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@DaKnight said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1818949#Comment_1818949
It still shows that every killer is more than capable of winning at red ranks. I play a ton of different killers at red rank, including the ones people consider weak. Sure, you will have problems taking an M1 killer into a 4 man meta SWF; but most players are not god loopers or anything. Against an average SWF you can do fine. I also think it's up to the player to choose perks that will compliment their playstyle instead of slapping on ruin undying and expecting to win every game.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nx1k5TeOj8c
You can watch this guy win almost every single game as perkless / addonless clown at rank 1.
Alright, I see. So weak killers are still viable in solo queue and even against an average SWF. But what about the good ones? I see that the weaker ones are still viable, but honestly, it was only because the survivors were not the best going against someone who clearly knows what to do. You are practically helpless as a clown against a SWF running all meta perks. The only reason you would even dream of getting a 4k is that they messed up really badly, or became overly-altruistic. So most of the time you can safely assume that you will do well because of solo queue, but if a proper mmr system was implemented this would just not be the case at all. Also, it seems that the guy in this video was facing a lot of noobs which I guess proves your point about most survivors being bad. But my concern are the good ones, if they don't mess you you are screwed.
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@GrimReaperJr1232 said:
I think comparing Wraith to Oni is a bit like comparing apples to oranges due to how vastly different their playstyles are. A better comparison imo would be between Wraith and Ghost Face as they're both Stealth killers with few chasing tools.
Maybe. I feel like comparing a killer with good mobility and chase potential and a killer without either (or at least a really weak variation of it) would be best to show how it is a bit ridiculous how certain killers are just more expanded upon over others. As for gf and wraith, that might have been a good comparison, but I chose Oni and Wraith because they were much different. Sure they have different playstyles, but they both contrast quite well in terms of what they have in their kits.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1818970#Comment_1818970
If you always think you only got a Hit because Survivors made mistakes, you should quit playing DBD; lol.
I didn't say that you only get hits if survivors make mistakes. I said most of the time against someone who knows what they are doing, you will struggle to hit them, and usually the only time you will hit them is if they misplay a tile. It is different for each killer. For example, as huntress, you can predict a vault and get a hit using a hatchet. As Oni, strafing during a demon dash and listening for the survivor movement can get you a hit. As pyramid head, if you are good at aiming the shockwave then you can get some pretty nasty hits. What about Wraith? He has to rely on a lunge to get a hit at a loop. I am not saying you will never get a hit if the survivors don't make mistakes, I am saying most of the time you will struggle. Just look at some of the ridiculous tiles that can spawn in favor of survivors on average.
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@TheClownIsKing said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1818777#Comment_1818777
I’m actually hoping they DON’T take Clown changes too far. I.e. I hope mechanically he still operates the same. Far too many still underestimate how powerful limiting/taking away the survivors mobility and evasive options is.
Yeah me too. I feel like just giving him lethality and a little extra spice is necessary. The real counter to him is dropping pallets early and slamming gens. Like seriously, if it is a decent pallet what can you do as clown? Nothing, you break the pallet and continue chasing.
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@[Deleted User] said:
Tbh I feel that way more about perks on both sides than I do as killer.
So many useless trash perks, and you have to grind through 3 levels for each of them for no real reason beyond having a grind. Unlike killers you KNOW they are not very useful very clearly and they can be fixed so easily, but just are not for some reason....
More and more perks are added, FAR faster than old ones are made viable.
That is another thing. But if all killers were very strong, you could probably still do well without good perks. But yeah, perks should definitely be looked at.. you know.... among other things
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1818899#Comment_1818899
Every Killer can be played at Rank 1. And personally, I prefer M1-Killers over Killers like Spirit. Not only does it feel like the Survivors have actually a chance to win, but I also feel better when I win, since I outplayed them and did not press M2 into a Hit.
So maybe it is "most of the time", but certainly not for me. Like, my Main Killer is Pig and in general I prefer Killers who are more basic.
The thing is, are you actually outplaying them, or are the survivors just making mistakes? For example on the coldwind farm, it is pretty easy to loop a killer for ages on shack since you can see through the walls. The killer can still mindgame you, but if you are playing it well then the killer will not be able to take a hit until you run away to another tile. Now, there are some people who haven't fully learned how to play certain tiles correctly, once they do there is not much you can do about it. Sure you could moonwalk or do other mindgames like fake going one way, but once the survivor knows what to do and what to look out for it can feel pretty helpless sometimes. A lot of the time during a chase, you aren't really outplaying the survivors, you are just hoping they make a mistake.
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@DaKnight said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1818899#Comment_1818899
Every killer is more than viable into solo Q teams. The latest stats released showed a very healthy mix of killers played at red ranks. Pig actually had one of the highest kill rates for whatever reason. Probably because every red rank pig runs double head pop add-ons which turns the power into an RNG mori if you are on the hook when the timer starts.
I see the point you are trying to make, but this data is not really that reliable. And no, I am pretty sure not every red rank pig runs those addons. The data shown above only takes into account the kind of ranks we are dealing with, the killers picked, and the average kill rate. It doesn't take into account strong perks for the survivors those killers faced, such as DS. Nor does it take info from people such as SWF groups and the type of map they were put in. I guess you could say that a weak killer is viable against solo survivors, but even then you will struggle as someone like Trapper or Wraith. Solo queuing survivors are not as helpless as they seem. Also what about DC's, or people killing themselves on hook? I don't mean to come off as rude btw.
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@Crowman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1818916#Comment_1818916
I don't disagree that OoO is unfair to certain killers over others, but it's not because the perk specifically works differently for those powers. Which was the case for Huntress Lullaby.
I didn't want to bring up SWF with OoO, because most killers in the game are unfairly hurt against a SWF squad being told where the killer is at all times. And that's something that won't change unless OoO as a perk is completely changed and even a reworked OoO will likely still be seeing the Killer's aura in exchange for showing your aura to the killer as other reworked perks still retained the core identity of it.
It does definitely need a nerf.
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Just don't play console :)
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@Crowman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1818838#Comment_1818838
OoO is not affecting the killer's power themselves. You can see the aura of the killer and see them using their power. Against trapping killers knowing where they've placed a trap means that trap isn't useful against you.
The Freddy interaction is because of Obliviousness status effect and perks like Nemesis can cause you problems against OoO users.
True, but it is still unfair because, for someone like trapper and hag, that is literally their only power. People only really run OoO when they are in a SWF group meaning that the trap is not useful towards anyone if the user sees you place it because they can just call it out to their team. They are just m1 killers otherwise.
For the oblivious status effect that is just bad in terms of design. This should not be the case and just falls into the category of OoO needing changes.
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@Almo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1818832#Comment_1818832
There's more to game design than just "what I think is cool". It's a discipline that requires careful systemic thought about everything you put into the game. Being able to maintain a live game's design over time is just as important as putting cool things in. It's both possible and necessary to do both.
What about using perks such as Decisive strike and unbreakable? These perks together create a lose-lose scenario for the killer. DS in general is quite overwhelming for killers.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
Its fine that Killers have different Power Levels. If you compare Wraith and Oni, you should also acknowledge that playing Wraith is easier than playing Oni.
It is fine to have Killers who are strong and Killers who are weaker, especially when they are more simple to play. The only difference are Freddy and Spirit, both are not hard to play (with Freddy being the easiest Killer) with the strength they have.
So its good that there are Killers which you basically can pick up and play without having to study them before, but it is also fine if those are not the strongest Killers.
I disagree on it being okay to have killers with different power levels. People most of the time find killers fun who are also effective at doing their job, ie killing. If you have killers who are weaker it will drive people away from them the higher the ranks they go. This means you will only see the same killers at the high ranks, Oni's, spirit's, p heads, etc. This creates rather stale gameplay in some people's eyes. I myself would also like to see more killers that are actually threatening at the high ranks. Even a really good player who decides to play someone like pig will get destroyed against survivors who know that they are just an m1 killer and take advantage of that.
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@Leonardo1ita said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1818820#Comment_1818820
Agree, keep not attacking him on a personal level, otherwise the post will get blocked
Sorry, forgot about that, I fixed it.
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@Almo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1818802#Comment_1818802
This is correct. As long as HHL affected some powers and not others, we'd have to make an independent judgement on every new mechanic involving a skill check. If you allow that kind of design, the number of perks that need individual judgements as you add more features slowly grows. It's not maintainable. You want as few exceptions in your design as possible. This is also why Kindred lost its "trumps all Killer stealth abilities".
That sounds kind of similar to OoO since OoO affects some killer powers more than others. OoO can most likely end up getting the user killed sure, but the effect is has on different killers is quite noticeable and increases the chance of the other survivors to escape. For example, it is outright unfair on both hag and trapper. It affects some killer powers far more than others. Another example is Freddy, if a survivor is asleep they can literally see Freddy for as long as they want at any time. Also, the only reason the object of obsession user dies quite often is because the killer usually throws the game to kill that one person. On killers such as Oni or Blight, it is less effective but still strong, especially in a SWF group.
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Also, that one line by coconut was amazing and it sucks that they just ignored it.
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@Elena said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1818777#Comment_1818777
Ah okay, I kind of whizz through posts if they seem too long in my opinion, so I try and find samples of it without taking it out of context so I can leave my comment on it
lol its fine
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@DaKnight said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1818727#Comment_1818727
It's not like you are ever constrained to one killer. I play Hag with browns/yellows usually but then go dump the points into a killer who actually needs them.
And with a really strong basekit you get some killers with lame add-ons. I love playing Pyramid Head but good lord are the add-ons trash/boring. Oni is another one like that, pretty boring add-ons for the most part. It's not like Myers/Wraith/Blight/etc where they completely change up the game.
Clown is pretty junk without add-ons but the second you give him ether or bleach he's a monster.
Yeah, p head's addons are good but just ehhhh not the best. His range addons are the best ones that actually make him a bit scarier. But I don't restrict myself to just Wraith, I just would like him to be more viable is all.
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@Elena said:
Well unless you've been living under a rock (which I doubt because you seem very opinionated), they confirmed that Clown was getting a rework and Wraith would be getting buffs 'soontm'.
I did mention that I did know that they are getting changes btw. I just am really hoping for them to be good changes, and I am questioning if they will be enough.
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@YOURFRIEND said:
Don't forget that you can see the aura of blood orbs through objects, giving Oni some built in tracking.
Yeah forgot about that, but there is yet another thing that Oni has.
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@lagosta said:
I don't think it's fair to compare killer's powers directly. They are not competing against each other, but against a team of survivors. Yes, Wraith is very dependent on addons, but you also need to ponder that he was conceived in the beginning of the game and is a very friendly to new players. Wraith teaches players macro knowledge without requiring deep mechanical skills and for that he serves well.
Yes, I can understand why he is the way he is due to him being outdated, but I would love if they changed him to be more viable but still really simple. A few creative changes and buffs could go a long way. But what are some things that he could teach a new player about the killer side of the game specifically? He should be more than just a starter character.
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Unless you are going for the full-on meta builds for survivors I would rate it 3/5 as is.
The only perks that are questionable are pharmacy and visionary.
Pharmacy could be replaced with bond, empathy, kindred, or even plunderers.
Visionary is not great if you can memorize gen locations and it is only decently useful if you are on an indoor map. Visionary could be replaced with better together or some other perk of your choice that helps your team.
Of course, this is all up to how good you are in a chase, and from what you say I assume you are not bad.
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@DaKnight said:
I don't really think looking at killers without add-ons is the way to go. If you run BBQ even somewhat regularly you can basically always be running greens and purples. Oni doesn't really get anything crazy add-on wise besides topknot.
But wraith has a ton of really fun stuff to use.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/7G3N4EUI3TDN/capture2-png.png
Silent bell wallhack wraith on an indoor map is amazing. And if the D hope goes off? 1 shots into mori's from complete stealth, from around corners. Disgusting. Way more powerful than Oni would be with 5 stacks.
Of course, I love using stuff like this on Wraith and it is super fun. But the problem is that even this against a team who knows what they are doing regardless of being in a SWF you will still struggle to kill anyone. With the best addons for wraith (Purple windstorm + coxcombed clapper) he will still suck on an open map. Devour hope is pretty high-risk high reward too. Maps are mostly survivor or killer sided as well, such as lery's.
It feels like Wraith needs at least 3 different addons to be able to use him while cloaked well. Sure you could do very well with the build described above, but this is not consistent. What if you start up in one of the farm maps? Or the Macmillian?
I compared the two without addons because I wanted to show the difference and usefulness of their power without getting really into it. With addons these killers are changed quite a bit, just look at the scalped topknot for Oni or the bone clapper for Wraith.
Also, I also don't think that killers should have a few addons that really change their power (except for the ultra rares). The fact that the windstorm addons have such a huge impact on Wraith says something about his core design. I feel like any killer should be changed to the point where they perform just fine without addons, addons should be what really makes killers pop out. Just not super crazy. For example, the Huntress's belts that give her more hatchets.
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@OniWantsYourMacaroni said:
I don't get salty comments anymore because of crossplay though :(
#EndgameChatForEveryone
I turned it off because I missed the salt, I also got full squads of people playing on different platforms. I also was tired of getting teammates I couldn't talk to, and by talking to I mean of course say gg...
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@Ghoste said:
This is just anecdotal but in solo queue I see this perk used to troll more often than actually countering Ruin. There are way better options to deal with Hexes. Plus if the Killer doesn't have Ruin then what? It's more or less a dead perk slot.
Yeah that is the problem with the perk, it is a hit or miss.
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Pretty sure the one everyone is waiting for is Jason Voorhees, I would also love to see him in this game. Although, I am not entirely sure why I know that licensing issues with the F13 game went poorly (someone plz explain). So I think BHVR is a bit scared of bringing him in.
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But I kind of like the hatch mechanic. It gives the last survivor a better chance to escape, rewarding them for surviving this long in a match. Keys are what allow it to be abused. Along with those blueprints that let you spawn it where you want.
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@Brhoom said:
By your definition, I can basement camp as Bubba with noed and bitter murmur and boom I'm one of the best.
Well technically it is not because you are the best, but the survivors are just not good as most aren't.
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@Todbringer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1818291#Comment_1818291
if you play enough survivior, you should know that most of the killers dont pay enough attention sometimes and often fall for it.
I know, like I said it was more of a memey post, I play survivor and I have been in this situation countless times. Kinda weird how killers sometimes don't pay attention to one of the only hiding spots a survivor could possibly be in, it is also very funny to go behind a tree and have a baby dweet look up at you begging for mercy.
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@Ohnoes said:
The perk is supposed to be for avoiding damage not making distance. You're complaining about the wrong aspect of the perk.
I see why, but doesn't it do both if the killer misses a swing?
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Repressed alliance
It should be at least 30 seconds, or just as long as the effect. Maybe 10 seconds more idk.
Premonition is just kind of dumb honestly, spine chill is a much better version that gives you buffs as well.
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The lighting is a bit annoying and I have to say I liked the Macmillian changes way more.
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This is exactly what I do, it works so well against survivors when I am using a more fun build.
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I like it, sure it is definitely not the best change and they still should have gotten keys done with them, but it was a huge problem with the game. Of many others, the devs have yet to touch...
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@rats00 said:
Naw, you'd be shocked how many times I've just gone still and a killer has completely missed me. Like yeah I will bail when you start walking towards me but I've had so many killers stop, stare for a second then wander off and im home free.
aint anybody got time fo looking around, we got gens to pressure
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@Eorpwald said:
Same reason a rabbit sits still when a fox spots it.
They're thinking 'has he seen me?'
"I think his mate saw me"
*bang
*Yes, yes he did"
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@TragicSolitude said:
The fallacy with this is that you don't know how many survivors have done that who you haven't seen; you only know about the ones you do see.
The number of times I thought I'd been seen and then the killer walked right by, plus the number of times as killer I never saw a survivor until they got spooked and ran.... yeah, those numbers aren't zero.
I assume the ones I do see most of the time then are just really bad at playing stealthy lol.
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@Todbringer said:
,,Are you doing it to be funny?"
Says the one who finds it funny to kobe in the face of others..
Back on the topic, most of the time the killers DIDNT saw you and just wanted to walk by or something.
Sometimes its worth to take the risk.
I don't think it is bad if that is what I might have somehow implied by that sentence. This is more of a memey post. But anyway, I don't see how hard it is to see a survivor wearing a neon-colored shirt right in the bushes on like yamaoka.
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@Nosferatu3145 said:
Hope...
lol
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@zackdaylight said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1817241#Comment_1817241
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1817215#Comment_1817215
And as gibbly said, you can easily mess up when blinking with nurse. Where as that loadout with Freddy works just as well, possibly even better, without having to master the killer and be a damn pro.
Just because you can mess up easily as nurse doesn't mean that freddy is better though. Nurse in the hands of an experienced player can destroy any survivor group. A full loadout makes her almost unstoppable, considering the player knows how to play her well.
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@zackdaylight said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1817053#Comment_1817053
Nope. Freddy is better if used right with the right perks. Not only can he counter looping, he can apply tremendous pressure. Something that nurse can’t do amazingly well. Unless you slug.
Does the nurse not do that better? She can just say f u to all survivor strategies.
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@SunderMun said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1815087#Comment_1815087
You say this, however in the past, even when there's been no Pop or Ruin, I've used it to signal to teammates that it's a gen with significant progress that I've been chased off.
For the most part, it is incredibly niche, though. The cooldown is too harsh to be worth running in the current meta, imo. Just as with a few killer perks and some other survivor perks.
Yeah the cooldown should be the same as the duration imo
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Another thing, you know who else counters BT if played properly? Wraith, Myers, pig, huntress even, and Ghostface.
I feel like he should be on A tier though. I will admit though, he needs something to make him more skillful.
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@zackdaylight said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/213231/freddy-is-b-tier-at-best-and-doesnt-need-nerfs
Freddy is S+ tier. The best killer in the game if used with good perks. Just because you don’t know how to use him doesn’t mean he’s not the best.
*laughs in nurse
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@Anara said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1815087#Comment_1815087
I use Repressed Alliance very often, and i can say that its a good perk whatever the killer is or his/her perks are.
Beside it block the gen, it show other survivors your gen in white. Then survivors knows killer is after me and can complete my gen.
I use Repressed Alliance + Better Together + Prove Thyself its a very strong combo to make sure to complete gens without any regression
I feel like using perks that encourage people to work on the generator you are working on is not the best playstyle because if the killer does come around, then the killer can pressure two or more people off of a generator more than often which is really bad for the survivor team. Repressed alliance should be used if you plan on doing generators solo for most of the match.
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@gibblywibblywoo said:
Its weird how this isn't actually noted in perk descriptions or the wiki but I've had a lot of fun using it recently. Some pop users get HELLA salty if you use it on them. I've been camped to death multiple times and even trash talked post game because of it.
Really? lol, what a bunch of babies. But then again, this IS dbd, people get upset over everything.
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@Nazeef13 said:
The 60 seconds of gen working requirement is too much imo. And it sucks especially if you're working with someone on a gen.
I think they were afraid of what would happen if 4 people were running it, similar to any means necessary. But we saw them reduce the cooldown for that later.
Yeah, I think that it should be buffed to 30 seconds before you can use it, so 30 seconds of usage and 30 seconds of charge up time. Also a good tip: You should only ever work on a generator with somebody if it is over halfway done. You don't have to, but doing this will mean that two people can be at two places at once, spreading pressure and making it harder for the killer to do anything. Try having more than one person work together if you need to clutch a generator. You will want to spread out especially if you are running repressed alliance.
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@Artick said:
No, it can not. The perk needs to be charged for way too long.
Yes, it can. The perk does take a long time to get working but it can help. Like I said, I know it is not the best perk but it is an option for people who don't have much else.
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Idk man, I have had BS like that happen to me as well. you could hook the entire team and still get DS'd because it is an anti-tunnel perk. Also, the devs apparently think DS is fine since they seem to keep ignoring it.
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Survivors are far more powerful than killers atm
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@Terro said:
is it really worth the perk slot? It protects for 30 seconds aka 15 seconds from ruin. U need to have already been repairing a gen for 60 seconds, which means within that 20 seconds before you finish the gen you need to be chased off it. You can only really use it twice a match unless your team really sucks at gens, which generally means repressed Alliance probably won't be worth much. It definitely has its use but it seems really situational.
I know this, I am just saying that this perk can be an option if you don't have much of other perks.