Laluzi
Laluzi
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- Laluzi
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I might start lobby dodging keys even though I didn't care about them before as a form of protest. Who knows, if enough killers do it that it becomes a problem, maybe BHVR will actually do something about keys.
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I'd also like to note that beyond keys, this messes with the effect of Franklin's by altering survivor behavior. You could use the perk as bait because survivors would want to retrieve their items even if they couldn't reliably use them, because they wanted to escape with them and keep them for the next game. Survivors would frequently return to drop spots as soon as a chase was over, after they got unhooked, or even stop to pick up the item right after you hit them, giving the killer an easy second hit. Franklin's Demise was a perk that played off of greed.
By removing the threat of the item permanently vanishing, survivors aren't pressured to retrieve their item. They can grab it at the end of the game if they're still around. You'll still see some survivors picking up their unused purple medkit or flashlight ASAP, but for the most part, survivors are going to be much more comfortable leaving their item behind if they can still walk out with it.
If you made no effort to guard items with Franklin's before, this is a buff, because you'll get more return out of the perk for each hit. A player who takes 30s to retrieve their medkit now has 1/3 of their charges gone, where before, they'd just get the item back. So that's nice for killers who aren't Hag/Trapper. But in return, survivors are going to waste less time running across the map to pick up their items, and there's no ability to guard a key into unusability, which was what a significant portion of players if not most of them ran it for.
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@Science_Guy said:
The faux outrage right on cue is adorable as usual.
As if you all even used Franklin's.
As if Survivors didn't just drop their key in a safe spot on the rare chance someone DID bring Franklin's.
Just another day in forum.dbd.
I didn't use Franklin's as a killer out of sheer ambivalence, but as a survivor, if I brought a key for a challenge/to clean out a character before prestige, 3 in 4 games saw the killer put on Franklin's. Same if someone else in the lobby brought a key. I'd immediately unequip my item unless it was a toolbox; there was no point.
Do you honestly not see the problem with giving killers zero ability to counter to the item that lets survivors win the game early and can turn a guaranteed 3k, 4k without hatch, into a 1k3e? To the point where survivors no longer even have a need to do their own counterplay (because plenty of survivors were stupid enough to fall for it?) Like, this is why Moris got nerfed to where they are - there was nothing survivors could do to prevent the game being ended prematurely, just because the killer brought an item. Your blitheness is coming across just fine, but I'm left wanting for your logic on why this isn't worth getting bothered about.
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@Rizzo said:
The changes to Franklin's have been made because of the Vaccine with Nemesis, since a single use of Franklin's could destroy the Vaccine.
I'm going to be honest here... even if Nemesis brought Franklins to destroy the vaccines, so what? Nemesis isn't Plague. If the killer's strategy is to keep everyone sick... that doesn't really change very much for anyone. People were perfectly comfortable never vaccinating in the PTB and I doubt that's going to change even though the main incentive to ignore vaccines was removed. It buys them an extra hit on Nemesis's M2 and allows them to do long-term stealth. That's all. Most killers only take two hits to down you and other killers have built in stealth denial. The game is perfectly playable without it.
This choice has much farther-reaching consequences than preventing a strategy on a certain killer. I'm with everyone else saying an exception should have been made for vaccines rather than changing how the perk itself works. This just killed the only counterplay to the most despised and uncounterable survivor item in the game. If killers don't want the survivors to disappear once they whip out their 3-gen, they have to dodge the lobby.
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@BlueFang said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2272297#Comment_2272297
Are you really gonna let a single item dictate what you play and any enjoyment you can get out of the game? That's just being overdramatic
Most gens get done in the early game; the killer's pressure comes in the late game, with less of an area to patrol and the survivors already scrambling to recuperate from the killer's damage across the team.
Keys let survivors nope out when the killer's setup is finally paying off, and the last remaining counter besides just dodging the lobby got removed.
Like I personally don't care about 4ks or the survivors escaping unless I'm going for an achievement, but you see how this is a problem, right?
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@Mandy said:
Franklins was mostly changed due to Nemesis. With the vaccine being a single use, Franklins effectively destroyed the vaccine completely.
But vaccination isn't even that significant? It's not like Plague; being sick against Nemesis does not have significant downsides beyond the inability to stealth indefinitely (which other killers already have in their basekit, so the removal of the option isn't anything new.) The dominant strategy in the PTB was just to stay sick and ignore it, because it actually denied Nemesis more of his power. Even though that's been fixed in the live update, survivors still aren't hurting very much from remaining sick. They can heal, Nemesis still takes two hits to down them.
This has much farther-reaching consequences than cutting off a strategy to one killer that wouldn't even be that impactful in the games it was employed. If this was seriously a concern, the team could have made it so that vaccines were unaffected by Franklins and weren't dropped. This just destroyed the only counter to the most broken survivor item in the game. Killers either have to accept that all remaining survivors can up and leave the game early, or dodge the lobby. There's nothing else.
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I love what they did to Nemesis's perks and I'm very glad they listened to feedback on the cooldowns, but seriously? Franklins nerf while still doing nothing to stop keys? I never ran Franklins, but this is absurd. Meanwhile moris in their current state are still 'toxic' or whatever the hell.
Seems like they didn't fix zombies' lack of collision when hitting survivors either, so getting stuck in a corner with a zombie is still an unsalvageable situation.
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@Crowman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2272265#Comment_2272265
Lifeguard Whistle got nerfed as well. It now also reduces the detection range of killer instinct from survivors near portals.
Uuugh, really? Guess we can't have nice things.
Poor Demo. They're terrified to let the doggo escape mediocrity.
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I'm not that worried about Lethal Pursuer, but I am bringing Lightborn as a QOL until people get tired of the flashbangs and blast mines. The PTB was something else.
I feel like Distortion isn't that useful beyond telling you the killer is down a perk slot for the rest of the game, because survivors frequently spawn in groups, and the killer is going to see anyone near you. If you spawn next to anyone else, you're gonna have to get into a locker. Plus, the killer's going to get into a chase with someone early, and that's all they really need - doesn't matter if it's you or someone else.
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I'm very happy with the gameplay, though some maps and powers definitely need to be looked at and I don't hold out much hope that many of them will ever be addressed, much less in a timely fashion. The game also stutters for me when someone Dead Hards or when I gain Bloodlust, and this is pretty obnoxious and causes me to miss hits. Plus, grabs. Grabs are terrible. Still, these don't break my enjoyment by themselves.
Every single bit of dissatisfaction I get out of this game, and every time I want to turn it off, is the fault of the players, not the game itself. Tons of pointlessly nasty people out there.
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@FrndlyChnswSalzmn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2270981#Comment_2270981
You're not a Killer main. You're a carebear disguised as a Killer; one of those 'I am better because I handicap myself to be a dancing monkey' types. You are dismissed.
And you're gatekeeping how people are allowed to play the game by dismissing everyone who doesn't sweat for the victory. Not everyone is hyper-competitive and desires the ultimate win condition at all costs. That doesn't make them a less valid player than you. Different people have different ideas of fun, and if you're not playing a game for your own enjoyment, then what are you doing?
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@sulaiman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2271696#Comment_2271696
Come on, noone can do it like bubba. No blocking the killer while someone else unhooks, no tanking hits, and if he instadowns, he downs all, not just one. What other killer can do that?
Plague can do it. Corrupt Purge shoots through survivors and can't be bodyblocked. If she hooks someone and grabs a fountain, good luck.
Oni can do it. Demon Strike has an AOE and he can hold his power indefinitely, then smash the unhooker and the unhooked player all in one.
Pyramid Head can do it if he injures the rescuer on the way to the hook, but either way, he doesn't care about being bodyblocked.
Bubba's got it the easiest, because he's got the fewest conditions on using his power and the widest range combined, but he's not unique in his ability to camp people to death and it'd be pretty hard to remove this ability without neutering his gameplay otherwise - when he's a pretty balanced killer to face in all other regards.
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I haven't experienced this, but twice in the past month I've encountered a Huntress that had no lullaby, so I'm not surprised. And I think I recall someone posting recently about a Blight that had no TR at any point in the match. Might be some kind of fiddly sound bug going around.
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If that bothers you, never try survivor challenges. Most of them take several games to complete. Cleanse 20 totems, repair 10 generators... then you've got ones that want you to stun or blind the killer half a dozen times, when most killers will wisen up to your tactics and start respecting the hell out of pallets or looking away after the first one, and some killers aren't even worth trying to blind or stun because they have some kind of pallet play that will gank you if you try.
I play both sides about equally and I have almost every killer challenge done, the only ones remaining being ones I don't particularly want to do or don't have the character unlocked for. Survivor archives have way more remaining just because their challenges take longer.
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I don't like Badham at all - way too many pallets and good structures, as you say, lots of walls that hinder map traversal, gens are extremely spread out, and the variations add absolutely nothing except to confuse your perceptions of the layout - but most of Badham's breakable walls aren't really in your interest to break? It's easier to catch survivors in or around the preschool when all the walls are up. Mainly you'd break the walls if you downed someone in the basement and needed to reach a hook, or if you were coming in from the side and desperately needed to reach the basement gen. (Which is a major issue with the map - downing someone in the main building, if the basement spawns in shack, is utter hell. There should be a hook in the basement, like with the Temple of Purgation.)
The only walls that the killer needs to break are if they spawn in the two-story house or the house of pain next to a window, and those are both RNG. Sometimes you even get a dead end wall in the middle of the house of pain that survivors never expect and run straight into.
But yeah, Badham's one of my least favorite maps, but doesn't make the cut for my most hated. It's very unpleasant to play, but it's not as soul-crushing as seeing a Jigsaw Piece or a Strode Realty Key in the loadout.
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Shelter Woods is probably the worst map in my books. There are at least things I can admire about Haddonfield, The Game, Coldwind, etc; even if I think their gameplay is frustrating, they have incredible aesthetics, or a solid concept, or something creative that makes playing on them distinct. Shelter Woods is just... a combination of bad playability and profound laziness. There's nothing to this map. Just a ton of dead zones with the same trees and copy-pasted structures. Wrecker's Yard and Rotten Fields are also very bad maps nearly on par with its awfulness - without a main building, there isn't much reason for them to exist compared to their brother maps - but Rotten Fields at least offers survivors somewhere to hide in its giant dead zone and Wrecker's Yard doesn't have the same cross-map visibility to complement its lack of pallets.
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@Habaneropeppah said:
Wow, so many terrific responses. I really appreciate it. Here are some things I have already done:
- Changed my expectation from entirely ditching the killer to distracting the killer to buy time.
- Considering the perks that I have access to, which will help me be more aware of where the killer is, or to help me be more elusive.
- Become more active in getting gens or helping teammates when they take a fall or hook from the killer.
- Watch YouTube videos of how good survivors work, and what the game looks like from the killers perspective.
Some things I havent done yet:
- Play as the killer. Its till pretty intimidating to consider playing this role honestly. I could probably get a couple survivors, but I really don't think I could try to prevent them from doing all the gens and escaping.
- Voice chat while playing. I feel like I am so panick'd and focus on doing skill checks or avoiding the killer, that its super hard for me to have useful communication while I am playing.
Trust me - I was terrified of playing killer at first too. Everything I'd seen on youtube told me it was the harder role and I felt like it'd be immensely stressful. I didn't want to touch it because it felt like there'd be too much pressure on me.
There's two nice things about playing killer for the first time.
1.) You'll be in grey ranks. Grey rank survivors are just as confused as you are and you'll have plenty of time to feel out the basics, and they haven't learned to be toxic yet, so they won't be doing stressful things like tbagging you, relentlessly trying to get your attention, or looping you in ways where you just cannot catch them. They'll be scared and hiding instead of doing gens much, so the game isn't on a tight time crunch; you'll be missing your swings as you figure out the distance you should be hitting survivors at, but those survivors are going to be running around blindly without any idea of where they should go, so your mistakes won't matter much in the grand scheme of things.
2.) It is a massive boost to how you play as a survivor, once you familiarize yourself with what the killer sees, how they think, etc. I can't stress enough how much it improves your game to play the other side. The same is true for people who only play killer; playing survivor makes it easier to guess where survivors will be and what ways they'll run (so you learn to cut them off.)
Don't focus on getting a 4k the first time you play killer. If it happens, it happens, but your main goal is just to map out how to play. Unless matchmaking flubs up and gives you a high rank squad with a smurf account meant to fish out new killers, you'll do better than you think you will.
(Anyway, with the perks you have available at the start of the game - definitely invest in Jake's Iron Will. It's one of the best stealth perks even at high level play; being silent while injured makes you much harder to track and makes hiding a possibility no matter your health state. Sprint Burst can also be nice to buy a lot of time cheap, and sometimes discourages the killer from following you if you were working on a gen and suddenly shot off into the stratosphere. Some killers will just kick the gen and move on.)
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I take the same approach to the game, and try to give everyone a shot to play the game, and really, there's no reason to humor a hook vulture. If they're hiding and you found them, they didn't do a good job. If they're blatantly following you, they're playing bold; see if they've got the skill to back it up. It's not like you're dooming the player on the hook. Someone else will come for the save when you chase them away, and that's what you want; it'll remove someone from a gen.
The only creed I hold myself to is not to go after a survivor who just got unhooked in front of me. Nobody's forcing me to, but it's not their fault their teammate's brimming with meg brain energy or is relentlessly farming anyone they can get their hands on. I'd rather punish the player making stupid plays than the one on the receiving end.
Any sense of mercy I have goes straight out the window when they get in my way and force me to take their BT, though. Same when I give a chance to an unhooked player and they follow me around begging me to eat their DS. They can enjoy the view from the floor.
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I think so. He's the most generically themed of the killers, and it'd be a real shame for the default chase music to disappear entirely.
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I love how they shared what the bug was. You know that the people at the office had a good 'seriously!?!' coding moment over this when they found it.
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@Sadsnacks said:
As killer it's either getting deviousness points (making use of my power and catching survivors off guard), like seeing people run into my traps as trapper. But I also enjoy goofing off with survivors. Playing clown with only the yellow potion and just spamming it for direct hits nonstop with the no perks or addons except for the party bottle. As doctor just spamming the shock on one person over and over and doing nothing else.
As trapper I'll bring two bag add ons and then gather all of my traps into one central location (killer shack for example) and lure survivors there. Then watch what shenanigans ensue. Spamming plagues vomit is fun too.
As survivor I enjoy holding Victor hostage for as long as possible. Booping the snoot. I enjoy dropping pallets in front of the doctor so I can spin in circles screaming while he shocks me from a safe distance.
I don't need to "win" to have fun. Either shenanigans or moments of skill paying off are what I play for.
You sound like my kind of player. I've done birthday party Clown before; Trapper minefield sounds like a ton of fun and I'll try that one out. In return, may I suggest Get Off My Lawn Hag? Take Disfigured Ear and place all of your traps in shack/main building/a high traffic area, or on a map like Lery's/Midwich, in a straight line through a corridor. Then laugh hysterically when a survivor runs through the hell zone. Maybe save 2-3 traps for normal gameplay and relocate your death house after it gets cleared to keep survivors on their toes.
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I'm really looking forward to playing against a bunch of Nemeses. I'm really not looking forward to playing on a bunch of police stations. That map... I'm cherishing my last day without it in the game.
Also, I'll be taking Lightborn until the flashbang/blast mine frenzy dies down. Or maybe Iron Maiden if I'm feeling spicy.
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@Sypherpathic said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2270357#Comment_2270357
I wonder if some solution like... slower gen progress for more hooks or inability to do certain things for being hooked more would be something interesting. So the survivors don't die, exactly, just see a diminishing return for play... maybe unless they do so in a co-ordinated fashion with less-hooked survivors.
It'd be pretty strange to have a slasher game where the killer can't actually kill anyone...
I think that if you were to do this and hooks still remained a meaningful way for the killer to make progress, you would ultimately have the same result - a player who gets 'tunneled' under this system would still be around, but their ability to contribute to the team was nerfed so hard so early that they may as well be dead and in the next game, because they're mostly dead weight in this one. All you could really do is have chases and stall the killer, and killers aren't going to target players who can barely touch gens when they could be chasing someone who's still a threat to them.
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I have the most fun when I'm able to interact meaningfully with the other players - especially in unexpectedly friendly or camaraderie-laden ways - and when I neither dominate nor get dominated. I like having to put effort in to get results; I don't like when my effort doesn't pay off and I don't like when I get results without effort, because then there's very little engagement for me. I may be a weirdo for this, but I despise getting 4ks unless it's a situation where I stopped the last survivors at the gates, or caught a final gen at the cusp of popping. A 4k at 3+ gens remaining is just depressing. I also feel bad about 4-man escapes when the killer got <=4 hooks.
As survivor, this means not getting removed from the game immediately, having chases where I manage to stall the killer, getting some difficult objectives done or enabling their completion, and rescuing a teammate (as in bodyblocking, luring the killer away from them, or a smart BT save, not just routine safe unhooks in a dark corner of the map.) I'm happy when I get to make meaningful contributions that any bot with a mouse key couldn't have accomplished. As a killer, this means mindgaming and successful predictions, having chases that last some time but don't stretch upwards of a minute, not getting significantly outplayed, having the opportunity to be merciful and acknowledge funny moments, and not having the survivors blatantly screw with me. When survivors BM me, any fun I'm having immediately vanishes, because I want to have fun with other people, not be the targeted source of entertainment. At that point I'm no longer playing casually and instead playing to punish, which isn't an enjoyable state for me even when I get what I want.
I enjoy befriending survivors as killer because it's just so incongruous and adorable - something about the lack of clear communication resulting in awkward pantomime between the short people and the tall murder beast. The subversion of the rules really charms me, but I want to play the game to the fullest extent I can before doing so. So if I'm winning too hard, one of my favorite things to do is to start ######### with people (in ways that are confusing but not cruel) and see how they react - like slugging survivors, picking them up and dropping them in a pile, and then leaving so someone else can pick them all up, or following one survivor without attacking them and seeing how long it takes them to stop running.
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I love reading the stories behind the characters, though the arcus/Observer stories are too disjoint and abstract for my taste and I'm not very interested in them. I'm more interested in the Fog as a world the characters dynamically inhabit than I am it as a cosmic multiversal murder soup.
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@Alice_pbg said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2270206#Comment_2270206
I don't think it's fun either. but we both know some people would jump head first at the opportunity
Plus there's people who would do it to clean up achievements and rift challenges even if they didn't particularly enjoy beating up rank 20s. I know I jumped at the MMR to grab Adept Nurse because there was no way in hell I'd be able to get it normally.
I did notice I got absolute potatoes when I played a Billy match during MMR, but I thought that was because I barely play him and I'm terrible when I do. Interesting to know there was an actual bug there.
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@Dito175 said:
Deja vu, premonition, no one left behind, monstrous shrine, unrelenting, this is not happening, resilience and all wraiths perks. Not really sure on the effects though
I agree on most of the rest, but Deja Vu is actually good. Not meta good, but it identifies the killer's best 3-gen so you can go and break it in advance.
And I have no idea why you'd want to change Resilience. It's a very viable perk.
Anyway, echoing that Distortion needs a way to regain tokens (right now it's only useful as a killer perk identifier, not a stealth perk on its own.) Up the Ante needs a full rework with some new effect, because Luck is useless. Solidarity and Autodidact should work with medkits. No One Left Behind needs the open gates condition removed, as the addition of the Endgame Collapse has made this worthless - instead it should be when the exit gates are powered.
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Ditching the killer is pretty dependent on the killer themselves - some are going to be more committed than others, and some are going to be easier to pull visual tricks on than others. The important thing to know is that you leave bright red scratchmarks while running and the killer can see these or hear your sounds, especially when you're injured. So as long as you run, the killer can see where you've been... unless you make your scratch marks themselves confusing, like running in a complete loop around a walled structure, then doubling back the way you came or walking around a corner and slipping away. As long as the killer doesn't physically see you leave, they'll likely keep chasing the scratch marks in a circle for a while.
That takes some practice, though. You can run perks like Deception, Quick and Quiet, Lucky Break, or Dance With Me as things to trick the killer mid-chase by hiding your scratch marks or giving the wrong cue. Some maps have thicker, darker foliage than others, and you can quickly disappear into it if you've broken LOS and your scratch marks won't give you away (so you didn't run straight up to the bush and stop.) Yamaoka maps, Swamp, and Dead Dawg have the most impenetrable bushes. The other thing you can do is make it not worth it to chase you. To do this, you need to show that you can loop the killer for a bit; keep looking behind you so that you can predict what they're about to do and cut off their mindgames. The big way to lose a killer is to move to a very strong tile - shack is the best one - and if they can't catch you immediately, they may decide this chase isn't worth their time and leave. However, very new killers won't understand that they can't chase a player forever and need to check on gens, and this may not work - though they're also the killers you can loop the longest.
Keep in mind that if you've lost a killer by getting into a locker/a bush/etc, you may to need to move around and switch hiding spots. If they give up and leave, you're cool, but if a killer starts checking every hiding spot in the area, they're going to find you eventually - you have to switch for a spot they've already checked (be very careful with lockers, exiting and entering produces a distinctive sound cue that nearby killers will hear) or try and slip away from the area while they're searching the wrong spot.
Also be warned that experienced killers are going to know the most likely hiding spots and check them on principle. Sometimes crouching behind a big rock and just moving to avoid the killer's line of sight is smarter than hiding in that tiny corner behind the door.
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@Sadsnacks said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2268776#Comment_2268776
Again, i wasnt suggesting it as an actual mechanic. I just wanted peoples thoughts and opinions on which killers would be purple, yellow, brown etc
As a survivor which version of such an offering would be purple to you?
Depends if we're going the 'higher rarity is a new/licensed killer' or the 'higher rarity is an actually rarer killer to encounter' mentality. ("Higher rarity is a killer survivors want to face" is a thought, but addon rarity has a poor correlation with actually being useful, so...)
The vanilla answer is that Nemesis/PH/Myers/etc are purples while Wraith/Billy/Trapper are browns, but the big brain take is that Billy's a damn iridescent at this point. Spirit is naturally a brown, as are Bubbas and Wraiths. Plague, Twins, Trickster, and and Hag are purples. Doc and Oni are some of the greens, while Deathslinger is one of the yellows.
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Couldn't work as an offering unless it actually switched the killer player in your lobby's killer, like a splinter that got forced onto them. And that would be extremely hated for reasons I hardly need to explain.
All the reasons this is a bad idea aside, I really like the uncertainty at the start of each match. It's tactically useful for many killers not to have themselves known yet (Legion wants everyone to group up, Ghostface and Myers want easy stalks, Wraith and Pig want to surprise someone, Hag wants to set up traps in peace, etc) and just more tense on the survivor side not to know your enemy from the get-go.
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I'm guessing not. They're characters, which maps have never tracked, and they're classified as 'special enemies' rather than traps.
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Getting a hit and having a pallet dropped on me/in front of me at the same time is the most helpful situation for a pallet drop. I already got what I wanted and the survivor already makes distance without the pallet (or is on the ground, and I have plenty of time to break the pallet.)
Blood Favor should be more useful at shutting down the next tile the survivor goes to. Its range needs to be larger.
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@ill_Boston_lli said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2268323#Comment_2268323
either or imo. I just think it should be equal between the two roles.
I'd really hate the double pip requirement on survivor because it would even more reliant on how other players play than killer adepts are. Killers are at the mercy of survivor choices, yes, but they're the only person on their team and they can define their strategy from the start. Survivors are competing with not just the killer, but each other, for points. Getting 3 or 4 iri emblems is asking a lot.
Benevolent: The easiest iridescent emblem, because you get points for all heals the team does (except self-heals), not just ones you perform yourself. Games against slugging killers or hit and run killers will get tons of benevolent points for free and you may not need to perform any unhooks. Still, if your teammates aren't healing much or you're against a killer that discourages healing for any reason, you're reliant on safe unhooks for points - of which there's a max of 6 that you can access in any match, and 3 teammates vying for each one. Grasp rescues also give massive points, though they're very reliant on the killer's awareness and not a reliable method. A camping killer can immediately prevent all survivors from accessing this emblem.
Evader: Requires you to either loaf around in the killer's terror radius for a disgusting amount of time, or escape from several very lengthy chases. Very easy to incidentally get on compact two-story maps where you'll spend lots of time in the TR while the killer is busy with someone on a different floor, otherwise a very involved process.
Lightbringer: Repair the equivalent of ~2 1/2 gens. Dull totems provide 7/100 points each, hex totems provide 18/100, exit gates provide 5/100 each, looping while other teammates do gens gives you a max of 30/100. All of these things are in limited supply, so if you spend too much time on a hook and your teammates slam gens while you're out of commission, or the killer insists on chasing you for a very long time, this can become impossible. Much easier with ruin/gen regression perks on the killer's side.
Unbroken: The hardest iridescent emblem for survivors. You only get it if you don't go down at any point in the match.
The problem with getting all of these in one game is that you generally do not have enough time to extensively perform all of these roles within the space of a single match. Survivors act as a team - your gameplay is going to be very reactive on what roles need to be filled at any given time, and how the killer interacts with you. You're not going to pull it off if one teammate is hogging all the unhooks, or if another teammate is taking the killer on a merry ride for most of the gens. Benevolent is the easiest emblem to max because it for some reason takes into account the whole team's performance, not just yours, so you don't actually have to do it if your teammates are healing each other enough - but no matter what, you need to spend a ton of time looping or stealthing next to the killer and do several gens. And you're also boned if you go down at any point, which you can't really avoid unless there's a large skill disparity between you and the killer. The only reliable way to not go down is to not interact with the killer, and then you're not going to get your Evader emblem.
Killers will generally get all four iri emblems if they have a 10+ hook game, nobody escapes, and there wasn't excessive instadowning or chases with survivors that were already injured. Killers also have the ability to farm survivors a bit in a winning game if they don't think they've satisfied Chaser requirements, or want to ensure that several survivors end up on death hook before they kill any of them to manage Devout. Survivors can't do the equivalent unless they're in a SWF, because they can't control what their teammates are up to and how they'll use the limited resources in each game. And then they're still at the mercy of whatever the killer does.
Tl;dr, the killer adept situation is bad, but the same structure on survivor adepts would be even worse.
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Weren't killer adepts 4ks originally, and changed because moris made that way too easy? Because moris have no effect on the speed or ease of removing survivors anymore, and it's a well-beaten ex-horse by now why the emblem system is so terrible for this purpose. It's more punishing to players at higher ranks, it forces the killer to humor survivors and let them go and regroup if they're winning too quickly, it limits how much certain killers are allowed to use their power, and it punishes the killer for how survivors play - you'll lose out on emblem points if survivors don't unhook each other, or never heal, or slam gens at the start of the match even if you manage to stop them in time.
4ks are a much simpler, cleaner solution. It should be changed back to be more on par with survivor adepts.
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I don't like situational perks that will only have an effect if the killer's using a certain strategy. I never ran DS outside of Adept Laurie or a few old rift challenges that required me to be the obsession. I'd personally prefer to run Unbreakable if I had to pick one, since it has wider use. DS won't stop me from getting tunneled out of the game in most cases anyway; it'll just take a few loops longer, unless there's somebody right next to me waiting to take the heat and the killer isn't dead set on eliminating my ass in particular.
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It's pretty nice. I'm not sure it's worth a perk slot to 1.5x your Bond, but it provides great information. Could be part of a fun meme build.
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Okay, that's hilarious. It'd be even better if Huntress was one of the killers whose M2 hides Devour Hope, but still, the sheer big-brained unpredictability of the whole thing is amazing. It probably works as well as it does because pallet play is very different against a Huntress than an M1 killer, so most people will keep running and wildly juking instead of dropping pallets and holding W, especially towards the start.
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@humanbeing1704 said:
A lot of people don't know what no mither does besides hue hue perma injured I've went against plenty of killers who think slugging me is fine when I'm a no mither lol
Sometimes they slug you because of No Mither. It's just entertaining to watch. No Mither gamers are a riot (and I'll be nice to any Davids I see running it in case they're trying to get the adept.)
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@Phasmamain said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2267386#Comment_2267386
Barb’s glasses and black heart make him quite good tbh. Rat liver wasn’t even necessary before imo it just felt nice to have on
Yeah, he has some nice addons (those two are major QOLs when playing him and feel really smooth, Lifeguard Whistle is brilliant, and both of his iris became pretty good), but a couple of other ones were inexplicably nerfed, most of his purples are still useless, and the changes to his basekit were largely pointless until they buffed his base shred movement speed. The teleportation cooldown will very rarely make a difference with how Demo plays, and increasing his Undetectable by one second fails to understand why that Undetectable is virtually useless on Demo. It's like Bone Clapper Wraith if the Wraith wasn't invisible, could only lunge in a perfectly straight line, and had huge stompy feet.
I don't know, it largely felt like his rework didn't understand what was actually wanted with him until they made retroactive changes. No addon pass is ever going to be as horrible as Billy's, BHVR willing, and I'm very glad that Demo's addons were a net improvement, but it's not one where I give them points for understanding community feedback beforehand.
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@MadLordJack said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2267166#Comment_2267166
They haven't said anything because they really don't give a crap. Just look at the reasons for overheat, when it first came to live everyone praised it because it did nothing but prevent facecamping. Then the Devs said they wanted it to be more impactful and set it to somewhere between PTB and live release Overheat. Why? Because they wanted to throw a bone to the person who developed it.
They have a history of just not giving a crap once people stop complaining about how OP a killer is. Look at Legion, or Pyramid Head. No changes at all despite the complaints, because PH isn't played much after they made his playstyle require some basic effort, and Legion hasn't been changed since they made Forever Legion go away and buffed their movement speed (except for how they recently made Forever Legion come back because BHVR Logic).
Personally, I'm just glad that Demogorgon and Huntress didn't get the same treatment, and it really does feel like they're learning what makes the community riot.
To be honest, I'm not sure they're learning what makes the community riot. Learning to react to community rioting, maybe. Yes, they walked back the rat liver nerf on Demo, but that was because everyone started screaming bloody murder about it - the fact that they ever thought that was a good idea shows they didn't have a finger on the pulse of player feedback, because the necessity of rat liver was the single loudest and most consistent piece of feedback Demo ever got. Plus most of Demo's tweaks didn't really address his problems - he got some nice addons and he's better off than before, largely because of basekit shred speed, but he has the same problems with giving too much information to survivors. And the iri head change wasn't one that anyone was really asking for or satisfied with, beyond the relief that iribelt is no longer a thing.
I'm pretty sure they know they ######### up with Billy, but don't want to address it because there's other killers they'd rather get to on their schedule and they don't know how to balance it anyway. I doubt they understand what's wrong with his addons.
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I think increasing the stacks on WGLF would encourage stupid behavior - bad unhooks and taking protection hits for no reason (ie running up to the killer while they're carrying someone, then running off.) I would rather see WGLF stay a 100% bonus but have full heals on other survivors, or at least heals out of the dying state, count for stacks. I'd also like to see more perks that offer 100% bonus bloodpoints through different ways, so these two perks aren't their own sort of mandatory, but don't stack with each other.
I think BBQ is fine as it is. It gives great bloodpoints already, and getting 12 hooks is actually pretty difficult because survivors often skip hook states via suicides or leaving each other to die. Plus that doesn't actually discourage tunneling in any way. If you get the first guy out of the game ASAP, you can get the other 9 hook stages at your leisure.
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I seriously hope so. Killers getting their own themes is probably my biggest wish at this point. Really want Plague, Spirit, Hag, Huntress, and Wraith especially, but any new addition to the ranks is good news in my books.
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Prove Thyself, We'll Make It, Kindred, and Small Game/Borrowed Time. Sometimes Sprint Burst if I'm feeling spicy.
Mostly I just like to be a helpful teammate. I'm not great at looping, but I'll rescue you safely and either patch you up or take a hit if the killer unexpectedly comes back, I'll find hexes or note dull totem spots, and I will crunch the ######### out of that last contested gen.
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@FrenziedRoach said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2265391#Comment_2265391
If taking a moment to break a god loop destroys the game for you, then you aren't as good as a killer as you think you are.
We are not so strapped for time against most of the playerbase that this is going to be a make or break mechanic for most of the games we play. You are blowing this out of proportion.
When did I ever say that? You're projecting. Losing an extra tile in a chase or giving the survivors 20s of free gens at the start doesn't break the game. Killers still play just fine. That doesn't make it not irritating and something I wish I didn't have to put up with, and not something that enriches the game in any way.
Most things that people want changed aren't make or break. Moris were and keys are, but even then, the game still plugs along with them.
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@FrenziedRoach said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2265325#Comment_2265325
Less than 3 seconds. 2.6 to be exact. My mistake for making estimations without looking it up and using the word "Literally". I'll own that.
But still, a minor inconvenience we have to deal with so that most of the survivor base (which, lets be honest, is BAD) can have a breather. Because let's face it, the game NEEDS strong loops for the weaker survivors. But we can't let these loops be permanent. This is the best compromise we have.
People need to stop listening to certain streamers that prattle on about "high level play" and look at the big picture.
I'm not talking about the time it takes to perform the animation. I'm talking about the time you take to go to that location near the start of the match instead of starting the gen hunt, or the distance a survivor makes towards the next tile and how much longer they can loop you for if you didn't neutralize the threat early. 2.6 seconds in a chase is only 2.6 seconds if the survivor stands perfectly still. The only case where a breakable wall actually only takes 2.6 seconds is when you take the risk, don't find anyone that runs to the strong loop area, and patrol the breakable wall spot for the first time when there are no survivors nearby. Then yes, it's just a few seconds to approach the wall and break it.
It's bad design. Breakable walls rarely fall into a happy medium of being something the killer might want up in some situations and might want down in others. 95% of the time, they're something that has to be removed immediately or should never be touched.
I've never watched any video on the subject. My opinion on them being a PITA is wholly from my own gameplay.
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They're either pointless, or a chore the killer has to perform because they enable a broken loop that shouldn't have been implemented. In most cases they've been used, they're not an interactive mechanic.
@FrenziedRoach said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2265306#Comment_2265306
It's literally 2 seconds out of your match to break a breakable wall. A temporary inconvenience that is being blown out of proportion.
It's way more than two seconds. Either you go out of your way to break the wall early, which can be a significant detour, or you risk your first time encountering that wall being in a chase, and the survivor makes significant distance on you while you're stuck breaking it - which ends up being more than two seconds lost unless the survivor really mucks it up.
There are some maps with breakable walls that feel like an actual choice - mainly Badham and Saloon (though Saloon has 3 god loop walls that are mandatory breaks, too, and plenty more you shouldn't be touching.) But for the most part, they're either things you'd rarely/never want to break, or things that shouldn't be there in the first place and you have to go out of your way to break them to be able to play the map.
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Something that's pretty important to remember when playing survivor is that the killer trying to push you out of the game early - tunneling off hook, ceaseless proxy camping - doesn't mean the killer is angry at you, or hates you. It could mean that, but it also coincides with what killers do to increase their chances of victory down the line.
Unless the killer is kebabing you, or nodding, or tbagging, you can't really distinguish playing to win from playing to grief. And yeah, it sucks hard to get tunneled out of the game at 5 gens because you're playing against someone who's insecure in their ability to win otherwise, but most of my games don't play out like that, even at red ranks.
There's also a fair amount of blame to be placed on teammates. If someone unhooks you and the terror radius immediately starts up after that, they should be prepared to take a hit for you. Again, it's true that some killers will doggedly ignore any bodyblockers because their aim is to remove a player ASAP, but most will take a free hit and then go after the target that's closest to them. Lack of hook aftercare is a bigger issue in solo queue for obvious reasons.
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Jill. Killer queues are going to be huge, so I may as well channel my inner sandwich, and I like her perks more than Leon's.
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I'd object on principle to making that little murder machine more lethal than he already is, but if you're asking for a way to disincentivize survivors from carrying him around for half a minute, yeah. That feels like an unintended interaction with the power and gives survivors more power over the killer than they should probably have.
That said, one of my biggest beefs with the Twins is that Charlotte regens Victor immediately no matter what happens to the little gremlin, and that this is the only case where she doesn't. Now, I think she should get him back quick in such a scenario because it's a successful play and doesn't deserve punishment, but her getting him back 5 seconds after he gets kicked is just ridiculous.
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I had pretty chill games on killer - outside of some killers I had no playtime on/perform abhorrently with, I was getting fairly average matches. On the weak side compared to usual, but not potatoes. Some stronger teams, but none of the red rank SWF total annihilation I'm used to. Though I took the opportunity to do some adepts, and I did notice that I'd get stronger teams after winning and easier teams after a 4E.
As a survivor, though, yeah. Every game was rainbow teammates, reds with greys basically every match, and it was a dice roll whether the killer was rank 2 or rank 19. No happy medium, just extremes in two directions. Relieved that's over; I wanted off Mr. Bones' Wild Ride.