Power_Guy
Power_Guy
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@FrostySeal said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2423685#Comment_2423685
I KNOW THE LORE MEANS NOTHING TO THE GAME. I've literally said this before, my whole point of my post which you got confused with isn't to slander camping and tunneling, it's to clarify that the game never says "you need to kill the survivors as fast as possible." No where does it state this, so people should stop saying it. If you want to say "I camp and tunnel survivors because I want to win" That's perfectly acceptable. If you say "I camp and tunnel because x and y" then its ok. Its not ok if you say that you do it because the game says to do it. Your doing it of your own accord, no one else is forcing you to do it except if the Survivors are extremely good at the game. Got it?
...I don't think I ever heard anyone, anywhere, say they camp and tunnel because the game literally forces them too.
If they say 'The first gens pop too fast, and I camp/tunnel to ensure a kill to catch up' is different. But I don't think I've ever hard anyone claim the game, literally, makes them camp or tunnel.
So what was the point of your thread again? Because it just looks like ego stroking from here, until the entire forum shut you down.
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@FrostySeal said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2423651#Comment_2423651
Oh my god, have you read the post at all dude? Any of my replies? Wanna know what's in almost every single one of them that you keep ignoring? I DONT CARE ABOUT HOW YOU PLAY. I camp and tunnel to as Killer, but the whole point of the post is that you keep missing is that if your going to tell people in an argument that the objective of the Killer is just and ONLY to kill the survivors as fast as possible, you are wrong. I know lore =/= gameplay stop using false information. Everyone should feel free to play however they want, but not use false information.
The game's lore does not drive the game mechanics. You're thread is nothing but you trying to say you're smarter than everyone else and go 'But the lore!" when people disagree.
The game, itself, says the Killer's goal is to kill. ######### the lore. The lore means between 'jack' and '#########' and jack left town. No, people are not wrong 'because the lore'. YOU are wrong.
You're trying to judge people, then say 'Oh, but I'm totally not judging. Also; you're wrong.' and 'I don't care how you play, but you're wrong'. You're trying to be the smartest person in the room. That's why you made this thread.
'I don't care if you camp, but you're wrong'. Is what your thread is. It's nothing but an ego wank. But guess what?
The. Lore. Means. Nothing. The GAME states the Killer kills. YOU ARE WRONG. The lore does not make you right. You. Are. WRONG.
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@FrostySeal said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2423202#Comment_2423202
Honestly some of the arguments both sides bring up are dumb. But the point of my post was to tell people who are going on the forums and whatnot saying "It's the job of the killer to kill the survivors!" is partially wrong. Yes they have to kill the survivors but going by the games lore your suppose to kill them slowly. But whatever, no one's really gonna listen to what the game is gonna tell you to do and that's ok, I just want people to stop misunderstanding what the game tells you.
People have told you; lore does not translate to mechanics. The game's webpage flat out says the Killer KILLS.
You're using lore to justify telling campers they're wrong. But the lore does not drive the mechanics. What happens in the lore means nothing. This is just a flimsy excuse for you to say 'You're wrong', but it's you who are wrong.
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Do we know what Pinhead's power will be?
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@Pukenplag said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2423448#Comment_2423448
This is false. The role, the tooltips etc. all say that the killer is meant to squeeze all the hope out of survivors, play with them, torture them, all before killing them.
The game's emblem system literally awards you for having longer and interesting matches. Quick matches or camping/tunneling ones usually hurt your emblems a lot.
And that applies for survivors too. Try to gen rush and all your other emblems are bronze/not existent.
The game's WIN CONDITIONS are killing or escaping. The emblem system is a grade based on what you did in the match. You don't 'win' by getting all Iris and you don't 'fail' by getting all Bronze.
You win by escaping or killing.
You lose by dying.
The Killer's win/loss is more of a sliding scale of HOW MANY he killed. One could say he 'barely wins' at 1 kill to 'completely wins at 4' and only 'loses' at 0.
But the game's win conditions, as programmed into the game, are killing and escaping. This is a hard fact; the Killer does not 'win' if he tortures everyone to 2 hooks and 12 downs each, and then they all escape.
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The Killer player wins by killing people. There's no victory condition for torturing the Survivors.
So if the Killer player's goal = To Win. Then To Win = To Kill. Therefore Killer's Goal = To Kill.
'Torturing the Survivors' is just fluff. By the mechanics of the game, the Killer gets the programmed win state by killing, not by torturing.
So 'I camp/tunnel to win' is a valid answer.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2422641#Comment_2422641
Ah yes. Instead force Meta Perks to solve the problem. Or, well, I guess comms works too. Maybe we need in-game comms for Survivors.
I've said they should just add voice comms and balance around it.
Instead, the devs pretend voice comms are not a problem and balance for the information blackout Survivors would have as solo-q's, which is why SWF groups pretty much destroy every Killer except Nurse, who can ignore walls and pallets.
This game will continue to balance like garbage until the devs admit that voice comms break the entire thing and rebalance with that in mind.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/272176/this-will-fix-dcing-altogether
Then people will just close application instead. The only way to really deter Dcing is to enforce higher penalties. Which I also refuse to support until BHVR can program the game to tell the difference between a DC and a game crash. Nobody deserves to be penalized for having the game crash, it happens far too often, depending on location, internet connection or even just what console you play on.
It is, literally, impossible to tell the difference between a DC and a game crash with current coding. This is not a BHVR thing; it's a programming thing.
The program just sees 'connection gone'. It has no way of seeing if it was a pulled plug, a router turned off, power was lost, or the program was closed. These is no difference to any of these, to the game, because they all equate to the same result; connection went poof.
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@Munqaxus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2422391#Comment_2422391
And here we go. You love camping, so nothing to fix the game will do. 🙄
Here's the thing; if Killers are not stupid, then camping will usually easily get you to Red ranks with no effort. But Killers aren't happy that it ruins the game for 80% of the player base, no; they want the game to literally punish Survivors and hold the Killers hands, so they can play sloppy AND the Killer still gets a 4K!
Glad you're not on the balance team. I'll say it again; camping is toxic, and a crutch, and your views on it do not suddenly make it none issue. Camping punishes Survivors and simply because you use it and only reply with salty and spiteful posts every time a change is proposed doesn't mean a change will never happen. In fact, most likely a change will happen.
The irony of claiming Killers want their hands held when it's Survivors who feed campers, then whine and snivel for hand holding mechanics to give them free unhooks is lost on you.
I've said it before; glad you're not on the balance team (grats for stealing that from me, BTW). This game would be unplayable as a Killer if you had any input.
But keep whining and sniveling that camping is a crutch, and real Killers don't camp, and YOU never camp, and camping somehow magically rewards Killers with 4Ks because <vague reasons>. It just means you'll never improve at the game, because you keep blaming 'crutch mechanics' instead of your own bad skill.
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@Munqaxus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2422110#Comment_2422110
I would say, when hooked, the survivor randomly goes to a different hook, like Pyramid Head's cages. I would also remove the location notification when someone is unhooked, it would just give a noise notification.
No. There are times when camping is a valid strat. Also, now you just want Survivors to never lose; the Killer does not have the time to re-hunt every Survivor after every hook, since your idea would make them teleport away AND basically hide where they were unhooked.
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@lolololol said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2422106#Comment_2422106
You’re lying to yourself
Are you psychic now? No? Just trying so hard to push that Survivor main agenda.
First it was inventing rules, like don't camp, tunnel, slug, or use certain Killers or perks.
Then it was inventing new definitions, when a Survivor main told me camping is defined as cheating.
Now it's inventing super powers to read my mind.
😂😂😂😂😂
If Survivors spent half as much time actually trying to improve as they do trying to force how the Killer plays; camping and tunneling would be non-issues.
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@lolololol said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2422066#Comment_2422066
You obviously don’t play both sides. You just see things killer sided. Plz play and see what it feels like to be tunneled or better yet. Loop a killer for five gens just to be camped with noed. You’re obviously oblivious to what real problems the game has..
🙄
I play Killer more, but I play Survivor with my friends. I've been camped and tunneled and even 'facecamped' by people trying to ruin my game. I just don't whine like a child when it happens; I laugh and continue on.
Maybe you should play Killer and stop seeing things survivor-sided. Then, maybe, you would understand why removing Killer player agency for a bunch of entitled Survivors who want to invent stupid rules would be a bad thing.
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@lolololol said:
Tunneling is for trash killers who lack confidence or proper knowledge of the game. Same with noed.
Complaining about tunneling and NoED is for trash survivors who lack confidence or proper knowledge of the game.
It's always the people who will claim gen speeds are fine and Killers need to accept genrush, while whining about how unfair it is that Killers can rush a kill (aka; tunneling & camping).
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No game is hacker free because hackers keep inventing new hacks.
How about you try coding a learning AI that can detect hacks based on human reasoning like 'This person is moving too fast' or 'Ghostface should not have hatchets!', hmm?
Until then; all devs can do is catch hacks as they become an issue and add them to whatever anti-cheat they are using. Because nothing exists to catch a hack before the anti-cheat program is told 'this is a hack. This is how it's hacking the game'.
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Honestly, 'actions' (vaulting, unhooking, healing someone else, etc) should have a separate button from 'powers' (Self care)
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@Junylar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2419944#Comment_2419944
Your killer-colored glasses are so swaggy you don't even see that three free survivors are more efficient than two survivors with a single digit percent boost, so nobody will do what you just described on purpose.
Wow. I make a suggestion and you promptly go 'Killer main! BIAS!' Heaven forbid someone suggest any sort of balance to even a hypothetical Survivor perk, huh? 🙄
Not everything is an attempt to keep poor Survivors down. I'm just pointing out a possible exploit. Heaven forbid.
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@xEa said:
When you are hooked by the killer, every remaining survivor repairs and cleanses totems 3/4/5% faster, as long as the killer is 20 meters next to the hook.
While next to the hook and not in a chase.
The last thing we need is one Survivor playing Ring Around The Hookie for force a Killer to give the other 2 Survivors a repairing bonus.
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@thisisntmax said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2418596#Comment_2418596
You're right. I should play out my four slow downs Twins game who slugs at 5 gens, instead of just going next & watching YT.
You should accept that any Killer and any perk are there to be used and that you don't get to decide who or what the opponent uses.
If you can't play every match you enter because you have to have everything your way; just stop playing. The player base will thank you.
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NoED does not 'reward you for being bad'. It rewards you for planning an end game build.
A Killer is not 'bad' and did not 'lose' just because 5 gens popped. This arbitrary limit Survivors put on a match need to stop. They don't decide when a Killer has lost or they have won. They only win when they can no longer be killed, end of debate.
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@stikyard said:
Don't quit just Alt-tab, take a piss, watch some memes and, check back in few.
Ah yes, the classic Entitled Survivor power move; throw the match if the Killer does not personally PM every Survivor in the lobby and ask who dislikes which Killer, so they can avoid playing those Killers.
Are we supposed to keep notes of every Survivor's screennames so we can ensure we never play a Killer each Survivor hates?
Either man up and accept that the Killer can pick whoever they want, or stop playing. This 'I AFK/hook-suicide/throw if I get a Killer I can't mindlessly loop 🤪' entitled baby mindset is getting really old.
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This is such a heavy nerf to Killer perks. You go from having synergies to having 1-2 perks work while 1-2 perks are turned off. Then those hexes are cleansed and now the Killer gets his other 2 perks.
No. I'm sorry but this would make some synergies completely useless for no reason other than 'I don't like it' or 'I think it's too powerful'.
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@calem said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2418456#Comment_2418456
Yep - Leatherface, Freddy and Pig were released in that order one after the other. And more recently, Ghostface and then Demo.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2418459#Comment_2418459
How is it annoying? No one is forcing you to read any threads. Stop reading ones about Springtrap and making yourself annoyed. Besides, now is the time where you should EXPECT Springtrap speculation because the hints BHVR are giving out could actually be referring to a FNAF chapter. I don't see how it's any different to the million threads about "nerf Spirit, nerf SWF, the grind sucks, etc"
You are missing the point entirely.
If every FNAF thread was in one thread, I could ignore it without 40 'OMG SPRINGTRAP!' and 'It'S sPrInGtRaP!' and 'FNAF CHAPTER!' taking up every other posting on the front of the forum.
It's spammy and annoying instead of being considerate and located in one post.
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@calem said:
It's hilarious seeing people complain about how there are "too many Springtrap threads", it's very easy to not click on thread and read it. I also don't see how the FNAF fanbase will 'ruin' this game, everyone is already extremely toxic anyway. The FNAF fans are probably less toxic than DBD players.
It's still annoying to have 30 threads saying the same thing pushing out any other discussion instead of one thread where it can all be consolidated.
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Ok, bye!
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@hiken said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2418120#Comment_2418120
how do you hurt yourslef by smashing (not even smashing because you didnt need to smash the button, just pressing it often) a button? are u a 6 months old child?.
People with physical disabilities?
People with arthritis?
Are you a child, that you can't understand people can have disabilities?
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@Rogue11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2418014#Comment_2418014
I don't understand why you would expect someone who wants to leave a match to suddenly change their mind because a teammate unhooked them before they could finish kermitting. They'll just go afk and wait to be hooked again, or worse, actively do things to throw the match or sandbag the other survivors. Better to just let them leave.
I'm fine with the current system but a quicker way to give up on 2nd phase would be nice in some cases.
Because people who afk or throw the match can be reported. Thus, the people who are too emotionally immature to play a game when they're losing get punished.
I am heartily sick of people hook-suiciding because I found them first. Don't log into an online game if you (not you, Rogue, just 'you' in general) are going to babyquit the moment you start losing.
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No. Old mechanic literally hurt some people and ruined keyboards. It was terrible. Suck it up if you load into a game that you are losing instead of asking for a quick way to babyquit.
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@Apollos said:
It essentially seems the same. Just a little more punishing than before. But at least there's arguably more counterplay if you're able to bring Built To Last and Streetwise.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2417079#Comment_2417079
Here we go again with the bias lol People are always complaining about keys and hatch, so it's not a big deal if someone dislikes Franklin's. Especially since it's not just about keys.
Bias? What bias? This is literally what happened.
People complaining about old Franklins: 0
Franklin's gets buffed: OMG! It's unfair! Change it! Nerf it! I should keep my item no matter what!
No one complained until it countered early hatch escapes. That's not bias; it's a fact.
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@Leonardo1ita said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2417450#Comment_2417450
So, you're not wanting a killer just for the people (not even of the FNAF community) making human mistakes, which are not even mistakes because not too many posts are made and nobody's forcing me/us to post these in another thread?
I think you should reconsider your logic
I'm just done hearing about it 10 times a day. I also think the FNAF fanbase would be 13 year old microphone warriors who would use the endgame chat to explore the new 'big boy words' they learned from their older brother.
That's just me, though.
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My god. I don't want Springtrap, simply because the people pushing for him feel the need to make 10 separate threads a day about 'OMG SPRINGTRAP!' instead of all using one thread. 🙄
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You're the only person with a problem with Franklin's. The perk is fine. The drainage is over time so the Killer gets USE out of it.
If it just sat on the ground for 120 seconds, then hit 0; Survivors could pick it up without any loss in charges. The way it works now means a medkit may not have enough charges to heal a Survivor after they get hit & find the item again, so the Killer got use out of his perk.
Again; Franklin's is fine.
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@Parusoid said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2417224#Comment_2417224
ok but why you are acting as if items has no impact of the outcome of the match? this is ingornat, items can win a lot of games
I'm not saying items don't help Survivors win. Are you just making up ######### to attack people?
I'm saying Franklin's does not help KILLERS win; It does not help in chases, it does not help gen slowdown, and it does not help down Survivors.
Where the hell did I say items don't help Survivors win? You're attacking anyone who dares to disagree with your idea.
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Franklins is fine. You don't need to know what perks a Killer has because there are 4 Survivors with 4 perks each; imagine a SWF building to counter a Killer's perks.
And the Killer is using a perk that does not help in chases and does not slow down gens and does not give him information to find Survivors. I mean, boo-hoo; you lost an item you can buy again, to a perk that does nothing to help a Killer win.
I think you're focusing on 'This is MY item' and can't accept that sometimes you lose the item. Hell, there was a time where using up an item's charges deleted it from your hand. You're not meant to keep them forever.
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I love how Franklin's Demine was perfectly fine...until they made keys need at least 1 charge to open hatch. Suddenly it's 'unfun' or 'OP' or 'unfair'. 😂
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No, because either Survivors won't be matched with lobbies where someone already has 1 of their perks equipped (out of 4 perks and 4 Survivors, each), and thus inflate queue times.
Or Survivors would lobby dodge when they find they can't equip perks they want to use, thus increasing queue times.
What is with people trying to limit perks lately?
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@Munqaxus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2416362#Comment_2416362
Do you think camping is the only way to win a game, possibly? Just reading all of your comments, you obviously rely on camping to secure wins. However, camping is a crutch. Ask anyone and they will tell you that when you are camping, it means you are losing the game as a killer. Camping is a crutch strategy that is handicapping your game play. When you fall back on a strategy used by "Green" ranked killers, how do you expect to learn strategies that will improve your game play.
Sure camping will get you to red ranks, but it gets you to red rank without truly earning that ranking. It's a simplistic strategy to artificially boost your ranking. If you watch streamers, you don't see them camping, because they've learned better strategies that allows them to win games. The better strategies are harder to pull off but show a skill at the game, that campers never learn.
As I've said before, camping not only is about survivors, it's also a handicap that unskilled killers fall back on instead of learning better strategies. It needs to be discouraged and this is from someone that plays both Killer (who doesn't camp) and Survivor.
Rofl. I love when people say 'It gets you to high ranks, but it's fake because you did not play the way I demand!'. If it gets a person to high ranks, then they got to high ranks. Anyone saying otherwise is a toddler throwing a temper tantrum because someone played in a way they don't personally approve of. IE: People in FPSs claiming anyone using <x> weapon they personally hate were 'artificially boosted'. Or you whining that 'campers don't deserve to be in red ranks!'
Keep throwing your little temper tantrums. Literally no one cares, and I'm sitting here laughing at your little screams of 'It's a crutch tactic!' as if your opinion meant anything to anyone other than yourself.
If I got to red ranks, then I deserve to be at red ranks, and you saying 'It'S nOt ReAl BeCaUsE cAmPiNg!' does not suddenly bust me back to green just because you don't like how I got there. 😂
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@Jigsaw_pprentice1993 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2416448#Comment_2416448
no it would not point 1 swf already coordinate and 2 surivors already bring strong stuff but geuss what most survivors u face are not sweat squads thats maybe 1 in 10 games u get a sweat squad so as a guy who was heavily killer main it dont effect good killers that bad
I made no mention of sweat squads. I'm just pointing out how SWFs would get around the mechanic. The fact that the mechanic dodge/exploit would exist means it has that problem, regardless of if you think SWFs would do so.
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No. This handicaps the Killer more than Survivors for 2 reasons:
- SWFs will coordinate who gets what perks, in order to get around the limitation
- There being 4 Survivors, you're '2 of each type' mechanic will always be dodged by pubs. IE: All four Survivors can still bring perks in the same category.
So this would limit Killers way more than Survivors. And if you limit the perks per lobby, people will lobby dodge if the perk they want is already chosen.
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Because key users come in 2 flavors, for the most part:
- Those who abandon their teammates to get a hatch escape.
- SWFs who will use the key to leave the match early with their friends.
Both must be fed to the Entity as quickly as possible.
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@Firellius said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2414387#Comment_2414387
Again; the chase should be the Killer's CHOICE.
How? It is literally the killer's only job.
That's like saying keys should be buffed because doing gens should be a CHOICE for survivors.
Perks and mechanics to encourage the Killer to leave the hook. Not punishments.
That's been tried and it didn't work. Hell, one of the attempts even soft encourages it, too.
On top of that, that's just maximising collateral damage while minimising targeted impact. Blanket buffing all killers that are doing fine without camping seems like a -really- bad idea, on top of not really doing anything to address facecamping itself. It's the exact opposite of a good solution.
Camping is the choice a Killer can make
Yes, you can opt not to play the game. That's fine. That's okay.
But you shouldn't even have a shadow of a ghost's chance of getting anything more than a 1K if you choose to camp. Unconditionally. Because if that's not the case, then any nerf to 'genrushing' will directly buff camping.
And here we go. You don't like camping, so nothing but punishments will do. 🙄
Here's the thing; if Survivors are not stupid, then camping will usually only net a 1K. But Survivors aren't happy that it depends on them playing well to punish camping, no; they want the game to literally punish Killers and hold their hands, so they can play sloppy AND the Killer still gets a 1K!
Glad you're not on the balance team. I'll say it again; camping is not toxic, or a crutch, and your views on it do not suddenly make it some huge issue for the game as a whole. Camping does not need a punishment simply because you're salty and spiteful. Every 'punishment' proposed is trash made by people who are angry, and will never happen.
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@LordGlint said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2414496#Comment_2414496
My roommate is currently watching a Markiplier video for a horror game called The Possession Experiment that is doing a 2nd person POV. You control a person on security monitors while your POV is from whoever is watching the monitors. It's kind of odd
There was an old PS2 game that was the same way. It used some sort of microphone to tell the character to shoot, punch, get item, etc. You played the person on the security cams trying to guide the heroine through the complex.
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@Munqaxus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2414926#Comment_2414926
I will also add that Survivors claim 'camping will become EASIER if you speed up generators'. I will call BS on this. As a Killer main; the reason I camp is because the matches go so fast. Not to grief, not to anger people. I camp because 3 gens pop in 1 chase and now I'm playing catch-up.
Obviously you are playing well beyond your skill level if you resort to camping all the time. You aren't even really playing the game, you're abusing an I-Win button built into the game. I play Killer just fine, without using slow down perks or camping. There's just no justification for camping, it makes you worse at the game, as a Killer and stunts your ability to learn and adapt to the game. Every time you camp, you are using a crutch and it's stunting your potential to get better as a Killer.
It's usually the players that vehemently support exploits that are doing that because they rely on the handicap to boost their lacking game play. And it's a lack self-esteem that keeps people doing it, when they could just accept that they aren't that great at the game, yet they can't have fun with the game because they are unwilling to accept that not every player is the best at a game.
I'm not sure if I made it clear; I don't care what your opinion on camping is. I don't care if you don't like it. I don't care if you think only bad Killers do it. I don't care if you don't do it.
You keep saying 'camping is an exploit' and 'camping is toxic' and 'camping is a crutch' like your opinion matters; It does not. You are wrong.
Continue to not camp, or continue to camp; I really don't care. But if you keep making ideas based on the flawed opinion that camping is evil, then you will never make a good idea. Because that idea is flawed. But continue to screech about how cool you are for not camping, and how only bad Killers camp; I'm pretty sure no one cares.
But you seem unwilling to accept that your opinion is bad, so you keep screaming it like anyone should care.
News flash: Camping is not a crutch. It's not an exploit, either. it's a tactic that Killers can use to secure a kill. And your view on it means pretty much nothing.
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@supersonic853 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2414147#Comment_2414147
I do think a option to go first person survivor would add some interesting flare and its not like survivors have to enable it. Also makes the game kinda feel scary again imo.
A Survivor perk to play in First Person and all BP gains are tripled, with no cap. I'd do it.
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@Munqaxus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2414419#Comment_2414419
You said that preventing another player from playing the game is the Killer's goal. Then why is holding the game hostage punished by the Developers, because by your logic a survivors job is to survive, so preventing the Killer from killing you by hiding is also acceptable. Do you see how your logic breaks down. From a game design perspective, you do not want one player to prevent another player from playing the game. If there are exploits that allow it, you either remove the exploits or punish players for using them.
Killers don't need to camp. I never camp as killer and can play just fine. In fact, if you are camping, then you just aren't able to play the game to the level of survivors you got and have lost that game. Just because you got a 4k camping, doesn't mean you won the game. You camping indicates you lost the game. It's a bad strategy and a toxic behavior which should be discouraged because it adds nothing to the game for either side.
'You said that preventing another player from playing the game is the Killer's goal. Then why is holding the game hostage punished by the Developers'
Because there's a difference between 'getting a kill' and 'preventing the game from ending'.
Camping: Survivor dies. Game is not held hostage. Survivor can die on the hook, and game will eventually end.
Holding the game hostage: Survivor cannot die, match cannot otherwise end.
See the difference?
Your arguments are made in bad faith. Either you have no idea how the game works, or you're deliberately trying to be obtuse to create arguing points. Because the fact of the matter is that your idea is bad. It will be abused. And you trying so hard to say it won't, then trying to mix 'Camping' with 'Holding the game hostage' shows that either you have very little idea of what is allowed, or you are trying to lie.
This is why I keep saying fixes based on 'Camping is illegal' or 'Camping is evil' will NEVER WORK; the foundation of the idea is wrong. The entire idea is based on a misconception and therefor cannot be a good idea from the start.
Survivors say 'Camping is toxic' and thus come up with PUNISHMENTS instead of legit balance changes. Because their mind is in the wrong place to fix the real problem.
Again:
- You give camped Survivors with BP. That takes away half the issue with being camped; that Survivors get nothing if they are camped early. That the match is a waste of time because they earn 1,000 BP, if that. Earning BP also means they are less likely to give up on first hook.
- You create perks and mechanics to encourage Killers to leave the hook. Such things are OPTIONAL because, sometimes, camping is legit. So optional rewards and such encourage leaving the hook while not punishing the Killer if they absolutely have to camp for some reason.
I will also add that Survivors claim 'camping will become EASIER if you speed up generators'. I will call BS on this. As a Killer main; the reason I camp is because the matches go so fast. Not to grief, not to anger people. I camp because 3 gens pop in 1 chase and now I'm playing catch-up.
If gen times we slowed down, maybe by reworking gens so Survivors don't have to 'mindlessly hold M1' as they say and give Killers 2-3 extra minutes; I would bet money camping would reduce. Because camping is boring. But camping is also the only way to FEEL LIKE we, as Killers, are doing something.
Chasing a Survivor feels like we are wasting time as other Survivors do gens. We feel the clock breathing down our necks. Same with hunting for Survivors. Once we have a Survivor hooked, however, we feel like we accomplished our goal; 1 Survivor hooked, probably 1-2 coming for the unhook. So we don't want to lose that Survivor or we feel like we bare back to square 1; 0 hooked/dead Survivors, and gens being worked on again.
So you change gens speeds and I bet camping will stop being an issue. But I think perks and mechanics to encourage leaving the hook will also help.
But I will NEVER back a 'punishment', because they are either vindictive BS (Stealing the Killer's BP? Really?) or easily abused trash (slowing/freezing the struggle timer).
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@LordGlint said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2414453#Comment_2414453
No, I get what your saying. You brought up seeing things from the perspective of the crows, which would resemble resident evil's camera in that it was always fixed in some random spot above you.
Sidenote, supermario 64 had a cameraman follow you around on a cloud, so TECHNICALLY I suppose THAT was 2nd person.
Huh, you're right. I did not even think of that. Mario 64 was a 2nd person view!
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@LordGlint said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2414417#Comment_2414417
Feel like that would just look like the camera angles for the original resident evil games.
Kind of, but only if those camera angles were, say, Lickers or other monsters that were spying on you. Whereas '3rd person' cameras infrequently actually have 'persons' attached to them, 1st and 2nd person cameras are tied to actual 'persons' in the game world.
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@Munqaxus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2414387#Comment_2414387
This is a game design issue. The game allows one player to prevent another play from playing the game. Again and again, BHVR has punished players for toxic behavior, such as holding a match hostage, DCing or using racist terms.
This is not a punishment against Killer players, because most Killers don't do this. However, there are a few players that do participate in toxic behavior, this is one of those toxic behaviors.
I'm not refuting your page long rant because it looks like it's copied&pasted and is filled with ad hominem attacks and doesn't have anything useful in it. What is your reasoning as to why one player should have the ability to prevent another player from playing the game? If you want to discuss this, we can, but you have to remember emotion does not carry an argument. Logic does.
Again I ask, Why should one player have the ability to prevent another player from playing the game, from a game design perspective?
'Again I ask, Why should one player have the ability to prevent another player from playing the game, from a game design perspective?'
Because that's the Killer's GOAL. How is this hard to understand? The Killer removes you from the game. He does this by putting you on a hook. He can then camp that hook if he suspects people are nearby.
How is this hard to get into your head? This is not 'toxic behavior' just because you don't like it.
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@CornHub said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2414147#Comment_2414147
What about 2nd person POVs for killer? Was that ever considered?
It's either First Person (You're seeing through the character's eyes)
Or 3rd person (You're seeing from outside the person you control. As if you were another person in the world)
A second person camera would be a viewpoint set from the perspective of another character in the game and not controllable by the player. Like if you could be one of the crows but could not control the crow.
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@BeamerBestWaifu said:
Well after watching all these comments, i changed my way of thinking
Yeah, i mean it's fine, but the only thing i want so much to change is that it at the end of the match, you will not loose your item. If bhvr does that the perk seems fine to me
They can't. Imagine you dropping a purple toolbox with a BNP, then someone else picks it up. Now they and you leave with a new Purple with BNP?
Unless you keep it in hand when you leave; you don't keep it. This is to prevent duplicating. And also for balance. You don't get to keep it just because you really want it; either go back for it, or lose it.
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@Munqaxus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2409452#Comment_2409452
Giving bloodpoints to the camped survivor does not solve the original problem. The problem is caused by players that have the ability to prevent other players from playing the game.
The Developers punish toxic behavior to reduce that behavior. You DC, you get punished. You call someone a racist name, you get punished.
This is another toxic behavior and needs to be punished to reduce it. I mean really, how is this any different than a player standing on a rock or holding the game hostage. All three of these behaviors stop the game from being played.
Survivors just stand 30+ meters away, in opposite directions. Now the Killer can't start a chase without giving up an unhook, and he can't protect his hook without being punished. I have pointed this out probably 100 times by now. But Survivor mains keep ignoring reality to stomp their feet and demand their easy to abuse trash ideas.
This argument makes no sense. This kind of situation is completely Killer-sided. What killer wouldn't want to start a chase immediately after hooking someone. This isn't a bad thing for the killer, this is a good thing for the killer. If that's the only argument against my idea, then I think my idea is pretty good.
Here we go again.
- Just because camping makes your feelings hurt does not mean it's toxic. There is no 'original problem' unless you're an entitled Survivor.
- Again; the chase should be the Killer's CHOICE. My scenario shows that your idea takes the choice away from the Killer; either he camps & gets punished, or he chases & gives an unhook. What if he needs that kill to start turning the match around? The choice is not in the Killer's hands anymore. You are deliberately ignoring this to pretend your idea is good. It's not. It sucks.
I've tried being polite but I've had this conversation more times than needed. No. The choice to camp or not is the Killers and should not be removed from his hands because some salty Survivor mains think they deserve every unhook the second they want to go for it, or believe camping is a problem because it hurt their feelings.
These ideas are pure trash or easily abused. I've pointed it out multiple times and Survivor mains like you ignore every flaw, or worse; think the flaws are perks because they benefit Survivors.
Camping does not need punishment or removal. it needs two things:
- BP for the Survivor camped, to encourage them to waste the Killer's time instead of hook-suiciding.
- Perks and mechanics to encourage the Killer to leave the hook. Not punishments.
Anything else is spiteful garbage or easily abused trash. I'm done trying to point this out in a polite manner, because SOME people ignore it and go 'Well, if I ignore everything you have said; my idea is fine!'
Camping is the choice a Killer can make, same as Survivors genrushing. A mechanic to punish it could screw Killers out of legit wins. Stop with these bullshit attempts to restrict how the Killer plays just because you hate losing.
The only 'problem' with camping is Survivors who believe it's not fair that they lost.