Coffeecrashing
Coffeecrashing
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@Malkhrim said:
There are two things I hate about Dead Hard:
- The lose-lose situations on pallets., not to mention the survivor is rewarded with the same distance as any hit, meaning they get more distance they before and don't need to drop the pallet.
- The fact that DH exists mean you have to wait and waste a few seconds before every downing hit until the perk is used or you can confirm the survivor you're chasing doesnt'have it. Some skilled survivors can wait for a LONG time before using Dead Hard, and that can be enough for the others to finish a gen before you can proc perks like Jolt or Pain Resonance (Eruption too... but let's be honest, nobody is going to use it anymore). On a game where every second counts and playing killer can feel quite rushed sometimes, this is annoying as hell.
And with certain killers, it's way more than a few seconds. There are a lot of times, where I can hit someone with a fully charged Huntress hatchet at a distance, and it would take me way longer than a few seconds to use my slow killer walking speed to get into point blank range, so I could do a quick m1 attack instead.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3347839#Comment_3347839
I'm not saying facing a different direction, I'm talking about aiming very slightly to the left so the knife just barely misses them. Or like I said, just hold the last knife for an extra second, I'm willing to bet most survivors would preemptively hit E at least the first time. Or just keep throwing, I know Trickster can chew through Endurance if he's got enough knives or has his Main Event up. Or bring addons and perks that deal with Exhaustion perks... I dunno, maybe I'm missing something, but it sure sounds like he has a lot of options to deal with Dead Hard and other sources of Endurance.
There are definitely killers who are more likely to hit into Dead Hard, but for the most part, it's killers for whom that isn't damaging. Blight and Nurse don't give half a damn, for instance, and even Huntress can ready up another hit super quickly, as well as being able to partially bait it out with camera flicks and such. They all, too, have addons and perks to handle it, though I will say that shouldn't be the default expectation. All killers should have some basekit way of adapting to DH, and outside of Twins (poor things), I am pretty sure most killers do.
The biggest problem is MMR. It doesn't matter if half the playerbase can be tricked by a projectile flick, MMR will still try to match me with the people that are really good at using dead hard, and those games feel miserable regardless if I win or lose.
And the speed boost makes it so that Huntress can't just ready up another hit super quickly. Her hatchet tap creates a really slow projectile, and the speed boost moves the survivor so far away that it's difficult to land a fully charged hatchet if the survivor starts wiggle dancing to try to dodge the hatchet.
And killers like Nurse absolutely do care, especially now that her range and recharge addons got buried. She still needs to go into fatigue, then slowly recharge tokens, then has to start chasing a survivor that is far away because of their speed boost. And her new chase music is so loud and miserable that survivors go instantly silent is they break line of sight, which they can often do because of the speed boost.
All this could have been fixed if survivors didn't get a speed boost. Allowing survivors to tank a hit should have been good enough. BHVR really didn't need to attach a speed boost to it. If there wasn't a speed boost, then yes, maybe huntress and trickster could better handle dead hard, but BHVR decided to combine two perks into one. Remember that the speed boost didn't exist with old dead hard. Survivors would just tank a hit, then be a bit farther forward than they were before. The new speed boost creates problems for killers, that didn't exist with old dead hard, and it should be valid to complain about it, even though it's not the same problem people had with old dead hard.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3347822#Comment_3347822
I don't play that much Trickster, so perhaps there's something I'm missing, but what exactly is stopping a Trickster player from holding the last knife until after the DH, or from throwing a knife intentionally to the side to force a survivor into reacting even though the knife misses them?
Like I said, I don't play Trickster much, but those would be my instincts when I know a survivor has Dead Hard. As with most killers, the counterplay is to bait it out - or to just circumvent it, but outside of perks that doesn't apply to Trickster.
Trickster's knives have travel time, and survivors can notice if his character starts facing a different direction. And this is only an example involving trickster. Huntress has a similar issue, and she can't rapid fire hatchets, so it's even more noticable if she turns to try to fake a hatchet the wrong way. This also doesn't help killers like Pyramid Head, whose power is so heavily telegraphed, that a survivor can dead hard it on reaction, even if it's at point blank range. And that's not even the full list.
The problem with dead hard has always been scenarios where the survivor doesn't have to predict an attack. With old dead hard, "dead hard for distance" was a scenario where it didn't need to be used predictively, but that didn't mean "dead hard for distance" was the only problem people could ever have with dead hard. People using dead hard on reaction to lunges, or certain killer powers, is the same type of problem as "dead hard for distance" used to be, where there's no prediction or mind games, and instead the survivor is just either using the perk proactively or reactively.
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@nf452 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3347694#Comment_3347694
Yeah many players can reliably dh the slow attacks (lunge), but the quick attack is just not reactable even if you have godlike ping and the dh mini game that most people complain about start when they are close to the survivor. It is a gamble situation for both sides, whether people want to admit it or not and it is annoying because a survivor wastes a few seconds from the killer, but there is no way for a player to react on a point-blank attack. More than ever the new dh is relient on ping, now that you cant use it for distance . Also lot of killer players have adjusted to the pallet and vaults and most of the times can bait dead hard.
New dh can be used for distance against Deathslingers.The small dash can be enough to avoid the hook in some situations. The new dh is objectively worse than the old dh and i hope no one disagrees with this. What the new one lacks is consistency. At least old one had i-frames and if u did it for distance it was 100% consistent.
That still doesn’t address the fact that new dead hard is more oppressive than old dead hard against certain killers. By telling people the counterplay is a quick m1 attack, you just told trickster players they should stop using their power, and use their slow walking speed to walk into point blank range of a survivor. How is that fair? Do you think “stop using your power” is a fair counterplay?
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@Brokenbones said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3347752#Comment_3347752
What's your problem I wasn't even talking to you
The person was talking about ranged killers getting hard countered by DH and I said hey at least deathslinger can deal with it
And that was completely unrelated information that was completely unhelpful. If someone is having issues with characters like Trickster, telling them "well, deathslinger is cool with dead hard" doesn't help them at all.
Dead hard is unnecessarily oppressive against certain killers, and reminding people that some killers are ok with new dead hard, doesn't help anyone at all, and doesn't solve the issue that dead hard is unnecessarily oppressive against certain killers.
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@Brokenbones said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3347703#Comment_3347703
???
The person I was replying to mentioned Trickster already
What was the point of mentioning deathslinger? Do you think it helps trickster players, when you mention that deathslinger is cool with dead hard? Do you think at helps trickster players when you say you personally don't feel like dead hard robs you?
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@Brokenbones said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3347690#Comment_3347690
Worth mentioning though DH does basically nothing against a Deathslinger who's good with their power, not only can the killer always force a deep wound but you can't DH when you're speared. There's at least some ranged killers who can deal with it
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3347694#Comment_3347694
There are valid complaints about it, for sure.
I made this very thread to hear those kinda complaints since my personal perspective is that I'm not really bothered by the perk all that much.
I see it a lot, on pretty decent survivors too but I typically don't feel robbed like I did before with old DH.
It’s not worth mentioning that new dead hard does nothing against deathslinger. And people should only mention that, if they are also willing to mention the specific killers where new dead hard is more oppressive than old dead hard.
Why aren’t you mentioning Trickster, where his knives harmlessly passed through old dead hard and old dead hard barely did anything to him, but new dead hard resets the knife count back down to 0, and gives survivors a speed boost?
New Dead hard tells specific killers that they should stop using their powers, and that is terrible.
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Dead Hard is unnecessarily oppressive against certain killers, where the survivors can use dead hard on reaction to these killers powers. There are also survivors that can reliably dead hard on reaction on killer lunges.
The worst part is many people refuse to acknowledge that it’s valid to complain about the NEW parts of new dead hard. We have so many people say “killers shouldn’t complain about new dead hard because you can’t dead hard for distance anymore, and that is what killers said was the biggest problem”. How does that even make sense? Do these people really think killers should have predicted the future, and before new dead hard was announced, they should have complained about endurance and speed boosts?
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@mila_kunis said:
Just a simple fix that should take place for Windows of Opportunity.
Why, as a survivor would we need to see breakable walls? We can't interact with them, and they make maps that have them, impossible to use the perk on, because it's impossible to see relevant things that are useful to a survivor.
Survivors need to see breakable walls, because sometimes it affects where you want to run to. Some loops are unsafe if the wall is broken, and some paths are blocked if the wall is unbroken.
It would be fine to request a different colored aura for breakable walls, but we do need to be able to see those auras.
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@HamsterEnjoyer said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3345514#Comment_3345514
Sadly thats my point. You shouldn't need to max out sensitivity and everything just to have a fighting chance as blight. If McLean did that then I send many thanks to him but Blight just needs a bit more help when it comes to controller so he can at least counter being spun
The last I checked, sensitivity didn’t affect his power at all. And the last I checked, console Blight couldn’t even do a 90 degree flick.
BHVR did try to make console Blight better to play, but they never actually got it to work well. They really needed to add button combinations that did quick 45 degree turns and quick 90 degree turns (that are still affected by the large angle turn nerf), but we never got those.
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This sounds like the same sound occlusion mechanic that deletes survivor footsteps, survivor noises, and boon noises, when there's no line of sight.
Killers have been dealing with this garbage sound occlusion for an extremely long time. Why should survivors get a free pass out of it? Sound occlusion should either be fixed for both sides, or it should cause both sides to suffer.
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No. Dead hard should be nerfed and buried with the same energy as what happened to eruption. Dead hard should be nerfed so badly that it’s clear to everyone that BHVR wants it dead.
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@wydyadoit said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/363749/aim-assist-messing-up-with-hits
lol. so the bug is back? i hate this feature. made me do an almost 360 spin because of some "tech" a survivor used on me.
the devs have said for years that there's no aim assist. there is. it's in the menus for console. and the tracking mechanic carries over into multiplayer.
whether that's intentional or not idk, but it pulls the camera when you do a long lunge and the survivor is near the edge of the screen.
You got the schematics wrong. There is no aim assist. But there is aim dressing, that can yank the killer’s camera, and steal hits.
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@SpaghettiVase said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3343292#Comment_3343292
I agree. The music is decent, but too loud, however it doesn't really fit nurse at all. It's very loud and bombastic which might fit better with a different killer. I personally view nurse as a graceful and methodical killer so i think the music should be more light and airy yet threatening.
I don’t understand how her new music fits with her theme. She’s got a bunch of puffy Victorian dresses, and I was expecting fancy violin or piano music for her theme, as it would be music she would probably have listened to. I have no idea where the loud thud thud music idea came from. What part of Nurse’s theme inspired thud thud music?
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@Zaydin said:
I've been feeling crushingly depressed all day and nothing helps me feel better like running into a bully squad (/s); constantly getting hit with Head-On and not even when in chases; I'd just be walking by a locker while patrolling and they would hit me with it. Constant teabagging after pallet drops and vaults and so on.
It made me want to just quit the match rather than put up with that kind of behavior except I'd be the one who gets punished by the system. I could have just gone to a corner and AFK'ed but most toxic survivor players will hold the game hostage if they can and refuse to leave until the EGC is just about to end, standing in the exit gates just so they can mock you knowing there's nothing you can do to stop them from escaping.
It's the sort of thing that just makes me want to quit playing DbD outright. I ended up sobbing after the match for 15 minutes because it was the straw that broke the camel's back for me after how miserable I had been feeling all day.
Bully squads are fine because when they are bullying the killer, they aren’t doing generators.
And that’s how this game works. It’s ok to complain about camping, tunneling, slugging, and anything else that might be unfun for survivors, but literal bully squads are fine even though their primary goal is to make the game miserable for killers.
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@EvilBarney666 said:
The talk has always been, buff solos up to swf levels and then buff killers. Well, now solo has alot more info and its made swf even stronger.
I hope the devs are just waiting for data to come in after the change and they will buff killers accordingly.
I feel they want to favor the survivors as it makes them more money. At this point it's a wait and see. Killer atm is rough. The game is too random to think you can win everytime. I just think some killers suffer more than others.
Remember, win and lose with dignity
The talk has always been about giving survivors quality of life improvements and accessibility improvements…. and then adjusting the kill rate back to where BHVR wants it to be.
The talk should have included killers getting quality of life improvements and accessibility improvements, but that has never happened. So be prepared for terrible buffs, like 2% longer lunge distance, that move the kill rate, but don’t help the killer experience at all.
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This sounds like the same sound occlusion mechanic that deletes survivor footsteps, survivor noises, and boon noises, when there's no line of sight.
Killers have been dealing with this garbage sound occlusion for an extremely long time. Why should survivors get a free pass out of it? Sound occlusion should either be fixed for both sides, or it should cause both sides to suffer.
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@Gamall said:
It's a bug
You don’t know that. It hasn’t been officially announced as a bug. And if it’s a bug, it should stay broken for as long as the other sound occlusion problems are broken.
Fix all the sound occlusion problem, or don’t fix any of them. That is fair.
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@indieeden7 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3344105#Comment_3344105
I mean I personally think there's a difference between gen sounds being muffled by walls and Spirit pretty much being reverted to her old self.
@egg_ said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3344105#Comment_3344105
Op asked a simple question and you wrote a whole fan fiction in your head and got mad about it I'm at loss of words
It’s the same sound occlusion system. I just think it’s funny that when killers complained about sound occlusion, we get told “it’s not that bad“, but when sound occlusion hurts survivors, then all of a sudden it’s a big deal, and some survivors are even asking for a killswitch to happen.
Survivor noises and killer noises should be treated equally. So if survivors think it’s ok for their sounds to get deleted when there’s no line of sight, they should also be fine when killer noises get deleted when there is no line of sight.
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This sounds like the same sound occlusion mechanic that deletes survivor footsteps, survivor noises, and boon noises, when there's no line of sight.
Killers have been dealing with this garbage sound occlusion for an extremely long time. Why should survivors get a free pass out of it? Sound occlusion should either be fixed for both sides, or it should cause both sides to suffer.
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@loothound said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/364449/surge-in-spirits
It’s probably due to the new bug? spirit has where you need line of sight with her to hear directional audio. Hens’ new video showcased it so people are playing spirit more now
This sounds like the same sound occlusion mechanic that deletes survivor footsteps, survivor noises, and boon noises, when there's no line of sight.
Killers have been dealing with this garbage sound occlusion for an extremely long time. Why should survivors get a free pass out of it? Sound occlusion should either be fixed for both sides, or it should cause both sides to suffer.
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@adam1233467 said:
I'm not here to cry about how spirit is a very strong and blah blah blah, I'm here to tell you that she has a very gamebreaking bug, that makes the sound of the phase not directional if you and spirit are between an object in the middle of the phase, this makes spirit uncounterable again, they tried to fix the Furin addon bug, and by the way, they broke her whole phase
This sounds like the same sound occlusion mechanic that deletes survivor footsteps, survivor noises, and boon noises, when there's no line of sight.
Killers have been dealing with this garbage sound occlusion for an extremely long time. Why should survivors get a free pass out of it? Sound occlusion should either be fixed for both sides, or it should cause both sides to suffer.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3343484#Comment_3343484
I don't think they should be expected to arbitrarily tack on "and of course we're in the planning/discussion stage for [x side] changes too" every single time they discuss a change they're far enough along to actually start teasing. I especially don't think that them not doing that should be considered fair reason to start accusing them of horrendous bias and misconduct.
It's not every single time. We've been going over a full entire year of "let's talk about survivors quality of life improvements and accessibility improvements, but we refuse to say anything at all about killers"
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@Mooks said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3343484#Comment_3343484
no, since killers also get buffs and other accessibility settings eg colorblind mode. And FoV slider might still come in the future - it’s not ruled out.
you just want them to be one sided and victimize the other side while disregarding anything they do for that side
Killers got zero killer-exclusive accessibility changes, and zero quality of life changes. Killers don't get quality of life improvements. They get generic number buffs, that raise the kill rate, but don't improve the player experience at all.
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@Mooks said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3343435#Comment_3343435
I am all for an FoV slider and accessibility options in general. But in this case especially with the visual TR, it’s not one sided over another.
no one reasonably argued that colorblind settings were in any way a killer buff or killer sided feature even though let’s be honest, it had a significantly bigger effect for killers
When BHVR talks about a survivor accessibility issue for a very long time, and talks about coming up with a solution, and promises it will be implemented in the future….. but absolutely positively refuses to mention absolutely anything about killer accessibility issues, then yes it is one sided.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3343382#Comment_3343382
Because Dead Hard has counterplay 99% of the time and Eruption does not. So Eruption takes priority for now. It makes no sense to leave one awful perk in place just because they don't have time to get to another annoying one for another 3 months. That's not how things work.
I refuse to believe BHVR "didn't have time" to think of a real dead hard nerf in all this time. Just bury the perk
1) Dead hard only works on basic attacks
2) Dead hard deactivates for the rest of the trial if it triggers successfully
3) Dead hard no longer gives a speed boost if it triggers successfully
Put all 3 of those thing in the game. BAM! We have a real nerf, and it only took me about 2 minutes to think of it. We don't need enormous amounts of time for BHVR to think of real dead hard nerfs. Do we really think a group of people brainstormed non stop for weeks to think of the eruption nerf, and they were so bogged down with eruption discussion that they couldn't focus on anything else?
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@Mat_Sella said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3343380#Comment_3343380
you do know that survivors also hear the same music, right?
I don't care if the survivors can hear the same music. When I'm playing as Nurse, I'm concerned on whether or not survivors go completely silent every single time they break line of sight while the chase music is going. I couldn't care less if the survivors heard zero chase music at all, because that doesn't change how miserable Nurse's chase music is for Nurse players.
Nurse has a slower walking speed than survivors, so it's very important for Nurse to hear them when they break line of sight. But now it's just totally silent survivors, and it's terrible.
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@sizzlingmario4 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3343045#Comment_3343045
It already does show the auras of dropped pallets right now (but only while it's not on cooldown).
Since the cooldown is going away, now this effect will always be active.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3343079#Comment_3343079
No range limit on it.
Wow that's super convenient.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3343054#Comment_3343054
I wouldn't get too focused on the balance aspect of it though. The devs are also considering the fun aspect of the game. It's a juggling act. With Ruin, PGTW, and Eruption, there was a common feeling of players feeling like they were on the same objective forever, often completing it twice when you factor in the regression. That's straight up unfun, and there should be healthier ways to introduce game delay mechanics. Thana was a bit different. The progress felt awful when everyone even when 3 people were injured at 90s gens. Again, balanced or not, it wasn't fun to play the game with it.
Correction, they are focusing on the SURVIVORS fun aspect of the game. Dead hard is the most unfun perk for killers, and we still haven't seen a nerf to dead hard that has the same energy as the eruption nerf.
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@Mat_Sella said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3343292#Comment_3343292
Oh yeah, i totally agree! The music is fun and doesnt sound like a repetitive sfx meant only to drown out other noises.
The one thing is, its not what I would expect to hear from a Nurse that steals people's breath. It's too...aggressive? Like someone who would be charging at you and not flying through the air
Menu music is otherwise fantastic though!
The music is not fun. It's purposely much louder than the previous music, and it purposely has a bunch of loud thud noises, which makes it absolutely miserable to hear survivors. And it's a giant slap in the face that BHVR gives survivors a bunch of player experience buffs in the same patch they give Nurse a massive player experience nerf by giving her this garbage new chase music.
If BHVR wants to make Nurse less powerful, that's whatever, but purposely lowering her quality of life with garbage new chase music is mean and spiteful.
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@Entitled_survivor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3343025#Comment_3343025
you don't need someone to tell you to pick a pallet you already know because of the perk and honestly picking up some pallets could be a waste of time since some are absolutely useless ex the new "tetris" tiles on azarov maps ..i'd never bother picking those up even for 10k points
@ProfessorDunwich said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3343025#Comment_3343025
Completely agree with the SWF part. The perk itself allows you to see dropped pallets anywhere on the map though.
Where did BHVR say the perk would allow people to see dropped pallets anywhere on the map? I thought the exact words are "This perk is losing its cooldown, meaning you can use it whenever you see a dropped, unbroken pallet.", which doesn't say anything about getting additional aura reading.
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@RainehDaze said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3342622#Comment_3342622
Fixing it would probably require fixing his other collision bugs because they're all interlinked, which I presume is proving difficult.
And all the maps are getting increasingly lubed, by all appearances.
Blight needs a total code rework, like they did with Nurse, if you want his collision to work as intended.
1) Blight has a collision bug with his bump hitbox, that started happening when they raised his camera angle
2) BHVR tried to fix this bug by releasing a secondary collision system, that never worked, and created an M2 bug
3) BHVR fixed this M2 bug, and hug tech happened as a side effect of this fix
So let's review. Hug tech hasn't gotten fixed yet, The secondary collision system hasn't gotten fixed yet, and his bump hitbox hasn't gotten fixed yet. We have 3 major collision problems with Blight, and at this point, it's safe to say BHVR would need to completely rework Blight's code if they want to get everything working properly.
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It's going to make killers feel even more miserable when they are against a coordinated SWF, where the survivors are using voice communications to point out all the pallets that need to be reset. Solo survivors aren't going to know where all the pallets are that can be reset, but SWFs with voice communication can get so much more value out of this perk buff.
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@C3Tooth said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3341799#Comment_3341799
10sec is useless if you pick dying survivor to hook. But 10sec is alot if you slug the 3rd survivor and go for the 4K.
Not a healthy change.
The game has a survivor HUD now. Do you really think the 4th survivor is going to sit on a generator if they know the killer has eruption, there are only 2 survivors left, and the other survivor is getting chased?
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@HugTechLover said:
Can y’all just be PATIENT?! It literally only mentioned an eruption nerf, because it’s the most anticipated perk nerf. A mod already said the notes did not encompass all the perk changes.
Why should people be patient? What is the purpose of repeatedly telling us about eruption, but making zero mention of dead hard, unless it's done on purpose to cause drama? There is no universal law that requires BHVR to only tell us one perk at a time. If they were planning on nerfing dead hard, they could have announced it already.
Besides we were patient before the meta shakeup, and look what happened there. And BHVR has been well aware that eruption and dead hard are the two most hated perks. I want dead hard nerfed into the ground like what is happening to eruption. I don't want a version of dead hard where people bicker and argue on whether or not it's a nerf. I want it nerfed so hard that everyone is in agreement that the perk is dead in the ground.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3341631#Comment_3341631
Pain res takes 13.5 seconds of progress off of a gen, and doesn't actually tell you reliably where it was. Eruption will show you the aura for a full 10 seconds. A nurse being able to see the aura of a survivor should basically be a guaranteed hit. The best slowdown in the game, is a downed or hooked survivor.
The top nurse players never actually used starstruck and agitation. They use aura reading perks, because a nurse can down people faster than any slowdown that exists in this game, and having aura reading to guarantee a hit is insane.
Except that some of the top Nurse players did sometimes use starstruck. It used to be a good anti-SWF perk for Nurse. Do you know which survivors want to be in the killer's terror radius when the killer is carrying survivors? SWFs with flashlights, toolboxes, or bodyblocks, that are using voice communications to try to prevent the killer from hooking their teammate. Starstuck made it so you didn't have to worry about these things, because if survivors did get in your way, they were only 1-shot away from getting knocked to the ground.
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@PowZapBamWoofMeow said:
This perk is getting its cooldown removed.
Sooooo… is it just me or does this have the potential for abuse:
Survivor drops pallet, killer gets stunned, while killer stunned survivor resets pallet, stuns killer again. ???
What you should be worried about are chase times getting longer, because some pallets are dangerous when undropped, but sort of useless when dropped, and when you are in a chase, you need to waste time destroying those pallets mid chase, instead of just leaving them so you can chase the survivor sooner.
Of course this is yet another perk that is much stronger in a SWF with voice communications. So even though we were told the goal was eventually to close the gap between solo q and SWF, here we are widening the gap again. You know those SWFs that like to have a 2nd person get in the way, by bodyblocking, trying to get head on stuns, or trying to get flashlight saves, pallet stun saves, or sabo saves??? Get ready for these SWFs to also reset the pallets you leave behind. It's easier for SWFs to use this perk, because they can use voice communications to tell each other where all the "best pallets" are that need to be reset.
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@Quizzy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3341557#Comment_3341557
Fitst of all if dbd said eruption outshined the rest then im taking their word for it. I could careless about pick rate. Im more concerned over the effects of perks in a match.
And its the reason i believe once again dh doesnt outshine at all because its not just certain killers that counter it. Lag/ping is also an issue on both sides.
Of course you don't care about the pick rate, because it doesn't fit your narrative. Dead hard should get buried into the ground, so killers can finally enjoy the meta shakeup they were supposed to get.
@Chilli_man2400 said:
I’m just going to say this
JUST BECAUSE TWO THINGS ARE PROBLEMATIC DOESN’T AUTOMATICALLY MEAN WE NERF THE OTHER SIDE!!!!!
DH is problematic yes but that can be fixed you don’t have to nerf both sides every update.
Stop with this bullshit mentality that we need to nerf that to cause it’s just as bad.
everyone has turned them into a Us Vs Them riot
I just want BHVR to stop doing this double standard. If a killer perk can get nerfed into the ground because it's perceived as the best regression perk, then dead hard should get nerfed into the ground because it's perceived as the best exhaustion perk.
And Us vs Them is mostly meaningless on these forums, because 99% of the time people only say it when people are complaining about survivors. If you gathered all the times people said "us vs them" on these forums, you'd discover it's very rarely ever said in response to people complaining about killers.
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@Quizzy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3341485#Comment_3341485
If thats the case, then both perks have its flaws and one is better than the other in certain situations. There is no clear perk that outshines the other overall because every killer is different. Every map is different. Its the reason eruption nerf was a higher priority. It clearly outshined the other regression perks. And thats why the OP of this thread is completely wrong about dh getting a major nerf.
Besides, even if it did, ppl will still find a way to use it and killers will complain again
Eruption clearly didn't outshine all the other regression perks, because pain res still had a higher pick rate. The big lesson is that eruption had the PERCEPTION of outshining all the other regression perks, which is why it was the most complained about regression perk.
Similarly, dead hard has the perception of outshining all the other regression perks, which is why it's still the most complained about exhaustion perk.
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@Quizzy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3341451#Comment_3341451
Swfs dont make up majority of the survivor playerbase. And tbh, i still do see some swf players fall for eruption
And trapper doesn’t make up the majority of the killers, but some people absolute love to keep bringing up trapper’s traps as an excuse that dead hard is “balanced” now.
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@Quizzy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3341454#Comment_3341454
Dh is the most used. But its still debatable for it being the best perk when there is counterplay to it being one hit killers, lag latency, waiting it out. Even sprint burst has consistent results than dh. I just believe killers have an issue when they get outplayed when a survivor times it well.
Do people actually believe the “sprint burst is actually better” argument? Do people really think survivors, out of the goodness of their hearts, are purposely avoiding sprint burst because they want to provide a more fun experience for the killer? Sprint Burst doesn’t even provide constant value across killers either. LoL if you try sprint burst against blight, and even wraith would just cloak and quickly close the distance. Sprint burst is not the survivors “best kept secret”, it’s trash compared to the current dead hard.
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@Quizzy said:
Comparing dh and eruption wont help you at all. Eruption was without a doubt the best gen regression perk as there is no counterplay to it for solo q players.
Dh in certain situations and against certain killers(one hit killers) is useless and doesnt shine over other exhaustion perks at all. It has a counterplay to it. Doesnt matter how boring it is for killers of "waiting it out." Survivors wait out pain res and thats a solid counterplay so im confident it wont be touched at all.
According to many survivors, eruption was “useless” against SWFs, so in their eyes it didn’t shine over other regression perks against all survivors.
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@dspaceman20 said:
I'm still waiting for the call of brine and pain res nerf because I also see those in my games a lot
You should start complaining about it on the forums! Everyone can watch in fascinated horror, of just how much BHVR is willing to buff survivors, without giving killers any information of what their plans for killers is going to be.
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@StarLost said:
The sad part?
Pain Resonance was used more than Eruption, which was at a...what? 17-20% usage rate?
(Looks at survivor perk usage rates, sighs angrily and goes back to leveling Ace).
What really grinds my grapes about this entire thing is that BHVR said that they wanted to make the killer meta more varied, as back then it was either PR+DMS, Ruin, Pop or some combination of these.
So they buffed Thana and Eruption, nerfed Ruin and Pop, nerfed Overcharge of all things (outside of the bug, I still maintain that vanilla OC was actually better than the new one), then nerfed Thana and now Eruption. All while buffing faster gen perks and adding more of the sodding things.
Meaning that the only game in town is going to be Pain Resonance. We've gone down from a stale meta of three to a meta of one.
And...what do you think happens to Pain Resonance now?
Are BHVR going to buff killer regression perks to compete, or are they going to nerf PR?
Before you answer - Twins and Nemesis addon nerfs.
I don't see any evidence that BHVR will buff other regression perks to help killers. They only promised to "fix the kill rate", which could mean giving killers generic number buffs, that doesn't help their player experiences, but does raise the kill rate back to where BHVR wants it to be. Like maybe they'll make the lunge distance 2% longer, which technically is a buff, but doesn't make the killer experience feel any better.
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@jesterkind said:
The tricky part about that is that Dead Hard isn't the undisputed best choice if you're looking at it from strength alone.
Sprint Burst, Lithe, and Overcome are all much better picks for getting distance and breaking chases- people are just more comfortable with DH and prefer playing aggressively without actually breaking chase, which is what DH does. It's difficult to think of a way to make the perk less appealing without entirely reworking it to do something entirely different, and if that's the road we're going down, it makes sense it'd take significantly more time than a normal balance change.
That's such a bad joke. Dead Hard is the undisputed best choice, which is why it's still the #1 survivor exhaustion perk.
Dead Hard needs a giant nerf, like what BHVR just did to Eruption. None of this "let's make it different, but still highly valued" garbage. I want it nerfed to the ground just like what they did with eruption. We've had such a long string of good things for survivors, that BHVR could at least nerf dead hard into the ground as a fair trade.
Something like Dead Hard only works on basic attacks, can only be used once per game, and no longer gives the survivor a speed boost when triggered successfully. Nerf and bury the perk. Make it clear the intent is to stop most people from using it, like what they just did with eruption.
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@SweetTerror said:
Not only is eruption dead, but I'm genuinely surprised that they didn't reveal a change to DH as well, at least that way they can say "we're not just changing killer perks".
The change to eruption after the meta shake up was definitely needed. The hindered status effect was too OP, but we're still seeing just as many complaints about DH as we always have. Make no mistake it's better than it was, but with so many perks allowing second chances now, there's just no need (imo) for DH to be allowed to be used over and over.
But yeah, BHVR has officially killed eruption. All they needed to do was block the gens for 20 seconds instead of the hindered status effect. Being able to see auras halfway across the map on a generator is only viable if you're nurse or a long-range killer like Huntress.
Why are you surprised? We got over a year of BHVR telling survivors they care about the survivor experience, months of BHVR telling survivors they care about survivor accessibility issues, and now we get buff after buff for survivors, and zero anything for killers. Why on earth was anyone expecting BHVR to help with killer frustrations, when they refuse to talk about it at all, and instead just give survivors patch after patch of good things for survivors?
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@albertoplus said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3340852#Comment_3340852
I was going to answer him but i think you did it a lot better. Thanks!
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3340718#Comment_3340718
Let's be honest here. Wiating is NOT fun for anyone. Waiting for Dead Hard until the survivor uses it is not fun. Waiting for Eruption to go off (and i mean, before the survivor is put down, so you don't get the incapacitated effect) is not fun.
You don't know when the other survivor is going to be down (unless you are in comms or see him directly). You don't know when the other survivor is going to E you. Funny is, the base is the same for both perks.
Eruption needs a solid nerf (and it got it, it left it in the trash can tho, but that's another story) and so DH. "Waiting while doing nothing" should never be the counterplay to a perk.
The thing that you are probably thinking: "I cannot juist wait until a surv is put down because what if the survivor just takes like 60 seconds to be put down!? Should i do nothing for 60 seconds?!"
Do you think kilers like to wait 3-5 seconds on every survivor on every wounded health state? In total time that can be a solid 50-60 seconds of "doing nothing", and that's counting the killer did successfully hooked every survivor on every first chase. Not counting the times where the killer has to stop chasing after getting E'd becasue the chase was getting so long, the times where survivors dont get hooked and just heal, etc.
Many factors can be said for both perks, but both of them share the same basics: "They get countered by doing nothing until they pop off. And that's not fun for anyone."
It's also more than 3-5 seconds on certain M2 killers, because the survivor can dead hard their killer powers on reaction, so those killers no longer get to save lots of time with their powers.
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@Chordyceps said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3341329#Comment_3341329
You think 10 seconds of aura reading on the nurse (more if you bring lethal) wouldnt be strong for nurse?
Nurse's sustained map traversal speed is garbage, now that the range and recharge addons were nerfed, and because the double blink addon is difficult to use in an actual chase so many people aren't using it. Nurse will likely not be able to reach the survivor in 10 seconds, especially if they should be hooking the survivor they just knocked to the ground.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3341311#Comment_3341311
I'm happy to respond here but I'd like to acknowledge that this is an entirely new topic and not the thing you were saying up until now.
Anyway! Discouraging camping is a great idea that I support, but it can't come at the cost of an objectively overpowered perk like Eruption stalling games out for ages, you'd surely agree? There's no way you could make the argument that Eruption on live servers is fine and healthy for the game, so something has to be changed- and there's no point highlighting that it took years to fix one thing if they're trying to fix this thing quicker, because that implies you think they should leave this broken thing in the game for years too.
I think BHVR needs to release a very powerful perk (or perks) to encourage killers to leave a hooked survivor. There needs to be a powerful positive reason to leave the hook, and to spend time traveling to and from the generator. People need to recognize that the cost of generator regression perks includes all the time a killer spends walking to generators, kicking them, then walking back to somewhere useful.
If a generator kicking perk has the same value as a perk that doesn't require potentially heavy traveling time, then it's logical to just go with the perk that doesn't require heavy traveling time.
The survivor HUD also made it less valuable to patrol generators, because now every survivor in the game knows when the killer is chasing anyone, and when survivors need to be extra careful because the killer doesn't have a current target and might be patrolling generators. This makes it easier for solo q survivors to pre leave generators and hide from the killers, which means killers are now less likely to find survivors on generators, and are better off proxy camping everyone instead.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3341288#Comment_3341288
I don't want to speak for OP, but that claim really is not evidenced by the text of their original post. The text pretty clearly implies they're mad about Eruption being changed quickly, with an extra dash of seeming to not think it was a problem to begin with.
The OP complaint was that BHVR claims they want to discourage camping. But they buffed eruption to discourage camping, and then nerf it into the ground, which encourages killers to go back to camping, because the kicking regression perks are no longer worth using. Why bother kicking gens for regression when we can use pain res and proxy camp the hook?