Pulsar
Pulsar
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No because second-chance perks will ALWAYS be meta, for either side.
Any perk that allows you to make mistakes and not be punished (or be punished less) will find a spot in the meta.
The reason why a lot of Killers hate DH and DS is the same reason why Survivors hate NOED and Ruin/Undying.
They both perceive it as the player getting second chances and being able to make mistakes more often than they should.
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STOP BREAKING RULE 6
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@yobuddd said:
You ever go through an old thread from a year or so ago? Scrolling through, ever notice how many of the commenters have the red “user banned, please carry on” icon?
I mean dang! Is it really that hard for people to behave themselves?
I've been around for nearly two years now, so it can't be THAT hard.
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Please don't necro two year old threads.
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@BlueYoshi1492 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1164699#Comment_1164699
Wow what a genius response
Please don't necro year old threads.
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@UrFat said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1909059#Comment_1909059
I'm going to do my best to address all of your points
- You argued the fact that Demo suffers a worse punishment then Deathslinger. While technically missing a shred is longer then missing a shot from Deathslinger there are other factors that say it's the other way around. Missing Demo's shred results in a stun that last 2.25 seconds while Deathslingers stun only lasts 1.5 seconds however, when you miss a shot with Deathslinger you have to reload. His reload speed takes 2.75 seconds (without add-ons). While reloading he also moves at 66% movement speed. If you choose to not reload you are stuck as a 110% m1 killer. I also have to bring up the fact that even if you miss with Demo, you still instantly move 11 meters whereas Deathslinger is still in the same spot he shot from. You also mentioned that huntress comes with 5 hatches and missing one isn't huge. I agree, however you will still end up reloading the hatchets anyways. It takes 4 seconds to reload (without add-ons). That means missing two shreds would be about equivalent to one reload. You mentioned that Pyramid Head doesn't lose too much distance if he misses. He suffers a stun of 2.25 seconds which is the same as Demo. I should also mention that the POTD has a max range of 8 meters while Demo's shred has a max range of 11 meaning Demo can hit a survivor sooner then Pyramid Head. You also mentioned FPS makes it hard for console to use it. Does this really warrant Demo a total rework.
- I don't think your 100% correct with the timing of this. Yes, if you cross over to the other side of the map just to replace your portal you are wasting time. But lets say you aren't currently in a chase with anyone, you may head over to that area to find a survivor. If you are in a chase you can just simply ignore it and replace it next time you happen to be in that part of the map.
- You said that we know they will be on one of the three gens but which one? What if they are spaced well? You would have to go check which gens are getting worked on. His tracking does that for you. You mention that tracking is more valuable early game and I have to disagree with that. Top tier killers vs. top tier survivors will almost always result in either 2 or 1 gen remaining. I would rather have good tracking late game where I can use it more to my advantage. During the early game at least 2 gens should be getting worked on. Even if you knew survivors were on those gens it wouldn't matter because one of them are still getting done even if you try to pressure one of them. Doctor is a prime example. I used to main him and every game I played where the survivors were my skill level or better we got down to 2 gens in the first 5 minutes. His tracking didn't help me that much until late game. I would be able to hold the 2 gens until I either got the 4k or I couldn't finish enough chases and they were able to get out.
- My point is simple. You compare parts of Demo's kit to top tier killers. Pyramid Head and Deathslinger is all about chase but you compare Demo's chase to them. Demo also has tracking and mobility in his kit. Neither Deathslinger nor Pyramid Head have any of that (unless you consider the occasional dumb survivor walking in Pyramid Head's trail tracking). People compare his mobility to Oni, Billy, and Blight. Oni only has his mobility when he has his power which only last 60 seconds. Now don't get me wrong I know that Oni's mobility is better. I'm just saying people are comparing Demo's mobility which he has constantly to a killer who does it better but only has that power for 60 seconds. With Billy you may have the occasional instant against bad survivors but for the most part he's an m1 killer. Billy has better mobility but his chase, and tracking don't compare to Demo's (not to mention Billy is map dependent). Blight has great mobility along with great chase but on top of being map dependent he doesn't have Demo's tracking. That fact is you're not comparing his kit to weak killers but to A tier killers. Demo obviously shouldn't have the best chase along with the best mobility along with the best tracking along with the best stealth. The thing is he has all of these in his kit and all except his stealth are viable.
I'll counter. I do appreciate you taking the time to carefully respond to me :)
- Demo's Shred often launches him FAR past the Survivor he was attempting to hit. Additionally, if you miss a Shred, you cannot turn around and hit them with it, unlike how Deathslinger can miss a shot, reload and hit someone. Most good Huntress players do not ever exhaust all of their hatchets, therefore, that argument is void. A hatchet is a health state, she is simply better than Demo and I think you know that. Pyramid Head and Demo's power have a similar punishment, but the thing that allows PH to lose less distance is the fact that his power can be used at loops. POTD can hit through walls and loops, making it exceptional on 80% of the loops in the game, while Demo would be hardpressed to do anything except eat pallets. As for Console FPS, either BHVR delivers on their promise to the majority of their players or they start making Killers that work as intended on Console.
- I was speaking in general terms, apologies, I should have been clearer. It was brought up in a video of Scott Jund's. He said something to the effect of, "Killers time is much more valuable than Survivors, say, around 4x." I think he later went on to say it might be closer to 33%, but its been a while since I watched that video. Basically, as Killer, if you aren't actively chasing someone, you are allowing 4 people free gen repairs. That was the gist of it.
- You shouldn't ever be in a position where you don't have a three gen lategame, but lets say you are. Yes, those Portals WILL provide information. But if there are 3 or more Survivors left, you've already lost, barring a dumb play on their part. If they cleanse your Portal once, like I said earlier, the time taken to go back and replace it allows the others to do gens for free. Also, you are not always channeling Shred, if his Killer Instinct was always active, I would be more inclined to agree. But its conditional.
- Demo doesn't have mobility. He has map traversal. He can get to a specific location quickly. Oni, Billy and Blight can all use their map traversal as mobility to down Survivors. Demo has way worse chase than PH or Deathslinger, which is fine, but they are EXTREMELY good in chase. That makes up for their lack of mobility (sometimes) since they get downs so quickly. Good Billy will almost always get 1-hit downs. After the nerfs, not many are left, but they still exist. Billy's chase is definitely better than Demo's on maps, he excels in the same places Blight does, in between loops.
- Demo is comparable to low tier Killers, I simply chose not to do so, as to demonstrate why he ISN'T a top tier Killer. Let's take Legion. Legion gets easier first hits, way more info and way better mobility. Demo has the edge in second hits and map traversal.
Pig's slowdown is viable, that doesn't mean she is good. Legion's tracking is viable, also doesn't make him good. Clown's chase is EXCEPTIONAL, he still isn't high tier.
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@Huge_Bush said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1911041#Comment_1911041
I dunno about full on rework. Make rat liver base kit, make it a little easier to shred maybe, and faster portal traversal. He also should be quieter.
Most importantly, he needs a Christmas sweater and fluffy slippers.
This is true.
But Demo is the second least played Killer. He's barely above Plague. He boring.
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@Huge_Bush said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1910998#Comment_1910998
I would play a lot more killer if I could! OMG. Survivors sitting on a gen and some slime goop falls down on them, only for them to look up and see me coming at them! They'd probably have to rework some maps to make ceilings a little higher or give camouflage to the xenomorph, but it is work that I am willing to put the devs through.
So would I. I'd really love to see something like that.
Still want my Demo rework tho
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@PerfectlyPink said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1911018#Comment_1911018
Fair enough and yes
Can run RDR2 with smooth fps, and no stutters
DBD
*Airplane engine noises*
15-30 fps, freezes when getting bloodlust, and can't handle fancy pants moving bumping into tires
I own an Xbox but this is still accurate.
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@PerfectlyPink said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1910988#Comment_1910988
Oh god gimme
I'd go a bit further and give demo blight's rush and give blight something else.
I think it'd be super scary and fun to have demo go on all fours and jump off the sides of walls
I'd just make Shred have one bounce tbh.
(and fix its FPS issues on Console pls)
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@ReverseVelocity said:
Dream Demon
Death won't accept him and thus he remains, a calamity, indisputable master of his victims' nightmares. Dream Demon allows The Nightmare to pull Survivors into the Dream World.
- Survivors who are awake do not see or hear The Nightmare.
- Once targeted by The Nightmare power, Survivors enter the Dream Transition after some time.
- During the Dream Transition they can see The Nightmare intermittently.
- When the Dream Transition lapse, the Survivor is pulled into the Dream World.
Once in the Dream World:
- Survivors' Auras are revealed to The Nightmare when they are outside of his terror radius.
- Survivors suffer an action speed penalty
- To exit the Dream World, Survivors can find other non-sleeping Survivors to perform a wake up action
- Some failed actions can wake up the Survivor.
- Getting hooked wakes up the Survivor
...
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@Huge_Bush said:
I want a killer than can scale over the environment and launch itself at unsuspecting survivors. It's why I really want Chucky or the Xenomorph from Aliens to be in this game. Chucky would be cooler if they can use his original actors laugh when he attacks.
Imagine your in Hawkins and the Xenomorph is on the ceiling above you and pulls you up. Jumpscare city.
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@wildcardyo said:
Look at all the bullying I've been subjected to for standing up for the oppressed class in this game
Bruh. I'm a Killer main and your argument is full of ######### at best.
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Stranger Things accurate Demogorgon.
Can pull Survivors into the Upside-Down, where there is a corrupted version of the map. Demo is faster and sees aura's when within 20 meters while in the Upside-Down.
Survivors can use either his own Portals to escape, find a randomly generated Portal (which is highlighted) or get another Survivor to pull them out.
Demogorgon can pull one generator into the Upside-Down with him, forcing the Survivors to play in his realm.
His Portals expand in the normal world and corrupt the surrounding environment, making it more dangerous to leave them unattended.
Basically, make Demo a hybrid of himself right now and Old Freddy. Main difference is that Demo doesn't HAVE to pull Survivors to the Upside-Down to hit them, it's just better for him to do so.
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Okay, so I'm not happy with how BHVR has been handling the game, but this is a MASSIVE reach.
I think you got confused about discrimination against people because they are in X group and not balancing things for one side.
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Since there is no confirmed release date, I'd suspect that means February 9th.
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@shalo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1910628#Comment_1910628
How is Legion bugged?
He might be talking about the speed/lunge bug in FF a while back.
Pretty sure that was fixed.
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@landromat said:
Consoles. They're probalbly wasting a lot of time rolling patches to consoles. They should patch pc more often and then bring changes to consoles with big patches or make all balancing server side
1.) They are not going to screw over the majority of players like that.
2.) Overwatch literally has a PTR on Consoles AND patches it much more frequently than DBD.
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@Hyd said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1910543#Comment_1910543
Kinda seems relevant in all situations for all Killers really.
The Killers generally considered "high-tier" allow you to make mistakes. The more mistakes you can make, the better the Killer.
Spirit, Nurse, Freddy and Deathslinger all allow you to make a few mistakes.
Same goes for Survivor perks. Anything that allows you to recover or not be punished by mistakes is usually meta.
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He's still M1 and relies on the Survivors playing poorly.
Even if he goes up against a team of average loopers, he can still make a single mistake and lose.
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Kill Rate is basically meaningless without context to go with it.
Coldwind maps NEED to be adjusted. You shouldn't have jungle gym, into cow tree, into shack, into TL.
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@RiskyKara said:
It absolutely depends on the writer. Both have world shattering Eldritch properties about them. The entity can theoretically keep putting Chara in an endless gamut until she dies, but Chara can keep reloading fueled by determination for the same length.
I imagine the entity doesn't necessarily grow in power and knowledge as time progresses, wheras Chara absolutely will keep learning and leveling. (Fundamental difference between horror antagonist versus RPG protagonist really.) So I can see Chara winning, assuming the entity is something that can be found and physically killed in some way shape or form. If it doesn't have a physically accessible or inurable form then nobody really 'wins' unless the entity gets bored of Chara and does some eldritch stuff to stasis her eternally. (Because once she dies, reload time.)
If it can be killed and if it can be accessed through mortal means Chara would one-shot it, not because she's super strong, but because as defined in her universe that's kind of her power. One shotting things.
I mean, I don't think that the Entity doesn't learn.
Look at Coldwind vs Hawkins. It's clearly become better at copying things from memories.
Real question is, how do the Entity and the MindFlayer interact?
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I wish I could VPN.
I've got a fan club that DDoS's me whenever I play against them.
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@chargernick85 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1909003#Comment_1909003
Tried again last night right before bed. Was smarter with this one (so I thought) right at the start of trial I drained the key and dropped it hoping the killer would notice I did not have it anymore. He killed 2 and left myself and a nea laying on the ground to bleed out for 4 minutes only moving if we moved. If I moved he moved otherwise just stood there staring at me. I had a medkit in my hand at that point. Idk all I can say is at least I only have to drain one more.
Well, #########, sorry dude. Hopefully, with the upcoming Key nerf (at some point) Killers won't do this anymore.
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@Exerath1992 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1909454#Comment_1909454
Oh, well I like the wide variety of skills crossplay gives me lol
For me, at least, there's plenty of variety just staying on Xbox lmao
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@Exerath1992 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1909002#Comment_1909002
Oh, I guess if I put the steam app on my phone, but there's also the xbox and wiiU platforms to worry about (I'm on ps4). That's such a hassle, especially when you spend the pregame coming up with mnemonic devices to remember what player use what character/outfit and what items they have. 60 seconds is barely enough time!
If they added a pre and post game chat for console i would definately do it though
I don't have Crossplay on.
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@AChaoticKiller said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1909066#Comment_1909066
you also said you can't do good with him because your limited by console which to me just says you haven't gotten good at him since i can shred just fine with him.
your past post counters your statement of skill doesn't equal low kill rate.
I am on the Xbox One X. Whenever I use Shred, my FPS drops to 10.
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@AChaoticKiller said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1909012#Comment_1909012
idk what you are talking about i play him on console and do fine and i get a TON of hits at loops, yes i zone with him a lot obviously but there are plenty of loops you can fake a direction and go the other to get the survivor to go to the better shred side as well as get distance to hit with shred.
the only and i do mean only issue i have is hitting shreds up close for stbfl o console. hitting shreds in any other situation i do fine however im no master but demo is very playable on console. it's really just a matter of being able to aim on the X axis, what makes console worse is how much harder it is to aim on the X Y axis but limiting it to just X and being good at aiming on that axis is pretty doable.
pick rate: players think he is weak and do bad with him so he is less used and he is dlc with no truly good perks. he is also very frustrating when you are not hitting shreds or sneaking up with portals.
kill rate: it is brought down by players who are bad at him just look at other skill based killers, the pick rate doesn't matter much in this regard since it is so easy to be bad at him by spamming shred.
Skill based Killers do not equal low Kill Rate.
Demo has both a low pick rate and Kill Rate because he is fundamentally average.
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@hmeekins said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1907356#Comment_1907356
Seeing as how you have the most upvotes Im going to respond to you points. First of all I am in no way saying he's op. But I do think that he is a lot stronger than people give him credit for
- You said that the shred is baitable and pretty punishing. The same can be said about deathslinger's spear, huntress' hatchet, and pyramid heads POTD. The trick is patience, he moves fast enough in the shred that you can react to a survivor actually window vaulting 95% of the time so as long as you wait to see what their actually doing you will be fine.
- Portals can be removed, but it takes 12 seconds by default to seal it whereas it takes you one to replace it. You'll probally be heading over their anyways since you do get shown which portal got cleansed so you know thats where survivors are so when you get their just spend 1 second replacing it. They're wasting more time cleansing then it takes you to replace.
- His tracking is average for most of the match. But when you get to the final three gens it becomes very difficult for survivors to play around. If they don't cleanse you are constantly aware of when someone is on your gen. If they do cleanse not only did they waste twelve seconds of their time you are also still aware of what gen their on.
- His stealth is bad I agree with you on that I was just making the point that you still sometimes to get value out of it.
I'm just saying with these facts in mind and the right build Demogorgon is a hard killer to beat.
Of course, I never presumed you were saying he was OP. Certainly, I didn't get that impression.
To address your points.
- Deathslinger's Spear has longer range and subsequently, isn't as punishing since it doesn't really matter how much distance they gain, you can still shoot them. Huntress gets 5 hatches. Missing one isn't huge. Pyramid Head POTD is also punishing, but you don't lose too much distance. Again, FPS makes this hard to do on Console, makes it difficult to react.
- They are actually not wasting more time. As a Killer, your time is 4x more valuable than the Survivors. Therefore, multiply the amount of time you spent walking there and placing the Portal by 4 and then you'll be able to see if it is worth it or not.
- His tracking is good at the end, but tracking does nothing when you have no means to capitalize on it. You already know they are going to be on one of three gens at the end of the game. Tracking is nice, but its WAY more valuable early on.
He needs something to make him unique and a better overall Killer. Right now, I have no reason to play him over anyone else.
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@Yords said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1908655#Comment_1908655
Not sure how it went from me telling you the facts to you saying I am trash at playing demo. They are not just trash excuses, but rather valid arguments for why demo is low tier.
The spirits phase sound is kinda eh because if you are in a chase, you will not hear it.
The deathslingers *ring sound when he is aiming at you is mostly pointless since he can instantly shoot you so you won't even hear it for half a second.
Freddy's teleport sound is global sure, but he can fake his teleport and always keep you guessing. He has snares too which make him a very dangerous threat in a chase.
I am not sure how nurses blink fits in here. Sure you can hear her blinking, but what does that do for you other than let you know she is in a chase? It also doesn't really matter since she is the most powerful killer in the game.
As a player who has almost played this game for 1800 hours and has played survivor and all killers the whole way, I think it is safe to say I know how to play demo and can identify his strengths and weaknesses. I am actually very good at playing him and can provide video evidence to prove it if you would like since you apparently think I don't know how to play him. Let me know if you would like to watch a couple of games.
The guy you responded to has kind of run out of arguments, so he's insulting both of us instead, lmao.
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@AChaoticKiller said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1907356#Comment_1907356
because demo when you are good and know when your shred will hit forces pallets to be thrown down, if a demo went for a shred and missed because you already made it past the pallet that demo wasted time and good demos know when shreds wont miss.
this makes it so he creates dead zones fast and since his shred is fast enough to hit you on reaction when around 8 meters away you can't use windows if he gets too close which makes him good at zoning, really good demos can zone a pallet at max distance go for the shred and even if it misses they will hit you proving that they either body blocked or have recovery addons (which are bugged atm).
edit: i do think his stealth needs a buff and his footsteps should be a lot quieter and obviously his addons need to be changed since most are useless.
Again, due to certain limitations, this is nearly impossible on Consoles.
The niche situation where Demo would get a hit with Shred and not by using a basic lunge is rare. It's like someone going down from Mending. Does it happen? Sure. Does it happen enough that I'll depend on it? No. His Shred is almost entirely used for zoning in most matches I've watched.
I invite you to explain his abysmal pick rate and his lower than average Kill Rate.
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@Saurian said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1908679#Comment_1908679
Or he just brings the Iri head, mori, and tunnels because that equivalent to the OP garbage the survivors are doing
You could. It's up to you. I like to give people the option to chose the easy way though.
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@chargernick85 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1908679#Comment_1908679
I have that Rift challenge I think it's in Tomb 2 fully deplete three keys so what I did was as I took a Green Key and attached Aura reading to it I can guarantee depleting it which I did but I was tunneled out of the match extremely quickly by a nurse, hit over and over and over again on the hook oh, and she nodded up and down a few times when she downed me
Which I mean, is just further reason we need to be able to differentiate between Green, Purple and Red Keys.
I don't WANT to tunnel someone if they have a Green Key, but I literally cannot tell. Feel for you tho man. I try to ask people if they've got a challenge, but if they don't respond I gotta assume the worst.
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@Exerath1992 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1908679#Comment_1908679
There's no pregame chat for consoles. So us killer mains that aren't a part of the PC master race can only assume ill intent
I just message them before the game. I can see the profiles on Xbox, so I just send em a quick, Hey man, can you take off that key?
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@Saurian said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1908687#Comment_1908687
Bruh... your logic, is ridiculous and not practical... I can spawn in place a portal down after a few steps between two gens and get moving... how tf is that 24 seconds
Like I said, your time as a Killer is 4 times more valuable than a Survivors, since there are 4 of them. Watch Scott Jund's video on PGTW. He explains it better than I can.
If you spend 10 seconds walking somewhere, and Survivors are working on gens, that is at LEAST 40 seconds of gen progression. Hence, your time is 4 times more valuable.
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@Saurian said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1908674#Comment_1908674
Devs have already stated multiple times those stats are not to be taken at face value, and those are comparable number to the killers in-between themselves not hard stats as how many people play him.
Low console fps doesn't make his shred unusable, that is a straw man and if it did there would be vastly more complaints about it.
His portals can be used for ambushing even with all the "tell's" the survivors get, I've ambushed plenty of good survivors to know that it isnt impossible.
Again, I do think you are Mediocre, link your stream with demo games vs. Good survivors and I'll take a look
Devs have stated the KILL RATES shouldn't be taken at face value, because there are so many variables. Those stats are the average Killer players over a certain period of time. That cannot possibly be misconstrued. Agreed, there may be slight fluctuation, but Demo is easily one of the least popular Killers, no matter what way you slice it.
I can literally link you at LEAST 5 posts talking about awful Console FPS whenever abilities are activated. I can send you videos of it. Legion's Frenzy, Demo's Shred, Blight's Rush, Nurse's Blinks, BloodLust ect ect.
If you can ambush Survivors, either they don't care or they aren't good. Good Survivors are NOT taken by surprise when the game gives them 3 warnings.
I do not have Demo games on my Stream, as I stopped playing with him about a month ago. I can give you some funny Legion games where everyone DC's tho.
I think more than likely, you are above average at Demo and are going against bad Survivors.
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@Saurian said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1908669#Comment_1908669
1 second to put down a portal and a small walk is not massive, if you are trying to spam the portals with maps then run corrupt and stop complaining
A Killer's time is 4 times more valuable than a Survivors.
Therefore, that one second channel and a 5 second walk is equivalent to about 24 seconds of time spent to set up ONE Portal.
It takes one Survivor 12 seconds to cleanse a Portal. 24 seconds is way longer than 12, ergo, not worth it.
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A better option is to simply ask them to take off the Key.
If they refuse, but say they have an Archive challenge, let them continue. If they refuse and are toxic, tunnel as normal.
If they do take off the Key, be a little nicer to them. It goes a long way :)
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@Saurian said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1908605#Comment_1908605
Same here buddy, I've been playing him since day 1 at release hour on live servers and I know a thing or two about him.
For 1 a killer being "boring" is subjective as hell, just listen to the entire debate of spirit and deathslinger being "boring" to understand what I mean.
And for 2 his shred is a wonderful tool that if you actually were decent at demo which you arent because of how you are think one of the most balanced and well designed killers in the game need a rework of all things. You can use the shred to bait survivors into juking for a free M1 and his shred in general move very fast and can be charged very quickly and fired at 65% charge, this leads to you being able to shotgun survivors before they can react or if you know... can actually be skillful and anticipate where they juke or move you can hit them anyways. His shred can be used to encourage survivors to move into certain areas in a chase or do certain actions like drop pallets early or vault a window based on the sound he makes so there is great mindgame potential.
His portals should be used for two things, ambushing or gen protection. Either place em on gens with tanky add ons or place them around gen areas so you can use them as a traversal tool, also his red lichen makes them into a bootleg nurse's calling/BBQ... sure they could use a stat buff, but they aren't horrible if you know what you are doing, and if you are applying pressure them cleaning a portal is not the end of the world dude.
I really do think your problems with demo is you being a Mediocre killer and not demo himself. If you want you can link me some of your gameplay so I could critique it
If you'd look at any of my other posts, you would understand that I am not a "mediocre Killer." I am not here to argue my own merit as a player, I've had enough hate mail to be assured of my abilities, but if you'd like to come check out my stream sometime, go for it. Now, onto your actual points.
First of all, the pick rates do not lie. Kill Rates are subjective, because they can be inflated by Mori's, bad Survivors ect ect. However, for whatever reason, nobody wants to play Demo. He's a perfectly fine Killer, mediocre, but like you said, "balanced." That leads me to believe people find him boring and uninteresting.
Again, this comes to low Console FPS. Juking is much harder to counter on Console because of the low frames, which gives the Killer less information and therefore, less time to react to said juke. Shred lowers the already abysmal FPS whenever it is charged, so in most cases, you are ONLY using it to bait Survivors. At least on Console, they know you aren't ever going to use Shred because it's way too risky. Sure, you can use it to eat pallets, but good Survivors won't drop pallets that early anyway.
His Portals can ONLY be used for gen protection. Ambushing with Demogorgon doesn't work, as we've seen time and time again. Like my original comment said, he gives THREE warnings to Survivors that he is coming. Map-wide notification, glowing Portal and loud stomping. Again, Demo suffers from the same set-up problems that Trapper and Hag do, but his Portals LOSE value the further into the match you progress, unlike those two Killers, whose traps gain value.
Frankly, when you say someone is bad, and use that as an argument, it makes me think you are running out of legitimate counters. Of course, I'm sure you didn't mean anything by it and were only trying to help :)
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I'm currently typing out a response but I figured I'd give you the chart first.
Demo is the second least picked Killer, barely above Plague. He also has the 4th lowest Kill Rate, below Clown and Wraith.
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@Saurian said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1907356#Comment_1907356
Uh no, demo does not need a full redesign
I main demo and his a tough killer to play and learn his add-ons could use a looking at but he is a very balanced killer and can be quite deadly if used correctly
Knowing how to use his shred and the limitations and tech of it will do you wonders, same goes for his portals, could they use some stat tweeks? Yes, full rework? No
If you think demo is awful or needs a full rework it is more likely you are trash at him than him being trash.
I have invested significant time into Demo. I have him P3 LVL 50 with all Perks. I've sunk at least 100 hours into him.
His biggest flaw is that not only is he mediocre at everything, he is BORING to play. The pick rate stats confirm this. Nobody plays Demo.
His Shred massively lowers FPS on Console and causes stuttering, so keep that in mind.
I'll list a rebuttal to your highlights on his Shred and Portals.
- His Shred can be EASILY baited. It's hitbox is also pretty funky. Despite its funkiness and easily baitable nature, it is very punishing. It is a 2.25 second stun PLUS the distance you lunged, at the bare minimum.
- His Portals can be destroyed. Portals are great in the early game when you don't have pressure and need to get places quickly. The problem is that you need to set them up. Set-up Killers are bad until they get set-up, making them strong lategame Killers. However, Demo is only gonna get a lot of value from his Portals during the early game, so that makes them redundant. Not saying they are useless, just that they seem counterintuitive.
Demogorgon is the least played Licensed Killer and almost the least played Killer overall. I suspect this is because he offers nothing unique and is painfully average. I understand the Devs have bigger priorities, but Demogorgon DOES need a rework, if only to get people interested in playing him.
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@aEONoHM said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1907356#Comment_1907356
"If you want someone with a ranged attack, why play Demo when you can play Deathslinger, Huntress or Freddy?"
😆
Had to toss that in there.
Freddy do be lookin like this sometimes
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@JPA said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1907420#Comment_1907420
If you ask me this is a plus, I hate add-on dependent Killers but its great if they depend on a brown add-on. I bought Demo like 2 days ago but I already have 25 Rat Livers, I'm sure they'll be easy to restock, too.
It is nice that he doesn't need a Purple add-on, but, he sort of ends up like Wraith. He NEEDS that add-on to be any good.
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@Bwsted said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1907456#Comment_1907456
Why changing your mind when your mind is right?
It does absolutely nothing. You can VPN from the EU to Australia when playing killer and not a single hit gets rejected at 300 ping. I don't know what paramaters they set, but maybe they simply want to validate hits for aliens connecting from Jupiter's moons.
I really want someone to try to make the argument that hit validation is working. I just really want to hear it 😂😂😂
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Hit validation does nothing.
Change my mind.
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I played against a Ruin/Undying, Stridor, BBQ Spirit running Mother-Daughter Ring and the Amulet.
Most difficult match I've had in a LONG time.
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Console Optimization and Legion QoL changes.
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@musstang62 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1907356#Comment_1907356
Well said, I agree with all of that. Only other thing I have to add to the conversation - in the most recent bunch of stats released for red rank kill rates, if we ignore Nurse and Blight since they're much harder to handle, Plague and Demo are essentially tied for worst killer at red ranks by a pretty noticeable margin. Demo was 62.8% kill rate. Clown, for reference, was about 66.2%. Killer average was 68.2%. I don't think that the stats are the end all be all, but it's still telling that Demo was much lower than average there
I'm actually always surprised that more people don't think Demo is dogshit in his current state. He sounds great on paper but it just never seems to play out that well compared to other killers
Yes. I'm really not worried about kill rate. If a Killer is fun to play, I don't think Kill Rate matters too much.
I also forgot to add that his add-ons are awful. You NEED Rat Liver, but almost every other add-ons is bad.
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Just buff the numbers on kicking gens a bit.
It's a waste of time right now, but if you make them regress at, for example, buff it to .33 from .25
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Because he is.
Demo suffers from something unique. He can do everything, but he isn't particularly good at anything. He is stuck being either bad at worst or mediocre at best because of it. This also affects his pick rate. If you want someone with a ranged attack, why play Demo when you can play Deathslinger, Huntress or Freddy? Want stealth? Why not Myers, GhostFace or Wraith? Easy map traversal? Spirit, Billy, Blight and Oni.
As for your points, I'll address them.
- His Shred is easily baitable and is pretty punishing. It also SUCKS on Console, which is where I play.
- Portals do offer map traversal, but they can be removed. They also give a huge notification that you are using them AND they glow.
- His tracking is decent, but again, it's only when touching the Portal and tracking without means to capitalize is meaningless.
- He is good with STBFL.
- His stealth is REALLY bad. Only really bad Survivors will EVER be surprised by him. He gives not one, not two, but THREE warning signs that he's near. Map wide notification that he is using a Portal, Portal glows and his stomping.
- He isn't map dependent. That is true.
Demo needs a total redesign. Not only is he mediocre at best, but he is boring to play. He could've been so interesting, he does so much in ST. Have him able to pull Survivors into the Upside-Down. Have his Portals expand to corrupt the surrounding area. Let him pull generators into the Upside-Down. Do something to make him unique.