Lochnload_exe
Lochnload_exe
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@Stroggz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2935434#Comment_2935434
"Shawty, shorty, shauty or shortie is an American slang used as a term of endearment but also frequently heard as a catcall."
are you flirting with me, Lochload?
lmfaoo still didn't address anything, I just think that word is funny. You can always count on the reddit takes
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@FlurryMage said:
Quick overview of the effects of old / vs / new Hemorrhage!
Old Hemorrhage: increases the rate at which blood drops on the ground. This effect was intended to help Killers track Survivors.
New Hemorrhage: in addition to its old effect, Hemorrhage now regresses healing progress at a rate of 7% per second, so long as a survivor afflicted with Hemorrhage remains injured. This means that survivors healed 99% will take a mere 14 seconds to lose every ounce of healing progress they'd earned.
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General Notes:
Some Perks and Add-ons that inflict Hemorrhage have an increased healing regression as part of their effect. For example, Sloppy Butcher regresses healing at about 8% to nearly 9% , depending on what Tier the Sloppy Butcher perk is.
Issue:
Most players agree that the old Hemorrhage status felt bare-bones and rarely, if ever, changed the outcome of a match. However, while the new Hemorrhage effect is much more helpful, it feels too oppressive for survivors. This is especially the case in situations where killers want to chase players recently taken off hooks, who may have been in the process healing / being healed.
Potential Solutions:
Being able to counter Hemorrhage in some way would be ideal, but there might also be a conversation for a rework regarding the rate of healing regression. As it stands, the healing regression from Hemorrhage makes perks like Solidarity and Resurgence much weaker, and in many cases, completely useless. My ideas for reworks for these two perks, are as follows:
-Resurgence: In addition to its other effect: When this Survivor is unhooked, the effects of Hemorrhage are not felt for some time (say, 20 seconds or so). This would essentially be a Grace Period of not feeling Hemorrhage.
-Solidarity: In addition to its other effect: While healing another Survivor, the effects of Hemorrhage are not felt; when completing healing a health state on an injured Survivor, the effects of Hemorrhage are not felt for some time (perhaps 10 seconds, give or take).
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Other Potential Hemorrhage Reworks:
This is a strong opinion, so I would love to hear what other players feel about it:
The value for Hemorrhage's healing regression is too high, making it punishing to Survivors, despite little Killer input / skill.
A player takes 16 seconds for a full heal from the Injured State, and 32 with the effects of Mangled; Hemorrhage regresses those efforts within a mere 14 seconds.
-Reducing the value of regression to half of what it currently is may sound extreme to some, but I believe it's what's needed to balance this effect. 28 seconds to regress what is nearly a full-heal would give Survivors more agency in what actions they can take to prevent their efforts being wasted, in terms of healing.
-Another potential way to counter Hemorrhage would be to look at the med-kit add-ons! Several of the current med-kit addons are simply repeats of other addons! Changing the effects of one to allow players to "Press the Ability Button; nullify effects of Hemorrhage for 20 seconds; this has 2 uses, and does not deplete the medkit." This might sound odd at first, but it would allow players more agency into how they utilize their resources, whilst not automatically solving the immediate problem of being hurt.
Final Thoughts:
The Anti-Hemorrhagic Syringe is already the best counter to Hemorrhage; Boon: Circle of Healing is already prevalent in the meta; and good med-kits+addons are extremely common in successful survivor matches. I worry that if the current Hemorrhage is not addressed in some way, Survivors will feel compelled to much-more-consistently bring strong medkits and Healing Boons. I believe this effect will lessen the fun for both Survivor and Killer, in terms of variety. Buffing Resurgence and Solidarity would bring those perks some relevance and usage among the player base, bringing more variety to matches and maybe even the current meta!
The new hemorrhage is not intense, op, or broken in the slightest. Heal when it is safe, or don't heal at all.
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@Stroggz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2935418#Comment_2935418
But you should. Because if you don't -- you are a bigot.
No one is saying that shawty, that sounds like some weird ass copium. Nothing is forcing you to wear anything, no one is forcing people to change their lifestyles, idk why people take simple things as personal attacks.
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@Brokenbones said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2935412#Comment_2935412
And likewise you can't provide any actual reasoning for why the current way BHVR is doing it is actually bad (The codes never expire and it's very easy to learn of their existance), and the majority of your arguments are based on "lol own the bigots" while generalising people who might not want to redeem some code or have some charm added to their account they aren't interested in
Again, I'm not denying bigots play this game, the whole David fiasco showed a lot of true colours and I don't support that kind of behaviour.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2935416#Comment_2935416
Thank you. An actual good point
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2935418#Comment_2935418
But what's wrong with giving people a choice then?
Some optional charms you got for engaging with an event, something you didn't have to do
A lot of other things are given through codes, something you don't have to do
I just think it's a respectable decision on BHVRs part to let the players decide how much they are interested, that's all. I don't get why people need to throw around the word bigot. Just ain't right to me but I am an opinionated person at the end of the day
I never said anything about being a bigot, I just said it isn't even an important choice lol it is literally a charm, you aren't forced to wear it, just like you aren't forced with the large variety of other free charms given out.
I am not calling you a bigot whatsoever, but the argument standing you are taking does look bad. It is just a discussion asking for something that should've just been base (as many games have things like even country flags as base), it isn't a fight against freedom of choice lmao it is helping players in the future from getting something they want without having to dig up codes.
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@Brokenbones said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2935357#Comment_2935357
That's not my point whatsoever
My point is the charms are currently optional and BHVR puts the decision in the hands of the player whether they want them or not. I don't see what's so wrong with that?
Maybe some people just aren't interested, so they don't redeem the codes.
You can also just not equip them. Does that mean that BHVR should remove the other charms given for free? The option and decisions are still there, just don't equip them lmao.
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@sizzlingmario4 said:
So I play with mouse and keyboard, but I’ve been told by several others that boil over’s increased stagger was a significant problem for killers using a controller. For those of you who use a controller, was the recent nerf from 100% to 80% enough to make it more manageable, or is it still an issue?
Ive always played on console and it wasn't too much for me, and it just something I had to learn to counter, that isn't bad for the game.
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@DoritoHead said:
Title.
Mine would be some polishing to Twins, Ghostie, and Slinger to make them less clunky and nicer to play as.
I'd also like changes to perks such as Resurgence and Solidarity to account for the new Hemorrhage, and for Dead Hard to be tuned down a peg.
Most of all though, I really want any form of advanced graphics settings such as disabling Anti Aliasing.
At this point, just a good amount of changes. It is tiring waiting long periods of time just for us to get small, easy-to-do changes and they are praised as insane changes. Please buff more than one thing, please nerf more than one thing, and please make meaningful changes.
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@TAG said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2929047#Comment_2929047
They already said a good while ago that while they initially subscribed to the theory of "we'll leave it up to your interpretation," the fact that they already had multiple characters in a heterosexual relationship was already straying far enough from that theory that they were no longer going to follow it.
So not sure why you seem to think that NOW is when they are dropping the ambiguity.
They did but they also never actually confirmed any heterosexual characters. Which characters are you thinking of that had big announcements saying they are straight? None from what I remember. In fact, even though Felix was stated to have a wife and kids, that did not stop a single person from still assuming he could still be far from straight. It wasn't confirmed anywhere. Hell, even David had an ex-girlfriend in his lore and he is now the first confirmed homosexual character.
The fact of the matter is now, the way DBD went along with their reveal, it is setting them in a bad position where they really need to start actually fleshing out their stories and characters. Which really sucks, because DBD doesn't have a good track record of doing anything not half-assed. Mikaela had a forced characterization, and I fear more come NOW with attached half-assed representations.
It isn't hard to just write a good character, but seeing as BHVR needed to collab?? just to write a gay character after 6 years, it isn't looking that way lol. Felix had a wife and kids in his lore, how hard was it to at some point just say "Dwight hung out with his boyfriend between work"?
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@Triforcer said:
My ideas (probably only doing one of these):
- Make Lethal Pursuer and CI basekit (together) so that all killers have a general idea of how to get the game started
- Give all killers Wraith's green (or maybe even purple) shadow dance speed for generators and doors (not pallets or vaults)
- Survivors have to be on a gen for at least 5 seconds to prevent it from regressing (if it was regressing previously)
Honestly the 3rd option is something that has been asked about for a long time, but the first two would most definitely push blight, spirit, nurse, hell MOST of the movement killers too far. Lethal shouldn't be basekit
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@NekoGamerX said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2928081#Comment_2928081
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2928107#Comment_2928107
I main David from the start I'm gay but David will always be more then gay character to me.
and again, I don't see David just as the gay character, I still see him as David, because that hasn't changed. However, the way BHVR went about revealing it, it makes it seem like they just want him to be seen as that way. That is the way I took it, if they didn't want that, they would've just released the lore and story for him and let people discover it naturally, by making it a large announcement, their intention was most certainly attention.
Again nothing wrong with that, I just wish they wouldn't act like it is extremely important to them even though it took 6 years and they needed to collab in order to put in representation, while other games just do it without needing announcements talking about how inclusive they are
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@supersonic853 said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=raChfQ1SA1o
For those who are having trouble facing legion since their buff i suggest you give it a look over! Splitting up dead harding and 99 your mend can really save your team against a killer i feel people are overreacting in strength! I know its blowing the lid on playing as a legion but i do not want another wraith situation. Legion is a definitely better killer now but not as much as i feel people are making it out to be. Have a good one!
Luckily for us, BHVR is now going to make Legion a 110 killer, we stay blessed 🙏
/s and I hope this stays sarcasm
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@UnknownKiller said:
I think BHVR could had let characters not to be defined, I mean "not defined" and add lore to represent others groups.
The game lore plays with universes so in one dimension David is gay and we represent it on the lore or in another universe is asexual.
I think on that way everyone could feel represented with a character and even with a specific david from one specific universe or maybe a bisexual kate.
I think that step would be the more adecuate. What people think about it?
That is how it was going and that is how the devs even said they wanted to keep it, as there was "no time for love in the realm of the entity" but now with the David reveal, imo they have to go the complete other direction.
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@TAG said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2928047#Comment_2928047
"he is now just going to be associated as the gay guy, which takes away from David's character"
I don't understand this part. Which part of David's character is being taken away?
No part is being taken away, that is my point. I stated that if they just simply released his tome (in the event that the tome is actually well done) and let people enjoy his development and see the representation naturally, it would've been taken much better because it doesn't appear like a big grab for attention. By making it a large announcement, without letting people actually discover the reasoning or writing that reveals his sexuality, people are already just associating David as the gay character instead of David's actual character and personality. David is MORE than just a gay character, but because of the way BHVR went about it, he is now just seen as the gay character.
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@Phasmamain said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2927211#Comment_2927211
While I don’t like it I think we have to seriously commend epic for their constant support and updates for fortnite. Every season feels wholly unique which is impressive
Agreed, I don't even play fortnite but I am jealous to see a game get so many constant updates and new content that people ask for.
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@squbax said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2926914#Comment_2926914
I think OPs point isnt about the point of david being gay but more about the lack of effort in bhvrs part on implementing a queer character, they just slapped the info into him, instead of doing a fully constructed new character and elaborate their lore, they just took an old character said they going for diversity and called it a day.
At least thats how I interpreted OPs post comparing it to other videogames in which they design the characters(queer or not) lore carefully first instead of adding stuff outa nowhere.
Then again I might have misunderstood OPs point.
@NekoGamerX said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2926935#Comment_2926935
well how it looks how they want to do it add a character with out say what sexual orientation they are at first then add it later in the story tome
at first when only know what they good at they skill more or less how they perks are sexual orientation shouldn't matter right away anyways.
also I like they did this I don't want them to just add random lgbtq character in the game for the sake
David a character a lot of us loved still do now that he gay in game(just like in real life) we need to accept him.
Both of those are correct. I both think it was badly done in the way they went about announcing David, while I am also ok with David being chosen. David can still be his own character and be gay, sexuality has nothing to do with a character, but at the same time because of the way they announced it so big - he is now just going to be associated as the gay guy, which takes away from David's character.
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@Sportsy said:
The best way to make an LGTB character its to make that his personality is not only being part of the LGTB
David is a good example (even tho he is kinda late to be anounced) he is gay but the character has his own good personality, he being gay is not something that lose or gain points to the character and thats something I really appreciate
In conclusion just make a good character and the people will not mind if they are LGBT or not
That is what I think so too and I think that is the best way to approach it.
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It is really a problem created from bad map design, and the need to repeatedly give every character a m2 that makes pallets and windows worthless. There is no need to try and learn to run tiles or loop killers if a large majority of the cast ignores windows or pallets to some degree. The Game is the worst case of it where they somehow thought over 20+ pallets was good design.
Not to mention it doesn't matter if the ENTIRE COMMUNITY points out those problems, we'll be lucky if in 2 years they say "we hear you" followed by waiting another half a year before they change one number value.
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Not surprising seeing as his music is downright horrendous and alone makes him almost unplayable to me. Not to mention the fact that his "update" wasn't even anything huge. The new addons are cool but he is exponentially easier to reveal now, playing against him doesn't feel any different but now you have the added benefit of having your ears bleed.
Legion definitely got way more attention and they feel like they actually did get a character update, still surprised it took them this long to do. I feel bad for the ghostface mains.
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Honestly a chad bhvr move if I've ever seen one. Why is it surprising they would do this after almost 6 years but still also not add an in-game feature? It took them years to change Iridescent Head huntress from a 3 to a 1, or give trapper 1 extra basekit trap.
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@KeiOrtem said:
So this may be a bit long but after reading that people feel that its forced/wasnt the right character/he has a ex thats a woman I feel like it should be talked about. I should not that these are all my personal opinions and it is kinda long so feel free to skip if you dont want to read.
1) "Making David King Gay Feels Forced"/"He had an ex that was a woman"
On the surface level, perhaps it may seemed forced but if you dig deeper beyond just scratching the surface, you will see that it truly does not feel like that. From the moment that we are born we are constantly learning about ourselves. We dont just come out of the womb and announce that we are gay, straight, bi, etc. These things take time to learn and sometimes you may never learn these things about yourselves(especially depending on how your parents raised you)
The fact that people feel that David having a girlfriend in the past and now coming out as gay is considered a retcon in lore really dont take into account(at least to me anyway) that maybe this is before he learned more enough about himself/finding out that he was gay. We live our lives through learning, experimenting, and experiencs; people change emotionally, physically, and mentally over time so the fact that people see this as a retcon doesnt make much sense to me.
2) "This was not the right character to choose to make gay"
Why does this character not feel like that? I see that people say that "they didnt get gay vibes from David Kink," my answer to that is, why do you mean that someone gives off gay vibes? Just like anyone else, gay men come in many shapes, sizes, personalities and more. Its not just someone with a fruity drink and saying "yaas queen" These could be considered harmful stereotypes but to be honest theres a lot of of us out there that are like that. I have gay friends that you wouldnt know are gay just by looking at them but thats because they arent into the typical things that some people would deem "gay behavior" Like personally I dont find drag shows fun to watch(im more of a criminal minds kind of gay myself) and some of my friends are appear as masuline as could be love watching those types of things. It all depends on peoples personal taste.
I just think the reveal was bad and it makes BHVR look like they just did it for brownie points and to stop people asking about an eventual rep character. If the reveal happened naturally through his lore and the tome, and people were allowed to find it out themselves, it would have been way less controversial imo. Still controversial, but less so.
All in all, personally I was happier with their original mindset of leaving every character's sexuality up to one's own interpretation, but representation is welcome and always good(even if it appears lazy)
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Shadowstep. It sucks that people just always want CoH, I get it, it is a broken perk, but I like funny no scratchmark perk
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@Pulsar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2920738#Comment_2920738
I'd really advise leaving if you can.
It's addictive but horrific for your mental health.
Is DBD this horrific for people? Damn I'd love to see how some people playing dbd handle regular life things, I've played for a very long time and I can't fathom being so distraught about the game that you have to talk about mental health issues. Really feels like a personal problem more than a dbd problem
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I started watching the game when freddy was released, but I got the game when spirit released and then mained freddy until his rework. Been a killer main for 4 and some years.
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@Pepsidot said:
Perks: Built To Last, Streetwise.
Item: Skeleton Key.
Addons: Blood Amber (see killer's aura within 32 meters) + Prayer Beads.
The perks, Skeleton Key + Prayer Beads are all simply to increase the amount of time you can use the key before it is depleted.
So whenever you're at a loop that you can't see over like a junglegym, use the key, see the killer's aura. Should be good for at least one chase, I guess. Go for refills with Built To Last.
Thoughts? Also you could even use Ace In The Hole too to re-use the addons if you escape.
This is actually a build I play with quite often.
BTW open handed works with the aura reading as well, adding an extra 16 meters. You can essentially always know where the killer is and what he is doing without risking yourself.
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I would say Spirit imo. She takes a good amount of skill but her power isn't super complex as much as like nurse, billy, and blight; and once you have an ok understanding of her power (or good headphones) she is fairly straight forward to play and also do good with
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@Blightyboi5520 said:
Hi this is my first ever post on the forums and i'd like to talk about my thoughts as someone who has 1.4K hours on the game! So, theres many killers that usually complain about bully squads being "Toxic" or "Unbeatable" which i'd like to argue they arent, and they are actually an asset to you as a killer player. For those who dont know a bully squad is classified as usually a 4 man swf with flashlights with the intent of bullying the killer by flashlight clicking at them, tbagging and using meta perks. The thing is, these swfs only go for mainly stupid plays and safes they dont intent to win the game or do gens they just purely want to get chased which in my opinon is the best part of dbd and we shouldnt be complaing about them and more encouraging them because I hear so many people complain about 5 minute games and when they finally get a bully squad they call it toxic and unbeatable when it simply isnt the truth. Anyways, what are your thoughts on this subject matter? i'd like to know!
based fr, welcome to the forums and it is nice to welcome another long time killer main that knows how to play
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@ReverseVelocity said:
Man's really crossed out Cenobite but not Trickster lol
THANK YOU that is what I'm saying lol
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@Lyonic said:
I try to explore the different killers through dailies etc - but some killers are just so trash its not even funny. Did you want to play one of the below killers with crosses? TOO BAD.
Unless you are using disgusting addons with the above, with 4 meta perks - its just not possible to have any kind of fun. What are BHVR doing? Ohtofu recently made a video about the REAL problem with this game its on the nose.
Every survivor has DH. DS, BT then add in a cheeky boon or unbreakble - something disgusting to garnish the scum.
I find myself just ragequitting more and more often now. If suvivors dont want a fun game, why bother?
Your crossing of killers is so confusing lmao like trickster is uncrossed but Pinhead isn't?
You can play however you want without "getting dunked on". If you want to win every match, bring stuff to win every match. If you don't care about wins, then don't play sweaty lol it really is that simple fr. You are in control of your own fun, and I don't understand the complaints. Fun is subjective and most survivor meta perks directly counter (again, subjective) notorious unfun killer strategies and killer perks counter (AGAIN, subjective) unfun survivor strategies.
Do you really just want easier matches? Do you just want to use meme perks but still 4k at 5 gens? Are survivors just supposed to stand still or play immersed all game? What do you actually want in the game? Play how you want, and realize that getting better is usually a part of any pvp game, especially one that is almost 6 years old.
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@Leachy_Jr said:
I know I'm awakening every trickster hater in existence by saying this.
He's so bad at main buildings and high walls that whenever you get a decently competent survivor they will just predrop and run to main. Honestly ignoring how fun he is and his camping ability id rather play any other killer in the game.
Making him 115 with some nerfs could help normalise his extreme situations where either he can't down the survivor or the survivor just dies with no interactivity.
So I would probably make him 115, increase base throw rate, 60 blades, increase laceration meter to 7, slightly reduce move speed while in throw state, and make him more accessible for console with a ton of changes.
Tbh they should just make a character good. Trickster's power design is just awful and he is stuck in a realm where he can't be buffed or nerfed very much without him being oppressive or just useless. Deathslinger makes way more sense as a 115, his power isn't super long range, he has a normal TR, and he can't even down over pallets.
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@danielmaster87 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2920047#Comment_2920047
It never fails to astonish me when people say that the Wraith nerf was unfair, but that the Engineer's Fang and Deathslinger nerfs were fair.
The deathslinger ADS nerf was fair and from what I've seen with most good deathslinger players, that isn't what hurt him. The TR nerf more than anything was just overkill and not necessary. The Engineer's Fang nerf was also fair, and I've been a hardcore pinhead main since he came out. It was an extremely high boost in strength for absolutely no cost. Every single chase was cut in half since injuring was not a worry, and then you still had his chase tool for slowdown. It was ridiculous and it now is still powerful with the cost being you have a worse chase tool for looping.
Wraith however was weak to a survivor knowing how to use windows, and yet he got nerfed because people only like facing predrop and hold w killers.
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@sizzlingmario4 said:
I agree, but his chains also shouldn’t interrupt box solving unless he summons the chain on his own. Those are the two changes I would make to him.
Fun Fact, they don't anymore. The chains that spawn while solving the box comes in 3 waves of 3 with pauses after. If you try solving the box while the active waves are spawning, it will interrupt the box solving but if you wait then solve, it will cease all spawning. When he first released they wouldn't stop spawning making it incredibly hard to solve the box once the chain hunt began.
Now unless you meant you wanted chains to do nothing while solving then I disagree, they have a way to counter it already and it is up to the survivor to avoid getting punished.
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@Dionysus42 said:
If that was some unforgivable aspect of a perk, then the following would need nerfs:
DH = activates when you get hit, poor play
IW = same as above
Unbreakable = activates when you get downed, poor play
DS = activates on being hooked.
Coup = activates from losing gens
Fire Up = same as above
Beast of Prey, etc etc.
The problems with NOED have to do with the fact that the ideal counterplay has to be done before you can know they have it, or else they can hook next to the totem and get a completely free kill etc. It has nothing to do with rewarding 'bad play', certainly not with this meta's gen speeds. Certainly not when the presence of perks like NOED and NWO clearly shows that planning for endgame is an expected Killer playstyle
I see it more as it is the level of the reward. You get a 5% increase in movement and also instadown WITHOUT a warning. IMO if NOED just notified all survivors it was active the moment the gens were done, it wouldn't be as bad.
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@danielmaster87 said:
It gets a little old, having killers, their perks, or their powers get nerfed or have a mass of suggestions calling for their nerfing. A lot of what people say is "X is too strong. It needs a drawback."
First of all, a lot of stuff already has drawbacks. Pop has a measly 45 seconds to be used, and Adrenaline Vial massively reduces your turn rate. But those aren't enough in people's eyes; no, they need to be nerfed again! I digress.
Secondly, why? Why should they have drawbacks? Killer powers are supposed to be meaningful and usable, something that they can't be if there's a drawback. Clown's yellow bottles can speed up the survivors, and Deathslinger's chain can be manipulated heavily and broken by the survivors. Killer perks and add-ons are supposed to straight-up improve the killer; they'd have to do that or there'd be no point in them. So you have add-ons like Pig's crouch add-ons, Trapper's disarm time add-ons, Wraith's uncloak speed add-ons. You also have various killer perks that may or may not be used in the meta. But the moment you give a killer a meaningful advantage in those add-ons or perks, people call for nerfs, especially via the introduction of drawbacks. And I'll tell you: that doesn't work.
We've seen countless ridiculous killer nerfs, clearly based around making the game easier for casual survivors, but made in the spirit of "fixing problematic aspects of the game." But as we've seen with many of those nerfs, they don't even nerf the part that people hated. You can still zone people out with Deathslinger, because guess what? His instascope wasn't the problem. You can still instadown people with Clown's Pinky Finger, because guess what? His bottle count wasn't the problem. You can still injure people with Engineer's Fang, because guess what? His number of chains wasn't the problem. All these nerfs have done is make killers' jobs harder, appease casual survivors, and irritate self-proclaimed competitive survivors because it wasn't "the right kind of nerf". The survivors who died and complained about these killer powers, perks, and add-ons are still doing so.
So you might say, "Drawback-based balancing can still work! We just need the RIGHT ones!" No. Nothing makes it work. Not only should these killer things, especially add-ons, be strong, they should also have no drawbacks. If the effect is so strong that it 'needs' a drawback, don't make it an add-on (or perk or killer power). Just don't do it, because it's not worth the hassle of this never-ending argument. We'll then start complaining that killer add-ons are generally weak, because the strong yet drawbacky ones would no longer be with us, but at least then we don't have to worry about stupid drawbacks. But back to the present, I have not seen one killer perk or add-on that has enough strength that it should require a drawback. Change around add-on rarities if you want, so that the stronger ones make more sense, but they don't need drawbacks. With a lot of these things that have drawbacks, and things that people want to have drawbacks, the drawbacks are so great that nobody even wants to use the thing. Let me give some examples.
Add-ons/perks that currently have drawbacks:
-Last Will (Pig): Increases the ambush attack speed, but increases the charge time.
-Trapper Sack (Trapper): Start with all traps on hand, but can't pick them up once set down.
-Ink Egg (Artist): Gives Artist an additional crow, but they disintegrate quicker.
-Deer Lung (Demogorgon): Increases portal travel speed, but decreases total portals by 2.
-Yakyoke Amulet (Spirit): Phase lasts longer and increases recovery rate, but decreases phasing speed by 15%.
-Iridescent Seal (Plague): When a gen gets done you get vile purge, but vile purge is 20 seconds shorter.
-Surge: Damages nearby generators, but it has to be with a basic attack, and there's a 40-second cooldown.
-Hex: Pentimento: Can relight hexes to create Pentimento, but only once each.
Highly requested drawbacks for add-ons/perks:
-Engineer's Fang (Pinhead): Shouldn't injure.
-Pinky Finger (Clown): Shouldn't expose.
-Flask of Bleach (Clown): Shouldn't slow so much.
-Pop: Should only last less than 45 seconds and be cancelled by Blast Mine.
-NOED: Should require hooks to gain exposed effect.
-Dead Man's Switch: Should last less than 45 seconds and shouldn't work on Artist.
The results we've seen from this kind of balancing have been bad, the proposed ideas using this same system have been worse, and the precedent it sets is very dangerous for the future of the game. If things that are "too strong" should have drawbacks, then we have to come to a consensus on what "too strong" is, and that's certainly not gonna happen. So people will continue wanting drawbacks on things that they deem strong, and the devs will give it to them, because they hate to disappoint, and the goalpost of that will continually move towards weaker add-ons. It seems crazy right now to suggest that "Windstorm needs a drawback" or "Fuming Mix Tape needs a drawback", but hey, those will be seen as too strong to some people, so they need that drawback. That's the direction this kind of drawback-based balancing takes us in. Doesn't matter the skill level of the people making the request, as long as it's popular and follows this easy-way-out system. It is, and will continue to be, disastrous.
Some things just do not need the drawbacks attached, but some things do. IMO, engineers fang is a good example. I actually think it is smart for it to have the drawback of it being able to injure but not be able to be used as a chase tool very effectively. It means he plays different and has new strengths. That is a good example of things with drawbacks. Imo addons like purples or Iridescents are ok to have certain drawbacks if they provide different ways to play a character. Myers is another good example.
When addons don't provide character altering changes though, they shouldn't have drawbacks. Something that simply adds a base buff to some sort of aspect of a kit shouldn't also have a drawback.
Killers kits, in general, is a bad example though, as "drawbacks" are just parts of their kits that are usually intended as part of counterplay. Being able to cut the chain of deathslinger isn't a drawback or even a bad part of his kit, it is part of his counterplay for survivors to use. Same with clown, the yellow gas affecting survivors isn't a weird drawback, it is a part of his counterplay where a clown has to use it well or risk a survivor getting to use it against him. With killers it IS a part of the balancing.
I think a more prominent problem that should be taken more serious is BHVR not being able to commit to buffs or nerfs. Seemingly every time they buff or nerf something, they also usually have to take something or destroy way more than needed as well. Take wraith, they buffed wraith but then also had to make him slow down to almost a standstill while decloaking. Sure that was a part of the basekit addon, but it still just felt unnecessary to an already weaker killer. Or slinger who ADS nerf was needed, but then also got the TR nerf. Just do the changes and see how they go, if they didn't take actual months to change simple numbers, it wouldn't be complained about so much in the community.
It sucks waiting actual years for something to change and then it being the laziest change in the world. BHVR isn't some 5 man indie team anymore.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
Question is on title.
Pinhead would be a close one, he is already very good as base and easily A tier with addons. If longer chain shots actually had more reward, the box took longer to solve, and m2 chains had some QoL buffs he would be S tier in the right conditions.
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@Zeidoktor said:
Do the Rekindled Totems of Hex: Pentimento count as Hexes for the purposes of triggering Hex: Retribution's aura effects?
Afaik, yes they do, they still count as hex totems
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@SuzuKR said:
Why? There is genuinely no good reason for this punishment for landing a chain successfully. You are forced to detour around the chain and lose time and distance anyways, or go through them and lose the time and distance anyways.
As the number 1 pinhead main (patent pending) I would love this to be done, but honestly, I am fine without it now. There is always a way to play around it and I'd rather just have it where they respawn without so much delay in every step of the process. I would just be ok with chains respawning instantly and shooting out instantly when broken, would probably be much easier to do as well.
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@Chocolate_Cosmos said:
Pyramid Head? Anyone else who is good at it?
Note: I am not asking because I want to tunnel Survivors 24/7, just curious who people think is the best.
Pyramid Head, Nurse, or Blight. Pyramid Head can directly bypass almost all second chance perks, and blight/nurse can just take second chance perks with little punishment seeing as they can catch back up so insanely fast.
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Dead Hard should just be a little duck, remove the distance. Not only would it be unique but it would be infinitely more skillful. I'm always way more impressed at a perfectly timed dead hard than a distance use. The animation can even stay the same, just don't make them dash forward.
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@FatallyIconic said:
Question for killer mains:
In your eyes, what is a strong and useful Survivor build/perks that you don't find to be Overpowered, toxic or tryhard. Must actually be useful and not memey.
Really am curious. This question is for people are fully killer mains or play killer at least 90% of the time.
Fully honest.
Fixated/ Self Aware. The walking speed honestly makes some mindgames really hard to read occasionally. Usually, just that little extra distance can throw off how far I think the survivors could've gotten. Turn a corner, walk some distance you usually wouldn't make, and i've really gotten confused with it when it is done well.
Same with Quick and Quiet, that random fast vault that is silent can throw me off.
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@DyingWish92 said:
Devs can we do something about this and help out Myers?? This is ridiculously outdated. Why does he start off worse then a regular killer??? His stealth means very little, good survivors are not stupid and a lot of them use spine chill which makes his start to the game pathetic.
It's time to update Myers. Stop using bloated kill rates from strong add ons as data that he is in a good spot. This is what I suspect you are doing. ^
Isn't this also the killer that opened up the flood gates for DBD with the Halloween chapter? Myers needs some love soon!!
I really think that each tier should have some purpose and strength and not just "oh I HAVE to leave this tier as fast as possible or I lose"
It would be nice if Myers was actually much much faster while in t1 with his undetectable but he still had no lunge
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@Hoodied said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2915307#Comment_2915307
Its more for fun, not winning
it removes one part of his casual side for no reason, whilst nerfing his add-ons, which is really unnecessary
I don't know how that increases his fun factor but it is subjective after all. While, again, I am in defense of the box not being changed, if it were it would not remove any part of him necessarily and it wouldn't be a nerf lol Everything that involves holding the box would still work, but people would still hold their items, that is it.
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@OpenX said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2915315#Comment_2915315
You know you can straight up lob them over huge loops right? Like longwalls / jungle gyms / shack / etc? Those are very hard to actually land correctly and feel godly when you do. There's plenty of tiny holes in the geometry you can throw the bottles through to stop a loop faster. Mid-chase you might need to smash a bottle on a small tree or similar to get a larger gas spread, etc etc.
Artillery bombing someone as clown requires you to predict their position like 5 seconds in advance as well as throw it at the exact right time.
I find it much harder to do consistently than say, landing an M2 as Pyramid Head or landing a blink as Nurse. Or even landing a chain as Pinhead. All of those you only really need to know the survivors location at that exact moment in time.
Yes but they aren't ever extremely impactful, and it sometimes is just making clown harder than he needs to be. It also isn't hard to predict a location 5 seconds in advance especially when all it gives is a small hindrance. Landing a perfect blink as nurse is not only harder, but also rewards you more as it is an instant injure, same as a m2 as pyramid head, and trying to land a long distance chain as a pinhead to interrupt something will always be harder and more rewarding as well. They all require on the spot mindgame skill and prediction at the current tile or loop which is always more of a 50/50 or harder to predict then simply throwing a slowdown where the survivor will noticeably go.
Herding survivors where you need them as clown is a very basic skill and while you CAN learn little bottle techniques, they aren't always applicable and they sometimes are fairly unnecessary
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@OpenX said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2915275#Comment_2915275
Clown takes a ridiculous amount of skill imo. If you just mindlessly toss purple bottles at people as you are chasing them sure he's straightforward. But using trick shots to cut off loops in advance and combining the two bottles effectively is very hard and requires a lot of map knowledge.
I would not say using both bottles effectively is very hard. Purple one side, yellow on your side, and then you get a hit at most spots (unless the survivor knows how to predrop). There is also not a huge amount of trickshots like there is with any other projectile killer. Again, there is definitely little things that can be learned with clown and wraith, but they do not have a wide array of techs at their disposable.
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@ThatOneDemoPlayer said:
No, the box should count as an Item, same with Nemesis' Vaccines.
I'm surprised Sadako's Tapes don't count as Items too, they should tbh
It is because the tapes themselves don't have an action tied to them. Vaccines and The Box each have their own unique item that can be done at any point, but tapes are simply something to put into something (similar to plagues fountains) hence why other items can be held with the tapes, they don't need their own button all the time.
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@Hoodied said:
They would have to make a new bind for it I believe, this is also a direct nerf to the franks demise build with it
This would be a massive nerf to Pinhead basically
As one of the long-standing pinhead mains since he came out, Franklins actually is NOT great on him and can hinder pressure. Being able to get the box on a down means you reset Chain Hunt, get a hook, and then can usually figure out the next spawn.
If you hit a survivor with franklins who is holding the box, the chain hunt is actually disabled and reset for everyone, as if it had been respawned. That means you have to either let the survivor you hit escape from the chase to grab the box, meaning now you still have 4 people available to do survivor stuff or find the box; or you keep chasing the survivor who is now not affected by the personal chain hunt while other survivors go about their day not needing to worry about chain hunt for a while or they can go find the now dropped box.
Idk why people insist on using Franklins on Pinhead. While the interaction is definitely cool, it can actually put you in bad situations where survivors could possibly gain an advantage through it. Hoarders is a different story as that actually benefits Pinhead in every situation but it can also be figured out just by practice.
While I don't agree with the statement that the box should be separate, it forces survivors to make choices, it would not be a huge nerf to pinhead lol you shouldn't even be holding the box for any period of time. You need to grab and solve right away most of the time.
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@Zachcjjj said:
in contrast to my last past who do you think is the easiest killer to play imo its freddy but i would like to know what you think? side note, DELETE FREDDY DELETE FREDDY DELETE FREDDY DELETE FREDDY DELETE FREDDY DELETE FREDDY DELETE FREDDY DELETE FREDDY DELETE FREDDY. sorry
For me, it is easily Wraith or Clown. They both are just very straightforward in how they play, and their skill floor to skill ceiling is not very big
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@Timeman63 said:
Hello class, welcome to Bad Perk University! I'll be your professor for today, and we'll be going over the worst perks The Entity has to offer and see how to make the most out of them. Today’s perk might be a bit controversial, and if you read the title, you already know which perk I’m talking about. Dying Light. Now there are mainly two different responses to this. The first one is something along the lines of, “What are you talking about Time? This perk is fine. You’re just bad at the game!”. The other one goes a bit like, “Yeah, I know what you mean, but I still run the perk from time to time because it’s fun.”. And you know what, props to the second group of people, because they understand what fun is, a concept most people don’t fully grasp, or understand that it’s subjective. But I want to talk about this perk because it’s actually pretty fascinating in its design, both its successes and failures. So let’s get on with it.
Dying Light is a perk that might trick you into thinking it’s better than it actually is. When you equip this perk, the Obsession heals and unhooks their teammates 33% faster, so right off the bat, you’re helping the survivors by running this perk. In exchange for this downside, every time you hook a survivor other than the Obsession, all survivors aside from the Obsession gain a 3% debuff to healing, sabotage, and generator repair speeds. By the way, once the Obsession dies, the effects of this perk go away. In other words, for every normal survivor hook, the action speed debuffs increase in severity for every survivor except the Obsession.
So why is this perk bad? There are a lot of holes in the strategy that Dying Light suggests that go unnoticed to casual players. It’s only when you really think about the way the perk works that you realize that the impact this perk might have on a match often isn’t worth the drawbacks. First of all, it’s a perk that incentivizes you to ignore the Obsession and go for the other survivors. Depending on the kind of survivor the Obsession is, this can sometimes be a bad idea. If the survivor is clearly an experienced looper who can run you for 5 gens, then yeah, you should probably ignore them and go for a survivor who’s less godlike. But if the Obsession is clearly not very good at looping, you should probably focus on them and make sure to get them out of the game as soon as you can, because they’re the weak link in the team that’ll make your life easier if you get them out of the way. But let’s say you ignore the Obsession like you’re intended. This is a survivor that not only has free reign on generators, but they can also heal and unhook their teammates faster than if you weren’t using this perk. And if you’re chasing the Obsession, if you happen to down and hook them, you won’t be making progress towards Dying Light tokens.
Second, the other survivors. OK, picture this. You have 2 stacks of Dying Light already, and you’re going for a third one by chasing and downing a survivor that’s not the Obsession. Guess what? By chasing that survivor, they’re not being affected by Dying Light because you’re chasing them, so they can’t heal, repair, or really do anything that Dying Light affects. So at any given point when you have stacks of Dying Light, you’re really only affecting 2 survivors with slower action speeds, 3 if you’re chasing the Obsession, but I already told you the problem with doing that.
Third, the effect of Dying Light itself. The effect starts off small, yet you still have to deal with the powered up Obsession. Having 1 or 2 tokens basically does nothing for you. 3 or 4 tokens is a bit better. 5 or 6 tokens is when the perk actually becomes difficult for the survivors, but by then, they might have already finished the generators because they were able to reset quickly while still keeping up with generator repairs. Sure, when you have a lot of tokens of Dying Light, the slowdown can be pretty oppressive, but by then, the survivors are either already in a winning position because the slowdown took so long to build up, in a losing position because you’ve been crushing them, or mostly dead because you REALLY wiped the floor with them, in which case Dying Light is almost overkill. If you were doing well enough to get so many tokens in a relatively short time span, then you might have actually done as well, if not better, if you brought a more reliable perk for slowdown, like Pain Resonance or Pop Goes the Weasel, both of which are perks that reward you for hooking survivors arguably better than Dying Light does, and you don’t even have to ignore the Obsession or give them a boost.
Look, I’m not stupid. I know WHY Dying Light buffs the Obsession. It’s to give the survivors a way to partially counteract the slowdown that Dying Light incurs by making one survivor immune to its effects and work around the slower repair speeds by having a way to heal faster. But with perks like Circle of Healing and Desperate Measures being in the game, do you really want to give survivors more methods of healing faster? Survivors already have perks to counter every method of applying pressure a killer has. Spreading injuries/hit and run? Circle of Healing. Slugging? Unbreakable. Tunneling? Borrowed Time and Decisive Strike. You can’t even commit to chases because Dead Hard is practically basekit at high mmr. The last thing you want to do as a killer is give survivors more resources to work with. Bottom line, Dying Light is a perk that can be described as a “win more” perk. If you’re dominating survivors with it, it was unnecessary to bring. If you’re struggling against survivors, this perk can actually make things worse for you. I can’t think of any other perk in the game that can backfire like this other than Unnerving Presence.
So how do we make the most out of this perk? In order to minimize the detriment that Dying Light gives at the start of the match, you’re going to want to run other slowdown perks to make Dying Light’s slowdown even more oppressive. I already mentioned Pain Resonance and Pop Goes the Weasel, and while they’re much better perks to run than Dying Light, running either of them with Dying Light is actually not a bad idea. Since all these perks involve hooking survivors, every time you get a stack of Dying Light, every Pain Resonance or Pop is going to hurt more and more for the survivors, since the regression becomes more effective the more repair slowdown there is. Thanatophobia is another good pairing with Dying Light. The slowdown incurred by Thanatophobia actually stacks with Dying Light, meaning repair speeds will slow to a crawl when every survivor is injured, forcing survivors to heal each other, which buys you time away from generators. Sloppy Butcher with Dying Light can make healing painfully slow as well, even with Circle of Healing. This is actually the main reason the slowdown from Dying Light starts off so low. It’s to balance the fact that its slowdown stacks with perks like Thanatophobia and Sloppy Butcher. There’s still the problem that once you reach the point where the slowdown actually becomes a problem for the survivors, you’re probably already winning and don’t need it, but it’s an idea to try.
But what about that pesky Obsession? The one that gets to heal and unhook their teammates faster? While these aren’t foolproof methods, and they definitely have different mileage depending on the situation, I have a couple suggestions. You might consider running slugging perks that allow you down the Obsession, but hold off on hooking them, allowing you to go off and pressure the other survivors that will be affected by Dying Light. After all, a survivor who’s in the dying state can’t do anything other than crawl. Knockout is an example that makes it so the other survivors may have a harder time finding the Obsession. Third Seal makes it harder for ANYONE to find other survivors, at least until they find the totem, which they will sooner or later. Of course, Unbreakable still exists, but hey, just get it out of them early and you won’t have to worry about it for the rest of the match.
There’s still the issue of getting Dying Light tokens in the first place, and the uphill battle you’ll face trying to earn them will usually be the biggest hurdle you’ll have to overcome. So let’s talk about which killers you should use Dying Light on. Or rather, which killers are the only ones worth using Dying Light with, because there really aren’t many candidates. Unless you’re trying to go for his Adept Challenge, you really don’t want to run this perk on Myers. His early game is already abysmal, you don’t want to potentially make it harder for yourself. Yes, he can instadown people, but sometimes you can’t afford to stalk to get your Evil Within 3 and just have to inflict injuries when you can. Same reasoning applies to Oni. His early game can be rough, so don’t make things harder. Plague is an...alright killer to use Dying Light. Since survivors basically can’t heal against Plague anyway, the only thing you have to worry about now is the Obsession unhooking people faster. The downside of that is that Dying Light loses its purpose of slowing down healing, and now only effectively slows down sabotaging and repair speeds. I guess this is a good thing, but Plague has so many better perks that work on her that you can do so much better than Dying Light. Now then, let’s talk about the only killer that Dying Light is worth running on. Legion.
Legion is a killer with a power that basically lets them get the first health state for free, potentially on multiple survivors at a time. After that, they have to chase normally and get the down with a normal attack. The main source of pressure, aside from the rapid injuries, is causing survivors to be nervous when they’re constantly injured, encouraging them to temporarily group up and heal each other, which means time away from generators. By using Dying Light on Legion, you can sometimes trick the Obsession into being overly altruistic and go around healing teammates, which can actually work to your advantage. Because injuring survivors is so easy for Legion, they don’t really care how fast the survivors heal, especially since Deep Wound makes doing anything actually productive difficult. This way, the downside to Dying Light becomes rather moot, and you have more time to start making the slowdown effects more severe. The thing is though, in my experiments trying this perk out on Legion, I’ve found the benefits of Dying Light to either be unnoticeable, or unhelpful compared to the other perks I use, and I felt like if anything, Thanatophobia was causing more trouble for the survivors than Dying Light was. Still, if you’re dead set on using Dying Light while actually having it be worth the effort, Legion is probably the killer to go to.
Closing thoughts, how do we make this perk better? Dying Light is a difficult perk to balance the way it’s currently designed, but I give it credit for being thematic. The way the old Dying Light used to work was that the Obsession still had the faster healing and unhooking speed, but when you killed the Obsession, every other survivor got a massive 25% debuff to their healing, repair, and sabotage speed. This was a strong effect, to be sure, but it made it so tunneling the Obsession was heavily encouraged, and that was really unfun gameplay that was thankfully moved away from. I don’t want the perk to be reverted to this version just so it can be good, so maybe we can work with the current version and make it less detrimental or stronger in some aspect. We have to be careful if we want to buff the numbers of Dying Light, since it stacks with other slowdown perks, but we can try by changing which action speeds it affects so we can safely increase the numbers a small amount. Thanatophobia used to be a bit like this too. It had lower debuff values, but it affected healing speeds as well as repair speeds. So even though the only way to get rid of the debuff was to heal, the perk made healing itself harder. Since then though, it no longer affects healing, but it has stronger numbers and it affects totem cleansing speeds. I think Dying Light could use a change like this. For example, you could make it no longer affect healing speeds, but it slows action speeds down by 4% each time, and it now makes blessing totems slower. It’s a bit of a shame that Thrill of the Hunt already makes blessing totems slower, because it would also be thematic to the perk. It’s called “Dying Light”, and making it so blessing takes longer, like the candle is dying out and becoming harder to light, sounds really cool. If you made this change, you could then remove the healing and unhooking buff on the Obsession, but for balance purposes, you can still make the Obsession immune to the effects of the perk. And yeah, that’s how I’d change Dying Light. It’s not really a perk in need of a buff or rework like some other perks, and I suppose if anything, it’s a great perk to flex on survivors. Like you’re saying, “I’m so good at this game, I’m gonna give you survivors a sporting chance and still trash you guys!”. And you know what, you kind of have to respect that. Dying Light is a good perk for when you’re already good at the game and you feel like matches aren’t challenging enough, kind of like how No Mither is a bit like “Hard Mode” for survivors. If you’re not so good though, stay far away from this perk. Thank you for coming to my lesson, see you next class!
TL;DR: Dying Light is a “win more” perk that does little for you if you’re steamrolling, and almost detrimental if you’re struggling. To make the downsides less detrimental, run other slowdown perks, slugging perks for the Obsession, and only use the perk on Plague and Legion. To make the perk better, you could maybe remove the healing and unhooking speed buff on the Obsession while still making them immune to the perk, then buff the slowdown to 4%, remove the healing speed debuff, and add a blessing speed debuff.
Imo, a great change would be like you said, just make the obsession immune to the effects. Don't give extra buffs, but also make it where hooking the obsession still grants tokens. The obsession is still immune, but the obsession getting hooked can still be detrimental.
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@Norhc said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2909175#Comment_2909175
Calling Shadow Step and Exponential "terrible", lol. Low MMR hands definitely typed this post.
Exponential is more situational unbreakable that only works in abusable situations, and shadowstep is only at its most effective when it is placed on inside maps where you can break line of sight easier but it still does not hide blood pools or footstep sounds. Shadowstep is definitely ok and it is a fun perk to use, but it is situational. Exponential is even more situational to the point of not being worth a perk slot unless again, you bring map offerings and have swf teammates that can help make it work lol sorry you get beat by extremely counterable perks but that is on you
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@MaTtRoSiTy said:
The entire concept is horrible imo, a killer that encourages slugging and camping as their ideal way to be played is bad for the game. Right from the botched DLC release they were cursed, it is one of the DLC's I absolutely refused to buy.
So Oni is a horrible concept too? Blight and Nurse must be awful as well.
Most killers playing the ideal way boils down to slugging/camping and that is the truth. Bubba's entire playstyle is based around camping and punishing unhooks. Blight and Nurse are notorious tunnel strong killers since they can take second chance perks and still catch up within seconds with little punishment, and Oni gets WAY more value out of slugging than most since not slugging means your power gets canceled. The only difference is Twins is punished for nearly every decision she makes, and to even try to get pressure going she has to try and slug, and even then she STILL has one of the most counterable camping strategies and slugging can easily be avoided as well if people just stick to groups of two.
People just hate twins because they don't want to realize her "bad design" is just how most killers play yet and she still doesn't do it as efficiently as others.