Coffeecrashing
Coffeecrashing
About
- Username
- Coffeecrashing
- Joined
- Visits
- 0
- Last Active
- —
Comments
-
@Remedicist said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3382240#Comment_3382240
I don't agree with that. Fast self healing speeds have always been a problem because they completely remove any pressure the killer caused. When at least two survivors are altruistically healing, it puts half the survivor side on hold to heal without doing generators, which means the killer is maintaing their pressure. That's why altruistic healing isn't a problem. However, the medkit self-healing action should logically take longer since a teammate isn't helping with the action and, therefore, allowing them to do other things. Hence, I suggest altruistic healing remains at 16 seconds without a medkit, and self healing with a medkit should take 24 seconds long.
Some games have zero COH and zero medkits, and are 100% healing. Those games need to have the healing speed nerf too, as compensation for the massive gen kicking regression perk nerfs.
The question isn't "which types of healing are problematic"? The question is "where should be move the slowdown to, if gen kicking regression perks are getting nerfed"? And the slowdown needs to be moved to every game, and some games have zero self healing.
-
@Grum said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3382245#Comment_3382245
Or:
Only nerf self healing while keeping altruistic healing the same.
Also, why are you pretending that gen kicking regression is the only possible form of gen defense? As if we didn't have literally years of gen defense meta that encouraged actually chasing and downing people.
Some games are 100% altruistic healing, so those games would have a zero healing speed nerf.
The Dev update literally says "First, healing will now take 24 seconds by default (previously 16 seconds). This will make each hit more impactful, ensuring that Survivors need to spend longer to heal their wounds".
Read that a few times. It says "EACH hit" and "ensuring that Survivors need to spend longer to heal their wounds". This requires all sources of healing to have their speeds reduced. It's literally the entire point of the healing changes. If the altruistic healing speed nerfs are reverted, then when aren't ensuring survivors need to spend longer to heal their wounds.
-
The actual problem is we don't know if the visual terror radius will respect loud noises like generators. If the visual terror radius literally pops up whenever a survivor is in an active terror radius or lullaby, then it's absolutely a buff.
If the visual terror radius only pops up if the survivor could realistically be expected to hear the terror radius (or lullaby) noises over the loud generator noises, then it will be fine. But I can tell you right now, that if I'm working on a generator, and there are far way faint terror radius noises, that I can't hear them over the generator noises. And if I get a visual terror radius, when I can't hear terror radius noises, then the visual terror radius is a buff.
-
Healing speeds are being nerfed, as compensation for the gen kicking regression perks being nerfed into the ground. There will be much much less slowdown from gen regression, and that slowdown time needs to go somewhere. If you don't want healing speeds to be nerfed, then ask BHVR to revert all the gen kicking regression perk nerfs, and ask BHVR to allow 3 gen scenarios to be as powerful as they currently are.
Because wanting gen kicking regression perks to be heavily nerfed, but also wanting for survivors to be able to bypass any sort of slowdown nerf on their side, is absolutely unfair.
-
@Remedicist said:
Altruistic healing should remain 16 seconds as it already requires two survivors that aren't doing gens, and of course should still be faster with more survivors that are participating in the healing action. I do think that base solo healing should be around 20-24 seconds.
Basekit altruistic healing speeds, and basekit self healing medkit speeds, are currently the same. If having the same healing speeds are a problem, then people should have brought it up BEFORE the meta shakeup #2 was announced.
It's clearly not a problem for these basekit healing speeds to be the same, and people are just saying "altruistic healing isn't a problem" as an excuse to get the altruistic healing nerf reverted.
-
@leowt said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3381657#Comment_3381657
I think that the current meta where it feels like injuries don't matter is enabled by boon COH and medkits, which deserve to be nerfed. But it's not so much altruistic healing speeds in my opinion. There are already significant downsides to altruistic healing, including the foregone gen progress of 32 seconds, not to mention finding and traveling to a teammate to heal you, which is not only time-consuming but also exposes you to the risk of running into the killer. Furthermore, it encourages survivors to group up, which makes them more vulnerable to killers pressuring 2 survivors at once. The only thing that differentiates SWF with respect to altruistic heal is the coordination of where to meet for the heal. Maybe the issue with the lack of Nurse's Calling value is a wrong prediction of where the survivors might be grouping up to heal.
At any rate, I feel like the nerfs to COH and medkit self-heal speeds are sufficient, and you will witness a huge difference even if basekit altruistic healing speeds remain at 16s.
I've played many games where zero people had COH and zero people had medkits. And injuries didn't feel like they mattered in those games. Altruistic healing, without a medkit, is the primary method of healing, so it needs the full nerf.
I don't know why people keep focusing on comparing self and altruistic medkit speeds. I've been healed many times by people holding medkits, and it's so very rare that they actually use the medkit on me. Medkits are a limited resource, and will be even more limited after the meta shakeup #2, which means altruistic healing without a medkit, will still be the primary healing source.
And it doesn't matter if altruistic healing has downsides. Killers are getting HUGE nerfs in their gen kick regression perks, and that slowdown time needs to be moved to EVERY GAME. And every game doesn't have COH or medkits in them.
And again, I won't notice huge differences in every game, if basekit altruistic healing speeds remain at 16s, because some games are 100% altruistic healing.
-
@leowt said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3381639#Comment_3381639
I agree that the incentives ARE there to take chase. At the same time, because injuries DO matter, there would be an even greater incentive to just proxy camp and get free hits/hooks. So yes, while there are more choices a killer could make, nothing really stops them from taking the path of least resistance. Also, with the DH nerfed this way, there are disincentives for killers to allow survivors to go for the unhook.
I personally feel that any amount of nerfs to the remaining few gen slowdown perks will not be able to compensate for the 50% increase in basekit healing. I'd be happy to nerf medkits and boon COH and keep pain res, cob, and overcharge the way it is rather than facing a healing regression meta.
I'd rather have a meta where injuries matter, regardless if I'm facing solo q or SWF, so I can be encouraged to chase people. The current healing speeds (altruistic healing included) are way too fast, and it often feels like a much better decision to stay in one place, than it is to chase after survivors that want to run too far away from the unfinished generators.
If altruistic healing stays the same, then injuries don't matter. I usually don't know if I'm against a SWF, and I need to assume every match will have lots of altruistic healing. There are so many times where I have Nurse's Calling equipped, and altruistic healing is so fast that I can't even get to the survivors before the healing is done. Altruistic healing speeds are a problem, and they need nerfing.
-
@SunaIIanu said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3381279#Comment_3381279
Maybe I'm missunderstanding your answer but it feels like you totally ignored my point, I didn't even mention different types of healing.
I get that you are trying to say we need a different type of game slowdown, but from experience I don't think that healing is the way to go.
I think Killers dislike to chase was mainly a results of the buffs to gen kick perks (Coh and medkits made target switching unappealing but not chase in generell imo) so with them nerfed now that shouldn't be an issue, it would be great though if the Devs would buff perks that reward chase like ruin and Pop again (and the pain res nerf is way to much, but that is besides the point).
With the proposed changes I expect weaker survs to struggle (and not necessarily because the games takes longer but because they die quicker) but strong survivors will just focus on gens, so I don't think this change will improve the game speed on higher levels.
Where do you want the slowdown time to move to? It's moving away from gen kicking regression, and it has to go somewhere. And trying to shift the burden to only self heals, which SWFs can easily avoid, isn't going to help.
-
@leowt said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3381252#Comment_3381252
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3381279#Comment_3381279
I understand completely where you are coming from. What I am concerned about this next patch is that the healing regression meta will be significantly more oppressive than the gen regression meta.
Consider the following scenario. You get hit by a killer with Sloppy Butcher. You find a teammate. 20+ seconds through the heal, the killer comes back to harass you and your teammate (not even committing to a chase, just to interrupt the heal), and your 20+ seconds heal (40 seconds of foregone gen progress) regresses to 0 almost immediately. There has been no gen regression (maybe except the 25s incapacitated eruption) that would erase 40+ seconds of gen time in a span of seconds.
Even with the strongest existing healing perks, I'm really not sure if survivors will be able to get heals off fast enough than the killers can dish out health states (or regress heals).
Furthermore, consider scenarios in which killers get cheap and easy hits, like when survivors go for the unhook. I'm not sure if the slowdown that the killers gain (60 seconds of gen time) is in line with the skill and effort it took to get that hit.
Although I see your point as to how the shift to healing slowdown can encourage chases, they can easily be abused. And believe me, they will definitely be abused.
If the new meta shift is overtuned, then it should be live for a while, and adjusted as needed. We shouldn't be trying to revert the altruistic healing speeds, before they've even reach live.
All the slowdown that killers are losing via the gen regression perk nerfs need to go somewhere. We shouldn't try to push the entire healing burden on self heals, so that SWFs can just easy mode bypass the nerfs with their voice comms. The whole point of the survivor HUD was to close the gap between solo q and SWF, so that survivors as a whole can be balanced together. Having healing speed nerfs affect all healing IS balancing all survivors as a whole.
-
@SunaIIanu said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3381252#Comment_3381252
I don't how long you've been playing, so maybe you already know, but this is not the first time BHVR tried to use healing as an alternative slowdown: In 2018 they changed healing from 12s to 16s with the intent to make games longer. It didn't work, good survivors just dropped selfcare and focused on gens. Sure, back then survivors had old ds, iw and dh, but resilience, Adrenalin and sb are still same, so my guess is that good survivors will just do what they did in 2018.
For more mediocre survs who are not good in chase the healing changes will probably hurt, because they need the extra health state, but it's not the mediocre survs that Killers tend to worry about.
A lot has changed since 2018, and we deserve to let the full meta shift happen. Game slowdown needs to be shifted to all healing, to encourage killers to chase survivors. The problem we are trying to solve is killers not wanting to chase survivors. The problem isn't whether or not some types of healing are more of an issue than others.
-
@leowt said:
The issue with healing has always been with self-healing with medkits and boon COH, and it is a great thing that they are trying to address this. However, the increase in healing time from 16 to 24s should not apply to altruistic healing.
To understand why, I think it is helpful to think of health states in terms of forgone generator progress and risk.
As of now:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/AP0EM46XO6QL/image.png
If the update goes live as is, this is what healing would look like:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/5OE7V7RTJ51S/image.png
From analyzing these numbers, we can make several predictions:
- Medkits will save survivors even more time than before, making them even more necessary than before.
- Camping will be more profitable than before. Killers can injure survivors coming for the save, and since it will take survivors a longer time to reset to go back for the save, there is a higher risk of a survivor hitting stage 2/dying and hook trading becomes more necessary.
- Although these changes will make stealth killers stronger, they will undeniably make top-tier killers A LOT stronger. Killers for which inflicting health states is trivial will become much much more oppressive.
- Perks and addons that inflict Mangled and Hemorrhage will undeniably become meta.
I think the most problematic aspects of healing have always been medkits (especially green ones) and boon COH, which allow survivors to split up and save time. Altruistic healing, on the other hand, should in fact be encouraged and should remain unchanged at 16s because
- It is a fair time investment of 32s (36% of gen progress)
- It takes time for survivors to find each other and travel to heal
- It increases the chance of grouping up and allowing killers to pressure multiple survivors at once
Also, if you devs go ahead with this change, please think about reworking Hemorrhage. Even in this boon COH and medkit meta, I have never lost a game as Wraith using Sloppy Butcher and Nurses' Calling to harass and constantly regress healing. I can't even imagine what it would be like to play against that after this patch drops.
Keeping the altruistic time investment the same as not a fair time investment, because all the good gen kicking perks got nerfed into the ground, and killers need the slowdown shifted to healing speeds.
It doesn't matter if one type of healing is more problematic than others, because that's not the point. The point is the gen regression slowdown is being shifted to healing speeds, and that requires all healing speeds to be nerfed.
And I don't know why people keep focusing on medkits, when there are a bunch of healing speed perks they could start using. Maybe the solution is healing speed perks are more valuable than before, which would encourage survivors to use different perks, which would be good because it's supposed to be a meta shift.
-
@Technature said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3380830#Comment_3380830
Killers are already being compensated by the fact that half the team is not doing generators or opening gates.
If the altruistic healing nerf is reverted, then killers would be punished if survivors used altruistic healing, because the total slowdown time would be much lower with altruistic healing. And besides, we still have altruistic healing bonuses on medkits and some perks, which can make altruistic healing speeds even better.
We should definitely try all the healing speeds intact for a while, to see how it goes. Maybe survivors can start using other perks, like we'll make it, to help altruistic healing speeds, instead of just demanded for the healing nerfs to be reverted.
-
@AmpersandUnderscore said:
These penalties are already factored into things like self care though. So the only place that the 'extra time' would apply to is medkits.
Just leave healing speeds at 16 seconds/charges across the board and apply a 50% self care speed penalty to medkits if you absolutely need to delete them as items. It accomplishes the same thing and is more consistent.
This would make solo q even worse compared to SWFs, because solo q doesn’t have voice comms, so they can’t always coordinate altruistic healing.
People like to yell “buff solo q”, but here we are with people that want SWFs to have the ability to bypass the healing nerfs.
-
@BlightedDolphin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3380844#Comment_3380844
But they already widened the gap because you can more easily coordinate with the teammate with the med kit.
The solo q to SWF gap is smaller if there the altruistic speed nerf stays as it is. .
-
@mizark3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3380827#Comment_3380827
The safe quality of an unhook is only in 1 person's control, the Killer. When I unhook someone at 15 or 59s (and everywhere in between), and the killer decides to return to tunnel, even when I bodyblock to the point of being slugged, that isn't a real argument.
In regards to Killer slowdown nerfs, I have no sympathy except for the original 6.1.0 Pop and SH:PR nerfs. Those were fair, fun, and earned. Pop being 25% max for 1 hook and a gen kick is fair. Eruption being 10%+ denying 27.7% assuming you ONLY hit 1 gen with 1 person, absolutely insane. The other perks have the main aspect untouched (Call of Brine Intel, Overcharge Bonus Skillcheck tanking progression, SH:PR doing solid regression without a gen kick), but their abusive factors are nerfed, barring PR to an extent. The problem with SH:PR is camping and hook trades unfairly rewarding low skill low effort strategies with high rewards. I think a better change might be 2 max PR per Scourge Hook, with an exception for Monstrous Shine Basement hooks. I just don't think they have the programming to do that.
Also you are ignoring the other ecosystem nerfs that those are existing alongside with regression dropping. Healing is taking 50% longer basekit. While I agree self-healing is a problem, altruistic healing is not. Baby with the bathwater with that change. If you were to take that healing slowdown into the regression nerf equation, you can find Killers are getting far more than they stand to lose. Especially if you use intel and/or lethality perks instead or alongside the changes.
Since I use a balanced build on the majority of my killers, and don't rely on the crutch of regression, this is going to give me free wins for days. But that isn't what I want. I want a fair and earned victory.
Lithe doesn't require the fast vault to be over a pallet you personally dropped in the past 10s, Sprint Burst doesn't start after 5s of running, and Smash Hit doesn't require the Killer to DC from the pallet stun. I think a fair DH works against Special Attacks basekit, with an unlockable M1 endurance qualifier. This way the busted killers are fairly impacted, and current 'normal' usage can still be possible with extra hoops.
Altruistic healing needs to be nerfed, or otherwise SWFs could just bypass the healing nerf by always coordinating heals with their voice comms.
We’re supposed to be closing the gap beaten solo q and SWF, and solo q is more likely to use self heals. This entire meta shift requires all healing to be nerfed.
-
@BlightedDolphin said:
Overall pleased but somethings should be addressed.
- Altruistic healing should still be 16 seconds, or at the most 20.
- Self-Care should be buffed back to 50%. Right now it take 45.71 seconds to heal whereas with this update it will take 68 seconds. Making it 50% will make it take 48 seconds, which is much closer to what it is currently.
- Hillbilly changes should not go through.
- If Hillbilly’s add ons are nerfed than Blight’s and Spirit’s speed add ons should go too.
Nerfing self healing speeds, but keeping altruistic healing speeds the same, would widen the gap between solo q and SWF, because SWFs can much more easily coordinate altruistic healing. We’re supposed to be closing the gap between solo q and SWFs, not making it worse.
-
@Belzher said:
I agree, having a teammate healing you already means you're not pressuring gens, so there is no harm in leaving altruistic heal alone
Survivors shouldn't be able to bypass a healing nerf, just because they are next to each other. Killers need compensation for the gen regression nerfs, and ALL healing speeds is the compensation.
-
@mizark3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3379443#Comment_3379443
This game is so laggy and buggy, that I've been on all three sides of this equation, where the Killer hits the recently Hooked Surv THROUGH the bodyblocking Unhooking Surv. This doesn't work, and without say, a 2s Invuln off hook, it won't work.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3379509#Comment_3379509
Even if we were to pretend no Killer could tunnel that effectively (Cough Nurse, Cough Blight, Cough Bubba, Cough Huntress, Cough Pinhead with add-on, etc.), IIRC from OhTofu's Scrim Nights, it isn't exactly 10s, as you are able to deny a Deliverance by timing the tunnel just right (AKA being able to count to the basekit 10s).
Do you understand this is supposed to be a real dead hard nerf, and that new dead hard will still be way more useful than the killer perks that got nerfed into oblivion?
You should be caring about your teammates, and if you're trying to farm them to activate dead hard, then you shouldn't be rewarded for that. Help your teammate by taking a hit if you want dead hard that badly. And if that doesn't work, then maybe you should think about using a different perk. I'm certainly dropping a whole bunch of killer perks that got nerfed into the ground. You too can drop a survivor perk if you don't like it anymore.
But don't expect pity for the new dead hard.... considering that eruption, call of brine, pain res, and overcharge all got way harsher nerfs.
-
@sizzlingmario4 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3380302#Comment_3380302
Survivors are paying for it though. DH and CoH, the two most powerful survivor perks, are getting nerfed, along with medkits, which were all overpowered and it’s good they are being changed. The base healing nerf was not necessary, but the medkit/CoH nerfs were long overdue.
Eruption, Pain res, Call of Brine, and Overcharge is the payment for the healing nerfs.
When the meta shakeup happened, BHVR tried to shift the killer meta to generator kicking. But now they are nerfing generator kicking into the ground, and the healing nerfs are the compensation.
Survivors wanted the 3-generator strategy to be nerfed, and BHVR is doing that, by nerfing the generator kicking perks. Survivors wanted the "hour long games" to be nerfed, and BHVR is doing that, by nerfing the generator kicking perks. Notice that the survivor gen speed perks weren't touched at all.
-
@kill4escape4win said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3380302#Comment_3380302
I guess that's true but damn 24 seconds....
All the extra time survivors currently spend on the current gen regression, needs to go somewhere after gen regression is heavily nerfed. BHVR decided to move this extra time to healing, which is why it's important for these changes to affect solo AND altruistic healing.
In other words, the increased healing time is the compensation killers get for the nerfed gen regression. This motivates killers to go on chases instead of relying on kicking generators to slow the game down. But this only works if all the healing nerfs stay in place, because if survivors can heal too quickly, then defending generators can become more important than chasing survivors.
-
I'm severely hoping that all of the healing nerfs go through, because gen regression got nerfed so badly that we need those healing nerfs as compensation.
-
Eruption, Pain res, Call of Brine, and Overcharge were all nerfed into the ground. The healing nerfs are fine, especially the altruistic healing nerfs, because gen regression is seriously awful now, and the time sink from gen regression is getting moved to healing.
Altruistic healing needs to be nerfed, because otherwise, survivors are getting the benefits of the nerfed gen regression for free, without needed to pay any compensation cost.
-
@Nihlus said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3379994#Comment_3379994
Killer has been in its' best spot ever. The game is literally handed to them on a silver platter most of the time. I've switched to playing killer outside of challenges or when a friend is around because solo queue is utterly unbearable and keep getting worse with every new patch.
Whenever someone says "killer have been in their best spot ever", I wonder if they remember what the kill rate used to be like before MMR......
-
@MegaFreeman said:
You misunderstood the issue. Its not about the unhooked survivor, its about the one doing the unhooking.
The game now wants you to hit the survivor and put them in deep wound because that will deny anyone else in the match from getting Dead Hard active
Deep wounds doesn't prevent a safe unhook.......
"For an unhook to be considered as such, the just unhooked Survivor must not enter the Dying State for the following 10 seconds.""
-
@MegaFreeman said:
New Dead Hard nerf has the same issue as Background Player; if a killer is camping and someone unhooks the survivor, the killer has no reason to go after the unhooker because they will get a free Dead Hard. Instead, the optimal tactic is to go after the unhooked survivor and tunnel them. That way, you're both going against the weak survivor (one without a dead hard, aka no 3 health states), and you're denying the unhooker Dead Hard.
This quite literally makes tunnelling a best strategy in the game
The current game allows killers to hit a survivor shortly after they are unhooked, to trigger deep wounds, which prevents dead hard. The new dead hard wouldn't change this scenario.
-
New dead hard would require a safe unhook, so we don't need to worry about unhook farming.
-
@glauxii said:
Could the changes benefit from fitting it to the same requirements as WGLF by making it a safe unhook OR taking a protection hit? I'm fine with an additional qualifier to the perk but it would be nice to have other options to work for, and it would be in line with David's other perk.
Safe unhooks are the best option, because they place a hard cap on the number of times dead hard can be used per match. If protection hits could activate dead hard, then there wouldn't be a hard cap anymore.
-
New pain res will be useless as a scourge hook. I have to go out of my way to hook unique survivors AND I need to get them to specific hooks?
-
That's still considered ragequitting.
-
The incentives aren't working they way they should. Incentives should be based on each player's queue times, to determine which queue that specific player should play, in order to balance the queue times. But that is not happening.
Ever since the survivor HUD happened, I've had 10 second killer queues, non stop all the time. But my survivor queues can easily reach a minute, even in the middle of the day. My incentives SHOUD be always showing killer, because that is what I personally should be playing to help balance the queues. Instead I get a mix of survivor and killer incentives, which is just hiding the problem that this game has a really bad killer shortage at whatever MMR level my killers are at.
-
@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3378725#Comment_3378725
I'd say it's a net gain for killers. At least on the competitive side, Gas Heaven is typically reserved for Billy and Blight because M1 killers get abused by the car piles. It's very difficult to close the distance on that map when teams are precise with calling out killer position.
Comp is such a small percentage of the games, that there will be way more games where a survivor can use the new gaps to chain tiles, than there will be comp teams using the current car walls as an advantage.
Also, I play Blight, and it's so sad that every new map, and every new map update, just make him slowly worse and worse. He really didn't need this map to be a nerf for him too.
-
Putting holes in the car walls is survivor sided, because the current long car walls make it more difficult to chain tiles together, when the car wall is blocking the survivor from reaching the middle of the map.
-
@Nirgendwohin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3377781#Comment_3377781
As you say, that's your personal choice. other people make different decisions for themselves. the additional incentives mean that nothing is taken away from you if you decide to only choose one target.
how do you get from tunneling to camping? These are two different things and problems that each have different approaches to solving them.
If I feel like I’m being forced to camp, then I’ve wasted so much time that I’ll also feel like I’m being force to tunnel. And equipping info perks won’t help, because it’s just too difficult to find survivors that purposely hide whenever a survivor is hooked.
This problem involves both sides. We can’t just punish the killer for camping or tunneling, but not give killers the means to keep the game tempo moving if the survivors purposely hide when a survivor is hooked.
Td;lr BOTH sides should be required to interact with the other side. If you want to punish killers for not interacting with all 4 survivors, then survivors shouldn’t be allowed to so easily avoid interacting with the killer.
-
@Nirgendwohin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3377751#Comment_3377751
Thank you for explaining the problem unnecessarily. i have criticized the community manager as a person and his handling of problems and said nothing about tunneling except that it is a serious problem.
in the feedback forum are countless approaches to tunneling. one would be to give the killer positive incentives to spread over multiple targets. neither does the game mechanics have to be changed, nor is the killer denied the opportunity to choose his own targets. as an example I would like to list the old BBQ here, which many killers had as a perk so that they could get additional bloodpoints.
this subliminal control via positive incentives is implemented quickly and whether it is effective can be determined using statistics.
now my question comes again, why is it not done although the people in the forum have been complaining for years?
Because it doesn’t matter how many incentives you give me, if the survivors are super immersed whenever someone is hooked, and I’m not likely to find anyone if I leave the hooked survivor, then it’s still not worth it for me to leave the hooked survivor. And this is double true when the survivors are using voice comms and are relaying my location to each other.
Many people like to pretend that a killer can leave a hooked survivor, patrol the map, and they will 100% find a different survivor to chase. This is not a realistic expectation, so if camping is going to be heavily nerfed, then there needs to be some mechanic that allows the killer to reliably get in a chase with a different survivor.
-
@Nirgendwohin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3377709#Comment_3377709
is a flowery answer to a serious problem all the community manager has to offer? disappointing and almost insulting to those who wondered.
Tunneling needs to be an option, because sometimes when a survivor is hooked, everyone else hides and waits for the killer to leave the hook. And if a survivor is far from the hook, they might work on a generator, but they will pre leave the generator and hide if the killer gets anywhere near them. In these scenarios, it’s not worth it to leave a hooked survivor.
And therefore, tunneling needs to be an option to counter immersed survivors, and if tunneling is heavily nerfed, then killers need some mechanic to make it much much easier to start a chase with a different survivor. Even though tunneling might be boring for survivors, it’s boring for killers when the survivors are overly immersed, and both problems need to be fixed at the same time.
-
The changes are absolutely a nerf. The benefits of easily being able to hold down a 3 gen, are way more powerful than the compensation buffs they just gave her.
She might have needed these nerfs though, partially because survivors complained so much about 3 gens, and partially because she might have been overperforming compared to her skill curve. Even though these forums like to make up tier lists where skull merchant is ranked low, in reality, killers like skull merchant might still be overperforming.
-
@DBDVulture said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3377488#Comment_3377488
-"DBD-Tournaments have nothing to do with Public Games. Bringing them up is not really an argument."
When you look at high level play there are 2 viable killers across all maps that can handle SWF. That's relevant for public matches because unlike a tournament you can play multiple copies of perks/items/perks.
In other words : SWF might be fair if you were not allowed to repeat perks/charactes/items/offerings.
SWF breaks the game because overall the number of pallets/size of maps/strength of loops only works when you are bad at survivor. If you play meta Nurse/Blight you can overcome most teams/obstacles.
Another way to say this would be : if not playing Blight/Nurse then you should have the option to only play against solo players. Alternatively they could make the game fair for all killers.
The problem is that most players aren’t high level, and most players aren’t overperforming with Nurse, especially after her overtuned new chase music happened.
We really should be saying “Blight and Wesker”, because for most of the playerbase, those are the popular viable killers that have good win rates.
-
@AGM said:
Would making it so that your bleed out timer doesn't stop while being carried, picked up, and put down help to accelerate the time that people have to endure this without it being abusable in some way?
I would be cool with that.
There might be pushback from other people though. I’ve seen streamers try to give a survivor hatch, and spend like 5 minutes with the survivor on their shoulder, as they desperately try to find which obscure part of the map the hatch spawned at. But to be honest, they really don’t need to slowly carry the survivor around the entire map like a backpack.
-
@Sonzaishinai said:
I see many people say Shadowborn gives you a bigger range to get flashlighted.
Is there a video of this somewhere?
It wouldn't be the first time the community was convinced of something that wasen't actually true
BHVR could just increase the FoV, but not increase the flashlight angles. To be honest, the flashlight angles are already questionable, where survivors can get flashlight angles, even when the flashlight itself isn’t anywhere near the killer’s FoV.
-
@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3376793#Comment_3376793
You raise an interesting question.
Can you be "bullied" in a game that you won?
Yes. And this is especially true with the bully SWFs that purposely die before the end of the game, so they can keep their MMR lower, so it's easier for them to bully in future games.
Likewise, if a killer bullies a survivor, but at the end of the game lets them get hatch, then it was still bullying.
-
@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3376781#Comment_3376781
If I wanted to shame them, I'd post their name 💀
Are you honestly going to sit there and tell me that this type of behavior is something to be encouraged?
I'm saying that whenever we have a forum post complaining about bully SWFs, we get told "it's not that bad" and "it's ok because they aren't doing generators when they are bullying". I'm saying that if these forums are going to make it a point to not care when survivors bully killers, then why should we care if killers bully survivors?
It's just like how some people think it's ok to ragequit as a survivor, but these same people want to shame killers that lobby dodge, because "people should play every match". If killers should play every match, then survivors should do the same, right?
-
@Gamall said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3376761#Comment_3376761
Here we are, the victimist killer is already here
Here we are, with another forum post trying to shame killers, because that is what this entire forum post is trying to do.
-
This game also has bully SWFs, that try to make the game miserable for the killer. And if they are a streamer, then you can hear them make fun of the killer the entire match.
Are you ok with survivors that purposely try to make the game miserable for killers?
-
@Adjatha said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3376634#Comment_3376634
Killers already get visual cues for loud notifications outside of FoV. They're big reddish-orange blob-bubbles and they've been in-game for quite some time.
The Heartbeat on survivors only applies to when the killer is near. A killer equivalent is for the many, MANY sound cues killers are expected to parse when survivors are near and which are totally silent for anybody with anything resembling less-than-optimal hearing.
This game is built on the back of killers' ears and accessibility options would make it far less unapproachable for quite a few people.
Fortnite has an option for visual sound indicators, and it can show multiple things at the same time, and it's super easy to parse.
DBD could even have the visual sound indicators respect sound occlusion, so it only shows a visual indicator if the corresponding sound makes a noise.
-
@Peanits said:
I can confirm that it is for accessibility. It provides absolutely no advantage over the regular terror radius, it's purely for folks who need a visual alternative.
At the moment, there is no equivalent on the Killer side, though it would no doubt be nice to have. When it comes to accessibility, we would rather get these features out sooner so the people who need them can use them than wait until we have other features to 'balance' it for both sides.
That said, if you ever have suggestions for future accessibility options, please feel free to drop them here: https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/categories/suggestions
I don't understand how this provides absolutely no advantage over the regular terror radius? For example, if I'm on a generator, I can't hear the far away faint terror radius noises over the loud generator noises. As survivor, will I be getting a visual terror radius symbol, in scenarios where I can't hear a terror radius?
-
Why did BHVR spend so much time trying to make a complicated auto buy system, that is still too slow, and can cause people to miss important items…… when it would have been way faster to create an option to turn off all the bloodweb animations?
-
I just want the option to turn off the bloodweb animations. I want very specific things from the bloodweb, so automatic bloodpoint spenders might be completely useless for me, if they might automatically skip over the very specific things I want.
-
It's a bigger nerf than her original directional audio. It's crystal clear over terror radius music, bell noises, piano noises, and everything else. And zero sound occlusion, or anything else that might get in the way.
I guess she wasn't considered nerfed enough when she had the original directional audio, and needed to be double nerfed to make sure she's as miserable as possible to play.
-
@Mandy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3365255#Comment_3365255
We have tested internallly and yes the audio is different and her directional audio is not currently working as it should.
Thank you for the response. I just hope that "working as intended" doesn't end up being a 100% crystal clear directional audio, that is 100% easily audible over all the game noises.
And for what it's worth, I honestly do hear sound occlusion in that year old video that is posted in this thread, and in that video, the other game noises are sometimes obscuring the directional audio when the survivor doesn't have line of sight of Spirit. I'm just afraid that "fixing" Spirit's directional audio will end up double nerfing her, where her "fixed" directional audio will be a bigger survivor buff than the directional audio she had a year ago.
-
@Mandy said:
we do have an acknowledged bug report in on this, it should be fixed in a future update.
It's not thoroughly game breaking so it does not require a kill switch at this time.
Can BHVR please review past game footage, to review how the directional audio functioned a year ago or a few months ago? Has BHVR determined that the directional audio has been different recently, than it was a year ago?
There is a video from a year ago attached to this forum thread, and in this forum thread I provided time stamps and feedback, showing that Spirit’s directional audio has always been affected by sound occlusion.
I’m hoping that BHVR makes an attempt to change Spirit’s directional audio to what it used to be, as opposed to just trying to delete the sound occlusion because a few clickbait videos claimed there has been a change in her audio.