Slashstreetboy
Slashstreetboy
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@dezzmont said:
The main thing killer needs IMO is a lot of QOL love.
The game is killer sided. Killers are the stronger role. A good killer playing perfectly should win every time.
But killer is also the more frustrating, busy, and hampered role. Basically everything about killer is designed to be as infuriating as possible. Stuff like constant camera locks, the ability to be blinded while you lack control over your camera, loops as the main game mechanic over stuff like hiding or break aways (and to be clear survivors need loops, juke based gameplay died with the survivor speed waaaay back when), and lots of other mechanics that allow a survivor to openly 'brute force' past you or otherwise have power in a situation they shouldn't.
DS+UB is actually really important to consider, because while is meta and strong, it isn't so strong killers can't win if they play well, it changes basically nothing about the 'ideal' win condition of snowballing save adding an extra step. But it is so ABSURDLY INFURIATING to killers because it creates a scenario where despite the survivor not even trying to escape you they have more power than you.
Other problems include stuff like lacking a real way to concede (End game collapse actually upsets me because it was downright OPTIMIZED to let survivors bully killers), a refusal to buff killers to be interesting or impactful, and nerfing tools killers have that make the game smoother and less frustrating. For example, ruin undying was too strong, but it also solved a problem where good killer play moment to moment wasn't rewarding at all unless you were playing amazingly the entire time. It gave you a concrete reward for correctly pressuring gens and allowed you to meaningfully extend the game for good tracking. Did it need a nerf? Sure. But its no wonder killers are furious because their tools are constantly nerfed in ways that remove the positives of them while survivor tools get nerfed in meaningful ways that maintain the intense negatives for the killer.
Killer is also physically exhausting. The camera locks are some of the best in gaming so it isn't physically nauseous save for nurse, but it still makes killer gameplay fatiguing. And killers have no downtime, they have to be constantly doing things all the time, so every little bit adds up and causes killers to quit.
And to be clear, its obviously why most of this stuff is in the game, mechanically it mostly works fine: Camera locks allow survivors to try to do more jukes and evasion based strategies which are cool. Its just that it all adds up in a really negative way for the killer experience which makes winning a killer game not feel good unless its a total blowout, and losing a killer game a nightmare as your forced to continually actively participate in your loss to do dumb stuff like run people out.
So what do I think killer needs?
1: More punishment for 'longer' bodyblocks such as it auto-damaging you after 2 seconds or something of uninterrupted contact with you not moving away. Pinning the killer to the wall should be an insane strategy, you should be trying to eat a hit or buy a few seconds not physically halt the killer entirely.
2: Get rid of camera lock blinds. Yes, this makes flashlights even worse, but as we learned from Deathgarden maybe having a major interaction component be '######### with a player's vision' is not fun and contributes to a lot of burnout.
3: A real surrender system. Killers should be able to end the game with a 'GG you win' rather than have survivors run around them and teabag until they start chasing again despite the gates being 99'd.
4: More base regression in kit. Killers seriously need this, like I think killers should get a 'mini pop' base kit so that killers feel way more rewarded for winning a chase. Bonus points: It teaches killers not to camp without a very good reason.
For meta changes that I think are more critical, because I think the killer die-off was way more 'Ok this game doesn't treat us well' rather than 'the game has a lack of balance':
5: Actual consideration to the EMOTIONAL impact of changes for killers, like they do for survivors, rather than just making it purely for the survivor's emotional needs. The devs treat killers and survivors EXTREMELY differently, and the mori nerf is a prime example of, frankly, scummy behavior. Its so telling they didn't warn the killers about the mori change because it would make survivors feel bad to have a week or two of killers using their moris, but killers have to just deal with keys for an indefinite period still as survivors burn through em as fast as they can. Like holy ######### that was just awful and its no wonder survivor Qs are 20 minutes now you treat killers like garbage, that was the kinda stuff that lead to the killer strike but now killers don't even want to talk to the devs anymore because its so clear its all appeasement.
6: Get off the stats based balancing holy crap. OoO needed to go a year ago how the hell is it still in the game? Actually think about what things do to the gameplay loop when it negatively affects killers, rather than just what it does mechanically. The idea that OoO or Keys weren't a problem because their win rate wasn't high is so amazingly dumb and ignores why people hate these mechanics. Its way more critical for the game to feel good to play than the game having a balanced win rate: this is why its ok that NOED is bad for example, because emotionally its a powerful perk that does good things for the game. This is why its bad that Adrenaline is so good: It feels awful for adrenaline plays to happen for the killer and while this high point is great for survivors that is ultimately what most killers feel is the only consideration here and it combos awfully with DS-Unbreakable.
This was a very pleasant read, and I agree. I´d like to add that a lot of frustration also stems from the unbelievably huge gaps between the Killers in terms of power. I main Trapper and Myers for the most part, the bottom of the barrell, because I like them. Ask the 4k+ hrs Survivor mains how threatening these are compared to a Spirit using the best addons. Of course there will always be a meta but currently the Killers are just way too apart. M1 play is too much in the Survivors favor, which has lead to an incredibly stale competetive meta. It´s kinda boring that the game´s design doesn´t allow more variety there.
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"Object is fine"
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If that´s something that offends you, you´re in for a world of pain with DBD. It´s not even close to the average post game slander from Survivors.
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1) Like and love yourself. If you currently don´t, make changes to get to a position where you can.
2) Be attractive. If you currently aren´t, make changes to get to a position where you are.
This consists of many things. Have good hygiene, groom yourself, be fit (at least decently, everyone can do that), have money, be
assertive, funny and empathetic. Actively try to develop your character further.
3) Do stuff. This is very important. Whatever it is that your passionate about, cultivate it. Be noticeable and go out.
4) Be cool.
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Imagine wanting BBQ nerfed.
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Well written out, and I agree. If both parties are very skilled, "M1" gameplay is tremendously in the Survivors favor. This has to do with tile strength, tile pacing, the miniscule speed advantage Killers have when running in a straight line (with obvious exceptions) and the fact that getting hit is a hard reset of a chase.
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@sulaiman said:
Using Filters also massivly changes the gameplay because it allows the killer to see things like hidden survivors that he otherwise might have missed. Its the same as stretched resolution, just for the other party. But since a lot of players (killers and survivors alike) dont like stealth players, it is not a big issue for them, but it still is cheating.
And using exploits intentionaly is cheating too, even though its the devs fault. if you use an exploit in windows to gain access to a computer that is not your own and you have no permission to access, try to argue with the judge its just an issue for microsoft to fix. Other games have banned players using exploits as well.
Filters only change things slightly though. Blending in a bush may be harder, but stretch res literally removes mindgames and makes every loop except a select few of them "car loops", changing the chases on a fundamental level.
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@sulaiman said:
Well, it depends on your point of view. There are people that say color filters, stretched resolution and using exploits isnt cheating.
Other opinions differ.
Sure, there´s an opinion for anything. I´d say of your examples, only stretch res (depending on how much vertical FOV is enhanced) is cheating since it massively alters the gameplay in the Survivors favor. Exploits like in bugs? That´s not cheating, that are issues the DEVs need to fix.
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@Retromind said:
You think devs will balance SWFs around the top 1% who are destroying killers effortlessly? The vast majority of SWFs are casuals, I don't think devs even have balancing SWFs as an objective in their current pipeline because there's nothing to balance.
There are balance issues. As I´ve stated in the OP, the free aura reading perks alone are a massive advantage. You won´t have situations where all 3 Survivors leave their gens to go for the unhook. Gens that are close to being finished are known to the others so they can finish them. The Killers general location and direction they´re moving can be relayed to others, allowing for efficient and effortless rotation. Trap Killers are more limited in their options against comms.
I realise that balancing Survivors around the top 1% SWF is not the way (although this is exactly how Killer balance is handled, stated by Almo) but in one way or the other the advantages need to be taken into consideration for a more fair and balanced experience for everybody.
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Being able to take abuse from Survivors is one of the core conditions that need to be met in order to play Killer. It is what it is, if you can´t take being called every name in the book or being told to ######### every day you play then Killer is just not for you. Unless you close post game chat, which is always an option.
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They do, with varying degree of skill. To be honest, I don´t think they need to no-life binge play it like so many of us do to have a general idea of how it should be balanced. These guys need to work on the game, after all.
That being said, they have a history of being notoriously stubborn to high level balance issues like swf, object, killer power disparity and general tile pacing.
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In the end, the new MMR propably won´t change much. Due to the severe qeue imbalances, the results will be pretty much the same. It will first search for a more or less fitting Killer, but swiftly expand to "anything goes" just like it does currently.
Also, every additional SWF member needs to increase the MMR for the matchmaking (for the off chance it does work). SWF is not cheating, it doesn´t make bad Survivors good, but it makes any group way better. I think people tend to forget that being in a group using comms gives like 10 aura reading perks to everybody without costing a single perk slot. It also boosts the coordination way above the average solo group.
To make up for the inhirent advantages, adding an MMR multiplier is really the least they can do.
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The blatant hacking epidemic is one of the few things the community is unanimously upset about. BHVR need to step up their game. First, they need some kind of anti-cheat software that detects hacks (one that works, to clarify) and more importantly they have to relieve the witness from the burden of proof in cases of hacking. If your anti cheat software does not work (it doesn´t) at least save the replays of matches that are flagged with hacking reports. It´s kinda baffling that unless the playerbase as a whole records their gameplay all the time, the hackers reign free. Support legit says that unless you provide more evidence, your ticket does nothing. Even if you happen to be recording the reporting process is so cumbersome.
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I got a little over 2k, every achievement, every archive yada yada. Still lovin it, no end in sight!
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@TripleSteal said:
Every time someone points out that killer X was ignored during patch tests and received some new bugs as a result, you can hear sad nurse noises coming from the darkest corner of the basement, long forgotten.
I´m pretty much convinced that Evan and Sally are both dwelling there, desperately trying to console each other to forget about their own respective miserys.
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@Tsulan said:
Right now you would get a potatoe killer.
Because the game tries to balance around the lowest rank.
BUT nobody knows how it will work with the new MMR.
EDIT:
There is also the problem, that right now, the matchmaking is kinda crazy. As it throws all kind of players together.
Not always. For me, around half my lobbys are all red ranks, the other half can have literally anything. Just recently I´ve had a rank 18, a literal rank 20 and two rank 1s. It seems anything goes, propably because of the crazy Survivor qeue times past noon.
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I don´t run the combo for the same reason I never ran Ebony Moris. It contributes to a ######### environment in DBD.
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@GamerGirlFeng said:
Now I'm confused. So are survivors always gen rushing or never doing gens at all?
Hmmm..
It´s both, obviously. It can magically change depending on the role you´re playing as well!
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It would not be enough to make him A or S tier, but it might be enough to bring him up to bottom of low tier. Make traps more threatening and do something about the trash grass in reworked maps and he may even be mid tier.
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Overall, better, especially Ormondo.
Worse for Trapper because they tremendously reduced the available trapping spots with the new ######### grass.
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Extreme Object nerf, key nerf, better optimisation, tons of bug and health changes, Trapper Buff. These seem the most urgent changes to me.
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I got only 5 Survivors P3 all perks, 4 of which are female, so I guess these are my mains along David.
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The most annoying thing to me is that you don´t get evader or bloodpoints while being chased by Victor. I don´t like em as Killer either, it´s the wrong kind of disgusting for me.
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It´s really unfortunate that he´s at or close to the bottom of any competent tier list. Problem is that he, like literally every other Killer, is still very strong versus potato Survivors which make up about 90% of the playerbase. This leads to a massively inflated Kill/Escape ratio and suggests to the DEVs that he´s fine.
His basekit is the most addon dependant to be usable and he´s a strong candidate for being DBDs weakest Killer. Versus an object team (that are at least decent at the game) he´s a literal joke. There has been a similar situation with flashlights in the past which required MCote to get demolished by a flashlight team to realise there´s a problem, I wonder if we were to replicate this showcase ,with a certain DEV playing Trapper vs Object team, it might make him realise there´s more to it than broad data.
If he were released today, he would have a secondary power, the traps would be more readily available and they would be more threatening. With the new RNG, Survivors still have a 33% chance of being out of the trap in 3 seconds or less, 50% to be out in 4,5 seconds or less, 0% chance of staying in the trap for longer than 9 seconds, making the changes undoubtedly a net nerf. Trapping spots are rapidly declining with every map rework.
As a Trapper "main" I never was able to understand why the DEVs are so persistent in their efforts to ignore his core issued that keep him frm being a mid tier Killer.
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Aren´t Deathbound and Tinkerer counterproductive for IF?
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Among DBDs exquisite entourage, there will always be an empty seat at the top of the pantheon for one of our greatest heroes.
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It´s so much better than the old one, visibility of scratch marks included.
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Let´s just hope that hour count will play a major role in the new MMR. Even if a baby <1k hrs Survivor does well against baby Killers, this doesnt mean he can go against 5k+ hrs Nurse mains despite his "statistics" indicating he does well in chase.
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@Mandy said:
I'm hoping we'll be able to communicate a bit more about the UI shortly - we did touch on the subject briefly during the stream last week and I think it will be an ongoing thing.
By the way, would you please tell us when the next Q&A will be? I couldn´t find any date.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1902834#Comment_1902834
The Bus is fine. Not every strong Loop needs to be nerfed into Oblivion. Its not like playing Killer is hard in general, if there are some strong Loops it is ok. Even with the good window the Bus is not as strong as the Loops which were in the game before (or are still in the game on the Live Version (Disturbed Ward)).
Kinda disagree on this one. A good Survivor can´t get hit there before entity blocker kicks in, which in my opinion is a problem with the loop, and this doesn´t even take the pallet into account.
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I´d say they should be either removed in SWF or map offering logic should be fixed. What I mean by this is that the Killer map offering should take priority, but not completely. The formula could look something like this:
Killer offering >1-2 Survivor offerings
Killer offering = 3 Survivor offerings (50/50)
4 Survivors offerings > Killer offering
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Even if this action speed buff was removed the perk wouldn´t even be mediocre. Think about it.
-Obsession doesnt give stacks, so preferably another Survivor is getting chased which leaves two people affected by the slowdown at any given time max .The effect even vanishes when the Obsession gets killed or sacrificed. The perk really shouled get an update.
Also, I like your username.
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@Liqhtninq said:
Use Franklin's Demise?
No offense but key gamers that get countered by Franklins don't pose a threat, regardless whether they are wielding a key or not.
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Object should get the mettle of man treatment, nothing less. It´s the most busted thing in the game currently (potentially, potatos fail to abuse it properly).
Every lobby has at lest 3 DS anyway, but for some reason I almost never get hit by it. The only thing I want to change about the perk is addressing situations where there is nothing to do other than standing above a slug or in front of a locker for a minute.
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@Monarch said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1902152#Comment_1902152
I'm uninformed on what you mena by facecamping was patched out, could you explain please?
Once upon a time, unhooks could only be done from a certain angle. If the Killer stood at this exaxt point, Survivors could not get the prompt for the unhook action, making it impossible. This was referred to as facecamping.
Nowadays, unhooks can be done from any direction, making this act impossible to do.
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I think this is the only in-game thing a Killer can do that could be considered "toxic".
There is no such thing as facecamping btw, it was patched out years ago. It´s just camping.
Slugging and "Tunneling" I have 0 problems with on either side, it´s just the game.
Playing Killer/Build X is never toxic lmao.
A case could be made for hitting on hook, but it looks too hillarious to be considered malicious imo.
Endgame Chat is another story and not Killer specific.
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@ILoveDemo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1901570#Comment_1901570
Mimimi just get gud, Jeezes. Nobody need Undying, hope Corrupt Intervention get a Nerf soon as well.
You´re legit the only player that´s inexperienced enough to complain about Corrupt. Smh
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MacMillan Update was awesome, it´s still my favorite realm, but strictly going by rework Ormondo takes the cake. This one they did phenomenally well.
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Preach it, we need to make the deafest of ears listen, after all.
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It´s okay to take breaks (please don´t take offense to this, I promise I mean it in a nice way).
Killer can be very stressful and sometimes the odds are just stacked against you.
Maybe reassess your expectations and take a look at particular things you want to improve on, then pay special attention to these during your matches.
When you identified the areas where you might want to improve, bring perks that help with that. For example, you mentioned loss of gens early. Discordance and Corrupt (but not both, please) can help tremendously with that.
Your choice of Killer of course also plays a major role in those things.
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@Huge_Bush said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1900029#Comment_1900029
Good loopers would choose her more! I dunno if I would get in trouble or not, but google image search sequin one piece swimsuit. It would be fire on her. She'll sparkle and run while looking bootyful.
Dam these would indeed be a great asset for her to have. I´d love it.
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@Huge_Bush said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1899955#Comment_1899955
I dunno, I feel a one piece will accentuate her curves and make her even more appealing. Like what they wore on Baywatch but dark red.
A bikini would be better imo, but either would be great albeit quite distracting.
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@SilentHillOnDvD said:
Get chased by trapper. Step in random trap in grass. GG that was a fun chase. The only killer in the game I hate going against
Well it´s kinda hard to step on such traps, especially on reworked maps.
Avoid grass is on the first page of "How to beat Trapper 101".
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@megswifey said:
absolutely vommy mommy, a tall woman wearing a dress AND a dope crown??? Literal queen <3
But don´t forget to bring anti-emetics, they might come in handy ;-)
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I´d say Kate for Obvious reasons, but beauty has many faces. I think Feng and Jane have a lot going for them as well.
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Imagine complaining about Trapper of all Killers.
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It´s because the entitys rules. On the flipside, it allows David to not get immediately split in half by a Cleaver or a Chainsaw.
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@Xyvielia said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1899648#Comment_1899648
Could’ve been ol’ Trappskiis, at least a couple of them anyway, since I’ve see only been seeing him once every 30 matches or so.
It’s interesting tho, since tbh, I only ever bring Rainbow with Jelly and Odd Stamp, and I only use it strictly for totems, but there’s so much info that they provide, I might as well utilize it’s full aura reading potential.
Of course. Maps are great. I always advocate for the removal of trap aura reading, though, but until then there´s nothing stopping you.
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I think your concern is valid. For the true top end Survivors it should become very rare to face Killers like Myers or Trapper after a while.
Obviously the stronger Killers used by the stronger players will have a higher MMR than the low tier Killers, they will just win more matches and more decisively.
For example, against a good Survivor team, a low tier Killer will never ever get a 5gen 4k whereas this is definately doable for great Spirit, Nurse or even insane Billy masters. We don´t know yet which metrics the new MMR will take into consideration, but I think it´s not too far fetched that Kills+Gens remaining may factor into it.
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@Mandy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1899598#Comment_1899598
I'd add old Sprint Burst to that list, prior to Exhaustion being introduced.
True, for some reason it didn´t come to mind initially.