gilgamer
gilgamer
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@Jago said:
It serves absolutely no purpose. Yoi can still ask the ranks on end game chat.
Im not talking about ranks I'm talking about the SBMM score, which from what I've gathered from what the devs have said, they plan to keep as a secret score that will determine your skill and you will have absolutely no way of checking this score
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@EntitySpawn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2421858#Comment_2421858
Yes but taking chases is important and certainly shows the most skill and that's why its important not only to take hook stages for your team but also to show you're good at chases.
To be high rank you should be doing everything in a trial, from chases, gems, totems, saves etc.
Biggest issue is alot of players dont do gens or chases which are by far the most important 2, so play how you enjoy playing and the game will adjust you to killers and survivors that match
Not too mention that if this matchmaking is actually good and working properly and you're getting placed with people like that then well im sorry to say but that means your the same "skill level" as them so....
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So far my games have been only slightly more erratic then usual with not much difference, most games are either 4ks or 4 outs with a 1k secure or a hatch escape mixed in.
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@Orion said:
It's been rough the first few trials, but I understand the algorithm doesn't know where to put me because I haven't played much.
Have you not played much the past couple months because supposedly its using data thats been collected over a several months period of time.
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@steezo_de said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2421444#Comment_2421444
With all the different ways they allow you to stab, hack, and chainsaw people, in graphic detail, it's just backwards thinking to put such a sensitive chat filter in an adult game. I'm a big boy-- I can handle ######### talking.
For real, if someone is old enough to see someone get eaten alive, stabbed, mutilated then they should be old enough to see those words.
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My problem with these kind of posts is I always have the doubt thats all you got since there's still no way to really tell if someone is swfing unless they straight up tell you. Even checking friends list isn't a garuntee.
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I dc'd earlier today and I still got the 5 minute ban first, I stopped playing after that and I almost never dc more then once a day.
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They've been pretty all over the place, maybe even more erratic then normal matchmaking.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2421876#Comment_2421876
How so?
Because an algorithm is 100% deterministic. Hell, even RNG is deterministic, it's just made to appear random, from an end-user PoV and a statistical PoV.
How would dbds matchmaking be more exploitable then any other games mmr?
It wouldn't, it'd be just as exploitable as those games. However, those games don't have a portion of the playerbase actively trying to get those games killed.
So why should people hating the game matter, its obviously not very large since the game is still growing so again I do think see how thats a good reason at all the worst thing a person can do to this game is just not play it, or I guess like hack the servers like what happened to titanfall 2 but thats not relevant to matchmaking. Also again how would it be legitimately exploitable, you can't answer that because we don't know how it works and if its not anymore exploitable then any other game why is not an issue for those games?. League has a far more toxic fan base then dbds and they show your rank.
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As others have said undying/devour is a pretty popular combo as well, not as common as ruind/undying but still up there.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2421870#Comment_2421870
If you understand how the algorithm works, it's always going to be exploitable because everything is.
How so? How would dbds matchmaking be more exploitable then any other games mmr?
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2421850#Comment_2421850
How does that make sense? An algorithm is an algorithm. Unless the devs add RNG to it, the results are 100% predictable.
Also dbd already has a massive amount of rng baked into it to begin with.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2421850#Comment_2421850
How does that make sense? An algorithm is an algorithm. Unless the devs add RNG to it, the results are 100% predictable.
Yes and if they make the right things rewarding then how would it be exploitable?
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@sulaiman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2421758#Comment_2421758
The thing is, if i end up in several games where only one other survivor is doing gens, and the other 2 just run around, why did i end up there?
I prefer to play stealthy, but i usually end up with the highest points (including killer) because i just do it all, gens, hook saves, totems, but chases only if the killer finds me (depending on the teammates i might also take over if one is in trouble).
But if i end up with people that don´t play constructive, there might be an unhealty focus on chases. I know for a part of the playerbase that is what the game revolves around, but thats is not true for all of us.
That being said, this reflects a previous experience and just shows why a little insight in how things work might help balancing different aspects of the game.
The last games i played were fine.
Exactly you won't know if your playstyle is possibly being under or over valued by the system and a well made system would reward general skill the most whether it be running the killer for 5 gens or being a good gen jockeys that never misses a skillcheck and knows how to do specific gens so as not to 3 gen or even a survivor thats good at hiding and wasting the killers time. All it being invisible does is make us assume whether the system is working well or not based on a game that has fairly extreme rng in their map design.
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Nothing being done is absolutely a reason to complain.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2421843#Comment_2421843
Someone already told you that the devs don't want people exploiting the algorithm.
A well made algorithm wouldn't be so easily exploitable, so I dont see that as a good reason at all.
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@GenJockeyNance said:
I was fine with it but it's driving me nuts I can't see to conclude my theories that people / swfs are purposefully pulling the rank 3, rank , 20, rank 16, rank 9 card right now.
Yeah people will still have swfs with mixed matchmaking but now you won't be able to see it and won't know why you did so horribly that round and will just be left to assume, its dumb imo.
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@gendoss said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2421823#Comment_2421823
Oh you mean they should show the SBMM rank? Yeah I agree with that, it's stupid they aren't. I thought you were talking about how they hid the old ranks because that went invisible today.
Yes I'm talking about how I can't think of a single good reason to hide someone's sbmm score.
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@gendoss said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2421812#Comment_2421812
Dude you are not understanding what I'm saying. If you say the old system is bad then why are you still using it to judge matchmaking? You just said the old system was bad but you want them to show the old color ranks to judge how well SBMM is working? They are completely separate things, the old ranks literally mean nothing, that's why they hid them.
What? No I'm saying your SBMM score should be visible so you were the one who was not understanding.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2421805#Comment_2421805
Even if they said anything, people would still complain, because they don't read. This is one of the few games I've seen where the in-game news appear as an unskippable, impossible-to-disable pop-up, and yet people still don't read the patch notes.
Besides, they don't want people to affect their MMR.
Then they can be corrected when they complain and the situation is resolved. Easy as that and a proper well made mmr system shouldn't be easily abusable even with knowledge of how the system works. People being willfully ignorant is not a good excuse to not inform your playerbase of what they should know.
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@gendoss said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2421776#Comment_2421776
No... The point of SBMM is that the old color system is bad and doesn't actually represent skill. It doesn't matter if a purple or green gets matched with a red rank because it means that they are similar in skill. The old color system is really bad, I remember the first test I was matching with brown rank survivors who were somehow amazing at the game.
Yes I know the current system is bad but that has nothing to do with this new system. If its accurate thats all the more reason it should be shown so you know if you are actually getting paired with people your level. Imagine if in csgo a silver was placed with a global elite.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2421776#Comment_2421776
Or people would see someone with a score that's 100 higher than their own and claim it's unbalanced, when, in fact, that difference might be essentially irrelevant in the algorithm they devised.
Then they should tell us what it means so we know. Having a system that's easily misunderstood is not a good thing either. Like all you have to say is your score is basically between 100 and 1000 with 100 being the lowest and 1000 being the highest so obviously if your a 200 and your matched with a 900 you should know, because regardless of how the match went its a failure of the system and people should know that. It very clearly shows they have no faith in their own ability to make a proper system
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@Junylar said:
Because if it were visible, it would be too obvious to see it doesn't work.
All it tells me is they have no faith in their own product.
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I'm nice all of the time, its one of the biggest reasons I lose matches, f*cking empathy.
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@gendoss said:
It's because people were basing their opinions on SBMM on the old ranks which are completely separate and not related at all. People were basically saying "I'm a green rank killer, why am I getting purple/red ranks survivors" when purple/red ranks survivors didn't even exist.
Okay then it being invisible only means you can't see when you are getting matched up with people way better or worse and just have to assume. If it was matching you up with people your score and the matches went well then it being visible would only be a good thing since they'd be able to show how well their system works. It being invisible only tells me they have no confidence in their own product.
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@EntitySpawn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2421748#Comment_2421748
Well the idea is not to focus on the rank, if you want feedback then focus on how the match went and not if you're ranking up. When you know the ranking it's quite easy to abuse it so I dont blame them, everyone should play for fun not to hit a high rank sorta thing.
Then again I feel like I'm the only one who wants MMR lol
Okay but if you knew what your sbmm rank was and you got ranked with someone way higher or lower and the game went well then you'd know the system obviously isn't working very well. People are gonna go for escapes or kills regardless and I dont see how a well made system is "abusable". A good matchmaking system should reward skill regardless of playstyle. So it being invisible just feels like a cope out so this system doesn't get the same criticisms that rainbow lobbies get.
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@EntitySpawn said:
Well if I'm not mistaken the devs said something like:
We wish to hide the mmr so players play how they would normally play and be match within the right ranking instead of people knowing how the ranks are determined and change how they play etc. To get higher.
Basically they want you to play how you normally would without ranking changing your play style
Okay but then wouldn't there be a problem of peoples playstyles being unfairly belittled by the matchmaking without their knowledge, I dont see how it's a bad thing to at least roughly know what the system sees as good or bad. How can we give feedback on the system when we know nothing about it.
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When its just a basic m1 that every killer can do, basically any special power doesn't count.
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@truegod_10 said:
I think you answered why with your last statement.
Having it invisible is an awful idea in my opinion cause even if it works great you will have a lot of people saying it isn't without a way to verify.
That's why I'm asking if anyone has a legit reason for it to be invisible because I can't think of one.
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@Clowning said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2421444#Comment_2421444
Hehe, you said a funny word.
So help me lord Child
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@VioletCrimes said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2421444#Comment_2421444
Also, some of the quotes have character saying “#########“. But we can’t say it? The quote for babysitter has “shithead” in it.
Not too mention using an @. Somewhere in the word gets around it so its not even a good filter. Also it will censor the dumbest ######### words like Myers.
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The chat filter needs a toggle, im an adult, I don't mind seeing bad words and bhvr doesn't need to coddle me like some 10 year old who still giggles at someone saying vagina.
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@BingBongMan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2420943#Comment_2420943
Have you seen how fast PC survivors can 360? After running into a squad that could effectively rob me of all the hits because they could 360 effectively, I turned crossplay off.
Not screwing with that crap again to preserve my fragile sanity.
You wanna know how to counter 360's you wait for half a sec then they stop spinning because of how momentum works in this game, you cant just infinitely keep 360ing without any momentum because then your model is just spinning in a very small circle and you can just swing in there general direction and auto aim plus your swings hitbox will just do the rest. That's why I barely consider 360's as an advantage when they are so easy to counter no matter what platform you are playing on.
Honestly PC's overall better performance is a better argument against crossplay but that's again not an issue with PC but an issue with BHVR's horrible optimization.
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@BingBongMan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2420737#Comment_2420737
Ain't saying he's right, but you can't deny PC players have advantages over console.
At the very least I would like to have the option to only be able to crossplay with other pople who have the same disadvantages as me.
They do as killers but it's fairly minor with how much the game holds your hand, like certain killers are scarier and they are slightly easier to spin that's about it and I didn't say there weren't advantages just that they aren't the problem or even really a problem, and in all my time playing killer since crossplay launched I have noticed almost no discernable difference between survivors on console or pc
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@JohnnyB87 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2418788#Comment_2418788
It's not growing, population only rises for a week or two during a new release and then it drops drastically.
But as for the topic: My biggest concern is cross play. Get rid of PC players, sorry, cause there's just too much advantage and a lot of wall hacking and resolution stretching going on. It won't hurt the game any if PC only played PC, cause other games have done it just fine.
PC players aint the problem and I wont argue this, and yes overall the game is still growing, the game hit its record peak players in July. Sure it pitters off until the next chapter but that's why they do chapter releases every 3 months, and not just the games peak players but the average players in a month has also been trending upward.
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Should they? Yes. Will they? Absolutely not, its way more work then its worth at this point for bhvr.
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@BingBongMan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2418722#Comment_2418722
Despite how much the game is being held back by poor choices, it still thrives as the sole success of its niche.
But eventually the poor choices will stack up so much that the community just can't ignore them anymore.
yeah exactly, its still growing, personally I believe mostly because of its licenses, but that can only last for so long
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A few addons need a nerf like all seeing but other then that he's perfectly fine sure he has a fairly high skill floor but i've seen plenty of bad wraiths who definitely see him as an easy win and get stomped because of it, then probably blame some other sh*t for it.
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Bad code and bad map design are in my opinion by far the biggest failures of this game that constantly hold it back and will likely be the cause of its death.
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@Exxodus21 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2415538#Comment_2415538
So you don't play Spirit and don't play enough survivor to actually have experience with trying to counter her. But your here and ready to tell us how none of them work. Your opinion is irrelevant since you have no actual experience on the topic. It sounds like you've watched some streams and decided to go with their opinion. All killers will be able to mitigate the effectiveness of counters. That doesn't mean they don't work or aren't reliable.
You're either flat out wrong or lying about counters not working at the highest level. Spirit regularly gets stomped on and teams like Oracle and others (I don't keep up with their names) have said she has counterplay, and demonstrated it. IIRC one team has said she has counterplay but they see how casual players might have a hard time with her. But that isn't the same as saying she can't be countered. Then there's all of the streamers that have repeatedly shown how to counter her and agree that she's fine as is.
Pro teams say she has counter play because they just drop pallets immediately and they are coordinated enough to make that work that's why they say that(have you ever actually watched those games?). Just because I don't play her doesn't mean I've never played against her I have over 1k hours that means I still have at least a couple hundred hours just on survivor and its not like I didn't do my research on this issue, I've watched yes streams, videos, read posts and I have played her before at rank 1 and done very well with her I just don't like her because directional audio is something I struggle with so I don't find her much fun.
But since you're willing dismiss my opinion regardless of my arguments then this conversation was done before it began, have a good one dude.
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"we can all agree that dbd is one of the best games out there" well let me stop you right there.
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@MeltingPenguins said:
This is a genuine question, cause I see people say on a regular base they'll automatically tunnel someone with a key out of the game.
And i'm sitting here wondering -why-
cause, people, you are giving the survivors an advantage:
- If they are a swf, not only have you now given them a place to store the key, you also gave them the means to navigate the other players of the swf to the key and the hatch once it spawns. which now is a gen earlier.
- even if they are not a swf you have now given them the hatch a gen early as well as a definite place to pick up the key.
It'd be better, tactically, to play without any tunneling and corral the survivors away from the hatch.
That's just not realistic, honestly if you tunnel someone out early say before they do 3 gens then you are in a very strong position against a team of 3 and they just lost they're backup plan on the move. It being on the ground is significantly better then it being on a survivor cause you can watch the key too and they'd have to get it unless they brought multiple keys.
Not too mention teams that plan around a key escape usually aren't very good.
Also yeah people will tunnel key users just to bm them for bringing an over powered item.
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These kind of mixes in skill level will very likely still happen to keep queue times as short as possible, just now you wont know because the score will be hidden.
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As someone who has liked wraith since 2018 I liked the wraith buff, also the DS nerf brought me great joy
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yeah in red ranks if you dont have slow down perks you either need to end chases very very fast or slug. You also have a far smaller margin for error, especially if your playing a weaker killer
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Because dead hard for distance still works just fine and doesnt come with the risk of getting exhausted on the ground and has pretty much zero counterplay.
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@CornHub said:
Guilty by association. Just don't queue up with leavers next time.
I know this is a joke but it was the killer who left you cant queue up with a killer
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I like fast queue times so I have it on
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@lolifasad said:
5% would be too much, that's a Brand New Part skill check and 3% away from Surge. It's just not reciprocal to the time it takes for survivors to repair 5% of the gen, which would make it slightly unfair, as repairing for 5% takes at least twice as long as the time it takes to kick it. What I do think should happen instead, is that after kicking it, for the first 10 seconds or so, the generator starts regressing slightly faster than usual. That way, you would kinda either force survivors to hop back on it, which could put them in an unfavorable position, or if they don't, at least not have it pop the very second you leave after kicking it.
I mean tbf it takes them what? a frame to stop a gen from regressing and when its a 4v1 match shouldn't a killers time be worth more then a survivors. That being said I'd prefer that they get rid of gen tapping instead of having a baby pop as base kit.
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@Exxodus21 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2415390#Comment_2415390
You have just demonstrated why the problem is with survivors. I gave you a list if counters and you flippantly dismissed them. It's not about getting better or learning counters, it's about demanding nerfs so you don't have to try. A counter is not something that is always 100% effective. It should be as close to 50/50 as possible. Which is funny because most complaints about Spirit are people saying "it's a 50/50 chance of working or not". So exactly balanced then. How is that a problem? Unless what you really want is an overwhelming advantage.
Fast vaulting a window for deception = slow vault from one side and immediately fast vault back so the Spirit phases around the structure, or vice versa. It works with pallets too.
No what I gave you are legit things a spirit would do to get around all your counters, and Ill admit the 50/50 coin flip analogy is a pretty bad one since its pretty much never 50/50 when the spirit has a significant amount more knowledge about the situation then the survivor does when she phases. The reason people use it because when "looping" a spirit if feels completely random whether or not the spirit will hit you or not and if you are playing her correctly you only use small bursts of phase in chase so you will get hit eventually and usually pretty quickly as the better the spirit the less likely they are to make a mistake.
People have tested almost every one of these counters against the highest level survivors in the game and they almost never work, does it work against meh spirits sure hell it'd probably work on me I'm terrible at directional audio.
And you know what you have just demonstrated? a complete lack of understanding in how spirit plays at higher levels you can list off all the "counters" you want and say "you just want to win all the time" but we both know that's not what I'm saying and if you do think that's what I'm saying then boy howdy do I have a shocker for you, I barely play survivor, its like 10% of my play time maybe a little more or less depending on if I'm doing tome challenges or not. I also don't even play spirit the reason I want her nerfed is because by all accounts that I've seen I feel she needs it, her nerf wouldn't even affect me in anyway.