IronWolf115
IronWolf115
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- IronWolf115
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I wasn't a fan of The Evil Within, but Boxman was really cool and I think he would fit DBD.
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Lol thank you friend!
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Yeah, this is good. It has a lot of the changes I wanted if he was just simply buffed rather than reworked.
I really think we are all on to something here, the more ideas we put up the better, maybe we need to mix some of our ideas together even!
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My work here is finished
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@Stormrunner7777 said:
@IronWolf115 I was playing as the SpiritAh ok, I usually play as Leatherface
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OH HELL NO, I did not just see my baby Bubba get insulted!
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@Dreamnomad said:
@IronWolf115 said:
Because you are not fixing the problems with Leatherface, most people look at his weaknesses like this:
No map pressure
Underwhelming, clunky ability
Terrible add-ons
No mind game potentialOne question. Precisely how does anything you are proposing help with any of these issues? Doesn't increase map pressure. You'd still be bumping into things and raging. No proposed change to add ons. No increase in mind games.
Firstly if you actually read my OP, I DO say that he needs his add-ons reworked, and it WOULD increase his mind game potential as the gens get done mainly because of his ability to move at full speed while revving his chainsaw, this would allow you to rev the saw around pallets and actually make the survivors drop the pallet sooner.
His ability would be FAR less clunky with these changes again because he would move at full speed while revving his saw, he would be a FAR more competent pallet destroyer, and his tantrum would be less impactful on him.
I intentionally didn't give him extra map pressure because we already have Billy for that, this is where LF weakness should lie.
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@HP150 said:
Honestly, I would settle just for him receiving an audio+visual cue when his chainsaw is fully charged (maybe a distinct grunt+the whitening of the sides of the screen like with what the Nurse has). There are times when you need to get the chainsaw off as soon as it comes up, but if the little bar in the bottom is just a pixel off you just set yourself back by a lot.Besides, staring at a tiny bar at the bottom of your screen while trying to keep up with a chase seems counter-intuitive. I've played him since release and STILL screw it up.
That would be a QoL change that I want also, but his buffs need to be beyond just that.
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@Dreamnomad said:
@IronWolf115 said:
Because you are not fixing the problems with Leatherface, most people look at his weaknesses like this:
No map pressure
Underwhelming, clunky ability
Terrible add-ons
No mind game potentialThis change would not solve any of these issues, would it perhaps be a slight help in certain instances? Perhaps, but not anywhere near the buffs that he needs.
A couple of quick counter points. Leatherface gives up his map pressure for being the only killer in the game that can put multiple survivors in the dying state with his ability. And btw, this is largely a misconception anyway. If Leatherface runs Pop Goes The Weasel and/or Overcharge and goes for a 3 gen strategy then he can effectively "shrink the map" and apply plenty of map pressure to the only place that matters.
As far as having an "underwhelming, clunky ability", I would disagree. I don't really like the phrase "git gud", but it feels appropriate here. If you learn where and when to use his ability in concert with what add ons are being used and it doesn't feel that way so much. I will concede that certain environmental objects have weird geometry in concerns to what constitutes bumping for his rage stun.
I will also concede that some of his add ons could use help. Anything that makes his chainsaw less noisy is pointless. They aren't particularly good for Hillbilly either, but at least you can get some surprise hits wit them. But survivors obviously already know if Leatherface is in chainsaw range. I do however like the add ons that reduce the charge time of the chainsaw and the add ons that increase his max charge speed coupled with chili.
I disagree with the "No mind game potential" for two reasons. One, for being a killer that isn't really designed around mind games he actually does have a few mind games to play. For example, when chasing a survivor around a small object so they can avoid the chainsaw Leatherface can double back and typically hit the survivor in the face with his chainsaw before they can react. There are also mind games to be played with lockers. Often survivors will run into them to avoid the chainsaw charge. But then you can play the "accidental" bump into the locker and often get the kill with the chainsaw stun rage attack.
With all that said, my second point would be that just like how Leatherface isn't meant to be the big map pressure killer, he's also not designed to be the big mind game killer. If that is your thing, there are many more killers more suited for mind games such as Spirit, Trapper, Hag, Nurse, etc. Every killer has their own little niche in the game. Leatherface is the guy who says "If I catch you in open ground, you are dead. Period. If I want you dead on the hook, no one will save you. Period." No other killer can really say that.
Ok, so to start, Leatherface can indeed put multiple survivors into the dying state. But the point I will keep making here is that almost exclusively the time you will do that is if you are camping a hook, which is the playstyle I am trying to move away from. In regards to the 3 gen strat you mention, I can kind of see where you are coming from but I also feel if that is the strategy you want to do, you are much better off picking Doctor or Hillbilly ( Doc for Madness, Billy for mobility ) not to mention that the 3 gen strat is FAR from guaranteed to happen by the end of the game.
His ability, I must say I don't like the phrase " git gud " either, because that is simply not the issue. I have over 700 hours on DBD, over half of that dedicated to LF. Ask anyone with even a remote sense of balance and they will tell you that LF ability, in a word, sucks. Why is this? Simple, it is a camping tool, again this is what I want to get away from.#
His add-ons are extremely bad, his charge time add-ons are pretty much the main useful thing for him, I would just mention to you that his Chilli add-ons are actually useless, they literally have almost no effect.
In regards to his mind game potential, the instance you mention about chainsawing around a small object is indeed a mind game, but this is not around pallets where mind games are of their most import. Take Hillbilly for example, at a pallet loop because he is not as harshly impacted by slower movement speed while he revs his saw, he can start to rev the saw with no intention of using it, just to try and bait the pallet down. Leatherface simply cannot do this because of the more severe penalty to his movement speed. With lockers, it isn't really a mind game, it is just if a survivor is dumb and tries to get into a locker while you are chainsawing, you will get them. Does he accomplish this better than other killers? Yes, but ultimately you won't see this happen enough for it to matter.
Finally, Leatherface not having map pressure or mind game potential is a massive issue, because that makes him a killer almost completely reliant on survivor mistakes, rather than clever plays by him ( because he can rarely do any ) You mention that he is a killer that if survivors are in the open, they are dead and that no other killers can say that, I have one word, Hillbilly. Far superior to LF because he has the same insta-down attack, but has great map pressure, much better mind game potential than LF and is able to be in control of the game far better than LF. So the main point here is that LF can camp really well, which puts us back at square one because this is just not a reliable playstyle, to hook someone and then just sit there waiting for them to die. I have no problem with camping, but a killer should not be FORCED to camp just to try and get anything done.
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Happens to me a lot.
May I ask what killer you were using?
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@TruEternity said:
First slugging will cause multiple people to be in a close vicinity in order get the res, which is required without unbreakable. Slugging was just an example, which you asked for one besides hook camping, which I gave. That was the point. Sorry you got lost.As for why the 1 gen buff is op, it makes pallets nonexistent. Moving at 115% while revving, not stopping once a pallet is chainsawed, gaining speed while chainsawing AND having a longer duration while chainsawing. In his base kit. No addons or perks required. That would be like giving the nurse NOED at 1 gen for nothing.
I’m kinda done, at this point you just want people to agree, with out any critique. On top of that this is pointless debate, it’s theory fighting on non existent buffs that will likely never happen any way. So peace I’m out.
Yeah, Goodbye
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Just a quick note to people reading this unfortunate argument I am currently having:
I would LOVE to receive constructive criticism, in fact I promote it. What I do not like is if you just say that my ideas are ridiculous and insult me.
By all means if you have concerns about my ideas ask me about it! I will respond!
Sorry to sound like I am laying down the law, I just want respectful discussion.
Thanks!
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@The_Fallen_Utopia said:
IronWolf115 said:@TruEternity said:
IronWolf115 said:
@TruEternity said:
* You want him to be able to go through pallets without stopping while chainsawing, on top of having a longer chainsaw time, and a faster rev up, and no penalty to movement speed while revving so it would be much stronger than Spirit fury ever could be.
* Slugging, bodyblocking a risky gen, it doesn’t happen often, but it can, and does.
* Yes you have to be very close, but with all the buffs you suggest, that would not be hard.Legit, all Killers are close range besides Huntress, you might have meant low mobility, but I digress. I do believe LF could use some love. For example make his revving walk speed 100%-105% and the Chili’s have a larger impact on his acceleration. I don’t feel him insta charging-sanic running-kool-aid manning pallets is the way to go. Do you not understand that he would only be able to go through pallets when there is only one gen left? Slugging has absolutely NO impact on whether he will hit multiple opponents with his saw, ANY killer can slug. Not to mention they are nerfing slugging next patch Getting close would still have it's challenges for one simple reason: I have proposed NO mobility buffs for him, you would still have to chase down survivors with no help from abilities like Nurse blinks or Billy's dash or Hags teleportation
So does every survivor run Unbreakable? No, so then how do they get back up? By being healed, wait for it, by another survivor. Also, ignoring his potential to prevent unhooks is silly, just pretending it isn’t a factor into balancing is short sighted.
I read the whole post, I just point out your 1 gen buffs because they’re unbelievably op, the rest are just as silly as well. You suggested a free add on pretty much every gen completed.I have another LF change in keeping with the movie; once the gates are powered if Leatherface doesn’t catch a victim within 30 seconds a truck pulls up and any remaining survivors can jump in and drive away.
At this point I don't even know what the hell point you are trying to make.
Firstly how the hell did we get into talking about Unbreakable? I simply said that slugging has no impact ON HIS ABILITY TO DOWN MULTIPLE PEOPLE AT ONCE.
Secondly I never EVER ignored his potential around unhooks. In fact in this post I even mention that ANY buff you do to Leatherface will make him even better at camping, that is unavoidable. These buffs are to promote NOT camping with him and making him a much better chaser
My 1 gen buff is insanely OP? How? You just have to complete the last generator and leave, yes Leatherface should be an extreme threat at that point. I have hardly proposed that he gets a blink ability like the Nurse which, just so you know, Nurse would still be better than LF even with these buffs but that is beside the point.
Finally yes, I want to make him act and play more like he is from the movie, why? Because he is a licensed killer, from a movie. Myers is great fun to play and I would like to see the other licensed killers reach his level at least.
Tbh even with that 1 gen effect he's still a weaker hillbilly, I don't see how these changes effect slugging either (slugging is getting nerfed anyway) and you're right in saying that he should feel more like he does in the movie. I wouldn't let these comments get to you. They are good changes and people aren't seeing it properly.
Thank you bud, I don't let it get to me. It is more baffling than angering lol
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@powerbats said:
@IronWolf115 said:
@grtf47 said:
What is slugging?It is where you as the killer down multiple survivors without hooking them. It is an effective way to apply pressure on survivors.
Usually weaker killers such as Freddy, Leatherface, pig etc gain some big benefits from slugging rather than just individual downs and hooks.
I see a lot of nurses and Billy's doing it all the time at rank 1 and 2 usually with knockout but then people realize it's happening and go to farthest corners of map to frustrate them.
Yeah I mainly try to do it with weaker killers, especially Leatherface but I know strong killers obviously do it more effectively.
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@TruEternity said:
IronWolf115 said:@TruEternity said:
You want him to be able to go through pallets without stopping while chainsawing, on top of having a longer chainsaw time, and a faster rev up, and no penalty to movement speed while revving so it would be much stronger than Spirit fury ever could be.
- Slugging, bodyblocking a risky gen, it doesn’t happen often, but it can, and does.
Yes you have to be very close, but with all the buffs you suggest, that would not be hard.
Legit, all Killers are close range besides Huntress, you might have meant low mobility, but I digress.
I do believe LF could use some love. For example make his revving walk speed 100%-105% and the Chili’s have a larger impact on his acceleration. I don’t feel him insta charging-sanic running-kool-aid manning pallets is the way to go.
Do you not understand that he would only be able to go through pallets when there is only one gen left?
Slugging has absolutely NO impact on whether he will hit multiple opponents with his saw, ANY killer can slug. Not to mention they are nerfing slugging next patch
Getting close would still have it's challenges for one simple reason: I have proposed NO mobility buffs for him, you would still have to chase down survivors with no help from abilities like Nurse blinks or Billy's dash or Hags teleportation
So does every survivor run Unbreakable? No, so then how do they get back up? By being healed, wait for it, by another survivor. Also, ignoring his potential to prevent unhooks is silly, just pretending it isn’t a factor into balancing is short sighted.
I read the whole post, I just point out your 1 gen buffs because they’re unbelievably op, the rest are just as silly as well. You suggested a free add on pretty much every gen completed.
I have another LF change in keeping with the movie; once the gates are powered if Leatherface doesn’t catch a victim within 30 seconds a truck pulls up and any remaining survivors can jump in and drive away.
At this point I don't even know what the hell point you are trying to make.
Firstly how the hell did we get into talking about Unbreakable? I simply said that slugging has no impact ON HIS ABILITY TO DOWN MULTIPLE PEOPLE AT ONCE.
Secondly I never EVER ignored his potential around unhooks. In fact in this post I even mention that ANY buff you do to Leatherface will make him even better at camping, that is unavoidable. These buffs are to promote NOT camping with him and making him a much better chaser
My 1 gen buff is insanely OP? How? You just have to complete the last generator and leave, yes Leatherface should be an extreme threat at that point. I have hardly proposed that he gets a blink ability like the Nurse which, just so you know, Nurse would still be better than LF even with these buffs but that is beside the point.
Finally yes, I want to make him act and play more like he is from the movie, why? Because he is a licensed killer, from a movie. Myers is great fun to play and I would like to see the other licensed killers reach his level at least.
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@Dreamnomad said:
@IronWolf115 said:
@Dreamnomad said:
This is all rather complex to add to his tool-tip. The only thing I really would like to see for Leatherface is whenever a pallet is dropped within 3 meters of him, his chainsaw charge time should be greatly reduced for a few seconds. This would substantially increase his pursuit ability. It's kind of like having a free brutal strength perk.The thing is though this would be almost obsolete on him, simply because skilled survivors know that Leatherface has no real mind game potential, so the main thing a LF would do in a situation with a pallet is to try and swing through it with his hammer, at which point he would be stunned anyway which slows the pursuit.
Not to mention his add-ons are trash
No. It really wouldn't be "obsolete" on him. Even if the pallet stun lands, he could quick charge his chainsaw and break the pallet faster than kicking. If a survivor messes up and drops a pallet on the wrong side, they are dead. Every time you are chasing someone and a pallet is dropped to stop you then you could break the pallet faster than kicking. How is that not a good thing?
Because you are not fixing the problems with Leatherface, most people look at his weaknesses like this:
No map pressure
Underwhelming, clunky ability
Terrible add-ons
No mind game potentialThis change would not solve any of these issues, would it perhaps be a slight help in certain instances? Perhaps, but not anywhere near the buffs that he needs.
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@Condorloco_26 said:
OP idea is a good one in my opinion. UpvotingThank you friend!
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@Dreamnomad said:
This is all rather complex to add to his tool-tip. The only thing I really would like to see for Leatherface is whenever a pallet is dropped within 3 meters of him, his chainsaw charge time should be greatly reduced for a few seconds. This would substantially increase his pursuit ability. It's kind of like having a free brutal strength perk.The thing is though this would be almost obsolete on him, simply because skilled survivors know that Leatherface has no real mind game potential, so the main thing a LF would do in a situation with a pallet is to try and swing through it with his hammer, at which point he would be stunned anyway which slows the pursuit.
Not to mention his add-ons are trash
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@Eninya said:
@IronWolf115 said:
@grtf47 said:
What is slugging?Usually weaker killers such as Freddy, Leatherface, pig etc gain some big benefits from slugging rather than just individual downs and hooks.
Pig doesn't slug unless she's camping, or she tunneled a single survivor to their death hook and maintained a lead.
It was more to make a point.
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@TruEternity said:
1. You want him to be able to go through pallets without stopping while chainsawing, on top of having a longer chainsaw time, and a faster rev up, and no penalty to movement speed while revving so it would be much stronger than Spirit fury ever could be.Slugging, bodyblocking a risky gen, it doesn’t happen often, but it can, and does.
Yes you have to be very close, but with all the buffs you suggest, that would not be hard.
Legit, all Killers are close range besides Huntress, you might have meant low mobility, but I digress.
I do believe LF could use some love. For example make his revving walk speed 100%-105% and the Chili’s have a larger impact on his acceleration. I don’t feel him insta charging-sanic running-kool-aid manning pallets is the way to go.
Do you not understand that he would only be able to go through pallets when there is only one gen left?
Slugging has absolutely NO impact on whether he will hit multiple opponents with his saw, ANY killer can slug. Not to mention they are nerfing slugging next patch
Getting close would still have it's challenges for one simple reason: I have proposed NO mobility buffs for him, you would still have to chase down survivors with no help from abilities like Nurse blinks or Billy's dash or Hags teleportation
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Quick note: I LOVE all the Leatherface avatars.
Now on to business, yeah I have NEVER used Insidious before, even as a Leatherface main.
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@NextKillerSpongebob said:
I like the ideas referencing to the movies.Yeah that is the idea, I think Myers is the best licensed killer right now and I believe part of the reason for that is that he is very faithful in his gameplay to how he is in the movies. Leatherface and Freddy getting the same treatment would be great.
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@TruEternity said:
So you think giving a killer who has a the ability to one hit multiple people in built Spirit fury and Fire up is remotely close to balanced? I get it’s not exactly that, but holy hell, does anybody know how to think up buffs that have some semblance of balance? LF needs some buffs, but “He looks in a survivors direction and they explode” is not it.- He wouldn't have built in Spirit Fury, for Spirit Fury you have to get hit by the pallet for it to break, these buffs would make it so he still has to chainsaw them.
- He indeed can insta-down multiple opponents, but when is that ever going to happen beyond you camping a hook? I'll wait...….. there is your answer.
- You would still have to be at VERY close range to pull off these chainsaw hits. These buffs would simply make it so that it is more reliable to do as the match progresses.
So yes I do think it is a good idea to give a killer who is meant to destroy you at close range, you know, the ability to destroy you at close range.
Thanks for your input!.
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I have a LF rework idea here if you guy would like to check it out!
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Just on a slightly different note, I am curious has anyone been saving up LF add-ons in case he gets a rework?
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@Lowbei said:
i like that you are putting a lot of thought into this
Thank you friend!
I will not rest until Bubba gets the love he deserves!
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@Mister_Holdout said:
Yeah, I think those changes could make LF pretty scary.Problem is he is still crippled by looping.
I thought about the ability to destroy pallets and keep going as one of his earlier abilities, I just didn't know how powerful people would feel that is ( Whether it was OP I mean )
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@The_Fallen_Utopia said:
IronWolf115 said:@Nickenzie said:
The_Fallen_Utopia said:
Dudddd said: Buff him so he can camp better? Yeah great idea More like buff him so he can do more then camping.. duh
Lol, no need for the camping salt because @IronWolf115 said that he wanted to make him better in general and not a better camper!
Indeed, all the buffs I have suggested here would help him in chases. Would they help him in camping also? Yes, but realistically ANY buff to him would buff his ability to camp soooooo, yeah.
Honestly any buff to any killer improves their camping ability.. that's how I see it. So there should be no reason to not buff Leatherface. He's only good for camping atm and if they buff him to be less reliant on that then it's a good buff.
Exactly.
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@Nickenzie said:
The_Fallen_Utopia said:
Dudddd said:Buff him so he can camp better? Yeah great idea
More like buff him so he can do more then camping.. duh
Lol, no need for the camping salt because @IronWolf115 said that he wanted to make him better in general and not a better camper!
Indeed, all the buffs I have suggested here would help him in chases. Would they help him in camping also? Yes, but realistically ANY buff to him would buff his ability to camp soooooo, yeah.
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@Supernaut said:
Lf needs reduction in TR!!!Well I thought of that but in the end I felt that if he did become much more powerful as the game progresses, his TR might not mean too much to him. Maybe a reduction while all 5 gens are active though? That would be nice.
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@fcc2014 said:
Like a built in fire up but better. I like it. @Nickenzie had some interesting ideas a while back for Leatherface buffs and may want to way in.By all means I would like Nick to chime in!
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@The_Fallen_Utopia said:
Even with these changes Hillbilly would still be stronger.. so these definitely wouldn't be op or anything. Which to me means it's a step in the right direction so good job with this buff idea.Thank you! Yes my intent is not so much to make him BETTER than Billy for say, more so to make him stand out and gain some power while he is at it.
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@only1biggs said:
I like the idea as it ties to the movie, but then, I am just a big fan of the movie.Thank you!
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That would be really cool though, a killer that killed another killer.
Killerception.
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We will find out more on Thursday so I await that eagerly
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@grtf47 said:
What is slugging?It is where you as the killer down multiple survivors without hooking them. It is an effective way to apply pressure on survivors.
Usually weaker killers such as Freddy, Leatherface, pig etc gain some big benefits from slugging rather than just individual downs and hooks.
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@PhantomMask20763 said:
I get it, people are tired of slugging, but THIS just got Freddy indirectly nerfed. Slugging was one of his most powerful tactics and now that it's easier to get people back up he has to go through that whole transition all over again. I might have to run knock out on him more now and waste a precious perk slot. I wouldn't have cared about this if they buffed him in this patch too, but instead they buffed sabotage and nerfed slugging. Might as well run Hangman's now huh. Sorry for the rant btw. It'll be useful for survivors which is good but Freddy is bad enough, he doesn't deserve this.Yeah I don't agree with the slugging nerf. I feel I am also gonna feel the burn as a Leatherface main.
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@MojoTheFabulous said:
@IronWolf115 said:
I have to admit I am curious what the " Results were not satisfying " means.Same. More info on that would have been really nice since this is a change many have been waiting to happen for a very long time.
Yeah I mainly just want to know whether they felt it hit DS too hard, or not enough.
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God knows that if BBQ ever does get removed, my Leatherface is setting up a nice campfire next to the hooked survivor.
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I have to admit I am curious what the " Results were not satisfying " means.
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@Legacy_Zealot said:
I mean... I play him at rank 1 and think he is fine. Lot more mallet downs than chainsaw downs though. It certainly isn't as viable when survivors really know what they are doing.I just questioned myself on if I would play him without the perks he has and the answer to that would probably be no. His ability isn't too useful considering the survivors I play against, so perhaps he does need some amount of tweaking. At the moment he is lvl 36 and has Frankies III and BBQ III. He is the only killer I have that has these perks at T III so that's why I play him over other killers.
@IronWolf115 Thank you, my eyes were open but I was not seeing
You are welcome my child.
Perhaps you would consider joining the Leatherface mains society?
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@Legacy_Zealot said:
Does he need a buff/rework? I think he is fine as isHe is disastrously bad at high rank.
Lacks any kind of map pressure
His ability is extremely clunky and slow
His add-ons are absolutely terrible to the point that his "best" add-on ( Award winning chilli ) literally doesn't do anything
And no mind game potential -
Hey, whatever gets the job done.
Good for you
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Yeah, this happens to me on Xbox A LOT as well.
For me it is always when they are vaulting over a pallet. -
BIG buffs needed to Bubba.
Hopefully after Freddy
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@rebelhunter316 said:
Aari_Piggy66 said:Amanda >>>> Nea >>>>> LF
IronWolf115 said:Family Matters
That a smile you can trust. 😀
Come into my basement friend.
Got some spicy meat down here.
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@DeadByFlashlight said:
@IronWolf115 said:
I obviously don't mean specifics but just something, ANYTHING. Even just SoonTM would warm this cold Bubba mains heart.I mainly ask because I know you guys are hard at work on Freddy, which is great, and you have done changes to Wraith, Hag and Trapper, also great. I think most of the community would agree that after Freddy, Leatherface should be looked at.
Thanks in advance!
The next rework is gonna be freddy and that will not happen soon. Leatherface is not even in soon TM range yet =(
Hell, even if they just said that after Freddy they will look at LF next, that would be the answer I am looking for
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@fcc2014 said:
I'm not 100% sure but i believe it was a Q&A question and Horvath or McClean said no.I believe it is a QnA on Thursday, so I dunno maybe they will mention LF in some capacity.
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@fcc2014 said:
I believe they said no a few streams back . It was one with Q&A with 3 of them. They may however go back and look at his stuff after all these others have been adjusted. It would only make sense.Awwww.
Well guess it's back to the basement for me!
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Family Matters
