dugman
dugman
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@Asssblasster625 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2830832#Comment_2830832
First match was mega easy, super altruistic survivors all randoms. Second match swf 2 flashlights a bnp toolbox, 2 coh users and the rest jus basic meta perks. Almost perfect teamwork. And they only had 1 gen left that was almost finished at 3 ppl left
Sounds like the first match was a little low but the second one was a good fit. FYI the game intends for some survivors to escape most matches so having only 1 gen left is normal when they have 3 survivors alive.
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I’m kind of ambivalent? 🤷♂️ I don’t hate Rancor, but I don’t typically use it either since it’s not that effective overall. It’s kind of like Lightborn - I don’t hate Lightborn, it’s actually funny to use sometimes for the hell of it, but it’s not a very effective perk.
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@Asssblasster625 said:
I know when to admit I was wrong and holy ######### was really wrong. sbmm is horrible, you win one game after not playing and your next match is a sweat squad that just hits u with endless bm. I somehow made it a win after I forced a 3 gen and slugged but it was awful.
I’m a little confused, you won against survivors but it was a tough match, how is that an example of bad matchmaking?
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I don’t have a strong opinion on how effective or ineffective he is, but I do think his turning speed while aiming feels super slow. I think he’s the only ranged killer that doesn’t turn at the normal rate while aiming their weapon. If they remove that limitation he’d feel better to play for sure.
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@deKlaw_04 said:
They should make a dbd racing game lmao
Lol, in all seriousness this looks more like an area control game in the screenshot.
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@Tr1nity said:
Dead by daylight Monopoly when?
“I build Hotels over all the preschools.”
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By the way, it’s a little hard to tell, but it looks like the killer in the screenshot is Doctor with his baseball bat covered in barbed wire.
@Mandy said:
https://twitter.com/Level99Games/status/1498692827781505028
The information is here for those that are not on Twitter.
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Yeah, they did announce Ringu a little early probably, but I’m not a marketing expert. 🤷♂️ I wonder what the optimal time is to release a teaser trailer for a game expansion in terms of generating a little buzz but not doing it too early and people losing interest by the time it comes out? Six weeks before release maybe?
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Yeah, on a tangent I’ve had people try to say that “pips” are what determines if you won or lost a match. This is yet another example of how pips aren’t actually a good metric of “winning”.
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In addition to all of the above replies, note that it takes 60 seconds of “stillness” to get an afk crow. They don’t just appear if you’re in a locker for a short bit while a killer is looking around.
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@Kurri said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2830608#Comment_2830608
How long have you been playing? A whole match is about how well YOU perform. As survivor you win if you escape, you lose if you die. As Killer you win if you get a Brutal or Merciless Killer.
I shouldn't have to teach you the basics of the game. If you want to make up your own win conditions, all the power to you, but that doesn't change the base foundation of the game.
Edit: To be fair this whole dumb argument is a good example that there isn't enough indication in game to tell Players how to play the game, and what their goals are - and I'm done arguing with you.
I’ve played the game since 2019, around when Oni came out. And I shouldn’t have to explain to you how “Brutal Killer” is just an artifact of an outdated emblem system that has nothing to do with winning or losing but is more about how active you were that game. Slugged for a 4k? Too bad, no pips. Got a 3k with a hatch but it took a while? Sorry, that’s a loss. Is it the 13th of the month? Now that 2k is a double pip, but last month when you were red grade it was a draw or a loss.
And feel free not to “argue” with me since you mainly seem to argue by just implying I don’t know what I’m talking about rather than addressing the issues I brought up.
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@Kurri said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2829507#Comment_2829507
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2829521#Comment_2829521
Emblems literally determine if you see Entity Displeased, Brutal Killer, and Merciless Killer in the end game screen. 🤣. It's seriously the only indication of victory.
It’s literally not “the only indication of victory”. There’s an entire screen of endgame scores and kills/escapes. Not to mention those descriptors don’t tell you at all whether the opponents out performed you in relation to emblems. If you get Brutal Killer, and they get a two pip result, is that a win? A loss? A draw?
Not to mention the whole thing of you can have two completely identical matches only if you play one after the monthly reset it’s a “win” and if you play toward the end of the monthly period when your grade is higher it’s a “draw or loss”. It’s nonsensical to say you win or lose based on when you played, or that because you took a vacation last month now you “win more often than when you played a ton and were red Grade”.
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I say this as a killer main who believes 95% of the time survivors complain about “tunneling” in after game chat they’re just sore they got downed two times in a row - I would have no problem with Borrowed Time being base kit, assuming they maybe slowed gens down a small amount to keep overall balance about the same. That’s because enough people run Borrowed Time anyway that, at least for me, I kind of just assume everybody doing an unhook has it and play accordingly. And I know I’m not alone, I suspect a lot of killers simply assume that when someone is unhooked in their sight that the rescued person is protected by Borrowed Time and they instead hit the rescuer.
So making Borrowed Time base kit would actually not change how I personally currently play as a killer at all. I’m already “working around it”, so it being actually in play doesn’t matter that much, aside from maybe rescued people doing body blocks on occasion?
Essentially while “tunneling” is usually a bogus complaint, I do think Borrowed Time does have a useful purpose in incentivizing spreading the damage a bit on hook trades because steering killers toward trades instead of rehooks in those instances makes for games where the killer is directly interacting with more survivors more of the time.
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The only issue I have with Boons currently is positioning yourself to snuff them is sometimes a bit fiddly. Occasionally the totem is squished between a couple of objects and you have to get yourself just-so to be able to look at it the right way to get the prompt to snuff it out.
Beyond that though the general system is fine. CoH is overpowered, though maybe a bit less so than before its nerf (hard to tell since there’s no data publicly available). The other Boons so far range from ok to kind of meh.
Also I think the devs are missing out right now on exploring the design space of killer perks that interact with Boons and totems. For instance, perks that
- Let you hear a Boon noise much further away and/or see a totem’s aura if you’re in a short range of it.
- Block all totems for X seconds when you snuff a Boon
- Give a killer tokens that build up stackable bonuses to movement speed and action speed every time they snuff a Boon
- Shows the killer the aura or killer instinct of the survivor who placed a Boon for a while, or shows all survivor auras for a somewhat shorter time
- Allows a killer to interact with any dull or hex totem to block it for X seconds
That’s just off the top of my head, the main thing is there’s probably a bunch of perks that could be fun for killers to try that make snuffing Boons or interacting with totems a bit more interesting for them.
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“Tunneling” isn’t “dirty”, it’s not even well defined in the first place other than “the killer downed someone twice in a row.” The vast majority of survivors who complain in my aftergame chat about “tunneling” are sore losing morons who assume that because I downed them two or three times in a row I was somehow obsessed with them or not playing “fairly”.
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Personally I think survivors should have a 1.5 second timer to start repairing a gen to stabilize it. Not so much for balance reasons but because it just looks completely ridiculous when a survivor, in the middle of a chase, runs by a gen and slaps it like they’re giving it a high five and suddenly it’s stable. It just feels like that should take at least some minimal amount of time to trigger.
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I keep seeing “bandaid” but assuming they keep making new maps over time Bloodlust is a hedge against ones that accidentally include infinite loops or practically infinite loops. It at least allows a killer to eventually catch a survivor who keeps running to one of those loops over and over.
There’s a lot fewer of these loops in the game now than there used to be but even now there’s probably a couple of super strong loops that something like Bloodlust might help with. Hypothetically they could probably take it out, but there’s not particular benefit to the game one way or another to do it and as a way to protect against possible future map issues it could be something worth keeping.
Also having Bloodlust in the game does hypothetically open up a design space the devs haven’t explored much yet by having perks which interact with it. Right now I think Beast of Fury is the only perk which does anything with Bloodlust and it’s almost totally useless since it just gives you stealth during a chase. (Note to whoever designed Beast of Fury and Furtive Chase - stealth is great between chases, but worthless during a chase.) They could revamp Beast of Fury and maybe Furtive Chase plus add another perk or two that actually buff the killer’s Bloodlust in various other ways besides stealth. For instance, make perks that
- Reduce the time it takes for Bloodlust levels to increase by 2/3/4 second
- Increase the speed boost from Bloodlust by 2/3/4% per increment
- See the killer instinct of nearby survivors for 4/5/6 seconds when Bloodlust triggers
- Reduce stun times and vault times by 40/50/60% during Bloodlust and don’t remove Bloodlust on a stun or missed attack
(I’m just making up numbers as placeholders above but all of those parameters could be tweaked up or down for balance.)
So personally I think rather than get rid of Bloodlust as a mechanic “because it’s not needed” they should think of it as a game mechanic that could possibly be leveraged into some new perks.
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I don't get that or the teabagging at Exit thing, either one. 🤷♂️
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@SpiderMan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2829259#Comment_2829259
6m with Monitor & Abuse plus Dead Rabbit? I thought he would be Undetectable with that combination.
To be fair, 6 meters is tiny. That's less than the width of the killer shack ( I think killer shack is roughly 10 meters across, so you don't hear Meyers in that load out unless he's something like the distance of the generator to the door in the shack)
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Split Dead Hard into two perks. One that lets a survivor lunge for extra distance but doesn't make them invulnerable doing it, and another that lets them become invulnerable briefly but without a speed boost. Odds are both perks would still see use, with the distance perk probably being the more popular one, and both perks would be weaker than the current Dead Hard.
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@fulltonon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2829528#Comment_2829528
It makes sense, game is literally moving goal post of "win" farther and farther as you win more within specific timeframe.
like, plenty of PvE games have variety of win conditions, this game is PvP with PvE winning conditions, simple as that.
I don't think anyone need metrics for win/loss, it doesn't really matter.
In the end, there is no indicator of win or lose, only emblem will be shown to you, it's only logical to assume this is what game is meant to show instead of simple letter of win/lose.
And people should assume game is made with those things in mind, it's what dev made, it's what dev kept and forced us to see every matches, it DOES NOT makes sense to ignore emblems when it's extremely obvious.
No PvE game that I can think of has a win condition where you win if you play on February 13th but lose if you play on February 12th.
The issue is you're assuming that the game is showing you "Brutal Killer" as a win/loss indicator, when in reality that indicator was abandoned for matchmaking precisely because it's such a terrible indicator of winning and losing. Really the only reason Grades and pips still exist is programming inertia - it's just not worth the dev's time to take them out entirely. So they've left it in as a "here are some stats on what you did this match" type thing and an indicator of how often you played. (Not even how often you won, per se, because again it's not measuring wins and losses so much as "activity".)
Not to mention, why would you think Pips are the "preferred" win/loss metric when there are at least two other even more visible metrics of winning and losing on the endgame screens - the endgame bloodpoint scores and the kills/escapes indicators? If anything, those are fundamentally more objective win/loss metrics since they don't arbitrarily change based on the time of the month, they only reflect things that actually happen in the match itself.
SO no, pips and Grades are meaningless when it comes to "wins and losses". There are in fact two other less variable objective measures in the game of those things, one of which is even the preferred metric for winning and losing in matchmaking. Emblems are more a reflection of how often you played than how often you won.
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@fulltonon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2829521#Comment_2829521
Who said this game is a zero-sum game?
If you 4k and got zero pip, it's tie, and if you got depip, you lost.
It doesn't matter how opponent played, this was literally a MMR before the SBMM.
So on your screen it’s a “tie” and on their screen it’s a “loss” or a “win”? Seems particularly against the grain considering the whole idea of the game is “escape or die”.
Also, you completely ignored what I said about how you can play two identical matches and whether or not you gain a pip is determined by whether you played immediately after a Grade reset or at the end of the month. Which makes zero sense if you’re asking whether or not you won that specific match.
Finally how nonsensical would a win/loss metric be if how your opponents did doesn’t impact whether or not you won or loss?
P.S. And yeah, they stopped using emblems for matchmaking because they were terrible at it in part because of these reasons.
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@fulltonon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2829159#Comment_2829159
Don't forgot 4k emblem with 9 hooks too, those things are #########.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2829434#Comment_2829434
"emblems are totally meaningless" when it is showing up every matches to the point of annoyance.
If it is actually meaningless, it will be removed, but it stays, it is showing us how we should play and how we played "good" with that term, if anything, it's a lot more important than just kills or escapes, because those two things and MMR is HIDDEN from us, unlike emblems.
Currently, main and only objective of this game is grades and thus emblems, if "this is not intended" dev should fix it asap because game is clearly not working as intended.
I totally agree, there is no reason to show opponent’s Grades etc after a match. They just cause confusion with people thinking they are linked to winning or losing or matchmaking.
Also if you think Pips are “winning”, then explain how you know who won the match when you can’t see how many pips your opponents all got? It’s entirely possible for you to 3k or 4k the survivors, for example, but only get 0-1 pips while the survivors got 1 or maybe even 2 pips if they escaped. And since whether or not you get a pip depends in part on your current Grade (i.e. it’s easier to gain pips when you are lower Grade than higher) you can have literally identical matches where in one match you played at the start of a season and gained one or two pips and if you play that same exact match at the end of the season you get no pips or even lose a pip.
Pips are utterly worthless as a measurement of winning or losing.
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@fulltonon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2829460#Comment_2829460
But can she counter windows or palettes, that's the biggest factor in chase I think?
She’s a stealth killer, so what she does is either get in close enough for a hit before the survivor can get to the loop or, at loops without 100% safe pallets, her partial invisibility makes it tough to tell which direction she is traveling the loop so the survivor may not know if she continued going clockwise versus backtracking, for example. For example, say someone is running at shack and runs inside. They don’t see her and, because she might be invisible after they round a corner, they don’t know if she’s chased them inside or backtracked toward the window. (Her invisibility persists for a second or so after Manifesting so by timing the Demanifest right before getting to the loop she can take advantage of the survivor not knowing what way she runs it.)
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I don’t get why someone would bother facecamping with Nemesis? His zombies are good detection machines, you see outstretched arms you know there’s a survivor in that direction so you can go down them. And he chews through pallets really quickly so being in chases just helps him create dead zones on the map.
I get why some people do the Bubba facecamp, he can guarantee a down even on healthy survivors and through Borrowed Time. But Nemesis in a facecamp is just a basic attack killer at the hook.
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I don’t know her play stats but keep in mind there are 27 killers (including Sadako) so the average killer pick rate is 1/27. Basically if you play one game a night you’ll only see a given killer once a month on average. Some are more popular than average, some less, but on the whole that’ll be the rate. Personally for instance I just play the killer I have a daily mission for each night if Ii have one, so I don’t end up playing any given killer more than a few times a month, if that, and a bunch of killers don’t get played in a given month.
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Also screw people who lobby dodge, they’re only messing up matchmaking for everybody else.
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The buffs to chase sound decent, as does cutting the Condemned removal to 3.
She actually looks decent in chase because of her partial invisibility and still moving at roughly survivor speed while Manifesting. She can chase someone entirely Demanifested, get up to hitting distance, Demanifest over 1.5 seconds and still be in range to swing when it finishes. (Wraith can’t do that, when he decloaks he slows down to very, very low speed so even with his extra lunge speed after a decloak he can’t get immediately the hit if they were running away from him during that time.) Dowsey was putting on a clinic with her on the PTB in chases even before these buffs so he’ll probably be quite happy!
If she still needs more of a buff I’d lean toward reducing the TV refresh timers. That both increases how often she can reliably teleport and thus the rate survivors gain stacks of Condemned and how often survivors are enticed to turn the TVs off.
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@PeaceNGrease said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2829388#Comment_2829388
Just another reason Freddy is even more mediocre after his power change. They either need to give him BOTH dream pallets and puddles, or just revert him to his power being the dream world.
It was a more unique mechanic and better overall for 4v1, in fact you could say he was the prototype for 4v1 style at one point, since spreading his dream world debuff was the better way to play him.
Total tangent but I’d be totally onboard with Freddy being able to swap between pallets and snares the same way Clown switches between pink and yellow bottles.
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@Kurri said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2828348#Comment_2828348
"I think there are a lot of high MMR killers who have this notion that the game should be balanced around the gens only being finished in 50% of the matches."
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/563L9RGU2DM7/image.png
I wonder why that would be when the game literally tells you you win - if you don't let the gates open. Something else I have complained about a lot, that the Emblems do not equate to the current victory conditions for Killer. Killers are told constantly on social media the victory condition is "If you get 2 kills that's a win, if 2 escape that's a win for both sides. Less kills than 2 you lose. More kills than 2 Survivors lose.". However the entire emblem systems is based in a way how well the Killer performs in game, including stopping the Survivors from completing their objective.
inb4; "Well one emblem doesn't lose you the game". One emblem not Gold/Iri literally determines between a brutal killer and entity displeased.
Because Emblems are totally meaningless, they’re not what determines whether or not you “win” a game.
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@WesCravenFan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2829093#Comment_2829093
That doesn't change my math. My math is correct, you are missing the point.
Why would I spend 30K bloodpoints to get add-ons to do a daily that rewards me with 30K bloodpoints?
That defeats the entire purpose.
First, because you get more than 30k per match when you use offerings, etc. With Streamers you’re getting more like 50-60k for instance.
Second, who says you need to buy an entire bloodweb to get one or two add-ons? If you really don’t want to buy more than what you’re using that match just buy a couple of add-ons and an offering, maybe a perk, and play the match.
Third, you’re still overlooking the central point of what I said - if you’re blowing away literally all your points tilting at a windmill of getting literally every perk on every killer then that’s your problem. If you use what you have it’s way, way cheaper.
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@GoodBoyKaru said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2829111#Comment_2829111
I think OP means faking. As in, crouch and uncrouch as pig, touch your toes as Trapper, or do some squats as Hag.
Ah got it, didn’t know what he was talking about.
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Also works well with: Trapper, billy, hag, doctor, freddy, pig, slinger, trickster, nemesis, and pinhead.
How does holding down your power button during a chase help you as Trapper, Hag or Pig?
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@Phasmamain said:
Rancor because despite running DS I am the obsession every single time without fail
Decisive Strike automatically makes you the Obsession if you’re the only one with it in the match, and also turns you into the Obsession when you activate it.
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@WesCravenFan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2828899#Comment_2828899
False. It takes a solid 50,000 blood points to do a bloodweb unless you get an amazing prune.
Average Survivor match blood is about 20K.
Average Killer match blood is about 30K.
So yes, if you are still trying to get everything on every killer, you are not like Bronx sitting on literally 1000 of something on Demogorgon.
Again, brown and yellow add-ons are exceedingly cheap. And you don’t even need to buy an entire bloodweb to get them.
I literally do a bloodweb before every single match I play on the killer I’m about to play every night. If you’re wasting all your points trying to get literally everything on every killer that’s your problem in a nutshell.
P.S. The average endgame scorescreen for killer is 30k, but you actually get more points than that because the bloodpoint offerings and bloodpoint bonuses from perks like BBQ and bonuses from events are added as bonuses on a different screen. That’s why when someone brings Party Streamers, for instance, you actually get around 60k that match.
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@WesCravenFan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2828355#Comment_2828355
Why not?
Maybe I don't have any more?
Not everyone has every killer at P3 and been playing for 4 years straight. Sometimes you get a daily, and you ain't got squat to work with.
Lol, ok dude. Brown and yellow add-ons are cheap as dirt and even without daily missions you get enough from a single match to do an entire bloodweb. I don’t know how you’re managing to spend bloodpoints and have literally no add-ons on the killer you’re playing but maybe you need to rethink how you’re spending them? 🤷♂️
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@TrickyNoobAsh4 said:
@dugman Wow, really appreciate the info. honestly i wasnt expecting anyone to respond to this. And i have a great first impression of the community! Yeah i use g force so i should be able to fix the resolution and frame by unlpugging one of my monitors that im not playing. Theres probably a better way but that should do the trick.
after playing several games my matches have been a lot more easy/fair for being a totally new player. Being new, i only had 2 or 3 perks. So most games like league of legends for example lets you buy xp boosts so you can catch up to the other players. I dont think this game has that.
I hate phone games so I probably wont do that. Thats very odd that the phone version has bots and the actual game doesnt? MY theory is that the devs dont want players hand testing the game for bugs to exploit. But damn it would be so nice to experiment with the game mechanics and test the width of all the hitboxes. Espesically since with it being first person it can sometimes feel hard to gauge the range of the attacks (or how close or far away I actually am). Like i wanted to test the things like if you start up the attack will it still hit if you turn around.. and how wide the chainsaw is and if making a sharp turn for a down is possible.
Regarding the mobile game having bots and PC not, the mobile version was developed from the ground up by its own development team long after the PC game was out. So presumably they were able to plan ahead for things like bots which the PC version apparently isn’t set up to implement as neatly.
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Is there a way to practice the killers other than actual games?
- Unfortunately not. The mobile version of Dead by Daylight lets you play custom games against the bots, and is free to play, so if you have a tablet you can try the killers out there if you want against the bots just to see how they work or to explore the maps, etc. Just keep in mind the controls are very different on the mobile version (I find the mobile controls on killer very difficult to use in a chase personally) so you wouldn't be gaining any muscle memory and so forth. But it's still an option if you want to fiddle around without going against humans.
MMR: My first game was against two Iridescent players (I-1 TTV streamer and an I-3) rest were golds.
- Yeah, when you first create an account it rates you in the hidden MMR as an average player or maybe a little below average. I think they do it that way because the game has no idea if you're actually a brand new player or just someone making a new account for whatever reason? 🤷♂️ Anyway, like you said, once you've lost a couple of games you should see easier opponents on average. However, note that regardless of your MMR, if a player leaves a game lobby before the match starts, it will just grab whoever is available at the moment to fill the gap so it doesn't have the remaining four players waiting in the lobby forever for a match. Which means even if you're a new player with a really low MMR, if you happen to be waiting for a game when that happens you could end up getting into a match against higher level players. (So it's not that it's giving you the wrong hidden rating, it's that it's pretty much ignoring the rating altogether in that scenario to not have long waits in the lobby.)
Framerate- Resolution
- Not my expertise but it looks like if you use NVIDIA Geforce that Dead by Daylight uses your default resolution. (Snapshot from my PC showing 3840 x 2160)
https://imgur.com/ocOsjsu -
Hawkins was a good map as a killer. Most of the pallets are gamable, and it had a good aesthetic.
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@danielmaster87 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2828360#Comment_2828360
You don't have time to set up like that. If you do, the survivors are giving you that luxury. You can set up portals on a bunch of gens, but survivors will destroy them or ignore them. The time spent setting up portals could have got you early downs instead.
Again, if survivors destroy them it takes them 10 seconds to do it and you only 2 seconds to replace it. That's a net gain for you. If they keep destroying your portals it's like getting a mini Pop every time you set a Portal. If they ignore portals then you spent 2 seconds setting up a radar station and portal to the gen.
You can play how you like, this is how I play him. I just played him last night even and got a 4k and a 3k with hatch, so it works for me. 🤷♂️
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I could easily see this concept for The Observer, where he subconciously mentally conjures himself as both a survivor and a killer.
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@some_guy1 said:
you just type their name in, it doesn't have to be a special link or something like that
I think the question they're asking involves people who just have blank boxes for a name, for example.
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@DyingWish92 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2822427#Comment_2822427
Working as designed. Giving every survivor and there mother a million second chances and canceling out any skill or mindgame the killer used to get the down. Well designed. Ruin was nerfed for the health of the game for survivors. Dead Hard is easily causing the most frustration and distress for killer players and more then half of survivors use it but its working as designed. It's overused and to powerful with how fast survivors objective is.
She didn't say it's not overpowered, she said it's not literally breaking the game which is what the kill switch is for. It's quite possible (even likely) that Dead Hard is overpowered and could use a nerf but what Mandy is saying is they don't just kill switch things simply because they're overpowered and popular.
And she's technically correct that Dead Hard is working "as designed". It was designed to give survivors a lunge for distance that also makes them invulnerable. So it's definitely not bugged, it's doing exactly what it says it's supposed to do in its description.
All that said, hopefully they're taking a fresh look at Dead Hard for a possible nerf because, ever since hit validation went into effect, it made it so that not only is the extra distance from Dead Hard as useful as it ever was but now, on top of that, it also can 100% be used in a pinch to evade attacks. Both those effects would be pretty solid perks in their own right, so having them lumped together in a single perk is a bit too strong. They should probably either split the perk into two separate perks, one that gives distance and another that gives invulnerability, or dial back the effectiveness of one part or the other or both.
And because the way hit validation works has made that secondary invulnerability effect much, much more reliable it's possible the data they've used in the past when reviewing Dead Hard didn't show it at its full potential like it can be used currently. Plus the old emblem system didn't give as good data either. So who knows, maybe they just need to pull new data sets on Dead Hard and reevaluate it for balance purposes. It's very possible that while they were ok with how it performed in the past that a new analysis would show a much stronger correlation with Dead Hard and escapes. (In fact, for example, when someone posted a full data set of 400+ games this month that included what perks survivors used, there was a very strong correlation between the number of survivors who used Dead Hard and their escape rates, much more than any other perk I looked at. It was something like if all four survivors ran Dead Hard they were escaping twice as often as when none ran it. Of course correlation isn't causation, it's possible that for example really good survivors like Dead Hard so if all four have it then it's probably a really good team in general. But it's still a red flag that would warrant closer inspection, assuming that the broader game data has a similar relationship in it.)
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I don’t know if the perk will be meta, but as a killer main I do think people who say it’s bad are underestimating it. Flashlight blind at a pallet and you have zero idea where the survivor ran too unless you happen to run something like Lightborn or Nemesis which, let’s face it, aren’t great perks overall so it’s not likely a killer is running them. And on a Decisive Strike the stun is 5 seconds which is more than enough time to get completely out of ear and eye shot before you start to leave scratches or blood again.
Of course, this begs the question, is it actually always good strategy to immediately resume chasing someone after they stun you at a pallet? Depending on the situation the answer is often no, your better bet is just break the pallet and switch to someone actively doing gens because if you keep chasing that survivor they almost certainly will have reached a new pallet and you’re back to square one. If you just keep chasing, getting a pallet drop, breaking and rechasing and rebreaking, by the time you get a down the gens will all be done. You need to be mindful of when to switch targets to maintain pressure on the survivors as a whole, not just on the one in front of you.
So this perk is probably good in that it does prevent a killer who might otherwise be able to efficiently catch up to you after a stun to have to switch targets regardless. But it’s probably not meta in the sense that good killers won’t just blindly stick to someone after a pallet drop but will be more willing to switch off when that happens.
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@hailxsatanxeveryxday said:
A lot of survivors here on the forum seem extremely eager to chime in whenever the subject of Lightborn comes up about how "bad" it is, but I get more free downs out of it than Exposed perks like Haunted Grounds or Make Your Choice.
I realize that a lot of killers are of the opinion that flashlights are the "weakest item in the game", and while I don't necessarily agree with that (I'd rather come up against four medkits than four flashlights, especially since they're probably redundant due to CoH), the utility of Lightborn isn't just that I get to ignore the flashlight stun instead of spending half the match staring at the walls and the floor, it's that you can easily get a couple of free downs out of survivors who don't realize that you have it.
Franklin's is more useful in situations where people are running four different items all with decent addons, and Lightborn doesn't seem worth it for just one flashlight, but if I see two survivors in the lobby with flashlights, it's worth considering if one of my other perks is expendable.
If everyone has flashlights, you can easily bait survivors into a free hit or three at pallets or near hooks, and you're practically guaranteed one free down per flashlight-wielding solo survivor if you mindgame correctly. SWFs will figure it out quickly and warn each other, but if they all had flashlights, chances are their entire playstyle and build were based around them, and they're going to have to change tactics, putting them on the defensive.
Considering some of the less than polite messages I've gotten from survivors about my use of Lightborn recently, I'm coming to the conclusion that it's not really a bad perk, and they're just mad (and the killers who say it's bad are just being contrarian).
Yes, there are better meta perks in most cases, but it's far from being the worst, and I'd argue that it's still more effective than Haunted Grounds or Starstruck in the right hands.
There’s no doubt Lightborn is fun when you get a free hit or down on a flashlighter. Where killers like me say it’s not as good a perk as other choices are coming from is:
- Survivors who are trying to blind you are already playing inefficiently. If the survivors just stay on gens except to rescue each other it’s noticeably harder to beat them than when they intentionally follow you around hoping for flashlight saves. So yeah, you can further punish bad strategy with Lightborn, but good survivors won’t be going for those blinds in the first place and Lightborn is useless if the survivors don’t bring flashlights at all.
- Also once the survivors see you have Lightborn they will stop trying to blind you and now they’re actually going to do the gens because what else can they do? So even if you get a free hit, you still might have just encouraged them to play to win versus play for flashlight saves and gimmicks.
Don’t get me wrong, I use Lightborn sometimes just for the hell of it since, like you said, it fun when it gets you hits. 🙂 But I never use it thinking it’s actually a good perk on average.
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@kombativo said:
they still didint rework Legion nor Ghostface
Yes and No. They did somewhat buff Deep Wounds and Legion’s add-ons that reduce the time a survivor has to mend, so hypothetically you can run both of those add-ons and stab survivors over and over to Deep Wound downs. It’s kind of a gimmick though, not really effective.
There is a full blown Legion update coming though, we don’t know the details yet but he devs have confirmed Legion is getting a big patch fairly soon, maybe even next mid chapter? 🤷♂️
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Some fun builds I like using
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I Want them to hear me coming
Distressing - Bigger terror radius
And three of Starstruck (coupled with Agitation possibly), Overwhelming Presence, Unnerving Presence (coupled with Overcharge possibly), Coulrophobia, Infectious Fright.
I use this mainly on Doctor since a larger terror radius directly improves his Static Blast. Basically with this build survivors are very likely to be in your terror radius much of the time, especially if you can steer the game toward a 3-gen. And depending on the perks you use they might be Exposed, have tools that only give half the effect, have to go even further away than normal to heal, or give you even further away screams when you down someone with Infectious.
Doctor is the best killer for this, but hypothetically you could also try this build on someone with very high map mobility like Oni or Blight or a teleporting killer since their high mobility means you’re keeping survivors in your terror radius even that much more often.
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I don’t want them to hear me coming
Three or Four of Trail of Torment, Dark Devotion, Nemesis, Tinkerer, Hex:Plaything
So you like playing a Stealth killer, but hate Ghost Face, Pig and Meyers? Well with enough perks you can turn any killer into a Stealth-ish killer by giving them lots of opportunities to be Undetectable or make survivors Oblivious. Works with pretty much any killer, assuming you actively know to use cover and not look directly at gens when approaching them so survivors don’t get tipped off too early by seeing you or getting a Spine Chill alert. I have fun going all in on the gimmick, but if you do keep in mind it has no direct slowdown so you do need to be playing a good macro game to pressure the gens.
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Pumped up kicks
Pop Goes the Weasel, Trail of Torment, Dragon’s Grip, Eruption
Kick those gens and feel good about it! Now after you can kick a gen to regress it 20%, become Undetectable, Expose the next survivor who touches it, and set it up to further regress when you down someone. In fact with Eruption you can kind of kick any gen you go near if you’re not chasing someone and get multiple explosions once you finish a chase. It’s a total gimmick but, hey, kicking things is cathartic. 🙂
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Pallets be gone
Spirit Fury, Enduring, Brutal Strength, Fire Up
Do you like destroying pallets quickly but hate playing Nemesis or Bubba? Now you can force pallet drops, even on your head, and destroy them quickly enough that you still might have time to catch right back up on them afterward. You can also replace one of the perks with Hex: Blood Favor to prevent pallets from being dropped in the first place (although don’t expect it to last the whole match). Works best if you like to commit to chasing someone for the down versus doing hit and runs, especially since you’ll need to get the downs to maintain pressure.
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OvEr Exposed
Four out of Dragon’s Grip, Hex: Haunted Grounds, Hex: Devour Hope, Make Your Choice, NOED, Iron Maiden, Rancor, Starstruck
Want instant downs without Bubba? Just stack four of the Exposed granting perks, plus maybe your killer’s red add-on that grants Exposed status, and go to town! Obviously there’s some overlap here, someone who is already Exposed might do a Make Your Choice rescue for instance, but that’s ok, they go down in one hit regardless.
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On the Hook
All the Scourge Hook Perks, Pop Goes the Weasel, Dying Light, Make Your Choice, BBQ and Chili, Blood Echo, Dead Man’s Switch, Grim Embrace, Devour Hope
If you like seeing things happen every time you hook someone, just stack up on perks which trigger on hooks or rescues. Surprisingly I like running this one on Twins because I don’t use Charlotte to get downs or in chases for the most part, and a lot of perks don’t work with Victor, but I do use her to hook people so all these perks work with her. (Yeah, the Twins are also know for face camping, but that’s not how I typically play, I’d rather be more proactively pressuring survivors.)
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Off the hook
Deerstalker, Knock Out, Hex: Third Seal, Fearmonger
Aka, the blindness build or slug build. Blindness’ best effectiveness is that it hides dying survivor auras from the other survivors. Especially when survivors are in solo queue, if you slug someone and the other’s can’t see their aura, it can makes it difficult for them to get rescued quickly. So if you like having someone slugged while someone else is on a hook and continuing on like that, this is the sluggiest of sluggy perk sets. Of course if they’re on comms they can tell each other where they’re slugged, so your mileage will vary, but half of the games are solo only survivors so 50% of the time it works every time! 😉
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@danielmaster87 said:
Don't use the portals unless you have abundant time. Use his shred for anti-loop, specifically with Black Heart and Barb's Glasses.
That’s absolutely the opposite of how I play Demo. I use the portals as radar, it essentially lets him create a 3- or 4-gen game with a much broader map area than normal. If the survivors ignore the portals you can patrol gens very efficiently even if they are split somewhat. And if they actively remove tunnels it takes them 10 seconds to remove a tunnel that you can replace in only 2 seconds which is still a net slowdown in your favor.
The portals are great in the macro game. Ignoring them isn’t as efficient as taking advantage of them.
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Do you have a particular killer in mind? I always use add-ons because, well, why not? But I don’t know any killer that is specifically dependent on using a particular add-on to be playable. (There are cases on some add-ons that are overpowered, like the old Huntress Iri for instance or Clown Pinkie Finger, but those killers are still playable with other add-ons instead.)
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@JoaoVanBlizzard said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2828345#Comment_2828345
In fact, I think it's even fair for the killer not to see the survs' items, can you imagine if the survs could know if Myers is using the "Judith's Tombstone" or Wraith has an add on to read auras, I was going to build a build to counter these add ons before the match starts, you can be sure that a lot of killer builds specific builds just by seeing the name of the surv that plays and the items they are taking to the match
Not seeing the survivors at all actually does prevent additional lobby dodging because some people will go as far as dodging a lobby that, for instance, has all of the same survivor because they assume it’s a swf.