Grigerbest
Grigerbest
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@Ayodam said:
Jeff, Bill, Jane, and David are also quite loud. Idk. It’s to help killers find them easier because killers have historically complained about struggling to find survivors.
What about Jill tho? xD
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Even if I'm a killer main, I'm not going to smoke with any of the them, simply because I don't want to hang out on a hook after a smoking session. xD
I'd probably take one with Ace tho.=3
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You mean there is no mmr for killers whatsoever. xD
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@Header said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3258384#Comment_3258384
Most B-tier killers struggle with defending a single gen against 2-3 survivors. Don’t see how this is perfectly balanced
I don't know why you brought up a gen defending into the balance of the game...
Also: why are they struggle exactly? Oo
To me B-tier killers are the killers of 50\50. As a killer you have 50% chance of winning (4k), and as a survivor you have 50% chance to have 4 escapes. Most of the times it's 2k and 2 escapes. It's all up to players and how many mistakes both sides have done. This is what Balance means, no?
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@Header said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3258368#Comment_3258368
S-tier just means those are the strongest. Since both nurse and blight are very hard they are allowed to be strong
Dude, exactly! xD
"The strongest" - is a definition of "balancing issue". You can't say these killers are balanced and the strongest at the same time, it makes no sense.
@Venusa said:
🏆️ Who do you think the most balanced killer is? 🏆️
We all know there are a lot of variables that can change the way "balance" is defined. (maps, add-ons, items, perks at play etc.)
If we were to take out all the variables or RNG and gave both sides a fair playground: Who do you think the most balanced killer is? The one that is both fun to play as and play against? The one that the other killers could also be balanced around?
All opinions are welcome! 🌹
To OP - To me the most balanced killers are the killers between A and C tier.
Any B-tier killer is the most balanced killer in the game.
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The weaker the killer you play - the more frustrated, angry, tilted you will be through out the matches.
You will rely on the map rng and survivors mistakes.
You will tunnel and camp more likely also.
Map rng brings some variations in the gameplay, but also brings unfair gameplay for M1 killers.
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@Header said:
I really want to say blight
How is S-tier killers are balanced?
The exact "S-tier" is just screaming the word "Unbalanced" to me.
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Same as Nurse... No?
The match started, 4-5 seconds I hear a blink and someone got hit.
(Usually that happens if killer spond in the middle of the map with Lethal Pursuer)
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The Trapper been the same (kinda) since the game was born.
His ability has a really strong counters, (Eyes and Disarm).
He's solid D-tier killer, as long if you don't use his strongest addons.
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You mean more strength for SWF? No, don't buff them.
As long as we have a huge gap between soloq and swf, you can't buff 1 side without buffing other.
I'd say... Buff communication of soloq to swf level. That would be fair.
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Ok...
I don't even understand how can you compare the strength of killer and survivor perks...
Completely different meaning and completely different outcome...
It's like: "Dead Hard is stronger than Franklin's change my mind" - and I will be like: "What in the hell did I just read?"
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I don't get Ghosty complain on that one. xD
"Imagine relying on pallets" is similar to say "Imagine relying on blinks" - if you play as Nurse.
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@Sonzaishinai said:
The whole run at a trap while looking behind you is such a lifesaver
You can use that "God forgive me for that word..." TECH in the chases as well, but beware that you can bump into an object or bump into her after triggering a trap, so at your own risk. xD
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Trapper, because I'm a hag main, but he feels soooo weaker compared to her.
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@HugTheHag said:
Very informative ! I already knew most of it from playing as her but I didn't have much opportunity to pratice disarming the traps without flashlights, so thank you. =)
Do you have the opposite of this post, aka how to counter decent survivor when you're beginning to face them more often as Hag ? My sweet days of encountering survivors who'd almost never gone against her are dwindling and I'm facing more and more decent survivors who both know how to counter her and how to loop me a bit too well for my liking. I'm barely hanging on from 3gen defense most games.
I've tried going for more instadown perks, but that's not quite as efficient when I struggle to counter loops.
I don't have Franklin's (no Leatherface and no Shrine recently), so I'm mostly using a duct tape lethality build, with Corrupt, Haunted Grounds, Make Your Choice and Overcharge, usually with one teleportation range addon and one setting speed addon. I've also messed with Sloppy Butcher and Shattered Hope because I see a lot of CoH, but so far whenever I take it, no boon.
I'd love any advice if you think of any =)
Oh God this will take me forever to make. xD I'd rather just upload my gameplay as a Hag, or show it through a translation via Discord, but it's not going to happen.=)
I just want to say... That what I described in the first post might not work against an actual Hag main, they play differently, their traps placed hidden from line of sight and they uses "camera lock" as a weapon.=) They don't always teleport at the trap, they know when they need to teleport and when not to, and they uses only 1 trap at ANY loops, aside from the main building.
I didn't mentioned that Hag can play with Shackles... Then it's a whole another story...
Tho I might make another post when the bots comes out, so I'd make a screenshots how you should trap in different loops (1 trap only), and how you use "camera lock" in the best advantage.
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@EntitySpawn said:
Wait who's hag? Is that a survivor? Never seen them before
The Hag is just MMmmm, MMMmmmm a lovely piece of art.
Very loved killer by the community and very known for being the most fun killer to face.=3
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@danielmaster87 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3257013#Comment_3257013
Yes, but WHY do you hate going against Hag? Do you not realize that you can trip her traps by spin teching? Or that you can simply have a flashlight and she has no power? Surely you've beaten her before. Have you tried playing her? If she's not OP, then what is it?
I can make the connection if someone will make it make sense, because I guess I like to find out stuff instead of throwing my hands up and deciding, "Yep, that's just the way it is."
People "hate" playing against hag because of these main reasons:
- They lazy to counter it or don't know how to counter it. (Shining flashies, crouching, using "turn back running tech")
- Lack of counter in a chase. (When you chasing a survivor on a trap that they don't know about)
- Hag in most situations don't chase. (She's not going to chase you outside the web, it's not fun (for some reason) for survivors)
- "Proxy camper" stereotype the hag got from placing traps under the hooks. (Even if she don't placing traps under the hook, survivors will still crouch, this is why it's a clear stereotype)
While I'm not going to teach anyone how to have fun, I'm just going to say this: Hag is not op even a slightest, she has at least 5 counters to her ability (she has more tho).
Playing against a Hag main is rough tho, don't get me wrong. but swf with a great communication and teamwork have all the chances to do so.
I'm not sure about soloq tho...
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@Chocolate_Cosmos said:
Place Guard on the loop. Continue chase.
As a survivor you have 1 "unbeatable" strat against him, holding W. Aside from other good counters. His power really undertunned to the point that survivors only get benefit from it, If he tries to use his ability normally (as devs expected).
Anyone who played him must already know, why you have to use his ability so cheap and poorly (Tap it on the loops).
Me and other people on the "PTB feedback" suggested a really good ideas and changes that will make "tapping" on the loops less viable, but when he uses it as he suppose to, more efficient. But it does will make you feel like you playing against a Spirit, rather Artist. And I'm good with that.
If he come into live with the way he is right now, I'm not going to touch him (maybe only his perks), there is nothing tactical about him when survivors able to see everything about your power, it's boring to go against, boring to play as.
Without addons - D (or maaaaybe C tier) tier, and most hated killer out of all. Hands down.
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@Huge_Bush said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3255985#Comment_3255985
Be honest, you wont respond because you know you're wrong. It is playing the game, it's just a play style you don't like. The killer isn't just standing still. They're being patient and waiting for survivors to take the bait.
Never said killers cannot do anything wrong, but with your post history, it's always "killers are always wrong". You don't have to respond to me, I already know of your bias, your post history is littered with it.
He's right tho.
You don't need to be away from a keyboard to be called "Afk". With "Bubba defender", you simply staying all game in the basement, survivors can just do all gens and get out, without even taking a look at the basement, and after a game report you for afk (or trolling).
At least we still have some curious survivors who "searching" for killer.=3
Chest defender Bubba is really good to have as a survivor once in a while.=)
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Server issue and yours (or killers) high ping.
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Am I seeing a survivor telling that Eyrie of Crows is "killer sided"?
"Thats enough internet for today..."
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I think the prime "goal" of such matches is to get --- this --- chest --- opened... at the cost of your LIFE!
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Restart the game.
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@Pukenplag said:
Pretty much the title. They are impossible to prove outside of guessing.
I just faced a Deathslinger who kept ping ponging to us from across the map, slugging, and aiming from behind walls, hitting us perfectly when coming from behind them. There is no way one can just go from injured to injured person without any guessing, just straight up going to the exact location, while also preparing sights from behind a wall for maximum surprise.
But outside of guesswork, what else can be done against these hackers?
Even if you 100% sure they're wall hacking - you can't.
"Hacking? I'm not hacking, I'm reading you like a book."
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@Dionysus42 said:
There it is, friends. The harsh truth. It will make it possible to play the game without dealing with the toxic community, without the cheaters and BMers. After that, Killer bots should be implemented as soon as possible, of course. Playing with three other bots won't be any different from existing soloq anyway.
Playing against programmed AI which doing the same thing over and over and over again will get you really stale pretty quickly my friend.=)
As much as I agree about "Toxic community, cheaters, BMers, DCers", there is a lot of lovely and wholesome players in this game.
With bots you will never have a moments of all 5 players in the match silently watching at the fire from a barrel.
You will never see the reaction of other side on some goofed bug.
You will never feel bad for the killer who got 0 hooks by the exit gates.
You will never get to boop the (Ok, I'll stop...)
Any game have a good and bad. Any community as well. You just need to get used to it and adapt.=)
I wish you all besties and more fun moments in your games, let's hope! xD
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@SweetTerror said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3255806#Comment_3255806
Bots also guarantee no toxicity, no one disconnecting because they were downed first, no Killers camping and tunneling, and best thing of all...no one in the post chat is telling me that I need to die.
Yes bots offer a great way to practice, but they can also offer so much more, which is why they're usually a staple in most multiplayer games these days.
You have your fun how you wanna have.=)
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*Simple reaction to survivors items:*
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Really bad idea to make 2 castles - 50% playing against bots and other 50% playing regular matches.
Bots are boring, they don't speak, they don't nod, they don't t-bag, they're lifeless programmed machines.
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Jason might be a skin for Trapper. <_<
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I mean, you knew they gonna disappear after the event goes off.
I personally just started to avoiding them in the web, after I've got everything from the event.
I don't really mind them going off for nothing.=)
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That was fun, I've had a really good times.=)
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@Cyber_Atlas said:
What is your definition of pay to win ?
My idea of pay to win are mobile games, where you cannot win unless you pay, and not a little bit, often several K's.
Because of that, I cannot consider DBD a p2w, or close to it.
You don't need all the content to win. It is an option.
(Considering the game is very cheap to get at the moment: all the content is a 100 bucks, which is a good deal).
This game is alive at november 2022, with a great support of 7 years, made possible only by this ''economy''.
You don't need to pay to enjoy (and win), but we do need to keep it like this to have this game going and better every year :)
My definition of p2w - Anything that you can buy only for real money, which is affecting your gameplay. Exactly in dbd, I don't consider "cosmetics, skins, charms" as a p2w, same goes for perks (coz you just can buy them for in game currency through shrine, no matter how long you'll have to wait), but I do consider a licensed killers as, because some of the licensed killers have an obvious advantage over original ones.
People and even Community Manager keeps telling me that "Nurse is free and she's the strongest killer" without understanding that not everyone good with nurse and they might never be (playing on console, don't understanding or not liking her power).
Imo, community manager should never say something like "This killer is strongest", it makes me feel like developers keeping the balance issues on purpose to prevent people thinking like this game is p2w. Why don't they nerf the S-tier killers and buff other killers to the same "dificulty", that no matter what killer you play, it's a pure balance? Because more people will start to consider this game a p2w.
In what I'm trying to say: They never nerf these S-tier killers, and we never will have a proper balance, because of a licensed killers.
You're saying "This game is alive at november 2022, with a great support of 7 years due to this economy"? Completely disagree.
This game is still alive due to many reasons but most important once are:
- This game have no good competitors since it's release.
- Game is alive because of it's community, who endured all bugs and unfair gameplay.
- This game was (and might still be) very popular on Twitch, because of a Fog whisperers.
It has nothing to do with licensed killers, or the "some economy" that you mentioned imo.
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@AbsolutGrndZer0 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3249476#Comment_3249476
Yes, I get so annoyed personally at how casually people throw around the "pay to win' accusation. Maybe, just maybe, I could see it if Demogorgon or Executioner or Cenobite maybe were the strongest killers, but they aren't. Maybe even if licensed perks were restricted from the shrine, but they aren't.
If anything, this game is "Pay for Convienence" as I call it, but really not even then... cause, you don't have to buy the licensed killers to "win" unless you actually like them, and then... well, that's still not pay to win, that's pay to play a character you like that isn't free.
Once they release a licensed killer which is the same, or stronger than nurse and blight (which is going to happen "someday"), I'm curious to see, what the reaction will be.
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@Mooks said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3249761#Comment_3249761
So… not licensed after all.
What a shocking turn of events. xD
I'm mind blowed!
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@mischiefmanaged said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3249838#Comment_3249838
I mean it's incredibly simple. You can win the game with any character in the roster. You're not forced to pay anything to be able to compete even if they nerfed Nurse to the gutter. You'd still be able to use any of the free killers.
It's also completely unreasonable to say that a game that's been out for 6 years should never have any paid DLC content and it's completely unreasonable to declare that because your friend played 3 matches and got 4ks as a specific killer that that killer is the best "for your friend" and therefore makes the game pay to win.
I just don't really understand the point of this topic as the entire premise is completely unreasonable. You're playing as a licensed character with free to use multiplayer servers where most of the content can be unlocked for free and the game is continuously on sale for as low as $8 and has a $20 price tag on PC. On platforms where it's more expensive, it's still on sale something like 8 times a year and the number of free killers includes even more characters, one of which is Spirit who is another top tier.
Even if all of the top tiers that are free or unlicensed got nerfed. Pay to win is specifically when it is impossible or completely impractical to play the game at all without buying more paid content. You can be fairly successful and have a lot of fun playing with Wraith.
What exactly is your purpose with this topic besides what appears to be attempted trolling?
I feel like in this thread I'm heading to some cheeky direction on "Bottlenecking" the balance, and how it will backfire in the future.
Firstly I just wanted to see people's opinions on the idea of this game being p2w, but now I'm really interested in some serious stuff about this game... Later.
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@Gamedozer7 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3249490#Comment_3249490
The definition of pay to win is paying money to get access to the best stuff. The best stuff is free is not pay to win
It doesn't matter if your friends good with PH or whatever they are not the strongest nurse is.
Ok so wait, if they buff or release a licensed killer to the Nurse tier, or they nerf the Nurse and Blight to their tier... What will you say then?
If the paid licensed killer will be a strongest killer in the game, you'll consider this game as a P2W? Or..?
Don't you think this is kinda stupid that 1 killer is actually "holding" the whole moral of this game being "Not p2w"?
Does this mean they never nerf her and never release an S-tier licensed killer?
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@SkeletalElite said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3249451#Comment_3249451
If you're choosing to not use the strongest option available despite it being free, that's not the devs fault. It's not really pay to win.
You can play nurse with sloppy, NOED, jolt, and bitter murmur to have a fantastic build. It will improve a little with progression too, giving you star struck, NWO, corrupt, overcharge, and pain resonance as potential unlocks.
Sure some of the best perks in the game right now are tied to paid only characters, like Eruption, Call of Brine, and Deadlock, but those are far from required to make a meta build.
Corrupt, NWO, Pain Res, + 1 free choice of NOED/overcharge is easily one of the best builds you can equip that is only improved slightly by the inclusion of the other perks.
@Krazzik said:
I mean survivors get a bunch of strong perks from free characters while killers get fewer but they do get access to -the- strongest killer in the game for free so it's not that bad.
Yes, if you want -the- strongest meta perks then you'll need to pay or wait for them on the Shrine but again, Nurse doesn't need busted perks to slay.
Some strong free perks:
Surv: Sprint Burst, Dead Hard, Unbreakable, Prove Thyself, Adrenaline, Bond, Lithe (if on console), not to mention the universal perks like Kindred, Inner Healing, Spine Chill, Resilience, We'll Make It.
Killers: A Nurse's Calling, Tinkerer, and the universal perks like Jolt, Sloppy Butcher, NOED, Fearmonger.
Guys.=) I really appreciate you time you've spent to write, and all the advices... But I'm not talking about perks. xD
I'm talking about exactly the characters.
For anyone who's saying that "Nurse is the strongest free killer, thats why it's not P2W" - it's not an excuse, as harsh as it may sound.=)
@Pukenplag said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3249476#Comment_3249476
But then this stirs the question. Should Nurse be nerfed, what would then happen? The next free killers after nurse are far behind other paid ones in a tier list.
Does this mean Nurse should forever stay the strongest just for the sake of the game not being p2w?
Even if something is unlockable through grind, it's still P2W. I'll give Clash Royale as an example, since the game is notoriously known for its P2W mechanics. People who didn't pay could get to higher arenas, but you'd need to play for sooo long, to unlock stronger characters. Someone who paid got them right off the bat, quickly winning their way to high arenas. F2P players could unlock the op characters too, but it would take so long it was basically impossible to win for the first many hours.
Considering many meta perks / good perks are locked behind a paywall, it's p2w. Yeah, I can still get Superior Anatomy without buying RE PW, but, I could as well have to wait 3 years for it. Should it become meta sometime, I would be unable to get it without money.
Tbh, I was quite surprised to read Mandy's comment so calmly saying that "Nurse is the strongest free killer", I wanted to ask... Aint that a balancing issue? So the nurse is being the strongest killer is an official excuse to say this game is not p2w even if they have practical characters for real money only?
I'd really love to see what she's gonna say, when they release a licensed character which will be stronger than a Nurse.
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@Bran said:
I wouldn't necessarily say it's play to win.
I would say all perks should be available in-game though, licensed or not.
As for killers, the licensed ones aren't best in game anyways. As for the original ones...well..they are also not so great too.
For some players they are the best. Or at least better, than original.
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@Mooks said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3249540#Comment_3249540
*Spoiler alert*
the next killer may very well be free (more likely actually based on the teaser) and the devs have stated they don’t want to release more licensed characters than original ones.
also, considering everything the licensed killers aren’t even that expensive if you want one (and not all at once).
Yes, the prices are really low, no matter how much I'll rumble about the game being pay to win, the prices are fairly low, and thats a really good thing.
*SPOILER ALERT* xD
As for new killer, we all know that this is a colab with For Honor. All the time if it's a colab with other franchises, it's going to be a licensed chapter, which is only obtainable for real money, sadge. And we just got passed a Wesker with Ada and Rebecca.
Edit: So we have to prepare our money again, right after we brought Project W.
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Guys!
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@jinx3d said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3249580#Comment_3249580
licensed things NEED to cost money. DBD paid for the licenses which likely costa lot, they need to get their money back somehow. i agree that dbd shouldnt cost money anymore, but every game has licensed things that cost money
In other games that I've seen, licensed stuff are only skins or outfits, no practical in gameplay. DBD is literally the first game, when I see a licensed stuff being used in a practical way.
@Iron_Cutlass said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3249490#Comment_3249490
I do not think you understand what Pay to Win means.
Pay to Win means you are spending money to gain an unfair advantage over other people (and said advantage can only be obtained by spending money).
What makes DbD not Pay to Win is Nurse and Blight out-performing every other killer at the highest level of play due to them mechanically being the strongest, regardless of your actual skill level, you cannot physically ignore the fact that Nurse and Blight are the strongest killers in the game that anyone can access. Especially when the most of the world records for fastest matches and longest win-streaks have been recorded with Nurse and Blight, which are true displays as to how much stronger they are than anything else.
"Oh but I 4Ked with a licensed killer" is not a valid argument for the game being P2W when I get load into a game of Trapper or Billy and walk out with a 4K as well, I get play a game of PH and walk out with a 0K as well, sometimes I 4K. Just because you do well or poorly with certain killers does not mean something is Pay to Win or Pay to Lose, it just means you are better or worse with certain things. Maybe take the time to learn Nurse or Blight?
The proper term for DBD is not "Pay to Win", but "Pay to Grind Less", everything can be unlocked in time, and DBD is hosting tournaments that let you basically get licensed content for free (or alternatively you can get an access code from Fog Whisperers since they give them out, it's how I got a lot of my DLC content), I unlocked everything on my main over the course of a year and a half, but the only benefit you gain from spending money on DBD is spending less time actually playing the game.
Let's see... I played very long ago 2014 or even less - Archage, WOT (World of tanks) and MMO (I completely forgot the name pardon me)...
In Archage you have to pay real money to be able to craft armor and weapons.
In WOT you have to pay real money to obtain some tanks and different types of bullets, which you can't otherwise.
And in MMO (I forgot the name), you have pay real money to buy armor and weapon sets from the in game store, and they were not just cosmetics.
Do I really don't know what "Pay to win" means? Ehh.... Not to mention the Blizzards.
@Laluzi said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3249580#Comment_3249580
The reason they keep making licensed killers is because there's a massive demand for them, both from the existing playerbase and the potential playerbase that may join the game from crossover. They should absolutely keep making more licensed killers - it is a win all around.
As it stands, all of the strongest killers in the game are original - Nurse, Huntress, Blight, Artist, Spirit, Hag, Plague, Oni. Tons of different playstyles are contained in that spread. This is not an issue.
I agree, it keeps the game at the highest population, but why so many in the last year? I'll repeat 3 licensed and only 1 free character in 2022.
Why don't they make 1 licensed and 1 free character one after another? It will not be so forcefull imo.
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@jinx3d said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3249451#Comment_3249451
that doesnt change the fact that nurse is the strongest killer, and pyramid head is a b tier at best
"Nurse is a strongest free killer" should not be an excuse for developers to make more and more licensed (pay only) stuff in the game.
I'm absolutely ok with perks and outfits. I'm even ok with killers being obtain only through real money, but don't you see what is happening?
More and more licensed characters are being released, I feel like in the near future we'll have more "Pay to play" stuff in this game, than a free... And it's not ok in a game, which you already have to buy.
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@dugman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3249472#Comment_3249472
Or you may not do better with a dlc character than an original. Nurse is free with the game and one of the best killers if you play her a lot for instance. Huntress is pretty popular and also pretty decent, even Wraith does ok.
I think you’re confusing “pay to win” with “pay for variety”. You can definitely do just fine spending no money on the game. Not to mention even if you do want a new character you can unlock a lot of them for free at a rate or about one per month if you play a few matches a night.
Yes, I agree with that.
But still in the case of my conversation with my friend, he's right. He has a pretty valid point.
The thing that worries me (I mentioned above), is that Behaviour in 2022 released only 1 free killer (Dredge), and 3! Licensed killers (Sadako, Wesker, Spoiler|Knight)
I really don't mind to spend money on a game that I like, but when the game is just rapidly snowing a "Pay to play" stuff on a players, with intend that this stuff is better than a free, It's going to lead to an pretty unhealthy scenarios. (Remember Blizzard?)
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@Mooks said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3249490#Comment_3249490
Well then your definition may fit DbD. Though, especially for a game that’s not even free to play to begin with this is hardly a negative aspect.
and the general definition of pay to win is not the same as your personal one.
DbD never advertised that all their characters play the same or are free so.. why even make this thread, what are you trying to achieve with this?
*SPOILER ALERT*
Here's another thing:
There is currently 28 killers, 18 killers are free, and 10 pay to play killers, *Spoiler allert* new killer is going to be a licenced one, so we'd probably have 11 ptp killers and 18 free.
And this is what actually worries me. When a company rapidly trying to pull out the money from my pockets, by making a stuff which can affect your gameplay, but only obtainable for real money.
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@Mooks said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3249490#Comment_3249490
Well then your definition may fit DbD. Though, especially for a game that’s not even free to play to begin with this is hardly a negative aspect.
and the general definition of pay to win is not the same as your personal one.
DbD never advertised that all their characters play the same or are free so.. why even make this thread, what are you trying to achieve with this?
Well, it's just basically me and my friend were having a conversation at work about dbd like:
"Pyramid head is the best killer for me, I'm always 4k with him"
"You should try better killers at this point"
"I tried, and It wasn't working"
And then I just come up with thought... "Does this mean this game is pay to win?"
In pay2win projects, there is nothing good about it tho. These types of games usually end up really bad... And I think it should not happen to dbd by any means, but the ammount of licenced characters are worring me...
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@GooseMan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3249451#Comment_3249451
It's pay to play character you like
No it's not about "like the character", it's about "Doing better with paid character".
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@Mandy said:
I would completely disagree with the pay to win aspect, as someone has already mentioned, the strongest killer in the game is free...and there's no denying the fact that she's the strongest.
What you're talking about is wanting to play the other characters, because you or your friend are better with them - that doesn't make something pay to win as you can still "win" without those characters. Playing the game unlocks more things, you can unlock characters/perks with shards etc as well as some cosmetics - this of course encourages gameplay, but it's definitely not about paying.
I disagree, "nurse and blight are strongest killers" have nothing to do with me or my friend doing better with other killers, like PH or Wesker, as I mentioned. If he's better with Wesker or PH than Nurse, what he can think of...? "If I want to do better in matches, I have to pay money for a better character." That is a pretty valid point tho.
@Mooks said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3249472#Comment_3249472
You are describing a pay to play scenario as there is still no guaranteed win scenario and it’s very much subjective as is.
if you look at it in an objective way, you got Nurse and Blight as the killers with the highest potential. Followed by Spirit and maybe Huntress. All of them are free to get.
with your logic EVERY game that offers characters to buy is pay2win…
Well, tbh, for me it's any game where you can buy stuff only for money, and this stuff is affecting your gameplay, I consider as a pay to win game.=)
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@Mooks said:
It’s pay to play. Which… well is obvious -/ it’s not free to play?
you can easily win with base game characters and perks and you can easily lose with bought characters and perks.
Here the important part about my post=) :
"In terms of a characters (Survivors are not really a big thing about it, they're just skins): If you pay - you have a new character to play, this character may become your main, you can do much better with this character than original ones, you may have a better expirience or win more games with a "paid" character or even have more fun with (this is the exact reason, why I think it's pay to win)."
It's a clear pay to win case.=)
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@Ryuhi said:
For the most part, no. The vast majority of content is available without paying, and you can be viable with combinations of free-only content on either side.
That said, it knows exactly what its doing when it takes content that is hard meta and locks it to paid only DLCs. Eruption and Call of Brine are a current example, BBQ and DS were previous ones. BBQ was notoriously only in the shrine of secrets a handful of times ever, and was likely an extremely high number of sales for leatherface. It wasn't an accident, which is the kind of situation that causes the P2W discussion to come up. It technically isn't as it is not required to be viable to compete in general, but it sure as hell is mandatory in the sense that tools that make other characters (or even perks via synergy) viable. This ebbs and flows on both the survivor and killer side with each rebalance but again, its not an accident.
Not all dbd players buys characters just for perks. They simply wants to play this character, because they think this character is stronger for them.
In my post I don't really consider a perks like a "p2w" aspect: "Tho you still can obtain every perk in the game without spending any money, you'll just have to spend more time on it."
But if you want to play a character, you have to pay real money, and there is where a "problem" appears, or you can tell... "Pay to win aspect"
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@Chocolate_Cosmos said:
Nurse is the best killer in the game.
If you would only care about winning, you have the best power base game. Then you just have to get good.
Now, when it comes to perks, sure, it would be grindy a lot but you can still unlock these perks in the end anyway.
I would say this, if you play the best killer in the game and you are good at it you don't have to super rely on your perks by this point since your power can allready destroy even good teams of Survivors.
By the time you would become really good with Nurse, you probably allready own some good perks for her. Also there are some great Basic perks like Sloppy or NOED that helps early a lot.
Tbh, I was waiting for this comment.=)
Now look. I have a friend, who knows that the nurse and blight are the strongest killers in the game, but he just don't like them nor how they look, nor their gameplay. He just can't learn how to play them, and he don't really want to, but he likes Pyramid head, and he's doing much better with him.
When he plays Pyramid head, he almost 4k in every match, but when he plays nurse, he can't even 2k. For him, a paid character is much better than OG one.
Pay to win? For me, it's a clear pay to win case.