NMCKE
NMCKE
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@RotBbRotBb said:
Purple Knife Gang, as the Doc would say it “Git Go-“ no I’m joking, Freddy is perk dependable while Legion is add-on dependent. If you don’t have good add-ons, he isn’t good. I recommend you try Susies Mix tape + stolen sketchbook for a few games then get back to me.Nickenzie said:
At least Freddy doesn't have to attack a survivor four times to down them. Freddy is definitely better than the Legion by a mile.RotBb said:Freddy, it’s realy obvious, he is simply more viable, people who say legion haven’t played enough games as/against him.
Yeah, sure, a killer is gonna be strong if they use the best add-ons, I'll let you win that argument. I'm talking about how the Legion is a low tier killer without great add-ons and killers shouldn't need add-ons to be somewhat viable.
I made a thread during the PTB period, read up on the solution to making him better and tell me what you think!
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/32479/the-legion-solution-reasoning-and-justification-final-thread-update#latest
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At least Freddy doesn't have to attack a survivor four times to down them. Freddy is definitely better than the Legion by a mile.RotBb said:Freddy, it’s realy obvious, he is simply more viable, people who say legion haven’t played enough games as/against him. -
Do you want my meme? You can use it for these types of people!yeet said:@Carpemortum said:
yeet said:Let's be completely honest, everything about this killer is miserable.
His power is incredibly poor, one of the worst in the game in fact.
His perks are mediocre at best, and uninspired in design.
His design is uninspired, and his backstory incoherent, and his power doesn't match his theme.
He is not fun to play as, or against, the play experience as him is miserable, and playing against him is so trivial it's boring.
I really cannot understand how we come off of a killer like the spirit, into whatever abomination we have here.
And the people trying to defend it are even more pathetic.
😁 [1] LOL!
what an eloquent and well thought out argument
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Don't take this to heart but I feel like the skill checks can over complicate things with the DW status effect. However, I see that you understand the main problem with DW: It has the same effect on injured and healthy survivors.Incarnate said:@Nickenzie - In regards to your suggested the deep wound mechanics.
I think there needs to be two different timers, as indicated just below.
1 - healthy -> DW'ed - Longer than the normal DW timer to compensate for timer going down during a chase.
2 - injured -> DW'ed - Longer timer than the one above.I think the deep wound timer needs to keep going down in a chase, but slightly slower, so that way if the killer decides to apply pressure on the same DW'ed victim, the killer will not be severely punished for it.
If a victim gets DW'ed while injured and while mending the victim gets "find help" the DW timer will stop before 5% left, here the victim can only stop the bleeding by keep mending, which would be different from the one who got DW'ed while healthy. In this situation the victim who keep mending will occasionally get a skill check where if they fail it, the timer will automatically decrease by 1% - which basically give a maximum of 4 failed skill attempts before going down. The result from this will be that if they're unable to actually get to another victim, they still have the option to stall the bleeding until another victim will get there and help, which will make this DW'ed victim unable to move and will pretty much be a sitting duck, unless they're willing to risk going down. Either way at this point the victim should consider it lucky if it manages to recover from this state.
In regards to the legion, I think it's base move speed should be 4.2m/s, or maybe even 4.1m/s as the legion is based of a victim, also because it's way too easy to keep chasing one who's already DW'ed who also happen to have a timer that keeps going down while in a chase, and with the changes suggested by Nickenzie, it might be necessary.
..and perhaps make legion unable to actually benefit from bloodlust, because legion already has the feral frenzy, which should be more than enough speed boost.
A 60 second DW timer is a lot if you think about it and most survivors should have enough time to mend (or find a teammate to mend if was previously injured). This and having Frenzy get stronger as you tag multiple survivors should help him slow down the game since he's able to DW multiple survivors. Consequently, we need to a way to balance this out because just these two buffs will make him a killing machine. The Legion will have to wait for his power to completely charge to 100% before using it and it takes more time to fully charge it (as well as lasting just a little bit longer). While my changes will definitely make him better, he should stay at 110% because it's the only thing he has when he doesn't have Frenzy. -
I see a lot of threads saying he's bad so I'll bump this thread (instead of making another thread) to show people how we can make the Legion better!
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Very.Doc_W__HOLLIDAY said:From what I hear, he's still bad. -
Well if you didn't cleanse a totem because you was lazy then you kinda deserve it. If you couldn't cleanse a totem because all of the totems were already cleansed then at least you know that you didn't cleanse a totem and that you should be careful.alivebydeadight said:for the rest of the trial part sounds a little too strong but I dont want to feel the hatred from that
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Perhaps if there was emblem points when you cleanse a totem then it would be worth it. However, making a totem worth 10% in the Lightbringer category will make the difference. It's either I safety pip because I'm not doing anything but totems or do gens and hook rescues with the NOED risk to hopefully pip.OrionsFury4789 said:
I totally get where you’re coming from and there should be more points and notice to cleansing totems , however I think of the patch notes got updated today and survivors knew one totem would save them it would be RIP noedNickenzie said:
The problem with "every survivor needs to cleanse a totem" is that every survivor doesn't cleanse a totem. I can cleanse 4 dull totems and still have NOED take effect because my other teammates were too lazy. Consequently, it doesn't feel good when I get sacrificed for doing my absolute best and my teammates run free. You see where I'm coming from? I'll like to mention that you don't get much emblem points for running around hitting totems so I usually safety pip since I'm not doing generators or getting unhooks until after I get every dull totem.OrionsFury4789 said:
I gave my reason for disagreeing earlier in the thread and I’ll throw one more out there, you clearly said if you do one totem you’re safe...Nickenzie said:
Ruin only takes one totems to cleanse while NOED takes 5 dull totems to cleanse. You're practically bringing 5 hex perks when you use NOED since each totem contributes to the perk. Now, is it fair for one survivor to cleanse the perk alone or is it fair for 4 survivors to cleanse the perk? My rework makes it where all of the survivors will need to contribute, not one doing all the work.Malakir said:Just gitgud tbh
I stopped using noed ages ago because people cleanse totems or find it right after it activates
The only one who actually have a problem with noed are usually newer players as far as Ive noticed. Can we just stop to ask reworks or nerf to a REMOVABLE perk? Because, you know, these can be removed as well as ruin etc unlike ANY survivor perk
The only time I used it recently (2months ago) noed to train with the nurse, 8/10 of matches didn't even activated at red ranks and as survivor I find more destroyed totems than fresh ones so.. I guess there isn't only a person who cleanse them especially with the awful spawns these things have
But if all four survivors do one totem and there is still one left for noed to activate who gets exposed? It’s a nice thought for solo survivors but it would be a major nerf to NOED if you only needed one totem to know you were good , noed would be gone every match before the second gen was popped. I think it’s good training for survivors because they should be doing that anyway but it’s too much and kinda unbalanced -
@PeanitsPeanits said:I'm not opposed to a short interaction, but I don't think that breaking a generator when there's still survivors there should be viable. You should have to make sure the area is clear first, not just kick it without checking and move on knowing that it'll regress a certain amount regardless.
Having a interaction time won't change this. If the killer doesn't check the area, the survivor can still stop the regression via short repair interaction. If the killer does check the area and it's clear, the generator will regress more to slow down the game. -
So with 5 tokens...AChaoticKiller said:The increased pressure of losing your prey fills you with anger and gives you unsuspected motivation. Each time the survivors complete repairs on generator, Fire Up grows in power and grants speed bonus to movement, pick up, drop, break action, and vaults.
* 2 tokens: receive a 2% movement speed bonus and 10% action speed bonus.
* 3 tokens: receive a 3% movement speed bonus and 12% action speed bonus.
* 4 tokens: receive a 4% movement speed bonus and 14% action speed bonus.
* 5 tokens: lose all movement speed bonuses and receive 25% action speed bonus.
The idea is that as the trial progresses you get slightly faster at everything. However since noed already gives you speed at the end, Fire Up losses the movment speed bonus it gives you and in return you can destroy pallets and vault windows insanely fast to close the distance on survivors. This is the 3rd tier version, what do you guys think of this buff?
-You'll move 9% faster than normal
115% Normal MS => 124%
110% Hag, Spirit, etc MS => 119%
96.25% Nurse MS => 105.25%
-Have a 61% action speed bonus -
I'll say within the 5 second period (that you're fixing the damaged generator) you'll receive the skill check. Additionally, Overcharge can (be buffed and) make fixing a regressed generator take 10 seconds instead of 5 seconds.SnakeSound222 said:@Nickenzie said:
KingB said:I just think to stop regressing the gen the survivor should have to work on it an equivalent time to how long the killer took to damage it. What does everyone else think about a change like this?
Actually, the survivor should have to go through a 5 second animation of fixing the damaged generator. After they fixed the damaged generator, they can start repairing at whatever they left off at depending on the regression. This will help out with the, I repaired 0.00000000000001% of the generator so I fixed it during chases.
How would this work with Overcharge though? Would you receive the skill check during or after the gen has been fixed and you've resumed normal repairs?
I actually like the idea of having to fix a regressed generator before starting the actual repairs. Currently, you just repair a generator to stop a regressing generator but having to go through a repair animation can make kicking generators more rewarding. -
Lockers should make it where the killer can't read your aura but you also can't read the killer's aura to compensate.Doc_W__HOLLIDAY said:
But picture this scenario, 4 man SWF who want to "booli the baby killerino duuud", holding the match hostage. Only coming out of the lockers when they see the killer is on the other side of the map.RinWaifu said:@Doc_W__HOLLIDAY said:
Oh God.... SWF with OoO in lockers is gonna be absolutely horrible...Honestly that don't change much, normally in SWF one guy loops you to the death while the others gen rush, that's also show how much SWF can [BAD WORD] this game mechanics
I'm probably gonna gets survivor mains saying, "Killers always asking for compensations" But it's only fair. Imagine the killer getting free aura reading on the survivor while in the basement but the survivors can't read his aura. This is where I'm coming from because it just wouldn't be fair. -
Actually, the survivor should have to go through a 5 second animation of fixing the damaged generator. After they fixed the damaged generator, they can start repairing at whatever they left off at depending on the regression. This will help out with the, I repaired 0.00000000000001% of the generator so I fixed it during chases.KingB said:I just think to stop regressing the gen the survivor should have to work on it an equivalent time to how long the killer took to damage it. What does everyone else think about a change like this? -
@powerbats has a phenomenal idea about how to change BBQ and make it do it's job. Basically, make it show the survivor's aura when they're within 24/32/40 meters to the hooked survivor. The numbers can be changed if it's proven to be too OP but you get the point.Master said:I will still run BBQ for double BP.
Who cares about some survivor tears because of a lil camping. Not my fault if they wanna get the incentive against camping nerfed. Thats their fault, now they can deal with it
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This here, the survivor can know when you're coming and run to another pallet. I'm not trying to bash the developers on how poor this killer is but I can probably run this killer for 5 generators. Sure, eventually Frenzy will down me but it'll take 4 hits and due to his Frenzy fatigue, I'll use Iron Will to break the chase.DarkWo1f997 said:
That’s the idea, but the thing is, at 110% speed, it can take a long time.powerbats said:@Wolf74 said:
4 hits.^^
So he is the opposite of an insta down killer.
He doesn't half the amount of hits to down someone, but double. XDIsn't this where you come up and non frenzy smack them since they're wounded already at that point?
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Are you a nice Nurse? I see some nurses abusing their power and play extremely unfun when they don't have to as they are the strongest killer in the game. Example: Whenever someone farms another survivor, I'll down the farmed survivor to make the farmer lose benevolence then go after the farmer. Usually the farmer gets hooked and the farmed survivor gets back up since really it wasn't his fault that he got down.xXNurseXx said:Back 2 Business Guys
@Nickenzie said:
Do you think Spirit is a great competitor to the Nurse?
Shes the second best Killer against good Survivors but no where as good as the Nurse
@KingB said:
Do you stream? Or have a YouTube or something?No but maybe i really should
Anyway if you want to watch a good nurse watch zubatlel im pretty much playing like him (only talking about nurse, hes way better with the other killers)
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Do you think Spirit is a great competitor to the Nurse?xXNurseXx said:Hey People of the Fog,
i 4k every game in DBD (or lets say 98 of 100 games) - doesnt matter if SWF or not. It also doesnt matter if they run D-Strike or Insta Heals, i just dont care. I even prefer to play against good ppl who are running all there crutch stuff because the game become a bit more interesting.
my Setup:
Killer: Nurse
Perks: BBQ - NC - Whispers - Shadowborni even dont have to tunnel or camp but whats most important to be successful but i have to admit that i slug pretty often and i always slug the last person to make sure the last surv dont get the free hatch escape (i mean if they manage to get 2 gens on because most of the times they dont).
Also note: i have 1850 hours. i would say around ~1400 hours as killer and ~1300 hours while playing nurse
So yeah - if you have any questions - ama
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I already knew this as a Pig main, I only do this to add more pressure to the survivor.redsopine01 said:If you crouch chase them your not in a chase and as such the timer don't stop but there forced to keep running from you (Found this out on a cheesy and cheap last second switcher and they went pop) -
The problem with "every survivor needs to cleanse a totem" is that every survivor doesn't cleanse a totem. I can cleanse 4 dull totems and still have NOED take effect because my other teammates were too lazy. Consequently, it doesn't feel good when I get sacrificed for doing my absolute best and my teammates run free. You see where I'm coming from? I'll like to mention that you don't get much emblem points for running around hitting totems so I usually safety pip since I'm not doing generators or getting unhooks until after I get every dull totem.OrionsFury4789 said:
I gave my reason for disagreeing earlier in the thread and I’ll throw one more out there, you clearly said if you do one totem you’re safe...Nickenzie said:
Ruin only takes one totems to cleanse while NOED takes 5 dull totems to cleanse. You're practically bringing 5 hex perks when you use NOED since each totem contributes to the perk. Now, is it fair for one survivor to cleanse the perk alone or is it fair for 4 survivors to cleanse the perk? My rework makes it where all of the survivors will need to contribute, not one doing all the work.Malakir said:Just gitgud tbh
I stopped using noed ages ago because people cleanse totems or find it right after it activates
The only one who actually have a problem with noed are usually newer players as far as Ive noticed. Can we just stop to ask reworks or nerf to a REMOVABLE perk? Because, you know, these can be removed as well as ruin etc unlike ANY survivor perk
The only time I used it recently (2months ago) noed to train with the nurse, 8/10 of matches didn't even activated at red ranks and as survivor I find more destroyed totems than fresh ones so.. I guess there isn't only a person who cleanse them especially with the awful spawns these things have
But if all four survivors do one totem and there is still one left for noed to activate who gets exposed? It’s a nice thought for solo survivors but it would be a major nerf to NOED if you only needed one totem to know you were good , noed would be gone every match before the second gen was popped. I think it’s good training for survivors because they should be doing that anyway but it’s too much and kinda unbalanced -
Ruin only takes one totems to cleanse while NOED takes 5 dull totems to cleanse. You're practically bringing 5 hex perks when you use NOED since each totem contributes to the perk. Now, is it fair for one survivor to cleanse the perk alone or is it fair for 4 survivors to cleanse the perk? My rework makes it where all of the survivors will need to contribute, not one doing all the work.Malakir said:Just gitgud tbh
I stopped using noed ages ago because people cleanse totems or find it right after it activates
The only one who actually have a problem with noed are usually newer players as far as Ive noticed. Can we just stop to ask reworks or nerf to a REMOVABLE perk? Because, you know, these can be removed as well as ruin etc unlike ANY survivor perk
The only time I used it recently (2months ago) noed to train with the nurse, 8/10 of matches didn't even activated at red ranks and as survivor I find more destroyed totems than fresh ones so.. I guess there isn't only a person who cleanse them especially with the awful spawns these things have -
Awe, we can agree that the majority of this community is NOT in the middle...Peanits said:I'm sure there's a lot of things, unless you take two people from completely different sides of the spectrum. If you go to the extremes, you're going to have one side that'll tell you everything about killers is OP, while the other side will tell you that everything about survivors is OP.
In the middle, there's the people who can be reasonable and put bias aside to look at things objectively, and they will agree that some of their own stuff can be OP.
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If you haven't killed at least 1-2 survivors before the 5th generator pops then you aren't doing something right. I never had a problem with Adrenaline since usually I don't injure every survivor I see because Adrenaline can undo that.The_Crusader said:
Disagree, especially since a lot of SWF all run the perk. Thay's why you see one sat right on the last gen as you walk right up to them, because they know as soon it it pops they're all getting a health boost.Nickenzie said:
DS is getting reworked and Adrenaline is balanced since the survivor sacrificed a perk for the late game in my opinion.The_Crusader said:I hate to say it but as long as DS and Adrenaline are in the game NOED needs to stay.
You can't make NOED weaker when you go up against a team of 4 all carrying those.
Now tell me, other than perhaps say Billy if the entire team is alive and they all get an instaheal once the last gen pops how the hell am I meant to counter that?
What am I meant to do with Wraith? With 20 seconds to take out 4 people with full health?
At least if 2 were injured you could maybe get 2 hooks out of it. -
Delfador said:
@Nickenzie I liked your idea but I have a couple of questions.
If I cleansed 3 totems and one teammate left out, is there anything he can do?
Will the killer know which survivors have been affected by exposed status? Not knowing puts killer in a disadvantage.
If I haven't cleansed a totem but after getting exposed, I decided to cleanse one. What will be the outcome?One thing I love about this idea, just like blight event, survivors will try to find dull totems before they start to do generators which is very cool and time consuming.
If I cleansed 3 totems and one teammate left out, is there anything he can do?
No, you basically screwed over the survivor who can't cleanse a totem to save themselves. However, at least they will know they didn't and will need to be cautious at the end game.Will the killer know which survivors have been affected by exposed status? Not knowing puts killer in a disadvantage.
The killer will NOT know who is exposed but not knowing shouldn't hurt the killer too much anyways since the exposed survivors will likely be hiding. Exposed doesn't mean anything if the killer isn't there to make it mean something.If I haven't cleansed a totem but after getting exposed, I decided to cleanse one. What will be the outcome?
You're exposed for the "remainder of the trial" I think this is fair because you couldn't cleanse a totem. If you couldn't then at least you know that you're exposed and will need to be careful.
I'll make some changes to the perk if you have some good reasoning behind it.
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It can be easy depending on the situation but usually it's a arduous task for most survivors.Boss said:I don't feel like doing all 5 Totems on my own is a lot of work.
What do we do now? -
DS is getting reworked and Adrenaline is balanced since the survivor sacrificed a perk for the late game in my opinion.The_Crusader said:I hate to say it but as long as DS and Adrenaline are in the game NOED needs to stay.
You can't make NOED weaker when you go up against a team of 4 all carrying those. -
You only need to cleanse one totem to avoid the exposed status effect, not 5 unless you wanna screw over other survivors.The_Crusader said:I think that would cause a lot of salt at the players in the endgame who didn't cleanse a totem. -
This could work as well! It's just a single survivor can only do so much and it's just not fair to put everything on a single survivor. Of course SWF this isn't a issue but still, Solo Q survivors are suffering from this.ChesterTheMolester said:I mentioned it elsewhere but i think it'd be interesting to remove Hex and Exposed and removes the Killers TR and red stain. -
Well, it's made!Orion said:@Nickenzie said:
Actually, I'll make a thread on how to make NOED feel great for both sides instead of crowding this thread. I'll @ you on my thread because you seem very civilized to discuss things with!First thing I do on every forum I join is disable notifications. You're better off just finding a thread I'm actively engaged in and dropping a link there.
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Actually, I'll make a thread on how to make NOED feel great for both sides instead of crowding this thread. I'll @ you on my thread because you seem very civilized to discuss things with!Orion said:@Nickenzie said:
BBQ is easy to counter but NOED is much more arduous for the single survivor. It's why NOED is weak on SWF and strong on Solo Q survivors because it's not just you doing everything.NOED has more counters than breaking totems. You can also hide near one of the exits, like I said, wait for the Killer to go to the other one, and then leave. You don't have to disable NOED for it to cease being a threat. The Killer can't use NOED if they can't find you.
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BBQ is easy to counter but NOED is much more arduous for the single survivor. It's why NOED is weak on SWF and strong on Solo Q survivors because it's not just you doing everything.Orion said:@Nickenzie said:
Yeah, but you'll have to consider that my version will warn you that the killer has NOED by showing you that you're doomed. The current version doesn't tell you that the killer has NOED until after you're in dying state, you had no counter play because you didn't know. I understand, just cleanse all 5 totems which is fair to say but one survivor can only do so much against the killer when his teammates don't aid him in the process. That's why the perk should warn you that you're exposed like Rancor when you're the obsession or get rid of the instant downs for a mori (you'll know the killer can mori you by seeing the doomed status effect to the right). Both choices I'm completely fine with since you know and can have a chance to play around the perk.There is counterplay. Just like how you don't know if the Killer has BBQ, you can still take steps to prevent it. I already mentioned Dark Sense as an easy counter to NOED.
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Yeah, but you'll have to consider that my version will warn you that the killer has NOED by showing you that you're doomed. The current version doesn't tell you that the killer has NOED until after you're in dying state, you had no counter play because you didn't know. I understand, just cleanse all 5 totems which is fair to say but one survivor can only do so much against the killer when his teammates don't aid him in the process. That's why the perk should warn you that you're exposed like Rancor when you're the obsession or get rid of the instant downs for a mori (you'll know the killer can mori you by seeing the doomed status effect to the right). Both choices I'm completely fine with since you know and can have a chance to play around the perk.Orion said:@Nickenzie said:
Not per dull totem, worded badly lol.Even just 10% is already a massive increase.
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Not per dull totem, worded badly lol.Orion said:@Nickenzie said:
Hex perks can be disabled, especially NOED and the survivors will get a warning (notification saying they are doomed). Trust me, I'll rather get mori'd by a killer who won a chase against me then have the killer insta down me because I didn't know a totem was still up.I'm not sure you understand just how massive a 10% movement speed increase really is, and you want it per dull totem, meaning there's a theoretical 50% maximum. That would put the Killers' speed at 165%, or roughly half that of the Nurse when she's blinking.
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Hex perks can be disabled, especially NOED and the survivors will get a warning (notification saying they are doomed). Trust me, I'll rather get mori'd by a killer who won a chase against me then have the killer insta down me because I didn't know a totem was still up.Orion said:@Nickenzie said:
Your rage from losing your prey calls upon the Entity to aid you. Any dull totem remaining in the trial will have this Hex applied to it when the exit gates are powered. Gain a 6/8/10% movement speed increase and all survivors will suffer from the doomed status effect. The Hex effect's persists as long as the related Hex totem is standing.Doomed Status Effect:
Survivors are marked for death by the Entity.
-Suvivors can be killed by the killer via mori.If that doesn't work, show every survivor when the last generator is completed if they are exposed or not. Rancor does this and it does its job by telling the obsession to be careful so why not with NOED?
That sounds absurdly overpowered, beyond anything that has ever existed in the game.
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Actually, I tend to use Deliverance instead of Small Game because NOED is heavily countered by Deliverance. Usually I'll play stealthy and get a safe unhook to proc my Deliverance for the endgame. When the killer NOED me, hooks me, and then chases the other survivors out, I'll kobe and run to the hatch (or second exit gate).Orion said:@SpongeBob420Pants said:
@Vietfox said:
Cleansing totems is not that hard.In solo queue, just for NOED? It's pretty annoying.
Dark Sense counters NOED. Just hide near the exit that the Killer is checking first, and when they go for the other one, open it and walk out.
The main problem with is you just don't see it coming. It's the reason why Rancor is fairly balanced since it gives the obsession a warning to gtfo or suffer the punishments. Another thing, NOED is OP in solo Q but SWF it's a joke. They need to make the perk less punishing to the solo Q survivors while remaining strong to the killer. How would this version work @Orion?No One Escapes Death:
Your rage from losing your prey calls upon the Entity to aid you. Any dull totem remaining in the trial will have this Hex applied to it when the exit gates are powered. Gain a 6/8/10% movement speed increase and all survivors will suffer from the doomed status effect. The Hex effect's persists as long as the related Hex totem is standing.Doomed Status Effect:
Survivors are marked for death by the Entity.
-Suvivors can be killed by the killer via mori.
If that doesn't work, show every survivor when the last generator is completed if they are exposed or not. Rancor does this and it does its job by telling the obsession to be careful so why not with NOED?
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KiraElijah said:
😄[1] LOLNickenzie said:
Have you tried cleansing 5 totems yourself just to get NOED because you thought that you cleansed every totem? Have you ever faced a non obsession DS? Have the DS user never landed beside a hook and you had to find another survivor?Theluckyboi said:@Nickenzie said:
Theluckyboi said:Fack off, i am tired that every thread in feedback, balance and general discussions is about NOED and Decisive being overpowered because there are a lot, and i mean A LOT of ways to counter these 2.
My best advice is to get good, your complains are tiresome.
Hmm, how would feel if there was a perk that allowed the killer completely regress a generator's progress once per trial? It likely wouldn't feel good for you since all of your progress is gone. It's the same thing with DS and NOED to a certain extent, they need to be changed.
Why can´t you cleanse all the totems? why can´t you throw the survivor each two seconds? why can´t you use borrowed time? why can´t you use enduring or unnerving pressence?
Both are necessary perks with a lot of nerfs and can be countered if you actually care about them
It seems like you are being one sided about things.
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"Sole Survivor: I don't like the 3rd token effect. This would make it possible to throw on this perk, sandbag or do absolutely nothing, and then slip out the gates for a free escape. I don't think a killer would expect it so you would go largely unnoticed. I definitely think Sole Survivor should give you a shot if you're the last one standing, but this would reward you a little too much for failing."Peanits said:Huh. I see the @, but I didn't get a notification. Weird.
I think I've seen a lot of these posted before, and I still like most of them. Just going to hit a couple things that I think might cause problems.
Sole Survivor: I don't like the 3rd token effect. This would make it possible to throw on this perk, sandbag or do absolutely nothing, and then slip out the gates for a free escape. I don't think a killer would expect it so you would go largely unnoticed. I definitely think Sole Survivor should give you a shot if you're the last one standing, but this would reward you a little too much for failing.
Monstrous Hooks: Might be better to keep it as a shrine (basement hooks only). This would still offer some interesting opportunities. Running it along side Agitation would basically hard counter We'll Make It, and you could turn the basement into an incredibly dangerous place with almost no chance of escaping from it. With blocking healing in general for all hooks, I just feel like this would remove the decision of whether or not it's better to heal at the hook and encourage tunneling the unhooked survivor. Tunneling that guy is already a powerful strategy, I don't feel like there needs to be perks to encourage it more.
Pain: A little close to stridor. Could go either way.
Left Behind: Minor note: You should just be presenting with the new part prompt immediately, having to stop repairing to do it again would feel clunky and confuse some people. I would also say that as a minor QOL change, the generator should not provide a notification when completed (the aura just disappears and the generator started sound plays). This would make fixing a generator a little less risky, since it would currently pinpoint your location.
Third Seal: This is interesting, but I don't know how much of an effect it would have. Most maps tend to generator the same way each time with little variation. Thompson House, for example, will always spawn with the house on one edge with jungle gyms to either side, with a couple hay bales and tractors in between, corn in the center of the map, harvesters and cow tree along the edge, and then the shack in the corner to the left (facing out from the house). Most maps have similar rules as to where tiles can spawn. In that regard, this blindness effect would likely have a pretty limited effect on experienced players. I could see this being more punishing to new players which ideally a perk should not do.
No Mither: This is something I don't think I'd want to see. Shards are currently a very protected currency. The rate you get them is the same as the rate everyone gets them. The issue I see here is that this would encourage people to run this perk just to get the shards. On the surface, that's fine, but it's also not fair to your teammates that you're handicapping yourself- and as a result, hurting the team as a whole- just because you want some extra shards. It would be frustrating to lose a match because all three other survivors are farming shards and keep going down in one hit, meanwhile you're just there trying to play the game normally.
Then again, I'm not really a fan of farming perks in general. If the bloodpoint/shard gain needs to be higher, I'd rather just see that raised as a baseline and leave perks just as gameplay modifiers. I don't think that certain perks should become meta purely for the rewards they provide.
Well let's look at the situations and see how perk has counter play for the killer! If the hatch has already spawned then the survivor was going to escape anyways. The survivor will eventually escape through the hatch even without this perk change. If the hatch hasn't spawned in, the perk can play directly into your hands by patrolling the doors and catching the survivor off guard.
"Monstrous Hooks: Might be better to keep it as a shrine (basement hooks only). This would still offer some interesting opportunities. Running it along side Agitation would basically hard counter We'll Make It, and you could turn the basement into an incredibly dangerous place with almost no chance of escaping from it. With blocking healing in general for all hooks, I just feel like this would remove the decision of whether or not it's better to heal at the hook and encourage tunneling the unhooked survivor. Tunneling that guy is already a powerful strategy, I don't feel like there needs to be perks to encourage it more."
The perk can encourage tunneling but think about the bigger picture here. If you let the survivor go then they will probably won't do anything for 30 seconds since they are sacred to even do anything until healed. The pain status effect will encourage them to heal as soon as possible so you're talking about 70 seconds to heal assuming you have sloppy butcher on and they use self care immediately.
"Left Behind: Minor note: You should just be presenting with the new part prompt immediately, having to stop repairing to do it again would feel clunky and confuse some people. I would also say that as a minor QOL change, the generator should not provide a notification when completed (the aura just disappears and the generator started sound plays). This would make fixing a generator a little less risky, since it would currently pinpoint your location."
I agree with the QoL change and how would you word what you just said about making the BNP prompt show up again?
"Third Seal: This is interesting, but I don't know how much of an effect it would have. Most maps tend to generator the same way each time with little variation. Thompson House, for example, will always spawn with the house on one edge with jungle gyms to either side, with a couple hay bales and tractors in between, corn in the center of the map, harvesters and cow tree along the edge, and then the shack in the corner to the left (facing out from the house). Most maps have similar rules as to where tiles can spawn. In that regard, this blindness effect would likely have a pretty limited effect on experienced players. I could see this being more punishing to new players which ideally a perk should not do."
It really depends on the map and killer because if you're a Huntress, you can snipe survivors who don't see you. This can also apply to the Nurse when you see a survivor on a generator and can blink to them without noticing. I can say that this perk has more uses with these changes and if it's too weak, the numbers can be changed.
"No Mither: This is something I don't think I'd want to see. Shards are currently a very protected currency. The rate you get them is the same as the rate everyone gets them. The issue I see here is that this would encourage people to run this perk just to get the shards. On the surface, that's fine, but it's also not fair to your teammates that you're handicapping yourself- and as a result, hurting the team as a whole- just because you want some extra shards. It would be frustrating to lose a match because all three other survivors are farming shards and keep going down in one hit, meanwhile you're just there trying to play the game normally.Then again, I'm not really a fan of farming perks in general. If the bloodpoint/shard gain needs to be higher, I'd rather just see that raised as a baseline and leave perks just as gameplay modifiers. I don't think that certain perks should become meta purely for the rewards they provide."
Agreed, they should increased the rate gained and make the perks modifiers. However, I like the idea of a perk rewarding you for challenging yourself!
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I hate that map so much for both the survivor and the killer. It's like someone always uses a black water offering to make me wanna DC (Of course I don't DC but I really want to on that map)Jacoby2041 said:I get Backwater like 25% of the time when I play killer, which doesn't sound like a ton but considering how many areas and maps there are I get it much more proportionally speaking than other maps. To be honest I still think this is a coincidence, it's just really weird that I get this area so much. Not to mention I don't really like it either.
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PWYF doesn't deactivate when a survivor dies, it only deactivates when you sacrifice a survivor. Additionally, the 5% movement speed increase and 25% interaction speed increase is actually a lot. Imagine Myers with 40% vaulting speed increase with his own speed increase in vault speed. Crazy stuff.Judgement said:I actually really like all of these, bar only PWYF.
Play With Your Food seems to be kind of useless to me as you only get at maximum 5% movement speed and the perk's existence can be negated by a Survivor deciding to suicide on hook in the middle of the game. The best it'd do is make 110% Killers as fast as 115% Killers until a Survivor dies, and it would completely lose its utility in Infinite Tombstone Shape and make it nearly impossible to get Evil Incarnate, implying it isn't hard enough already.
5% movement speed until a Survivor dies isn't really worth a perk slot in my opinion.I love your idea of the Pain status effect, and Doomed looks solid as well, so long as it doesn't innately give Survivors the Exposed effect either.
I always thought that your idea for Pain should be applied to the Broken status effect and No Mither be buffed as a result to make it so a Survivor with No Mither makes no pain sounds whatsoever, so that the injured noise increase only applies when Survivors are afflicted by Broken as in due to Deliverance. But it is still a very good status effect.
Doomed could not possibly be named any more perfect. You know when a status effect in a game says 'doomed', you're in for the ass-kicking of a lifetime. Take Final Fantasy, Kingdom Hearts, and some other games inspired by that series for example - Doom is nearly always 'kill this enemy before time runs out or die instantly'. In Dead By Daylight it's 'if you fall, you die'.
But like I said, I only agree with Doomed if it does not automatically cause the affected Survivor to go down in one hit as if they've been Exposed.Besides all that, these perk ideas look awesome.
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I really feel like these perks need a rework:thesuicidefox said:I'm not a fan of completely changing the design of a perk. Most of the perks on your list are fine as they are they just need some minor buffs or QOL changes. Only the bottom of the barrel perks need to be reworked (eg. Spies, Surveillance, Monstrous Shrine).
Also, we have plenty of status effects, we really don't need more at this point. The only status effect I want is "Inefficient" which is basically a Mangled effect on repairs. This could go on Thanatophobia since that's kinda what it does anyway.
I do like your idea for Sole Survivor but that's honestly it.
-Huntress Lullaby
Basically paying attention to the screen shuts this perk down meaning you don't need to cleanse it. Hex perks should be OP (like Devour Hope) if left untouched and Huntress lullaby isn't strong enough to be a Hex.
-Monstrous Shrine
It's restriction to the basement hooks is too harsh on the killer since you can only go 58.88 meters before the survivor wiggles free. There needs to be a rework since buffing the perk won't solve the problem.
-Left Behind
This is a grey area since your team has to suck for this come handy or have the killer camp the hatch. Situation 1: You need to spawn the Hatch. Usually you'll do a generator and hope you can pull a miracle by hoping to complete a generator without getting caught. The problem is if you buff the speed, you'll make the perk OP as the it is either too good or too bad. Situation 2: The killer camping the hatch. You can just take your time 99%'ing the generators since the killer won't be patrolling. Here's the problem, you'll get the same effect without using Left Behind since it just speeds up the 99% progress and speed isn't important as the killer is not patrolling. Overall, if you buff the perk, the problem will still remain as it's still too situational and you can still get the same results without using the perk in situation 2.
-Thanatophoia
(Same problem with Left Behind as) the perk just needs a rework since buffing it will just make it like Dying Light and keeping it how it's right now will make it underpowered.
-Fire Up
Same thing with Left Behind and Thanatophoia, buffing it will make it a better Brutal Strength.
-Play With You Food
The problem with PWYF is it's too time consuming to get tokens and too easy to lose them. Buffing how many tokens will give the survivors no counter play and buffing the speed per token will will still give the survivor no counter play. Both of these buffs also don't solve the original problem of PWYF which is tokens are hard to get and easy to lose.
As for the rest, they are fine but I felt like they needed a rework (second effect such as Sole Survivor) to justify a perk slot. -
Hey, @Janick what do you think about this change?
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"This ones in a good place but what are the numbers for gen damage compared to now and how would this work with say Overcharge?"powerbats said:@Nickenzie said:
Brutal Strength:This ones in a good place but what are the numbers for gen damage compared to now and how would this work with say Overcharge?
Sole Survivor:
How would the aura reading work with say Trappers traps, Scratched Mirror Myers or his tracking addons, Amanda's aura addon and Jigsaw Boxes addon. The Wraiths aura addon, Huntress aura addon on hits. Then there's also Bitter Murmur and Tinkerer.
Monstrous Hooks:
Your care to your hooks make them deadly to the touch; wounding every victim it touches. Survivors unhooked from the hook suffer from the broken status effect for 10/20/30 seconds and they will slightly/moderately/considerablely suffer from the pain status effect. Pain Status Effect:
The grunts of pain is probably a bit much since you could be on far side of map and say you're a Billy you'd be able to hear that person pretty much instantly. If they pause to heal well 1 or more are going right back on the hook.
If anything I'd make progression a bit faster and failed attempts penalty harsher with 2nd hooks both overall and on basement hooks harsher.
Play With Your Food:
The stacking Ms is fine but the up to 30% action speed is brutal if you combine it with say Fire Up/Brutal/Bamboozle/Relentless. Then throw in say Legion who'd basically become the new Nurse. IF you kept it 1% across the board for each token that'd make it good but not op.
Since your goal is to hook repeatedly and then at the end you go for the sacrifice.
Left Behind:
1st 2 tokens only change is make it 10 and 25% and for the 3rd token instead of BNP perhaps make it 50% faster so gen would take 40 seconds. That's not counting any great skill checks.
Thanatophobia:
This is a tricky one since if you combined it with say Coulrophobia for healing and or Dying Light it could be brokenly op and would end up getting instantly nerfed.
I'll come back to this one after dinner.
Hex (Huntress Lullaby):
This i could see getting nerfed pretty quickly especially if you combined it with Monitor and Abuse and you'd become a ranged Myers at that point.
I'd change it to the 3/4/5 tokens but make each token give 1/3/6/9/12% reduced terror radius which is still pretty brutal if running M&A.
Hex (The Third Seal):
So basically like a fog/haze effect but I wonder what this would do to colorblind people though since you'd basically make their whole screen the same color of hazy white so to speak. The aura reading is fine but perhaps make it the furthest part of each distance tier is the more hazy.
Think of it this way if you're on say Macmillan Estates or Autohaven and look across the map it's hazy in the farthest corners of the map. It could work the same way but on small maps like say haddonfield it'd be a royal pain since you'd basically blind half the map.
Fire Up:
This is completely broken since no one would ever want to be the one that completed a generator, throw in a Tinkerer user/Bitter Murmur with say Nurse/Billy/Spirit. You could lower that to 2/4/6 seconds but even then the high mobility killers would have it easy.
Doomed Status Effect:
This is a free Rancor/Mori without having to use either one and instead the last person should have the exposed status effect. The mori effect can only be applied during the next 15 seconds after which they still retain the exposed status effect.
No Mither:
Shards might be a bit much since it's supposed to be risking yourself for bp so instead I'd go a different route to make it a real risk reward. You have the exposed effect the entire game but don't start the trial with the injured effect. Once you're downed then the No Mither effect is shown to everyone and the killer knows you're running it.
Now here's the big change, you'd make it like WGLF but instead it'd be stackable across all categories including Boldness so you're tempted to be in the killers terror radius. Do you take a chance and get chased for those extra juicy Boldness points up to 100% bonus?
How about going for that rescue when the killer is close knowing you're going to probably be on that very same hook shortly. This would really encourage a high risk high reward playstyle for running it. It wouldn't be for the faint of heart and it'd reward you for really taking risks.
This perk won't affect Overcharge, it will only affect the speed in which a damaged generator regresses over time.
"How would the aura reading work with say Trappers traps, Scratched Mirror Myers or his tracking addons, Amanda's aura addon and Jigsaw Boxes addon. The Wraiths aura addon, Huntress aura addon on hits. Then there's also Bitter Murmur and Tinkerer."
Same as the current version of Sole Survivor, if the killer is within that range then the killer cannot read your aura.
"The grunts of pain is probably a bit much since you could be on far side of map and say you're a Billy you'd be able to hear that person pretty much instantly. If they pause to heal well 1 or more are going right back on the hook.If anything I'd make progression a bit faster and failed attempts penalty harsher with 2nd hooks both overall and on basement hooks harsher."
I dunno, I feel like my version can waste a lot of time since it prevents them from healing for 30 seconds and are likely too scared to do anything until they are healed. The extra grunts of pain can help you find their healing spot and counteracts Iron Will.
"The stacking Ms is fine but the up to 30% action speed is brutal if you combine it with say Fire Up/Brutal/Bamboozle/Relentless. Then throw in say Legion who'd basically become the new Nurse. IF you kept it 1% across the board for each token that'd make it good but not op.
Since your goal is to hook repeatedly and then at the end you go for the sacrifice."
I feel like the action speed is justified BUT if it does gets out of control then we could nerf it down to 3% or 4% per token.
"1st 2 tokens only change is make it 10% and 25% and for the 3rd token instead of BNP perhaps make it 50% faster so gen would take 40 seconds. That's not counting any great skill checks."
I feel like 40 seconds would take too long since the killer will likely be patrolling generators. My BNP at 3 tokens makes generators take 20 seconds to complete if you hit the difficult skill checks assuming you performed the BNP action 4 times on the generator.
"This is a tricky one since if you combined it with say Coulrophobia for healing and or Dying Light it could be brokenly op and would end up getting instantly nerfed.
I'll come back to this one after dinner."
I don't think this perk will get out of control since if the killer was able to get 10 tokens then the survivors are likely gonna lose anyways.
"This i could see getting nerfed pretty quickly especially if you combined it with Monitor and Abuse and you'd become a ranged Myers at that point.
I'd change it to the 3/4/5 tokens but make each token give 1/3/6/9/12% reduced terror radius which is still pretty brutal if running M&A."
I understand where you're coming from but it's a Hex. Hex perks can get destroyed at anytime and thus makes this perk strength justified when at 5 tokens.
"So basically like a fog/haze effect but I wonder what this would do to colorblind people though since you'd basically make their whole screen the same color of hazy white so to speak. The aura reading is fine but perhaps make it the furthest part of each distance tier is the more hazy.
Think of it this way if you're on say Macmillan Estates or Autohaven and look across the map it's hazy in the farthest corners of the map. It could work the same way but on small maps like say haddonfield it'd be a royal pain since you'd basically blind half the map."
Like I said above, Hex perks are supposed to be OP if left standing because they can be cleansed at anytime. However numbers can be changed if proven to be a little much.
"This is completely broken since no one would ever want to be the one that completed a generator, throw in a Tinkerer user/Bitter Murmur with say Nurse/Billy/Spirit. You could lower that to 2/4/6 seconds but even then the high mobility killers would have it easy."
Think of it as MYC but worse since you're only getting 5 survivors exposed with only 1 them getting doomed. I feel like there's enough counter play: Not doing a generator when the killer is nearby.
"This is a free Rancor/Mori without having to use either one and instead the last person should have the exposed status effect. The mori effect can only be applied during the next 15 seconds after which they still retain the exposed status effect."
Same thing as I said above, just don't do a generator when the killer is nearby and you'll be just fine. It just looks scary because the exposed and the doomed status effect are strong status effects but don't mean anything if the killer isn't there to make them strong.
"Shards might be a bit much since it's supposed to be risking yourself for bp so instead I'd go a different route to make it a real risk reward. You have the exposed effect the entire game but don't start the trial with the injured effect. Once you're downed then the No Mither effect is shown to everyone and the killer knows you're running it.
Now here's the big change, you'd make it like WGLF but instead it'd be stackable across all categories including Boldness so you're tempted to be in the killers terror radius. Do you take a chance and get chased for those extra juicy Boldness points up to 100% bonus?
How about going for that rescue when the killer is close knowing you're going to probably be on that very same hook shortly. This would really encourage a high risk high reward playstyle for running it. It wouldn't be for the faint of heart and it'd reward you for really taking risks."
Your version can work BUT I made this version because someone wanted it to be viable while remaining a hardcore perk.
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This here!Doc_W__HOLLIDAY said:Can be as killer or survivor. I had a game tonight vs a super toxic genrush squad and managed to whoop that ass so hard it gave em flashbacks of their alcoholic daddies.
https://xboxclips.com/NMCKE/f69da931-c247-404b-b081-88d910ce4f07
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Have you tried cleansing 5 totems yourself just to get NOED because you thought that you cleansed every totem? Have you ever faced a non obsession DS? Have the DS user never landed beside a hook and you had to find another survivor?Theluckyboi said:@Nickenzie said:
Theluckyboi said:Fack off, i am tired that every thread in feedback, balance and general discussions is about NOED and Decisive being overpowered because there are a lot, and i mean A LOT of ways to counter these 2.
My best advice is to get good, your complains are tiresome.
Hmm, how would feel if there was a perk that allowed the killer completely regress a generator's progress once per trial? It likely wouldn't feel good for you since all of your progress is gone. It's the same thing with DS and NOED to a certain extent, they need to be changed.
Why can´t you cleanse all the totems? why can´t you throw the survivor each two seconds? why can´t you use borrowed time? why can´t you use enduring or unnerving pressence?
Both are necessary perks with a lot of nerfs and can be countered if you actually care about them
It seems like you are being one sided about things.
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Hmm, how would feel if there was a perk that allowed the killer completely regress a generator's progress once per trial? It likely wouldn't feel good for you since all of your progress is gone. It's the same thing with DS and NOED to a certain extent, they need to be changed.Theluckyboi said:Fack off, i am tired that every thread in feedback, balance and general discussions is about NOED and Decisive being overpowered because there are a lot, and i mean A LOT of ways to counter these 2.
My best advice is to get good, your complains are tiresome.
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The developers cannot remove a perk from the game because you hate the perk. However, you can offer feedback on how to make perk feel more fair for both sides since you obviously feel like it's not fair. Here's a example of what you should do when you don't like something below.SpongeBob420Pants said:- NOED: Just remove it from the game.
- Camping/face camping: Increase the negative chaser points based off proximity (Face camping from first hook until dead should result in no chaser emblem).
- Decisive strike: It should require the 50% wiggle regardless of obsession.
Hello, I feel like NOED needs a nerf because [Put what you see wrong here]. Here's my suggestions as to make NOED seem more fair to the survivor side while remaining strong for the killer.NOED:
[Insert new perk description here]
[Explain why you think this version of NOED will solve your problem mentioned above] -
Fire Up seemed like a Brutal Strength wannabe in my opinion. I changed it to serve as a secondary purpose as to punish survivors who do generators while the killer is close, especially for Freddy.MyFreddyIsBae said:Great list! But tbh, I'd rather have Fire Up buffed instead of reworked ^^
Are there any perks you'd consider on using now?
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Yeah but the moment you sacrifice a survivor then PWYF is gone just like a Hex perk so you'll want to spread the damage.ChesterTheMolester said:PWYF sounds like a new Meta perk especially for Freddy since he can keep an eye on the obsession and keep them hurt at the same time. -
I had the idea that Plunder's Instinct gave you the ability to search a chest twice.HuN7r3sS said:This isn't all that detrimental to the game, but I believe that Plunderers Instinct should have the aruas of items dropped by Franklin's shown to whoever is using the perk. I don't use plunderers I just think it makes sense that if your already looting on the map then you know where dropped items are as well