coppersly
coppersly
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@TWiXT said:
Oni masks have power behind them, some are even thought of as an object that seals them away and only through great turmoil or sacrifice can they once again regain their true form. It's possible that Rin's father isn't the new killer at all, and that his actions have unintentionally revived an ancient Oni trapped in the mask he acquired and coveted. All it may have needed was an offering of the blood of the innocent to be revived, and Rin's father provided that in gallons.
Either that, or Rin's fathers/mothers spirits are now donning the mask and will use it to brutally punish the living. All i'm Hoping for is another killer who is viable at high ranks. I predicted it last summer: I Said that if they "nerf" the Nurse's base kit, all that will do is prove that if the community of survivors whine hard enough... they can take down a top tier viable killer. After that, the next thing we'd see on these forums is a torrent of "Spirit/Hillbilly OP, Plz Nerf" posts, and to my chagrin, apparently I was correct in that prediction. In order to balance out this loss, I'm hoping they give us another killer that can fill in the Viability hole the Nurse left behind. As of right now, Red ranks are mostly populated with Spirit and Billy, with a few Freddy's thrown in, and some Ghost Face's, but the latter 2 don't have the same Viability power Nurse used to in order to be considered completely viable as opposed to the former.
With Spirit next on the "chopping block", I really want the next killer to be viable enough to fill in the gap, and give killer players something new they can work with at the high ranks. I'm not saying that it needs to be OP, and instead I'm Hoping that it will be competitive enough that it's able to add more Killer diversity to the high ranks than we are currently experiencing.
I prefer female killers because they are usually more interesting (Nurse, Hag, Spirit, Huntress) the best male killers are like... Freddy I guess? Idk female killers just have more interesting lore and cool designs. And more unique powers.
That being said, I hope it is her mother using the Oni Mask. Although due to someone else posting a snippet of the lore mentioning the Mask and the estate... it doesn't seem likely that she or even her father are using the mask. The original owner seems to be the most likely.
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@PoisonN said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/833095#Comment_833095
Yes... and imagine with BL? She's a 96% speed killer btw but wow, we have add ons who increase her speed!! Such fun
Don't forget one that rewards you using your power with... removing your power!
Well done indeed.
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@LordRegal said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/833063#Comment_833063
I take issue with this logic because “knowing when to use your blinks” has become “you are a one blink Nurse until you are 100% confident you have the second hit on a survivor because using it any other time forcibly makes you a one blink Nurse for the rest of the chase.” That’s not skill, that’s forced gameplay.
Exactly! She was versatile before, able to be used as you see fit. Now it's use it this one specific way or get punished for it. That's not fun or versatile.
@PoisonN said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/833058#Comment_833058
So you're assuming that the old Nurse was just a spam toy who were able to down instantly? I guess you underestimate how difficult she used to be. Now she is even worse. Just because my killer is "oVerPerForMinG" doesn't mean that she need to be mediocre
I wish I played the Nurse these people use, spamming blinks and instantly getting downs must be really cool. Too bad it was never in the game.
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@crossboy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/833034#Comment_833034
I've played her both before and after, and still enjoy her. I haven't had as much time to get used to it, but she's much better now imo. Instead of just being able to blink all the time as much as possible, now you actually have to think about whether or not it's worth it to blink the second time. "can I get a hit here if I use my second blink, or should I save it and blink twice at them?" She's much more rewarding for players that are skilled with her, which is what she should be.
Why do people always try to assume people dont know what they're talking about and flame them for it without even knowing? It just makes you look silly.
What is skillful or fun about having your power limited artificially (blinking easily half as much before the changes) or when it screws you and eats a blink or the charge wasn't done so you lost the 2nd blink?
These are not skillful interactions, they're a byproduct of band-aid patch on Nurse that doesn't make mechanically or logical sense.
And who cares if they were spamming blinks? I'll let you in on a secret: if they were bad it doesn't matter if they were using blinks 24/7 or barely using it at all. SPAMMING BLINKS DOESN'T = REWARD. It just means you're moving a lot. That's all it has ever meant. You must USE YOUR SKILL in combination with the blink or nothing happens. Why does this stupid argument keep coming up?
If a trapper places a million bad traps or no traps, is there a difference? No, it takes skill to know where/when to place the trap. Spamming them doesn't get you a reward, it is the SAME for Nurse, except now you can't even use your power with confidence or fun anymore.
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@Johnny_XMan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/832982#Comment_832982
@coppersly if blinking constantly was part of her design then they would have just given her the constant blink as a mobility power and not let her hit WHILE blinking because that’s what broke her.
You could literally blink infront of a survivor sometimes and swing and you’d get a guaranteed hit. That doesn’t exactly scream skill especially when you have already blinked enough to correct your mistakes.
The act of blinking itself leading to a hit is what takes skill.
You must know the right amount of charge so you don't go too far/too little
Plan ahead and try and predict where they're going to be in a few seconds
And on top of it when you finally blink right on someone you have to get lucky and be able to swing (the bugs make this almost a skill tbh, too many times I've blinked and been unable to swing)
So unless you're doing all of those things, you WERE NOT GOING TO GET A HIT. It is never free, it never hands you a free hit unless someone is a potato and walks into you, and there was always counterplay.
And you know what really doesn't scream skill? Running in a straight line across the map being the counter to a killer.
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@CrowFoxy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/828923#Comment_828923
No. She's terrible now. I can't believe I play a character for 2 years then she gets rekt, when they said only add ons. And I was HYPED for add ons changes. Almost all were useless.. now they're actually terrible.
Yeah I was hyped too, finally more useful addons other than extra blinks/omega.
What did we get? Some kinda useful ones... and a lot of the same stuff no one uses or actively hurts the killer.
@jus_Ignant said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/833004#Comment_833004
Forget 'like before', I haven't seen any in all the games I've played since the update.
Not 1, compared to previous times climbing the ranks you'd always get a few at least in the red ranks. What a shame.
I'd like to see the #'s of Nurses playing now compared to a similar time frame before the 'change'.
I bet they won't release the number, it would show just how much no one liked the changes.
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@PolarBear said:
I haven't played much Nurse due to issues with dedicated servers and blinking, but the time I played I can say I did not enjoy. I didn't despise it either but I won't be picking her, at least for a while.
Just because something was not successful before, does not mean bhvr should refrain from doing that. The devs are not out to ruin the fun of their players, the would be incredibly stupid of them.
What currently however is ruining the fun of a lot players is Spirit. Even if you don't agree with it, she is killing too well for one reason or another so they have to do something.
I do not want bhvr to butcher her, I really don't, but keeping her how she is not gonna fix the problem.
I honestly believe if we buff low tier killers into viability, Spirit use will go down since you can actually play another killer in high elo and not get stomped.
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@Outland said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/832963#Comment_832963
Marth however slugs in order to keep survivors under control. So he sees a lot of DC's because it wasn't enough for the survivors to complain the nurse into mediocrity, they still don't like how Killers play her.
If people still DC against new Nurse DbD honestly isn't for them. How can anyone feel that she's unfair to go against now? Just walk forward lmao.
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@HamdaN said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/832956#Comment_832956
if you have issues with current nurse, you were never a good nurse to begin with. her blinks now require actually thinking and not just mindless no cd flying around. with that kind of opinion you probably relied on omegablink or multiple extra blinks. its clear as day
I enjoyed Omega-Blink, no shame. I was never very good with the extra blinks tbh.
However, I was plenty capable of winning without either of those addons. It took a little longer and was harder, but still I was able to destroy countless survivors who ran in straight lines or tried looping like I was another killer.
Now it doesn't matter that you're Nurse, you are an m1 killer in-between blinking. There is no rewording that, when you are not blinking now there is no amount of skill or thought involved, it's a limitation without any way to get more out of it. You can't do something new or interesting or EVEN MINDGAME LIKE YOU USED TO, it's literally completely and utterly a negative compared to the old kit. Saying it takes skill not to use your power is just... stupid.
And blinking constantly was PART OF HER DESIGN. She is the slowest in the game BECAUSE YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO USE HER POWER TO MOVE. That usually requires using it back-to-back constantly. And it does take skill because if you're blinking a lot without any skill you're going to fling yourself way past them or no where near them or even not move because blink got eaten by the map. It is stupid to say she was OP because you could blink constantly, IT TOOK SKILL to use those blinks to get hits, they didn't just happen because you held m2.
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@GrootDude said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/832948#Comment_832948
The fact that you think Nurse was only good on pc is just wrong. Console has good nurses but she is harder to use.
I know that there are good Nurses on console, I acknowledge their existence. But they are very far and few between, and the devs have shown she is indeed the single WORST killer on all platforms but PC. After these changes I wonder if her killrate will sink even lower?
I hope every stat about her gets much worse, so that maybe they'll revert it or try a better change. God, almost any suggestion is better than what we got man.
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I hope he's fun and powerful too.
But given the track record, neither of those is likely.
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I agree.
Less rewarding and less versatile are apt descriptions of what they did.
They took away mind-games, map pressure, and just the good ol' ability to use your power the way it was intended (for everything)
Now she's a hollow shell of what made her great. And I really hate hearing that the cooldown addons make her almost like old-Nurse, because 2 seconds in-between charges is still long enough to cut down on blinks by over 40% (it's literally just a 1-second difference with both addons, still 2/3 more than before)
If they do anything like this to more killers, I will be laughing. Because they clearly want the game to die, or are pulling an Overwatch 2 and want people to play the new one and ditch the old.
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@GrootDude said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/832771#Comment_832771
Never said “pip”, my comment says I rarely “de-pip” from a 2k. It is entirely possible to safety pip with a 2k.
Indeed it is. But Mr_K put it pretty good as to why the 2k system isn't going to work
@Mr_K said:
At red ranks where pipping requires 13 points. A 2 kill 2 escape game would result in a black pip or a depip 9/10 times. In order to advance in this rank you have to, by BHVR's definition of balance, overperform. Thus whatever killer you choose to play will show up on the Devs stats as in need of slight tweaking.
Being that Nurse was the most popular killer at red ranks, she ofcourse would require 3-4k a match to even be there. Because she is hard to play, low rank baby Nurses usually don't perform very well balancing the numbers. But because of being the killer of choice at a rank that requires more than 2k to advance in, she was overperforming and in need
nerfsslight tweaks.Spirit, not requiring to use her power to kill low rank survivors and being effective enough to get over 2k in red ranks to rank up, is next on the chopping block. All because BHVR has two conflicting ideologies.
I agree with you, it seems logical and all that until you hit red rank/rank 1, where you HAVE to get a pip (at this point being easily a 3k possibly even 4k for a single pip) to even stay at that rank. By definition the 2k system does not work at the highest level of play, it simply does not provide the incentive or method for a fun game. So many issues at the highest levels of play where they willfully ignore issues because casuals don't experience them, but they'll nerf Nurse who was only good on ONE single platform and ONLY in red ranks... smh.
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@Yung_Slug said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/832297#Comment_832297
Look, I don't think they should have nerfed her base kit, nor do I agree with the "nerf strong killers" mentality (weaker killers should definitely be buffed instead to diversify the meta), but Nurse is a special case.
Nurse was S-tier at base and SS-tier with certain add-ons. Her add-ons definitely needed to be changed, I'm sure we agree on that. I don't think they handled it well, and I feel like they gave her two different reworks that don't really work with each other. Still, she's not "destroyed" like people say. I could be convinced that she's not the best killer anymore, but her ability to ignore most defenses survivors have still put her on another level from most killers.
Also, are you sure running in a straight line counters her? The only time I've seen that work is with the two add-ons that make your blinks worse. And it definitely doesn't work with the recharge add-ons, which make her power almost identical to original nurse (which are only green + yellow, which you can easily get more of each game. I've been almost exclusively using the same green and yellow add-ons on Myers for a long time now and I don't even spend all of the BP I get from him on his bloodweb).
Again, I liked going against Nurse before the changes, and she definitely got needlessly nerfed, but she's still high-tier. I'm just tired of people saying she's "destroyed" or "trash" or "C-tier", because that's complete nonsense.
Mechanically wise I guess she's still close to high A tier.
On the fun spectrum though she's a hard Freddy tier. (Old Freddy)
I'm glad we agree the addons were the only thing in need of changing, and that they did that poorly too. For running in a straight line, yes it does work sadly. And if you're about to catch up they can always fake running one way and double back while you recharge. The counterplay went from it's intended hard to do, to an AWFUL gracious and easy to accomplish manner.
In the last few games before I uninstalled, survivors weren't doing ANYTHING but running in a straight line to the other side of the map, avoiding generators as well as they could. It completely worked, it took at least 4~5 blinks to actually get within decent range of them, and then another 2~7 depending on how much junk they could loop around during the cooldown.
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@luvcraft said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/829929#Comment_829929
are we playing the same game? I frequently de-pip with 3 kills!
Lmao, he openly admitted to pipping with 2ks... so green/yellow ranks?
Yikes do some people even understand the mechanics behind this game.
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@Neas_last_breath said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/832591#Comment_832591
Nurse's changes
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/832591#Comment_832591
Nurse's changes were bad
base kit nurse was fine
I agree with you. And even if they have to change her for whatever reason they have, there are so many better ways that limit her without destroying her like they did.
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@TeambossFloze said:
Surely its this guy -
The estate was bought by the first of the Yamaoka, a shipwreck survivor, who came from a distant ashy island. He washed ashore just as political tensions sparked the flames of war.
Yamaoka joined the battlefield and unleashed hell on his foes. No one could match the raw fury of his Katana, which elevated him to a legend. They say his devilish mask haunted the dreams of all men.
Yeah if this isn't related to or the actual killer... like wow lol what a throw away.
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@TWiXT said:
Unfortunately, I don't believe there will be a Survivor in the next chapter. In the Devs Roadmap for the year, Chapter 14 is listed without a new Map, and the previous 2 times the roadmap listed a chapter release without a map, we got Ash, and Ghost Face. Also considering that Chapter 13 released with 2 survivors, it's more likely this will be a stand alone killer chapter since the current survivor roster is at 19, and the killers are at 17.
Remember that survivors are the more important role to care about. We're lucky we're not like hero shooters where there are 348234 DPS and like 13 healers and tanks.
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@NMCKE said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/831441#Comment_831441
Add the cool-down to your average chase time. ??
As simply and lovely as that sounds; it most definitely does not work like this. If you factor in speedburst perks being even more effective now, and the incredibly easy to juke hits now you have to add much more than 5 seconds to the chase time.
Ooops, looks like you accidentally started a blink with the cooldown at 99%! Now you have to add more time.
Ooops, you're blink was bugged/got eaten by the map, better add more time!
This is an obvious example, but important to keep in mind.
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@Omans said:
The funny thing about this situation is all the people complaining in this thread would be SO happy if the current iteration of nurse was the next killer released.
Imagine we never had a nurse killer, and then suddenly this nurse was released. Still goes toe to toe with spirit as best killer in the game, can blink through walls, still has good map presence (don't even mention Haddonfield and big maps like that - I'm a huntress player. I know.), can down survivors really fast, etc. Like, it's obvious that they aren't looking at what she currently is, but comparing her to her previously broken state.
Oh, and isn't the person who made that video showing the nurse being slower than billy running, even though the nurse started WAY behind, and was only using one blink here in this thread, claiming that simply running straight is a counter to nurse now? Or was that a different diehard nurse player? Let me guess, still only charging one blink? I would love to see this new 'running in a straight line' counter.
PLAY HER.
Come back after a few matches in red ranks (or if you get sweaty SWF in other ranks it doesn't matter) and see if you think it was fun or effective.
Before you had to have skill otherwise NOTHING was going to happen to any survivor. Now? Just run straight. That is literally all anyone does now, they don't even bother trying to break LOS they can just run to the other side of the map and run you around for so long now.
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@GrootDude said:
I’ve been playing her and huntress a lot lately and I think she is still good and fun.
Did you play her before the changes?
You are in the minority.
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@Endstille said:
Well counterplay to nurse has been reduced to run in a straight line away from it.
Honestly, I read this a couple of times on the forums, so I did have to test it. Yesterday I went into Custom Game with a friend, we picked thompson's house for a test run.
So yeah you will not be able to catch up to a survivor, no matter if you blink once or twice you can simply outrun the nurse. Should you not get a hit by the end, you would have to do the whole thing again. How is this considered balanced or fun @Peanits ?
So for testing purposes we took the wall right next to the house which is basicly a big straight line without any LoS blockers, without something blocking the way of the survivor or the nurse. I had no idea it was actually this bad.
How to catch up? Use an ultra rare oof.
Yeah the fact that this made it past testing... it really shows no one on the team can play Nurse, only against her.
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I don't think anyone is worried about the new killer being strong.
BHVR has clearly shown us what they think of strong killers.
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@horsegod386 said:
It wasn't like explicitly stated but they talked before about how she is "overperforming" and the next chapter is hers so putting 2 and 2 together its easy to take a guess that she might be next for a nerf
They are developing a bad habit of releasing content/cosmetics for a killer AFTER they nerf them, instead of before and trying to cash in on all the hype they have before they murder it.
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If DbD is to cling to the pathetic lie that it is a casual game and not competitive (they say this because if they held tournaments everyone would see the competitive aspect is a ######### JOKE) they NEED to remove the ranking system, or at least remove it from players eyes.
Being able to see your rank only encourages competitive attitudes and playstyles. It's half the reason we have so much problems with "sweaty" games. If rank was hidden at least you'd never know where you are for sure so the casual environment can actually start to set in.
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@Yung_Slug said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/832221#Comment_832221
I almost never see a nurse even before the rework, but I haven't played much red-rank survivor.
She's not trash like the other person said. If the new killer was like nurse, they would definitely not be C-tier. I've played her a lot during the PTB and she didn't feel that much different.
If her numbers dropped off, that's good. There are like 17 or so killers in the game, and from what I heard nurse was like 30-50% of the red-rank killers, which shouldn't happen. People who stopped playing her were literally just playing her because she was top-tier and now they don't because they can't use an omega-blink slug build anymore.
There are problems with your argument.
Firstly, if she is the most played then that is indeed a problem, but not for the reason you listed. If she is the only killer doing well in red ranks to such a degree that should tell you the rest of the trash cast needs to be brought up to her level instead of her sinking to theirs. It's only a matter of time if this continues until all killers actually capable of even 2king at red ranks are so bad or frustrating to use no one is going to play killer seriously and eventually the ranking system will fully collapse as people derank left and right to even get games that are over in 3 minutes.
Secondly, she feels VERY different. If you did not play her a lot before the changes I expect you not to see the nuances that are destroyed by the changes. Running across the map in a straight line without even attempting to break LOS as the MAIN COUNTER for her now is all you really need to hear to see that the changes are serve. She can't do mind games anymore because the cooldown punishes you for it, you blink at least half as much or LESS than before the changes (>50% is not a SLIGHT change), she still has addons that are garbage and will never see use outside of memes, I mean there are just so many things wrong with the way a cooldown interacts with her power.
Thirdly, she was strong. But she required a LOT of work and skill to actually be effective. She was an incredible model of skill:reward. If you had a lot of skill you got a lot of reward. Now even if you have a lot of skill all it does is make the match less annoying and frustrating. It still isn't fun or cool.
Sure, Omega blink should have been nerfed (and it's current version isn't too bad, but the base kit change on top of it ruins anything you can do with it) NOT HER BASE KIT. It took skill, had counters, and was F-U-N.
Now the best way to play against her is to do what used to get you killed against her: RUN IN A STRAIGHT LINE.
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@FrenziedRoach said:
I'm sorry, but given the sheer volume of changes your proposing, I can't help but think this isn't the game for you.
Bruh... look around. The game sucks for solo survivors and is hell for killers at almost any rank if survivors are toxic. If a game with a POWER. ROLE. is having a problem where it is common for the WEAK survivors to BULLY THE KILLER, there is a bigger problem than one or two issues.
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@Yung_Slug said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/832083#Comment_832083
new nurse
So... high tier if not top tier then?
How many people do you actually see playing Nurse still? Her numbers have dropped way off because she isn't fun or rewarding anymore. It's a chore to do LITERALLY anything with her now. Just stupid.
Also I agree, it's probably another C tier killer who can get bullied in green ranks. Wow that sure is fun for the 16th time.
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@Endstille said:
It is not even about fun anymore.
I seriously doubted that it was possible to run from nurse in a straight line. Let that sink in, a killer that can not catch up to survivors who run from him in a straight ######### line. No mindgames no nothing required, finding that i lost all faith in those developers.
This is not even factoring in exhaustion perks.
How is anybody going to have fun playing that or against that? This isn't possible for any other killer how did that ######### get through testing?
In the few games before I uninstalled, I was literally unable to catch up to survivors if they had a speedboost perk. I. Was. LITERALLY. unable. to catch up. to a. running. survivor. As. Nurse.
Anyone who says she's fine or running straight doesn't work OBVIOUSLY don't play her, and if they somehow actually have used her it certainly isn't in sweaty ranks. And she just is so unfun now. Deleting her would have been more respectful than this rework.
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@ZackAndCody said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/832083#Comment_832083
bruh. NeW nUrSe TrAsH. dAmN sUrV mAiNs
She is definitely weaker than before, and certifiably less fun.
But I don't blame survivors or killers, sides are pointless. I blame the devs for refusing a lot of feedback and pushing the changes out anyway to fit some behind the scene plan they had.
It wasn't for balancing because she was too strong or weak, it's because something in her kit they didn't like fundamentally, so they took out the fun portion of it.
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@Artyomich said:
I reckon you can actually escape with three survivors as long as there's one generator left because Hatch spawns at that point.
Keys are balanced.
Yeah this is a big problem in coordinated death squads, but what isn't? :(
@OP I agree, I think balancing towards 2k/2escape is only good until red ranks, then it succumbs to the problems you stated.
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@NitpickDropkick said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/829572#Comment_829572
Thank you for the kind words. The overall attitude barring a few attention trolls has been very positive and i'm happy to see that there are so many other players hungry for large changes in the game.
Regarding the changes you did not like, i know that the billy changes have gotten a lot of backlash, and the spirit portion needs a rewrite as people seem to misunderstand what I am going for. Is there anything beyond these areas that you strongly disliked? If you have the spare time I would love to know your thoughts. Thanks again.
Sure, I'll try to get them all in an organized post for you.
I loved, LOVED a lot of your killer changes. That being said, you didn't list any changes that would fix Legion. Sure the ones you listed are needed, but they don't fix his underlying problem of being un-fun and very ineffective (like old Freddy, his power hurts him more than it helps him.) I don't play Legion so I can't really help with suggestions :(
Same for Clown, good suggestions but not addressing the core issue like you did with many others. Something to help with their map pressure and generator pressure ideally.
Hag suggestions were
oompf, I'd play the game again with that.For your perk suggestions, I want to say I absolutely 100% agree with the design philosophy of changing perks that feel mandatory to run. I could not agree more with you on that.
I think Territorial Imperative might be too strong and encourage more camping, which is something we should try and avoid. The opposite end, I dislike your BBQ change. 8 seconds is too long, on old Nurse it would be definitely too OP. I think 5 seconds would be a good change though, to really try and encourage active counter-play so perks like Iron Maiden can actually see some use.
But like I said, these are only a few things, the rest is really great. I would love to see a lot of your changes in game.
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@dfrenchiee said:
Nurse has become so painful and frustrating to play, I've started just playing spirit instead. They really did my girl dirty
Dirtier than Legion.
At least Nurse was actually good before the change. Legion was never very good.
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@Irisora said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/828922#Comment_828922
I love how some people take out of their hats statements like this.. if you think shes the same as before you can't be taken seriously.
She's unplayable and unfun for the majority, both skilled and new obviously. You just need to search the forum and you will see. Or wait until the devs have her new data if they are willing to share it in a near future.
I completely agree, she is absolutely terrible to play now. You just run in a straight line across the map, that's how you counter her now. Like the WHOLE POINT was to promote going and breaking LOS, but you don't even need to do that now. JUST RUN IN A STRAIGHT LINE, doesn't matter if there's debris or anything to block vision, it takes too long to catch up for that to matter.
It's actually a great startedgy now to get the runner to keep her in LOS so she has a target to catch up to instead of focusing gens. Like did anyone even play her on the team...
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I think a lot of changes you listed were amazing and would really improve this game 100%.
Some of them were iffy and need work, and some were outright not healthy for the game. But these were only a small portion you listed, a majority of it is incredible and I hope is seriously considered by the devs.
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@dfrenchiee said:
I wonder if the devs are ever going to say anything else regarding the nurse or if they're just going to do her like they did legion :/
Peanits has said they know Nurse has the absolute lowest kill-rate and is under-preforming on console. Hopefully they undo these changes and try a better solution if they HAVE to change her still. I can list like 2 or 3 good ideas; as a Nurse player who knows what makes her fun to play.
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@Marcus said:
Both need major buffs or even complete reworks.
I don't mind who is first, but both need to be fixed eventually.
This. Along with a few other D tier killers who could use a lot of love.
Anything is better than just bringing the better ones down to the low levels. Like if the trash killers aren't fun why would bringing the only fun and strong ones down be a good idea.
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I would like to see a killer that pretends to be a gen and then suddenly starts swinging at survivors. That would be amazing tbh.
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@woundcowboy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/818214#Comment_818214
Shouldn’t we not want killlers to have worthless pink addons? It’s particularly frustrating that they spent time and resources on her addon “rework” and the end is result is that she now has 4 worthwhile addons (2 of which only mitigate the base nerf). This rework was a complete failure
EXACTLY
Thank you!
They said they wanted to accomplish 'X', then they did 'Y' and now we're left with all the problems of 'X' and on top of it all the problems of 'Y' together.
I don't want to just berate the company but she was literally one of the only reasons I even play the game. Now she's so unfun and the rest of the game is unfun, why would I ever launch it?
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Well the answer used to be Nurse. Learn her and the only time you lose is when they actually adapt and change their playstyle or you played badly. SWF or not if you were skilled you could very often crush a SWF, especially if they had to rescue the weak links often.
Now though? Just sit in a corner and give up. If they're optimal there just isn't much you can do. It's often more fun and less stressful to go stare at a corner than take their BM.
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@LordRegal said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/818466#Comment_818466
Honestly she reminds me of Trapless Trapper back when his traps were permanently removed if someone ran sabo. Except Trapless Trapper was at least a 4.6 speed killer. Nurse gets her power back over time, but you’re gonna be using the good old wasd more often than not now at 3.8 speed. And neither one is fun.
Before the changes it was fun to be Nurse and use your power the was it was intended; to overcome her slowness.
Now you're slow, punished for using your power, punished for missing, punished for using it to catch up, just all around not good or fluid or smooth or FUN. :/
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@[Deleted User] said:
It's not just that she's less fun now, it's that she's downright frustrating to use. I question how much internal testing was even with the cooldown or how much Nurse player feedback was taken into account considering survivors can simply outrun her now. That's absolutely ridiculous and shouldn't have gone live.
It is clear no one on the team plays Nurse otherwise these changes would've never left the design table.
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@ZerLukas said:
The problem I have with new Nurse is that she's simply become unenjoyable.
Half the game you are literally doing nothing but waiting for your blink to recharge. And unlike the other killers you are entirely powerless in the meantime. That's just super boring, as it feels that I'm waiting more than playing(though will current killer queues I really am)
That's just my opinion but I'm definitely not gonna play her now.
Indeed.
If slight means -> half of the blinks you did before the change
then I don't think it's very slight, is it?
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@sorrowen said:
No one asked for nurse base kit changes but bhvr wanted a power bar I think...
And it wasn't even a good implementation of one.
The best I've seen so far is a bar which charging a blink drains from, so you can rapidly blink like 4ish times in a row without letting any cooldown happen, but it rewards patient + precise blinks but also allows you to use it more freely than the cage of a power bar we have now.
@CrowFoxy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/817089#Comment_817089
Nurse main here, I play spirit now.
I just quit and uninstalled. Teleporting everywhere was so fun and unique, now it's a chore and so janky. No other killer besides Hag has anything close to that, and it got boring after a while getting set up and 2~3 gens are done.
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It's a human problem. Very prone to sticking to an ideology and trying to improve what they perceive as theirs.
I just try and picture myself in the average game and see what is fun for me as both killer and survivor. I don't enjoy the toxic behavior or incredible gen times as killer, and I don't enjoy camp/tunneling while I'm survivor, or how boring a gen is to do and how I have to do it x5.
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I tried it out when Dying Light was changed. I don't think it's super strong on Freddy tbh, since it requires you to have Thana at at least 3 to be effective. On Plague it's much better because they can't heal and cancel a large portion of it.
Every time I used it I never noticed a serious decrease in gen speed unless they were already losing pretty hard.
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Some people don't care about putting thought into WHY the game has problems and what would actually address those issues. They're also loud and extremely repetitive with no substance.
We just have to ignore them and continue to provide more than tears and salt so the developers (when they actually choose to take community feedback) aren't hating using their own forums.
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The real question is how can we make doctor a fun killer with interesting mechanics that don't make people want to gouge their eyes out while also simultaneously making him viable in high-elo.
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@MrPenguin said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/818096#Comment_818096
Ok I will try to explain why all of what you said is wrong. There's only one add-on that changes distance per time charging, and its dull bracelet. Nothing you mentioned messes with "if I charge this long I will go this far" the type of muscle memory you need while playing nurse. Chan blink window just lets you charge longer before fatigue, it doesn't change how far you will go with that charge. Torn bookmark just doesn't let you blink through walls. You can still go through pallets and windows if its worded correctly. But it in no way changes her charge timing or speed. Yeah you'll have to play differently but that's a choice you make for an extra blink.
Consistent in terms of charge time per distance is what I meant, but what you mentioned in your paragraph has nothing to do with consistence. Learn the timing or listen for the audio que, just wait .1 second for it lol. You being impatient and rushing your power is not a consistency problem. If she does have a new consistence issue its recharge time with add-ons, but every killer with a resource has this and its not an issue.
A lot of her add-ons are weird or kinda pointless, but overall more people should be able to use her and a lot more of her add-ons will be used. I would prefer they changed those add-ons to be useful, or at least made them all brown.
"Chan blink window just lets you charge longer before fatigue, it doesn't change how far you will go with that charge"
This is wrong. Pocket watch exists to combo with the range addons since they increase the MAX CHARGE TIME of blinks. This means your first blink takes a long time to charge, and the 2nd one will never benefit from the range increase... unless you use pocket watch.
Not being able to blink through walls is 101 of Nurse. That's like if Hag had to have LOS on her traps to teleport to them. It is so fundamental to their power any change to it is a change to their muscle memory (just a much broader example of it) Having to fish tail around L-walls and other obstacles is not something that a Nurse should be forced to do with her power.
I agree, I really wish this addon pass that was supposed to address the issue of addons not being used would have actually fixed that, instead we have some new addons that are actually good (like 2, literally 2) rest are meh, and we STILL have at least 5 that nobody will use outside of memes.