Laluzi
Laluzi
About
- Username
- Laluzi
- Joined
- Visits
- 4,175
- Last Active
Comments
-
I'd say high C tier. He stomps pubs with his passive alone, but SWFs just break it in half, and his M2 is overall quite weak. It's good for preventing someone from getting distance when they predrop, and can be used to stop objectives at a distance, but complicated and momentum-killing to use mid-chase, hard to hit when you're not spawning them right on top of a survivor, punishing when you miss, and even when you do it right, the chains can break randomly on the environment or by you closing the distance, so the value's very inconsistent.
He's hard to place because his strength changes so much depending on whether he's against pubs or comms. The only other killer that's that affected by the SWF-solo gap is Hag, and Hag still does fine as long as the SWF doesn't know how to counter Hag (which a surprising amount don't.) Keeping the box in check doesn't require any game competence, just the ability to ask what your teammates are doing.
-
All the time, if I decide it's probably better to err on the side of non-snideness or if I decide my comment was only tangential to the thing I was replying to.
-
If you play Huntress/Blight/Nurse/Bubba and Ruin/Undying/Tinkerer/Pain Res/Pop/BBQ/Corrupt/NOED, they yell at you for using meta. If you use anything else, they tell you to knock it off and use the meta.
People will find reasons to dislike anything you do, so you might as well do what you want. Personally, I think Scratched Mirror is some of the most fun and engaging stuff in DBD and I cherish each spooky Myers I get.
-
-Scissorman from Clock Tower
-Daniella from Haunting Ground
-Alex Mercer from [Prototype]
Those are the three I'd die to see. Other than that - Springtrap, probably, but I don't have an extensive wishlist.
-
I mean, we have James as a legendary now anyway. Not much reason to be sad over a favorite character not appearing in DBD. Sad that he costs $15, maybe.
-
When I do that, it's because I'm trying to get the triangle head daily challenge. Sometimes you get survivors that really do not want to be tormented and it makes getting his daily a nightmare, so you can waste time forcing the issue for them.
Doing it legitimately isn't the best strat, since it wastes tons of time hooking each survivor, and you can't really camp cages the way you would hooks if hard tunneling is your angle. It's better to torment them, hook them, and then tunnel and cage/kill if that's your angle.
-
@NOEDENJOYER said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2739963#Comment_2739963
It's the principle of it though. We want fair gameplay, so a perk that isn't entirely fair needs to be changed.
If we're going to operate purely off the principle of an anti-tunneling perk, then DS should never deactivate as long as the killer is still pursuing that survivor, even if that chase takes 5 minutes long, and you should never be able to slug and wait it out because you're still tunneling. Because if the perk doesn't work when the survivor's being tunneled, then it's not an anti-tunnel perk, right?
Do you really want that to be the design philosophy you go with? Or do you want to keep the perk fair and balanced and just eat the occasional random stun when you're snowballing the hell out of a game? Because it's not the end of the world when it happens.
-
@NOEDENJOYER said:
Imagine not tunnelling a survivor, only to be stunned by their anti-tunnel perk because you played too well.
Now imagine if there was a killer equivalent to this, survivor mains would be up in arms, as clear by this thread of ''keep my second-chance perk unfair please''
If I get surprise DSed by someone 50 seconds after they got off the hook, I didn't tunnel them and ran into them later on (and probably after chasing someone else), they didn't do anything during that 50 seconds and I'm in a good spot because of that. It's a minor nuisance at worst.
Just eat the DS and carry on, or slug on the side of caution if it's that much of an issue. And learn to recognize when a survivor very obviously has DS and wants you to down them; be suspicious of survivors that act super bold off the hook, or who bait themselves and run straight at you for a free down when there isn't something in play that could have caused them to not hear you were close.
DS does not need a nerf in its current state. What you're proposing would turn off DS if the killer downs the rescuer 1 second after the unhook, slaps them up, and goes straight after you again, and that's still tunneling.
-
I don't understand what you're actually proposing. Bloodweb buffs? Do you want laceration to decay faster or slower?
-
@gendoss said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2739606#Comment_2739606
Well the easy/effective thing isn't necessarily true because nobody plays as Hag but she's super brain dead and very effective. If you play like one or 2 games with the Twins you'll definitely be able to use Victor pretty easily, it just might take a bit to get used to him.
Hag is braindead against solo survivors - which isn't saying a lot, because solo survivors are bad against everyone. Against coordinated survivors, and even uncoordinated survivors where everyone is baseline competent and you have a player or two that are proactive about nuking her traps while she's busy, she struggles more than most killers. She doesn't like CoH and she doesn't like players who run in a straight line away from her zone of control. She's also not as simple as you're setting her up to be. She has to think about where she puts her traps and plan them around the gens that get done, and she can be slow to adapt if her 3-gen is broken or her setup gets obsoleted. A smattering of traps at loops all across the map isn't very effective because of her range limit and the inevitable thinness of such a net. And trapping windows/pallets requires you to chase survivors into them the correct way (trapping doorways and thin hallways is more all-purpose), and carries a short time penalty to set mid-chase that will see survivors break from the loop if they have a brain (unlike how Freddy used to be able to do it.)
-
@gendoss said:
I just think people think they're unfun to play as and against. Kind of like Hag, the gameplay loop for Hag is just placing a trap at each end of the pallet and rise and repeat. You can guarantee to hit survivors with victor at every single pallet so it just isn't that fun and kind of brain dead to play as them. That's my theory at least, same with why The Artist is unpopular right now. Just place crows at each end of the loop and win.
That's not right. If something is both braindead and effective, it'll be super popular to play. In the short time I've been playing, there was pre-nerf Freddy, pre-nerf Spirit, and now there's a ton of camping Bubbas. Wraith was really popular in the short window of time that he was actually decent, too.
I think you're drastically overstating how easy Victor is to use, especially when you have survivors that don't mindlessly drop pallets in front of ranged/semi-ranged killers.
-
Twins just feel awful to play. Their QoL is through the floor. Constant stuns and cooldowns for doing anything, frequent 'you can't switch to your other half because you're still too close to a hooked survivor, even though someone's looping you around the hooked player or there's a contested gen about to go off and you need to switch now.' No other killer takes as long to just pick someone up and put them on a hook.
Add in that survivors tend to take Victor hostage if you send him at a healthy player, and that CoH neutered their most effective playstyle, and Dead Hard validation turned into EZ Victor yeet mode, and yeah. They need help, because their above average potential (if that's even true in the era of CoH, they relied heavily on mass injury and Victor can't even touch boons) is not worth the extremely above average suffering it is to play them.
-
Blast Mine for sure. It's not good, but damn is it satisfying.
I like playing Wraith, scaring people off gens, and then sitting next to the noisy gen and waiting for the survivor to turn around and come back to it so I can introduce myself. Same with sitting in front of exit gate switches or a hex totem I know someone saw. It's just so damn funny.
-
Look, I'm as much of a rabid Plague stan as anybody, but we got two new outfits for her in the past six months and they were both really cool and did something new with her. I can rest on my laurels for a little bit longer, as much as I want to see her Glacial skin.
-
@RainehDaze said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2737023#Comment_2737023
If flashlights get a tiny nerf to their usability and people with photosensitivty stop getting headaches, that seems like a really good trade.
It seems kind of weird to say other people should either stop playing or put up with health risks just because it would be mildly inconvenient to one item's usage.
Not to mention that you don't even have to remove the clicking that everyone loves so much to fix this. You just have to cap it so that it can't go at macro speeds.
-
@Haddix said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2735806#Comment_2735806
I was told by the designer who was in charge of adjusting Freddy that him being easy is not the reason for his high kill rate, but I could not agree. The reason why the Nurse is so low is because human error is an extremely common factor in how successful player are with her, as you said, whereas Freddy, who was weaker than a Nurse at her MAXIMUM potential (and that may or may not be something indicated by your data collection), was performing the best out of all characters because of his power level and ease of use.
Wouldn't the objectively better solution for "too easy for the level of strength" be to make a character harder, not weaker? If you make more room for error, then a killer will always be weaker on average statistically, which would allow for more interaction between survivor and killer and force players to improve at the character to reach his maximum potential. That's not what happened, though.
Why directly weaken rather than introduce more room for error? Changes of either nature can be mutually exclusive.
Ehhh... I'm skeptical of that design philosophy, because the 'this power is too easy, make it harder' changes lead to things like Billy's overheat and Deathslinger losing ADS. Maybe even Twins and their giant mound of stuns, though I'm less certain what exactly was behind that. Still. It's historically translated to anti-QoL that made the killer much less attractive and I can't say I want to see any more of that.
Some mechanics are simpler than others and are going to be easier to use as a result, and you'd have to majorly fiddle with a character's identity to introduce room for error at all. Wraith will never take as much skill as Huntress because he doesn't have to consider throw arcs and predict survivor trajectories, he just runs up behind you and uncloaks. There's only like two ways he can screw that up and he'll figure both of them out the first time they happen, because they're binary 'don't do this when the survivor is doing that' situations. Plague's power is a constant jumble of decisionmaking dependent on survivor playstyle and her current info and she can fail very badly if the player doesn't know how to react to what's happening. Trapper's skill cap involves predicting not only survivor movements, but the direction survivors will come around structures and what their field of view will be in order to place the traps that will be most likely to catch people off guard - but at the same time, he doesn't do that much worse if you just trap the obvious windows and doorways, and his performance is always going to be marred by RNG and the X-factor of survivor attentiveness. Blight requires a great deal of experience and map-specific hitbox familiarity to be able to bounce and hug when he wants to and where he wants to. Then you've got Bubba, who just needs to learn how close he can skate to a wall before he hits it and he's good to go on most maps.
I don't see how you could make all of these killers' skill ceilings anywhere near each other. In theory, what you're suggesting sounds nice, but in practice, I'm not seeing it.
-
Literally the only reason to preserve this feature is to protect BMing. At best, it's a taunt and an annoyance. At worst, it's a serious health concern.
"We want players to be able to have a satisfying experience mocking the other player" doesn't stand up to epilepsy concerns, if it ever stood up at all.
-
Good God, this has to be the fastest turnover I've ever seen. Log into the game now, @Pika_Belle.
-
@Peanits said:
I'll start by saying that I'm not trying to throw any shade here. People come and go over the years, and I really don't expect anyone to catch every single thread we've responded to or remember every time we've answered something. I'm willing to bet there's a good chunk of people who weren't even around last time we talked about it, but we have indeed brushed upon this in the past.
First of all, I just want to clear up this idea that we are only thinking about this now that SBMM is a thing. I can safely say that it is not the case. Over the few years I've been here, there have been loads of conversations about not only this, but many other hot topics that for one reason or another have to get shelved for a while (whether that's time constraints, bottlenecks, bigger fish to fry, etc.).
We shared this statistic because it gives something concrete to aim for. Previously, we only had ranks 1-20 to work on, and due to the way ranks worked- and since there's not a whole lot of granularity when you only have 20 ranks to work with- players of wildly varying skill levels ended up lumped together. I think anyone who's reached rank 1 on the old system knows that it's not necessarily purely about skill. Just by virtue of playing a lot, many people would end up climbing to rank 1 even if that wasn't where they were most comfortable.
As a result, the data wasn't very reliable and the gap appeared far smaller than it really was. Does that mean the gap didn't exist? No, absolutely not. Sure, we could feel a difference playing matches, but I think we can all agree that blindly aiming for a target that you cannot see is not a good idea. Doing so makes any change we could do very risky, as it could be totally overkill and buff Survivors way too much, or not enough and still leave solo Survivors behind (as well as wasting development time that could be spent on other issues). Even after the fact, it'd be hard to say whether or not the change was effective because we don't have anything but our gut feeling to determine if it worked.
With SBMM, on the other hand, we're able to see much more accurate info on just how big the difference is at different skill levels, and more importantly, we have something we can monitor to see how effective any changes are. It gives us a tangible goal beyond "This feels a little better I guess." Now if we do a change, we can see exactly how much the gap has closed (whether it's gone, unchanged, or smaller than before).
But moreover, the main reason we shared this info- both the statistic and the mechanic- is to be more transparent. I think anyone who's been around for a while can vouch for the fact that we normally don't talk about mechanics like this so early on. It's something that people have been asking for and it's something we've been pushing for as well. We genuinely believe it's better to be open about it and frame the things we're suggesting with reasoning rather than dropping it as a surprise with no context.
On a personal level, I find it a pretty disheartening that when we do push to reveal things earlier like this, it's often met with conspiracies, fearmongering and passive aggressive jabs at the team. I always get excited when we're able to good news like this with the community, especially when it's a big topic like the SWF gap. But it's really disappointing to see something that people have been asking for somehow get twisted into something negative. Even still, I stand by the fact that it's better to be transparent and share these details than the keep them locked away until the last second.
I'm for one joyful about this announcement, because when SBMM was announced, I was hoping that stratifying the data among clearer skill brackets instead of the muddy rank 1 area that could contain anywhere from semi-competent players to 10,000-hour gods was going to lead to you guys addressing some long-standing balance issues that were largely centered around emergent top-level play. The announcement about looking into increasing solo queue's information game was potentially the best news I've heard since joining DBD, both for planning balance changes I strongly agree with from both a survivor and killer standpoint, and showing that the data is being looked at in the way I'd hoped it would (which sounds promising on a couple of other angles.)
Not sure if you were watching then, but the forums were overwhelmingly positive on the 3rd when the news was dropped. The mood just got overshadowed by the Leatherface mask controversy and the seemingly underwhelming patch notes next day, and I think everyone's back to their usual cynical self at this point. But addressing the solo-SWF gap was received very positively and the major concern was that there might be a long waiting period between solo buffs and general killer buffs to follow - not the move itself. People are happy about this.
-
@Anniehere said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2735378#Comment_2735378
I think Adept mostly.
Funnily enough, i played with Spirit a few times and my Conniption achievement is still on 0. (use Yamaoka's Haunting to down 30 Survivors)
I'm really that bad, haha.
I just got Spirit and I'm really bad with using her power - I keep ending up reappearing behind the survivor, and the window for the score event is very small.
That said, it's very easy to hit survivors going for unhooks, picking up slugs, or committing to nearly done gens with the power, since you know exactly where they'll be and there's no guesswork involved. Try those? I also found noodling around a pallet and then hitting through it had a good chance of catching someone.
To the OP: Well done! Damn, but that's living the dream. How did you get Left For Dead? That's the only one I have left that I don't know how I'm going to get. Seems to rely on either sandbagging your team or hoping for a killer that takes pity on you, and I'm going 0 for 4 on the latter. (The rest remaining are just adepts and power achievements related to characters I don't own yet.)
-
@dugman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2734759#Comment_2734759
Actually when I’m down to two survivors I hook one and actively look for the other or, if the hook timer is close to finishing, head toward the shack or main building to see if I can quickly spot the hatch. I figure if the other person actually rescues the hooked survivor I’ll easily get another hook since I know exactly where they both are, or I might even spot the rescuer running in while I’m looking for him and cut him off.
I usually wander far away to encourage the unhook, because I want more points all around and I don't care if someone hatches out, but it doesn't change the fact that two survivors left are super doomed and unless there's one gen left that's partway done, they don't have any chance of accomplishing anything. I respect players who try to save each other more, but I get why people go 'screw it' and wait for hatch.
The real painful games are when you're the killer and both survivors decide to do this, though. :x
-
If the survivor was playing the game normally up until that point, what she did is very understandable.
At the stage where two survivors remain, there isn't much you can do. Once they catch somebody, the killer is not going to move far from the hook, because it is the only place the other survivor will be (unless there's just one gen left to do, but that's a risky prospect and allows a save.) If they're not camping the hook outright, they're going to return immediately once the unhook happens, and if they're not crazy, they won't be far. Going and unhooking the survivor will typically result in both of you dead unless the rescuer is healthy, has Borrowed Time, and neither of you screw up and get downed in less than 15 seconds.
Even if you do successfully get away and the killer downs her, your positions are now reversed (and you're now injured, which means you can't bum rush a save and will probably go down before you reach the hook.) You can't recover from this situation. You can only hook trade until you both die (which will happen if the killer decides they want the 4k; they'll slug the first and go after the second once they know where the second is), or one of you gets hatch. The teammate decided she wanted the hatch and left you behind.
If she was healthy, she could have tried, but it wasn't ever going to result in something better than you or her getting out through hatch, and may have ended with you both dead. If she was injured, there was no way she could save you, period. It's unfortunate, but players aren't obligated to sacrifice themselves to save you.
I'll still go for the save because I have BT and I like bloodpoints, but I understand when players don't and I'll often let myself die on hook if they don't immediately run for me so that they don't have to make that choice and can look for hatch safely.
Of course, if the teammate was hiding in a locker all game, that's a different story. But hiding in a locker while the killer patrols the only other guy left isn't a sin.
-
I don't know what games were like 2 years ago... but I can tell you what's changed in the last year. Hex perks are hella risky and tend to blow up before they get any value, the current killer meta is on gen blockage or delay more than gen regression, you're often kind of screwed if you're playing a killer that doesn't have anti-loop capabilities (and coincidentally, every release we've had since, like, Oni has anti-loop), and split pressure doesn't work anymore with boons. You commit to each injury or they run to the boon and heal. On the survivor side, against certain killers, running across the map and predropping pallets is more effective than looping. The game is 100% about chasing rather than hiding, if it ever was in the days you played. Other than Circle of Healing, the survivor meta has not changed at all. Also, Dead Hard actually works and it's rather terrifying.
-
I think everyone's getting the shards regardless of whether they had the masks unlocked or not.
Which is a good thing, or otherwise everyone would be playing Bubba and doing an OG survivor hunt right now.
-
No thanks, I like having fun.
I'll just be over here with my stash of Marvin's Blood, buying up Pinhead addons so that I can fiddle with the cube and arrive when his voice goes live again.
-
@tester said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2732197#Comment_2732197
- I already have all perks.
- I already have all characters.
- Fine. Then give me ability to buy 1 entire yellow outfit, 2 grey outfits, 1 green item, 3 yellow items, 6 grey items for Cannibal. Oh, wait! You want $$ for those? That's were we have a problem.
Greedy, because they took away the ONLY freely unlockable outfits and replaced them with paid ones. Did you know that you can search this forum and see that there were threads about black face bubba being racist all the way back in 2018? But those were ignored... Because Bubba didn't have any paid cosmetics at that time.... Until... Wait for it... Paid cosmetics were added to Cannibal. Think about it. If that still doesn't sound even slightly suspicious to you, than there is nothing else I can say to help you.
I'm very skeptical that this had any influence on BHVR's decision. Generally, players that will not buy cosmetics cannot be convinced to spend money on cosmetics, and players that will spend money on cosmetics will do so freely on whatever appeals to them. There isn't an awful lot of overlap between the two groups and you can't squeeze money out of a stone, so to speak; there's little point in trying. And even if the survivor faces had an impact on Bubba's sales, they only covered his face slot. I was going to say the other two slots only had paid options anyway, except he's got the same free prestige outfit that everyone else does, mask included, so... ????
This take sounds... pretty conspiracy-theory-y. It seems way easier to assume they did this to shut down controversy than as an evil master plan to make you buy Pretty Lady Bubba.
-
@Xendritch said:
As a side note not sure what it says that something they made a purple they now feel comfortable making a yellow, did they rework clown thinking the yellow bottles were good? Cuz as of now they only reason to use them is with the cigar box so not sure what the thought process was there.
I get the feeling that they're perturbed people rarely use yellow bottles and they're trying to carrot-and-stick people into using them.
Yellow bottles aren't useless, but the purple bottles are on their own stronger, more straightforward, and less risky, and it's simpler for most players to stick with one (using both in one chase is rather advanced and the way yellow bottles work requires precision), so your average player is going to continue using purple-bottle-centric builds until BHVR really makes them immediately worthwhile. This addon tweak of weakening Bleach and Pinky Finger and strengthening Solvent Jug is... not that.
-
@Xendritch said:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FBHiGLIXMAAj57H?format=jpg&name=large
Why are we nerfing an average killer that nobody plays?
Like what possible reason is there? BHVR usually makes decisions based on data well the data says twins is average at best. Are we going off top players using them at max potential? Cuz Pixel, Lynxi, and Dowsey and all the other twins mains say they feel like absolute garbage to play and these are the people that actually liked them forget everyone else that wouldn't touch them if they were the only killer in the game. So what's the deal? I'm usually the last person to go all conspiracy on bhvr but it's hard for me to come to any conclusion other than they just wanna forget binding of kin ever happened.
The nerfs go like this: when there's a brown -> green killer addon that gets run in a high percentage of games, BHVR gets out the nerf hammer, because it must be overperforming. They also try to buff a couple of their higher rarity, less used addons alongside that, in an attempt to split addon usage among a more natural gradient. We saw that with most of the killer addon changes today.
What this often ignores is that the addons in question are either big QoL improvements for the killer and patch a hole that's otherwise left gaping, or all of their other addons are really situational and unappealing and giving them a numbers buff doesn't change that the effect is not good or universally helpful. These are almost always ill-conceived and unwanted changes as a result - nerfs to common addons people like in exchange for buffs to rare addons that nobody uses. Remember when the first thing they did when rebalancing Demo's addons was to nerf Rat Liver? At least they listened to the community outcry and actually fixed the issue that Rat Liver previously covered.
Nobody plays Twins, but the few that do use Victor move speed and ease-of-pounce, so this happened.
-
Please, yes. I'd love to practice blinks without Plaid Flannel or get the volume-timing right on phasing so I can emerge on top of people instead of behind them without embarrassing myself in front of real survivors (who are... often not the most gracious training dummies when they realize the killer is bad at what they're doing.)
-
@Predated said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2732074#Comment_2732074
First off, I fully agree that there needs to be a replay mod for this game. Being able to download a match and single out the moments in the match is far easier for players, takes no time to set-up and is far easier to report hackers alone. However, back to addressing the issues:
"This would be easily handled if DBD kept match recordings in case of a report instead of leaving the onus on players to use external programs to record and submit evidence."
You might think so, but to do so, you would need to hire a very specific team to watch match recordings, find the moments where it happens and EVEN THEN, it's not gonna be clear cut. I'll use some of your points to basically show why:
"a revealing profile who facecamps and BMs all the black survivors while letting everyone else go" Except, that they are not facecamping and BM'ing black survivors, they are facecamping and BM'ing black players. You cannot typically tell the ethnicity of a player through the game, so this can be done purely on accident. Especially if there are multiple black players in the same game. You would need to contact said player to explain themselves, and if they refuse to explain themselves, there is nothing you can do without having potential legal action backing it up, as it's not solid evidence.
"if it turned out the player in question was BMing and facecamping every player" Sheer statistical probability means that there is at least 1 killer who will only do this to black players without knowing it. This can lead to very nasty legal actions if they are banned wrongfully, not only losing money to just cover the costs of the game, unbanning them etc, but also would easily be a case of slander, which can reach into compensations up to hundreds of thousands of dollars alone, just because of 1 free cosmetic. It's not solid enough to uphold in a court of law, that makes it very easy to claim discrimination and slander, and sue the company.
"send a warning not to do this again just to be absolutely sure you're not hitting anyone innocent, with a next-strike-you're-out." This would be seemingly fine, except that you cannot really tell a player to not play the game the way they want to play while all other players get to play the game the way they want to play, especially considering their behaviour isnt breaking the rules in the game. This again can turn into quite a cumbersome legal action where there is player discrimination. Since BHVR is a company, its far easier to gain evidence on them. For players, you would need to launch a personal investigation just to see if they are actually racists. Both can cost a lot of money, it's easier to simply remove the thing that causes the problem.
"Many of these degenerates aren't shy about outing themselves and give ample, ample rope to hang themselves with." These players actually already see bans, which is why most of them return on a new copy, maybe on a new device and remain silent.
Effectively, the options to keep the cosmetics are either:
- gonna cost a lot of money through legal actions
- gonna cost a lot of money through investigations
Considering the cosmetics are free, that is a LOT of money to be spending, just to keep a small portion of the playerbase happy and while the harrassed portion of the playerbase will still experience the same negativity.
The reason why it's very hard to prove someone or something is racist, is because of appearant racism. Racism needs personal investigation, and once there is actual evidence of racism(aka, intended behaviour), only then can you legally take action without being at risk for slander.
I don't entirely understand how there could be that much legal kerfluffle around banning someone for repeatedly doing something if you make that something against the rules, but I will concede it's really hard to prove whether or not someone knew whether or not what race a player is. It's... easier to prove with streamers, but much less so when it's a matter of looking at people's profiles or extrapolating from their names. That's an angle I hadn't adequately thought out, and you're right, players could easily unknowingly be dinged for this when in actuality they pay no attention at all what's on people's profiles and are just sparing or killing certain players because Feng didn't want to farm or the other three were cute or whatever.
Thank you for that, because it's done more to convince me why this decision was made than anything else I've heard today. I'm still cynical that this change will do much to help, but it at least sheds light on why improved moderation was not the obvious solution it seemed to be.
I still want it, though - it fixes way more problems than just this. And I'd prefer match replay be handled in-house than the current system of having players essentially have to use an external website to write up a proper report that will actually be heeded, because that is unnecessarily obfuscating and clunky and I can't think of a single other game that's ever required people to go that out of their way to report people.
-
@Predated said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/303302/why-arent-we-talking-about-this
Quick question:
What evidence would you use to prove it's racism? What evidence do you think players have available that makes the difference between percieved racism(aka, something that feels like targetted racism when it's just a coincidence between a bad mannered player who simply likes wearing a specific skin) and actual racism(who is bad mannered and wears that skin BECAUSE they are targetting players)?
In both of these cases, the player who is/feels targetted has a very negative experience due to a single cosmetic item. So that cant be used as evidence. Afterchat maybe? Well, racists would simply stop using chat to do so. Encountering the same player over and over again because they are sniping you? Could easily be chalked up to matchmaking giving you the same player(I've faced the same player up to 5 times in a row as a killer, same killer up to 5 times in 3 hours time).
Seriously, what would be the functioning report on this, without falsely banning players? Would you really want players to be banned for a false accusation just so you can keep a cosmetic?
There is none that I can think of. Making this question somewhat rethorical. This is exactly why the cosmetics themselves have to go. You cannot tell the difference between percieved racism and actual racism in a game like DBD, yet the experience is the same for the player suffering from it.
This would be easily handled if DBD kept match recordings in case of a report instead of leaving the onus on players to use external programs to record and submit evidence.
Everything that happens in the match happens with a blindfold to the current report system - every single form of in-game harassment there is cannot be discerned by the people going over the reports and it's all unconfirmable hearsay from not-necessarily-reliable narrators. But if you have a racist who's canny enough not to say anything in endgame chat or have a revealing profile who facecamps and BMs all the black survivors while letting everyone else go, and BHVR actually viewed ingame actions, this would only need to be reported, like, three times tops before you have enough proof that a player is behaving in bad faith and needs to go. Once is already enough to flag them for concern and perhaps send a warning.
Meanwhile, if it turned out the player in question was BMing and facecamping every player, or at least attempting to catch and kill other players, which would also be covered by the match recordings, that report could be discarded because while the reporting player experienced what felt like racism, it doesn't appear that that was the actual intent. Same if the match recording showed that the person who got singled out was provoking the killer beforehand, or any extenuating circumstance where there might be another reason. (Being able to save the killer's current active challenge would be ideal, as they may have a challenge to kill the obsession - though I'd imagine this would be a very rare coincidence.) When sufficient proof has been obtained, send a warning not to do this again just to be absolutely sure you're not hitting anyone innocent, with a next-strike-you're-out.
That's just for the players who don't say anything, though. Many of these degenerates aren't shy about outing themselves and give ample, ample rope to hang themselves with.
Keeping match recordings (until the lobby is dissolved, and saving them when a report is made) also has the benefit of being able to properly address hacking, all forms of hostage-taking, teaming with the killer, sandbagging and griefing, and repeated and unfair targeting over the course of several games. It's something that's needed across the board.
-
It's honestly kind of incredible how every single update since, like, April has at least a small kick in the face involved for them. Since their release and subsequent immediate bugfixes, they went from janky but strong to just Absolute Suffering: The Experience, and they have not gotten a single meaningful bit of compensation to address their issues.
It's almost like BHVR's been roleplaying their backstory. Everyone hates them and wants them to suffer and Charlotte is doomed to a miserable existence where she loses everything she still loves, claws for every dwindling, meager scrap, and finally dies forgotten in the cold.
-
I actually did get gen yoinked by this addon once. I was right next to Badham main building and the Huntress was chasing someone inside the building while I did a gen outside. I was watching the building for signs of the chase and she reloaded, snuck out behind around a fence, and grabbed me from the other side while I was still thinking she was 20+ meters away.
I'm not denying that it was really stupid to give a killer with a lullaby an undetectable addon, and that a numbers buff won't actually make that better, but there is a smidge of an idea in there somewhere. It's just... generally really dumb and won't work outside the specific situation where a survivor is braving your lullaby, waiting for the TR as a signal to tell them when to run, and there's no LoS. I think this is almost always going to be limited to cases where survivors believe you're occupied with someone else, because Huntress's actual TR is the second smallest in the game and it's just not big enough for survivors to want to play chicken with it.
I really like your idea #2. It might be a little on the powerful side, since the lullaby is so large, but screams are worse than auras and it's a purple addon anyway.
-
@LoneSlinger said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2731987#Comment_2731987
I gotta say I typically like your posts and agree with your takes and opinion
Aww, thanks.
@thrawn3054 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/303302/why-arent-we-talking-about-this
Your personal take is inaccurate. They were and certainly will continue to ban people exhibiting racist behavior. The removal of the faces is to give them less tools to be racist ass hats.
They eventually remove them, I'm sure, but they take inordinately long to do it, and the bad actors are able to abuse far too many players in the meantime.
You know the current hacker issue where people are flying around spamming screams and headpopping every survivor two seconds into the game, and they can go unbanned for upwards of a month despite it being really, really obvious they're cheating? Being a racist ######### is just as bad. You don't have to be subtle about it; even with the game taking chat logs, people can report you using slurs over and over again and it still takes BHVR forever to get around to checking them.
A report system that works on this long a delay isn't a working report system at all.
-
What do you mean, why aren't we talking about this? I've been yelling about this very take all day all day. There's been at least twenty threads.
@KolbyKolbyKolby said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2731938#Comment_2731938
Are you suggesting that when people of color experience targeted harassment made easier by a cosmetic, they should simply no longer stream because it is instead racist for them to show people the racism they encounter? Rather than Behaviour removing a cosmetic that was unnecessary and often used for harassment, instead, black content creators should be silenced when people behave poorly towards them in racist manners using cosmetics that can instead be removed as to not be used as a tool that way?
To clarify, you're completely right about the onus not belonging to streamers here - people should be able to enjoy the damn game without being harassed, especially not on the basis of who they are, and "just stop streaming if you're getting harassed" is an awful take. I don't take any issue with what you're saying here except one tiny line, but that's "removing a cosmetic that was unnecessary." Every cosmetic is unnecessary. This game would function fine if everyone just had the default outfits and nothing else. They are, however, nice things to have and losing any of them is a shame.
Every single thing about this problem could have been fixed by actually banning the racist dickweeds instead of this limbo where it takes a few dozen reports and several weeks minimum before BHVR does anything. Instead, we're left with a situation where we have less cosmetics to enjoy and the racist shitheels are still roaming around being disgusting to every Claudette/Tapp/Adam/Elodie they meet because the report system in this game barely functions and even obvious, unrepentant proof isn't enough to get rid of people in a timely fashion.
Getting rid of Smartface didn't fix the problem that awful people are allowed to run rampant in DBD with little fear of repercussion. It just took away a set of cosmetics, and now BHVR is patting itself on the back for looking out for its community while it refuses to actually put in the legwork and manpower to address the long-standing and incredibly pervasive issue that plagues this game.
-
God, this. It seems like even when you've got several chat logs of obvious evidence against a player, they might get banned a month from now if you're lucky. Meanwhile, if an abuse happens in-game and doesn't have corroborating chat evidence, the burden is on you to record this happening, visit their out-of-game support website, and submit a ticket corresponding to your report (you can't do one or the other, it has to be both), otherwise they won't do anything even if they do read the report. And if they do get to the report, it will again be after a huge time backlog and the abusive player will have been able to ruin hundreds of other games in that time.
It's a goddamn mess and it's frankly embarrassing that BHVR won't allocate any resources towards fixing this. It is an issue on so many levels.
-
I might use it in my quest to get the Left For Dead achievement.
Otherwise, no. Would rather bring perks that help me reach that point in the trial.
-
I mean, that's absolutely ######### disgusting and I'm so sorry you had to keep dealing with this piece of human excrement... but to me, this just highlights how this problem isn't solved. This player is able to be virulently toxic, makes zero effort to mask their motives in chat logs which are explicitly recorded, says the most horrible things... and despite being reported repeatedly over a long period of time, nothing happens to him and he's allowed to keep going.
He won't have Smartface anymore. Alright. But he's still here, and he's still going to be here until that dusty pile of reports gets looked at... when, a month and a half from now? That guy needs to be removed from the game immediately - #########, he needed to be removed from the game ages ago. BHVR ignores the safety and wellbeing of its players when it leaves moderation to such a backburner role.
-
Forget Haddonfield balcony. RCPD library and upper floor Thompson House next to the chest is where it's at. Don't even have to bother with sabotage in those ones. Possibly some balcony spots on upper floor Eyrie? Or Ironworks outer catwalks if you don't get the hook inside the building? This is the real thing to test in the PTB, just which spots it turns into GGEZ git gud baby killer.
-
I was expecting a map rework or one of the promised Legion or Ghostface updates. Instead, we got a bunch of underwhelming perk and addon tweaks, and they didn't address boons or validation problems at all.
Yesterday was awesome, today was Entity Displeased.
-
Killer, always and under basically every circumstance. Survivor points are badly portioned out - it's very rare that you'll be able to max out all your categories, because all of your teammates are filling different roles, competing for point opportunities in Objective and Altruism, and one category - Survival - has almost no opportunities to earn points outside escaping. Killer is the only player on their team, so they'll tend to fill up all of their categories evenly and can reliably max or near-max everything as long as the match isn't extremely short and one-sided. The only issue is Devious, which some killers (Pig, Myers, Plague, possibly Cenobite) have bad points or capped opportunities to fill it up. That isn't an issue on most killers.
It's also easier to get 4 stacks of BBQ than it is 4 stacks of WGLF.
-
@Mandy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2731541#Comment_2731541
We cannot answer what action has been taken against a player. That is between us and the player, it's not something that's ever discussed with 3rd parties.
And yes, stopping racial harassment is probably next to impossible but we are certainly not prepared to give people the tools to use - hence the removal of the masks.
You understand you're not going to stop racial harassment in DBD without removing Claudette, Tapp, Adam, Elodie, endgame chat, and also somehow removing Twitch, right? Every single one of these things is a tool.
People will find ways to be shitheels in game and you're correct that you can't truly stop that. But removing stuff in the game isn't the answer, because the people that will do this will find other avenues to express their ######### nature as long as they remain in the game, and removing their toys... at some point you're left with scorched earth, and you've burned plenty of valuable content along the way. This was always a moderation problem and could have been solved if egregiously bad actors were blocked from coming back with throwaway accounts, the game actually saved match recordings so silent-but-obvious racism didn't fly completely under the radar, and it didn't take weeks for reports to do anything, if they ever do.
The whole thing leaves a sour taste in my mouth because it signals to me that BHVR is more interested in a CYOA instead of putting in the resources to address the real issue.
-
Okay, what racist ######### do in retaliation is in no way BHVR's fault.
I don't agree with this decision and I don't think it was the right way to fix the issue of rabid racists in the community, but this is just an absolutely horrendous take. Please stop.
-
It does seem rather like lazy design. Iri addons have been getting super formulaic, and also not very good - the numbers have been tame as hell on release and gradually brought up months later once BHVR realizes nobody is using them. OP is completely correct; look at Artist's Exposed iri. 4 seconds! The play is just to shoot a bird at someone right in front of you, hug their back, and hope they don't catch on. How is that fun? (And her Undetectable works during cooldown at the cost of one bird. Very hard to use, and the effect is better achieved by one of her greens.) Nemesis's was 12 seconds of Exposed on release, for something that survivors would never do next to you. Trickster's used to have less give on how many blades away from full the survivor was. Meanwhile, when we get actual complementary-and-strong iris like Pinhead's iri box, they get nerfed. I miss the days of stuff like Mint Rag, Coxcombed Clapper, Bloody Coil, Iridescent King, and Black Incense where iri addons shook up playstyles and offered a variety of strong effects that directly complemented the killer they were attached to.
-
At no point in MMR or ranked matchmaking have I ever encountered so many AFK killers that I couldn't get an unhook survivor challenge done.
They're nonexistent at mid-high MMR and uncommon at low. Rock bottom, perhaps.
-
BHVR! What is that thing? Could the legends be true!?
-
Gouda and Colby Jack here. Mmm...
I like that we're just ignoring the rant in favor of cheese discussion. These forums can be cool sometimes.
-
@MrDardon said:
Tbh, they are certainly overused since they're the ONLY Add-ons which are being used. I wonder how they didn't get nerfed.
"We thought being able to remove Hemorrhage was a little too impactful, so we've buffed Crimson Ceremony Book to apply Hemorrhage for the rest of the trial. And Obsidian Goblet's Undetectable effect now persists for 0.5 seconds after leaving a placed Trail of Torment."
-
BHVR really likes to nerf lower-tier addons that get heavily used without considering why they're heavily used, or why the killer's other (and presumably better) addons aren't attractive.
-
The only use I can think of for Furtive Chase is to break off from chase and go after someone else nearby. Since obviously your TR doesn't matter to the player you're being chased - they're not going to be fooled into thinking you've up and disappeared, and it's not as good as straight-up Undetectable in chase where there's no red stain and no directional audio. (Which in and of itself isn't very useful! But still more useful than this.)
Except this works just fine without the TR reduction. Because the deal is that non-newbie survivors do not flee from a terror radius if the killer appears to be occupied. They will continue working on their gen while monitoring the situation. Either they're watching the killer and will react if the killer comes towards them, otherwise staying around regardless of the TR (Furtive Chase doesn't matter), there's a LoS blocker and they won't notice the killer breaking off until it's too late (Furtive Chase doesn't matter), or they're on comms and the person being chased will broadcast the killer's movements (and Furtive Chase doesn't matter.)
Keeping Furtive Chase's stacks when the Obsession dies doesn't address that Furtive Chase's effect is fundamentally not helpful.