Warcrafter4
Warcrafter4
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@Mysterynovus said:
This is a big leap and pure imagination, but imagine if they introduced scalable walls for maps. Walls with surfaces that can be climbed like rocks, vines, etc.. Both Killer and Survivors can climb them, but Killers will climb them faster (2s compared to 6s or whatever, it's variable). This could provide stop points on large maps where a Survivor player has to halt and make a choice to go another way or spend time climbing over. For Killers, it can also provide a way to cut off certain loops on the other side. At the very least, it would provide variety to maps because outside of baby Dweets, no Survivors wants to run in a straight line for 30 seconds. It's effective but boring. Scaling walls can change things up a bit.
It might also make some maps like Haddonfield and Badham less annoying for Killers by making certain houses have ivy walls that they can scale to get upstairs in a few seconds.
Climbing was tested in the alpha and was ultimately scrapped for one reason or another.
So I doubt it would come back let alone be implemented wall if breakable walls are any indication.
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Survivors say they want a secondary objective and hexes give them it(The lightbringer aka objective score category gains points when you cleans totem and more for hex totems).
Then they complain when they actually have it.
What a surprise!
That tangent aside its a fairly ok perk that is ENTIRELY in the survivor's control unlike bamboozle which is its 2nd main balancing factor outside of being a hex perk.
If you get downed because of it its entirely your own fault.
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These are an offering type that can do literally nothing as there are maps without killer shacks meaning these offerings have a chance to do literally nothing before you factor in their inherent chance to fail.
Also the game map has neither a main building nor a shack so no matter what blueprint offering you use it gets wasted along side any "The Game" map offerings also wasting them.
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Its the ultimate risk/reward hex perk in the game.
However its ENTIRELY on the survivors for letting it go off as it only gains tokens from a survivor action(unhooking) with a secondary condition(while the killer is ALSO 24 meters or further away from said hook).
On top of that unlike NOED it exists in the game from the start so its entirely possible for the killer to lose it before they have even found a survivor to begin to stack it.
It also requires the killer to get a min of 25% of their objective done to get any real reward from it and 40% for the instant kill mori.
Finally once undying gets to the 3 stacks for the exposed status there's no reason not to hide and skulk around to find the totem which reduces the killer's ability to make use of the exposed status let alone get to or use the 5 stack instant kill mori.
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The rework changed none of his issues and thus ultimately accomplished nothing.
Him winning chases was never the issue.
Getting into chases was due to his lack of map mobility and pressure are some of his main issues.
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@Superyoshiegg said:
There would be nothing stopping you from adding the other random Survivors still alive and telling them the Killer's build.
Sounds unlikely, but I think the devs wouldn't want to take that risk.
It used show the killer's build during the game but it got abused like how you said.
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With the game's already SWF dominated nature having another way for them to stack even more advantages is just too much.
Also its just kinda too late to fundamentally change the entire survivor role by adding these passives along with the legal nightmare of them having to get reapproval from EVER SINGLE LICENSE HOLDER to do it.
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@Claudette_Baguette said:
Whenever I play Huntress I feel so cheap. I'm always like "What THAT hit?"... her hitboxes are insane, even with perfect latency her hitbox is garbage and should be adjusted. They already did that once but Huntress mains cried because they ACTUALLY HAD TO HIT SHOTS FOR ONCE and then the devs reverted the change.
The server latency makes current hatchets unbearable and considering how much a deathslinger has to aim it's time to adjust huntress' hatchet hitboxes again!
Left: current one
Right: Changed (accurate) one
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/ZOPHBM5304NY/huntress-hitbox.jpg
That 2nd hitbox is actually more inaccurate as it doesn't take into consideration the fact that the hatchet spins.
A more accurate hitbox would look like a large coin because of the spinning.
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@TheClownIsKing said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2052478#Comment_2052478
Plague has some control over that last situation though. A reset usually only occurs because of complacency: ignoring the need to manage certain pools to create areas of control that are dangerous to be broken in.
Eh not overly as plague doesn't really have the means to actually reach a lot of her pools unless they are extremely close to what she was doing anyways.
Aka you will reach a pool reset just depending on map spawns and where survivors dictate chases end at as you lack the speed and/or time to reach most pools.
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@Red_Beard said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2051368#Comment_2051368
I think what you are trying to say is the statistics don't tell everything about the balance of the game between survivors and killers if both sides are of equal skills. I agree. If skill-based matchmaking works, the statistics will change. I'm not optimistic about SKM because I think it is too hard to quantify skill of an individual player based on many of the factors they have to take into account.
That said if match making were to stay the way it is, based on numbers they have posted with 1000s of data points available to them, on average, killers get more than 2 kills per match. If the goal of the game is to have an average of 2 kills and 2 escapes per game for the player base, that would say killers are a little stronger than they would want them to be. The goal was never that every individual average out to 2 kills per match.
I see a lot of people talk about how hard it is at Rank 1 as killer. With only 1600 hours in the game split between survivor and killer, I do not have that experience. I've always felt my win rate was above 50%, now I have a little data to back it up. In my opinion, people are equating top 1% survivor potential to the state of the game in public matches. That is not accurate.
Well you kinda aswered your own question when it comes down to why your winning as killer so often when you have over 1600 hours(I have been playing on and off sense the nurse's release and i only have 430+ hours total) into the game.
To give you an idea that many hours that is; it rivals my nearly 10 years of TF2 game time(And no I don't idle in tf2).
Also just remember all of what I am saying is in context of me pointing this out to @Mugombo who tried to be sarcastic about these stats being the end all be all for why killers are OP.
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@MeltingPenguins said:
The changes are good, lbr, but I'd suggest one change:
Don't have DS wear off upon entering a locker if inner strength is active, or if you just tab a gen to stop it from regressing.
the rest of the change can stay as it is.
Stopping regression is progressing you're objective which isn't allowed.
Also unless they changed it they said inner strength healing in lockers didn't Disable DS.
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Quit hidding in that corner and unhook me you know the killer isn't near the hook.
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@Red_Beard said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2051347#Comment_2051347
I'm not sure why that makes statistics invalid. You can definitely say there might not be enough data points with only 25 matches to conclude a normal distribution but the numbers such as kill rates and escape rates that BHVR has put out with 1,000s of data points are valid to the current state of the game whenever they put them out, unless there was some big mistake when they pulled their numbers.
For all either you or I know none of those games could be fair skill wise which is the main issue.
A person can win 100 games in a row but it doesn't matter if all 100 games didn't have fair match making as someone like Otz winning 100 games in a row against noobs doesn't really prove anything.
Remember even the devs have SAID TO NOT USE THE STATISTICS.
They know the statistics aren't accurate due to way too many factors going on in the game like DC games,First hook suicides,Afks, unfair match making both for and against the survivors, how maps are generated as a 12+ pallet map spawn will usually have a lower KR then one with only 7 pallets,What add-ons were being used,What items were being used,SWF or not, ext, ext, ext.
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@Red_Beard said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2051305#Comment_2051305
You equate rank to skill. I think it can be a good indicator, such as someone consistently in red ranks is better than someone consistently in green ranks, but you don't know the skill of a group of survivors until you play them. For example, I depipped in 4 matches. The first match survivor ranks were 2, 4, 4, and 1 at the end of the match, a full red rank team. The second depip game, 5, 2, 5, 3. The third 2, 4, 7, 6. And the fourth was 2, 2, 6, 8. So three of the teams that I depipped when I played against were part of the 13 "rainbow" lobbies. I quoted rainbow because that was your term, mine was mix.
Of the 5 full red rank teams, I 2 pipped twice, 1 pipped once, safety pipped once and depipped once.
I was mainly pointing out to Mugombo how the matchmaking can invalidate most statistics in the game as theoretically the survivor team only had a perfectly "Fair" game in about 20% of the games.
Its also why MMR was being tested to be introduced to actually try to make games fair so statistics can be accurate.
As Mugombo was being sarcastic about these results as if they actually were accurate to the game's balance.
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@Mugombo said:
One of the weakest killers in the game having an 80% kill rate in red ranks? Blasphemy! Killers have no chance in this game at high ranks /s
If you bothered to look at the rank distribution only 5 games were fair 4 Red rank survivors VS a red rank killer with 13 being rainbow lobbies...
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He is more or less the embodiment of: Good Enough/Noob stomper.
He is the most average B tier killer you can find by having good strengths with his anti stealth/anti loop(once you get good at it) but is crippled by his lack of mobility and lethality.
Even though he has anti loop he has no way of actually downing survivors faster especially ones that just hold W(Not a specific weakness of the doctor's but all non mobility killers).
He is played a lot mainly because he's a fun killer with fun add-ons while being the main test for new survivors to see if they deserve higher ranks with his illusions/anti stealth/skill check nonsense.
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The issue with antidote is that its an unneeded ability.
He already had insanely good anti loop with tonic and the antidote anti loop is just overkill.
This is in addition to it not addressing his main issue of lacking map pressure which his rework should have been addressing.
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@GrimReaperJr1232 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2046800#Comment_2046800
The question was if it would be balanced, not if it would be good.
If its borderline unusable then its not balanced; its broken design just in the other direction.
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@Galklife said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2046800#Comment_2046800
Maybe you dont know but Slinger has range limit xd and has to bring them 20m+ to himself ...
Meanwhile there is bunch of Huntresses that are going for crossmap snipes with bbq or just when they see surv on gen.
My point was that with indoor maps you can't realistically get the 15+ meter distance requirements on indoor maps due to multiple factors.
For example in the huntress' case door frames/low roofing actively hinders her ability to do long distance shots as she needs an arc which the maps aren't built around giving her.
The large amount of LoS breakers means that there's almost no situation where you'd get a line of 15+ meters to even attempt it even without considering the other factors.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2046856#Comment_2046856
There are some bad spots on Autohaven, but there are also some really really good one's.
Swamp, Haddonfield, Badham and Coldwind all have egregious spots.
Pretty much every other map has serviceable totem spots. If a Survivor spawns and gets lucky, then that really sucks, but your totems aren't built to last forever. I understand that frustration, but you can't rely on those perks. I always treat Hex perks like I'm on a time limit. Cause as much damage while they are up as possible.
Reread my comment:
I have NEVER had any good spawns on said maps while playing killer.
Meanwhile my survivor experience I never had an killer who got good spawns on those maps as they don't exist.
I know totems aren't meant to last forever but the developers have purposely made those maps totem spawns worse as these hill top totems were in the maps at the beginning but were REMOVED because they were awful and changed to have the more corner hidden spots people know of.
But for some reason they READDED back in the old bad spots they ALREADY HAD TO REMOVE FOR BEING TERRIBLE.
My point being is that the developers seem to be actively sabotoging totem builds at this point.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2046836#Comment_2046836
To be fair, they are better than what they used to be.
How much better is up for debate though.
I have yet to have a totem NOT spawn either out in the open(On top of hills or in the open by things like stair cases) or right next to the generators on both of the recently reworked maps.
Its really getting to the point that I think the devs don't want hex perks to be in the game anymore and are trying to make them irrelevent both with the undying change and actively making the reworked map's hex spawns worse.
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@GrimReaperJr1232 said:
Considering Slinger's Iri add-on has a range limit and it's not that prevalent? Yeah, a range of 20+m would do it for me.
Iri coin is so underpowered that no one uses it and could be baseline and it wouldn't effect his overall power.
Remember as @ukenicky said making it distance based would mean it would be useless on maps like "The game" or really any indoor map.
Iri coin is a FAILURE of an add-on which is why the devs haven't even pretend to think it would be a good idea for iri hatchet unlike other change ideas.
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@Leachy_Jr said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2021708#Comment_2021708
Not only for new paths, but to be added to improve map design. EG: The breakable wall that prevents the badham gate window from becoming an infinite. That's a good breakable wall.
Things that walls would also be used for is making some gens less safe due to less options of escape. Lots of maps have gens in just completely safe locations, adding walls to some escape routes would benefit there. It's why I actually like the breakable walls on game as it provides less escape routes for any gens nearby.
But as most things, they're added in a way where you're forced to break it and not put any thought behind it. Making boring gameplay.
Lets also not forget the noob trap walls like the ones in the badham's preschool/coal tower 2nd floor breakable walls that are solely breakable to screw over newer players who are trying killer.
For a mechanic that can only be interacted with by killers breakable walls are almost exclusively survivor sided.
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@GannTM said:
Yeah it's so annoying. No one asked for them and yet the devs still rub it in our faces like their ideas are top tier.
Correction: They were asked for BUT only for killers to make new beneficial path's through maps for the KILLERS ONLY.
They were not wanted as a way of making new infinite loops until broken which the developers are mainly using them for.
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If a killer mass slugs the survivor team to death within the first 2-3 minutes the survivor team screwed up.
If you hear any of the global warnings for a snowball killer like Michael/Oni/Plague then STAY AWAY FROM YOUR TEAMMATES.
The snowball killers generally speaking have a LOUD GLOBAL WARNING FOR A REASON LISTEN TO IT!
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@Moundshroud said:
I was just in a game at Ormond as a Survivor (Claudette) and I was the last one left, crawling trying to find the hatch. I was up against a Ghostface. He found the hatch first so I crawled into a hiding place and decided to wait. Just as I bled out, the game disconnected me. It took me a few minutes to sign back in and I had a matchmaking ban for a few minutes left. I didn't disconnect nor did I lose internet. Is there a bug which triggers on bleeding out?
Servers have been having issues since the mid chapter patch.
Its just a known bug atm as it can happen to anyone at the most infuriating times.
Such as for me when I was playing as legion and got disconnected as i was grabbing the 2nd to last survivor who was hiding in a locker.
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I agree with kicks giving 2-3% regression by default as 2-3% regression is more or less just the time it took to kick the generator to begin with.
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@Dennis_van_eijk said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/234212/killers-stop-expecting-a-4k
Survivors don't expect to escape every single match 🤣
It sounds like you barely if not ever play killer by the sound of it.
If you did than you would know that the emblem system is broken for killer and a 4k can mean the difference between a pip or a blackpip.
Hell I've even had a 4 with 32k bp and still blackpipped, tell me how is that balanced? 🤣
Also it is to expected that your friend do very good as a new player on killer.
Barely anybody in those ranks know what they are doing so there the killer is strong.
There is nothing wrong with solo q if you can loop a little bit.
That 10% you say is what I die and the others is what I escape.
Learn to play and once you reach red ranks in a legit way then we'll see what you have to say
Don't forget plague's legendary Emblem score nonsense making so plague can get a normal 4k and still depip!
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2015176#Comment_2015176
I very rarely see hook suicides. Saying that those are common is a blatant lie.
I am sorry but its an issue that effects A LOT of people in this game.
Just because it doesn't happen to you often doesn't mean it doesn't happen to others often.
My self included as its VERY common no matter what rank I am playing on nor what side I am playing for first hook suicides.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2015123#Comment_2015123
Nonsense. I know you will never get away from your narrative, but people suiciding on Hook will have little to no impact on Killrates. It has an impact, but is not responsible for Killrates way above 50%.
@Topic:
If anything, the Killrates indicate that playing Killer is not as bad as some people make it up to be. But thats about it.
People literally killing themselves on hook doesn't significantly increase how many people are killed on the hook?!
I am sorry but this makes no sense as one hook suicide is literally half way to 50% let alone it cripples the survivor's ability to complete gens.
Its like saying tunneling someone out of the game early doesn't effect the outcome of the game!
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@SunaIIanu said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2014469#Comment_2014469
As far as I know the Devs do not includes matches with a dc for this statistics. Atleast they did so with the 2019 stats: https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/107244/are-those-stats-with-or-without-dc
I also don't think you can base balance decisions only on stats but atleast the dc Part of your argument is not correct.
They never said they removed them in the 2020 stats which mind you were overall much higher making it seem like DC's were counted.
It also still doesn't address first hook suicides which accomplish the same thing.
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Its a perk that I honestly believe is worse then "Remember Me".
As "Remember Me(RM)" forces a survivor(other then the usually tunnelled obsession as you get rewarded for that) to stay on the gates themselves for an extended period of time giving you an advantage in both finding them and chasing them.
"No Way Out" has the issue that it doesn't corral the survivors like RM does making it almost worthless as with NOED survivors literally have no reason not to just hunt for the totem.
The only use I have seen for "No Way Out" is to meme it with Rancor to do a mori dailly without a mori almost always being successful.
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@sluc16 said:
Starting locations in this game are stupid!
How is it possible that the match just started and the killer is already on my ass. Is f...g ridiculous and unfair.
You ran and left scratch marks giving away where you were to the nurse if she hadn't already seen you.
@Zeus said:
To be honest, this is how every game should be in the first place.
I feel like the killer should never spawn next to a single survivor but a group of 2+ survivors minimum.
I agree with killers needing an earlier first chase but I don't agree with a lone random survivor being randomly selected by the game to more or less be the first person hooked.
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@lagosta said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2014469#Comment_2014469
The other way around is also true. If a killer DCs, the match KR drops to 0 and pulls the average down, so what's your point?
Also, one statistic alone may not be much, but when ALL KRs skew towards the killer side then something might be up. And stop pointing to anecdotal evidence. "Nurse low KR is proof that statistics fail" is the most resonated fallacy I read in these forums when this graph shows up. Sally is a killer with a steep and unforgiving learning curve but she is far from a scapegoat to your logical prejudice and even if it was, she's still above the 50% threshold.
Statistically survivors DC 4 times as often as killer due to there being 4 times as many survivors then there are killers in a match.
So yes it does in fact hyper-inflate KR upwards and that's with being TOO FAIR to the survivors as we all know survivors DC disproportionately more then killers do.
No the Nurse example holds up as the fact that she IS hard contributes to a low KR but not a low power which you use KR to be an example of killer's power strength.
Nurse is the prime example of why the statistics don't work for estimating a killer's power strength and PS almo has also confirmed that in the top 1% of 1% killers she only has 4/5th place KR wise even with god nurses only being counted.
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I am sorry but there's no objective reason to stay at the exit gates against a deathslinger as things like NOED(/STBFL(?)) work with his pull.
So you are literally never safe while within the exit gates as he can pull you out and one shot you(/rapid double tap you)...
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Yep the aim desist has been getting worse each patch making it become so bad at times that I miss a survivor walking in a straight line whom I am point blank against their back.
Its increadibly painful to play killer this patch because of it.
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@lagosta said:
Take a look:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/I4K7B4VP5U5C/image.png
On all matches where 'theoretically' the most invested killers went against the most invested survivors, the LEAST performing killer is way above the expected mean of 50% kills (the 2k outcome). Are you seriously telling that your experience is more valid than ALL red rank matches put together? Are you sure that your personal experience is really unbiased, despite EVERY SINGLE killer across the roster performing considerably better than what the community considers a draw?
Why don't you prove them wrong and show the data you collected throughout your games, pretty sure an excel sheet could be helpful.
KR means nothing as DC/First hook suicides games are counted as even if only one survivor DCs it usually dooms the other 3(75-100% KR) hyperinflating the total KR.
There's simply put too many factors for KR to matter and it is why the devs have said repeatedly that KR MEANS NOTHING!
Edit: These satistics especially the rad rank ones means Nurse is underpowered and is the worst killer in the game.
So should she be buffed because of the red rank statistics?
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Ok are we going to ignore the survivors whose lag can become so terrible that they can literally become unhookable/undroppable after being picked up?
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To show that when I am playing Claudette I am not a useless Blendette.
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@Pilot said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2003673#Comment_2003673
Oni / Billy are harder to play IMO. They can't do a 270* degree turn, not even a 180*. Go to 2:45, slow it down and tell me what you think.
If you ask me, for now, people are not going to be vocal about it. But once people figure it out how to do it constantly and develop muscle memory it might be a problem, especially after Blight is going to get his FOV fixed and we're gonna see A LOT more Blight players. At least, this is my prediction.
Idk really. It seems a little too much for me. A good blight player can destroy but if he also knows this he'll be unstoppable.
There's also a major difference between Billy/Oni and Blight:
Billy/Oni are instant downs while Blight's isn't and can't be chained without waiting for an external cooldown(power charges).
It makes sense that the weaker damage wise ability with an external cooldown would have better mobility.
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General kenobi.
Anyways I do believe you even without a picture for the screwed up match making as well.
We have so many pictures of it its kinda sad that its still happening.
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Its a noob trap with people trying to rely on it with the now useless Hex:undying.
But by itself its pretty much the baseline power level for where all token stacking hexes should be:
If they reach 5 stacks you should almost always win as its nearly impossible for stacking totems to survive long enough to reach max stacks.
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@Kazim said:
The funny thing is that the twins how are the typical monster that everyone ask for and most people don't like to use them. 🤷♂️
People love the twin's visual design and concept; its just no one plays them because their gameplay sucks.
A beautiful shell can't always hide a rotten core.
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He's the main "Feast or Famine" killer.
If you can deny him a early hit by throwing pallets early you can almost always win against him.
However if he gets a down before he gets his power he's going to snowball the match pretty hard.
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Feel's plague man.
Trust me specific killers that's not the exception but the rule sadly and thus is one of the reasons why the devs are trying to push for MMR over the current pip system.
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Its a map with a strong main building that's always next to the killer shack with effectively 3 guaranteed generators(Two always being on an upper floor) near these buildings.
Let alone with a lot of spots for all exhaustion perks but Head on to be used in while a chase.
Overall a good design choice but favors survivors due to enabling a lot of stronger but niche exhaustion perks like balanced landing/Lithe to be able to be used in nearly every chase.
I am sorry but while its not haddon its still one of the safest maps for survivors in the game.
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Blood lust ONLY exists because of infinite loops which has been said many MANY times.
Its foolish to say its for anything else as the developers not that long ago turned Blood Lust off to see if they had fixed the infinite loops.
There are still A LOT of semi/true infinite loops so bloodlust was turned back on because the game still needs it to make up for bad map design.
So there is no equivalence between the two as one is a good survivor perk and the other is a baseline mechanic meant to break infinite loops.
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@ukenicky said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1972370#Comment_1972370
I don't think BHVR wants to add such things in as it could result in the game being restricted in certain regions.
They already have the Hag ripping out people's livers and eating it so I doubt it would get it banned anywhere that didn't already ban the game for the hag's mori.
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@AppeaseTheEntity said:
What's wraith gona do, go Bing bong and hide from him?
People seem to forget that wraith can rip people heads/spine off with his bear hands out from under a still working freaking car crusher in his lore...
I still don't understand why bear hand decapitation his not mori given that it would be more lore appropriate.
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@Bond4ever said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1971952#Comment_1971952
Difference is you can see those killers, they're not invisible
With the hag's trap she can win every window by the idle mind game with her phantasm instead of instantly teleporting.
She has EVEN LESS counterplay then the spirit does because with the spirit its always possible to take the 3rd option and sneak away erratically from the window/pallet while the spirit is shifted with isn't an option against either the hag or trapper.