UndeddJester
UndeddJester
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... I find an Urban Evasioning basic skin Nea pretty cute... I have a real crisis of conscience killing one...
Not part of the question... but I also find a newbie Amanda who is 24/7 sneaking around map equally cute... again... feel super bad when I pallet stun one.
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I don't like facing Clown, but that's because I'm not that good in chase, and I'm not sharp enough to pre-throw and then know where to chain to most of the time... but if you play as him, you realise he is definitely not OP.
Clown is an anti-loop specialist, his kit is exceptionally good at cutting survivors off and ending chase quickly... only really trumped by the likes of Nurse...
However Clown lacks map mobility and any inherent slow down in his kit, plus is vulnerable to pre-running and pre-throwing pallets. He can get a lot of pressure built up sure, but any imperfections in chase can quickly eat into his lead and snowball out of his control very fast.
This is why a lot of Clowns fall back onto tunneling a player out, because the one area he is strong is gating a survivor to an area and forcing a hit, which suits tunneling well, and the fact he is so good at it is his main means at which he can draw other survivors off gens to try and help.
TBH, he kind of needs a buff, but the only thing debatably overpowered is his pinky finger iri. It's not that hard to land a direct hit in a skilled players hands, and this does get very potent... this is the add-on that makes Clown unbuffable, because any buff to his kit has to account for this add-on too.
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@NerfDHalready said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3627677#Comment_3627677
it wouldn't fit the essential theme and purpose of totems but idk the integration of totem cleansing into regular gameplay sounds so nice as it would both give survivors a secondary objective (while giving so many perks and maps a real purpose to exist) and adjust the gen speeds as the game goes on, which would make for the perfect balance (regarding gen speed) in my opinion.
cleansing would be completely independent from blessing so you'd need to break a hex totem no matter what. if you'd only bless a hex and left, it would be both a hex and a boon totem and therefore the associated hex perk would still remain active.
I getcha, its a "do you wanna be sure to get rid of the hex, or have the boon first" type deal.
Though boons only working on dull/cleansed hex locations might be interesting to consider as well... give a bit of usefulness to Haunted Ground on its own without other hexes to support it...
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@NerfDHalready said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3627603#Comment_3627603
ah my bad 🤦♂️ i insisted on calling it inner strength before the reclaiming of st license because inner healing sounds weird but here i am confusing it.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3627604#Comment_3627604
i would encourage it because comp gamers still won't do totems even if it gave 5k and doing gens gave nothing. i'm down for anything that makes soloq bearable.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3627555#Comment_3627555
you are cooking with this, and i like it a lot. that would speed up drawn out games while slowing down early game both of which would be great changes. though this would destroy hexes since survivors won't be wasting that much time if they come across 3 dulls while looking for hexes anymore meanwhile erasing devour hope from the face of earth.
here are the few changes i'd make to this:
- i'd change all numbers by 5 (100>95>90>85>80>75), since essentially this would be a survivor nerf and i don't think that's very much needed. yes on high levels gens are fast fast but on lower level lobbies... it's tough. 100 with all totems up wouldn't make it much more higher than current gens and 90 is reached after 2 broken totems while 75 is considerably lower than current 90 which would make it a fair trade.
- broken totems can be blessed and blessed totems can be broken, basically making survivors bless a totem spot rather than the totem itself, putting an end to the fight between cleansers and booners.
- a totem spot is gone after it's snuffed. you can still move the boon without wasting the spot.
- boon perks should get buffs with their spammability gone.
- blessing a hex is no longer slower nor does it deactivate the hex.
- visibility and audibility is fine imo, but boon effect is on the skull part of the totem instead of the burning part since that would block hexes' burning flames
- pentimento... do relit totems further remove gen charges, say 2 per? does it not give its effects (fully) for broken dulls? it would need special attention for sure.
in this set up totems are basically forced into the survivor objective pool, regardless of whatever the killer is doing
which would be what both killers and survivors want no? gens are too fast and holding m1 is boring, people always say. looking for totems isn't as boring as holding m1, might get frustrating on particular maps but still. maps (item) would get incredibly stronger and obscure totem perks finally can see some use like counterforce and small game. getting that 1k and doing those challenges wouldn't be much of a game throwing anymore.
Hmmm... I didn't have enough confidence in it... maybe I should have just thrown the idea out there xD
Only thing that confused me there, how would you have a blessed and hexed totem? Wouldn't you always cleanse it?
Or is the idea that you bless it to block the hex, but don't lose the space as a blessable location by cleansing it?
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I always like these. A lore accurate build for Oni would probably be:
- Sloppy Butcher
- Blood Echo
- Blood Hound
- Forced Penance
- Splintered Hull
- Ink Lion
Kazan is quick to enrage and enter Blood fury, and makes a point of desecrating and brutalising his victims, turning them in to bloody corpses, shamed by their defilement at his hands, striking fear and hatred within those who witness his acts upon their kin/home.
All of these perks wound victims and make them bleed profusely, enarging Oni when anyone stands united against him, and punishing everyone who opposes him.
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A mad cap idea I've had for Hex's for a while is to have totems have a passive effect in the trial, so that when someone in soloQ breaks them, then they aren't actually wasting the teams time, and giving killers more time against gen rushing, while allowing survivors to counter 3 genning.
Something like: -
- Generators have a base repair charge of 80 charges. (Gens repair at 1 c/s)
- Every totem in the map adds 5 charges to the total repair time of all generators, capping out at 105s.
- Cleansed or booning a totem removes those charges from all generators globally.
- Booning a totem grants an additional 2.5 charge reduction to all generators.
- Snuffing or breaking a boon totem adds those charges back to the gen pool.
- Give dull totems a white flame/glow to make them easier to find.
The problems of course is this is overly punishing to new players, and Boons would also need signficiantly improving in general... though at least perks like Small Game, Detectives Hunch and Counterforce actually would be useful.... However there is also how unbelievably busted Hex: Pentimento would become.... there is also a question of how good hexws in general would be because survivors will always be actively looking for them every game.
It also feels a little shoe-horned to my mind... in this set up totems are basically forced into the survivor objective pool, regardless of whatever the killer is doing... so... not overly happy with it... so I've never suggested it, but it's at least interesting to think about.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3627300#Comment_3627300
you keep insisting that they're same perks. it is like saying undying is same perk as thrill of the hunt for defending totems but hex:undying is better in every way.
We're gonna live forever is appeal is suppose to be 100% healing speed. the endurence aspect was added to the perk because it used to be equivalent effect of BBQ where it increased your bloodpoint gains by 25/50/75/100%. The BP bonus was removed so they added tag in effect to try make perk more appealing but it was worthless since killer could hit the person with we're gonna live forever. Fun fact, original version of the perk was 200% BP.
MFT has endurance condition to activate the perk. The main appeal of MFT is suppose to be that you gain 3% haste when your deep wound. once upon time, it was indirect exhaustion type perk that gave consistent haste bonus. Now, it is some situational effect that nobody runs.
these two perk are not specialized in anti-slug. their anti-slug nature is side ability. Buckle up on other hand is entirely specialized in anti-slug.
Yes, I understand the history of their design, but I disagree with your implication that the endurance effects and anti-slug on MFT and WGLF are side effects/tacked on, not primarily what you use the perks for. We all know how impactful endurance is; you do, if you have any sense and you can, play for it.
- WGLF is a pretty cut and dry anti-slug perk, it literally heals downed survivors faster, with an additional effect to protect that allybif you manage to get them up.
- MFT is the special case, as you can also get your speed via other means, but even with its original design, the endurance when healing an ally is still quite clearly anti slug.... you can even get it again by healing the slugged player to full. Your typical scenario is gonna be taking a hit on route to a slugged ally on 95%, finishing off the 0.8s to heal them, and getting endurance for when the killer follows you.
Considering WGLF, MFT and old Buckle Up, all 3 of them offer some form of anti-slug, each with different effects. How good they are is free to debate, but all 3 offered 3 different options.
None of them were popular/chosen for their anti-slug qualities for the same reason Tenacity and even Unbreakable isn't popular. Even if the effect is strong.... the perk does nothing if the killer doesn't Slug. This is the only scenario any of them can be used. Realistically you're not very likely to pick up a survivor unless the killer goes on a long slug spree, and the survivor makes a lot of recovery before you try, even with WGLF.
So the scenario where all 3 perks get triggered: -
- The killer has to slug for long enough to make it there/the survivor to recover.
- The survivor has to be complete healing before/as the killer comes back, and be ready to take the hit.
This is where old Buckle Up drops off. The need to completely heal so you can stand up and run away before the killer cones back, to not even get more speed than the killer if they do... means the perk achieves basically nothing even if you do pull it off more often than not. So now we give it the very strong effect to grant endurance to both survivors. The perk is still not popular, because its trigger condition still requires the killer to slug.
In isolation, this is a problem, because we have 3 perks that trigger off the same scenario, with Buckle Up no longer synergising with the other 2, as it offers the same endurance effect of both MFT and WGLF, and as stated above is an effect that is too hard to earn typically, despite the effect being strong.
You see where this going I'm sure. Versatile perks that work in a lot of scenarios will always be better than perks that require a specific thing to happen. The only reason Buckle Up is relevant now is because when combined with FTP, it becomes versatile, and can be used not only when slugged, but even on a regular down, and be used for anti-tunnel, and even just to punish killers in general.
The argument is that two players getting endurance is too strong an effect to have in a versatile scenario. In our basic slugged scenario, it is fine... but it removes synergies with the similar perks. However with FTP it's now too versatile.
You traditionally could consider FTP with WGLF as an option to be really anti-tunnel, with WGLF giving a little anti-slug viability too. You might consider Dead Hard to combo with it... you may even take MFT to give you even more help escaping after doing it. With my revised Buckle Up you could consider it in place of WGLF or MFT, both options are worth thinking about.
However with modern Buckle Up there is absolutely no point in any of that, as it's just hands down better at doing the same job as all of those perks for only 1 perk slots... and then it offers even more on top.
FTP + Buckle Up is your anti-slug, anti-tunnel, chase extender, gate escape, Swiss army knife combo all in one. It basically makes every other anti-slug perk even more situational than they already are... I.e. can still be used while wounded.
My overarching point is, Buckle Up without FTP offers a very situational bonus, that doesn't synergise with the perks that trigger in the same situation. With FTP, it's a super combo that trumps most other options in the game.
My goal would be to tone down the BUFTP combo, and allow synergies with MFT and WGLF.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3626819#Comment_3626819
Made for this has effect to gain endurance because the condition to use the perk is to be in deep wound. Without effect, you wouldn't be able to trigger the perk. We're gonna live forever gives 100% healing bonus for healing survivors on the down. This perk has token system because the perk used to originally give you blood points. They had to replace the token system with something else to not make it flat out useless. these two perk have different design goals. They're different perks. They're not being used because they're not good enough.
Learn something new off you every time man. I love DBD history, so cheers for that little gem dude 😅
Still the point remains, even if these perks were buffed/meta, we essentially have Buckle Up that does the same job as these 2 perks combined. Even if FTP wasn't an option (where most people agree Buckle Up isn't OP on its own), it's still not good to have 1 perk doing the job of 2 perks, without appropriate trade offs.
We have crossovers like this for other perks, like Botany Knowledge vs. Desperate Measures, but the 2 play differently and you can argue either way which one is better. The Exhaustion perks are similar, SB is probably the best, but you can also put reasonable arguements for Lithe, BL, Dead Hard.
Now WGLF probably doesn't need it's condition, and that would probably be a fine perk. Not OP, as it does nothing if the Killer doesn't slug, and when used with FTP it only affects the target, so we don't get this nasty combo.
MFT is probably in an OK place too, because the 3% as we know can be devastating in the fight hands, and can be supplemented by other perks to attain. The pick up is hard to pull off but it can be pretty clutch when you manage it
However if these effects are/bevone well balanced, they are still pointless, because FTP + Buckle Up exists and just beats them hands down...
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I have a lot of fun with them, it encourages you to think about perks, builds, and even characters/ add-ons you wpuldnt normally use, that would give you the best chances of achieving them.
I had one from Tome 3 to grab a survivor out of a locker using Iron Maiden... You rarely get locker grabs in most games, so how do you get it?
I took Myers and the add-ons for longer stalk time in exchange for longer t3 with Corrupt Intervention and pretended to be Tombstone Piece Myers. Got it in like 2 minutes on the first survivor in my first game 😅
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Hahahahaha... that's funny.
TBH... Plot Twist gives so many daft and goofy interactions that work out in the survivors favour, I reckon this one can probably slide by :D
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As a model painter myself... this is exceptional work. Used their inks perfectly, the shading is spot on.
The illumination of Doctor's electric shock on his coat is very good, especially on white... anyone who has tried shading white on a miniature before knows how easy that is to totally screw up... the only way I know how to do it without making it look dirty is using a pigmentless paint to severely soften the wash and then painstakingly keep adding layers until you get enough colour to get the idea, but not enough to drown the colour underneath...
Dry brushing/highlighting is seemless, to the point I'm struggling to tell if they just layered the highlights or not...
I also recognise Blood for the Blood God paint... I approve😏
Literally my only critique... is "No miniature is truly finished until they've been based". I demand MacMillan shrubs on Trapper's base! 😁
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Ah, so you're saying the target shouldn't get endurance. It's not a bad point at all... however this makes Buckle Up a non-conditional MFT. The main issue for me with new Buckle Up is it now steps on the toes of 2 other perks, and the real issue is, with FTP it is better than both of them:
- Made For This gives endurance to healer (but only when wounded and takes as long as a regular pick up)
- We're Gonna Live Forever gives endurance to target (but only when satisfying the activation requirements, and at +100% heal speed, which equals 8 secs from 0% recovery or 0.4s from 95% recovery)
The counter to both of these is hitting the other target, and in the case of Made For This, doesn't work against instadowns if you're full HP, like Myers, Bubba, Ghost Face, Hex: Devour hope, etc, etc.... neither case of which is an issue for FTP + Buckle Up.
To my mind it isn't healthy to have multiple perks do exactly the same thing, with one being safer/better in almost all scenarios, and having one additional scenario where it is outright obnoxious (i.e. healing in the killers face during the attack cooldown animation). This kinda thing cuts off build ideas, and makes the game less interesting overall.
I personally want Buckle Up to go back to how it was, and then buff the numbers. Give it something like 25% haste that degrades down to 10% over 6/8/10 seconds to the person you pick up, and 10% flat for the person who picks up. This way they're actually able to make some distance from the killer for the duration, while you become the easier target, which fits Ash's badass hero persona.
This would mean you can use MFT and We're Gonna Live forever with Buckle Up for some fun, and if you used FTP, you can use something like Dead Hard to try and get away with it. Things like this actually opens up pathways for being clever with builds, rahter than just having one unga bunga combo that is way better than everything else by default.
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@radiantHero23 said:
I WAS SUMMONED!!!!
Changes for our lady would be:
- faster crouch movement speed (100% movement speed base)
- faster crouching and uncrouching (combat straps basekit)
- longer ambush duration
- survivors can longer die to a rbt while searching a jigsaw box
The RBTs are extremely oppressive even without addons. You just need to know how to use all the different rng-variations correctly.
All that said... I do also really like this variation... I tend to use John's medical File and Combat Straps in majority of buiilds just cause it feels so much nicer to play...
With this at base and the longer ambush lunge, we would be able to crouch to mind game quickly, and if we commit to the ambush, the longer lunge would be super helpful at larger tiles and at shack... and we'd still have access to the RBT powahs...
What do you reckon to adding:
- Ambush scream starts after 60% charge (0.30s).
On your list? The crouch itself is a mind game, and this would strengthen that mind game more, as the survivor has less time to realise you're committing to an ambush (which you can still cancel).
The only sad part is I love the ability to spam roar at survivors, which I find a suprisingly useful communicaiton tool when needed... although my brain tells me its a good idea... my heart does not agree🤔
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Hehehehe, funny.
The 2 variatons of the add-ons are different though. The issue with old Alc Ring was a sufficiently skilled Blight (not even that highly skiled Blight) could go on a massive slugging spree basically until he missed, and even if he did miss his power still comes back pretty fast anyway, so he can basically just keep doing it all throughout the match.
This new version allows him to keep rushing inifinitely until he gets a hit, but when he gets that hit, he has a 20 second cooldown period where he gets literally 0 rushes to convert it into a down and has to play as an m1 killer. The smart thing to do now is to try and keep survivors wounded, and use the time to actually hook or do some other menial task while the power is disabled.
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@radiantHero23 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3626545#Comment_3626545
I feel like i heard these suggestions before somewhere....
Absolutely agree! with all of them 🐽
What can I say? When our resident Pig Main speaks... only a fool doesn't listen... especially as an aspiring Pig main myself🤘🐽🤘
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After several iterations of this discussion I'm now pretty settled on my Pig changes:
Buffs to Chase
- Crouching movement speed +5% (3.60 -> 3.8 m/s)
- Ambush charges +33% faster (0.75 -> 0.5s).
- Ambush scream starts after 60% charge (0.30s).
- Ambush lunge time +20% (2.0 -> 2.5s)
Nerfs to Reverse Bear Traps
- Saw traps cannot pop while the survivor is searching Pig Jigsaw boxes.
Or
- While searching a Jigsaw Box, each Great Skill pauses the head trap timer for 2s. (Jigsaw boxes have an 80% skill chance every 1 second)
This improves the 1 area she really struggles, which is chasing around loops, but gives a little bit of safety to survivors removing their RBTs to compensate.
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@TheRealConsent said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3625339#Comment_3625339
1- Stop necro'ing posts.
2- HE WROTE THAT WHILE IT WAS STILL 15% REGRESSION. Literally NO ONE would run it if it was still 15%.
Eruption does 10% and that can trigger on MULTIPLE generators; It doesnt require a Scourge hook, and its not limited either.
Thanks dude, I was trying to work out what crazy update I missed for a moment there xD
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@PastaSauce said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3624734#Comment_3624734
That doesn't work at all. If you lose 2 stacks with every basic and special attack and gain 1 stack by hitting a non-obsession, then you will be stuck at 1 token because you have to use a basic attack to hit a survivor in the first place. That means you're at 1 token, start a basic attack costing you 2 tokens taking you to 0 tokens, land a basic attack on a survivor taking you up to 1 token, repeat. It also means missed attacks would cost tokens. I'm sorry but the code for PWYF is not even slightly applicable here.
You misunderstood my guy. Sorry I didn't make it clearer.
I mean hitting the obsession works like Play With Your Food. As it stands, it is whenever the Obsession loses a health state, which means Plot Twist and FTP denies the STBFL stack... pretty BS. Instead make it so hitting the Obsession with Basic Attacks and Special Attacks should be the condition.
However its not that simple, as some things are special attacks, but are not actually attacks... things like Trapper traps, Vile Purge on Plague and Add-On kills from Myers. PWYF aĺready makes this distinction, so my suggestion is reuse the code for PWYF to determine what is and isn't a special attack to damage the obsession.
There is a nice list here:
Play with Your Food is a Unique Perk belonging to The Shape.Prestige The Shape to Prestige 1, 2, 3 respectively to unlock Tier I, Tier II, Tier III of Play with Your Food for all other Characters. Nerf: decreased the Movement Speed bonus to 3/4/5 % per Token. Nerf: added a cool-down timer to Token-accumulation. Change: updated the Perk's description to specify the types of Attack instead of just referring to them as "offensive actions". Tokens are acquired whenever the Killer's Obsession escapesWeirdly Pinhead's damaging chain add-on doesn't count for losing a stack of PWYF... which seems wrong to me... but hey ho... 🤔
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I have fun with most Killers tbh.
S I almost never have a bad game. People playing these chars are almost always fun to face.
A is fun as long as they don't tunnel hard or use really cheap strategies/builds (e.g. Tomestone Piece Myers, Hard Tunnel Pyramid Head, Face The Darkness Head Pop Pig).
B it kinda depends how they play. Played well but fair, they are amazing. Played dirty are frustrating.
C you get good games and annoying ones. Basically B... but games tend to 50/50.
D usually is a cheap strat... they can be fun but more often you're getting a lame playstyle.
E always feels bad... even if fair.
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@Alen_Starkly said:
I hope they do with Skull Merchant the same thing they're doing with Sadako: revert the rework, but fine tune certain elements. Current Skull Merchant sucks to go against, because you can go from healthy to broken very fast, if you had been scanned by drones 2 times previously. It's not really about skill.
The old Skull Merchant was more interesting. You had to strategize to get that exposed status effect.
The main thing I don't want back is the AOE auto detect zone on an active drone personally, the dodging beams approach is far more interesting to play around, use, and navigate against.
Other areas of her kit are fine to be on the table, but an unavoidable AOE that you must disarm while guaranteed detected has nothing interesting about it.
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If this is the change they want to make, they should make it basic and special attacks, and just reuse the coding from Play With Your Food stacks. Literally achieves their goal with none of the exploits.
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As someone who wasn't around long enough/experienced enough to develop hatred for Skull Merchant at her time of release, and thus have no bias towards/for her, I do find the hate she gets laughable at times. It's like I've listened to the talking points around her, and I understand why the bias is there, but I find people's inability to acknowledge their bias quite unbelievable at times.
There are other killers/set ups/strategies/things in general that I've found waaaaaaaaaay more annoying to face than modern Skull Merchant: -
- Agitation, Iron Grasp, Insidious Bubba in basement before AFC.
- Sloppy Butcher, Nurse's Calling hit and run/tunnel Wraith.
- Thanataphobia hit and run/tunnel Legion.
- Face the Darkness guaranteed head pop Pig.
- Pinhead with your average SoloQ team where no one understands how the damned box works.
- Impossible Skill check Doctor.
- Anyone cracked and going maximum sweat on Spirit, Nurse or Blight.
Like on the list of stuff that frustrates me, Skull Merchant largely seems kinda small potatoes tbh. I think her kit has a little too much in it, it's unclear what is in effect when and how to compensate, but other than that, I'm still waiting to have 1 of these horror games that everyone is talking about... honestly I get way more annoyed at all the survivors giving up immediately over anything any Skull Merchant has done.
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- Take Reassurance to stall hooks for your allies.
- Take Camaraderie to stall hooks for yourself.
- Take Desperate Measures + Dead Hard/Overcome to unhook faster and sprint away after taking a hit.
- Take Borrowed Time to grant the 10% speed boost and endurance for longer to your allies.
- Take Off the Record to ensure the killer can't wait out your basekit endurance.
- Take FTP and Buckle Up to mess up the killers hook interrupt attempts.
- Take Made For This to get more value out of attempts to chew through your endurance and potentially save a slugged player.
- Take Sprint Burst so your off hook speed is 150%.
- Take Kindred to know if you should stay on gens or leave, consider Open Handed to make this even better and help allies with Bond.
All of the above are made more effective by the AFC. Is it free? No. However they are all easier to pull off because you have a 16m buffer zone.
AFC does exactly what it says it does, it prevents face camping.
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@VomitMommy said:
Eruption is so trash with this. Basically every kick is going to take 2 stacks for it. (1 kick, 1 down)
Ruin is going to be good, because it shouldn't count towards it, so you get kinda early game regression for free.
Blocking perks are going to be way better now.
CoB, Overchange should get buff with this. Those are beyond useless when it is so limited...
I wonder how Opression is going to work, but that CD is just way too high...
You manage to kick the same generator more than maybe 3 times with Eruption? I wish I played against your survivors...
Seriously though, Eruption is not trash with this change. You get 5% now on your kick instead of 2.5%.
This gives you more time to proc the Eruption outright, increasing your chance of getting value, and you now get 10% without having to stop. You also cause screams as well on that gen, and it takes 4.5 seconds to break the regression now, so you get potential to interrupt repair attempts too, both before, and after Eruption pops.
Then there is the elephant in the room... If you got 4 downs on 1 gen, you also likely got 4 hooks... that means you're not far away from getting some one out of the game, all from 1 gen. Sounds to me like you're doing well in this scenario.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
Sadako's old power improved and coming back.
Billy is coming back with very decent buffs and his annoying nerf finally removed.
We need old Freddy too. His new power is boring and it does not feel like Freddy himself. But you had it. You got amazing Freddy design which felt Nightmare Demon himself.
We just need him back with some good buffs and QoL changes.
As a big NoES fan, I don't wanna get hopes up or start spreading rumours or anything... but with the strength of recent acquisitions by BHVR, I low key suspect the reason Freddy is off the radar is BHVR are hoping to secure the real Freddy Kruegar...
BHVR isnt a small fledgling game developer anymore like they were when they originally acquired Freddy, they had to take the new version or nothing in their original agreement... but they actually have some real money and clout behind them now...
With all their recent game updates, you can bet they have heard us, and I suspect they have something big cooking for Freddy...
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
They just did not see the real issue with this perk.
Like why i would make killer run around progressing gens? My goal will be take him away from gens. 5% speed is not worth it, even 10% speed is not worth it. Because killer just can leave me and pressure on gens.
This perk is just bad and have no use. I wish they would just rework it. But instead of reworking, they nerfed it.
Gonna be honest, I think people are underestimating this perk change. 36m is actually a pretty damned large radius, and where it'll come into play most prominently is breaking a 3 gen.
Each time the killer pushes the survivor off of the gen, the other gens in range will gain the bonus. You have 3 of you on 3 different gens, especially with the limit to kicks now, there is potential for some solid value... You combine with Deja Vu, you've got yourself a decent little anti-3gen build with just 2 perks.
@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3624456#Comment_3624456
I think just increasing radius to 48 meters and revert gen-speed decrease to old % would make perk see use. Like I would definitely use it because i enjoy looping but this version is too useless.
That'd be busted my guy, 48m in most maps will be hitting 4 gens at almost all times 😅
TBH, at 36m, not unrealistic to grant it by accident just playing normally, especially on a small map with multiple floors like Game or Midwich, or maps with heavy traffic central areas like Disturbed Ward or Chapel.
A change that might be useful to add is to reveal auras of survivors affected by the perk, so that at least the user can actually see the impact of the perk.
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Yeah, I am looking at the big picture...
If you've managed to get all of that on a 3 gen cluster... you're looking at least 3 downs... probably 5. That's a lot of progression halted, 12% from Surge, 15% from kicks, 30% from Eruption, plus whatever regression time you got from Trail. You're probably looking at 65% regression or more across those gens, which across 3 survivors 150+ seconds you've saved from the team, plus whatever time you clawed back from them saving and healing each other.
That to me sounds like you've gotten good value, and should be close to getting someone out of the game...
Like tell me exactly how all of this you've described, is bad...
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@RpTheHotrod said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3623866#Comment_3623866
What about trail of torment users? They kick gens regularly to trigger its affect and can have zero reason to actually do it for regression
Again I'm not convinced... Trail has a looooong cooldown, I typically find with Trail that even if survivors are Jonny on the Spot with removing my Trail, I still get what... maybe 6 uses most of the time?
Thats on any gen...
Also Trail is actually buffed, because it takes 5 seconds now to break Trail, rather than just tapping the gen.
Edit: Remember it's 8 kicks PER gen, not 8 kicks period. I doubt you'll manage to get 40 uses out of Trail of Torment in your average game.
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I don't think so... 5% for the kick now instead of 2.5%, so just by kicking the gen you get more value...
You thus get more time to use Eruption, and get an additional 10% when it goes off. That's a 5% net gain over what you would have gotten kicking the gen again, and you didn't have to go back to it do it. It also starts regressing again, which a survivor must repair for 5 seconds to stop the regression, so if you're nearby when you get your down and you hear a scream, you can potentially save against the regression prevention too.
Then there is the point whenver I've used Eruption, I can't remember a time I've kicked a gen more than maybe 3 times.
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This issue with STBFL was a little bit of an oversight I think...They should just Piggyback off of the same coding as Play With Your Food, and have it be basic attacks and special attacks.
Play with Your Food is a Unique Perk belonging to The Shape.Prestige The Shape to Prestige 1, 2, 3 respectively to unlock Tier I, Tier II, Tier III of Play with Your Food for all other Characters. Nerf: decreased the Movement Speed bonus to 3/4/5 % per Token. Nerf: added a cool-down timer to Token-accumulation. Change: updated the Perk's description to specify the types of Attack instead of just referring to them as "offensive actions". Tokens are acquired whenever the Killer's Obsession escapesA change I would have liked to see though:
- Hitting a survivor with endurance does not benefit from the attack cooldown.
This would kill the ability to chew through endurance states and tunnel off hook with Rapid Brutality so easily. I feel like this instead of the speed nerf would be better.
We'll see what the PTB brings.
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@RFSa09 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3623727#Comment_3623727
i don´t think anyone here can like, be a killer you know? unless you´re a psycho sigma male or something
What if I have proven my credentials in Dead by Dalylight? Given the choice, I'd choose not to be a survivor and be butchered for all eternity... 😅
Pliable Sinew
"Dear Entity... I do, in fact, actually have a neck"
Whenever you vault a window, you can look 30/50/70 degrees in all directions for the vault duration.
"I've never seen anything like it before... it just... looked at me..." - Anon
I Beg Your Pardon?
When in chase, press the active ability button to activate I Beg Your Pardon? for 0.75 seconds.
- Your movement is is slowed by 60/50/40% for 1.25 seconds.
- If a survivor stuns you with a pallet, you instead catch it and push it back upright before causing the entity to break it. This perk then goes on cooldown for 45 seconds.
"Manners... in such short supply nowadays... "
Deal Maker
"I have a deal for you... as long as you don't mind getting your hands dirty..."
After hooking the 2nd to last survivor, once they go to the struggle phase this perk activates.
- While this perk is active you can press the ability button to unhook a survivor, granting them permanent endurance, immunity to deep wound, and a permanent global aura of the final survivor.
- These effects end if the survivor does a conspicuous action.
"I wasn't sure what to do... It just kept muttering something under it's breath about rodents..."
Edit: ... Now I think about it... what if DBD was actually a government funded profiling tool? 😶
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@NerfDHalready said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3623587#Comment_3623587
didn't realize ALL active tvs inflict condemn, and i assume survivors won't be able to turn tvs off at the cost of 1 condemn stack like they could before, which could help her.
but tapes will be such a non-factor it feels like then, you just need to travel a distance to get rid of stacks. holding onto tapes would build stacks over time before rework, and getting your tape knocked off inflicts with 2 stacks now. they won't do anything after this.
You may be right, will need to see it play out in the PTB, but the impression I get right now is a Sadako who tracks people's movement well will be able to prevent survivors getting rid of TVs, and offer a similar level of slowdown as the Pig.
I don't think she'll be high tier, she's still just a stealthy M1 with a TP killer at her core... but the slowdown will buy her time, and she'll at least be more engaging and interesting on both sides...
If she catches a high condemn target, that's when the sauce begins 😁😁😁
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@NerfDHalready said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3623458#Comment_3623458
this is old sadako and if they don't bring old iri tape back her condemn mechanic will go back to being irrelevant and non existent once again. we'll see
Not so convinced though.
Her TVs come back on considerably faster than before, and survivors will be grabbing tapes rather than ignoring them to disable the TV for the longer 70s, and ofc denying her TP to get condemned stacks. The fact that the stacks can get permanently locked in, is not trivial.
The kicker is, once they grab a tape, they can't grab them to disable the TV again until they get rid of them... and once TVs come on again, every teleport will affect ALL powered TVs.
This means once the TV comes back on, they're gonna be getting condemned stacks every TP near, not just that gen, but every gen. So they have to go do their TV at some point, otherwise they can't disable her TVs or her condemn build up.
With the right gen slowdown, timings and predictions... Sadako could do some serious work.
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Crying good? I'm guessing good...
Seems to me her weak chase is supplemented by a strong "ignore it at your peril" slow down. Gives her a lot of reward for guessing TVs correctly as she can now lock in condemned... but guessing wrong doesn't completely kill all of her pressure, and converting chases is a Biiiig deal.
I like the idea that ignoring condemned becomes a "get off the damned gens" slowdown... though a high level Sadako knowing where I grabbed my tape and working out my TV... 😱😱😱😱
NGL... all changes here sound fricking awesome...
3 gen kicking/breaking got shafted, but so did gen tapping... so that was actually a very solid pair of changes.
Hillbilly with 100% chainsaw turn on Hillbilly basekit! Rewards for being a chainsaw nutcase!! More zoom zoom!!! Just... put it on a damned cracker for me 🤘😁🤘
Blight changes all look reasonable, but I'll wait for a more experienced hand to rate them.
Perk changes are all great... love Shadowborn being an alternative to Lightborn as an anti flashlight perk to catch those filthy pallet break flashlighters (I am one of said filthy pallet break flashlighters).
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As a console killer: Deathslinger.
Every other killer it feels like, even if they're tough on console, there is something I can do with add-ons, or builds, or even play style to be somewhat successful with them... even Huntress I can usually mind game and secure a hit with either the axe or the m1, as a vaulted window or pallet is still down... but with Deathslinger, every miss is so much lost distance, and the fact you have to be mindful not only of hitting your target, but where you are respectively when you hit your target... it makes it brutal on console.
For survivors: Ace... I dunno why, but I'm jinxed whenever I play Ace... every challenge I get for him is a 10 game no escape streak 😨
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@ElodieSimp said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3621921#Comment_3621921
So you suggest holding a player hostage that doesn't want to be in that game any longer? Doesn't sound like a solution, just sounds like you want to troll someone.
Hook Suicides are not the root of the issue, if BHVR started solving root issues, we wouldn't even be here.
I'll happily punish someone for screwing over the rest of their team, yes. If that person wants to act like a child, I have no problem treating them like one and putting them in time out.
You joined a game that requires 5 players, then kicked your toys outta the pram and refused to play, after you already agreed. I don't tunnel, I don't camp, I don't usually play meta.
If you're so selfish that you are willing to ruin my, and 3 other people games after making that implied agreement, then all courtesy goes off the table.
You reward behaviour you want to see, you punish behaviour you don't, its that simple.
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The problem is at a certain point survivors stop trying to do gens and start competing with each other for hatch. You can't make 2 survivors try to get each other out, and if you look at the store page, survivors don't necessarily have to work together. Potentially screwing each other over to save themselves is part of the game, as it would be if this were real life.
This involves just hiding infinitum until one of the survivors is found, so the only way for the killer to have a reasonable shot at getting a 4k to maintain their win, they have to slug. Otherwise its a 50/50 gamble... less in fact, cause the survivor can still get gate if the killer gets to hatch first.
Before anyone says anything about "you already won with 3k, why do you need a 4k?", a 4k does translate to increased bloodpoints and end game score for chances to pip up, and is almost a minimum requirement in iri rank to get 2 pips, and that also ignores any challenges the killer might have.
At a certain point, both Survivors become in it for themselves, so if you have a better way of the Killer securing a winning game without putting it on a coin flip, do please share.
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@FFirebrandd said:
Hello everyone.
In the light of the Stranger Things perks leaving the collection of general perks and the devs AMA seeming to not get why the general and free perks need a tune up, I thought I would go through every general Killer perk and the ones available for free (steam version) and explain if they need changed, why they need changed and give a potential set of changes for them if necessary. If people want me to, I can do this for the Survivor free perks as well.
Bitter Murmur
Honestly, Bitter Murmur has always felt very underwhelming to me. I believe the reason is that information is primarily useful for preventing the Survivors from successfully doing something. This perk only gives you the info *after* they've done the thing. It isn't useless, especially paired with NOED, but it is still kind of underwhelming. I'm not sure this would fix it, but I think the duration of the aura reading should be buffed to 10 seconds, and the endgame aura reading to 10/12/15 seconds. This would also help immensely with the annoyance of the black bubble blocking the aura.
Deerstalker
Honestly I'm not sure this perk should even be a general perk. Newbie killers probably shouldn't be slugging because they will probably do it wrong and lose hooks for no gain. That said, this perk does do a passable job of allowing killers to track their slugs, but could use a tune up in the form of also helping the killer know when they might be losing a slug. In that vein... I think it should also do the following: Any survivors healing a revealed survivor will also be revealed, and the color of the aura changes depending on the Survivor’s recovery meter.
Distressing
In theory this perk could be good via enhancing perks that weaponize the Terror Radius. In practice, none of the current TR weaponization perks are good and the only decent one isn't either general or free. Also I personally feel that combo pieces have no business existing in the general perk set because new players could easily not have the perks necessary to combo with them. So… I think this perk should gain a 3/4/5% repair speed penalty for survivors inside the killers Terror Radius. I think that will be enough to be helpful, but not so much that it’s suffocating since countering this effect would be difficult. Also we should add Ruin’s “this effect ends once a Survivor is killed by any means” just to the repair speed penalty.
Hex: No One Escapes Death
Honestly, I think this is possibly one of the best perks to have in the general set. Newbie killers are going to have times where they just get bodied for one reason or another. This gives them a much needed safety net. This perk should not see any changes.
Hex: Thrill of the Hunt
This used to be an OK stand alone perk because you could get extra value out of it by contesting the cleanse and either getting a hit or deleting the cleanse progress or sometimes both. Now it is just bad partially because the Killer has next to no feedback that it's actually helping at all. So, to fix it just bring back the Cleansing notification, and maybe nerf the slowdown if necessary.
Insidious
Let’s be honest, no healthy game play ever happens due to this perk. This perk is completely useless outside of camping and we probably don't want to encourage that. Camping basement Bubba can be funny occasionally, but I think that's a loss that will make the game overall better. So, I think it should be reworked.
Hex: Insidious
Starts deactivated.
Activated by manually lighting a dull totem. This action is a retooled version of the snuff action.
While active, grants the Undetectable status effect.
Deactivates when you damage a Survivor by any means.
If cleansed while active, it gets permanently deactivated.
Yes, I just smooshed Hex: Face the Darkness and an old version of Trail of Torment together to make this rework.
Iron Grasp
This is good for what it does. However, it has a problem of accomplishing exactly nothing if no one contests the hook and the hook the killer goes to is nearby and in the open, but the effect itself isn't really strong enough to be that conditional. So I think it needs to gain a small additional effect on top of what it currently does that will pretty much always be useful. Gain an action speed bonus of 10/15/20% when picking up, dropping, or hooking Survivors.
Scourge Hook: Monstrous Shrine
The effect this perk gives is too weak to matter, and would be incredibly obnoxious to face if it was stronger. Currently its best use is basically just a combo piece with the other Scourge Hooks to make the basement be Scourge Hooks, but that’s useless to a new player because they won’t have Pain Res or Gift of Pain yet. So… I think this should get a partial rework as well.
Keep the turning the basement hooks into Scourge Hooks.
Whenever a Survivor is hooked onto a Scourge Hook, the following effects applies while the Survivor remains on the hook.
Increases the Action speed of breaking Pallets, Walls and Generators by 20/25/30%
Increases vault speed by 5/10/15%
Shattered Hope
Shattered Hope has one simple issue. You never know when you will need this because it exists solely to counter a small subsection of Survivor perks. If there isn't one in the game, this perk is a dead slot. Also it is my opinion that Killer Hexes are way too all or nothing to be pickable. I believe that this perk can get buffed to kill 2 birds with 1 stone so to speak. To both those ends, I think it should gain the following effect: When a totem is broken by any means, gain a token. Gain a 1/2/3% Action Speed bonus to pick up, drop, pallet break, generator damage, and vaults per token. (max of 5/10/15%). This way you gain small amounts of additional power from successfully kicking boons and you can use it as a bit of a backup plan for Hexes.
Sloppy Butcher
I'll be honest, I have no idea why this perk is on the Developer road map. It has a job of making healing more difficult and it does that job well in a not overbearing way. It's currently either the best or second best non tracking perk in the Killer's free set. This perk shouldn't get changed.
Spies from the Shadows
This isn't a bad perk. However, currently this perk fights with Whispers a lot over the niche of “short range detection perk” and it loses badly. I think this perk would be improved greatly by changing its numbers to set it apart from Whispers. Something like range increased to 64m while cooldown increased to 20-30s.
Unrelenting
This is another perk where it is very easy to go the entire game without gaining even a lick of value from it. It having a small neat thing where lunging into a drop to go a tiny bit faster is cool, but no newbie will know to do that. I am aware that just flat buffing the effect can't happen because at some number most killers will just start lunging across the trials, so I think that it should get buffed in a different way. Let its swing cool down reduction applies to obstructed hits as well. I don’t know if this will be enough to make it decent, but at least this way it’ll help when you go for a window/pallet hit and don’t get it.
Whispers
This perk is a little tricky to get used to using, but it is arguably the best info perk among all the general and free killer perks. This doesn't need any changes.
Now, on to the teachables on the killers who are free in the Steam version.
Trapper:
Agitation
Honestly a pretty great perk. It does a little something every time it activates, and is occasionally completely amazing. This needs no changes.
Brutal Strength
If there was ever a perk that basically embodies a cozy blanket, it's this one. Nothing it does is amazing but it's just quietly there making things feel better for the Killer. This perk needs no changes.
Unnerving Presence
The biggest issue with this perk is that it can cause absolute mayhem against other newbies, but it can also actively make the generators faster against good survivors. It needs a partial rework.
Survivors repairing or healing within your Terror Radius suffer from the following effects:
Increases the Trigger odds of Skill Checks by 10%
Good Skill Checks result in 1/2/3% regression on the Generator/Heal
Great Skill Checks grant 0% bonus progression on the Generator/Heal
Success Zones are no longer made smaller.
This effect ends once a Survivor is killed by any means.
If you’re wondering, yes this is a weakened form of old Ruin, with current Ruin's
Hillbilly:
Enduring
This is in a similar boat as Brutal Strength. It's a slightly more powerful but more unreliable boat, but still a very similar boat. This needs no changes.
Lightborn
In contrast to Shattered Hope, Lightborn is primarily here to counter flashlights, which the Killer is warned when they are going to be facing them, so it works. This perk needs no changes.
Tinkerer
This perk doesn't strictly need changes. However, I personally think it could use a small tune up after it’s nerf to only go off once per generator. Something like lower the activation % to 60% and increase the undetectable duration to 16/18/20 seconds. Mostly to make it a bit easier to use for immobile killers.
Wraith:
Blood Hound
Gameplay wise, this perk just doesn't come off as particularly strong because usually all it does is make the blood of the person you're already chasing brighter. I think a really cool and thematic buff tho this would be that it reveals the auras of pools of blood within… 8/10/12m of the killer. The perk is supposedly based on scent… so… if you’re close enough you can “smell” them.
Predator
As this perk stands, it’s currently arguably weaker than base kit scratch marks because it basically makes it impossible for scratch marks to splash up onto walls or trees so they’re visible from significantly further away. A perk that is worse than base kit obviously not a good thing. So I thought… what if we flipped that on it’s head and made that a thing Predator caused on purpose? Sounds potentially great to me. So... add a new effect. If a running Survivor is within 1 meter of a wall, tree, or other vertical barrier, a normal set of scratch marks will appear on that object. This effect has a cool down of 5 seconds per Survivor.
Shadowborn
This is getting a rework anyway because an FoV slider is coming. So here we go!
You are at home slinking through the shadows unseen and unheard.
While undetectable and at least 16 meters away from a survivor, gain 3/4/5% haste. This won’t reactivate until you’ve been at least 16m from all survivors for 3s.
That last bit is mostly so killers can’t constantly use it like a stronger version of Whispers. Also this has some nifty synergy with my new Hex: Insidious.
Huntress:
Beast of Prey
This perk is just flawed. Bloodlust forcing Survivors to eventually use resources or take hits is good. However a perk dedicated to strengthening Bloodlust while it is active just isn't it because it's very easy for survivors to make it so a killer can never get value out of the perk. To fix it... I think it should be disconnected completely from the Bloodlust system. So... after being in chase for 25/20/15 seconds gain undetectable. This lasts until you damage a Survivor by any means or 10 seconds after losing chase. This is NOT reset by all of the things that reset Bloodlust and is also cumulative like Diversion is.
Hex: Huntress Lullaby
This perk isn't great, but it can't really be directly buffed because it has a much stronger effect on new survivors than vets. I’d be interested to see what happens if it was made less all or nothing. Say, the extra regression on failed skill check was permanent but maybe cut in half post cleansing.
Territorial Imperative
This isn't a particularly good perk, mostly because the survivors really don't have any reason to go into the basement as it is. Also I don't know why it has any restrictions really. I can see two ways forward with this perk. First way is this, remove both it's restrictions, so whenever you are farther than 24 meters from the basement, the Aura of any Survivor in the basement is revealed to you. Second way, I was also thinking of reworking it into a totem defense perk… The Auras of Survivors within 2/3/4 meters of any Hex Totem are revealed to you. And yes this is Undying’s aura read for Hexes instead of Dulls. It also synergizes with Huntress Lullaby.
Nurse:
A Nurse’s Calling
Simple perk with a simple goal and does it well. This needs no changes.
Stridor
I personally don't love how it doesn't help much against healthy survivors but there's nothing wrong with this perk as it is. Also it's current effect does fit with Nurse's theme of interacting with injured survivors. So while I personally don't like it, I don't think it really needs to be changed.
Thanatophobia
Backloading the slowdown on this perk was not the way to go. This made the perk roughly the same for Legion or Plague but hot garbage for everyone else. Ideally this would get changed to be frontloaded but less total slowdown at 4 stacks. According to the wiki at one point this thing gave 6% for the first stack, then 3% for the rest for a total of 15%. That would honestly be fantastic.
In summary, I think I listed around 9-10 perks out of 28 that don't need changes. That is not even remotely close to a good ratio. Give these perks some love Behavior.
Awesome list. I especially approve of: -
- Distressing
- Iron Grasp
- Shattered Hope
- Unnerving Presence
- Shadowborn
- Beast of Prey
I pretty much agree with everything else, might tweak some but:
- Insidious being a hex is an interesting idea. Might need fine tuning, as this has some far teaching implications. Can basically turn everyone into a stealth killer, which hurts characters like GF and Pig. I suppose you as killer also have to find a dull totem to use... maybe it's fine?
- Huntress Lullaby retaining half the effect is interesting. I might be tempted to have it be a hopping hex at base that you cleanse twice. With Hex:Undying that would mean you only save the halved effect, but similarly it means you don't need Undying to get value.
- Tinkerer I'm not sure if that's better... against efficient teams your big problem will be multiple Tinkerers popping at once. The best value you can get is that they all pop at different times, lowering increases the chance of getting less value from it.
- Hex: Thrill of the Hunt. Not sure a notification is better, it makes it near impossible to get a killers Devour Hope to always have a notification, and if the 2 Hexes are nearby, survivors are boned. I suppose I would assume TotH would be fine if Boons were ran more often, but as boons are kinda not worth running now, its not so good. So I guess changing TotH kinda hinges on if ever boons are planned for improvements.
Overall though, the whole list would be great for the basic perks of the game.
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It can be pretty clutch in SoloQ, especially as its not expected.
It allows you to heal off hook, and if the killer comes back, you haven't just granted an automatic extra hook.
Good vs. Tunneling. If your teammate doesn't have OTR, it can buy them the extra time they need to reach a loop and stay alive longer, and with the speed boost on top being longer in some way it can be better than OTR. 20 secs almost guarantees being able to make something, even if everything nearby is used up.
The fact it doesn't disable at end game also gives a solid chance to get everyone out.
I think it's kinda slept on tbh.
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A friend of mine who didn't really get into DBD pointed out that one of the reasons he wasn't so keen is because "this game compared to a lot of others has this issue where losing feels personal".
It was actually quite a poignant point that I suppose is only really applicable to asym games. 1 player has a lot of strength, vs. multiple players who work together.
For both it can easily feel you're being bullied, either by 1 player stronger than you, or by multiple players ganging up on you...
I don't believe the trash talk is worse by any means in DBD really... seen way way worse elsewhere tbh... but the nature of DBD I think just amplifies the effects of trash talk.
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Yeah the survivor set up isn't good by default, it would help newbies out a lot to change it. You have to do a reasonable amount of rebinding to get around this, Pinhead chains especially will mess you up badly.
Vault, using lockers and throwing pallets is known as 'Actions'.
Healing teammates and using gens is known as 'Interact'.
By default, both of these are bound to R1, which is why you're having the issue. So you need to separate them.
My binds are:
- L1 - Actions / Secondary Action, Skill Check / Wiggle Left
- L2 - Run
- R1 - Pick Up Items, Interact / Wiggle Right
- R2 - Use Item
- Triangle - Drop Item
- Circle - Crouch
- Cross - Activate Ability 1
- Square - Activate Ability 2
- Touchpad - Activate Event Ability
Will take you a couple of game to get used to, but it means all your time critical buttons are the R1 and L1 triggers, and none of your actions will interupt each other.
Hope this helps!
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@OrangeBear said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3622374#Comment_3622374
It doesn't have to be loud noise notification i mean just a noise notifcation that the perk activated. So you would still have to look around to see where the aura is and distortion would still hide it etc
Ahhh gotcha, that's actually a really nice change, especially for console.
You can't turn as rapidly to look around like you can on a mouse, so an audio cue would at let you be a little lazier on console, letting you at least know when it's worth looking vs.staying on your target.
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Just a crow caw would be enough I would think... the notification bubble is pretty clear.
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Kinda stepping on Call Of Brine's toes a little isn't it? Especially as with Lethal you can take this up to 10s.
Gearhead is great on someone like Huntress.
Edit: If it needs buffing, might be nice if Gearhead triggered a (good-only/normal?) skillcheck when a Survivor is wounded too. Anyone on gens gets a warning they have been seen, but still has their aura for 8s, anyone not on gens doesn't know and can still get caught by it normally.
This would mean you could look around when you wound someone and see what's what.
Not sure if good-only or normal would be better. On one hand you gives chances for great skill checks every time you wound... however you also make it less apparent you have Gearhead... not sure which is better.
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@Krazzik said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3622115#Comment_3622115
I just can't see how she's any better at holding a 3-gen than a Knight or a Doctor.
Thus far this is my experience. I'm waiting to go up against a 3-gen merchant, but still haven't seen one... or if I did, me and my team weren't good enough to make it to the 3-gen, my escape rate feels about the same as any other killer.
Thing is I like playing Skull Merchant, I don't tunnel or camp, and I try to hold a reasonable set of gens. I may give up on a couple, bit I'm always patrolling looking for gens. My experience on her is a lot of people just don't even really try.
I've let so many players escape because 2 or even 3 of their teammates just decided to go AFK immediately and/or not bother playing. Like when playing Bubba, sometimes it's really annoying getting tarred with the same brush. 😒
I've even left a Dwight slugged for 3 minutes for blatantly throwing his team who were trying under the bus and trying to get me to hook him. When he realised I wasn't being a Chess Merchant and wasn't gonna let him get out for free, he actually started playing again.
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Cheers for the responses folks, they are always enlightening, and I always have respect for the opinions in this forum... However I just wanted to say to anyone advocating for a forfeit... please do not underestimate how often people will forfeit if it gets added.
I'm overly verbose I know, I like to debate, I like to argue, and I like to learn. I try to be unbiased in what I say and post, and I like to explain my perspective clearly so it is understood, and am happy to be proved wrong... but I realise on this particular topic I might come across as a little tinfoil hatty... but that's because I've seen these kind of things make games very unfun numerous times.
This game has some pretty nasty and unfun things in it sometimes, things don't go your way, things feel cheap and frustrating... but when things do go your way, it gives you a great high... the highs counterbalance the lows, that's why we play it. If the lows outweigh the highs... we stop playing.
If you allow forfeits... you'll rarely see the high, and the only games you'll feel are the cheap frustrating ones. I can tell you from experience... nothing will make you more bitter than playing out your losing games, and people forfeiting on your winning games.
You will rapidly get to the point that most games feel empty... losses will continue to feel bad, wins feel empty. You stop caring, and that apathy is what truly ruins a game for you.
If I see forfeit become a serious suggestion, I will argue against it tooth and nail... with exception of maybe a 15 minutes forfeit... and maybe with the option for the opposing side to accept the forfeit, or reject it and continue against bots.
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@crogers271 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3621921#Comment_3621921
If you see someone suiciding on hook, let survivors save, down that player and leave them on the floor, with the mutual understanding of letting them bleed out. Let them get crows, then report them for AFKI don't think that would really do anything.
1: If BHVR really cared about AFKs, they could handle it themselves. The game already detects AFKs, if they deeply cared about it they could just program some type of X amount crow time in Y amount of hours results in a DC penalty.
2: I don't think the AFK rule is meant to apply to situations were you cannot progress. More for players who AFK from the very beginning and do so repeatedly.
So why not a Forfeit option?There's a few things that could be done to address most of your concerns.
1: The forfeit could have conditions. The most obvious would be a time limit, but if the worry was people would just wait to that point it could be based on something in the game. Say if a survivor is killed and there are still 3+ gens to go survivors get the option to say they have no chance.
2: Spamming could be addressed by never showing what the other survivors have put in.
3: No games go to completion: this could partly be addressed by given a countdown timer of 30 seconds. So the killer can't forfeit to deprive the survivors of getting out the exit (however, the forfeit does stop the idea of survivors just hanging around the exit gates forever).
Additionally, not going to completion is not a huge deal. One of downsides of DbD is that the end game can be long and pointless. Yes, DbD has exciting ends were you are rushing to the gate with the killer on your heels (or rushing at the survivors trying to get them before the line), but also times you're just lying on the ground bleeding out.
I highly doubt DbD would give serious thought to a forfeit issue, it would mess with pips, probably MMR, and the games theme. But I don't think the problems you mention are big deals especially given that people will throw a game when its not going well already, this would just speed up the process.
I've been playing video games over 30 years, online games for 20.You young kids with your new fangled ideas and gadgets. It sounds like you didn't even have the joy of an Atari or trying to play an FPS on a 33.6 K modem. 😋
I did have an Atari computer as a kid. Sensible Soccer was my jam 🤣🤣🤣
I only speak from the experience of a number of online games I've been borderline addicted to over the years. A forfeit system starts to become the standard result of the game.
Take League of Legends for example, you can quit after 15 minutes. Average game is 25-30 minutes.
You get this annoying scenario where whenever you do well your opponent just gives up. You might get a couple of kills over your opponent, a couple of turret plates, and they immediately try to 'ff' (Finish Fast). If the rest of your team is going even or just slightly ahead, you might make a good play at a fight at Dragon, and get a Triple kill for your team, and now you're a long way ahead. You now have a legit problem where you've just transitioned to mid game, and you have quite a lead. You're just one won team fight away from the enemy team just quitting... it's legit a strategy to deliberately die to give the team hope instead of FF...and they still might just give up the next lost teamfight anyway.
Now you mirror that scenario, where you're the one that's losing, and now your team is the one considering FFing. Your team tries to gank your fed opponent, loses the exchange, you get flamed, you get reported for losing, (reported for losing a game... it's really that bad), and your team FF, you don't even get to try to come back into the game.
So now you have a game where maybe 1 game in 8 or 9 goes past 15 mins, and that 1 game is the one opportunity to have any real fun. The rest of the time, the game is a bland, boring quit-a-thon whenever you're winning, and you just get slapped around when you're losing. Your average game experience becomes empty and hollow.
You can try to impose limits, but you make it a reasonable limit to forfeit, people just give up as soon as they're losing. You make it a harsh limit, the game is almost over anyway. As someone who doesn't like to just give up, if you wanna still try and play, every time the vote cooldown comes up you have to vote again. Its the fact you have to keep voting that gets annoying.
At least now, the other players need to be dead to get hatch. If there are 3 of you, it keeps you trying for gens... you've not got anything better to do. Having a forfeit breeds a culture of players just giving up, and in my experience it slowly rots games from the core.
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@Sava18 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3622059#Comment_3622059
at 5 min the game should be minimum halfway over. I guess you could make it 7 or 8 min.
Since the games are so short I'd prefer just no surrender option tbh, I don't understand how a game that's so short makes some people so miserable they need to leave right off the bat.
I'd be more OK with a Forfeit at 15 minutes, if someone is just trying to stall and hold someone hostage.
However yeah, I'm with you, games are over so fast, forfeit doesn't make sense.
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@Sava18 said:
Remove 4%, add forfeit at 5 min.
Trust me, you don't want that. Every game will end in 5 minutes
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@Madjura said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3621921#Comment_3621921
Yes the in-game report menu is terrible and completely irrelevant. Only the game rules page matters. The report menu also says to report for disconnects which the game rules say explicitly to NOT report (https://support.deadbydaylight.com/hc/en-us/articles/4408581146516-What-actions-will-result-in-a-temporary-ban-).
Fortunately the developers are aware of it and will definitely fix it (October 2021): https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/2556458/#Comment_2556458
It's a very complicated thing to fix so obviously the 2+ years they have known about it is not enough to do anything about it.
Keeps the support team staff demand high I suppose. Always appreciate job security 😅