Mooks
Mooks
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@sphingidae said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4062509#Comment_4062509
Accidental deletion has already been mentioned in this discussion. It seems to me that this is not a problem if the functionality is implemented correctly? Or am I wrong?
‘correctly’ is a very subjective term in this case and there is still not really a good enough reason for removal to justify this, especially when not only free but paid content is affected
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@sphingidae said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4062503#Comment_4062503
Why not? Due to various restrictions, players are looking for ways to get inaccessible content. But this is beyond the scope of this discussion.
Maybe I used the wrong word, I'm not very good at English. Do you understand the title of this discussion? What do you think about it?
Accounts are not transferable - its explicitly stated in their TOS. Content thats not available anymore has (legal) reasons to be not available and why would circumventing that be supported?
i think hiding Badge/any cosmetic pieces or at least favouring some and only displaying those should have been implemented a Long time ago since there is way too many.
Deleting/removing from account shoudnt be a thing, there isnt any actual offensive cosmetic pieces and definitley none that anyone has to distance themselves from - and this Feature would inevitably result in some people accidently removing things and wanting them back resulting in higher Support requests which arent worth it at all.
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@sphingidae said:
Sometimes you follow the trend and strive to get all the badges to be in the topic. But sometimes trends stop being relevant and going out of dates or their maintainers starting act like world most attitude f**s so you don't wonna be a part of this and want to hide/delete any reminder about this. It would be nice to get such function/settings/opportunity
which badges are even related to maintainers? Are you talking about some licensed content?
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It seems to not directly under ‘Holding the Game hostage’ as they cant do this infinitley and its also not griefing as they are not directly targeting you/someone else.
It may fall under the ‘not participating in intended gameplay’ rule still though its a grey area and probably needs to be judged on individual case. So you can record such a Match, make an in-game report and an additional Player report via their Website where you attach a link to your uploaded video evidence and.. well if they deem it rule Breaking or not we cant say.. you would get an in-game notification if any Action was taken based on your report (though it never explicitly states which of your reports actually is referenced here)
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yeah, we know. We have seen content creators getting banned - on some cases where it wasnt warranted it was also lifted.
Though.. we do also get Feedback? It may take some weeks but you do get a Notification in-Game that some action was taken due to your report
for hacking and stuff like that you do Need to create an additional player report via their website (additionally to mandatory in-game Report so the Match can be tracked). For Chat harrassement/a use that is mit required and only the in-game Report would be enough.
I have noticed that some of my (hacking/griefing) reports lately got ignored (Clip on YouTube wasnt even watched once) though pretty sure i always got. a notification After chat reports -
@top500spiderman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4060290#Comment_4060290
If they did i can think of so many things that are in the game right now that wouldnt exist. I like how they at least TRY to balance off feedback thats not biased in nature and makes sense. Theres alot of poplular opinions here that gets backed hard that are flawed and they get ignored. Excellent dev team.
and you can tell what is biased feedback and what is not? As well as which opinioms are flawed and should rightfully be ignored?
Or could it be that it just so happens that your personal biased opinion just aligns well with this ‘excellent’ dev team? (Which would be fair enough though should be phrased as such…)
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@zonkednb said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4060313#Comment_4060313
Bill is one I can hunt down easily because of how loud he is, but I like playing him because - and I don't know if this makes me a bit sadistic - his pain nosies are legitimately funny to me. His voice acting sounds like a regular dude trying to do an 'old guy' voice if you see what i mean.
As for certain other noises… I can't say I've noticed it myself, but there's a very strong chance it'll become a one of those sitautions wher I can't unhear it now that I'm aware.
Also is it just me or does Taurie have some of the funniest downed noises out of the cast?haven’t really played Taurie that much or seen her often
but since this is a favourite sounds thread maybe more positivity from my side:Alan Wake has damn fantastic voice acting
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@zonkednb said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4060308#Comment_4060308
In all seriousness which survivor are you talking about?
Not that I wanna play them I just…
Yano any excuse will make it sound worse. Please just sate my curiosity.as for loud, actually kinda Bill. And Jeff, Michonne, Maggie and others.
The other group. Well. It’s a direction for all survivors i think, but Rebecca iirc is one of the worse/more obvious ones. But pretty much every especially female survivor has some noises in between where you think… what is happening right now??
(And just for the record, i know why they are doing it and get why this will stay a thing and not really completely against it)
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@dbd900bach said:
If I remember correctly, these tips only appear the first 3 times you face that specific killer. After 3 times, you will stop receiving those tips or spoilers.
This is a primarily for new players and returning players so that the on-boarding isn't such a rough process.
Yeah it’s only the first three of even just two times. Though to be fair, if you go out of your way to specifically deactivate hints for beginners, these hints should be disabled as well? -
@zonkednb said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4060301#Comment_4060301
"too much on the pleasure side"
You're talking about Bill, right?Well i get why you would think that. But nobody can say anything bad about those sexy Daddy sounds, come on now!
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í kinda had to think about the wind chimes on Yamaoka first thing when reading this title. Also the tanuki on the Yamaoka maps.
I do love these small atmospheric sounds on the maps
(Though sound design in this Game in general is great. Well. Not counting certain injured survivor sounds that are either too loud or too much on the pleasure side 🫠)
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have been asking for this since i have been on these forums, good luck lol
Seriously though, nothing against the Community Mods here - they can only gather the Feedback and forward it but even if the devs want to do it, they Need approval from the higher ups etc. and history has Shows that accessibility features need a veeeery long time.
Best chance would be to get their big content creative partners to actually start to talk about these things more often and actually strongly to spread awareness. It kinda worked for Colorblind mode and now customizable aura colors pretty much that way it seems -
@top500spiderman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4060218#Comment_4060218
No not bans, I just like how they dont care about biased popular opinions. If it doesn't make sense, it doesn't make sense. Alot of forrums fall victim to biased views because its a popular opinion. I feel like this is one of the reasons DBD has lasted for so long.
they literally listen to the loud and crying crowd all the time especially when it comes to actually needed bigger balance chances that may affect certain playstyles that are popular (regardless of survivor or killer side)…
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Look into your inbox on the PTB, you get plenty of Auric Cells to spent on PTB for characters and cosmetics to test out.
PTB and Normal Build are two separate enities, PTB as mentioned is just a copied state of your DbD Account from a specific Date (this snapshot is usually taken a few weeks/days before the PTB but Not directly stated when) so anything you do on PTB stays there including purchases and the other way around after that snapshot was taken
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@top500spiderman said:
Thats one thing i love about the dbd forrums the community managers and devs dont care about favorites.
that couldnt be any further from the truth though🙃🤷♂️
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@Phantom_ said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4059464#Comment_4059464
Yes, that was the name, thank youu ^-^
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4059731#Comment_4059731
Lowkey curious as to what happened 👀 I took a long break way from DBD and here.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4059566#Comment_4059566
Nope, one of my favourite persons on here. Hope you're doing well gamer!
Lowkey curious as to what happened 👀 I took a long break way from DBD and here.
i have been away for some time as well so don’t have any details on Forum stuff and discussing bans is gonna get me banned anyway but there have been some debates about forum moderation, some mods left for various reasons, there have been some questionable bans (with the ban system being super weird but thats not new…).
As for the game itself, also nothing new i think just that balance, QoL and Quality Assurance seems always to be too slow/not up to the Standard you would expect with the game being arguably very successful and that not since yesterday.. (though the general direction is great.. but why are customizable colors just now implemented? Cross hair locked behind an addon? Just two current examples) -
@bm33 said:
100% agree with your list so not going to repeat all the names.
You, @THE_Crazy_Hyena should definitely be on there.
I'm too lazy to tag each one or put where they belong so tippy2k2, Tragic Solitude, Orion, Mooks, C3Tooth, TheGannMan, JPLongstreet.
I feel like I'm forgetting people. 😬
Aww thanks, tbh i expected to be completely forgotten on here by now…
These forums used to be so fun but there are so many glaring issues with them and BHVR/DbD itself that i kinda drifted away from trying to help out or giving constructive feedback 😅
one forum member i haven’t seen mentioned and definitley deserves a spot is @KateMain86 , iykyk -
@kosaba11 said:
Honestly, this is good thing. Frankly, phobia modes should only be included in non-horror games. I saw so many people on Twitter demanding an arachnophobia mode because of that, now proven fake, leak of a jurogumo yokai being added - but that's frankly stupid for a horror game. Everything is a phobia, and every killer represents one phobia or another, so adding a mode just for that phobia would be like only accommodating one form of color blindness. It'd simply be babying one set of people while telling everyone else they have to just deal with it.
would be like only accommodating one form of color blindness
so.. since the current colorblind mode isnt actually helpful for all kind of colorblindness conditions they should remove it as well?
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Well they also said they haven’t planned a Spider Killer at all.
And they used to say they will not add a Clown as Killer because Coulrophobia is pretty common.
So… This is pretty much telling is nothing at all.
though it is funny how it’s now a horror Game but when it comes to actual gameplay of atmospheric lighting etc. it’s not important that it’s a Horror game.. -
aaaaand I missed them 😭
Just wanted to start the streams and I am too late. Thats disappointing.. as i am pretty sure just a few days ago while i forgot about these i did Check on Twitch as i felt like i forgot about some Drops and they werent listen there
Oh well.
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@camping_site said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3944120#Comment_3944120
i think something is down with reporting system. Reported 2 obvious hackers through ps5, no response within a week. But yeah- subtle speed hacks, wallhacks are every 3-4 game. Also, I live close to Russia, so it’s consequential.
I do get resonses on my reports, though mostly to tell me they have more than normal tickets and thats why its taking time
i also often only start recording after seeing the obvious and after that nothing more in my line of sight so 🫠 -
yeah. Same here. More survs doing it in my already lesser played killer matches but also some obvious (and dumb) Killer ones..
Though I only noticed that for the past few weeks
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@MikeyMyers666 said:
I believe the legal issues have been resolved. There was a release from the "Jason Universe" of a new image of Jason. The Crystal Lake series on Peacock is moving forward, and they said they will be brining Jason to various mediums, including gaming. So perhaps more good news is on the horizon.
additionally, talks/negotiations and then design/concept phases etc couldnt really only start once the legal issues wäre resolved, so it was just not possible yet
Core said in a recent Interview that next years anniversary would be ‚massive‘ - and license-wise, with Alien and Fnaf being added already I would argue that F13th is THE one that would be warranted to be called massive.. but then again vorhing confirmed and it might be massive in a completely different sense
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because Grading isnt used for matchmaking at all and kinda just rewards you with BP for the Grade at the end of the month (13th). It’s supposed to only measure time played while still kinda rewards playing ‚well‘
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@vol4r said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3940145#Comment_3940145
It doesn't require you to slug. It just require you to play a little bit more. I am more of a survivior player and yet I am fine with such quests
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3940195#Comment_3940195
Killer queue times are result of surviviors not haiving fun in the game. I myself don't play nearly as much as I was before the Kaneki release. Games against him are miserable and not fun and it drains out the will to play. That's case for me, my friends and I Believe it's not just us.
Also surviviors experience in chaos shuffle is immidiate tunnel to the person who got hooked first. Who wants to play that?
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3940306#Comment_3940306
I totally agree, we should be awarded more.
It doesn't require you to slug. It just require you to play a little bit more. I am more of a survivior player and yet I am fine with such quests
Thats way I wrote „*kinda* requires you to […] and/or […] slug“
Yeah it doesnt directly need to be done that way, but it’s done quicker that way especially for those of us that don’t have the time/Energy to Play Killer as often
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@vol4r said:
Can we normalize harder challenge completion? I want harder survivior quests too.
75 hit challenge is fine.
But this isnt really hard, is it?
It’s just tedious, requires multiple matches, kinda requires to play M1 killers and/or unfun (for Both sides) playstyles like slugging.
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while I am also often annoyed how this community complains (instead of giving constructive criticism) i think getting emotional over frustrating elements in a game that people care about is pretty normal and understandable.
I would still dran the line when it gets toxic and outright destructive, bashing/insulting the devs personally or ‚the other side‘ (often Killer vs survivor)
On the other hand… it very much seems like you reach the devs WAY easier with this attitude so.. 🤷♂️
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@Lexilogo said:
I'm personally not too invested in picking out specific entities because there's so many, and when BHVR have done stuff like this in the past their interpretation has always been on the looser side. Oni and Spirit take very clear inspirations but they're still a bit different than their typical archetypes.
My personal guess is that it'll be inspired by Chinese folklore though. That's what BHVR were probably originally planning to make with Doctor, until the playerbase voted for the unexpected direction that lead to Doctor. The only other option that was on that poll I know of is Heibai Wuchang, which could be cool for another try at the idea of controlling two Killers. I wonder if anyone else knows the other folklore options that were suggested back then?
there was a community vote for a Killer?!?!
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@CrypticGirl said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938880#Comment_3938880
Ooh, how was it? Does it look or run better?
it didnt look that much better imo, but at least the next Update will bring Gamma setting which should help in-Game.
I only played one Match as surv and don’t have a direct comparison as the last time I played on Switch was a longer time ago. I guess it was a bit more stable though.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938843#Comment_3938843
You can't play dbd on Switch 2.
https://media.nintendo.com/switch-2/pdf-compatibility_issues_EN_05272025.pdf
I played it already today before writing my comment.
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what do you mean, not compatible?
You can play the Switch version on the Switch 2, and I would assume since it’s better Hardware the performance will be better (minus the fact this Game isnt optimized for consoles or Switch to begin with..)
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@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938779#Comment_3938779
I'll have to take your word on that as I wasn't part of the DBD community back then, but the same logic applies. If BHVR had stuck with the argument that we can't have clowns because of Coulrophobia, we likely wouldn't have the Clown, despite the Evil Clown being a classic horror tope in the genre.l.
The fact we don't have an accessibility option doesn't prove that it's not viable to include accessibility options… but the fact BHVR went and did it without one after voicing those concerns does kinda indicate that having to include accessibility options for phobias is something that poses a problem for character development and design...
So I'd say my point still stands... why go to the effort to try to make an Arachnid killer, if you have to strip back and limit the concepts and ideas around it for being too spider like? Even if that isn't the direct reason BHVR doesn't want to do an arachnid killer, it's certainly a factor that would also sway their position if they are likely to take flack for not including an "arachnophobia accessibility" option.... which let's face it... they absolutely would.
it still boils down to assumptions and miscommunications and people getting worked up over these instead of actually looking at it rationally and constructivley
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@TimberGoingDown said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938489#Comment_3938489
Because it's a horror game and a spider killer would be freaking cool. That's why.
there is horror games without spiders that work just fine. There is non-horror games with Spiders that work just fine.
The Horror Genre isnt defined by having Common phobias in the media (even though there is a big overlap.
‚it’s a horror Game‘ is not an argument at all.
It would be freaking cool. I would love a Spider Killer as well.There is literally no excuse for actively wanting no (arachno)phobia mode outside of development issues/respources needed - which doesnt seem to be a factor for this Community when it’s about other things than accessibility features.
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@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938460#Comment_3938460
We've already argued about this already, so I won't dredge those talking points up regarding phobias...
However a strong consideration for why people are against that idea is that it basically means arachnophobia sufferers basically gate keep such content, and is likely why we got the announcement saying it'll never happen... I myself as someone who has had arachnophobia get so annoyed by it, because a Spider killer would be a great killer to touch on my fears, which is something I would love to have back in DBD.
How are they gate keeping? Well think about it as if you were a developer. To actually create a Spider killer with an arachnophobia accessibility option, you have to go through all the work of creating said killer as you do for any other... which as we all know is not an insignificant undertaking.
However now you also have to dedicate time and resources to researching arachnophobia, all the different variations and trigger, and then build various handlers on top of your killer to mitigate those issues. There isn't some handy widely available plugin or feature you can just slot into your game engine like you can for color blindness, you need to do the work yourself in the design of the killer. Likely you have to compromise several areas of your killers design, given that to accomodate arachnophobia you have to effectively make it 'less spidery'... which itself begs the question why are you even doing a Spider killer in the first place?
You then have to do extensive testing to ensure it complies with the accessibility requirements, and then you can finally ship your killer...
That is a lot of additional work to put into a killer... and time is money... any sensible business person would simply say "we're just not gonna bother doing a Spider killer, and will do something else instead".
Sure Monster Hunter did it, they literally turned the spiders into blobs... and sure these are OK in the context of monster hunter, but this would just be plain stupid in DBD.
https://youtu.be/Xq2jZRGabYU?si=IHEDt_oWajAzHIt7
So basically this industry shift to "arachnophobia accessibility" in gaming basically means none of us can have spiders, cause it's a waste of time trying to implement them along with implementing a passable replacement for the feature.
but we already have precedent that this gate keeping is not even happening with the Clown.
The devs have stated they wouldnt add a Clown killer because Coulrophobia is so widespread but then they went back on their word and still added the Clown without any further consideration.
Now we have the Twitter statement that handles both a potential Spider killer as well as accessibility features and I get why people may get confused and draw a direct connection - but its been confirmed these two statements are indeed separate from one another and its not a direct causal relation at all..
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@Yggleif said:
People have the phobia for different reasons it's not a catch all. For me I absolutely hate the mouths and hairy spiders so pics were actually tough to get through (no hate btw I understand you're just trying to find a solution) so I wouldn't love it if any of those were added to the game.
I can only answer for me but I think for me to be okay with a spider killer they would have to do that one thing some designs do where the mandibles are horizontal and are sort of like ant mouths and make the body more uuuhhh what's the word? chitinous? Where it looks like there's an exoskeleton or some sort of shell. Like the entity legs don't effect me at all. Also for examples I don't find Duke's Dear Freyja from Dark Souls 2 so bad or Lala Barina from monster hunter wilds all that bad even though it moves very weird. Nurubians from Warcraft are usually fine too so I suppose any spider centaur ish design would probably be fine. Meanwhile designs that triggered tf out of me were things like frostbite spiders in Skyrim and Aragog in Harry Potter.
Again this is just for me, I'm sure another arachnophobe could come along and say they disagree with me completely but this is an approximation of what I could personally deal with and what I couldn't. I'm not completely against a spider killer as I think that idea lends itself to a trap style killer which we need more of and I know many want it I just don't want it to be a design that runs me off the game and I do think that's very attainable.
One last thought is I don't know how the pro spider people feel about the idea of something like human form Eliza from LoL where the killer is human but has spider powers? That I'd be 100% fine with I feel.
One last thought is I don't know how the pro spider people feel about the idea of something like human form Eliza from LoL where the killer is human but has spider powers? That I'd be 100% fine with I feel.
I can obviously only speak for myself but I feel Like I have seen it often expressed by others: I would really want a full on (monstrous) non-humanoid spider. It’s why I am not really that disappointed with the rumours about the Jorogumo turning out false - it means we still have the chance for an actual spider instead of a Woman with spider-features
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@Ryuhi said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938492#Comment_3938492
I can agree with this. While I feel survivor side has been more accommodated in regards to hearing issues (big part of why I play majority survivor,) there are still multiple issue on their side as well. Accessibility especially shouldn't be an us vs them topic, its not about pulling each other down as much as it is making sure everyone is taken care of.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938454#Comment_3938454
Regarding phobias, the issue is in psychosomatic responses, which often come hand in hand with many phobias. Its not as much about fear as your body literally tricking you into believing involuntary sensations. There's a very big difference between even deep psychological horror and physically getting ill, or even true Fight/Flight/Freeze/Fawn responses. Few people who advocate for further phobias being excluded from the game think that the ones already there should be ignored, in fact they could (and should) be fixed the same as other accessibility issues.
Since it is too late as they are already in the game, accommodations would have to involve removing/swapping assets in a voluntary (specifically end user focused) censorship fashion (A setting to force the clown to use an appearance that does not represent a clown specifically, muting vomiting/giving it disassociated visual representation with an unnatural appearance like rainbow vomit, etc.) If you add another common phobia to the mix just because the other mistakes were made in the past, you're putting preference and/or spite before accessibility. There is far more feedback about how phobias do/have affect(ed) players in the community, so we have more data on the subject than we did when Clown was released. Obviously its mostly anecdotal feedback, but people have voiced their difficulties on these topics compared to before they were implemented.
The most important thing that a lot of people need to understand about how a lot of these issues affect players isn't about fear specifically, its about everything that comes with it turning it into a disproportionately negative experience, as opposed to being a "thrill" with no direct consequence. One of the most important aspects of appreciating horror is that it is always in a safe environment, thats why even cortisol can be welcomed in the right circumstances. Thats something that people should always be able to expect from their games, and a complaint that shouldn't really be ignored.
thank you so much for this explanation! People have a hard time distinguishing between a phobia and being just afraid of something specifically and i think you worded it very well (better than I ever could).
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@Malkhrim said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938460#Comment_3938460
I'm fine with that option, but considering how long it usually takes for acessibility options to be implemented in this game (I mean, we are getting brightness settings NOW, 9 years after the game's release), can we imagine how long that would take? Would the devs even WANT to make an entire new feature only for the release of one killer? Or would they just decide to do a completely different killer instead because that would be too much extra work?
THAT is a good Point
I would assume they would at least use that Feature for Clown and possibly Plague
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@AlreadyTracer said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938469#Comment_3938469
Because it's the easiest to
easy and a lot of people are affected.
Makes sense to implement such a feature as the playerbase may be bigger, certain streamers may be able to Play (and promote) the game, it doesnt harm anyone, …
I still don’t see the big reasons against it tbh
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@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938485#Comment_3938485
If chase music were made much quieter, and sound occlusion were removed from the game, do you honestly think survivors and killers would benefit equally from those changes?
no, I am not the one that asked for equal treatment in an asymmetrical game either.
I would welcome these changes for the Killer side, I just think it’s Not really fair to always bring up ‚us vs them‘ for any topic. The terror Radius I just a very specific Feature for the surv side
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@TimberGoingDown said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938479#Comment_3938479
That's different and you know it. They can't cater to blind people because it's a visual medium.
However, catering to a phobia is a stylistic choice. Plenty of people are terrified of clowns, yet we have a clown killer. Plenty of people puke when other people do, yet we still have Plague. Why are we making exceptions for people who are scared of spiders?
‚we‘ don’t make exceptions for arachnophobia
I have asked for modes for Emetophobia and coulrophobia for a Long time here on the forums.
and no, I don’t See how it’s completely different tbh.They have the ability to accomodate phobias Like these three mentioned easily. Why do you feel the need to gatekeep these?
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@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938448#Comment_3938448
Sound occlusion affects survivors way less than it affects killers, because if a noise is important to survivors, the game makes sure the survivors can hear those noises.
Did you know Spirit's directional phasing audio used to respect audio occlusion? But people complained that it was unfair they couldn't always hear the audio, so the directional phasing audio was buffed so that it could be easily heard through walls?
And yes, the terror radius noises are another perfect example, where the audio works perfectly through walls, because it's important for survivors to be able to hear important noises.
But there are directional, occluded noises that affect survivor players especislly against stealth killers..
Terror Radius isnt directional so you shouldnt expect it to be treated the same here
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@TimberGoingDown said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938385#Comment_3938385
If they can't cater to every phobia, then they should cater to none.
if they cant cater to every every vision or hearing impairment then they should cater to none. Since they cant cater to fully blind bor deaf people i guess we need to say good bye to the already implemented accessibility features.
who is allowed to making up these rules again? -
it cant be generalized like that. Some people that are suffering from arachnophobia may not be affected by any depictions on a monitor at all, for some others its just the movements of a spider.
One way to make it happen would still be to make a neutral cosmetic that would be shown client wider to those that have the optional option turned on. We could get a cool Spider Killer and plenty of cosmetics and wouldnt even notice if someone Else has the option turned on - so not immersion breaking at all.
Somehow people still have something against this idea 🤷♂️
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@DylianoAlexandria said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938437#Comment_3938437
Is a spider killer not out of the equation then?
Never has been, they just stated its not currently in the plans - which includes the planned chapters up until next anniversary chapter.
I guess theoretically that Community vote chapter may lead to a Spider still
@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938437#Comment_3938437
I just wish the hearing accessibility enhancements would happen on both sides of the game.
Survivors were given a visual terror radius, but killers still have a sound occlusion system that purposely hides survivor noises when there isn’t any line of sight.
I have the game volume blasting in my ears, at way too high a volume, but what else am I supposed to do when the chase music is so much louder than survivor breathing/grunts of pain/footstep noises?
Sound occlusion and purposely loud chase music, is so very anti-accessibility, and it can be considered a bit of a health hazard, because it encourages players to use a volume setting that might be dangerously high.
Survivors were given a visual terror radius, but killers still have a sound occlusion system that purposely hides survivor noises when there isn’t any line of sight.
The Sound occlusion also affects survivors and iirc doesnt affect the audio of the terror radius either
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that sounds interesting.
May I ask if this also affects other movement keys (A S D), if it also Happens when rebinding forward to another Button, using a controller and if survivors are affected?
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@I_Cant_Loop said:
This is so ridiculous if concerns about people with arachnophobia is the real reason for not wanting to create a spider-based killer.
I fully expect now that BHVR will ensure that they are being sensitive to every possible phobia, which basically means that all game content must now be removed.
If they don’t, it obviously means that they don’t care about accessibility.🙄
It’s no where stated that they haven’t added a Spider Killer because of arachnophobia. Assuming that based on the tweet is already irrational..
and obviously they cant address every single phobia in existence as phobias can be literally triggered by anything
Is it really that hard to react rationally about a possible and only optional feature that would make a videogame accessible or let it stay so to some players without affecting anyone else? -
@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938323#Comment_3938323
Not unreasonable argument, and I will take this moment to apologise if I came across overly bullheaded.
I think the main reason why myself and other people object to this thought process is where do you draw the line?
The problem that comes of accessibility features is they almost always sacrifice immersion for functionality, and in almost all cases, these are abusable for competative advantage... every accessibility change is a near unavoidable compromise in this regard.
e.g. the Visual Terror Radius is just categorically better for dealing with stealthier killers than not having it. Colour enhancement systems like reshade counter trap killers and allow for effectively aura perks for free. Gamma effects allow players to totally bypass darkening effects, etc, etc.
As such the inclusion of additional features to combat phobias runs a similar risk... and the problem is the Pandora box this opens.
For example: -
- Do you allow people to ban Clown for coulrophobia? Huntress, Nurse, Ghost Face or Trapper for Masklophobia? Billy or Blight for Dysmorphobia? That is abusable to just avoid certain killers.
- Do you allow people to make the game brighter to counter Nyctophobia? Despite the obvious advantages this brings.
- Do you allow people to to turn all sharp weapons into blocks for Aichmophobia, making those killers weapon textures larger, blockier and easier to see?
- Do you allow people to change models, sounds and powers completely such as Plague for Emetophobia or Zoophobia for Pig and her roar?
You can see how the list goes on, and basically if you facilitate one phobia, the implication is you have to include accessibility for all phobias on demand.
By implication none of us can say no to any request regarding phobia support, because after all, why would you support accessibility for one phobia, but not others? If someone asks for it, aren't you then duty bound to support it, cause not doing so is favouritism to one type of phobia over another?
You might say no, of course not, supporting all possible phobias would be ridiculous, but the fact is you then have to have someone define which phobias it's fine to have accessibility for, and which ones it is not, and that seems like a lose/lose no matter what you do.
As I say, this is a horror game the entire point is to touch on phobias... so of the goal is to make phobias accessible... you basically need options to turn of basically every aspect/element of the game... which just seems a flawed premise at its base.
Ideally accessibility features wouldnt provide any advantages for people that arent affected by the initial issue. And I can see that argument is reasonable to some degree.
but people are also exaggerating these, eg i still can hear Most Killer lullabys before I can see the visual indicator (Most easily with Huntress but also others) and I have to think to myself: are the people that rally against this feature sure they are not the target audience here?And even then, these features can be fine-tuned, where the advantage would either be negligible or even give a slight disadvantage if it is too much
I already Said where I draw the line: if the feature is integral to the whole games Identity such as Masks, sharp weapons, blood, nighttime in DbD then an extra mode may be not reasonable. But if the game didnt feature something triggering a phobia sich as arachnophobia for literal a decade and suddenly it gets added but wont affect more than 90 perfekt of matches then why not add a phobia mode which changes the model client-sided to something still Horror themed but just not arachnid - it shouldnt give an advantage (there is already cosmetics that change the killers appearance greatly that are Not considered super advantageous) then what exactly speaks against it?Obviously the line has to be drawn somewhere, but the Community/player base should be able to ask for such features without being attacked for it and the devs can consider to implement these (based on requests, available resources, etc) without being attacked for it for either decision.
Just because they implement one phobia Mode doesnt mean they have to accomodate to all possible phobias just as much as they don’t have to cater to any existing color blind condition just because they have a basic colorblind mode (eg its a Video Game that uses colors and it will never be fully accessible for achromatopsia) - though they still should improve their colorblind settings
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@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3938290#Comment_3938290
I absolutely agree with you that fear and horror is unique to each individual. In fact I cite that as one of the greatest things about horror as a genre, the fact that it is so personal to you in regards to what you personally fear.
To get a little philosophical, video games are a medium that allows players to immerse themselves in a world that they otherwise would not be able to experience. Fear is a negative emotion, why would any of us want to experience it? The reason I would argue is because it is such an interesting emotion, uniquely introspective to you as a person, and a very raw to the human experience.
I had a very intense fear of the dark as a child and well into my teens, more specifically cracked cupboards or dark hallways. The Dredge touches precisely on my childhood fears, and the only reason I'm able to deal with him now is there have been many forms of media that hit this precise fear that I have explored at length.
I have intense fear still of concepts such as possession or various representations of poltergeists/demons that I cannot put a physical barrier between me and it. I believe it may have grounds in feeling unable to control.
The common trait of a hero is bravery, and the definition of bravery is "the quality or state of having or showing mental or moral strength to face danger, fear, or difficulty". Bravery is not defined as a person that is not afraid; not caring about danger is stupidity, which is why we have lines such as "there is a fine line between being courageous and being stupid". What makes a character brave is that they experience fear, and yet are willing to face that fear anyway.
I bring this up, because to come into a game that is predicated precisely on the idea of gathering together and celebrating all icons of horror and fear, and then try to demand features to diminish its horror elements instead of taking steps to manage your own phobias, is at best cowardice, and at worst extreme entitlement.
My family have several individuals with autism, bipolar disorder, ptsd, etc, and in a lot of cases have phobias associated with them, some of which can be explosive at times. We have a common saying in our home of "that might be a reason that explains your behaviour, but it is not an excuse", and we still hold each other up to the same standards as everyone else. I have my own phobias that I have faced and still face to this day, not limited to DBD, but all aspects of life, and have held me back in numerous ways... but I wouldn't dream of asking for special treatment to remove those hurdles, because doing so would prove that I can't overcome them, that I will forever give into them. Being forced to face them, I have become much better (even if still not good) in those regards.
This mentality of "my challenges in life, even if they are entirely irrational or of my own making, aren't for me to solve or fight to overcome, they are for everyone else to accomodate", is not an attitude I believe should be celebrated in any way shape or form, and is a attitude that seems to be very prevelant nowadays.
and then try to demand features to diminish its horror elements instead of taking steps to manage your own phobias, is at best cowardice, and at worst extreme entitlement.
Demanding and asking for are two very different things.
It seems like the people against optional Phobia modes are the ones demanding something here - which wouldnt even affect them as no one would be forced to use such an optional Setting and this seems to me more like what entitlement is. Espeically considering they way people are speaking against it (calling it stupid/dumb, having no empathy for other, only Talking about themselves and their own experiences, belittling others, trying to dictate how others should handle their own phobias and media usage)
you don’t have to ask for special treatment for yourself, no one is saying that you should or trying to Tell you how you handle your mental health, but why do you think you can tell others what they ask for?
just because this way has worked for you doesnt mean it will work for wvwry affected individual and they may just not be in a mental state to go that way.
"my challenges in life, even if they are entirely irrational or of my own making, aren't for me to solve or fight to overcome, they are for everyone else to accomodate"This isnt happening either. They are asking Game devs for an optional feature. Every other player would not be affected.
And again, making it a slippery slope, generalizing.. the world can become more welcoming but somehow people try to turn that into something bad when it wouldnt harm anyone Else or affect them negatively -
@D00M said:
this is dumb as hell but ya know how this game have spider charms and spiders in toba landing wth are they talking about???
different people are affected differently. Some arachnophobic people may be affected by these depictions and others can handle these well. As I have read, Most are affected by realistic looking Spiders and especially their movements.
But sure, arachnophobia Mode may also affect these depictions, wouldnt hurt anyone either and may make it more easy for people that enjoy DbD/Horror in general but don’t want to be confronted with their arachnophobia.
‚it’s a Horror Game‘ is not an excuse btw, This Game would be ENTIRELY the same without spiders, they are not integral for the actual Game/gameplay.There are phobias were a specific Mode wouldnt make sense to implement in DbD but using this slippery Slow Argument is irrational for arachnophobia/emetophobia/coulrophobia as they are only present with specific killers (in case of spiders not even actually present now but it Apparently still Counts as a Horror Game…)
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@UndeddJester said:
The words "arachnophobia mode" annoyed me greatly.
A phobia is defined as a persistent, excessive, and irrational fear of an object, person, animal, activity, or situation.
As someone who has arachnophobia and worked for years to overcome it, I find the notion of an anti-phobia accessibility option absurb. I started with tiny money spiders and letting them on my hands, and am now able to hold even medium sized spiders unprotected, and can capture even very large spiders under a glass and paper and take them outside without panicking. I still have to control my fear, but that is a skill to develop in itself.
My mother suffered with incredibly bad arachnophobia, still does, but when she became a teacher had to get it under control so that she could deal with spiders in front of 5 year old without panicking them.
DBD is a horror game. The reason you play horror games is to experience and face your fear, and I would love to have that new player fear experience I had when I started playing DBD back, and I'm sure many players would. There are things to do with accessibility that do need to be handled, like the visual terror radius for hard of hearing, the sensory overload/epilepsy issues from Clown and Doctor, etc. These things should be handled...
However when it comes to phobias, asking foŕ accessibility options on them, I'm sorry, is just ridiculous... Emetophobia might have a case because it can make you physically sick... but other phobias is just being silly... are we gonna add options for Hemophobia to remove blood? Nyctophobia to remove darkness? Aichmophobia to remove sharp objects?
"Accessibility" isn't a word that can be just thrown out and be automatically right. How far exactly into the "irrational fear" accessibility pool do we want to go? Fear is fear. Deal with it or leave.
everyone has a different journey and they may experience their phobia differently.
its great you are overcoming yours but that doesnt mean everyone else has to do it the same way and it should definitley not be mandated by a Video game they are playing.The reason you play horror games is to experience and face your fear
thats not true though - I don’t have any kind of phobia and I still play and enjoy horror games. People with a specific phobia (irrational fear) may still enjoy horror media that don’t include their phobia and especially in DbD case arachnophobics may have player the Game for almost 10 years and enjoyed the present horror aspects.
Emetophobia might have a case because it can make you physically sick... but other phobias is just being silly...Thats not true, other phobias can make people physically sick as well. Are you sure you are actually talking about phobias and not just normal fears…
are we gonna add options for Hemophobia to remove blood? Nyctophobia to remove darkness? Aichmophobia to remove sharp objects?imo this is different as these are themes that are present in the whole Game, not even just every Match but even outside of the matches. As for Stufe Like Coulrophobia, Emetophobia, and potentially Arachnophobia it would only be präsent in some of the matches that in this case survivor players cant control at all. So they are forced to either not play the game at all because they might encounter this theme suddenly even when it wasnt there for years of them playing or they have to close the game (dc/afk/playing blind/deaf) for these matches.
Though there is an EASY Solution for these problems: phobia mode that changes these visual or audio triggers client sided. It wouldnt affect anyone else, correctly implemented wouldnt give any advantage, and people that want to accustom themselves to their triggers can try and turn it on
Other games have implemented these without it actually affecting other Players already. It’s really that simple and you don’t need to work yourself up about it.