FrostySeal
FrostySeal
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I agree, Dead Hard is an incredibly stupid perk and if I had the power I would most certainly nerf it or rework it into something else entirely but it's not just for bad survivors. I've seen really good survivors use this perk and it makes the already really good survivor players just that much more better in the chase. Because of how powerful it can be for distance in the hands of a good player they can make the chase last way longer for the Killer and get themselves out of bad spots where they would otherwise get hit.
If anything Dead Hard is for good players. There is a massive difference between a bad player using Dead Hard and a good one. But overall it doesn't take much skill to use, it just complements a good survivors looping skills.
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@Callmehandsome said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2228809#Comment_2228809
I think most frustrating is that all skillful play with billy is punished. If you are basic billy who uses chainsaw to move around the map and then just walk behind a survivor and use chainsaw to down them cooldown doesn't hurt you much. But if you try to be curve billy around loops it's punished A LOT, even faking the chainsaw is punished now if you try to bait survivor to take another loop
Yeah, I find that part to be the most frustrating thing about Hillbilly as well. Ive always liked curving on survivors because of how satisfying it was but with how Hillbilly is now its not only incredibly frustrating witnessing your overheat meter build up so fast but also really unfun. My favorite addon to run on him was doom engravings but whenever I use this addon I always have to use either the brown addon for overheating or the yellow one, otherwise my chainsaw overheats super fast.
Ever since his rework Hillbilly has just been drained of all the fun he had and now is just a soulless husk of what he used to be. Every time I play Hillbilly I always think "man, I could be playing Blight or some other Killer that is 10x more fun and stronger than Billy." Its really disheartening to see how far Billy has fallen.
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I feel the same way, I've already made some posts talking about how he deserves a better rework but unfortunately I just can't see it happening. With how painfully slow BHVR is at doing anything I wouldn't expect a hillbilly buff until next year minimum.
It really sucks too since he used to be my favorite killer but with his garbage addons, stupid over heat system, and buggy animations he quickly became my least favorite.
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Nope, not even close. Any Killer that is vulnerable to the holding W strategy will never be S tier. Nurse, Spirit, and Blight all have the ability to catch up to survivors in seconds and have incredible map mobility. Nemesis doesn't have the ability to catch up with survivors quickly and doesn't really have any map mobility.
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Like everyone is saying, a 3k isn't a lose, in fact it's actually a win for the Killer. Secondly, your complaining about the game lasting 35 min when you were the one standing over hatch and had the power to close it?
This has to be bait.
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Because survivor is the only role where you can play with your friends, killer is unfortunately for the most part a solo experience. Neither role is harder or easier than the other so I don't believe the whole notion that people play survivor because its "easier."
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Nope, it's been there since the rework of this map.
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People have been saying that he's an S tier Killer for a while, if not at the minimum a high A tier. The only reason why people were putting him that low is because no one really knew how to play him but once people started figuring him out they fixed their mistakes and rated him higher. If anyone puts him lower than an A tier now it's because they're bad as him.
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The map in Blights trailer is father cambells chapel.
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@Northener1907 said:
Why everyone keep saying he is Trapper. So what lol? That is not point. Point is good survivors can keep busy killer for minutes. And that is mean killer will lose gens and game. Because survivors have so much God pallets.
Everyone is saying that he's a Trapper because he is the worst Killer in the game, combine that with the fact that he wasn't allowed to use his power and had literally no perks on which shows that this video is a stupid example to show how survivors are "op." This is also a 1v1 meaning that it's not representative of what would actually happen in a real game. In a real game, survivors aren't gonna drop every single pallet early because that'll just create massive deadzones and set up 3 gens for Killers. This is also on one of the strongest survivor maps in the game but if Otz did a 1v1 on Hawkins or suffocation pit the chase times would be way less. Does that mean Killers are op? No.
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This is an awful example to use on how survivor is apparently the "stronger" role. Otz was playing Trapper, the weakest killer in the game, with zero perks and didn't use his power. If he was playing a much better Killer with perks the chase times would be cut down much much more.
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@gatsby said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2199752#Comment_2199752
The Twins don't have to camp at all. I really don't know why people keep perpetuating that stereotype. Especially since the BT buff there's not a ton of advantage to camping because you can't abuse Victor's lack of Terror Radius anymore.
Twins can snowball with slugging but that's hardly unique. Oni, Myers, Billy, Bubba and Nurse commonly do that as well. The only difference with the Twins is that they're horrible with Infectious Fright and rely on the entire team being injured to snowball, which gives them more counterplay to slugging then other Killers.
I worded that a bit wrong, but what I meant to say was that in order for the Twins to win any match they HAVE to slug, camping and tunneling is just something you can do with them to increase your chances, but not necessary. Due to how long it takes to wake up from Victor and his 5 second stun after hitting just a single survivor you will *have* to resort to slugging. They have a massive time efficiency issue and it's pretty easy to see why.
Lets assume that you decide to use Victor to chase down a survivor. After around 8 to 12 seconds you catch up to them quickly (and assuming you don't miss and get a good chunk of your pressure destroyed) then down them. You wait the 5 second stun then take a 2.5 second stun to wake up. Then you have to walk all the way to wherever the survivor is and then pick them up, then you have to bring them all the way to a hook. Assuming nothing else happens then it will have taken you a total of ~28 seconds for that single hook.
The difference between all those Killers and the Twins is that its a requirement to slug with them. Not slugging with them is detrimental and unless your going up against potatoes you will always lose the match. And yes, despite the fact that they rely on the whole team being injured to snowball you can use that against them. Sloppy Butcher is easily their best perk and I always use it whenever I play them, making it ten times more frustrating to play against. It makes it harder to revive dying survivors and injured survivors will constantly waste precious time, all the while the gens are regressing with ruin and their other teammates are being destroyed.
In theory they should have more counter play then those Killers, but they don't. It sounds simple on paper but when you put perks into the equation and the fact that the Twins player is a good one then they have much less counterplay. Your assuming that all the survivors are sticking to each other, which chances are they won't, especially in solo queue. Victor moves at 150% movement speed and has a massive lunge, so unless the survivor player fully understands the Twins (chances are they won't) they'll get downed quickly leading victor to go on a mass slugging spree usually ending in multiple or all the survivors being slugged on the ground.
I can count on a single hand on how many times I've encountered survivors who fully understand the Twins weaknesses and exploited it against me. Encountering a whole team that knows how to play against them is one of the rarest things I've ever seen, in fact I haven't gotten to even go up against one yet.
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@[Deleted User] said:
YeAH, keep complaining.
Cool comment riyasiz, you added so much to the conversation with that!
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@gatsby said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2199481#Comment_2199481
The Twins definitely have bugs, but nothing worse than Blight or Nurse when you're comfortable with them.
As for the slugging argument, I actually think the Twins counterplay is sort of cool. It's like reverse Legion. Grouping up and running healing perks/med-kits is ideal. They're really weak to We're Gonna Live Forever, Desperate Measures, Botany Knowledge and Unbreakable. Also, the Twins encourage Survivors pairing up because Victor CANNOT slug two Survivors that are together due to use 5 second downing vulnerability period or latching mechanic on healthy Survivors
The difference between Blight and Nurse bugs is that even if you encounter a bug with them generally it won't matter too much as they can quickly catch up with survivors, however if you encounter a bug with the Twins you can very easily lose the entire game because of one singular bug. I know this because I've mained Blight since the PTB and play Nurse sometimes. Missing with Victor is the most punishing thing in this game so when you have him bug out at the worst time possible it can screw the player over incredibly hard.
It's good that you find the counterplay cool, but mostly everyone I see hates their gameplay. As Survivor coordinating with your teammates is incredibly hard and frustrating so the counterplay of the Twins and the outcome of the match depends on whether your teammates have any braincells or not. And I've only talked about the slugging part of the Twins, they also have another fun part to them, the camping and tunneling part. As a survivor there is absolutely nothing you can do to counter the Twins camping and tunneling you unless your teammate has BT or you have DS and UB. Otherwise your going to get targeted by Victor and slugged. Also with their most recent nerf playing the Twins feel even more frustrating with the full 5 second stun you have to take every single time you down a person with Victor. It makes them even more slug/camp reliant which means that if you want to win with them your going to have to use those strategies.
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@FrndlyChnswSalzmn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2199465#Comment_2199465
People complained non-stop about PH and Deathslinger until they were nerfed.
PHeads nerf was needed, plus even with his nerf he's still definitely an A tier Killer, but how did Deathslinger get nerfed? He never did.
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@gatsby said:
I feel like all the Killers in 2020 were pretty solid. Twins, Blight, Pyramid Head and Deathslinger are all above average from a power level and gameplay perspective.
Nothing like 2021 has been so far with the failed Clown rework and Trickster existing.
I feel that as well, all the Killer's you mentioned are really powerful when used correct but the point of this post is to talk about how the Twins as a whole was a mistake. Because of how they work you constantly have to slug at the bare minimum meaning that the opposing side is going to have absolutely no fun at all, and then you combine that with the fact that because they're so unique they are also consequently extremely buggy. The most recent bug makes it so that if you pounce on a survivor when you've cornered them you'll go right through them and smack the wall leading to you getting kicked. They have many design flaws and stupid bugs that are ingrained into them meaning that it's going to take a while to fix.
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@FaceCampinBuba said:
I would suggest always using victor when able, to pressure gens. And always pouncing the injured survivors so u can snowball. Position Charlotte in the center of the map or near a 3 gen if u have it. Also run perks that don't require ur hud. For instance 'I'm all ears' dosen't help victor. I use ruin,thrilling tremors, and corrupt.
Don't worry, I know how to play the Twins. Ive kinda mained them since their release and I know the best way to play them, but despite that I still believe that they were one of the worst DLC's BHVR put out. Even now, many months after their release I'm still experiencing game breaking bugs that nearly cost me the game.
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Neither, anyone that says otherwise is one sided. Way too much RNG and other factors to tell if it's survivor or killer sided.
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Yeah, no. Most of those are complete garbage or extremely situational, I mean come on, mettle of man? Poised? Seriously? That's like claiming that Deathbound and Overcharge are meta perks.
There is a *massive* difference between META perks and GOOD perks.
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@TheStabbiNAngeL said:
That's not Pyramid Heads add-on
He has to many right's recharge rate almost in every category ,and too many killer instinct add-ons
He needs something that gives survivors a penalty for stepping in his trails for 45 or 60 seconds are one could be a exhaustion add-on.
Yeah, accidently left that in for Phead. Also forgot that most of PHeads addons are awful so he needs an addon rework.
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@Zeus said:
Scalped topknot is an oni addon. Not pyramid head.
Yeah, my bad wrote this at 2 and didn't notice
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This game was NEVER a horror game. It's always been an action game (and the dev's have acknowledged this fact too), and making a horror game would require so much work it wouldn't even work, in fact it would kill the game. Not only would most of the players leave because the game has been reworked into something entirely but newer players would veer away from a game with a dead player base.
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Both Survivors and Killers in this game are extremely toxic, both sides do stupid things and say stupid things. Just the way DBD is meant to be played causes a lot of toxicity in the game due to certain play styles that cause extreme frustration on both sides. Then you have people who only main only one role act like the other side is constantly coddled by the developers and are insanely overpowered. Moral of the story is don't let anyone tell you what you can and can't do in DBD, there are no rules saying you can't tunnel, camp, slug, tbag, flashlight click, etc.
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That isn't even a SWF problem, that's just matchmaking pairing you up against people who have more hours than you. Even if all of them were solo survivors you would've still lost because they played the game much more better than you did.
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@Kate_Main_01 said:
Survivor main here who has been gone from the game for 8 months!
What makes the Trickster difficult to play? I've not gone against him more than twice so far since my return (a shame!) so I've not gotten to interact with anyone playing him very much. Is he really Michael slow? He felt more Legion in a chase but that could be because of how rusty I am.
He's the one Killer I've been tempted to try and learn to play as just because of his backstory and how unique his appearance is. It's a matter of preference, definitely, but I actually kind of love the neon flamboyance of his design. It is a visually interesting contrast between the rest of the Killers for sure! 😊
Trickster is difficult to play because his power can easily be countered by good survivors and because of that you'll need to play damn near perfectly otherwise you'll lose gens real fast. His main event can be gimped by running around a little rock. When he holds his knives and throws them he moves slower than the survivors and once he starts throwing a bunch of knives he slows down a bit more. And the reason why he feels like legion is because he has all the same design flaws as legion, really underpowered power that downs you no matter how skillful you are and more.
If you want to play him, be warned, he is arguably the second weakest Killer in the game. If you care about winning, then avoid him at all costs but if you just wanna have some fun then he's pretty good at that.
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Damn, you could've just said that you were a Killer main. Inb4 "I've played survivor since 1982 and have 100000^4 hours in the game so I clearly know what I'm talking about!" Try playing solo queue without knowing how to loop and how to efficiently utilize your time. Unless all your teammates are god like or the Killer is a baby, you'll lose real quick.
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@MigrantTheGreat said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2182666#Comment_2182666
I don't consider looping skillful because, I don't sense or feel myself using my brain outplay the killer, I'm just going off of information that's given to me.
I'm at a mind-gameable loop. Oh well, let me wait and peek around the corner fits spoonfed counterplay instead of basing everything off of expirence.
But God forbid a killer that actually makes you make a educated guess, is problematic because I'm not getting the direct counterplay information I need in order to loop the killer for 5 gens.
Looping is objectively a skill based technique, it takes time to learn it and even more time to master looping. Knowing when to chain loops and use the least amount of resources possible is skillful, throwing down every single pallet on the map is not. You may not consider looping skillful, but your opinion doesn't change the fact that it IS.
And Spirit is just awfully designed, unless you have a bias she, and many other things in this game are awfully designed. Her power gives absolutely no information which makes the chase a guessing game where the odds are stacked against the survivor. Look at Nurse, she's objectively the best Killer in the game yet she still offers the survivors plenty of information to go off of, such as whenever she's holding a blink, showing the survivor the blink location, and audio cues whenever she blinks. Despite all of this she is still the best Killer in the game.
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@MigrantTheGreat said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2182553#Comment_2182553
There's nothing skill based about survivor's besides skill-checks and flashlights!
Damn, guess all those hours of learning how to loop, how to counter each killer, how to be as time efficient as possible, how to maximize chase time, and other skills just don't count as skill :/
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@DapperTrapper said:
I don't think the twins and hag are boring to play as. Hag is slow sure but it's super satisfying. I had a Nancy t-bag me after a pallet stun and when she tried to run away she stepped on a trap and I immediately killed her.
Twins are extremely fast paced too so it's not hard to have fun with them, specially if you leave Victor camping
Deathslinger is pretty frustrating to play as if you have bad aim.
And as for survivor, I thought they found Huntress extremely frustrating because of bullshit hit shots,and people tend to DC more against doctor than Spirit
I don't think the twins are boring to play as, in fact I kind of main them but after the most recent nerf to them they are extremely annoying to play as. I've had many situations where if it weren't for the 5 second cooldown I could've gotten more downs. Even in the situations where I manage to successfully get a down it takes sooo long to get back to the survivor and just makes them feel like crap to play as well. Deathslinger is pretty annoying when you miss your shots but usually I manage to hit mine. I would've put huntress in the frustrating category but I put her in the meh category assuming that in a match she doesn't hit you from 500 miles away.
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@DawnMad said:
You or them probably have high ping.
It couldn't be me since I frequently check my ping whenever I go up against on of the killers I stated before. Every single time I check mine it's always in between 60 and 100, and I highly doubt that every single GF, Nurse, and Michael I go up against have high ping.
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I don't think her power is overpowered but it is certainly not balanced, so somewhere in-between overpowered and balanced. The problem with spirit is the lack of information she gives to survivors which essentially just turns every chase into a big guessing game where the odds are stacked against you each time. This could be fixed by giving survivors the occasional sound cue whenever she phases, kind of like the spirit bug a couple months back where she would make breathing noises whenever she phased which gave her much needed counterplay but not as obvious as that. Maybe instead of breathing noises they could give her a unique chase music and they can make certain instruments play whenever she phases, something that involves the survivor needing to listen and pay attention to the environment just like the spirit needs too.
Her addons for the most part are fine except a couple, such as the duration addons. I'm not sure if they fixed it but I read somewhere that the duration addons for some reason also come with the unintended affect of making your power recharge faster meaning that all the duration addons are essentially two addons combined into one. Also mother daughter ring combined with yakuyoke amulet is extremely powerful and deserves a nerf. Other than that though I'd say that her addons are fine enough.
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Because Survivor gameplay is completely different from Killer gameplay and requires different balancing decisions and in return for not having many second chance perks Killers have much, much, more slowdown perks than survivors have perks that make objectives go through faster. It all balances out in the end.
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Too bad most people won't listen to this or will play the other side for 1 game and decide that's enough to form an opinion on how the game is still harder for the side they main.
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It's obvious that you've never been in a match where you get hooked, then tunneled off of hook only to get moried immediately after or have had a teammate suffer the same fate. Moris were objectively OP.
But yeah, more mori animations would be pretty cool.
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@xEzekanarioX said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2173788#Comment_2173788
Who would refuse to play the easiest role of the game? Please be honest.
Yeah alright dude, your either baiting or have a strong bias for Killer. Either way there's obviously no point in arguing with you, but your wrong as hell. Both sides take skill to play as, neither one is easy to learn.
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@xEzekanarioX said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2173630#Comment_2173630
Its funny how survivor mains say that the game is killer sided... but they dont want to play killer.
Hmmm
That goes for both sides, some KiIller mains will say that the game is survivor sided and refuse to play survivor.
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@Okapi said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2173179#Comment_2173179
The devs aren't oversupplying survivor players on purpose. It's more of an accident. Player populations peak during the evenings and that's when survivors face lengthy queue times and killers almost instant queue times. Which means the game has more people survivor than is needed right now. The question is why?
Now some might say who cares? But the issue is it's forcing newer and more casual killers into matches against high rank survivors, which increases the difficulty and unfun factor of the game for them. Faced with such difficulty in what is meant to be a casual party game, many leave or stick to survivor. Only compounding the killer shortage.
For me the biggest reason why a large chunk of DBD players refuse to play killer regurarly are as follows:
- Optimization hurting killers more. On low end platforms/hardware killers suffer with more consistent FPS drops than survivors. It's why 360s were so common a tactic against console killers before crossplay. It was easy to pull off when killers saw their game turn into a slideshow when survivors got close to them.
- The lack of social element with killer. People like to play with their friends and if you want to play killer with your friends you have to have 4 other friends available to do so. Plus unlike survivors who can earn bloodpoints, dailies, rift challenges, and shards from playing with friends, killers are forced into custom games where no progress is earned.
- Their is a difficulty whiplash that comes from the solo-SWF gap. A casual killer who first starts out against uncoordinated solos will learn to play the game at a more slower pace with more mistakes. But then they start getting matched against SWF and they suddenly start doing terrible. The game gives them no warning if they are going against SWF or solos. So they are then forced to tryhard and sweat every match just in case. Which turns off people looking for fun matches that don't force everyone to sweat. A lot of people get into this game to roleplay playing their favourite horror icons, but DBD's current gen/kill rush meta scares off a lot of those killer players.
- No easy way to train as killer. Survivors can join up with a friend who can show them the ropes, but killers are all alone. The only way for killers to get help is through custom games and as I mentioned in point 2, that requies having 4 other players on hand to help you.
Honestly besides a few killers (Trapper, Myers, Depipster, Pig) killers are not as weak as they were in the past. The issue is killer is not fun for too many people and in the long run this will hurt DBD. High rank survivors will only endure long ass queue times for so long before leaving the game.
The killer shortage is problem of people not having fun and I do think addressing my 4 points will make killer fun.
I think we can just agree to disagree. I've never agreed with the notion that the game is survivor favored or killer favored, the game is balanced currently but people will NEVER admit to that because of their one sided entitlement or the fact that they just can't accept the fact that after they won 10 times in a row and lost a single match that the developers are X sided and only care about that one side.
One of the possible reasons why survivor queues are sometimes higher than killer queue times is matchmaking being matchmaking and pairing up people against more skilled people, resulting in frustration for that person. And about the whole unfun factor, that happens to both sides, Killers get tbagged and clicky's while survivors spend 2 minutes in a game before being booted back or sit on hook as they watch their teammates selfcare in a corner and a killer who refuses to leave the area. Both sides deal with BS, however my guess as to why Killers get angrier is probably one of the reasons you mentioned, the fact that Killer is a solo experience and as such you can't hang out with your buddy to make the experience sweeter.
*Optimization is a big problem in DBD, especially for consoles like the PS4, Switch, and Xbox 1. I won't argue, it's pretty dumb how BHVR still haven't optimized the game which causes huge issues for both sides, mainly for Killer recently.
*Talked about it earlier but its an issue that will probably never be solved because of how the game works, unless BHVR implement a 2v8 mode, but that will probably never happen with how slow they are to implement updates and how many problems are in the game. However, you don't need 4 other people to play Killer in custom games, I play custom games with 2 of my friends and the game works perfectly fine as long as we implement a couple of rules beforehand.
*Yup, there's a gap between solo and SWF, I won't argue against that. It's a hard problem to fix, but making a better tutorial for both sides will fix many of the frustrations and practice issues both sides have. However, I don't believe that it's SWF that's the big issue, but once again matchmaking. If a rank 20 killer and a rank 20 four man SWF go up against each other, it'll still be a mostly fair experience since both sides don't know what they are doing, but if a rank 16 killer goes up against a rank 10 four man SWF, then yeah, that will be unfair for the Killer since they don't know the game fully yet and despite the survivors also being relatively inexperienced will still probably win because they know more about the game.
*The Gen/Kill rush meta is something that will probably never be solved due to the nature of the game and its players. For example, a survivor looking for a casual experience repeatedly gets tunneled, camped, and slugged and learns quickly that they need to stick on gens and be extremely efficient, or they'll get sacrificed. Then that same survivor goes up against a killer, and during the match the killer who was looking for a fun casual experience quickly gets destroyed and suffers a defeat. That Killer then learns that in order to stand a chance, they'll need to camp, tunnel, and slug. Then that killer encounters a survivor who is looking for a casual experience, and you can guess the rest. This cycle then gets repeated multiple times and as a result people either are forced to use unfun strategies or just leave the game altogether.
*I heavily disagree with this point, when my friend first started playing DBD and got curious about Killer I decided to set up a couple of 1v1 custom games and managed to teach him the basics of DBD and even a couple of advanced tricks, and even though he's not perfect he managed to climb up the ranks quickly and even when going up against stronger teams usually ended the game with a 2k. People without someone to play custom games with are the people with the most issues, but this game be solved by offering a better tutorial or improving on custom games with bots.
Both sides have their fair share of issues that need solving, both sides will repeatedly get stupidly unfun games, but the reason why survivors stick around for longer is because they have friends to play with. With how people on both sides play this game and the nature of it, its a problem that is incredibly difficult to fix and with how the devs are will probably result in even more frustration if they try and fix it. But if they do some of the things you and I mentioned I do believe that DBD will improve on their queue times and overall improve the experience on both sides.
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@DawnMad said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2173188#Comment_2173188
I play killer on red ranks regularly and I see a key 1 out of 5 matches, it was much worse a few months ago too. Also no one is exaggerating how strong keys are, the moment you lose your 3rd generator 2 people can escape with a key the moment others die and you can't do much to prevent it other than heavy slugging. If people are failing to use it then that's them being incompetent, nothing to do with the keys.
I also play rank 1 Killer yet rarely ever do see keys, and have continued to be rare for me to encounter. Keys are definitely over exaggerated with how strong they are. They aren't an Insta-win item and can be countered so long as you aren't playing a weak killer or going up against the rare 4 man comp team, although I will acknowledge that they do make the match more stressful. In order for two people to escape with a key, they need to have completed 3 gens total, and even then the Killer has already received two kills, just the way the devs intended. If you got two kills and the survivors escaped through the hatch, then yeah sure, it sucks but you still received a 2k which is suppose to be average. You can stop this from happening by just using more camping, tunneling, and or slugging. And just because a survivor isn't able to use a key doesn't necessarily mean they are incompetent, sometimes they just get out skilled or they couldn't find the hatch in time.
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@DawnMad said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2173179#Comment_2173179
It's been like this since the Mori changes, so it's probably all of the killers done with seeing keys in every lobby.
I play Killer frequently but I almost never even see keys in lobbies, and even when I do I just put on slightly better addons and end up winning anyways. I'm 99% sure everyone is overexaggerating to the extreme on how often they see keys and how strong they are.
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How are the devs oversupplying survivor players? Recently we've just gotten a nerf and a rework for two of the most complained about perks, DS and OoO. Queue times for survivor at night are high but during the morning it switches around and killer takes longer to load in while survivors are instant. And the reason why lower ranked killers are sometimes being ranked up with higher ranked survivors is because of how lobbies function. If a killer leaves a lobby then the game tries to find a killer as quick as possible for that lobby which involves getting a killer from a lower rank.
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Well, the problem is that as soon as Huntress hatchets hit a survivor they immediately get injured which means that there isn't really a way to buff Deathslinger (other than a desperately needed addon rework) to be at the same level of Huntress imo.
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Trickster has all the same god awful design choices as old legion. Power that takes really long to down someone but has no counterplay, and despite their power being oppressively, they're still really bad killers over all. It's incredibly frustrating to see BHVR put out a awfully designed killer, and the worst part about is that they have to be really careful with how they buff Trickster, because one wrong move is all it takes for him to become the most oppressive killer.
I could go on and on about how his power has nothing that the other killers can't do better. You find someone out of position? Yeah sure but there are also countless other killers that can punish survivors for being out positioned, like Bubba. You trying to down someone at a loop? Deathslinger, Spirit, and other chase heavy killers can down survivors within seconds, even at strong loops. His power sucks, and his main event sucks even harder. Not only is it super situational but it can be countered by running around a tall loop, or hell, even a rock for crying out loud. Easily the worst designed killer, right next to old legion.
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I'm pretty sure the dev's never intended for people to kill themselves on hook as a way to bypass the 5 minute ban timer, so using that as an excuse to be able to toggle skill checks on hook is dumb. And the devs have stated before that they want the struggle state on hook to be interactive (something along the lines of that) so being able to just use a scroll wheel to catch a break is also a bad excuse to bring it back.
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It's all subjective, some people like me find killer more relaxing, and others will find killer more stressful and survivor more relaxing.
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@Freki said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2156402#Comment_2156402
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2156493#Comment_2156493
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2156403#Comment_2156403
hmmm let me see oh "Undying is sooo oppressive!!!!" 3 months after they put the perk in the game they nuked that into the ground. let me see freddy's being nuked, survivors mori's are oppressive! killers keys are broken! moris get nuked, keys ignored 6-7 months. need I go on? oh yea spirit's prayer beads are too oppressive! changes them to map wide, making it a meme thing only like legions iri button but there is no second action for prayer beads like button.
it's been a great deal lately and very LITTLE nerfing on the survivors side... oh they do some but not to the extent that the killers get it. in this up coming package huntress, freddy and two others are getting nerfs and one nerf is accompanied by a small buff. and DS was changed to what it should be and is deserved. freddy's gutting was not deserved!
Undying WAS oppressive, perks like Ruin aren't meant to be up forever and it was quite often that survivors would need to cleanse Ruin multiple times combined with the fact that on killers like Blight, Nurse, Spirit, and other strong killers you would usually end up losing a match because you got unlucky with Ruin. Plus, it had absolutely no synergy with token based hex's which made them obsolete. Freddy is being nerfed for a good reason, he has many things in his kit, far more than most killers and none of it has any punishment for him. Look at Demogorgon, he's essentially a much weaker Freddy. Freddy has stronger anti loop as it allows him to spam snares on a loop without being slowed down while Demogorgon needs line of sight and even then can be juked on top of all that. Freddy can teleport to any generator and yeah, Demogorgon can teleport anywhere but it requires him to go over to that place, place down the portal, and then even after all that has a global audio cue, a visual cue, and his portals can be destroyed. I could go on and on but I'm not going to for time.
Mori's got nuked for a really good reason. Keys also need a nerf, but its not as simple as changing a singular number. They need an entire rework, addons included. Spirit prayer beads were quite possibly the most overpowered addon in DBD, the amount of free grabs you would get with this item and the complete lack of information on the survivor side made facing off against a prayer bead spirit to be a extremely tough match, usually ending up in a loss for them if they weren't coordinated enough.
Just because one side gets nerfed doesn't mean the other one also needs a nerf and vice versa. Sometimes one side will get nerfed or buffed more than another one, that's how balancing works. Remember that one period of time where survivors got infinites removed, Insta heals nerfed, and toolboxes nerfed? Those were heavy nerfs, but did you see the devs also compliment that change by destroying Killers as exchange for doing that? Did you see them make every Killer a 110 because they took out infinites? No, because that's not how balancing works.
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@Lord_Tony said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2159967#Comment_2159967
It would be a start because comms is ######### destroying this damn game.
No amount of balance can be fixed because of comms.
OOO broken because of comms.
knockout? Broken because of comms
aura reading perks? No need you have comms
myers and ghostface trying to jump scare you? Welp you got comms to tell you where they are.
Comms are broken and I'm tired of pretending it's not
While yes, comms are very strong, they're one of the only thing keeping this game from dying. You take out the ability for people to play with their friends or simply punsih them for having the audacity to try and have fun with each other and you'll have the playerbase drop hard. It is an incredibly hard aspect to balance, and the best thing BHVR could do is buff solo queue, and even then with how long they take to do anything it would take years to buff solo queue to SWF level and every killer to SWF level.
And yes, even though comms give you a pretty significant advantage, it doesn't give you a free win or immediately nullify aura perks. Perks knockout (Although at a lesser degree) still work, the average SWF player isn't that much better from the average solo queuer.
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@Lord_Tony said:
Sure it can.
Nerf SWF
or
Buff killers/solos
it's the only way to make this game balanced once and for all.
Yeah, no. Even if SWF were to receive a nerf or solos got a buff, this game would NEVER in a infinite amount of time become balanced because it's an assymetrical game. The very nature of DBD and how widely different every perk, killer, item, map and other variables just make it impossible to balance. Assymetrical games are notorious for being impossible to balance for a reason.
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@HarleyQuin_n2K16 said:
So as a 5 year player for killer main and dabble in survivor when my friends want to play SWF.
1.) I cannot believe they did this but the mori nerf
2.) the inclusion of more pallets under the assumption they're "unsafe"
3.) 2/3 of the killer perks are unusable because gen speeds have been a problem since 2017 once survivors started to learn skill checks and how to 360 their camera while working on gens.
4.) infinite loops; just infinite loops why...who thought of this?
5.) Including the effective replacement of exhaustion perks with second chance perks. Before we only had lithe, sprint burst, dead hard, and balanced landing and used vigil to regen our exhaustion while running to use them again rather than get a full on second life.
6.) Size of the maps with the abundance of gens available to work on, and the skewing of maps to be "Survivor" or "Killer" sided. When each wall basically has a window, or pallet attached to it and most are tall enough to block projectiles.
7.) The amount of notifications a survivor gets about the killer from red stain to terror radius gives too much tools to plan rather than play in the moment.
8.) Few perks and abilities actually work in the basement now so that basement builds are null and void because of the fact only a few killers can utilize it which also takes away a perk offered without being a teachable monstrous shrine which refers to point 3.
9.) The SWF coms have not been addressed or even attempted to be balanced, constant live feed to the team while the killer has only himself to rely on and detection perks do not compare to live coms communicating his location and actions. This is made even worse with SWF using Object on one of them broad casting from a distance where and what the killer is doing.
10.) Hex totems are the most problematic thing to be added to DBD yes they can be clutch but over night every survivor learned the spawn locations and devs refuse to make these permeant perks because killers having strong perks makes it unfair for you but when we spend 5 min chasing you for one more hit for a down and you stab us stunning us and running away AGAIN...that's ok its balanced.
11.) Keys, why do survivors need a get out of trial free card. The killer can play perfectly not tunneling, camping, or slugging and the survivors can still 4 man escape with gens still to work on or not. Even if the hatch is closed can still be opened with a key.
12.) Killers are supposed to be faster but still take 2-3 min to make one hit if not able to make a surprise hit but with all the alerts a survivor has now red stain, terror radius, alert, spine chill, kindred. Its very hard.
13.) Unlike survivors who do not have locked perks to their survivor killers have locked abilities. So some killers are straight up not playable if you want to win, if you do win with them you sweat really hard then hear from survivors about how trash campy tryhard sweaty and other things they say if they lose a game the devs created for them to win.
If you think playing killer is easier than survivor or survivor is hard, you are just not on the level the rest of us are at. Using the 6 tools that are not perks given to you and still not winning you have other things you need to learn than complaining about camping killers here or anything. We camp because the game forces us to kill one survivor ASAP so gens do not pop faster than cranking a jack in the box. If the devs buffed killer side it would make both sides feel more relaxed and open up more builds than second chances and gen rush.
- Moris were the most overpowered thing in the game at the time. If your arguing against this, then your hopeless.
- Yeah, which maps have gotten a buff to their number of pallets? Even if they added more pallets, like you said, they're unsafe which means they could be mind gamed relatively easily and even ignored.
- Most of the survivor perks are also unusable due to how awful their affects are, like power struggle.
- Infinite loops are gone. They were removed a year ago.
- Yeah, not sure what your even going on about dude. DS, UB, and Adrenaline were perks since the beginning or close to the beginning. Nothing wrong with second chance perks.
- Some maps are more killer sided and some are more survivor sided, its just how it is.
- You can abuse the fact that survivors rely on your red light and do moonwalks to get hits on them. Those tools are necessary, otherwise you'd turn every killer into a stealth killer.
- How is that a killer problem? The reason why not many perks affect basement hooks is because if they did you can easily take advantage and camp around the basement or inside of it and punish the survivor for simply just being there. Even if there was a decent basement perk, no one would use it because why would you? There's ten times better perks than that, it'd be way to niche.
- Some things about SWF are being addressed, like OoO, and anyways the problem is much more complex than you think. Nerfing SWF outright would harm the game and wouldn't fix any of the problems they bring.
- If your asking for hex totems to be made permanent perks, then you are seriously biased and don't understand a single thing about balance, which makes this list more understandable now that I think about it. Making devour hope or ruin permanent would break the game. Period.
- Keys are broken but they exist just like how mori's exist. Both act as a second chance in order to save time.
- Killers are faster than survivors, it really isn't that hard to hit a survivor unless they're extremely good and your playing trapper or trickster. Killers like Blight or stealth killers can get easy first hits in.
- Some Killer's are weaker than other, but no killer is unwinnable or unplayable with. Every killer is viable to play with, and just like how some survivors like to call killers sweaty tryhard's there are also killers that will slander you just for surviving. Don't act like its only one side being entitled. And if the devs truly did create a game for survivors to win, why buff killers or nerf survivors at all? Wouldn't that defeat the purpose of letting them win? Better yet, why do they say they want to balance the game around a 2k? If they wanted to let survivors win wouldn't they make it a 0k? Your logic makes no sense because people like you have their head so far up their ass and refuse to see the other sides problem and only acknowledge your own, because blaming the devs is easier than saying that you aren't good at the game and the lose you probably received was justified. There are BS scenarios in this game for both sides, no one side has it worse than the other. For every killer who gets tbagged by a 4 man there is a solo queuer getting tunneled and watching on as a Claudette sits in the corner while meg self cares with sloppy butcher.
If you think that survivor is an easy playing experience, then you've got another thing coming. Don't act like your good at the game, because its clear from these messages you have roughly 100 hours on this game maximum, and maybe 10 hours on survivor. You don't understand anything balance wise for this game and have only seen the problems on one side, refusing to acknowledge the other sides problems. You refuse to acknowledge the buffs and nerfs on the killer and survivor side and instead choose to live in ignorance. Play both sides for at least 200 hours and you'll understand how awfully wrong you are.
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@danielmaster87 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2156976#Comment_2156976
"Survivors need another objective." "Let's destroy this perk that gives survivors another objective because it's 'op'."
Love how you only mentioned undying and not the other changes. And no, survivors don't need another objective, at least not one as oppressive as old undying. Hex perks like ruin are incredibly powerful and are only stopped by the fact that they're a hex, undying made it last much much more longer than it was suppose to meaning that it would singlehandedly win games. it'd be the equivalent if a 4 man SWF was running OoO, Ds, Dh, and Ub.
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@Ethelwulf said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2156403#Comment_2156403
Survivor mains are so cringe. Legion is ######### because of you yet you wash your hands. I'm so glad I started to camp and tunnel like crazy on every game. Enjoy your long queues only to get camped.
Jeez dude, atleast try to hide your bias. Entitled killer mains like you are also just as awful as entitled survivor mains, you aren't any better then them so stop acting like you are. And camping and tunneling every survivor you come across isn't gonna fix anything, in fact it makes you an awful person as well because statistically speaking most of those survivors probably haven't done anything to you to warrant it.
Your message says a lot about you as a person.