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@Peanits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1039610#Comment_1039610
We've nerfed plenty of survivor perks as well, if time isn't a factor. Let's not forget that Sprint Burst used to have a 20 second cooldown and recharge mid-chase. Several nerfs later, you could still stack it with Lithe, Balanced Landing, and Dead Hard. Nowadays Exhaustion exists, and it doesn't cooldown while running at all.
Double pallets are gone, DS doesn't activate the first time you pick someone up, MoM has been massively toned down, instaheals are no more, instablinds are dead and gone, vacuums have lost their suck- the list goes on. There's changes to both sides, we're not picking favourites. Sometimes there's going to be changes that are great for you, sometimes the pendulum swings back the other way.
False equivalence. That logic only works if Survivors and Killers started out roughly evenly balanced, but they did not.
Survivors have always been in the strong position by far, and still are today, nearly 4 years later, despite all the changes.
You could give Survivors 20 more nerfs and Killers 20 more buffs, and Survivors would still be in the stronger position.
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@Spooky13 said:
Key nerf when as well, then. If they nerf one they have to nerf the other. Both give unfair means to end the game early.
Keys are not the equivalent to Moris.
BNP is the closest equivalent to Moris. Both cut out a portion of the work.
Keys on the other hand let you escape when you the Killer already has you in a "checkmate" position. The Killer equivalent to a key would be something that brings a Survivor who already escaped back into the game and kills them.
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Multiple of the above, along with some others.
-Skillchecks are trivially easy, there is basically no point to even having them.
-Gen times are too fast even at the base level, when you factor in perks, toolboxes, and co-op repairs it just becomes absurd
-Most maps are far too big for the Killer to effectively patrol.
What I would say needs to be done are the following:
-Add a new NON-OPTIONAL objective of some kind, preferably something that isnt just "hold m1 on this thing for x seconds"
-Make skillchecks -significantly- harder and rework toolboxes to be focused on making repair skillchecks easier, rather than making repairs faster.
-Make skillchecks more frequent as well. Seriously, sometimes you can go 0-100% on a generator and get only like one or two skillchecks, sometimes even zero.
-Cut down the size of most maps massively.
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I dont see why not.
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Eh, Keys are pretty disgusting.
Like, imagine if Killers had a way to bring a Survivors who already escaped back into the game and then kill them. Thats basically what the Killer equivilant to a key would be.
They should honestly be removed along with moris.
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Yeah sure, I have been wanting Nemesis ever since the L4D crossover, but then they never did another videogame crossover again.
But he definitley has to have his bazooka. Make it absurdly powerful. Instadowns Survivors, Breaks pallets, even undropped ones, Regresses generators by a massive amount, makes vaults into open "doorways". The catch is that it can only be used a limited number of times per game with no way to restock it, like Pig's RBTs.
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@NMCKE said:
I don't think the developers are survivor sided because they made changes to both sides.
Here's a few to start:
- Survivor: Nerfed Balanced Landing
- Killer: Nerfed Hex: Ruin
- Survivor: Nerfed Instaheals.
- Killer: Nerfed Nurse.
- Survivor: Buffed Perks.
- Killer: Buffed Perks.
- Survivor: Buffed Pallets.
- Killer: Added the EGC.
- Survivor: DS wasn't gutted after change.
- Killer: Freddy wasn't gutted after change.
I can go on for a while, but in short, the developers aren't bias towards any side. You shouldn't assume the developers are X sided because Y got buffed or nerfed. Research, from previous patches, shows the developers are quite neutral and look at top tier players for advice. 😁
Your logic only works if the Survivors and Killers started off evenly balanced, but they did not.
Survivors have been in the stronger position since launch, and it is still that way today even after all the nerfs they have received and all the buffs Killers have received..
You could give Survivors 10 more nerfs and give Killers 10 more buffs, and Survivors would still be in the stronger position.
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@leyzyman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/123485/the-devs-dont-deserve-all-this-hate
I do agree with some of your statements. Yes, I wish the forums would be a better place. I would say I am more sided with the killer POV, but when I am disagreeing with someone, I try to bring up the past updates, videos, ect with my argument, not just be pissy and say stuff like "your trash, git gud".
But, the main thing I do disagree with is the the hate that people are giving to the devs. Not all of them are bad, mind you, but the approaches they have taken are starting to backfire in the community.
For a time, there have been problems on both sides of the spectrum, and instead of trying to fix it in the game, they give a perk for it instead. A couple examples are:
Camping: borrowed time
Tunneling: DS
Lots of pallets: spirit fury
Slower killers: PWYF
There are more, but I just wanted to give a small sample.
Well, against solo survivor teams, I agree that this is alright.
But for swf, the only really good slowdown perk was ruin (for early game), and now there is nothing that 90% of killers can do. Billy is the only killer, IMO, that can apply any early game pressure atm. Not even Nurse can do it as well.
Killers have been begging for something, but ruin was the only thing they had. Now, there isnt anything. On top of that, after the community put in feedback for the PTB, one of the devs made a post saying that killers are wrong, and on another post agreeing with someone saying that killers that use ruin aren't good enough to be in red ranks.
I agree that constructive criticism is needed to the community, but I do not feel bad on some of the dev team.
@yermom said:
I have thousands of hours invested into this game and have spent a lot of money on content, and the changes they've made over the past patches are making all that time and money spent seemingly worthless. If I quit because the design choices they make, then in my opinion I wasted my money.
Honestly, the problem isn't that Ruin was changed, it's the problem that Ruin covered up, and is no longer covered up. They unearthed this problem but did nothing to address it.
What's frustrating people is that half of the killers cannot get around the map fast enough to be competitive, yet the developers don't seem willing to recognize that it's an issue. On the other hand, they change the game for survivors claiming that the game isn't fun, or they change the spirit because she's 'not fair' but as far as gen times are concerned, they aren't as concerned with that fairness. That makes people mad, because people feel like they're being tricked and taken advantage of.
I feel this is understating the problems greatly, but yeah.
I honestly dont understand why people even bother to play Killer when over the years BHVR has made it crystal-clear that they do not care about Killer players and just want them to be punching bags to entertain Survivor players. Any issues Killer players have are routinely derided, dismissed, or ignored by the developers.
I stopped playing Killer a long, long ago because of this behaviour from the devs, and they do not show any signs of stopping it any time soon.
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Killer- Killing all 4 Survivors is the minimum I would consider a win. If any Survivor escapes, the Killer has lost. The "scale" of the win is determined by number of gens remaining.
5 Gens=Perfect Victory, 4-3 gens=Good Victory, 2-1 Gens=Okay Victory, 0 Gens=Narrow Victory
Survivor - How much work I got done. If I barely did anything, I lost. If I did a good amount, I won. Escaping is considered a Perfect Victory, equivalent to the Killer killing all 4 Survivors with all 5 gens remaining.
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There is a penalty: The other Survivor do gens and escape for free, Killer depips.
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You can kill with sacrifice and it still counts towards the challenge, dude.
You dont need to use Mori/D.Hope/Rancor.
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Ew, no.
Imagine volunteering to being a punching bag for 4 random people on the internet.
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They should still be hex perks, but the entire Totem system should be reworked.
Making totem spawns "harder" only hinders new players, experienced players just memorize the totem spawns.
Hexes should be able to be places wherever the Killer wants to put them, as long as its not somewhere were it is impossible for Survivors to cleanse. (Eg: Teleporting somewhere Survivors cant reach as Nurse, at the top of a staircase blocking both the stairs and the cleanse prompt)
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They already tried this years ago, it doesnt work. Survivors abused the hell out of it.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
This is under known issues:
- Frame rate issues occur when combining The Doctor's Foul Bile and Auto-Lobotomy cosmetics.
Playing Doctor and using any of those Cosmetics? (In the Bug Report someone was only using the Auto-Lobotomy Head, and it was enough for Framerate Issues)
Even when not playing against Doc, im getting issues some times.
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This but without the 40 cap. No reason for it.
Also, remove Perk tiers.
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Trapper, simply because he is the oldest and the face of the game.
He's got no buisness being as archaic/outdated as he is right now. He needs a lot of quality of life changes, and a lot of his addons should be base kit.
Other than that, Legion. Legion is just a utterly unpleasant Killer. Unfun to play, unfun to play against, and their power doesnt even reflect their lore. Whats the point of having a "gang of Killers" if you only see one at a time. Legion needs a full Freddy-style rework, a new power that incorporates the other 3 members of the Legion that you are not playing as.
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Other: I think its fine, but I wish it were optional.
Maybe the music selection should be a cosmetic slot, rather baked-in to each Killer.
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Myers. Specifically I want the bedsheet ghost/Bob costume.Stuff from the Halloween zombie remakes would be good too. Like the pumpkin mask/teen Myers. Bad remakes, but cool potential cosmetics
Englund Freddy would be great, but I dont think thats happening any time soon.
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I think Its gonna be licensed, have pretty decent guess on who it might be as well.
If it ends up being original though, Im fine with that too.
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Higher caps per category. Generally as a Survivor you are going to reach the cap in one category or another pretty quickly unless you are doing basically nothing. For Killers thats even more true.
Oh, and remove perk tiers. They have no good reason to exist.
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Too reliant on the recovery time addons, his other addons are trash, and Survivors being able to break him out of shroud when he cant even see them is an issue.
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I would want simple emotes that have a purpose. Eg: a "stop" emote.
I would not want taunts, dancing, or other goofy stuff.
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None of the above.
I consider escaping to be a "perfect". The equivalent of the Killer killing all 4 Survivors with no gens completed.
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None. Using exhaust perks makes you reliant on them, making you a worse player.
You aint gonna get better if you need to rely on exhaust perks.
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Not even a competition.
Overwhelming is mediocre as hell and Overcharge is straight trash, literally useless against anybody with more than 10 hours played.
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Sure, why not.
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Spirit was fine the way she was.
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I dont play as Killer, total Survivor main, but watching others play new Nurse is just sad. She really didnt need to get stabbed as hard in the gut as she did.
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Execution's Blindfold is countered by SWF, so into the trash it goes.
Despair is good.
Rage is okay, but but could use a little tweaking. Maybe make it take less tokens to active, but remove the perma-broken effect.
Killing Veil is way too easy to exploit. You stick a single Survivor in the basement with Agitation and its GG.
Death's Leash is straight up trash. It needs to last way, way, way longer and maybe have a secondary effect to even be worth considering.
Jinx's effect is awful, but I really like the idea of having more perks that trigger off Crows, the last one we got was Spies From The Shadows which was nearly 3 and half years ago, when the game first came out, and we never got another crow perk since.
Odd One Out is broken.
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The other members of Legion shouldnt be seperate characters, but they should be incorporated into the Power somehow. Whichever ones you arent playing as should be able to assist you in some way.
One really good Legion rework that did this here:
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==Survivor Perks==
Dont care about the Survivor herself, as I am a hard Claudette main (mostly because I am too lazy to grind out the other Survivors though, to be honest).
Any Means Necessary and Breakout are broken.
Lucky Break is cool, I might use it sometimes.
==Killer==
You know those joke threads where people joke about how you could nerf each Killer into the ground with absurd joke nerfs? Things like "Nurse can no longer see Survivors while charging her blink", "Trapper's traps deal no damage and can be escaped on the first attempt every time", "Hag should be slowed and cannot attack for 30 seconds after teleporting".
The Oni is basically the "Billy should only have a limited amount of fuel for chainsaw" joke made into an actual Killer. How they thought this was a good Idea I will never know.
Bad.
==Killer Perks==
Zanshin Tactics is straight up trash and will never be used by anybody except to get the Adept Oni achievement.
Blood Echoes is kinda bad except maybe on Plague, even then its pretty meh.
Nemesis is useless on its own (other than the cheesy Legion tactic), but maybe it could be decent with PWYF. Other than that its kinda bad.
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Overall, not a fan of this chapter.
Oh yeah, the map aint too great either.
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The idea of "sequels" to chapters is interesting, plus there were alot of people dissapointed that the father wasnt playable after the "First Cut" trailer, which seems to be whats going to happen now.
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Wasnt even worth it lmao, the legacy cosmetics are ugly as sin.
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There shouldnt have been exclusives in the first place, but its good that they are finally releasing them.
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FEED ME BP.
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I agree.
Escaping should be considered a "perfect", the equivilant to the Killer killing all 4 Survivors with all 5 gens remaining, and should have its difficulty rebalanced to reflect that.
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Playing against new Nurse is like watching a crippled old dog trying to do something and failing repeatedly. Its not fun or entertaining, its just sad.
How BHVR thought this was a good idea baffles me and it only serves as a living testament that you should never expect BHVR to properly balance this game.
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Mr. Yamaoka.
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I have literally never seen anybody say it was anything but trash.
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Quentins, because they are near non-existant.
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Less of a single perk, but more of the entire Totem system needs a rework. Begone, RNG trash.
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Nice, now you get all the cool benefits the Devotion system grants, like..
...uhh
Nothing.
How long has it been since the devotion system was added again? And it still does n o t h i n g?
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He's not outright useless, but he's definitely archaic and in need of a reworking, both of his base kit and his addons.
Even just letting him carry & start with all of his traps would be a massive improvement (though still not enough to make him good).
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Dang, turns out when you introduce an absurdly lengthy timesink of a grinding system that is entirely reliant on time played, people are going to set up a farming system to avoid the massive timesink.
Who could have seen that coming? Surely there was no way to predict this. The Rift system totally isn't poorly thought out and excessively grindy or anything.
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Thick Skinned is broken. A 20% increase to the Killer's attack cooldown is absurd and would cripple any non-instadown killers.
Lone Wolf is disgustingly broken. Even if it was like "within 30 meters" instead of just 8 meters it would still be broken.
Grit seems interesting, but its probably too good, even once per trial.
Defiance is basically just a better version of Cameraderie, also they already tried something like this in a PTB and it was broken.
Odd One Out seems like a fun challenge perk, I would run it occassionally because I am BP hungry.
Escape Artist seems fine.
Not In Vain is busted, a 25% boost for 30 seconds is crazy, even if only triggers once a player dies.
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Neither.
Kindred should remain as it is and SWF should either be made a seperate mode or an optional toggle for Killers.
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His ability is way too unreliable thanks to the janky leaning mechanic and due to how easy it is to take him out of shroud.
Actually trying to use his ability is a waste of time. Its better just to ignore his stalking ability entirely and just treat him as "Wraith, but without a speed boost in exchange for instant decloak".
Also his addons are basically all trash. The only real ones worth anything are the ones that make his shroud recharge faster, everything else is hot garbage.
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Theres really no reason to get rid of it.
It affects literally nothing.
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Its not the same. Its similar, but its not the same. There have been thousands of other horror things that have had similar echoing drone noises. It could be literally anything. Plus nothing about the audio event code lines suggest that its Valak.