SunaIIanu
SunaIIanu
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@xI_Fabi_Ix said:
But I also wanna know since it can be strategic.
Let's say you play Killer and (FOR SOME REASON) 3 survivors literally sit in a corner (where a totem could be or something) and you block them so ALL 3 of them are stuck. 5 gens left.
Technically that's not holding the game hostage since the last survivor can do gens and the 3 trapped survivors will die from endgame collapse. Also, if the last Survivor isn't doint the gens in this case, the Survivor is holding the game hostage (!)
Now that would take ~400 seconds + travel time between gens. That's about 7 or 8 minutes. Depends how slow that Survivor is.
And what about trapping Survivors with active Bear Traps on their head? Takes even less time.
And since we know that slugging isn't bannable, the X in your question is more than 3 minutes.
I want a dev Statement on Updated Game Rules. :)
If you block one or more survs for an extended time without egc being active, it's reportable:
@Peanits said:
Unfortunately you can't, but as they're doing it before the collapse started, it would be reportable.
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@Deadman316 said:
So far, all the matches has used map offerings, is the Silent Hill map really that bad? I also played against a Hag that used Spencer's Last Breath, figure that one out. I didn't report it because it was a quad escape by us.
I think the addons are somehow connected to Quick switching in the lobby, so I think it's a bug, not a cheat.
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@Hex_Generator said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1348692#Comment_1348692
If you want to see the Killer as a villain for ENDING THE MATCH then you've got issues. This thread just shows the entitled mindset of 'The Killer did not let me win when the game broke! BAN HIM!'
Survivors always assume they should win, and some people here even claimed him ENDING. THE. MATCH. was 'holding the game hostage'. Rofl. Entitled people will make up anything to punish people that hurt their feelings.
No one expect the killer to not end the match, OP complained because the Nurse didn't end the match immediatly.
OP said, the Killer didn't try to hit him and waited intentionally a few minutes to close the hatch. Sadly there is no video so we don't know what happened exactly. Of course it is possible that the Nurse wanted to hit him, it wasn't possible, she killed the other survivors and closed the hatch. But we have no Video so we can only trust OP's version of the story.
You said that sometimes a killer can't hit the survivor under the hook, but wouldn't you try atleast? Hitting a survivor is the Killer's job and if I would see a survivor just standing there it would be the first thing that I would try.
The Nurse didn't. Maybe your right and hitting wasn't possible, but if it was, that was the first moment were she could have ended the game (atleast for the survivor who was stuck) but didn't, the next was when she didn't close the hatch immediatly.
Obviously it is hard to say what is holding the game hostage or griefing, because there is a grey area, but Peanits said it's reportable, if a killers blocks a survivor in the corner till the end of the game before egc starts, even though that isn't technically holding the game hostage, so I would assume that the behaviour of the nurse could be criticall. Obviously not without a video though.
As for the general situation: It is (or was, I'm not sure) possible for a Killer to get stuck at a three. The only way to get free was to pick up a survivor. So let's say a killer gets stuck on a three, the survivors see it, finish the gens as quickly as possible and leave. There would be nothing wrong with it right? Maybe they don't know how you can save the killer and you can't expect them to give themself to the killer for free. But what is, when the survivors see the stuck killer, dance around him for a bit (like 2 or 3 minutes, annoying, but technically not holding the game hostage) then finish the gen, leave and mock the killer in the endgame chat. Wouldn't you say that behaviour should be punished, even if it doesn't fall directly into a reportable category?
As for you comparison to general BM: You can still play the game, someone teabagging you or hitting you on the hook doesn't take your ability to act, so it's a different situation imo.
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@Chewy102 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1341915#Comment_1341915
Deathsinger is the latest Killer and his power use achievement is a 1%.
Bloodbath being a .5% is very much an oddity in my opinion. Demogorgon having a .8% I can expect with most people saying they never see a Demo added with his DLC being the most expensive. Demo is also doesn't have much of a fanbase. Outside of ST fans, there isn't any known names (that I recall) that play Demo on twitch or youtube. Most just call Demo "balanced" and use someone else.
Oni on the other hand has a few backers giving him a fanbase. Scot Jund is well known and loves the Oni. Iv also noticed several other Killer streamers play Oni more often than most Killers due to how good Oni can be and how much fun he is. Yet Oni's Bloodbath achievement is still at .5% even with all that backing.
Deathslinger is getting higher achievement unlocks than Oni and he just came out. Deathslinger is even seen a tad on the weaker side.
I can't explain this other than that is seems no one likes Oni for one reason or another.
Atleast in my region Oni isn't played much, but I'm not sure if Deathslinger is more popular here.
I don't play Oni or Deathslinger, so I can only guess, but Deathslinger's achievement might be easier, because it only requires 30 uses of your power, while Oni's achievement requires 75 uses.
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@Madjura said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1345211#Comment_1345211
Targeting specific players is against the rules.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/19450/game-rules-and-report-system
GRIEFING: INTENTIONAL GAMEPLAY ABUSE
[...]
Targeting specific users repeatedly in order to ruin their game experience
It says "repeatedly" though, so what is, when I do it once? Is it okay or not? Is it only okay, because it's harder to prove that a player is targeted specifically with one game?
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@Bovinity said:
Yep. All night every night is just me at rank 16 vs.red rank SWF's exploiting the queue with a low rank.
It kinda gets old fast. It's literally every single match, every single night now. Because they know what they're doing.
The matchmaking is supposed to match an SWF with the highest rank in the group, so it shouldn't matter if they team up with low ranks. As far as I know, the problem is, that the matchmaking will ignore ranks with time, e. g. when the system can't find a killer in red ranks or when the lobby with the group gets dodged.
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Probably because it's a newer achievement. Others might be harder, but the players had more time to do them.
And maybe not everybody brought the dlc or some people might prefer Hillbilly.
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@Frankie said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/159255/can-i-be-banned-for-this
Being that there's no way to hold a game hostage anymore with EGC existing, no, you shouldn't be banned for it. That being said, regardless of what they did, it was still a dick move; and that's coming from me, a killer main.
I feel like I'm spamming but if Peanits position is the official one, OP's action is bannable:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1254997#Comment_1254997
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@matchmakingworksfine said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1333016#Comment_1333016
Honestly. In otz's add on tier list I dont think a single Iri made it past b besides iridescent heads for huntress.
No, Wraith, Doc, Shape, Hag, Clown, Spirit, Legion, Plague and Freddy also have an addon in A- or S-Tier, atleast according to Otz.
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Yeah, that's what I thought aswell. Didn't they add it when they changed SS a while ago? I'm pretty sure that was in the Patch Notes.
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@venom12784 said:
Essentially a bubba can trap 3 survivors in the basement and it is not reportable cause the 4 one can do gens and trigger egc
That's not how it works, atleast according to peanits:
@Peanits said:
Unfortunately you can't, but as they're doing it before the collapse started, it would be reportable.
Link to the original discussion: https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1254997#Comment_1254997
In OP's case we don't know when the Legion started the bodyblocking, so it's probably not reportable.
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@WRussoW said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1320358#Comment_1320358
I just find it really strange that people try to get all perks without P3ing. Like, c'mon. P3 takes, like, 20% of the whole time.
I don't know how you calculated the cost, but my calculation is about 5,7 to 6 Million BP to get all the perks, starting at Level 1 and 4,5 to get to Prestige 3 Level 1 (you would still need to spend the 5,5 to 6 Million to get all the perks).
So if my calculation isn't completely off, prestiging would definitly take more than 20% of the whole time.
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@Raven014 said:
That really isn't holding the game hostage, because the game will end in due time. Killers really dont have any ability to hold the game hostage because all they do is slow down survivor actions.
Situations that do hold the game hostage are survivors who do not complete gens and just hide. Especially when there are two of them and they are blendettes. The game is not progressing because none of them will take any risks or do anything to move the game along (gens or being on a hook).
It is possible for a Killer to hold the game hostage. He can block a survivor in a corner. Sure, when other survivors are alive, EGC can end the game, but there was a post recently about this Situation and a Dev said, that doing it before the endgame starts is against the rules.
@Peanits said:
Unfortunately you can't, but as they're doing it before the collapse started, it would be reportable.
It's also possible to block the last survivor in a corner before the hatch is closed, so no EGC will end the game.
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There is a way to see which Killer you are facing in the lobby, but it's considered an exploit so I don't think that you are allowed to talk about that in the official forums.
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I think it's fair because rancor gives you a benefit before the gens are done/the exit gates are powered.
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@SpiritLover1133 said:
Stridor counters iron will. But survivors groans of pain would be at 50% and with chase music being too loud it’s sometimes hard to hear.
if you are playing SWF, during a chase tell your friend to jump in and out of a locker to make too much noise and she won’t be able to listen to anything but the loud noise your friend is making.
But if a spirit enters phase the chase tend to stop. And 50% is still super loud on charakters like Feng and Meg.
The locker tech might work, but sounds a bit toxic to me.
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@Bovinity said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1285030#Comment_1285030
Perhaps.
I don't mind losing, and I don't mind my opponents trying as hard as possible. It's really only fun when everyone does that, in my opinion. (Barring the occasional, "I'm just doing a challenge on a killer I don't play, so I'll goof off." game.
That said, I do have specific objections to certain perks, but not really balance issues. More gameplay issues and how they encourage certain types of play that seem to conflict with developer intent.
Have to admit, I can get pretty pissed when I lose, especially against something that feels "unfair" to me like a mori (I recently "lost" a game because of a kobe, to say I was dissapointed would be an understatement).
But I don't get the "trying as hard as you can" - thing, wouldn't it mean, that you should only play the top tier killers with good perks and addons either and vise versa on survivor?
Like DS encouraging people to do gens right in the killers face?
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@Bovinity said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1284954#Comment_1284954
It IS fine. Why would it NOT be fine for groups to try as hard as they can?
So I get my ass kicked now and again. It's not a big deal, as long as people aren't jerks about it.
I guess we disagree fundamently then. Might be the old discussion between casuals and tryhards, but I think that strong and annoying things like moris and keys (and perks like OoO and DS especially in SWF) should be changed, because they make it really likely that only one side is going to have fun in that match.
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@Bovinity said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1282786#Comment_1282786
Oh no, the killer killed you.
Leave the match and queue up again. We all have bad games.
By that logic keys and sweaty 4-man swfs with all the meta perks are fine too:
"You win some, you lose some, just queue up again and don't complain."
By that logic everything is fine, how op or annoying it might be, as long as you don't encounter it every match.
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The game works too, if you drop though one of the holes in the top floor, but not at the stairs as far as I know.
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@Icery said:
Have you seen anyone to criticise Improving Actions? That could be a meta too. Exhaustion effects and many perks can be fastened with that. Why you do not look at that? That would make many survivors win the game.
Have you heard of Vigil? It let's you and the other Survivors in range recover from status effects like exhaustion 20% faster.. But it isn't Meta by any means.
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@GrootDude said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1277186#Comment_1277186
Your Dwight is a cutie 🥰😍
Thx :) I'm a firm believer that hallowed blight Dwight is the best Dwight^^
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Thx :) I really like your third Claudette Outfit btw, the skirt and the blight top match really well.
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I'm late to the party but here are some of my outfits:
My Killer outfits aren't finished yet, I need a better head for Wraith and a weapon for Doc (maybe the upcoming one will fit):
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/991/Geist (2).jpg There was an error displaying this embed.
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That's just perfect.
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@cheetocultleader said:
I was healed by "Jesus" recently. I shoulda took a screenie. I was cracking up.
Please tell me it was a Jeff.
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@Yamaoka said:
Most players (including red ranks) are not as good at the game as they should be due to the fact it's WAY too easy to pip and rank up on both sides. On top of that rank reset is still bugged (since release). Many people kept their ranks despite rank reset.
As a result even the worst killers may feel like they are actually strong. That's why Scott won 32 games as speed limiter Bubba which is basically a default killer with no power. That's why I haven't lost a single game as Bubba for years now.
Wraith's power is strong when it comes to finding survivors but pretty useless when it comes to downing them if they know what they are doing (which is rarely the case as most red rank survivors have like <100 hours in the game these days).
As a result Wraith FORCES the player to use the "hit and run strategy".
If you just want to chase and down people the conventional way - Wraith will often get run into oblivion even by solo players that are "OK" at the game including myself:
As you can see I basically started the chase injured and exhausted and still had enough ways to run Wraith for 5 gens ON A REWORKED MAP.
Now imagine the following scenario:
- a coordinated SWF team instead of a bunch of solos
- competent survivors that work on gens while injured and don't go down immediately instead of people that drop the shack pallet at 5 gens and still get injured (notice how the shack pallet is already dropped in the video AND everyone was injured)
- meta survivor builds (I was running some "meh" perks without adrenaline)
- multiple toolboxes with addons to make them somewhat viable despite the nerfs (brand new part is still decent)
Why do you censor your perks?
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@Flawless_ said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1274457#Comment_1274457
Did you also notice the games where I went against 3 DS? 3 Iron Will? 3 Sprint Burst? 4 Adrenaline? 2 Purple flashlights? You make it sound as if I shouldn't be using those addons for some obscure reason and just stick to brown and yellow. What difference does that make? I genuinely want to know.
No one is saying that you shouldn't use those addons, but as many users have already mentioned: People place wraith low on tier lists because they feel he is very addon dependant and you postet 10 wins while using strong addons so you haven't disproved this argument.
Of course you can discuss if tierlists should includes addons or not, because most players in high rank will use addons but I think many people think about wraith, that he will do significantly worse without addons than other killers would, so they place him lower on tier lists.
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@Fibijean said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1267677#Comment_1267677
You say that you expect people with prestige to be new in certain cases. Would you be able to elaborate on what those cases are - when do you judge someone with prestige to be a new player, and when do you assume differently?
I usually won't expect a new player when someone is playing a license charakter with prestige, imo prestiging them makes sense because they have fewer outfit choices. They are also not free, so not everybody is going to have them right from the start.
The number of the prestige also plays a role, I do expect someone with p1 to be newer than someone with p3. I am the most certain that someone is new, when they play p1 (with the other Outfit parts being the default) on a free character with many cosmetic options, especially when they play meg, because she has so many options and her prestige is so ugly. Claudette is a bit of an odd case, but I think experienced players play either full prestige or no prestige.
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@SkylarPup said:
I used haddenfield and got the crows, but I would have assumed blackwater swamp would have a bit more. One at the big house the crows go away one time and they never come back I notice.
They come back, but not if you finish the gen on the house.
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@Cheers said:
If survivors can't hit unnerving or overcharge than they're doing something terribly wrong.
That was my thought aswell. If those red ranks can't hit skillchecks you can probably win against them even as yellow rank Killer without a special build.
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That can't be answered in a single sentence but as general rule: Luck offerings only give you between 1% and 3% luck bonus (if the wiki is correct), which is additive to the base unhook chance of 4% (as far as I know) , so if you want a real benefit the best idea is to stack luck perks and offerings, e. g. one"vigors jar of salty lips" increases your unhook chance to 7%, 4 of them increase your chance to 16%.
If the Wiki is correct, the highest possible chance to unhook yourself is 52%, when you stack 4 "up the ante" and 4 "salty lips".
https://deadbydaylight.gamepedia.com/Luck -
@Fibijean said:
I find it really interesting that so many people have said that they expect players with prestige outfits to be somewhat skilled. I tend to assume the opposite, based on the fact that prestige is (a) easy to get, (b) therefore usually the first cosmetic that people get access to, and (c) not the favourite of most, meaning that if they have other cosmetics, they usually use those instead. So most of the people I see wearing prestige are newish players who want to show off that fact. Veterans typically don't feel the need to show off prestige skins because they've earned enough bloodpoints in their time to prestige everyone, so to them it's not that special anymore.
I agree with you, I don't expect people with Prestige to play better. Might be because I think Prestige is useless and don't prestige my characters anymore, but especially on non license characters I can't understand going for Prestige Outfits when they have so many more interesting ones in the shop. To be honest, if the Player with Prestige has an open profile and I can see they have only a few hours, I presume they have poor jugdement. (I think it can be a different case with Prestige on Killers.)
To the other questions: Like many others I expect LF to camp, also the Hag. Nurses and (spirits) tend to be really sweaty imo, I don't think any Killer is more likely to meme from my experience.
Dread would be to harsh to say, but I'm a bit suspicious of blendettes (because some of them do nothing) and Davids (because some of them farm for wglf).
I expect people with basic outfits (and Prestige in some cases) to be newer and less experienced and I expect blendettes to be bad at Looping.
I don't tunnel or let people live based on a certain cosmetic.
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No. A mori gives you 1000 points, hooking a survivor gives you 500 plus 200 for each hook state. So if you mori a survivor after the first hook you get 400 bloodpoints less than what you would get if you hooked them 3 times.
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It might be glitched on PS4, but it's not unlikely that it just takes you long to complete it because its requirements are so specific and basically want you to farm a fellow survivor.
I'm on PC, have about 1000h and still haven't finished it, so doesn't have to be a bug, the achievement is just ridiculous.
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@Pantemic said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1259876#Comment_1259876
I think that mostly happens because since dedicated servers the lobbies arent killer reliant anymore so if a Killer dodges the lobby the lobby wont disappear and the next killer finds an instant full lobby.
Yeah, that's what I meant, thank you for explaining it :)
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@Exonaut_X said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/929/WUCGF12RGGQZ.jpg
I really like to play survivor, but everyone is play with friends and I can't find a lobby. I'm a ps4 player and sometimes I wait 10 minutes to play as a survivor. When I finally find a match I can understand that the other 3 survivor are communicating and the don't care unusually to save from the hook. So I have to play as killer and when I immediately find 4 survivors at the same second at my lobby... Haha I have to play boosted Myers to make things equal. Any other who feels the same... Must take Myers and upgrade him all the time. I'm tired of survivor friends 🔪💀
4 survivors joining at the same time doesn't mean they are SWF for sure.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1258922#Comment_1258922
Well, there's no difference today. What the 3.7.0 update did, was to break matchmaking even more.
If you've been on reddit / forums these past few days. You'll see pictures of ranks that look like rainbows at the end of every match... Even I have screenshots like these...
As far as I know the problem with the matchmaking now is, that the system will ignore ranks if the wait times become longer, e.g. when someone dodges a lobby, the System tries to full it as fast as possible, because the players in the lobby have already waited for some time and so the system allows players outside of the intended rank area to join.
So sometimes you have lobbys where the matchmaking is working as intended and sometimes you have rainbows. The Matchmaking at the moment sucks and the Devs need to improve it as soon as possible but atleast there is a small chance of getting a decent lobby, opposed to when the matchmaking bug was active, because SWF would get matched with Rank 20 all the time independet from Player count, wait time etc.
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There was a trouble with the matchmaking at the time: Any SWF would get matched with Rank 20. I was in purple ranks and played with other purple ranks and we constantly got matched with Rank 20 Teammates and Killers. We dodged them (I really miss the Rank Display in the lobby) but it didn't matter, next lobby was Rank 20 again.
The stranger things dlc brought many cool things to the game, I agree, but the matchmaking bug was really annoying.
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Would have been interesting if you had differentiated between duo, 3man or 4man SWF. I prefer SWF over solo, but play mostly duo-SWF, I'm not a fan of playing in a big group.
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@batmanscar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1257126#Comment_1257126
but I am talking about no-ed when all the gens are done , then you spear and hit someone , would that count as a 1 hit down or not because it isnt an m1 hit but a m2 to spear them and then an m1 hit
All exposed perks work the same way: They only work with a basic attacks. If m2 to spear and then m1 to hit is counted as a basic attack for haunted it will count as a basic attack for Noed too.
It is sometimes a little weird, what counts as basic attack and what not, for example, if you blink with a Nurse and then hit, it is counted as basic attack even though you used your m1 directly after your m2, deathslinger seems to work in the same way.
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https://youtu.be/o8vt93ONEv8
At 1:15 he spears and hits a healthy Bill, which instadowns Bill because of haunted grounds. If it works for haunted, it will/should work for Noed.
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@batmanscar said:
ok I will check again to see if I can spear and no-ed a survivor because I remember in the beta I did that
I got rancor'ed recently by a deathslinger, and the exposed from rancor worked with getting speared and hit, so it should work with Noed too. I've also seen deathslingers playing with Stbfl, so I think hitting after spearing is counted as basic attack, but I'm not 100% sure.
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@NursesBootie said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1254072#Comment_1254072
My personal experiences show that swf have a much higher chance of being toxic against solos and killers. My explanation for that is, that they got a huge advantage over the solo/killer, so they can bully without consequences (especially with the report system of dbd).
I do play more SWF than solo (mostly duo, so I can still be matched with other SWF, but I have fewer chances of getting matched with a toxic SWF) but I don't think I've ever been sandbagged by an SWF, insults in the chat, yes, but no ingame sandbag.
Yes, being in a group makes it easier to team up on one player, especially in chat imo, but I don't think fear of reports plays a role in sandbagging or not sandbagging, because it won't matter if just one person or more people report you, without a video nothing will happen.
My point is: The problem isn't SWF, it's that the report system is so dependant on videos from the player base that often people will get away with something because nobody records the match (had survivors in a match recently who were exploiting/hacking, but I don't have a program to record, so they will get away and will continue to do that and that sucks). I know that other games have a way to save matches, it would be great if dbd also had such a system.
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@EarthToGravity said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1252028#Comment_1252028
If you want to play with me sometime, my psn is EarthToGravity. (Same as my name here) I don't really use a mic often, but if you're playing and I happen to also be playing, we could team up to make sure we don't run into toxic teammates.
I don't think I reported them, which is my biggest regret in the past two weeks.
I absolutely hate it when people mess around in the basement like that. It's so annoying.
I feel like people play like this because they lose one too many games and just decide to ruin the fun for some random person they don't know because there are no consequences.
Don't regret that you didn't report them. Without a video proof the Devs won't do anything so as much as that sucks you would have wasted time. It's super sad that you need to have a recording option always available, but at the moment is doesn't seen like this is going to change soon.
@NursesBootie said:
SwF iS bALAnCed ThEY jUst waNa hAVe fuN filTHy kIlLer mAiN
I don't get your point. Yes, in OP's case it was an SWF and they are naturally more effective with sandbagging because they can work against one person with three others, but it's not an SWF exclusive behaviour, I've been (intentionally) sandbagged by a lot of Solos too.
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@FireHazard said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1252540#Comment_1252540
I personally don't know if the mass of crows actually count toward the challenge, if they did than that would be too easy upon further examination. I don't know how many crows are on the two main swamp builds for both the swamp maps, but it would most likely take a good chunk out of the challenge if it counted every single crow that's disturbed.
It either counts for every single one of them, or it just counts it as 1 crow. It might not even count it at all, the "obstacle" that the mass of crows makes up is only shown on both the swamp maps... So... who knows.
I'm pretty sure that they count. Someone mentioned it in the forums and I tried it with the 30 (or was it 20?) crow challenge in one of the old tomes and I got it easily in first try on the pale rose and so did my bf. Might be an oversight on the dev's part, because it definitly makes the challenge a lot easier but it works.
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@FireHazard said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1252456#Comment_1252456
I'm curious to understand what you mean by "Crow bombs".
There are multiple crows sitting on the big ship on pale rose and on the pantry on grim pantry. If a survivor or a killer gets near the ship or the pantry they will all be disturbed, I think you can hear that over the entire map.
I'm not sure but I think they are gone once the generator on the building is finished.
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The crow bombs on the swamp maps are also quite useful if you're trying to do the challenge, because every single crow of the bomb will count.
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@Mister_xD said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1251254#Comment_1251254
not quite, a mori cuts away one third of the survivor gameplay.
in a normal game the survivor has to go down 3 times to die. in a mori game he has to go down twice.
dunno how you got the two third idea, honestly.
and yeah, considering the key is ONLY used by the last survivor to escape you are right. ill gladly just take the 3k and move on.
usually keys arent used like that tho.
keys usually just end up punishing the killer for playing nice and / or efficient.
a single key forces me to eigther play suboptimal and only tunnel down the key user, or it forces me to lose when i play normal and dont kill the key user before the hatch requirement is met (=> playing nice (no tunnel / camp) and playing efficiently (killing players)).
a mori might shorten the game by a certain amount, however keys actively punishes killers for doing well.
both shouldnt work like they currently do, both are WAY too powerful.
i dont think there is anything to discuss with that statement tbh.
I'd say it's half of the survivor gameplay, because survivors need to be downed AND hooked three times to be sacrified normally, a mori only need two downs and one hook. A down isn't a confirmed hook because of ds, flashlight or pallet safes or body blocking.