MarcoPoloYolo
MarcoPoloYolo
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@Phasmamain said:
I think it’s fine personally. She’ll still be easily A tier and that’s where all killers should strive to be
Oh definitely not. She'll be C-B tier at best. The nerf goes straight into survivor handholding. That dust footsteps part of her nerf means that Spirit's blind, but the survivors are not.
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@Jivetalkin13 said:
How about you play her after the changes go through and then you can make a judgement? For all we know when they say "dust gets kicked up" it's just a couple particles. All I'm saying is reserve judgment until afterward, then you can complain.
I don't need to play her to tell what's going to happen. Survivors have more information on the Spirit's location than she has on them. She's basically going to be a killer with very little anti-loop and a meh mobility power.
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Yes, but be warned. He's unintuitive to play. The box is your biggest priority, so box solving and portal rang add-ons are the best combo to go with (chains resets box solving from scratch). HIs turn rate add-ons are trash that don't do anything. Survivors at least feel like they can still turn faster than the chain can.
The box spawns where both you and the survivors aren't, so you can search for it early game, and hover around that type of area mid/late-game to poach the box. I highly recommend Franklins since it'll cut your chase time to get the box by more than half. Hoarder is something a lot of Pinheads like. I think you can deal without it TBH.
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@Momentosis said:
Just don't sweat
Not how it works bud. I jacked up my Pinhead (bugged lunge) MMR with my initial build (until I got Franklins) being corrupt, deadlock, Retribution, and plaything. Minimal if any tunneling. Result, 4-man stacks of small pp builds as time went on. Competency will send you sweaty games or builds.
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@Artick said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2512098#Comment_2512098
If survivors outplay you by holding W while you play Nurse then you probably aren't any good at playing her. Not trying to be rude, but it's a fact.
You can't math. 1-blinking is the established meta for moving as Nurse. The total time taken for charging, max-range blinking, the chain-blink window, and fatigue, is 7 seconds. 2 + 1.5 + 1.5 + 2. 4.6 m/s X 7 seconds = 32.2m/s.
What does Nurse travel at? 2.89m/s * 2s = 5.78m. 20m for 1.5 seconds for blink. Chain blink window is 1.54m/s over 1.5 seconds to be 2.31m. The fatigue is .96m/s for 2 seconds at 1.92m. So, in 7 seconds, nurse travels 30.01m per 7 seconds assuming double recharge. Nurse only has map mobility with range add-ons. Think of her as a super Deathslinger that can move through walls.
I'd highly advice you investigate and understand what you're talking about before you talk trash to others. It's not a good look for you.
https://deadbydaylight.fandom.com/wiki/Movement_Speeds#The_Nurse
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@Mat_Sella said:
Nurse will outpace
Blight will outpace
Wraith will outpace
Billy will outpace
Victor will outpace
Spirit will outpace
Oni with Demon Dash will outpace
Freddy will teleport in front of them
Demo will teleport in front of them and can close an 11 meter gap as it's attack.
Hag will teleport on top of them and hit them
Huntress will snipe
Deathslinger will pull
Nurse isn't as fast as you think. Holding W might be less effective compared to a 115% killer, but it's effective if she's not using omega blink.
That's Blight's main power, so no surprises there.
Wraith can do that (and it's helpful), but he has little anti-loop power, so basically holding W becomes secondary for the survivor.
Billy can cut the distance by a bit, but the 3 second cooldown will maintain some distance regardless. If there's clutter in the way, it'll become comical.
I have no idea why we're bringing up Victor. That'll happen only a very specific circumstance with the Twins.
If they're running to a gen, maybe, but under most circumstances, no. That, and they'd have to fall for an obvious trick. So no, still is a standard 115% killer in most circumstances.
Well you don't use Demo do you?
Hag doesn't chase, so that's irrelevant.
At a sweet spot. At a certain distance, the survivor can react. Also, with cover in the way, it's worse for her than the average killer.
Did you just list one of the biggest victims of the W key as one of the killers that counters it?
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@th3 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2512028#Comment_2512028
You remember the first few mmr tests? Literally every game killers were stomping baby survivors. It wouldn't have worked and the new player experience was worse to an abominable level.
Well
1. That's not the subject. We're talking about what we were told, not discussing the merits of it.
2. No one said baby survivors. This is an exaggeration. Can we agree that a baby Nurse or Huntress should not be sent against a second chance build SWF at the very least?
3. The new player experience is going to be awful regardless considering what fresh accounts are likely to face.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2511613#Comment_2511613
Wasn't one of the points of the system to allow people to play new Killers without being stomped? I could've sworn I heard that, maybe it's a Mandela effect.
No, you're not crazy. It was directly stated that killers that were picked up for the first time. The most charitable stance I can assume is that there's massive miscommunication within the company.
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No clue. I typically don't BM unless BM'd to.
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@Ghoste said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2510951#Comment_2510951
It makes sense though. If you're high MMR on a Killer, you've probably got the fundamentals down and can play any Killer at a basic level. They probably want to prevent noob-stomping by switching to a Killer you never play, but still lowering the rating a bit to help out. Idk seems fair to me.
10 matches worth of difference only? Don't think so. Killer viability is closely related to power mastery. You could make this argument for Bubba and Freddy, but the average killer that have a higher barrier of entry? 110% and lower killers? That goes straight out the window.
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@Clevite said:
Tunneling is not a must, it is a choice. Especially nowadays with MMR.
It is really done because one is applying an arbitrary number of kills to define a win.
Play for fun , play how you would like to verse , and the game does chill out a bit.
Yeah, no. I can tell you from experience with Pinhead that this does not happen.
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Well, my queue times are longer on pretty much every killer regardless of my playtime on them, so that automatically makes it less enjoyable. Sweat builds are far more common as are SWF, so yay. It's not that I can't perform decently well, but the process tends to be less enjoyable. I guess this is an excuse to master survivor I guess.
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Let's make it to where killers have an option to opt out of SWFs and exhaustion + second chance perks. Sounds like a stupid request doesn't it?
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Because Twins are probably the only killer that's more obnoxious to play at this point. He has a built-in 3 second penalty for misusing his hard to control power while the user has to be mindful of the overheat mechanic punishing the user to be more cautious with him (paired with obnoxious sound effects, arguably the biggest turn off for me to play him). He's just not that fun.
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While this may or may not work, BHVR should just fix their code so that stretched res doesn't increase vertical FOV.
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@GoodBoyKaru said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2501396#Comment_2501396
Tinkerer is also stronger than every perk you mentioned.
"A gen is about to be done" is no where near as useful as you think.
I'm sorry I played ~100 matches as double range Ruin/Undying/Tinkerer Nurse, Freddy, and MDR/Yakuyoke Spirit. Do forgive me for speaking from experience because the perk is complete bullshit solo stomp.
I'll take Infectious and Discordance over Tinkerer any day. I prefer proactive play rather than reactive. Tinkerer is good, but the problem it represents is exaggerated, especially relative to other combos in the game. Could it be looked at in the future if the devs decide to make the perfectly balanced game? Sure, but not before the laundry list of other issues.
Also, solo queue shouldn't be the standard of balance. The devs should just add voice chat in game already, and balance around comms. Just bite the bullet already devs. We've been playing 2 games in one queue for too long.
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@GoodBoyKaru said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2501199#Comment_2501199
Once per generator.
Hell no! That's a ludicrous restriction. You can aura read with BBQ a total of 8 times, you can have discordance unlimited times. You have unlimited procs of infectious. Tinkerer being limited to 5 times per match is just horrific. Bitter murmur would arguably give more value. How about we make all killers viable for high-level play before we go around nerfing killer perks because they feel bad for some? "A gen is about to be done" is no where near as useful as you think.
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When survivors decided to declare anything that is effective boring.
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As the dust settles, no. As I expected, by merely being competent and not choosing the sweatiest builds or having the sweatiest playstyles, I regularly get large SWFs or survivor meta builds that outclass my own. People that say "don't sweat and you won't get these people" are just full of it. There's really not a point in not choosing a stronger build since no matter what, you're going to be facing annoying stuff on the regular anyway. Thankfully, this MMR is not the most consistent thing ever, but the quality of life in the game has gone down. This change is only good for bad survivors and screws over everyone else.
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Waiting for the chainhunt means there's a chance the chain hunt will interrupt you solving it, buying Pinhead time to interrupt you himself and screwing over your team with another chainhunt. For solving, however, it's best to solve when he's picking up a survivor he downed.
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@GrimoireWeiss said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2494015#Comment_2494015
As I said, Huntress has a WAY longer wind up than Nemesis, so the survivor has way more than time to react. Nemesis unleashes his attack so fast that you can fast vault a window and in the middle of the animation he can take out his whip and attack you before you're done vaulting. I feel you're understimating Nemesis range there too, 5 or 6m is enough to get hits at the shack window that you wouldn't get with a M1.
I don't get it when you say "take a loop wide". He's still moving at 115% on your direction, if you don't hug the loop he'll just close the distance and M1 you anyway.
On pallet loops Nemesis is also way harder to deal with. Against Huntress, each loop you basically have a 50/50 chance of Huntress winding up her hatchet to try and get a hit while you drop the pallet. If she misses that, she's slowed down so much that the survivor can easily get another loop. With Nemesis, if you try that, he only gets slowed down to 95% MS (100% on tier 3!), so you'll probably be hit with a M1 before you do another loop.
I don't even need to talk about his zoning. The guy shreds through pallets faster than Demo and Bubba.
Yes, that's the trade-off in range. He can't hit you if he starts in the middle of the vault animation. That's a huge exaggeration. The best he can manage is start the windup just before the vault animation begins and get a hit, and unless he's tier 3, he's outright inferior to Demogorgon in this regard, and that's not debatable. It comes down to their numbers. If you got hit by the tentacle at shack at anything less than tier 3, you're reacting slowly, or lost a mindgame that led up to the tentacle attack landing.
He moves at 90s when charging the tentacle. Canceling it means he moves at Myer's T1 speed. It's a similar principle to Pyramid Head's corner shots. Either he wants to hit you, and taking it wide results in a miss that you can punish, or it was a bait, and he'll catch up.
This is why I brought up loop shape. Depending on the loop shape, it's actually 2 50/50s. The 50/50 at the pallet, and then, with proper timing and preaiming from the Huntress, a 50/50 on the loop's side. And, again, if Nemesis' entire advantage is small pallet loops, his demerits are not proportional to his power's value. Also, you are outright wrong on missed hits. If he holds the tentacle, he's moving at 95% or 100%. This does not apply to misses. It's the standard cooldown speed. A Huntress missing is actually moving in the 90s for 2 seconds, which is both faster and shorter than Nemesis's misses. God help you if Huntress is using cooldown add-ons. which are low-rarity.
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@GrimoireWeiss said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2493746#Comment_2493746
Huntress has a 1,5 seconds wind up compared to the 0,35 seconds Nemesis has, is slowed down to around 60% MS so she can't fake her attack like Nemesis can, moves at 110% and doesn't break pallets with her hatchets. The only advantage in chase she has above Nemesis is range, because in actual loops it's way easier to hit attacks with the Tentacle.
Not even to mention Huntress doesn't have zombies.
But on the loops where Huntress's power is valid, there's less counterplay for Huntress than Nemesis. Due to Nemesis' range constraints, a survivor can take a loop wide causing them to be safe from the whip. This is not an issue for Huntress. Pallets stuns also interrupt the tentacle attack while it won't interrupt a hatchet toss. The only thing that would make Nemesis better at filler loops is that survivors can't cheese the fight by dropping pallet one loop early, and even then, depending on the loop shape, Huntress can still get the hit. This is also not even factoring in that Huntress will just outright be better at any windowed loop due to how temperamental that angles are on the whip requiring him to be closer to the survivor than huntress to seal off a window. Also, Huntress has her own style of zoning. Anywhere in her line of sight is a target.
So, in conclusion, Nemesis is only debatably better than Huntress on the weakest tiles in the game, and that's apparently justification enough to not only require winning the chase 3 times before a down, but give a survivor 2 free spring bursts that turns even correctly executed usages of your power game loosing chases against good survivors. Fantastic.
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@Pulsar said:
I was playing Hag for the first time today and I was getting decent Survivors.
So no, I don't really think it works.
Supposedly the MMR for your new killers is based off of your average killer MMR until your placements are complete despite what their release statements said. So basically, there's no positive to MMR if you're playing as a killer.
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@Zarathos said:
Sbmm is gonna suck regardless of what killer you main. Nemsis is likely to receive changes by next mid chapter. We will have to see what happens but according to dev's who reply to a forum post they think infecting and also taking a health state is too strong? So expect him to wallow in mid tier. I highly advise maining a killer with more potential if you don't want your dbd main to actually scale.
It's worse. If I remember correctly, he said that the speedboost not being there was what made him "miserable." So what's being doubled down on is the balance issue all in the name of "fun." It's astonishing that people have tried to say that Nemesis is this uber oppressive killer when his tier 3 is only a slightly better chase tool than Demo's pounce with low-rarity add-ons. Meanwhile, Demo has a functional second power, whereas Nemesis does not.
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This won't do anything. 1. The devs don't consider other perspectives. 2. The devs use base game annoyances as the basis for their perk design a lot of the times. They're probably not going to make a baskit change and lightly nerf gen perks.
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@fogdonkey said:
Pretty fine, was 3k-4k-ing most of my games (15+) while still using only brown add-ons. The survivors probably weren't the best, but around half of the time there was some swf.
Unless... It is "The Game" map. I couldn't use Pinhead very well there. Easy to break line of sight, many pallets, most loops are big and they break chain before I could get to them.
Guess which map I've had as him 4 times this week? Strangely, 3 of those were wins.
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Moderately. I'm definitely seeing a huge amount of sweaty builds or typical SWF shenanigan's, but I'm not typically having an initial chase and having a 3 gen pop and feeling like the game is over. Whether that's me or the survivors, who knows. Then again, I'm not sure I've had 10 matches with Pinhead yet. I'm also intentionally using a less sweaty build and having a less sweaty playstyle and let the game run its course.
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Why? Those perks kinda save him, and even then, he can't do anything if you open the box while he's hooking a survivor.
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It's really hard to rate him. I will say that, if you're not running add-ons, he's pretty weak (almost as if the solving add-ons should be basekit). Among the low-mid rarity add-ons are his box solving duration and portal range add-ons. Those in combination enable him to interrupt box solving. With these, you'd be surprised at the situation you can come back from if you keep chainhunt up. So, in that sense, he's good. There's a problem though. There's a very brainless and easy counter to chainhunt that can tank his performance. If the survivors wait until Pinhead picks up a survivor, it's almost a guaranteed solve.
They need to do one of two things.
Path 1. Let Pinhead see the box's aura at closer ranges like 20m so that there's the possibility that he can find it on its own, and no, the spawns aren't consistent, so I do feel this is warranted. It feels like it will spawn forward or to your side on an end of the map, but there's no telling which.
Path 2. Make the box respawn 10 seconds like what happens when you pick it up and not 45 seconds. In total, a survivor solving the box ensures that a chain hunt won't occur in 2 1/4 minutes. Meanwhile, whenever a chainhunt activates from Pinhead picking the box up, the box is available to be solved at any moment. Can you see the Dev's philosophy of having killers and survivors have disproportionate consequences within Pinhead's design yet? If the box respawn is 10 seconds after a solve, then at least it holds the threat of a chain hunt every 100 seconds. As it stands, Pinhead's passive slowdown, so to speak, is actually weaker than even nerfed Freddy's clocks.
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He is, in fact, a 1v4 killer. This is what survivors in the forums asked for.
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If they're strong perks, it's going to be a disaster for killer players. Killers can't afford secondary objectives, and the fact that survivors are getting a feature killers should have had since forever (picking your totem spot), and there is no totem detection perk for killer, totems will be a stronger time waste for killers than survivors.
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To be fair, undetectable on Huntress is a joke. This effect shouldn't be a purple in general. Undetectable add-ons jump between green and purple rarities for killers as a whole.
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It doesn't matter. If you have high MMR, you're going to get SWFs more often or god-tier solo players. Just eat the match.
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Bruh. Endgame camping is just how the game's designed. It's either secure the last kill (or farm more hook states from a rescuer), or just give a free escape. The devs refusing to deal with 99 gates means that camping in endgame is the only choice to make that's not actively throwing. The only exception is if you have info on where the other survivors are for a slugging play, but that requires perks specifically tailored to endgame. If you find the endgame boring, talk to the devs. It's their problem to solve.
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@ad19970 said:
The devs already said that Nemesis not giving a speed boost to survivors when infecting them was not fun to go against. And I agree that shouldn't be changed. There should be enough incentive to get vaccinated against Nemesis. And he is already pretty damn strong in chases.
I think it's the Zombie Ai that needs to be improved, allowing for more map pressure. I feel like that would be enough to make him perfectly balanced and viable.
Pinhead I personally still disagree. It's still early though, but I feel like he is already pretty strong. Buffing his chains in any impactful way I feel would make him too oppressive in chases. Which would be a shame in my opinion, because we don't need more killers like that.
His chains aren't always a net benefit, but their average use case is strong enough in my opinion. Being able to break chains on objects is nice counterplay for survivors in my opinion. the only thing they could maybe do is increase the chain break animation from 1 second to 1.2 seconds, but I fear like that could already end up being too strong in open areas.
And I'll reiterate that the speedboost is his problem. His chase power is nowhere near strong enough to warrant such a weakness. No other killer has a power that acts as free chase extension for the survivor. His anti-loop only becomes good at tier 3, the pallet breaking being the only good thing about him until then. The speed boost should be tuned down at the least.
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Because as usual in instances like the hook UI, there's an expectation for killers and none for survivors even though good survivors exist. As you've seen with Mandy, they think that chain hunts will happen all the time. If Pinhead had map-wide aura reading, then this would be true. However, what the devs created is the opposite extreme. A sound notification when you're right next to it on maps the typical size means that the mechanic of picking up the box might as well not exist.
You're only starting chain hunts if you chase down a survivor with the box, and even then, it comes down to luck as the survivors have to be opening it relatively close to you for you to stop them from opening it. At minimum, there needs to be a close-range aura so that you could take the risk of patrolling the map and potentially find the box without actually looking at every crevice.
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He's whom Pig aspires to be simply do to the fact that the slowdown is not dependent on mediocre chase abilities. That being said, it's not hard to be better than Pig, and we'll have to see how he is over time.
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Good if the survivors don't know how to play safe against him. Terrible if they do, but good again if you use bamboozle.
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Not sure what I'd do with chains. Maybe make collision breaking not a thing at all. Maybe duration, who knows.
I'd like it if the box actually showed an aura close up (maybe 20m or something like that). As it stands, you only get the box by taking it from a survivor that didn't know you were close by. Even then, chain hunt will only be active for 10 seconds before the survivors can potentially get the box to stop it.
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@knell said:
From the "Skill Based Matchmaking Recap" News from June 14th, 2021
"Halfway through our test, we were seeing many reports of high-skill Killers being matched against low-skill Survivors. At around 1PM EST on Thursday (around halfway through the test) we enabled a system that would assign unrated Killers a starting Rating based on their other Killers. To put this another way, if you had a high Rating with The Shape and The Trapper then decided to try out The Oni for the very first time, your Oni rating would start higher than the normal default due to your experience with other Killers. Enabling this appears to have resulted in an improvement of match quality, and we intend to improve this system in our next iteration."
Oh, so it functions completely differently from their release statements. "Skill based matchmaking ratings are also separate for each Killer, meaning you’ll have tougher matches with the Killer you’re really good at, but easier matches when you’re trying out a new Killer for the first time."
Unless it means higher than the global average, but lower than your main killer's MMR (indicated to not be the case by experiences), these statements are mutually exclusive. So all they did is move the problem from one side to another. Classic. If you don't have a great build on a new killer, enjoy your loosing streak nerd, because the matchmaking system is actively going to search for tough opponents for you.
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Please do. In the meantime, I'd like to add what I've felt on how to use him. Granted, I have, uh, significantly less matches than you. Feel free to consider or discard them. I think if you just downed a survivor, it's worth teleporting (unless you know they're at a safe spot in the map). It's basically free slug pressure. I also think that his chain hunt speed add-ons are worth running as well. They put more pressure to solve the lament configuration, which might result in more passive slowdown.
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Honestly, a lot of the fun factor comes from the possessed chain, so I don't think he should purely be a M1 killer. Still like 4-5 matches in with Pinhead, so I'm still getting used to the power. I feel they need to do something about the power, like maybe remove the cooldown where you can't destroy objects after using the chain. That way, even if it is a ludicrously safe pallet, you can still at least make the next part of the chase less safe.
Honestly, his biggest issue for me is the fact that the devs have done the best they can to make sure that Pinhead never picks up the box himself by giving survivors map-wide auras and he gets no auras whatsoever, and if he does, lower the consequences by making the box respawn 10 seconds latter. It kind of shows the kiler/survivor gameplay in a nutshell.
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My stance has never been "Spirit has an excellent amount of counterplay" myself as much as "the game is filled with BS mechanics that don't have counterplay, so why do we care about Spirit in particular?"
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If you really wanted to eliminate the us vs them mentality, what would have to be done is form teams of killers and survivors that take turns going against the other side.
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At the moment with 4 games, Corrupt, Plaything, Retribution, and No Way Out.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2481831#Comment_2481831
Your Rating will adjust after a few games. So if you try out a new Killer and get your ass beaten a few times, you will get weaker Survivors.
It is impossible that the SBMM starts at 0 for people who try out new Killers. This would face them against Survivors who just started playing with two obvious problems:
- You can simply obliterate Survivors with most Killers. Say you know how to play the game as Trapper - you will have an easy time against Baby Survivors with at least every M1-Killer. This would not be fair. The difference in playstyle between Trapper and Pig is not really relevant when going against brand new Survivors.
- Second, if a new Killer gets released, everyone would start at 0 Rating for this Killer. So the Queue Times would be HORRIBLE when you try out a new Killer because suddenly thousands of Killers with 0 Rating queue up. And brand new Survivors will go against lots of experienced Killer players.
I didn't say anyone should be going against day 1 players. That's your words, not mine. What I'm saying is that the premise of sending a killer player using a killer for the first time against the players that they'd be sent against if they were playing their mains is stupid. It's also outright the opposite of what the devs said would happen. You should obviously start with the mid-level survivors. 10 matches is over 2 hours of playtime to just get screwed over. This makes saving bloodpoints for new killers even more important, which is, again, stupid.
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@Munqaxus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2481831#Comment_2481831
If the system serves no purpose, then why are you complaining about it. Since it's not doing anything, then it's not any different than the previous matchmaking system.
You clearly didn't read what I said outside of the first sentence. SBMM is achieving the opposite of what it's supposed to.
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@Mr_K said:
The baseline MMR per killer is based on your overall MMR of other killers. During the testing it was like you said, new killers you never played before goes against rank 20s. It wasn't until the last test that this baseline was more inline with your other killers skill.
This is to avoid stomping new players. Even if you haven't played a killer, you still have a lot of game knowledge to work off.
This baseline is just the starting point. It will adjust the more you play the killer.
Then the system serves no purpose and the only positive aspect of the system is non-existent. The point of SBMM and the reason why it's included in casual games is to separate those who don't know what they're doing from those that do. Part of the point of SBMM in DBD (as noted by others) is to give easier matches with the killers you've never used until the user gets better. If you picked up a killer before, you'd face a random assortment of skill levels of survivors while learning a killer. If the baseline MMR is based off of the MMR of other killers, then this means that the game grantees that you will face survivors that you are not ready for until it calibrates, which means SBMM is not properly implemented in the game, period. It's the opposite problem. If it works how you and the OP says it does, you're effectively reverse boosting the survivors if you pick up a new killer.
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Oh, someone whom shares my pain. 4k stopped by the server crash. Granted, I don't think that getting to high MMR will exactly be a positive thing, so we get to enjoy built-in reverse boosting I guess.
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If I had to guess, it's the Trickster's purple add-on situation. Clearly not a bug (no, no matter what you tell me, those add-ons were not bugged), but probably an example of intended mechanics causing an unintended effect. I guess for now, you REALLY don't want to hold the box hostage.