Kind_Lemon
Kind_Lemon
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Woah, that Knockout effect would be cool in-game.
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@xxaggieboyxx said:
Kind_Lemon said:
@DeadByFlashlight said:@Kind_Lemon said:
DeadByFlashlight said:
@Kind_Lemon said: A balance change to reduce choice camping would be to not let the killer know how much longer the survivor has on the hook before they die. That would mean a greater chance for unpredictability in survivors in situations where the survivors aren't experts at chase, and the killer is dominating the hook game. Tell me why the community members agree or disagree. How does this affect camping at all? I mean camping literally means that the killer chills next to the survivor until he dies, how does it matter AT ALL whether he sees a timer runing or not? The timer is actually only useful for killers that DONT camp. Take that away and you will see probably evne more campers :lol:
It affects the optimization of camping, making it harder. A killer can’t just leave when there is a fraction more bar left, looking around for unhookers that might be running in last second; they have to wait until they see the survivor stabbed with spikes. That gives roughly 10 extra seconds at the end of a sacrifice for survivors who aren’t in comms to make up for their inefficiency during that time.
I dont think you know what "camping" actually means and I believe you are talking about "patroling" actually.
A killer that camps doesnt move away from teh hook anyway and doesnt give a [BAD WORD] about any timer until the survivor is dead^^
Yes; that would be camping. It is the prevention of a save off a hook through the defensive strategy of standing near the hooked survivor. Most killers will start to leave the hook if the timer is low enough and there is not enough time for a survivor to run in and save. It’s a small change to require more investment, albeit amall, to camping.
All I want is for the killer to have less time to catch other survivors if the killer camps.
Why does everyone cry about camping? You yourself just called it a defensive strategy. If it's a strategy why should the devs even touch it in any way to make it less valid or viable. Even the whole chaser thing is dumb. Honestly with the way this went I would just close the thread if I were you.
Idk how to close threads, and anyway—hey! Who are you to tell me what to do? I don't care about camping as long as other survivors don't try and get the survivor off the hook, and they instead get the rest of us out. But this game pushes survivors to be overly altruistic from emblems to bloodpoints to a good experience even. Good killers don't need to know the hooked survivor's status to do well. It's only killers who are less skilled that use the information.
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Yes; that would be camping. It is the prevention of a save off a hook through the defensive strategy of standing near the hooked survivor. Most killers will start to leave the hook if the timer is low enough and there is not enough time for a survivor to run in and save. It’s a small change to require more investment, albeit amall, to camping.@DeadByFlashlight said:@Kind_Lemon said:
DeadByFlashlight said:@Kind_Lemon said:
A balance change to reduce choice camping would be to not let the killer know how much longer the survivor has on the hook before they die. That would mean a greater chance for unpredictability in survivors in situations where the survivors aren't experts at chase, and the killer is dominating the hook game.
Tell me why the community members agree or disagree.
How does this affect camping at all?
I mean camping literally means that the killer chills next to the survivor until he dies, how does it matter AT ALL whether he sees a timer runing or not?
The timer is actually only useful for killers that DONT camp. Take that away and you will see probably evne more campers
It affects the optimization of camping, making it harder. A killer can’t just leave when there is a fraction more bar left, looking around for unhookers that might be running in last second; they have to wait until they see the survivor stabbed with spikes. That gives roughly 10 extra seconds at the end of a sacrifice for survivors who aren’t in comms to make up for their inefficiency during that time.
I dont think you know what "camping" actually means and I believe you are talking about "patroling" actually.
A killer that camps doesnt move away from teh hook anyway and doesnt give a [BAD WORD] about any timer until the survivor is dead^^
All I want is for the killer to have less time to catch other survivors if the killer camps. -
It affects the optimization of camping, making it harder. A killer can’t just leave when there is a fraction more bar left, looking around for unhookers that might be running in last second; they have to wait until they see the survivor stabbed with spikes. That gives roughly 10 extra seconds at the end of a sacrifice for survivors who aren’t in comms to make up for their inefficiency during that time.DeadByFlashlight said:@Kind_Lemon said:
A balance change to reduce choice camping would be to not let the killer know how much longer the survivor has on the hook before they die. That would mean a greater chance for unpredictability in survivors in situations where the survivors aren't experts at chase, and the killer is dominating the hook game.Tell me why the community members agree or disagree.
How does this affect camping at all?
I mean camping literally means that the killer chills next to the survivor until he dies, how does it matter AT ALL whether he sees a timer runing or not?The timer is actually only useful for killers that DONT camp. Take that away and you will see probably evne more campers
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Wow; cool! There was more disagreement than I thought there was going to be.
Here’s a hypothetical example of the proposed measure in action:
A Leatherface is tightly patrolling around a survivor and wants to make sure that survivor dies. The change doesn’t affect this scenario much because the killer can visually see the time left on the bar and his strategy doesn’t change except for the very end when Leatherface stays a few seconds longer around the hook before he realizes the survivor is dead.
However, not knowing hook phases for the killer matters more against a Spirit who checks back at the halfway mark and juat before the survivor is dead. Those two times are the optimal times for aurvivors to save because it maximizes the time each survivor spends on a hook. If the survivors insta-save, the spirit can down the injured one and waste about 50 seconds of hook time. If the spirit can make sure the survivors don’t save before the second state, that also gives her about 50 extra seconds. This aspect of the game is more pivotal than people give it credit for. The altruism part of the game is always painful for me, and having killers that don’t optimize in their anti-save capacity makes the game less frustrating.
It’s not a nerf to killers who let survivors unhook each other while it makes choice camping require more attention and thought. To me, it seems like a change for a better game.
What are your counter-examples?
Note: I would rather saves reduce the time left by 1/3 of the entire bar instead of having the weird 50% stuff there is now, but this would require more work. -
@Bravo0413 said:
Relax the event isnt even put yet what the hell? You don't know if its going to be difficult or not... you only know it's a rumor... breathe... if survivors lose nectar there must be a reason.... I mean heaven forbid there is a punishment for dyingThe punishment for dying should be not getting the bloodpoints for surviving. It should be a good horror experience either way. It's not.
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I used to like being stealthy. Now I don't because being stealthy all game won't keep other survivors alive who keep you alive, and stealthiness is too punishing when it doesn't pay off in full. My preferred version of stealth would be to let the killer know I'm around, but not engage in chase. Eg. a broken twig, a lock of hair, etc. That would be my dream come true. But that's not one of the one and a half ways survivors can play.
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Please just make him more interesting. Go ahead and add some custom music while you're at it.
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He's weak and I hate playing against him. Like Freddy, but the distaste is not as strong.
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If I die as a survivor, I want to feel as if I had a good, horror experience. I never have except on two occasions. Ever. And it's "Yay, I lived" not "Yay, we lived".
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I refer you the post below for an idea for a buff to Thanataphobia that doesn’t just involve small percentages.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/21992/thanatophobia-reworks-youd-like-to-see#latest
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I would prefer a change such as the following:
Hope
-each time a generator is completed, gain a stack up to 4 stacks
-each stack increases movement speed by 1/1.5/2 %
-Hope will deactivate 120 seconds after both Exit Gates have been opened
Yes, I know that it gets a 1% boost in speed at tier 3. -
With the change where her power can be heard, it would be nice if her terror radius was reverted to normal.
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@powerbats said:
@DarkWo1f997 said:
powerbats said:@DarkWo1f997 said:
What I feel is a much better solution.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/16907/injured-state#latest
This was already addressed in your other thread where you got much more detailed feedback about injured states.
True but I didn’t have all the balance changes included in the original post. I feel the first one is the better version and I really hope the devs see it at some point.
True and I forgot to add in that you could link to the prior post and say this was the original idea and the feedback has been incorporated into this thread.
What do these posts have to do with the proposed rework?
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It was expected by the developers that The Doctor was going to break stealth and the game/meta when he was introduced. They didn’t realize how strong looping was, and that made him significantly less viable. Therefore, he was never really balanced around stealth because for most players, stealth didn’t matter. The stalth-countering part of his power consequently does not scale with hours played and the rank of survivors. It’s unfortunate, but stealth at low ranks isn’t interesting enough to be important enough for consideration by the developers.
I wish you the best of luck in improvement! -
I second this
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The qualm I have with the Nurse's lunge is that it feels as if the lunge appears before the Nurse. I just want the Nurse to look like she's in her final teleport spot a smidgen before she actually is to compensate.
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@Kalec84 said:
Leave it as it is, but add "dead" to the affected statusThis was how the original perk was, and then because of its steamroll potential with no counter, "dead" was removed from the penalty decider.
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This should happen, yeah, but I would like to see the Pig's ambush attack put a reverse bear trap on a survivor before they are downed. Having an RBT put on your head after being downed is insult to injury and it feels bad, especially if The Pig decides that they really want to sacrifice you first.
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I wish for better on-the-hook music. I end up grumpy because there is nothing else to pay attention to while on the hook. If the music was better, I would probably be more engaged.
In terms of balance, the struggle phase should occupy 1/3 of the hook progress and not 1/2 if only to help bridge the gap between being two-hooked and three-hooked, which is a tremendous gap.
P.S.
This would probably never happen, but if the hook music was some epic orchestration, the button mashing should definitely be required to be on the beat in order to survive. -
Yes, this is what happens. It's the same as when being hit on a generator or an exit gate; basically everything but vaults is cancelled by damage.
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O.M.G. I love it! XD
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All of the above sound pretty amazing except for the healing one. The only issue I have is that madness II is currently too easy to get into, and having all of these effects apply in the early game is probably both oppressive and daunting. Therefore, madness should become harder to apply but yeild a greater reward.
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Being able to permanently close the hatch is silly —So is being able to slug the second to last survivor to prevent a hatch escape. However, the hatch shouldn’t open automatically either; the hatch should require a 10 second initial animation to attempt to pry it open which has the ability to fail. Each subsequent try would be shorter, as in a 5 second animation. All tries would be affected by luck perks and luck offerings.
Voila, another use for the mechanic of luck has been proposed. -
By low rank you mean low numbers like 1-5?dogepoop said:@Kind_Lemon said:
A solution to make skill checks require more attention without being harder to hit is to have the skill check appear on the model of the generator and not in the center of the survivor’s screen if they are looking away. Survivors would then have to look back at the generator to complete the skill check.Lol, just give the killers free grab ? Never gonna happen thats some low rank bullshit
Additionally, if you are being grabbed off of a generator, why did you not A) leave when you heard the heartbeat, B ) not listen out for footsteps or breathing, and C) not look around for a Myers or Pig? You quite honestly deserved to be grabbed if you weren’t being observant.
There’s a skill check notification sound that would let you know when it’s time to pay attention to the generator again and not your surroundings, so there’s no reason to be staring at the gen the whole time?
The idea of the proposed skill check change is that it splits your attention and makes doing objectives more stressful, which should have already been the case.
I’m honestly interested in why you said what you said.
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The part of the game I find lacks any horror is when being slugged or farmed. There is no creepy music, and agency does not exist. That’s not scary.
Freddy also isn’t scary because he clearly has no emotions because he has no facial expressions. In addition, hid lunge animation is strange, and he isn’t imposing whatsoever.
A side note:
The devs should give more worth to sound in this game. Horror can’t be horror without it. -
A solution to make skill checks require more attention without being harder to hit is to have the skill check appear on the model of the generator and not in the center of the survivor’s screen if they are looking away. Survivors would then have to look back at the generator to complete the skill check.
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Bloodhound is decent if you don’t have anything better and have issues with tracking survivors.
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I agree that the animation is terrible even though the hit is legitimate. The killer cannot be moved through the window to finish the way the animation is meant to be finished. I wish lunges actually appeared to be lunges with the weapon and not the mess they are now.
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I think it’s the best choice.luvcraft said:@Kind_Lemon said:
"Vulnerable" would be a much better name.yeah, Vulnerable would also be good.
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It doesn’t except for the fact that if it was buffed, it would make that survivor much more powerful late game and consequently more of a sensible target early game.CoolAKn said:Sole Survivor doesn't really have any business being an obsession perk.
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This would be hard to do, but super cool.
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Thank you for supporting my idea.projecteulogy said:I feel like this would also combat slugging, which for me is more annoying than being camped. i can at least get struggle points when im camped lol
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Wow. That’s quite a bit of time investments and bloodpoints. I only wanted to say that 1million BP gets between 45 and 46 levels and not the whole 50, which makes the grind that much worse.
To change this, I would like to see bloodwebs be the way to unlock the first tier of every perk, but require a separate upgrade system for the tiers of perks. This would also allow for Ultra-Rare and Common rarities for perks to return for the people who want them.
I dislike how teachables work right now, and I would rather teachables have another criteria that must be fulfilled before appearing on the web. Good criteria would include using the perk at least 4 times in a build on the character it is being taught from before it can appear, or require the adept achievement to be met before the perks are made available. -
DexyIV said:
Nah. This would make an already tunneling meta even worse. Killers would just go after one person who would become more vulnerable with each hook (since the vault speed would be reduced as well). ESPECIALLY if it were to be just an innate feature. Sloppy Butcher and slugging during the mid game with Thanatophobia is a perfectly good combination imo. I see no reason to change itNickenzie said:This should be built-in to the game and not be a perk so every killer would have a incentive to go after more survivors!
Great idea!I don't think that my suggested rework should be base game (even though I do think that there should be something, but that's not for this discussion). The reason that this would be a good rework to decrease tunnelling early and mid-game is because survivors are affected by Thanatophobia only if they have been hooked before, which doesn't happpen to multiple survivors in the early game in the case of tunneling.
If a killer were to tunnel, other survivors would be just as unaffected as they were before. In fact, survivors would be more efficient than with the current version of Thanatophobia in the early part of the game because they haven't been hooked themselves yet. Therefore, if the killer wants to apply the penalty to generator regression, that killer would have to let the hooked survivor go and find a different survivor. If the killer did not make that decision, tunneling would only be as effective as it is now, aside from decreased vault speed. If vault speed is then the only possible cause of increased tunneling, then the penalty to vaults can be removed.
I had put decreased vault speed in the perk rework to begin with in order to give an incentive to the killer to hinder all survivors in chase late game rather than to tunnel one survivor more efficiently. I now see how this would not work as intended.
In regards to camping, it is to the killer's benefit to let survivors off the hook before they reach struggle phase since Thanatophobia only stacks on hooks and not on sacrifice phases, much like Huntress' Lullaby. Both tunneling and camping are deincentivized by the reworked Thanatophobia.
I lastly am responding to your comment on slugging. Slugging is a terrible-to-play-against tactic in my opinion if solely because the music ins't tense when a survivor is downed, so it takes the stress out of the exprience and makes the experience of not having any agency more boring than it already is. My proposed change to Thanatophobia would not combo well with early game slugging, which is a good change.
Going slightly off topic, the effects of Sloppy Butcher should be negated by medkit use because right now, Sloppy Butcher feels like a Very Rare perk instead of just a Rare perk. Medkit usage is also not as supported as it should be in gameplay.
Thanatophobia, which does little in gameplay currently and does not have much to do with its name, is completely outclassed by my reworked Thanatophobia which would not only see more effect on gameplay but also tries to discourage tactics that often remove players from the survivor experience such as camping and tunneling in excess.
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@OrionQc24 said:
@Kind_Lemon said:
I like to think the campfire exists under its own rules that even The Entity can't control. The Entity being the Warden in this example and the campfire being the embodiment of the prison.So the "realm" would be created by the hopes and despair of both the survivors and the killers? It could explain why the maps all have exit gates.
The realm cannot exist without the thoughts and memories of the survivors and killers. All The Entity can do is play with those memories to create different locations and scenarios where trials occur. The Campfire seems to not be from a memory of anyone, so either it's a memory of The Entity's or a creation that is independent of everything else, perhaps to the point of being the place where the realm exists, much like where the internet is stored, for example.
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I like to think the campfire exists under its own rules that even The Entity can't control. The Entity being the Warden in this example and the campfire being the embodiment of the prison.
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@tehshadowman33 said:
Yesssssssssssssssssssss, be like that chainsaw guy from Zombies Ate my Neighbors.Seriously though, we need this.
Haddonfield vs. New Map.... Which is more cluttered? LOL.
I hadn't even thought of that zombie, but that makes me want walk-through hedges even more XD.
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Haddonfield would be godly if killers, and only killers, could push their way through the hedges at reduced movement speed. That would be a really cool mechanic, and probably balance out a lot of loops, which would allow for more windows to be open on that map again
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This is similar to Rancor, and doesn’t seem that interesting to play against as a survivor. Why not ask for reduced movement speed from everyone (survivors and killers) once the gates are open so that there are less mad dashes across the entire map in short amounts of time. It’s times like those that survivors should be given more tools to help them escape a chase, requiring them to avoid the killer in order to escape rather than simply run in a straight line when the killer has no chance to catch up.
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FOV changes can be hard to deal with and result in a lot of missed attacks as killer by me. The developers don’t want to do multiple passes for lighting on the same map, so Shadowborn won’t get the vision boost back. I would like Shadowborn to clear mist instead. Accompanied with that, I would love a mist 2.0 update where mist lessens vision of the map as well as muffling sounds like the heartbeat the more mist there is.
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I would appreciate if the lunge animation looked more like a lunge with the weapon and less of a burst of speed to the body that’s holding the weapon like a feather duster and somehow hits you aross a window. The hits should land, yes, but the animation should reflect that more.
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I personally feel as if The Pig was a missed opportunity in game design. I hate playing against her because with a trap on your head, it is the same old pains you have to deal with accompanied by normal killers added to a mandatory extra objective. The only time I have ever had fun against a Pig and didn’t survive was when I had to make a choice between attempting to get the trap off my head at a box across the map possibly near The Pig and saving a a Claudette on the hook in the other direction. I chose the Claudette, and the instant she came off the hook, I dropped my medkit for her and my trap popped. As I died, I realized the hatch was 5 meters away. It was a really satisfying end to the game for me. I personally wish that The Pig didn’t use hooks at all, had Rules Set No. 2 built in, could set traps on people yhrough a successful ambush attack, and had a different criteria for starting the traps’ timers. She could have been so much better than she is now.
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That was a cool video; answers my questions as to why survivors complain so much about looping being somewhat less effective.
For Obsession Perk Reworks:
Perk Buffs:
Sole Survivor - I would run it almost every game because of its potential if the activation/way the numbers scaled was slightly different. Below is what I would do with it:
Sole Survivor- _Reduces the range at which killers can view your aura by 6/8/10 meters
- Start the trial with 4 tokens
- Each token doubles the range at which the killer is unable to see your aura
- Every healthy, injured, or dying survivor temporarily removes 1 token.
- Considerably increases the chance to be the killer's Obsession._
Reasoning: The Sole Survivor I have put forth is infinitely better if only because of two things. The first is that in case of a DC, sole survivor will increase in power whereas now it does not. The second is that if a survivor is hooked and the killer looks around for auras shown by bbq, a Sole Survivor would count that hooked survivor as not "healthy, injured, or dying" and increase the perk range to help counter bbq and chilli. This rework also covers OoO, which it should. I would still like immnity when all survivors are dead with tier three of the perk, but that requires more complicated code probably.
PWYF - I would always run this perk on hag if only to surprise survivors with super speed. The same goes for huntress. I cannot do this on huntress because of the amount of offensive actions I take and miss. It's just not worth it on hag.
Play With Your Food- _You become obsessed with one survivor
- Every time you engage in a 20 second or more chase with the obsession and let them go, you gain a token up to a max of 5/5/6 tokens
- Each token grants 2/3/3 additional movement speed
- Each time the obsession is downed, you lose all tokens_
Reasoning
The perk would no longer be hard countered by self care when playing a hit and run style of gameplay. PWYF no longer results in such a noticeable change in speed; this keeps survivors from catching on too soon, and it makes for a smoother killer experience. Injuring survivors, but letting them heal can also be seen as playing, so I don't think this goes against the spirit or name of the perk.Not a buff:
Decisive Strike - it's an extremely good perk that is infuriating to play against because of the time it can give to all survivors to completing objectives.
Decisive Strike- _When in the killer's grasp and underneath a pallet, press the activate ability button to throw down the pallet and free yourself. This ability has a 60/80/90 % chance to succeed and will not activate if you are captured by the killer underneath a pallet. This ability can be used more than once and is affected by luck.
- If not the obsession, this ability activates only once there are 3/2/2 other survivors dead
- Considerably increases the chance of being the killer's Obsession_
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I was not aware of a range outside of the normal loud noise notification range. When did a range happen for THOTH?
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The only time that I have ever seen it was during the ptb when I hit an object while carrying someone. (I ended up letting two people off of my shoulder to watch it happen a bunch more times).
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When I first saw the notification, I thought it mean that something was now known that wasn't before. Exposed is the participle, meaning a change in placement which could consequently lead to vulnerability, but vulnerable is the static state that the effect should be called.
@apropos said:
That's one of the meanings of the word, though. You might be mostly familiar with it's use as a term to describe exposing something visually, but even then, that simply means you're exposing something to light, where it can be seen - everything you see is nothing more than light that is being reflected onto your retina.
More commonly, the word is used to describe something that is subject to change, due to it's interaction with what it's exposed to, and therefore vulnerable to it. Go outside in the snow without a jacket? you're exposed to the elements.
Look at it this way, now you know that there's another way to use the word exposed.
I had a longer post that was deleted because the draft corrupted
Edit: But now there are two posts, and I think I can't delete either one? -
When I first saw this pop up on screen, I thought it means that the killer's power was "Exposed!", and that all survivors now knew something that they hadn't before (like NOED was active, that the killer had Devour Hope, etc.). Exposed shouldn't be the name of the one-hit down effect, but rather the notification that the status effect has occurred. It's a possibility that the developers were planning to do that and then encountered technical difficulties or simply gave up and thought that the way it was was good enough.
@apropos said:
That's one of the meanings of the word, though. You might be mostly familiar with it's use as a term to describe exposing something visually, but even then, that simply means you're exposing something to light, where it can be seen - everything you see is nothing more than light that is being reflected onto your retina.
More commonly, the word is used to describe something that is subject to change, due to it's interaction with what it's exposed to, and therefore vulnerable to it. Go outside in the snow without a jacket? you're exposed to the elements.
Look at it this way, now you know that there's another way to use the word exposed.
I consider your definition incorrect as Exposed is used to describe the action which led to the possibility of vulnerability and not the state of whatever noun is being referenced is in. Exposed is a participle whereas vulnerable is an adjective, so frankly Vulnerable should take priority if it is a state of being rather than a notification of a change. In other words, Vulnerable is a better title/name for that status effect because *Exposed** doesn't make sense.
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In response to the original post:
While I completely agree on the power of self-care as a time saver to the extreme for survivors, I do not think that self-care's healing speed should be nerfed, although that would be the easy solution. Instead, I would rather the devs implement a new status effect, much like they did with blood lust, where self-caring without a med-kit gives the bloody hands status, which slows down all actions and decreases all skill check zones until either 60 seconds of consecutive actions have been acomplished, or that survivor has either used or been heald by a medkit.
A side note on Small Game: This perk should be changed to show the auras of traps and totems within 8 meters while in a chase. Small Game should be more useful against Hag and Trapper (I've run into more traps due to small game because I thought the ding was for the totem right next to me and not the trap in front of me).
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Survivor: Autohaven Wreckers: Wreckers' Yard
Killer: Red Forest; Coldwind Farm (bc corn blindness)