HerInfernalMajesty
HerInfernalMajesty
About
- Username
- HerInfernalMajesty
- Joined
- Visits
- 0
- Last Active
- —
Comments
-
@UndeddJester said:
I recently came to my epiphany about how DBD worked, and that is that survivors are NOT a team. They are 4 players who individually trying to survive, but also rely on each other. This is reflected in the bloodpoints reward system, the grading system and the store page itself.
I've maintained for a while that MMR is working as expected in line with what the community asked for (Prioritise queue times over accurate matchmaking hurts me every time... what did we think would happen?).
Hens did this video on MMR yesterday and he nailed it, and highlighted the same thing. Survivors are NOT a team as far as MMR is concerned. I recommend watching the whole thing, but 1:48 and 5:10 stand out for the point.
https://youtu.be/ZhYciabFkLE?si=C1cjV9VR3_fuvbUC
This is the disparity I think a lot of people have, made worse by the existence of SWF where suddenly the survivors actually are a team, and this creates a disparity in how the game plays out.
So now we have a Theme problem...
Games can create crazy and fantastic scenarios that puts a player in a world they'd never have experienced in real life. The world is a horror setting, one where you are tasked with the goal to escape. From the Steam page:
Real People, Real Fear - The procedural levels and real human reactions to pure horror makes each game session an unexpected scenario. You will never be able to tell how it’s going to turn out.
The theme of Dead by Daylight is a horror one... one where everyone is trying to escape, and in those scenarios, you can never truly trust someone else to save you, you have to save yourself.
True to life, if you're a hero, and sacrifice yourself to save 3 other people... your reward is that you lose... in real life, you'd be dead... this is the horror theme of the game.
I personally like the theme a lot, and would lament its loss... the acquisition of Michael Myers kickstarted this game into the Juggernaut it became, and thematically Myers is one of the most accurate adaptions of any killer in the game... with that in mind...
Sacrifice Theme for Gameplay?
It is undeniable that another reason DBD has taken off is the mechanics are rewarding and fun. The skill ceiling is very high, and the DBD Iceberg is rich and rewarding to crack.
To resolve a lot of the ills of the community, particularly regarding skill expression, the gameplay of DBD needs to be altered to make it a true 4vs1. The survivors need to be changed so they actually ARE a team and are rewarded for working together and being skillful.
The problem is without the theme... this basically makes DBD a glorified game of virtual tag. People talk all the time about how killers aren't scary anymore... and they're right... Myers once again demonstrates this, as despite being one of the best thematic killers, is also one of the weakest killers in the game in terms of skill expression, relying on exploiting a particular insanely overpowered add-on.
How do you maintain fear of the killer, if you completely remove the theme and focus entirely on skill expression? Following after the killer to mess with them, slapping killers with pallets, blinding with flashlights, being aggressive and looping them for 3 generators makes them look weak, and kinda funny... not the horrifying monsters they are supposed to be. These aggressive high skill play styles absolutely dent the theme... but still at least is offset by the fact the hero is punished.
So you can't please everyone
Some players love the theme... some players love the skill expression.
For the theme side, people don't want the killer to play super efficiently, with tunneling, camping and cheap strats to bulldoze a win. People want the killer to follow the theme and try to chase, hook and inflict as much "pain" as possible before sacrificing survivors. This doesn't work if Survivors are a team not interested in their own survival, but embracing the theme comes with the cost of having rats survive often.
At the same time people want it to be a skill game, where they gets chances to outplay and make impressive moves. If everyone is doing this, hunting/baiting the killer, pulling them without fear and being willing to die for the team, as that is still a survivor win, then you force killer into playing for kills, so you kill the rats but at the expense of actively punishing a more thematic killer playstyle more than it already is.
We all know that highly organised SWFs give killers a really hard time... and I suppose the question is, do we all genuinely want to be forced towards that style of play?
Personally I want the theme to win out no matter what changes it brings.
-
😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱😱 This is INSANE!!!!!!! 😱😱
Btw thank you sooo sooo much for documenting this and keeping it in one place for all of us! 😊😊😊
-
A guilty pleasure of mine is making the game difficult for the Killer.
Love the loadout. My David is the Survivor I use to run builds that make the Killer angry 😂
-
@Seraphor said:
I actually ran Boil Over on Hawkins yesterday and tried this exact thing.
There were 3 hooks within Boil Over range, including one up the stairs right next to the railing.
Shh! Don’t tell them the secrets! (jk) Boil over on Hawkins actually sounds like a really fun time as a Survivor.
Sorry for the frustration though.
-
I have so many different builds but I am going to make a build for Kate soon.
It will be: Dance with Me, Quick & Quiet, Lithe, and Lightweight.
Now you see me, now you don’t 😎
-
Love him. I just wish I had the option to toggle his voice on when playing other Survivors or Killer.
-
It’s fixed now!
-
Thank you!
-
@sharpef3rn said:
Why was this event tome so short? Like 7 days and that's it. A one part event that has exclusive banners and badges, 2 extremely limited things at the moment. Like I was literally gone for a week and missed the entire tome. When I logged on this morning I had 1 hour to complete it and the first challenge I only got 1/10th of the way through. I also apparently missed the new year banner and badge deadline. Like why were these so much shorter than all the other events and things. You can still get pride charms 6 months later (which is great I love that) but its less than a week after the new year and I can't get the banner or charm anymore. This just makes me sad for all the times I finish a chapter or tome early and play so many games without a challenge but because I literally was gone for a week I miss this entire segment. I am not super upset about missing the new game mode but having to deal with those jumpscare snowmen for 2 months and this event lasting so short when its completely optional just is upsetting to me.
A new year banner and badge icon?
-
@jonifire said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3649471#Comment_3649471
It‘s a different one
Thank you 🙏
-
Does anyone know if the forum account is the same or different from a Behavior account???
-
I thought something was wrong with my account!
-
I don’t use the auto purchase because I like getting the rarest stuff first. I wish there was a bloodweb store.
-
@Seraphor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3649094#Comment_3649094
I think it's fair. If there's only one gen left then the survivors haven't been struggling and the killer has likely not been tunneling, at that point, the killer shouldn't be penalised for a sacrifice.
It's self-limiting for both sides. If one side 'wins too much' (tunneling or genrushing) then the other side gets a repreive/bonus, which only lasts until the game 'levels out' again.
Gotcha. Like a catch-up mechanic. I would definitely be willing to try it. It’s a lot better than the 2 Survivor problem we have right now. I like it!
-
@xEa said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3649070#Comment_3649070
When it comes to 2nd hook vs first kill my reasoning is that if Survivors start with a penalty to repair speed; be it 25% or even as low as 5%, if all four are alive most of the match because the Killer is going for the 8 hook then the penalty should be doing its job and they should still make adequate progress.
I mean, like i said before, it depends a lot on how much of a penalty we are talking here. Lets say we use penalty before someone is killed off, it would like like this: 25% would be way to much, survivor wont stand a chance. 5%? Not enough penalty to shake up the meta. 10% probably a decent amount.
I see however where you are going with the 2nd hook idea. First, is it the 2nd hook of the game? Or is it the first 2nd hook for a Survivor? Let me know where I get it wrong.
Second hook on the same survivor.
If you mean a Survivor’s second hook: All Survivors start with a penalty to gen speed. Once one Survivor reaches their second hook, then the game goes back to normal dbd rates. Once someone is killed then the repair speed goes up. So the best way for the Killer to get value out of this is to hook everyone once then start another round of hooks until 8 hooks are achieved then go for kills.
Kinda like that. At least this would be encouraging killer to go out of their way and not tunnel.
I guess both versions are a (in my opinion) a decent step into the right direction. Early game genrush is annoying for killer, getting tunneled is annoying for survivors. I dont see a better option then evening out the game a little bit for both sides while also fixing tunneling. some argue that killers will still tunnel, but then they will simply loose. And i also argue back, that tunneling is done by people who want to win, so they use the optimal strategy.
Last but not least, the only real issue i see with both versions is that slugging will become more popular.
I really like your idea the more that I think about it.
Slugging would increase… But the silver lining is that more slug perks would have their time to shine. I’d love to see wglf used more. Also, at least with being slugged there are options to still win.
But slugging is slugging… and at least with being tunneled you can hop into a different lobby. When you’re slugged you have to wait it out at the worst of times…
Idk, I would be willing to make that trade-off I think.
-
@Seraphor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3649058#Comment_3649058
Precisely why in my first post, I suggest it should be a system that scales with both kills and gens. This dampens the snowball effect for either side, and doesn't take victories away from the killer if they're valid victories.
So if there were only two Survivors left then the last gen would be normal speed. It’s a little tough imo but I’d be willing to try it.
The only criticism I can give it is that maybe the system could feel too convoluted at first. But I think people would catch on. The trial gets more difficult as Survivors progress with some small relief after a Survivor dies.
-
@xEa said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3649036#Comment_3649036
For ballance reasons.
Lets assume there is a 25% penalty before one person is dead, this would make it almost impossible for survivors to win. Tunneling is not the only viable strategy, in fact i win most of my games with hooking survivors and then pressure gens.
AKA creating the cycle where only 1 survivor is usually on a gen while the others are either on the hook, rescuing or getting chased.
If i have to go with my gut feeling, it has to be either no penalty or slight buff for survivors once 2nd hook stage is in play.
I see. Thank you for replying.
I personally have different thoughts but I respect yours.
For me, it’s hard to use gameplay style to determine what is and isn’t adequate since the MMR will eventually put you as the Killer into a position where your play style is good enough. Again not to disprove your experiences, I am just of a different mind.
When it comes to 2nd hook vs first kill my reasoning is that if Survivors start with a penalty to repair speed; be it 25% or even as low as 5%, if all four are alive most of the match because the Killer is going for the 8 hook then the penalty should be doing its job and they should still make adequate progress.
I see however where you are going with the 2nd hook idea. First, is it the 2nd hook of the game? Or is it the first 2nd hook for a Survivor? Let me know where I get it wrong.
If you mean a Survivor’s second hook: All Survivors start with a penalty to gen speed. Once one Survivor reaches their second hook, then the game goes back to normal dbd rates. Once someone is killed then the repair speed goes up. So the best way for the Killer to get value out of this is to hook everyone once then start another round of hooks until 8 hooks are achieved then go for kills.
If you mean the 2nd hook of the match: The Killer has a small window of slower gen speeds. If the Killer double hooks one Survivor then they eliminate the penalty, it goes back to normal dbd rates. The Killer is then one hook away from making gen speeds faster. If the Killer hooks two different Survivors then the game goes back to normal dbd rates. And the Killer can now spread hooks making use of their early time given from the penalty. Did I get that right?
Thank you again graciously for taking the time to flesh this idea out.
-
@Seraphor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3648914#Comment_3648914
What sense does it make that if you manage to kill 2 survivors, you should be given the last 2 kills for no effort?
You haven't killed 4 survivors, you've killed 2, 2 out of 4.
This is like survivors powering the exit gates after 2 gens if they get repaired fast enough.
This snowball effect isn't something survivors have access to, and is solely what makes tunneling so effective. You've ended the game early for one or two survivors, and then damned the remaining survivors to a hatch game or worsen before the games even really begun.
Tunnelling should remain a valid choice for the killer but it shouldn't be the single best option, and scaling objective speeds based on eliminated players is a way of modulating that, and fine tuning the single variable that makes tunneling ridiculously over-rewarding.
Thank you for putting down what I was trying to convey. It really does feel off that a 2K is pretty much a 3-4K.
I mean I get the argument that if the team played well and there is only one generator left then the two have more of a chance to escape vs if they have to complete three gens because the team didn’t play well.
But like you said it still doesn’t make sense that a 2K translates to a 3-4K. I mean I suppose the answer is that it translates to a 3-4K if the team played bad which I can see as valid. But idk… I keep going back and forth with this one.
In my eyes I see every kill as making the game smaller. So when two Survivors are left the game becomes a mini trial between the last three players: The two Survivors and one Killer. I mean it’s kind of like that when there’s only one Survivor left and the hatch just got closed.
Idk, I get where everyone is coming from. I just wish a 2K wasn’t mostly an automatic loss for individual Survivors.
-
@BubbaDredge said:
I disagree. 2 of us left at 3 gens, if we play smart and careful we have a good shot.
I'm not very good, either, I still miss skill checks and can't get out of a chase, pretty new to survivor. As a longtime killer, I thought there would be lots of "it's hopeless now, how do we make the most of it?" but that's not been my survivor experience. Most the time those gens ain't cold, if 2 of them are halfway done, you're on easy-street.
I hide and do gens, that's all I'm ok at, put me with another player like me and we can do 3, maybe 4 gens while the killer runs back and forth trying to see us. Put me with a powerhouse Steve that does nothing but keep the killer busy, that works, too. Those both happened last night.
I had a God-awful one where no gens were done when we started dying, it was Legion and no one could get anything done. 2 of us got out, though, because the constant trying to work gens had most of them close to finished. I was tempted to kill myself on hook during that one, glad I didn't.
It's a challenge, but you'll win more if you just refuse to give up. More rolls of the dice, once you're doomed, you can be more heroic.
That’s amazing. I hardly ever see that in my games but I do believe you. It’s too bad it’s not more common in my personal experience.
-
@I_Tunnel said:
I don't like the idea because the Killer STARTS at a disadvantage; He can only be in 1 place, while Survivors can be in up to 4 places at once.
This idea basically removes the entire point of the Killer getting hooks and kills; His momentum being built.
Now, instead of slowing down gen speeds by causing Survivors to do other things; They either get faster, or break even (Depending on the speed buff via this idea) for the Survivors still doing gens.
It misses the point that the Killer is supposed to build momentum by hooking survivors, and instead takes all that momentum away by removing the slowdown from Survivors as they are hooked/dead.
Survivors should not get a 'reward' or 'buff' just because they are starting to lose the match, which is what this idea does.
I agree with you overall after seeing everyone’s thoughts. I even think you're technically right.
I mean I guess the consensus is that if at 2K there’s still 2-3 plus generators left there’s really not much the remaining two can do, they should have “played better”. Which of course leads to MMR and how often it creates teams where the more skilled Survivor has to carry the least skilled Survivor.
Idk, anyways as with everyone else in this thread thank you very much for entertaining the idea and participating. It’s nice understanding why some ideas are/aren’t reasonable enough to implement.
-
@xEa said:
Thank you for the credit.
There is one missunderstanding with my original idea
The only reason I deviate from hooks is because it would feel awful to get 8 hooks and gen speeds are too fast.
Not quite. The repairspeed would not be faster after 8 hooks (if even by maybe 5%), it would only disable the penalty of repair speed.
My idea was basically the same with some ballance tweaks and in my opinion the only way a system like this could work. Otherwise it would be to oppresive for killer.
Like i mentioned in the thread, survviors have to start with a repair speed penalty, which gets removed after a survivor is hooked a second time. I think this is absolutly essential.
Eventually, when a survivor is killed off, repair speed has to increase tremendously.
The game would still be very even, but it basically forces killer to spread hooks. Tunneling and killing off a survivor would not be nearly as effectiv as it is right now.
On the other side, there is no early game gen rush, so the killer is in no stress at all. They are actually dictating in which scenario they want to live in. Tunnel and get gensrushed in mid/late game or spread hooks and dont tunnel.
Like some people mentioned (for example @Xernoton ) it has some potential issues. For example slugging will become more popular. But to be fair, slugging is not nearly as effective as tunneling, but when survivors are having the penaltiy, it might become very oppressive indeed. Hard to tell how ballanced this would be, but it would definitly lead to slug meta and eventally slug perks getting nerfed.
IF we follow the idea of a repair speed boost ONLY after one survivor is killed, it hast to be a minor boost. For example 5% penalty before first survivor is dead and increased repair speed by 5% after the first one is killer.
I keep trying to understand why would the penalty be removed at the 2nd hook when there would still be four survivors left? Why not once one is eliminated?
-
@CammyChameleon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3648375#Comment_3648375
If the killer is getting two kills though they've earned that, it's not broken, just the survivors didn't play well enough.
Punishing either side for doing the objective is bad imo.
Yeah for sure I see that. It’s crazy how easy it is to sink the Survivor ship and how few Survivors catch on and learn to play as a team.
-
@GrimReaperJr1232 said:
I strongly dislike this idea.
Firstly, in terms of "feel goodness," it feels awful as killer. You're winning, but you're punished for it. Yes, obviously dying feels bad as a survivor but that's not the point. The killer accomplished their goal but now has a punishment. It just feels bad.
Second, part of playing survivor is protecting your teammates. Take the aggro for someone dead on hook, have that person keep low, and generally do whatever it takes to keep them alive because a teammate that's hiding and not taking risks is still better than someone that's dead. Now, that entire dynamic gets thrown out the window. Doesn't really encourage fun or interactive gameplay, if anything, it discourages it since someone dying makes repairs faster and any rescue/ save attempt is risky.
I’ve acknowledged your first point in a comment to @RpTheHotrod . And I can see and agree with the point being made.
Your second point is one that I haven’t considered. You’re right. Survivors should be forcing the Killer to spread hooks as much as possible by taking protection hits etc.
I decided to write this post because it doesn’t feel right that the game is mostly over at 2 kills. That’s the Survivor side of my brain. But if I’m being fair but tough to the Survivor side, Survivors absolutely throw themselves unnecessarily at the Killer. Survivors play with such little patience that it loses them the game. People don’t take aggro or protection hits too often. The thing is that it feels awful when you do those things and still lose because your teammates don’t understand. And that will always be the case, hence where my mindset was at when created this post.
But you’re right, if the Survivors want to win, they have to play smart. And I see how my proposal circumvented that. You can see where I was coming from though right?
Overall you’re right. It takes agency away from the team and makes it too punishing for the Killer. I just wish there was something two survivors could do when their other two teammates are eliminated. The answer is, spread hooks and don’t die in the first place right? But it still feels so weird that a 2K is pretty much a forecasted loss. Idk why it feels so bad but it does.
-
@RpTheHotrod said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3648375#Comment_3648375
In that case, the killer won. Survivors failed. Why give them a catch up mechanic? Why bother even playing killer and doing the objective if it makes no difference in the endgame? If you kill 2, survivors get super speed and knock gens out fast. If you don't kill, survivors get super speed in numbers and knock out gens fast.
Yeah I see where you are coming from. It’s like no progress is being made for the Killer and they are just spinning their wheels in the mud.
I guess it really comes down to how the game really is, is it a 4v1 or a 1v1v1v1v1? Because if the Killer kills 2 as a 4v1 then yeah, the game is pretty much over. But if it’s the 1v1v1v1v1 then it feels like every kill should make the game a smaller microcosm.
Regardless, it just feels like a huge waste of time on the Survivor side when half the team being eliminated pretty much means the game is over. Even when it’s just one player eliminated it kind of feels that way.
But again, I totally get where you are coming from. Let me know if I am wrong but you believe that killing one survivor should be a bonus or a reward in addition to the elimination itself. Meaning it should handicap the Survivor team in some way. If it doesn’t then the Killer is doing work for no payoff (except for the fulfillment of the elimination itself.) Did I get it right?
It’s doing work but getting nowhere. the Killer should be receiving gains from the work. If not then it feels like a punishment. And I agree.
The mindset is that slowly eliminating Survivors makes the game easier. What I was thinking when I created the thread was that each elimination should make the game smaller, kind of like the danger wall in a BR game. I assumed the elimination was the reward in and of itself, instead of a tool.
Thank you for taking the time to participate and entertain the idea. I’m glad you wrote what you did because it's given me much more to think about. It still doesn’t sit right with me that 2K is pretty much ggs. It feels a little bit like a thorn.
But again I respect what you wrote and it is valid in my opinion.
-
@Chocolate_Cosmos said:
So you either make Killer to Force them to play majority of game 1vs4 which means fast gens and hard time or you just punish them for doing their job. Yea, I don't see any problem with that one.
Maybe the starting gen speed can be slower than it is now. It just feels wrong that at 2K the match is mostly over.
If it’s too brutal for the Killer then there would have to be other changes. Regardless though the 2 Survivor situation just feels broken.
Thank you for your input though I really appreciate these different perspectives.
-
@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3648373#Comment_3648373
I think there has to be some different way. I respect your opinion of course but I think this would a very unhealthy gameplay loop overall. I also doubt that the majority of players would be willing to put up with extreme slugging. Especially with perks like Knockout, that are surprisingly strong in the right build. I have played Doctor on the game with a slugging build (Knockout, Caulrophobia, Distressing, Brutal Strength) a few times and so far I haven't been beaten. It's extremely nasty and it leaves survivors with almost no possible way to get out on top.
A base kit DS (although the 3 seconds version with some adjustments) and stronger anti tunnel perks as well as an incentive not to tunnel would be an alternative. Of course there would be side effects as well but I think they wouldn't be quite that bad. I'd rather a survivor with DS take a hit and me having to slug them because that is avoidable. I could also think of some ways to work around that. Although the best one I could come up with so far is based on protection hits, which is not the most consistent mechanic in the game.
Yeah… I see where you’re coming from.
There just has to be a way of fixing the game when there’s only two Survivors left because right now it feels kind of busted.
-
@Sngfun said:
I think hatch should be interactable and closed when 2 survivors are left, leaving an objective to be done(searching hatch) instead of hiding waiting for the other person to die. Also would make keys slightly less terrible.
I can respect that idea for sure.
-
@Crowman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3648375#Comment_3648375
It's a 1v4 asymm game. Of course the killer is going to be stronger when they start picking up kills. If survivors could easily 1v1 the killer there would be a huge problem.
I’m on the same page as you, I completely agree. What’s hard for me to reconcile is that a 2K is an almost guaranteed 3-4K. It doesn’t sit right with me.
-
@Crowman said:
The problem is just this punishes the killer for completely their objective.
Survivors wouldn't like it if every gen they got done slowed down their action speed.
Yeah that’s very true! It just feels broken that once the Killer gets two kills then that’s pretty much the match. Not always, but often.
-
@Xernoton said:
I don't think this is a good idea to be honest.
If we were to implement a repair boost for survivors simply based on the amount of their dead team mates this would also provide a problem in matches that are naturally close. Picture an even game where everything is still open, until someone gets caught and dies with only 1 gen left while the killer has 7 hooks in total. The other survivors would need to get a considerable boost in their repair speed to make up for a lost team mate. This would allow them to easily get the last gen done get out through the gates. Even when the killer didn't tunnel.
This poses an issue because these close matches usually happen when a killer does not tunnel. But now they are punished regardless with the only way to circumvent it being not to kill that survivor. Meaning, they could do pretty much everything they want and the killer has no way to interfere other than maybe slugging them. But slugging doesn't work that well, when you can't kill that person anyway since you invest a lot of time just to get one person away from gens without actually progressing. Unless you go after the others and slug them as well.
So in theory this whole thing would heavily incentivise slugging multiple survivors at once and wearing them out like that. Which would probably mean a higher pick rate for Knockout as well. I think this is not a desirable outcome.
Thank you for your perspective. I was wondering what the drawbacks would be. And you’re right this would be a side effect.
It feels like a “pick your poison” kind of situation. Personally, I could deal with being slugged if it meant there was always hope of escaping. But I honestly don’t know how the player base would react overall. I suspect they would like the increase gen speeds but obviously hate being slugged.
Thank you for participating. I truly appreciate your perspective. It’s helping me think about the issue of two remaining survivors.
-
It was wrong that they did that. The best you can do is report it. I sympathize with you, many of us have been there.
-
@Nebula said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3648342#Comment_3648342
I very rarely get these as well (funnily, I get more playing survivor than killer) but I've been going with the "kill them with kindness" route and it's pretty funny to either see people completely 180 and try to say something nice, or just get more frustrated that they didn't get the salty response they wanted.
I think that’s the best way of doing it.
-
@I_Tunnel said:
Part of it is because playing Killer is horrid:
- You do badly? Insults and ridicule.
- You do well? Insults, threats, and ridicule.
- You 4K? Insults, threats, and ridicule. Get accused of breaking some insipid 'rule' Survivors made up. (Seriously, I got accused of 'proxy camping' and 'tunneling' because I walked away from the hook, only to have the person rescued 5 seconds later. Having seen no one else; I returned to the hook. Where the unhooked proceeded to bodyblock me, then accuse me of 'tunneling' because I downed them and re-hooked them.) Also get told whatever Killer, perks, or map were used is 'crutch' and 'for noobs', and how you only won because of the hated Killer/perks/map.
- You don't give hatch? Expect to be called a 'sweat' and how 'you don't need to try for the 4K'. (Though I've never seen a Survivor give me a kill if they are about to 4E. Apparently only Killers can try too hard. 🙄).
It makes playing Killer a thankless job more than a fun game. Sometimes, I feel like the Survivors I play against see Killers as NPCs that exist for their fun instead of a human being trying to have fun & win, same as them.
I understand that. I get the argument that you can’t change other people so just have thick skin and ignore it. I mean what else can we do. But politeness and respect really do go a very very long way when it comes to maintaining the health of a community.
It’s easy to say feelings don’t matter, only controlling your own. And there’s truth to that. But feelings do kind of matter and it may seem like a thankless job to be considerate of feelings but it is something we can be better at (obviously within reason). Trash talk will always exist. The quantity and intensity of negativity seems like it will always exist. But I truly believe that wholesomeness, consideration and respect are the necessary counter balances to that negativity.
We take and leave the things that we want.
-
@Nebula said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3648294#Comment_3648294
While I can see this point and agree that some people are definitely like this, I think a bigger reason for people leaving is feeling that they have no control over the outcome of matches, especially in solo queue. I don't think this is a domination thing or anything, I simply think it's players feeling a lack of skill expression. I think a lot of people are led to the feeling of "what's the point", because you can literally play the perfect match and have absolutely no autonomy for how the match plays out. Bad teammates, someone getting tunneled out right away, etc. It sucks to feel like you have zero control over how the match plays out and I think that's a major turnoff for a lot of people.
Sure, absolutely. The people and feelings you’re talking about are also another reason. 100% agree.
-
🙏🙏🙏
-
Honestly I think the answer is an ugly truth. I think people are leaving because their favorite broken mechanic cannot be exploited anymore. It is unfortunately a part of human nature to dominate your enemy (carte blanche when you have the anonymity of the internet) and a lot of the broken mechanics in the game allowed you to do precisely that.
I personally think that DBD was (and still sometimes is) a personal cruelty simulator for some people to express their more base instincts. Cheap and broken mechanics are heavily abused by players regardless of what side you are playing on. Now that these are being fixed I think people who enjoyed this aspect moved on to different places that have easier ways to dominate opponents.
It’s always about control. Cheap exploitable mechanics give control. Fixing cheap exploitable mechanics takes away control. So people go to where they have more control. And what do you know there are people who love to have control over other people.
I think this is one of the many reasons why some people may be leaving DBD.
-
Sam! I LOVE Until Dawn! 🎉
I seriously thought Dwight was based off of Mathieu 😂 (No disrespect! Only laughter and love ✌️)
-
@Iron_Cutlass said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3646640#Comment_3646640
I play a lot of variety.
Got looter-shooters like Warframe. A wide variety of MMORPGs. A lot of horror games. A lot of FPS games. Rogue-likes and tycoons. Etc.
Have you tried Cult of the Lamb? I have been having so much fun with it!
-
@xEa said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3646294#Comment_3646294
I dont think killer would tunnel at all, because the only reason they do is it is the best strategy at the moment.
With a change like this, pressure gens / spread hooks and make survviors bussy would be more effective.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3646313#Comment_3646313
Not sure if this is actually a survivor nerf. Why would it be?
If killers can not tunnel anymore (aka no quick 3v1), slower early gens completly justify the repair penalty.
And if killer keeps tunneling, gens will fly after the 2nd down.
Again, like i said, those number are not carved in stone. If it would be more fair to make it 80/120/150% repair speed or 70/100/130 is not up to debate, its about the bigger pictuer.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3646341#Comment_3646341
That is what i am trying to do with the idea.
The repair speed at the beginning is less then 100%, but once a survivor is hooked twice, it goes up to above 100%. If a killer kills of a survivor, the speed goes up much much faster.
I personally think that repair speeds should only speed up on kills but overall I respect your idea.
-
@pseudechis said:
I don't think that's an unpopular take, there have been lots of players who are enjoying it as survivor, myself included.
Like anything there are those who aren't fans and those who'll whine about that, the latter can be prevalent on the forums, but it's definitely not an unpopular take to like playing survivor in lights out mode.
I got my first consecutive escapes in lights out last night. It feels more rewarding to escape from lights out mode than in the base game.
The atmosphere, the need to be constantly watchful and looking around rather than just relying on TR heartbeat while repairing gens.
Lights out puts the tension back into playing survivor and its great.
Congrats on the escapes.
It’s so funny, in a weird way Lights Out feels more like “normal” DBD and the normal mode feels like the comp mode.
-
@HeroLives said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3646424#Comment_3646424
I don’t see how you don’t see as survivor not completing all gens and getting hatch as a free escape…it’s not really a free kill the killer wiped the floor with the team. The team lost…if hatch spawned we lost if all 5 gens aren’t done. Its a free escape…that a singular survivor has the possibility of getting…for their side losing.
I understand where you are coming from. But without the hope of a hatch wouldn’t Survivors give up and stop playing? In the very least doesn’t it motivate Survivors to keep playing until the end?
-
As always, thank you!
-
@I_CAME said:
I sweat in every single game. I tunnel, proxy camp, and bring the strongest perks I can. Basically everything I complain about. The amount of survivors who give up or DC in my games is actually sort of depressing.
That’s hardcore. A slave to the Killing 😂
I’m just kidding though. I think all of us who enjoy Killer have been there at some point.
-
@GeneralV said:
"This is my world. And you can't ever leave." — Freddy Krueger
My favorite thing as killer is control. I love the idea of pulling survivors into a dangerous world where Freddy is the one who holds all the cards. I like to spread the pressure, control the map, keep people asleep as much as possible.
And when they think they escaped from the Dream...
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/7Y2ANIZQL02D/image.png
The nightmare begins again.
Utterly terrifying. 20/10
-
@skylerbound said:
I’m very chase oriented, spread out hooks and maybe go for a kill or two after 8 hooks are met.. or a 3k if I steamroll and I don’t want to wait for 3-4 gens to be done by two ppl.
I used to sweat but that got really stressful then I shifted my focused on chases especially when killers would stop chasing me which is the fun part of the game for me. At first I was steamrolled and then eventually I got to where I’d pub stomp 9/10 if I really wanted to go for the 4k win.
I respect that. Whenever I play Survivor it’s noticeable when Killers spread hooks. I can’t say it’s unwelcome!
-
@Xernoton said:
I am the undisputed most sweaty, brutally tunneling, slugging and camping Skull Merchant main (no offense to any Skull Merchant mains) you could ever imagine. I 4k every single match. Always. If it's not a 4k, then it's not me. Also, I take great pleasure in breaking my opponent's spirit and will always go out of my way to nod, shake my head, smack on hook or bm in any other way. I will never use any build that is not carefully crafted to subjugate those puny survivors. I once had a survivor almost escape through the hatch and this scarred me for life. I exist purely to make survivors sad. 😈
Please ignore the matches in which it looks like I play Hillbilly, ignore one survivor because they are already on 2nd hook and instead go for someone else, play with meme perks, let survivors go, write ggs in end game or give survivors second chances when it looks like I might win the game right at the start. I assure you that is not me.
I would also never try to challenge myself by playing dream pallet Freddy with only STBFL or meme around as Bodyguard Bubba.
You’re an inspiration ⭐️🥲😂
-
That’s terrifying. It reminds me of when killers in scary movies/shows dance around while they torture and kill people. Omg very very scary.
-
@Atsuka_Anarchy said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/XA27OLGDVEY0/img-8098.jpeg
“Our first encounter is our lasting experience in this match. You decide your own outcome. Live or Die, the choice is yours.”
I usually play stealth (Myers, ‘manda, Ghost) for the jump scares. I’ll meme a lot with ‘manda. I’m overall more excited about the interaction than straight up winning.
Same, the interaction part is more fun for me than the actual killing.
-
You are my Dark Devotion… So much that it makes me sick.
-
I like where you’re going with the idea but maybe it can be tweaked a little bit.
Maybe repair speeds can be less than 100% at the start of the game. And every time a Survivor gets killed the repair speed goes up.
It’s similar to your idea but instead of triggering from hooks it triggers from kills. Also 80% is probably too drastic. Maybe 90% would be better.