HexSlugged
HexSlugged
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@pidgeon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4086342#Comment_4086342
I have this happen to me like literally every five games especially on indoor maps because people will just rat or genuinely be unable toi get progress against certain killers. I think its a good addition to the game because it allows the killers/survivors to disconnect in case there isn't much actual interaction happening. It also helps with the 2 survivor situation.
im not AGAINST it, i just have never been aware of this being an issue where dev time needs to be added to handle it (i assume it wouldnt be hard to do but idk)
but if you are at a stalemate just go to killer and get hooked if you give up. not sure why you need to dc (assuming the killer didnt go afk or something and was actually playing)
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i think they changed that when they did the emta shakeup some years back if i remember right, that perk was in so many builds that they were trying to get other perks in the meta. but we all know how that went
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ive never had a game where no gen popped or made progress in 10 minutes and i have played no small number of matches.
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@FerrousFacade said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4086291#Comment_4086291
- You can't find them saying its intended, so many things have gone unaddressed this just happens to be one of them. BHVR quite clearly focuses updates on things that make money, thus even if they want to change it its incredibly low on their priority list.
- The killer doesn't need to be standing on top of me, getting me up is not going to work. Its not hard to keep track of the incredibly slow moving slug while looking for the last survivor. You cannot blame someone that did not make the choice to put us in that position.
- Selfish actions (keyword right there) require you to make a choice, to do something, I am not choosing to be forced to do nothing when I am trying to game. The killer is choosing to do that. The killer is the one taking an action against another for their own personal desires, I can't be selfish for wanting to move on after that happens. As the person taking the action only the killer can. There is nothing wrong with wanting a 4k, as I have said many times, there is something wrong when you take actions that harm (yes incredibly minor but still harm) others to achieve it.
- Nothing in your previous comment engaged with anything I said, the ones before that did. You just claim its intended with no proof, blame teammates for whats happening when they have zero say in the matter, claim I am the one being selfish while its the killers actions that lead to the situation, and then try to turn the argument around on me with nonsense about how wanting the killer to not leave me with nothing to do is selfish or that not wanting to sit slugged for up to four minutes makes me a poor sportsman. Ask a football player if they would be ok with their opponent making their team sit at half field and do nothing while that opponent scores points against their team, you would get laughed at.
- We are talking about a 2v1 situation, someone will be found moments after the slug is picked up whether or not its in the killers face, and even once someone is up unless there is almost no gen progress left to complete (unlikely) then you end up in that cycle. I should not be forced to go do something else while trying to play a game, its a ridiculous ask.
As for the time, I literally bled out to a slug for the 4k twice last evening. In one my teammate did get me up but guess what I went back down shortly afterwards and with two gens left there was no getting out of that. All getting me up did was extend the stupid situation, congrats, should have just left me on the ground. If there are two survivors up we have lost and can no longer win, capitalization doesn't change that.
There is no situation where the killer becomes unable to play the game. On top of that killers have many chances to start a snowball that wins them the match up to the point where all survivors are truly safe, I have done it many times and I would bet you have too. In a 2v1, the survivors cannot win, trying to turn the argument around doesn't work because the roles are incredibly different.
Hatch not counting as a win is exactly my point. Why is it ok for the killer to cause harm to someone else (again minor) to deny a not a win? Why is it ok to ask the survivor to endure that harm (again minor) so that the killer can get a 4k? No argument you could possibly make can justify that.
your writing is much better than mine! also i want to preface since we are clearly on 2 different positions that i hold no hostility or ire towards you even though i can come off blunt or insensitive. So I just want to make sure that you are aware i am talking to you with these long messages because i enjoy talking to you, not because i want to show you up or ypur some enemy of mine.
- i do not think its reasonable to hold a position for them to have a mechanic for 9 years in the game that they did not want in the game that has an unintended game interaction and then not only never change it but then go around in in all sorts of adjacent and change those mechanics and say "we want to change certain game actions" and also want to do that with the final slug and not implement any change to that or discuss it. It is far more reasonable to infer that they dont see that as a problematic and an unexpected emergent game behavior as if they did at some point it would have been handled to remove it or lower its impact as they have done with a a bunch of other unintended mechanics and game interactions.
2. if you want to decrease the game experience of other people in the match to heighten your own experience (i.e. abandon your team mate and other players mid match because you dont want to sit there not doing anything for a couple mins) that is by definition selfish. which is OK to be selfish, im only stating that you cant say another person playing their game with the goal to win and utilising a strategy (non rule breaking) is being selfish because they dont want to play less effectively because you are bothered by a minute or 2 of lowered(you ar able to game interact while slugged) game interactivity or boredom.
3. one of my favorite activities to do when im in that situation is to slu crawl away, if the killer isnt proxying you you can absolutely crawl away and get out of sight within 15 seconds. ive done it dozens and dozens of time(i find slugNseek fun) but most of the time killers are chasing the mori so they leave you alone and dont remain on your body (ime)
4. Occam's razor would suggest that bhvr is aware of that mechanic and if they found it problematic or against game design they would have included that in the slug patches and qol passes they did. it takes more leaps and assumptions to conclude that they are aware of this, not talking about it but internally thinking its not an intended mechanic. why are you assuming they feel this way?
5. i agree this is likely the case in nearly all circumstances but the game still isnt over and a comeback i still possible even if its only a 4 percent chance (hopefully you get that tongue in cheek reference lol) and there is still a chance you can come back and escape. i have done so, not often but a few times it has, or ive at least been able to be part of how team mates escaped even if it was lost for me.
I want to reiterate here that ia m not pro slugging (sluggings fine if you dont over due it or being a jerk about it) in that i have a "get slugged loser" mindset (im aware my username may indicate otherwise) i do care about peoples fun and i do not slug the 3rd for the 4th (most of the time, in competitive matches where all of us are trying, i will because im trying to win) vast majority of the time i let the last 1 or 2 go (i let 2 people go twice last night) and i dont enjoy being slugged and left instead of hooked, i roll my eyes when it happens.
But my point is is that even tho its boring and it sucks, it is part of the games design, clearly is intentional or at the very least tolerated and not seen as a tactic that needs to be removed and i dont think its good for the game to add more ways for people to just dc when a game isnt going the way they want, we already have a major problem with that.
But if that were to be changed and you could abandon, i wouldnt personally complain because its an issue that wouldnt really be impacting me, i just get the DC whenever i down someone faster than they want or they dont like my killer choice or the wind blows or whatever happens in these games lol. I just am not convinced that there is an argument to be made to abandon a game just because you feel like you cant win and dont want to wait a couple minutes.
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@FerrousFacade said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4086193#Comment_4086193
Have they ever stated that its intended? Does anything state anywhere that its intended? I don't think they have. People are so quick to say things like "the devs don't understand why people slug more on gideon" but here you think this is intended? I think they don't change it solely because they know there is a large cohort of people that cannot stand a match ending with them getting anything less than a 4k and those players would kick up a huge fuss about it.
It is never on either of the survivor, it can't be, they are not the one choosing to create the situation and its ridiculous to put any blame on them. I'm not going to blame someone with no power in the situation for not picking me up, I am going to blame the person putting us all into that situation, its illogical to do anything else.
It is not selfish to want to move on when I have been slugged for the 4k, you can't even give me a reason why that is selfish, how does that even make sense? What about it is selfish? Whereas I can point directly at the slugged survivor and state that the killer is choosing to waste that persons time because of their selfish desire for a 4k.
You're not even engaging with any of my arguments at this point just saying that I'm wrong while spouting nonsense. How am I removing my teammates ability to potentially escape? How are they supposed to pick me up in such a way that we can continue the match and not just fall into a cycle of pickup → slug → pickup → slug? Its an unreasonable expectation. Me being there is the primary thing preventing them from potentially escaping, complete nonsense.
It is selfish of the killer only and they are the only person being a poor sportsman.
- if that had been an unintended and undesired emergent behavior it would have been addressed by them sometime within the last 10 years just as they have addressed other undesired emergent behaviors (you being satisfied by it is a differnt story) They have changed other things that are very divisive so claiming that because some people wouldnt like it is not a valid point to make here as they have a decade of making changes that upset people.
2. if your team mate leaves you for 4 mins on the ground without picking you up and the killer isnt standing over your body, thats on your team mate. the game was in progress and you were savable. the game was not over, hence why 3 people were still in an ongoing match. Something being annoying or boring to you is not the same thing as being disrespectful or poor sportsmanship.
3. almost every action you do is selfish. Slefish actions are fine, it has a bad connotation but you can not engage in life without selfish behavior.
Killers and survivors both want to win and as such want the opposition to lose. That is both want a more positive outcome for their individual self than for the opposition. This isnt really arguable. Its objectively selfish and the game can not exist if neither side is selfish and desires a better outcome for themselves than the opponents. this is simply what competition is.
4. Amusing you say im not engaging with your arguments when i have directly addressed them. You not likeing or agreeing with what i said doesnt magically mean im not addressing you. you just arent compelled by my reasoning which is fine but dont go making up lies dude lol.
5. well for 1 survs could stop picking each other up in the killers face, that would be a great start.
the killer isnt trying to waste your time (for most i assume anywasy like myself in the times i do slug) they are trying to win via a 4k. preventing the 4th person from escaping by triggering the pity portal is completely valid and i dont think you have any real justification that someone shouldnt try to do that if they want.
at MOST its 4 mins if your team mate does nothing but run in a circle and achieve nothing. In reality you will either be picked up or the other guy will be downed within 1-2 minutes.
complaining about a 1-2 minute wait every once in a while is a little entitled. if you were left there for 10 or 15 minutes or something or that the game wasnt actually progressing while your downed your position would hold more validity.
Survivors waste killers time when standing in the end gate when they have won. but you cant or shouldnt take action against that (as much as it annoys me when people dont just leave) because the game is still progress able. either the timer or the killer can force the game to end.
in the same way, your team (this is a team game for survs) you are there to be a support for your team and vice versa even if your slugged on the ground and even if your team mates are trash.
your welcome to abandon your team mate and fellow players but that IS bad sportmanship hence why there is a DC penalty.
if the devs felt otherwise they wouldnt have excluded this from all the other abandon features that happen when the game is ACTUALLY lost.
if your slugged anmd your team mate is still up you are LOSING but you have not LOST hence why you dont get to DC without penalty.
check your tik tok or whatever for 2 mins if you really cant be bothered to not tap buttons for a minute or 2.
Hatch doesnt even count as a win, so if you have 2 gens left and 1 guy left or 2 guys left and 1s slugged why not just immediately end the game instead of playing it out?
or 1 or 2k for killers isnt a win, should a killer just stop playing when its clear they can not achieve a 3k?
you signed up with 4 other people to play a game. its bad sportmanship to abandon game before the match is over.
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@FerrousFacade said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4086166#Comment_4086166
It's objectively you doing nothing, not gameplay (unless you consider watching paint dry gameplay?). It lasts for up to 4 minutes for the full bleed out timer not 1-2.
Hatch was designed to end the match and I doubt the developers even thought someone would slug the second last survivor to prevent it spawning in.
A two out is a tie not a comeback and while I have in fact made that happen before we are talking maybe two matches out of thousands, statistical anomalies. In one scenario the killer wins and in the other the killer wins, its not less of a victory. You don't see a football team quibble about winning by only 3 points instead of 20 points, they still won and that's all that most people really look at.
All you are doing is justifying someone making a selfish decision and being a poor sport while downplaying how it effects the slugged survivor.
i mean, i think they are well aware since this has been possible for the entirety of hatches existence which is like 9 years or something now. It clearly is an intended mechanic even if you dont like it. to be clear im not arguing that you SHOULD like it. i totally understand how it can be annoying, but the game is designed to be done that way and killers are supposed to and clearly allowed to not have to allow someone a chance at hatch as technically the killers job is to prevent people from having a chance for a pity escape anyways.
very rarely in insatnces ive been in that situation has it taken 4 mins for the last person to get downed or come and rescue me and if a killers spent 4 mins looking for the last guy and that guy hasnt come picked you up, thats on your team mate not the killer
wanting to abandon a game instead of staying in it when the game is ongoing just because for the moment your having to sit there is selfish. your wanting people to change how they play and win "less" in order to avoid you having to wait a couple minutes to que up again and remove your team mates ability to potentially escape or pick you up.
Its mutually selfish on both sides.
its not poor sportmanship though.
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@FerrousFacade said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4086092#Comment_4086092
The slugged survivor is able to crawl, that's not gameplay and it isn't participating in the match. Yes, you can be picked up and if I am the last survivor up I will try to do so if I think its possible and I still try to get gens done, I mentioned that earlier. I am not asking to be let go or given a "free" escape in any of these scenarios, I am asking that the match be allowed to continue to its natural conclusion which includes the possibility of a hatch escape.
I am not asking to stop playing because I am losing, I am asking my opponent to not arbitrarily decide that an intended game mechanic doesn't apply to them. It would be like the winning team being able to declare that the losing team is no longer allowed to score more points. If you lose the first 8 rounds in a combat sport you could still win the next two, slugging for the 4k is the winning fighter saying that for the last two rounds the losing fighter has to fight with their hands tied behind their back, the last two rounds become guaranteed wins.
Hatch exists, deciding that it doesn't apply because someone wants a guaranteed 4k instead of their already guaranteed 3k is poor sportsmanship and disrespectful to the slugged players time unless they already know where the last survivor is (something I have also mentioned before), there is no reasonable argument that can be made to deny that. All of the analogies to sports fall apart at the smallest level of scrutiny because those games don't allow the already winning side to decide how the rest of the match is going to play out or let them ignore rules they don't like and the losing side doesn't have to remove players from the field to the point that the original objective becomes impossible to accomplish.
I would love the entirety of the endgame to be reworked in both the survivor winning and killer winning cases. Until that happens it isn't asking much of the killer player that they not go out of their way to deny hatch by slugging for the 4k, just like it isn't asking much of the survivor players not to sit in the exit gate to bag. If someone can't see that then it is absolutely reasonable to say they lack empathy for the other side and that they are being disrespectful and unsportsmanlike for choosing to prevent a mechanic simply because they don't like it.
it objectively is gameplay and its objectively participating in the match albiet not in a particularly exciting manner. but this was something intentionally designed as a gameplay mechanic therefore it is gameplay.
I do not disagree that its a tad annoying to be left bleeding out instead of hooked in a 2v1 scenario but the game was designed this way. hatch was designed so there is some reason to play when its a 1v1 scenario as gates can be almost impossible to solve at that point.
it wasnt designed to ensure survs get to always use it obviously or that there is an expectation the killer should let you play for it.
I understand you dont like laying for 1-2 minutes every once in a while when you only have a small chance to win. but its only 1-2 minutes and the game isnt over even if the chance of a come back is astronomically low.
But it isnt reasonable to expect people to accept less of a victory in a game designed around achieving the victory in a competitive game where most people are trying to win when they play.
The game does not tell you in any way that you shouldnt kill all 4 or that you should ensure everyone has a chance for hatch.
Again hatch was only ever implemented to prevent a softlock in the old days where neither side was able to break a deadlock and escape or get out.
its not there as an expectation that anyone should be able to play for.
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@AlwaysInAGoodShape said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4085933#Comment_4085933
"Penalizing the killer". All survivor perks penalize the killer, and all killer perks penalize survivors. That's just not a good point.
the perks in the game are related to your interactions in the game and what you do in it.
you want to add a perk that is not related to game interactions and instead gives you a benefit by not interacting and paying attention to the game to make things easier for you. so you can play less than the others in the match.
if your too lazy or uninterested to pay attention the game you are playing with other people than go play a game that ONLY has your friends who also arent interested in paying attention to the game your playing or go play a single player game.
if you want to be rewarded for playing dbd then play dbd. dont ask to be rewarded for playing dbd by playing it less.
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@FerrousFacade said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4086019#Comment_4086019
In ALL of the games you mention each player is still able to play the game in all situations. In american football, when one team is up 21 to 0 is the losing team forced to just stand there while the winning team scores more points? No, they are not they get to continue playing and try to score some points.
Combat sports? These literally have a referee that stops rounds or the match as a whole to ensure no one gets injured. They regularly end before getting through all rounds.
No one said you have to let them escape but it is unsportsmanlike and disrespectful to not allow them to continue playing or let them move on. I agree dcing is unsportsmanlike, good thing I don't do that and think those players suck too.
your still able to play the game in dbd. when you are slugged you are still playing and still in the match regardless of whether you are able to engage in actions you want to undertake.
when you are slugged and 4th person is up your still able to be revived and put back in the game. is it easy? no. neither is coming back in any competition that you are losing.
combat sports are only stopped before the end due to safety issues, if safety is not in play, if its a 10 round match, and you lost the first 8 rounds, the match still continues for 2 more.
whats disrespectful and unsportsmanlike is wanting to stop playing because you are losing and not in a competitive position you prefer not to be in. (something i have been guilty of myself)
bhvr not implementing a ranked or casual mode is not on survivors or killers to not try and win the best they can.
You may not care about a 4k or a 4 man out (i dont myself) but other people do and other people caring about it is valid and fine even if you dont like it.
the killers job is to kill ideally everyone and the survivors job is to escape as a team and ideally with 4 people.
there is no expectation that the game places that you shouldnt try to fully complete your objectives or that you have to limit what degree you win.
show some sportmanship and wait a minute and the last guy will get downed or youll get picked up.
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@FerrousFacade said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4085966#Comment_4085966
The killer is the one creating the situation it is entirely on them to end it, not the survivors. The blatant lack of respect people in this thread are showing towards their opponents is staggering.
Going for a four man out is not the equivalent situation, its survivors bagging in the exit gate. The match is at the point where one side has won and nothing is going to change that. Both are massive wastes of time and do nothing but show disrespect to your opponents. Why is it so hard to remember that we are playing a video game and there is a person waiting to move on to their next match?
If anyone is wondering why there is so much toxicity in this community this thread is the perfect place to start. So many people being completely OK leaving another player on the ground solely to guarantee a 4k win instead of the already guaranteed 3k win and probably still a 4k. Apparently sportsmanship and basic respect are foreign concepts.
how is trying to eliminate all survivors (literally the entire point of the game) staggeringly disrespectful?
The goal of the game is to kill everyone/escape
it is not only kill a few and let the last person escape or only 3 people can escape not 4 rule based game.
do not twist made up rulebooks invoked whenever you dislike losing with what the game, rules, and mechanics actually are.
what other sport or competition that has a clear start and end has the game end early or have the winning person/team stop playing just because they are winning?
In american football is it unsportmanlike for a team up 21 and 0 in the 4th quarter with 2 minutes to still play to win and try to score points?
how about basketball?
combat sports?
you dont like losing and remaining in a state of being aware you are losing. so you want a shortcut out of it. thats why alot of people dc too. thats unsportsmanlike.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4085128#Comment_4085128
- non-argument. Slugging for the 4K happens way more often than just Adepts.
- The Killer still won the game. That the Survivor MIGHT get a pity escape does not change that at all. Even when Hatch spawns, the Survivor is at a disadvantage in finding it, since they move slower than the Killer and have to hide. They can basically only get lucky.
I just dont understand why people need to prolong a game where they clearly won. Nobody will debate that a 3K with not all Gens done and a Hatch Escape would be a clear win for the Killer. Yet Killers like to waste everyones time by slugging for the 4K while the Survivors have no way to actually speed this up (the last part is important, before someone comes up with "Yeah, but what is with Survivors waiting at the Exit Gate"…).
@Topic:
At the very least the Survivor on the ground should be able to abandon in a 2v1. This would allow the Killer to slug for the 4K while wasting only the time of one person instead of 2.
In general it is sad that at this point the best way to play the game is to be the antimate.
i dont think its reasonable to have an expectation that in a game people play both casually and competitively that they would forgoe their only objective "kill survivors" and kill less survivors for no reason or so that a survivor can escape through hatch.
its like saying a why should survs go and try and save a 4th surv if they win with a 3 man out.
thats just now how people are and it doesnt make sense to argue that people should try and win "less" for no reason than making someone who doesnt like to lose get less upset at their own failure.
If its about wasting time the 4th surv could just run to killer or go pick up slug if the game is "already lost"
that would speed it up.
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@Feather said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4085762#Comment_4085762
We could limit this to 1m. I thought of insta down killers like bubba or billy that sometimes cant down survivours because of window etc, so they could swing to see them and get another chance of Downing them.
I thought of this for like 15s so there might be problems i cant see :P
Ive had an idea in the past where hitting generator with basic attack would special-damage it, something like TBTC but close to generator
i think there is an issue where there is just too much unintended things like if i know your on the other side of a wall loop i can just swing and get an aura. also tbh im not so sure i trust the game to reliably detect that with how weird hit boxes and stuff can get
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i think the perk is fine. its mostly meant for new killers as whiffing alot is common. it used to be a staple for me when starting out on killer because i missed like 80% of my swings lol.
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@TropesDaMan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4085570#Comment_4085570
And your completely right, Like i hate playing Clown, but i bought him and wasted BP for his perks. i feel that this idea could be extremely healthy for the game
take that back immediately.
there is not a single finger on your hands you deserve with an attitude like that
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so….you want to penalize the killer for you not wanting to pay attention in the game you and 4 other people made a commitment to play together?
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never go to the exit gates, hop on your phone and let them look like idiots tbagging to the air to a killer who will never show up to be taunted.
it brings me as much satisfaction as winning the game tbh knowing they are just sitting there waiting for me to show up
tbagging doesnt need to be penalized as there is no benefit to the survivors whatsoever and is either neutral to the games progression or can hurt the cx as if they are tbagging, they arent making distance.
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these lice infested rats arent worthy enough to spit on!
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so…you dont want them to fix the issue your having?
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@Valuetown said:
Why do killers slug and spam w and s when they know they've won? Seems kind of worthless if you ask me.
this has nothing to do with the post and is a tactic children use.
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im sure if they slap on another 0.02 second buff he will feel very strong in your hands
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i dont think endurance should be removed as removing endurance prevents any incentive for a rescue play, the hooked personw ould just be abandoned.
So endurance should exist but it shouldnt be 15 seconds imo and i would remove the haste boost there prior to endurance hit.
this would allow rescue plays in end game but not just make the unhooked invincible and get an escape with essentially zero risk
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your not in the wrong for your friend being emotionally unstable because a game was lost.
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people dont want to have to run anti map offerings every single match.
offerings still improve the chance.
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the original franchise that they do not have the legal rights to use. They can not use her in aqny capacity (im pretty sure) as her and her likeness is not owned by the license bhvr currently has.
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@Sepi said:
worst suggestions ever. atp just make survivors die from first hook while you're at it. KILLERS DONT NEED ANY BUFFS. in the other hand survs need them the most. the 10% winrate is not looking good for survs.
im not a good survivor, im average in every way and my escape rate is much higher than 10% and so is essentially every other survivor player in the game. I dont really see the point in blatantly lying about something no one is going to believe. Why not try and argue for your perspective in a way that doesnt paint your position in a bad light?
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they have stated multiple times that there is alot more than just jason.
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@Yamalive said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4083759#Comment_4083759
We could read this every Patch. Survivor perk X is so useful and/or broken, yet after release you hardly ever saw them again. People always overestimated survivor perks on PTB and neglected all arguments.
But here comes my real issue, there was no talk about new perks at all. So why even throwing this in ignoring the discussion?
"on the contrray, Survivor also just got perks that are useful in a certain niche situation and even in those situation theyre barely noticable effective. "
If i was supposed to assume you meant perks that were released months ago that was no clear in your post. but sure, im ignoring the discussion.
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not a fan of it personally.
but after a few dozen games you should already gain a sense where things are anyways
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@Rokku_Rorru said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4083610#Comment_4083610
To be fair the "Strongest" status effect you're on about is in chase where they are within eyesight of the killer, so that means footsteps are still able to be heard, it'd be different if it was in a loop over where the likes of Nowhere to hide etc can't work.
I personally want the perks to be fun, not overpowered, this isn't stopping the killer from hitting you or using your power to get you, not to mention killer instinct still procs on elusive doesn't it? So it's not as bad as you make it out to be.
I still think these perks have plenty counter play, they don't take the killers controller for them, it'd be different if they did. These aren't OG Made for This or Buckle up's rework not too long ago.most killers dont have killer instinct.
the game was not made to rely soley on foot steps. they ARE useful absolutely, but when your in chase you have loud ass chase music blaring in your ears and it covers up foot steps a bit. furthermore, not everyone has good quality directional speakers that can be sueful to tell the direction. and on high loops, survivors will be out of eye sight where with all the cues you already have to make guesses that may not be right and many loops can have multiple exit points and so some killers or people may be less impacted by others, being able to absurdly extend chase if your a decent survivor by constantly making killers second guess and disoriented and losing time in a game that often doesnt give you much time to work with anyways.
it should NOT work in chase.
and especially on maps with poor visibility, like lerys where there is a ton of different directions you can run to or the cornfield or swamp map where visbility is bad all over and having zero cues to work off of means maintaining a chase will often just come down to luck because when you lose sight of a survivor and you have zero information to go off of there are almost always going to be multiple different direction they could have gone. and while i didnt play the PTB i have seen comments where killers are completely losing the chase multiple times in a match.
The game is designed for chases to work via tracking in order to maintain it. the game was not built for you to get to work soley of of footsteps and footsteps alone. and having it so that every single chase you have the survivor will ALWAYS gain complete invisibility if they are not in your LOS and did a single loop on a tile is not how the game nor killers were designed to work and take down surivors.
i dont think people understand how utterly disrienting having to locate survivors who dont leave tracks are like otr is really hard. you might hear some footsteps but that doesnt mean its easy to identify exactly where they are and precicely what direction they are going especially in areas that are complex and its not simple i go right or left. so to have this happen potentially in every single chase in a game if survs all run it, is one of the most unenjoyable experiences in the game i can imagine and thats before all the other factors come in to play when you do down someone, the invsible flashlight saves and other survivor safety perks and tactics. its just way too much with this added on.
the perk is fine if its not able to be used while the killer is in chase by the person being chased. and i say this as a survivor player that prefers stealth and use lightweight on every single build.
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@Yamalive said:
Are you sure that in the past two years survivor perks have been stronger than killer perks? I dont think that this was a thing, I would even say both roles have equally useless perks, though latest Vecna perks are used quite a lot. The process behingd killer perks is easy, you cant give them perks that are easily used and strong too as those perks become too offensive. So having more activation requirement is pretty fine. On the contrray, Survivor also just got perks that are useful in a certain niche situation and even in those situation theyre barely noticable effective. Thats design-wise even more of a problem.
In my mind the developers have absolutely no creativity in perk design and lack too much gamesense to make valuable perks everybody could live with. Unless they get this knowledge into their own staff, I have no hope for good perks. But BHVR isnt such a company to take into account the good feedback of their community. They have a history of ignoring the objective feedback and mostly making knee-jerk reaction on unreasonable shitstorms.
They need to make a big turn in their game-development strategy, otherwise this game wont evolve any further. Were basically been on a halt for several years now, just pushing out content over quality.
all 3 perks in this round for survivor are very useful and one is completeley broken (cross examination)
the 3 perks for jason are almost utterly worthless.
what do you mean exactly then when you say they just got perks that were niche and barely noticable effects? all 3 are incredibly valuable perks.
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im proud of you but do you have a 2001 phone camera?
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i respect any main who plays the rarer killers. you could forget half the killers in the game existed if you didnt have one legend playing them in the 1 out of 100 matches you play
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@zonkednb said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4082701#Comment_4082701
No assessment of a gamestate is going to be wholly fair by numbers alone. Could very easily be that the other 3 players let the killer snowball hard by going for ill-advised saves and unhooking in their face.
Let's add an extra qualifier to better illustrate what I mean. We've got 1 gen left and some progress on them, but the killer is keeping great pressure up. In this case you'd do better to let the killer spot you and waste as much time as you're able to.
Plus, a big part of contributing to the game is wasting the killers time. If you're so stealthy you're not taking any chase/attention, then that just allows the killer to be extra efficient vs your teammates and get them down to death hook quicker. I tend to play stealthy (not a stealth build but instead avoiding taking chase unncessarily) until it starts coming down to the wire, then I take chase.i will take chase, im not someone who will never engage with the killer, but on average other survivors will last longer. if you want to win, there needs to be 1 person on a gen pretty consistently. typcially im the only person on a gen. if im able to identify that my team mates are incapable of staying alive by unhooking in front of killer or going down multiple times in just a minute, then me getting in a 30 second chase means nothing because the game will NOT progress (in my favor) because the team is incapable of capitilising on anything.
I will absolutely trade when it makes sense to do so
I will not when doing so will not assist the team or me.
often im the only person who bothers to go for saves (not to say ive not been the slacker on the team before) but if i have a team whos unable or unwilling to take advantage of rotations and saves(and its soloq so) then im not going to put myself in danger if my calculus isnt that there is a benefit to come from it.
SO i do see your point and im in agrreeance with it, but many times doing that will just lose you the game as well.
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@zonkednb said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4082655#Comment_4082655
I fully agree with the idea that players are optimising the fun out of the game.
On stealth, I agree that it's valid, but when I'm playing survivor, and me and 2 other teammates are on death hook, and one pure stealth player is on 0, it's time to use some of those free hookstates as a resource. Not doing so is where it crosses the line into ratting.
DR is good. I just hope we get other means to make specialist builds than % stacking.i dont disagree but i would counter by me being a stealth player, im not good in chase but i am good at evasion and many games where im at 0 and the rest of the team is at 2 hooks is typically because my team mates are being soloq team mates and im the only person whos ever done anything of value the entire game. at this point its my mercy on whether i bother trying to trade and throw the game or go for hatch (i count that as an escape on an individual level) or gate escape.
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ive been playing twins alot recently and as the above person said if you have good game sense victor is extremely deadly and is incredible at giving pressure if you know how to track without scratch marks (injured is easy of course)
I barely m1 with charlotte unless its to cut a surv off that has victor on him, but i try to injure as much as possible and use victor to push people off gens or get knock downs. She is a killer where slugging makes sense for her play style (no need to overdo it) and ive been running a hex: third seal, ruin, undying and thrill of the hunt, so basically only 2 perks and i have had incredible success, its been easy to get all 4 blind which excluding coms means your strategic slugs are harder to find as well as hooks are harder to find. all while using victor to push of gens or heal so much that ruin is crushing it in the back ground and undying and thrill keeping my blindness and pressure up very well if you can keep them from cleaning your hexes of course.
I know alot of people dont like hexes because of how easily your power gets removed but i swear by them, they are so much fun to use
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are you saying blindness is bad or? not sure i get the sideways message your saying
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the keyboard part would be fine, the mouse part "could" be challenging just as i feel that freedom of movement with your hand would feel off to move the camera alot, but i dont see it being something you couldnt get used to.
keyboard is just wasd and if you have a mouse with a thumb button i would bind killer power to thumb button so you dont have to use ctrl for it which i personally find super uncomftorable to move my pinky to hit
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i believe they stated before they wont do that as it would break the bp economy
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A question I have is this: Sometimes as victor i see gen auras and other times i dont but i am not inflicted with blindness. what causes this? I do not see this listed in the power and it makes it difficult when im trying to move to a gen but i cant see the aura
editing: just completed a match and as victor i couldnt see gate switches and when i went back to charlotte i could see my totems but not the gates either. im assuming this is a bug?
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Thats some good tips, ill definitely be trying some of that out!
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i would agree with basekit kindred minus killer aura which would solve the most kamikaze of survivor plays.
i think bond doesnt need to be basekit since it does provide you indirect tracking of the killer if hes in chase which i think should require a perk
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For slowdown i bring hex perks which arent really slow down per se but you can make them spend alot of time totem hunting. but ruin is the only true slowdown perk i use but only because it goes with my perk builds. i dont like kicking gens much or am busy chasing or tracking and end up rarely kicking unless im right by one.
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@MrBuffalo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4081709#Comment_4081709
What you just said is something I wish more people would understand.
"Games change. Rules Change. Community feedback matters."
DbD has changed so much since it came out and it plays and feels like a completely different game. I do find the community can be stuck in its old ways. So I thank you very much for trying to start a discussion like this 😁
i agree discussion is nice and im not a fan of reshade because i agree it feels unfair but if i remember right some of the dev team also uses that common reshade mod though i could be misremembering and if thats the case no discussion is gonna change it. behavior is fine with it and said so after a previous period of heavy disccusion a couple years ago i think.
So this is one of the topics i dont think any discussion will change
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Behavior has directly stated they are ok with reshaders and dont consider it cheating, so nothing can be done about it
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@CrypticGirl said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4081536#Comment_4081536
Another thing that's funny is that a Survivor standing and doing nothing is considered a bad thing, but a Survivor lying on the floor doing nothing is fine. Make it make sense.
one is the survivor choosing not to play in a match they qued up for. the other person is down due to an interaction while playing the game and is an intended function within its mechanics. I.E you are expected to have moments where you are down on the ground.
you are better than this and you know thats an absolutely absurd point you think you are making.
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your team mates are still playing the game. its a team game(for survs) not a individual game like many people play it as.
Id love to dc against legion as i hate playing against him with a passion, but i dont because i have a team and its not fair to them i abandon the match. i still need to do my best to give them a chance at escaping.
so i force myself not to be a crybaby even when its clear the game is lost.
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@Kill_For_Mother said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4081498#Comment_4081498
You're spreading misinformation is what you're doing.
i was incorrect that in 3 movies of the 12 there are a few scenes where he was running yes that is true.
but in the majority and in the version of jason that this ip is, he doesnt run.
also, from my understanding he was running before he was the more supernatural zombified version which is the version in dbd.
and jason literally cant run to get to appear in some of the locations he does either way. hope this answers your question.
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@Kill_For_Mother said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4081480#Comment_4081480
What are u talking about? He ran in the movies…
i havnt seen every movie and the ones i have were a very long time ago but im still quite certain hes absolutely not known for running.
either way, there are many scenes where running does not justify the location shift. Hence the inferrence which if i remember right, the IP holders agree with when the f13 game was made
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@CrypticGirl said:
Okay, I admit I haven't seen all of the Friday the 13th films, but when did Jason ever have a teleporting ability?
its an inferred ability since he shows up in an impossible manner at a speed and distance that you couldnt get even if running and jason doesnt run
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@Valuetown said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4081369#Comment_4081369
Spirit is literally a top 5 killer. He has ranged AND a better spirit power? Everyone who cares about match integrity should be upset with this design.
its not a better spirit power because how you sue them is different. there are things spirit can do with her power which jason can not do