PastaSauce
PastaSauce
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@roundpitt said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3624734#Comment_3624734
This would work. Or make it not give stacks on endurance hits. The whole reason it’s a problem now is because you can use it to eat through the basekit endurance and tunnel people out of the game. Their solution didn’t even solve that.
I mean clearly their goal here wasn't to make it so STBFL isn't useful for tunneling. If they wanted to do that they could have just made it that hits against endurance cause normal recovery animation. But this wasn't their goal at all, and i don't understand why you seem to think that was their goal when they openly stated what the point of STBFL changes were, and there is absolutely no way you could possibly misconstrue their statements as them trying to make STBFL useless for tunneling.
Their publicly stated goal with these changes is to make it so you didn't have a scenario where STBFL behaves completely differently based on which killer you run it with. Their other goal was to tune it down just a tiny bit. The real issue here is that in their attempt to make it more even across killers, they seemingly opened a huge gaping exploit to completely counter it, and even worse it's an exploit that is super easy for SWFs specifically. It's also possible they just worded the update badly and the way they actually implemented it this exploit doesn't work.
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@UndeddJester said:
If this is the change they want to make, they should make it basic and special attacks, and just reuse the coding from Play With Your Food stacks. Literally achieves their goal with none of the exploits.
That doesn't work at all. If you lose 2 stacks with every basic and special attack and gain 1 stack by hitting a non-obsession, then you will be stuck at 1 token because you have to use a basic attack to hit a survivor in the first place. That means you're at 1 token, start a basic attack costing you 2 tokens taking you to 0 tokens, land a basic attack on a survivor taking you up to 1 token, repeat. It also means missed attacks would cost tokens. I'm sorry but the code for PWYF is not even slightly applicable here.
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@Sometimes_Sage said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3625231#Comment_3625231
So a downed Survivor getting saved is a failure of the Killer that deserves them to lose the game, (because a save is always preventable - yeah), but if Survivors build a 3gen by going for the savest gens first, they deserve to have their game saved by a mechanic, that was allegedly designed to only activates against Killers who play for a 3gen from the start?
If you've had 8 saves on you in one match, you deserve to lose. You also have the option to just not bring surge, or to down survivor with your killer power which doesn't activate surge. In the first place if the generator is at 0 progress it's not like surge activates. If it's at 20% progress you want surge to activate. If you've gotten 8 downs within range of one 3 gen and all survivors are still alive, you do kinda deserve to lose.
I'm a killer main myself and any realistic scenario where the situation you've described actually happened in game, either you're already in what's considered to be the killer win state or you're so outclassed by survivors you don't deserve to win, or you've purposefully created a 3 gen.
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@RpTheHotrod said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3625202#Comment_3625202
Fair thoughts, but the problem is that this also affects perks that don't even do gen damage but require kicks such as Nowhere to Hide or Trail of Torment. Not only that, but both can even literally provide no benefit (such as no one being near near gen on nowhere to hide, or otherwise distortion being in play).
On top of all of that, killers have a million and one things to worry about and balance, and now there is a generator just sitting there and they have to feel discouraged from kicking it? Playing killer is feeling more like jumping through loops of what they are not allowed to do so survivors can just keep standing there teabagging. Can't grab of hook, can't kick gens, have to stand way over there if someone is hooked, can't hit people off hook, and so on. While some of that definitely was needed (ie basekit BT), killer is constantly being bombarded of things they aren't allowed to do and it's becoming and increasingly more frustrating experience where every patch has the hands tied behind your back becoming tighter and tighter.
I'm confused as to how you even have so much time to kick gens. Even when i'm running a build where i'm planning to be kicking gens (like with trail of torment, overcharge call of brine, ect) I don't think i go above around 15 gen kicks the entire match in 90% of cases, and that's spread across 7 generators.
Obviously this is a much greater worry if you're using a perk like Surge with a gen kick build, but Surge doesn't exactly have amazing synergy with gen kick builds in the first place. Honestly the new system is more likely to make me start kicking gens more often than usual than it is to make me kick them less out of worry, because now it's way more likely i'll get good value out of the time i waste on kicking a gen even if i don't have any perks up.
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With old Onryo, survivors could basically just ignore condemn and they would almost certainly get out way before anyone was close to being condemned. Now at least survivors are pretty much forced to interact with TVs which gives you ok slow down. If every single TV in the level is off, just remember that means survivors had to spend time running around not doing gens and you can still take advantage of that. Either way she's not a strong killer now and wasn't before.
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Haddonfield is just a really bad map period. But yes, it used to be way way worse.
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Calling iron grasp a discount agitation honestly is too much oversimplifying. They are perks that do fundamentally different things, it's just that what iron grasp does is basically meaningless. There is no real benefit to holding a survivor for longer, when the game is designed that when you pick up a survivor your goal is usually to put them on a good hook as soon as possible. If there was a mechanic that in and of itself made holding a survivor for longer beneficial to killer then "suddenly" iron grasp would be a clearly different perk from agitation when the perk itself hasn't changed at all.
And before someone says "if you're admitting it's useless then it needs to be buffed" there are more useless or almost useless perks in the game. With 246 perks to balance, and hundreds more add-ons and 33 and counting killer powers, not every perk can possibly be balanced in a way to make them all useful. And the changes being asked for here are not only unnecessary, they aren't healthy. And the end of the day flat out getting rid of pallet saves is just taking away interactions between killers and survivors in a game about them interacting. If there actually is a real problem with pallets in dbd, the solution is not adding a perk to turn them off. Not only is that incredibly lazy, it's bad game design.
Lightborn frankly is also not a healthy perk but its saving grace is that it's mostly pointless if you know what you're doing and it isn't worth sacrificing an entire perk slot for it so it's rarely run at mid-high mmrs. Shattered Hope also is just bad game design. The solution to boons isn't adding a perk like this, if this was the way dbd wanted to go they should have made it base kit. It also, again, just isn't even a good perk worth running especially as they had nerfed the most problematic boons by the time they added it. If you honestly truly think that pallet saves are not good for the game, you should be advocating for having them completely removed or otherwise having it changed or nerfed, not to have a perk that just removes it if you decide to use it.
Also, just for your own benefit, you should really stop using light born. If you're always using lightborn, you're never going to learn how to deal with flashlights, and then you're always going to be reliant light born instead of using better more useful perks.
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Considering the number of complaints i still see about Killers saying AFC is too strong, the idea that it does nothing is ridiculous. Yes, if you know what you're doing you can work around it, but where this actually matters (at low mmr) killers generally don't know how to effectively camp from a distance.
Secondly, you cant define the changes in gameplay this has had out of existence. The changes are real, no matter how much you want to reject them. Yes, there are still issues with the system, the solution is to modify it, not to get rid of it. Devs have already said they are going to make changes so that tombstone doesn't go through endurance, and i'm sure they will consider other changes. The fact you decide to ignore all of this kinda comes off as you being dishonest.
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@Nos37 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3589620#Comment_3589620
You chase them away and they come right back.
You commit to them and they just kite you away and go down under a different pallet. Try to pick them up and the survivor with Background Player is there in a heartbeat.
Meanwhile, the survivor you left under the pallet gets picked up or picks themselves up. and has their exhaustion perk back. Better to eat the stun, which is not a counter. It's just a lesser of the lose-lose you're in.
If it takes you so long to get a down in chase that the dying survivor can be brought all the way to full health, then you just need to get better at chasing. It takes 30s for a down survivor to get to 95% recover on their own or 16s for another survivor to heal them to injured without a medkit. Takes another 16 seconds to get them to full health without a medkit. At a minimum you have 32 seconds to get a second down before survivors reset completely, realistically you have even longer than that if there isn't a 3rd survivor nearby. Considering the fact bloodlust builds after 15 seconds of chase, you should generally be able to get a second down before a survivor is fully reset unless you're in a particularly bad map or something. If the 4th survivor comes over to you and does the same thing while the other 2 are healing, this is basically the best scenario for you because now no one is doing generators and as long as no one is doing generators it doesn't matter how long it takes you to get a hook because survivors aren't getting any closer to escaping that entire time. Bonus points if you have a perk like Jolt/Surge, Pain Resonance, or Ruin, because at that point survivors are actively getting further away to escaping in this scenario.
If you're regularly blood lusting before you're getting a hit, then you're going against survivors that are a lot better than you and you're going to need to expect to take the L and just use the match to learn to do it better next time. If blood lusting before getting a hit is something you're regularly experiencing in all or most of your matches, then you need to spend some time learning to chase better.
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@Nos37 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3589562#Comment_3589562
I've been in situations where I could not ever get a single hook because of coordinated survivors.
Starts off with blinds. I adapt and counter with Lightborn.
Then it's bodyblocks. I adapt and counter with Mad Grit.
Then it's hook sabotages and horsey perks. I adapt and counter with Iron Grasp.
Then it's last second hook sabotages. I adapt and counter with
Hangman's TrickAwakened Awareness. (I preferred Hangmans, but they nerfed it by making it only affect four hooks instead of all hooks 😥)It's gotten to the point where I have all 4 of these perks in a loadout on EVERY SINGLE KILLER. Even that's not enough
Now it's purposefully going down under pallets...
The best I can do is play Trapper, trap 1 side of the pallet, pick up from the other side, and hope they don't coordinate holding the trap open for someone to run in for the drop.
This means to counter all this crap survivors on comms get away with, I have to play Trapper with ZERO chase/slowdown/endgame perks. Meawhile, they just need a flashlight and Iron Will (maybe Clam Spirit if they suspect the killer has Ultimate Weapon or Infectious Fright).
And survivors would call a "counter" to pallet saves overpowered?? 😂
Killer can secure the hook they spent time in chase earning, but that's 1 less perk slot doing other things. 😔
When you're playing against a team that's just a lot better than you, kinda a given they're gonna win. There really is no reason anyone should ever be running lightborn, it's a complete waste of a perk. You get the exact same effect as lightborn by just facing a wall when picking up survivors. If there isn't a nearby wall, then look for any nearby survivors. Also try to pay attention throughout the game to where survivors are so you can figure out if they are even nearby and what direction to face away from so they can't get a save when they just manage to get in range.
Besides, if you give up a hook to down a second survivor and then hook that second survivor, it's a net plus for killer. The reason is that 3 survivors aren't working on gens for the duration. One survivor that is down, one survivor you're chasing and hopefully about to down, and one survivor that had to leave their generator to pickup the down survivor. If no one went to pickup the down survivor, then you get 2 hooks anyway.
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@Nos37 said:
There needs to be SOMETHING for killers to counter pallet stun saves, other than either walk away, find a new survivor, and hope they don't also go down under a pallet or eat the stun, break the pallet, and start the chase all over.
My idea so far has been a micro-Blood Favor that is not strong enough to be a hex, but has similar effects.
For 3 seconds after downing a survivor, pallets within 4 meters are blocked by the Entity. The perk then goes on cooldown for 90 seconds.
Maybe replace the long cooldown with a tradeoff, like increases pallet stun duration by 60% / 55% / 50%.
Or maybe the tradeoff could be what @Grigerbest said: Instead of an instant wiggle it only partially fills the bar, but still by a significant amount.
There already is a way to counter pallet saves. Step one: check for survivors nearby Step two: kill or chase away nearby survivors, or make them drop the pallet the first survivor was under step 3: pickup the most recently downed survivor
Depending on what step you're struggling with, you know what aspect of gameplay you need to get better at.
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@saintjimmy456 said:
After complaining about Prove Thyself, the devs reduced its strength.
After complaining about Brand New Part, the devs reduced its strength.
After complaining about Dead Hard, devs reduced its strength.
After complaining about Made For This, devs are about to reduce its strength.
They released Xeno which destroyed survivors so bad it was the focus of every topic for like 2 solid months.
They're just about to release a new killer that some pros are saying is one of the strongest to ever be put in the game.
"This game has become SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO survivor sided it's BS." 😂
What? Xeno does not destroy survivors. Xeno is mid tier.
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They definitly did not nerf every killer in the past 4 months. The only thing substantially that's changed for killers is the new anti-camp mechanics that doesn't even change much unless you're face camping.
Other than that Behavior has overall buffed killers. If you look through the patch notes, basically all the recent changes except to the brand new killers have been buffs.
Likely you just got rusty after not playing awhile. Only other possible explanation is that you actually haven't played in 6 months and are going against people using MFT which was added when Singularity was added in June and is now meta for survivors.