they're likely to go right back down if they're in a bad spot. Given people shouldn't be able to just insta-heal mid-chase as easily. I agree that's dumb, but giving it such a downside isn't the way to go. I saw someone suggest making it a heal over time, which sounds interesting to me. I'd be up for that change. Like maybe it would go off of the medkit's speed.
If you're rank 50 and don't have any, sifting through a bloodweb to look for more is a downside. That's a fact. If you switch to another character who may not have all your typical perks or even good ones, it'll advantage the killer as you may forget or not play with your typical build so be out of element. This isn't a flat earth sort of conversation, but the fact that you're treating it as such is telling.
The opposite of agreeing with your point would be to say "I don't think you should be exposed because of x,y,z." I did so and I'm being told to stop misdirecting the conversation. How is that not about having to agree with you?
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@NoShinyPony said:
@fluffybunny said:
@NoShinyPony said:
@fluffybunny said:
@NoShinyPony said:
@Watery said:
Do keep in mind that syringe and stryptic are very rare items and cost a lot of bloodpoints. Insta-heal has its downsides- you lose the medkit, making it one time use.These add-ons may be rare in theory but you find them in every bloodweb on lvl 50. Spending bloodpoints is not a downside gameplay-wise. And of course, insta-heals are one-time-use? If they weren't, nobody would need to play this game anymore.
When losing a brown medkit is the only argument somebody can bring up, then you know there really is no argument.
We have talked about these points several times already in this thread.
If they're in "every" bloodweb, where is it? I can go multiple bloodwebs without coming across one. Even if you say the percentage is high, it's not. Out of all my characters (I have all but 2 and 8 of which are level 50), only 2 have anything to do with the insta-meds on their webs and one of which is a rank 40 I'm bound to never play again unless I actually waste points at ranking him up and getting better perks (or, y'know, daily). I'd be up for the argument of limiting the type of medkit to green or higher, but saying it appears every bloodweb on lvl 50 is an outright lie and you know it. They are rare. That's the point of them. You're bound to go through 4+ looking for them. It may not feel like it is, though, 'cause we have cheaters among us who can just give themselves an unlimited supply.
I like how you chose to ignore the entire balance issue and instead post a screenshot of a bloodweb where you don't have an insta-heal.
We already established that spending bloodpoints, the cost of items/add-ons etc. have nothing to do with gameplay balance.
Just shows to everyone that you very well know that these add-ons are unbalanced freebies for survivors and you don't know which point you could bring up to justify keeping insta-heals as they are. Which is understandable, since there just is no valid point.
Nah, I'm just pointing out holes in your argument. I've already approached with my opinions of what's being pushed and you've willfully not acknowledged or dismissed it. Exaggeration doesn't really help your case, like pretending survivors just are fed points for existing and therefore always have a ton of extra BP to spend.
It's not a hole in my argumentation. We are not talking about the cost of add-ons.
You refuse to talk about the topic of the thread which is the balance of insta-heals. Instead, you try to distract with talking about how often these add-ons appear in bloodwebs, how they are so expensive... It's like writing in a NOED discussion thread "My character is on lvl 40 and still no NOED".
If you don't want to talk about the topic of the thread, that's totally fine. Just stop writing here. But stop trying to disctract and acknowledge valid arguments.
The first post indicated a change should be done to insta-heals. While I agree the item/add-on should be weakened, I don't think the change should be as abysmal as "you're exposed when you use it" since that would make it relatively unusable. It's supposed to be an ultra rare item and those should help you win. They do on the killer side. Why should they get in the way and actually screw over the person using it when used on the survivor side?
And sure "It's like writing in a NOED discussion thread "My character is on lvl 40 and still no NOED"." would be valid if your argument against people saying it's expensive and therefore shouldn't be useless wasn't that you can get every bloodweb. Going back to you saying "These add-ons may be rare in theory but you find them in every bloodweb on lvl 50." The point in my post is to point out how much of an exaggeration that is. And maybe "Spending bloodpoints is not a downside gameplay-wise." is true for you, but it isn't true for someone who's still leveling up their characters, getting new perks and so on. They're still adding new characters, too, and they may want all the perks on one or multiple characters.
"But stop trying to disctract and acknowledge valid arguments." In this case is the same as saying "agree with me," right? Because you don't find the argument "valid" and therefore it should be dismissed.
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If you grab them, you get more points, though.
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@NoShinyPony said:
@fluffybunny said:
@NoShinyPony said:
@Watery said:
Do keep in mind that syringe and stryptic are very rare items and cost a lot of bloodpoints. Insta-heal has its downsides- you lose the medkit, making it one time use.These add-ons may be rare in theory but you find them in every bloodweb on lvl 50. Spending bloodpoints is not a downside gameplay-wise. And of course, insta-heals are one-time-use? If they weren't, nobody would need to play this game anymore.
When losing a brown medkit is the only argument somebody can bring up, then you know there really is no argument.
We have talked about these points several times already in this thread.
If they're in "every" bloodweb, where is it? I can go multiple bloodwebs without coming across one. Even if you say the percentage is high, it's not. Out of all my characters (I have all but 2 and 8 of which are level 50), only 2 have anything to do with the insta-meds on their webs and one of which is a rank 40 I'm bound to never play again unless I actually waste points at ranking him up and getting better perks (or, y'know, daily). I'd be up for the argument of limiting the type of medkit to green or higher, but saying it appears every bloodweb on lvl 50 is an outright lie and you know it. They are rare. That's the point of them. You're bound to go through 4+ looking for them. It may not feel like it is, though, 'cause we have cheaters among us who can just give themselves an unlimited supply.
I like how you chose to ignore the entire balance issue and instead post a screenshot of a bloodweb where you don't have an insta-heal.
We already established that spending bloodpoints, the cost of items/add-ons etc. have nothing to do with gameplay balance.
Just shows to everyone that you very well know that these add-ons are unbalanced freebies for survivors and you don't know which point you could bring up to justify keeping insta-heals as they are. Which is understandable, since there just is no valid point.
Nah, I'm just pointing out holes in your argument. I've already approached with my opinions of what's being pushed and you've willfully not acknowledged or dismissed it. Exaggeration doesn't really help your case, like pretending survivors just are fed points for existing and therefore always have a ton of extra BP to spend.
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@George_Soros said:
Vietfox said:She's not indeed. I like her.
I like her too.
Despite her being ugly.Don't make her glare at you.
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@Laakeri said:
I was hoping to see some constructive criticism from op, but he is just another one of those.What are you expecting from someone with that name? Are we sure this isn't bait? "Killers need to get used to not winning and grow a pair" "kill survivors before gens are done (it's not hard)" both statements contradict each other. "I can counter infinites" =/= "I'm a trash killer"
Just pointing these out.
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Survivors tbag to communicate with each other, too, or for non toxic reasons. Just because you give into the bait and chase them, doesn't mean it should be changed.
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I think at certain times of the day, you may find less killers in your area and the game may pair you with killers from further away.
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@Snikers said:
@Jake_Parks_prince said:
Oh and side note HOW IS FENG ATHLETIC SHE JUST SAT AROUND AND PLAYED GAMES?!This is hardly unique to Feng. Dwight was rejected by his high school athletic teams, Claudette is a shut-in (though apparently given to "strolls", so there's that), and Jeff's a chunky monkey. Ace and Tapp (assuming he's the same age as Donald Glover was during the first Saw) are in their fifties - I won't count Bill because he could keep up with the young'ins in his own canon. And yet, they're all a few teachable perks away from being equal to Meg, David, and Quentin, canonical athletes.
Admittedly, Feng has a unique exhaustion perk, but since the word "lithe" doesn't imply speed so much as agility, her speed boost might just an abstraction of the quick reflexes she would, reasonably, have.
Wait, Quentin was an athlete? I had no idea. I thought he was like a nerd or a bookworm or something.
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Some people are far too immersed for their own good, but that's part of surviving for them and that's ultimately a survivor's goal. It's easier when everyone does their part and I personally find it a loss if I'm the only one able to leave, but not everyone is like that. I usually run bond to see people and beckon for them to follow if they're being too immersive and I don't usually have issues with people doing nothing, but you can't really influence what people do while you're in a chase.
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I'd be up for something like that. Like a green mode, a purple mode and a pink mode. That would mean you'd have a distinct idea of who's using what in the purple/pink modes, though. Additionally, just more gamemodes that change up the objective would be fun, too.
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@Milo @George_Soros you two are funny. XD
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@NuclearBurrito2 said:
@fluffybunny said:
@NoShinyPony said:
@Watery said:
Do keep in mind that syringe and stryptic are very rare items and cost a lot of bloodpoints. Insta-heal has its downsides- you lose the medkit, making it one time use.These add-ons may be rare in theory but you find them in every bloodweb on lvl 50. Spending bloodpoints is not a downside gameplay-wise. And of course, insta-heals are one-time-use? If they weren't, nobody would need to play this game anymore.
When losing a brown medkit is the only argument somebody can bring up, then you know there really is no argument.
We have talked about these points several times already in this thread.
If they're in "every" bloodweb, where is it?
bottom left
I am so curious if that's going to be a brand new part. That add-on is utterly useless now. Given, it needed a tweak, but still.> @NuclearBurrito2 said:
@fluffybunny said:
@NuclearBurrito2 said:
@fluffybunny said:
@NoShinyPony said:
@Watery said:
Do keep in mind that syringe and stryptic are very rare items and cost a lot of bloodpoints. Insta-heal has its downsides- you lose the medkit, making it one time use.These add-ons may be rare in theory but you find them in every bloodweb on lvl 50. Spending bloodpoints is not a downside gameplay-wise. And of course, insta-heals are one-time-use? If they weren't, nobody would need to play this game anymore.
When losing a brown medkit is the only argument somebody can bring up, then you know there really is no argument.
We have talked about these points several times already in this thread.
If they're in "every" bloodweb, where is it?
bottom left
I am so curious if that's going to be a brand new part. That add-on is utterly useless now. Given, it needed a tweak, but still. EDIT: It was a BNP fml lol
If it was an insta-heal that would have been hilarious
It would have been really funny. xD The next page didn't have either insta-meds, either.
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@NuclearBurrito2 said:
@fluffybunny said:
@NoShinyPony said:
@Watery said:
Do keep in mind that syringe and stryptic are very rare items and cost a lot of bloodpoints. Insta-heal has its downsides- you lose the medkit, making it one time use.These add-ons may be rare in theory but you find them in every bloodweb on lvl 50. Spending bloodpoints is not a downside gameplay-wise. And of course, insta-heals are one-time-use? If they weren't, nobody would need to play this game anymore.
When losing a brown medkit is the only argument somebody can bring up, then you know there really is no argument.
We have talked about these points several times already in this thread.
If they're in "every" bloodweb, where is it?
bottom left
I am so curious if that's going to be a brand new part. That add-on is utterly useless now. Given, it needed a tweak, but still. EDIT: It was a BNP fml lol
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@TeaLeaf said:
@fluffybunny said:
@TeaLeaf said:
@fluffybunny said:
@TeaLeaf said:
Hmm its an interesting case I will give you, though it is still an argument of playing sub-optimaly because that makes you 'better' and 'more skilled'. However it is the best argument I have herd for such a thing in a while and can relate when its kill your friends. I suppose at the end of the day, if your on the killer side if you seek to win (try hard) by doing what a horror game would have a killer do.. aka kill as your fun or simply chase. Like wise with survivors who load every advantage talent wise they can, if fun for them is surviving or if they don't try to do gens as a priority. For me I expect survivors to gen rush and try to win and killers to kill. If the game was meant to have one character acting as a game master, I would think differently. However both sides are set up in a competitive fashion. Is the issue the games design then?Well, I'm not really talking about sub-optimal play. By all means if they rush the hook, punish that. I personally expect it. They shouldn't be doing that. Killers are supposed to take advantage of mistakes and misplays, though. It's part of their role. What irritates me is when the killer WAITS for a misplay. Like they hoover around the hook and wait for someone foolish enough to go in for it. A lot of times people do, too, and reward the killer for something that doesn't take much thought. Given it happens less at the higher ranks, but it's still annoying. And you can always tell who relies on such tactics, like you can tell who uses NOED. They're just weaker players overall. I don't really consider trying to win as being try hard. I consider using OP items/add-ons/offerings as being try hard, especially if it's to help the side who used them win. Like if I want to live (daily), I'm bring in an OP item for myself 'cause I wanna live. I would be essentially try harding.
I would also argue that just because it's part of the game, doesn't mean it's perfect. My biggest concern is that when killers get all the buffs they need, they'll still camp and tunnel because it's the easy option. Playing killer is far better than it once was and sometimes it feels like there's just been an increase in camping and tunneling. Ideally, we would want a match that is fair for both sides and if one player is tunneled down and killed, they're not really given a chance to play.
Well for the purpose of killing I would say it is indeed a sub-optimal style spoken of. What I am referring too is specifically letting a survivor run off for the reason they got hooked a moment ago or when presented with an option going for the wounded survivor near death rather then the fresh. As well if the gates are powered and you have had no kills, but you have some one hooked it is very sub-optimal to leave that 1 kill you may have secured by camping when leaving assures no kills (and depending on set up of survivors its possible you can't defend that camped hook either).
When it comes to reaction I mean that survivors use on generators dictate the flow of the match. You can only chase one survivor and the speed at which generators can be completed is 2 min 40 secs for 5 generators (not factoring in interruptions and travel time). This means the killer must react to the survivors flow and mistakes as a skilled loopier and use of pallets can easily allow 3 gens to be completed before the first hook (chase, down, travel time to the hook). A game can be completed in truth in about 3 mins. Some killers are able to apply map pressure but its not universal to all killers as some are not exceptional at map pressure.
As for defensive play being looked down upon mentioned above I would also add... one of the emblems for killers is gate keeper. It is achieved by preventing the gates being powered 10 mins or not being finished. We also have killers (like the hag) designed for defensive play styles. To say defensive play is a poor style means certain killers should be removed and some of the emblem system is counter productive.
Are we talking about hoovering around the hook and tunneling the hooked person once they're unhooked or someone happening to unhook in front of you and going after the weaker target? I think the latter is more understandable. You're reacting to a situation and I'd say it's the biggest reason I try not to go down when solo if I can help it. You can't account for people you're playing with to actually do good saves and for the killer to have mercy when faced with that situation. Sometimes I'll down the person and leave them to get picked up and sometimes I won't. Depends on how generous I feel. I don't personally find it an issue if a killer camps once the doors are opened. It's expected at that point. I don't think I'm as critical of killers as others are, though. Some will accuse killers of camping and tunneling, even when they didn't do anything to deserve that sort of treatment and some people consider some things to be bad when I don't consider them to be. I'm typically more annoyed with my team than anything else (joys of solo play).
As for the gate keeper, that comes from giving pressure to generators, does it not? Ignoring generators to chill next to the victim shouldn't yield in a good returns. The same could be said with hoovering around victims, rather than pressuring generators and putting pressure on the field. Also using examples of possibilties in game isn't exactly a strong argument. It isn't like they have massively tweak looping to make it easier for killers, after all, despite it being in game.
As for what I am in defense of it is strategic camping, not chilling by the hook (unless gates are powered.) For example if I hook some one, I will often leave but then 30m out back track towards the hook. This is in hopes to intercept some one going for the unhook, as once I engage them in a chase some one eles has to leave a gen to unhook victim number 1. This also can have the effect of making survivors sneak for future unhooks and take more time in their unhook attempts to make sure I am not doubling back. This is because it isn't strategic to do this all game, once they suspect your going back they might linger on a gen too long. Its all about buying enough time for a killer.
Oh I am in agreement about face camping on the first hook or while gens are done, as it is a very sub-optimal style of play. It takes 2 mins for that survivor to die which leaves the other survivors all the time to complete gens and get out. My use of suboptimal is often what I see expected of me, never hook some one twice in a row, and any thing less then running tot he other side of the map your called a camper. As you said, you can still be accused of it regardless. I have often been left to believe most who throw down the word don't understanding what face camping is and how it is different from other form of camping aka baiting and ambush.
Examples arn't the best way for an argument but I feel this is more of a sharing of idea's then either side aggressively trying to make a point. Mutual sharing of idea's I think examples work wonders under that goal ^.^
I think that's fine, personally, though I know some people are more at the extreme ends than others. My biggest issue with solo play is that a lot of people won't go for the saves or they outright farm you. xD; Feels like no one can go for safe unhooks. Like they won't even try to block or anything and you'll just go down immediately.
Yeah, like I said, it depends on my mood if I'll two hook someone or leave them on the ground. If the game is going well, I generally won't tunnel or whatever. It's kinda on them if they lead me back to the hook or they don't let me leave, but I always try to get the farmer when I can 'cause that crap annoys the crap out of me.
Mhm, it is, though I think expressing specifics is always important. Someone won't know where you're coming from if you don't describe the road, you know? Kind of like that. Given some people don't care what the other "side" is experiencing, but I'm always up to hearing people out.
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@Master said:
@fluffybunny said:
@Master said:
@fluffybunny said:
@Master said:
@fluffybunny said:
@Master said:
@NuclearBurrito2 said:
@Ihatelife said:
@NoShinyPony said:
@Ihatelife said:
@NoShinyPony said:
@Ihatelife said:
Jesus christ. Survivors needs also some helpful stuff like insta-heals. Every side have a different benefits in the game. Such as the killer can mori survivors, insta-down them etc. Besides survivors more die than escape.I believe that helpful stuff should still be balanced. I'm fine with the existence of insta-heals as long as there is a downside which makes the add-on balanced.
In general, if there is a strong perk/item/add-on for either survivors or killers, it should be balanced. I don't like the freebie character of insta-heals. It takes no skill, there is no risk. There is no equivalent for killers with such a freebie trait. A killer equivalent would be that somebody just randomly loses one or two health states. And of course, that doesn't sound reasonable at all. So why should survivors have such an unbalanced add-on?
Than why killers should have mori, insta-downs add-ons? Mori after the nerf doesn't have a downside. You just need to hook a survivor and ta dam you can mori him. Without this you must have to get them killed by hooking them 3 times per person, so there is not downsides for this offering. Insta-down hatchets? Yes there is downside by reducing the carrying a hatchets to only 1, but you have unlimited times to use it and insta-heals are only once per trial.
First, I don't think the Ebony Mori is balanced. It's too strong. But the existence of one unbalanced thing doesn't justify the existence of another unbalanced thing. There simply shouldn't be anything unbalanced in a game.
As you described, insta-down hatchets have a downside. And on top, it still takes skill to hit a survivor and the killer has only 3 attempts (if the add-on for additional hatchets is used). After these 3 attempts, the chase is over. Insta-heals on the other side take no skill at all. Just make a click and it's done.
It's similar to the one other insta-down add-on in DbD. That's it. Not a lot of killers even have insta-downs.
"You can only use insta-heals once per trial" is not a downside, either. If you could use them multiple times, nobody would play DbD anymore.
Than... I'm okay with insta-down nerf if we nerf a mori.
Make a thread about nerfing Mori's then. I'm certainly up for the idea if you have something specific in mind
Well 4 insta heals are way more powerful than a mori, so.....
I don't think those are actually more powerful than a mori, unless we're talking about the green sort specifically, which we wouldn't be. If everyone had a syringe, that would be 4 extra lives, while a mori would reduce 4 extra lives. Mind you, both are ultra rare and one side requires 4 to have the same affect. Additionally, moris can be done wherever and if you're getting up someone from the ground, you're often exchanging a health state for that. You also need to be in the right place at the right time. A person with a syringe being miles away from the downed person doesn't help even remotely. When you're chasing someone with a mori, you're often right on them.
If I had to choose if I could use an ebony vs 4 insta heals or no mori vs no insta heals, I would prefer the no insta heal game
The problem with isnta heals is that they can be used on downed survivor too and not only on yourself
Oh and then there is still the insta heal exploit that BHVR doesnt bother fixing
All things equal, it would actually only be 1 as that would be the equivalent of an ebony mori and I'd prefer something that often wouldn't impact the match (they have to be nearby/in a good position for it not to go to waste/be unused). If we're talking about a 4 man squad of insta heals, that'd be more like a one-down huntress with a mori.
I haven't heard of an insta heal exploit, but I wouldn't be surprised with this game.
Well, you know its a 1vs4.
And guess what, 4 man squads are part of the game, but an instadown+mori offering is not
Those are part of the game if someone chooses to use them, though, and it'd be going off of the same amount of points. I think the biggest issue (from what I've understood) is SWF and couldn't we counter something like that if we kept people in SWF groups from running the same items and perks? I've seen someone suggest something like that and still think it's a really good idea. I highly doubt you're gonna get a squad of mostly solo players who all bring in insta-meds.
That doesnt change the fact that it will always be 4vs1. 1 insta heal shoudl not be equally powerful to a mori
Well, I'm going off of points, though they would probably have about same amount of rarity and likely hood of finding them. If the team isn't coordinated, they'd be less likely to randomly equip it and they still need to be nearby to have the full affect, otherwise they're just using it on themselves. There's a lot to account for that you really don't have to account for with a mori. Franky's can be used if you see a full team of med-kits, too. Killers get the benefit of seeing what they might be opposing and adjusting their build accordingly. My biggest issue is making there be a exposed affect immediately after using it makes it super useless as an item.