GrimReaperJr1232
GrimReaperJr1232
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Noed: Do bones. With Boons becoming meta, you should be learning totem spawns.
Bubba: He's fine as he is. A bit too good at facecamping, maybe, but otherwise perfectly balanced.
Wraith - we're nerfing Wraith now? Seriously?
Myers - This guy needs help, not nerfs. Especially since this'll make his abysmal early game worse.
Spirit - So what's even the point of her power?
Blight - .... you forgot something.
Trickster - oddly, I'm on board with this... if he's made 115%. Otherwise, no. He needs help.
Artist - how do you even have 5? And getting those through walls hits is already difficult if the survs are repelling. No need to make it worse.
Corrupt - Why?
Pentimento - again, why?
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@GannTM said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2695302#Comment_2695302
I don’t think I want to do that, she is a minor and where I live, 18 is when it’s legal. Although when she came out in 2018 I was 17 soooo.
What? Spirit was a university student, mate. She was an adult.
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Killers only see the totem and hear it chime when they're close.
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Times they took feedback into account?
1. They nerfed Spirit, using the positive response from when she was bugged as a reference keeping her strong but more fair.
2. They nerfed DS.
3. Despite them stating that they were statically irrelevant, they still nerfed keys.
4. One of the few times they went back on a change was when they took away Oni's ability to flick. The backlash was severe enough they reverted the change but with a 90 degree cap (unless you have a cracked dpi or something).
5. Object of Obsession nerf
6. Nerf to toolboxes
7. Undying rework
8. Reworking Pig's add-ons despite their own statistics she's performing very well/too well.
Make no mistake, they anger me beyond belief at times. But they do listen... sometimes.
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That would be... horrible. Entire point of Legion's power is to force survivors to heal, wasting their time since they'll get injured again anyway. Legion Pin only works if you build around it (Thana or Blood Echo).
Otherwise, no. This just makes him almost a complete downgrade from Plague in almost every way, which many could reasonably argue is *already* the case.
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Wraith counters W but is loopable.
Clown can get by if you can land your bottles. If nothing else, you can throw yellow ones to catch up.
Huntress is a weird case. She doesn't catch up but she has infinite range.
Maybe Twins since Victor moves at mk5, so he can get a Pounce on you.
Other than that, I've got nothing.
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This is a lot more complicated than you might think.
The intended way to play when the game was first released was that this game would be more of a hide-and-seek sort of deal. Looping was something that didn't happen immediately, but survs began to realize that was the better way to play as keeping the killer busy was more effective than just hiding. More than that, it was also a lot more engaging as both sides were interacting with one another.
Lately, things have been getting... messy. With looping in mind, killers have been made to combat them. Look at Demo and Neme who are masters of zoning and shredding through pallets. Spirit was meant to be mindgame central to deal with loops. OG Legion bypassed them completely (to horrendous results).
What this has caused is that survivors realized there's another strategy. Just hold w and drop. Don't both looping. There are enough safe pallets and the maps are so large that this is both safer and more effective than actually looping. The stigma comes from... well, you're holding a button. There's no skill. There's no interaction. You're just holding a button to get the guaranteed time and tossing a pallet the killer can't play around.
But to answer your question, the chase isn't the only thing you need to know. you need to read a situation and know what to do. Know when to go for an unhook or finish a gen. Learn to take the aggro off a teammate (EVEN if it means you'll go down) because they may be on death hook, and it's better to lose a hook state than an entire teammate. There are a lot of things to learn/do, but most people play this game for the chase which is why killers that tend to be very strong in the 1v1 chase (OG Slinger, Pyramid Head, Clown, etc) are more often than not hated by survivors. Conversely, loopable killers (Billy, Huntress, and Pig) are the more liked ones.
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1. This killer has the worst mobility in the game alongside Huntress. On top of being 110%, he needs to reload.
2. He also has Huntress' map dependency. Get a map with a lot of cover, and you're SoL.
3. Unlike Huntress, he needs a constant LoS because he only deals partial damage. From my estimation, he needs at least 1.94 seconds of sustained fire in order to deal a health state of damage in a 1v1 scenario. Compare that to Huntress who just needs 1 cheeky hit, or even Deathslinger who shares his short windup.
4. He's impossible to play on console. Huntress has a larger and more forgiving hitbox. Deathslinger literally has iron sights for you. Trickster has recoil, small hitboxes, and needs to land 6 knives.
5. His projectiles are deliberately inaccurate. That means you'll waste a lot of ammo, meaning you need to reload more often. This not only means you'll be slow to do anything, you lack Huntreess' snowball potential that makes her so strong. This leads to my next point.
6. He has no map pressure. Huntress has crossmaps and snowball potential. He has nothing. This isn't unique to him but it's a problem.
7. His lullaby is semi-directional unlike all other lullabies that are completely non directional.
8. Main Event is so situational that it's functionally useless. You need a survivor out in the open running like a headless chicken or going for an unhook since camping is literally the one thing he's great at thanks to his DPS being ample to go from 0.5 per second to 0.67 per second (for those that don't want to do the math, he can down you in exactly 3 seconds at his max throwrate).
I could go on. This killer has so many issues, it's not even funny. Considering he's 110% and his power is this underwhelming makes him, in my honest opinion, among the worst killers in the game. And considering many consider Legion, a killer whose power is to NOT HAVE A POWER, to be in that same group, that's pretty bad.
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@nikodemo said:
As a Cenobite main I hate that you're giving away our secrets. However, maybe if people actually learn counterplay we won't get nerfed again. XD
It was literally in the patch notes as being "fixed." I had to say something before solving Lament made you immune to all chains. I'm sure you can understand.
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I don't see how buffing the speed from 10m/s to 12m/s helps, especially when it accelerates quickly to 15m/s in less than a second.
Honestly, I'd rather just have it so the launch delay by respawning chains is decreased from 1.5 seconds to 1 second. That'd be fair enough, imho.
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@Brimp said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/297924/why-i-dislike-boons
I do say Exponential is the weakest of the 3 but that doesn't make it bad. Just the threat of exponential being up makes the killer either pick in a slug situation where there's 2 injured survivors so if you down and chase the first one picks themself up or you can go look for the boon (which got a decreased noise radius when they fully launched) giving the survivor distance and the rest working on gens to get even more progress.
Now that doesn't really affect mobile killers that much if they see the boon in their los so they down, snuff, snowball but I do think that it can definitely impact Oni slightly cause of the threat of it possibly being Exponential. Overall Exponential ######### over twins because you can be at 1 end of the map, m1 a survivor, send victor after them and they can just hold W to the boon and by the time your 8 second fatigue is over and you slowly walk to them, they already picked themselves up on victor and crushed him before you could switch back in time.
Oh, no. Exponential has insane potential and has saved my life. It's the weakest of the 3, but by no means bad. I just think Unbreakable, which isn't limited by being a boon, is better.
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Same with Legion applying Deep Wound to an already injured survivor
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@ProfSinful said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2674429#Comment_2674429
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZ9S50jgSyY&ab_channel=Kav
it doesn't take third party, it's all flicks
While I'll admit that's a new one, that utilizes the Hug Tech to pull off. You can see at the 2 sec mark he still does a sharp 180 despite not bumping into anything.
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@ProfSinful said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2672164#Comment_2672164
It's a matter of DPI and timing your flick at the beginning of a hug tech, I don't know the exact way but I'm sure someone will drop a vid how to do it, though I've always known that as a moon rush, not a "lag flick". They're harder to do now as opposed to when J flicking was possible
Dpi and timing don't matter.
Blight's turning has a hard cap on how much you can turn per frame. Now, it's possible to get 180 flicks through legitimate means, but at the 2 second mark, you see him do a sudden sharp 180 degree turn without any pre-turning or anything, something you're not supposed to be able to do since the removal of J-flicks.
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@ProfSinful said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2659676#Comment_2659676
you actually don't need third party software to do this, there are blight players that do this without it
Care to explain how?
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Bird Lady strong. Like, really strong. As in, only hell, "how is this killer 115%" strong.
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1. The Obsession is immune, meaning you want to ignore them. So you'll chase a Obsession meaning the perk only affects half the team at best.
2. It buffs the Obsession, countering the time given to you. This buff happens at the start of the game, meaning the perk hinders you at the start.
3. You need multiple stacks for the slowdown to get decent, meaning you're already winning.
4. It's outclassed by other similar perks. Most notably Thanatophobia that affects everyone and is easier to gain stacks on.
5. The perk turns off if the Obsession dies.
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@Hunter_Main_322 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2660962#Comment_2660962
On the red ranks, you often come across such guys.
So Blight deserves a little cornering nerf
I am constantly annoyed by such players with macros.
That can unfold for him like a snake
Limiting it to 30 degrees will be balanced.
You don't understand. Blight's turning IS capped. The entire cheat centers aimed inducing lag to bypass that cap. Your solution would be pointless.
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@Starrseed said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2659212#Comment_2659212
Don't bother reporting him that wasn't an L-flick or anything I saw his game play he did nothing wrong except having a freaking good control over blight in that moment
I rewatched the clip a thousand times at half speed.
At around 2 seconds in, if you look closely, you see Blight's red light only for him to do an immediate 180 despite not even bumping or swinging. This falla under the umbrella term of an Lag Flick.
You're not supposed to do this normally, and can only be done by inducing lag with a 3rd party software. It's... literally cheating. You're using something *outside the game* to gain an advantage.
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That is an L-flick a.k.a Lag Flick. You can tell by the sharp 90 degree turn despite the Blight still moving forward without turning into a wall.
L-Flicks are the result of cheaters using a program to induce lag that allow them to bypass Blight's hard cap on turning.
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I think the reason Doc is so restricted is that he is the only killer in the entire game that can physically prevent survivors from doing anything. That is a pretty huge deal and a nightmare to balance.
I'm not arguing whether or not it's needed but I can understand the devs erring on the side of caution.
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@aknitus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/295591/should-iron-will-be-nerfed
The very fact that you even thought of bringing up a nerf for iron will makes me angry, like honestly speaking. IW is not OP and it is certainly not unbalanced. It is the one thing that helps us very minutely in the game of ever-increaisng campers and tunnelers.
No, tell me what do the killers want next?
a) Nerf BT so that survs only get 3-5 secs of protection?
b) Nerf spinechill for it to not give the 6% bonus to gen repair?
c) Nerf kindred for it to not show killer's aura?
d) Nerf we will make it and boons and reduce their healing speed by 50% each?
e) Nerf all sprint burst perks to having a cd of 200 secs?
f) Nerf ds even further, maybe even remove it?
g) Nerf keys, like just take them away and the hatches too
h) better yet, nerf surv speed to 3.9 and killer to 4.8
And even after all this, keep complaining that the devs keep this game surv sided and not killer sided. Like at what point do the killers stop crying and complaining? No seriously, I need to know this.
You killers can camp and tunnel and debate that it is a strategy that you use. Well then let us keep our strategy and perks as well. What's wrong with IW? It certainly does not "BREAK" the game like some would say. Unless those some are spirit mains, who desperatly need the old stridor countering IW...
Sheesh man, calm down. It's just a game.
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Regarding Sloppy, I asked McLean something similar to this before he left BHVR. This was after the Clown rework.
"Why did you make all Mangled add-ons infinite, similar to Sloppy Butcher?"
The thinking was like this. They compared Mangled to Broken, as they're the two status effects that most closely resemble one another. Mangled was about slowing healing, while Broken was about taking away your option to heal.
With this in mind, considering Mangled would only slow heals down, it having a timer was ultimately decided to be rather redundant.
And not downing someone for a minute isn't "free pressure." They're still injured. They can't go for a save on a hook, they can't afford to do any risky plays because they're 1 mistake away from going down. It's a hit you earned and you're capitalizing on by having a perk that's encouraging them to stay in a vulnerable state.
Free pressure is when Nemesis' zombies come bother you on a gen because you just got unlucky.
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I mean, few killers on dbd *are* evil. A lot did horrible things, but even then, they're rarely "evil."
Look at Blight. The guy has a massive body count, yet isn't truly evil because he expresses genuine regret and the deaths were unintentional.
Look at Oni. From his point of view, most of what he did was the morally correct path. Even his massacre could be defended as him simply defending his family's honor, and he DID breakdown when he learned he had killed his father.
The only truly "evil" killers in this game I would say are... Danny, Doc, Clown, and Trickster (discounting licensed killers). They know what they're doing is wrong, and they do not care.
That's only 4 out of... what? 25? 26?
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I... don't know how to feel.
It's basically a permanent but weaker Ruin. That kills any synergy with Pop and Eruption, which is unfortunate.
80% normal regression means -0.2 c/s or 5 seconds to undo 1 sec of repairs.
It's a pretty underwhelming perk, tbh. If it were 100% it'd still just be decent, but it being 80% just kills it.
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I know this is bait but technically, they don't.
Pop and Ruin are mutually exclusive. The only thing you can do is have an plan A and B. It'd be pretty much impossible to stop these from "stacking"
Surge/Jolt and Eruption are the only ones that kinda stack. The former hits through things like Ruin, while the latter pairs with Pop. Still, these perks are considered off meta and their numbers aren't anything amazing.
Tinkerer isn't slowdown, it's technically an info perk. Likewise, Undying technically isn't slowdown. It's just often paired with Ruin which is regression.
Thana and Dying Light (and Gift of Pain ig) are the only direct gen slowdown perks. Sloppy Butcher is there for healing slowdown. The former are niche or terrible perks. The latter is only decent on M1 killers.
So technically no, slowdown doesn't "stack"
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Brutal currently turns a 2.6 break into 2.16. I'd make that 2 secs which would mean 20% --> 30%. That'd be fair for a perk slot, I'd feel.
No One Left Behind needs to be changed to "when the gates are powered." It only working when they're OPEN is absurd.
Buckle Up needs... anything. Literally anything. This perk is awful in every way. It needs something.
Beast of Prey - ditto.
Iron Will needs to be nerfed to 75%. Idc. The perk literally trumps every option a killer has to make grunts louder (Freddy's add-ons, Stridor, Nurse's Spoon). Nothing should be THAT strong without a downside. 75% keeps it as strong but not uncountable. (With it being multiplicative, you'd be at 37.5% volume with Stridor; still weaker than it pre-nerf so don't go crying Stridor Spirit)
Conversely, No Mither can have a grunt reduction of 100%. That's already survivor hard mode. It warrants that benefit.
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Ghosty and Legion are both on the list for changes, so yeah, probably.
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Medium vaults are only 0.9 secs compared to a fast vaults 0.5
They're fast enough already. Just learn to get your fast vaults down
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Nurse is an artifact of Old DBD. She was essentially the killer solution to some of the most absurd set ups, true infinites, old DS, etc. None of that mattered because they had Nurse.
As the game changed, Nurse remained. Like it or not, her age has more or less led to her gaining a general acceptance status among the community despite her power completely disregarding most of the base game mechanics. The devs are essentially stuck; they can't change Nurse because the community outcry will be severe (just look at her last nerf), so the only thing they can do is make her absolutely brutal to play/learn.
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Oppression... yeah, the cooldown is dumb. What are you going to do? Spam kicks on a regressing generator? It's default regression; the effect isn't that strong. Just remove the cooldown and have the number of gens hit scale with tiers.
Just make Surge's cooldown 20 seconds. Enough to scale with tiers but not enough to be as irritating as it can be currently.
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Well, this is very informative. I definitely understand what the bug is and why it's so impactful.
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I like playing Spirit but I stopped because of all the ridicule and hate mail I was getting. I want to play her more but... ugh, bad memories.
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@[Deleted User] said:
I like the majority of these changes, like, a lot. Not a particular fan of the wall-bashing idea, nor making missed attacks less punishing, but overall this would be basically what I want to see changed for the killer.
I think the idea many people have with Legion getting less punished for misses is a matter of risk and reward.
Billy misses and gets a 3 sec cooldown. Same with Bubba whose power is both lethal and 1.5 secs - 3.5 cooldown.
Combine this with the fact that the above examples are Lethal and incur less recovery. (12 seconds on Bubba if you need all 3 charges WITHOUT add-ons, and 15 secs if you completely overheat your saw as Billy).
Compare this to Legion. Sure, there's less counterplay but it can't kill you (add-ons aside). There's no real immediate danger from it. Despite this, the power incurs a brutal 4 sec fatigue and 20 sec recovery in its current state. He's punished so much more despite his reward being so much less.
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Trapper: Lengthened Jaws. Stepping on a trap should always have a consequence. Already being injured nullifies that if Trapper is otherwise occupied.
Slinger: Ammo belt for reasons you described.
Legion: I'm going to cheat and just say Double Fatigue cuz ho-ly hell 4 seconds is too long.
Pig: Combat Straps. Anyone who's used her ambush knows why.
Clown: At least the sticky soda. Just something to compensate for having to juggle 2 bottles.
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I'd lower his TR from 32 to 28m. Low enough to give him some help for being 4.4, but big enough you can't cheese with Monitor.
Beyond that, I'd just change some of his add-ons.
Movement speed add-ons should have their values changed. I think 5% and 2.5% (from 2.5% and 1%) would be fine.
Reel Speed add-ons are useless, and their effects can be replicated by backwalking. What I would do is buff their effects, but remove the added acceleration from backwalking (so the reel takes longer if you backwalk in the open, but could still do it to get some cheeky hits).
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@YOURFRIEND said:
So you hit someone with frenzy, wait for your power to come back and hit them again? Can you not vacuum them into a pallet? Don't you have dead hard?
Seems like a dumb gimmick and very minor nuisance.
Any Legion worth their salt knows not to blindly run into a pallet. They will wait until it's dropped or you're away.
And Dead Hard... i mean, really? That's the solution? A perk? One that can be baited out and it's ability to give distance rendered meaningless in this scenario?
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@R2k said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2578886#Comment_2578886
If I pick any other killer and tunnel u whole game will u call it no counter?
Depends. Can I throw a pallet and not die? (Unless you're Nurse)
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@Rey_512 said:
50 seconds minimum to down a survivor? Legion still loses.
It's not a matter of viability. It's a matter of being completely unfair with 0 counter.
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@AhoyWolf said:
I wouldn't call it old Legion exactly, since it still takes a lot of time to recharge your power, with old Legion it took just a few seconds.
But it's much more viable than before, I'll always play this build when I want to turn of my brain and just get some bloodpoints, and who knows, maybe I get a kill or two now!
EDIT: Just to clarify, these add-ons shouldn't exist, but for the time being, lets just have some fun.
Fair assessment. Although Old Legion had a pathetic duration, especially with a partial charge, so he'd need to catch up as 4.4 killer while his gauge filled. Hard to quantify the down time.
@R2k said:
I think survivors who complain about Legion shouldn't exist. Watch any Legion, it takes him roughly 1.5m to stab someone to death and it's more than enough to repair 3 gens by that time.
So Legion trades 1 hook for 3 gens and u call it broken? Without any jokes? U should be happy when u go against Legion with Franks Mix tape.
Legion is a noob stomper and has nothing to go against decent survivors.
Yes, I do call this broken. I'm not a survivor player. You can look at my history and see me defending SPIRIT of all things. THIS is an abomination that shouldn't exist. It's not a matter of "this is an instant win." It's the fact this is completely unfair with 0 counter.
I'm not calling this viable. I'm calling it BS.
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Doesn't matter. I'd use one charge to get a double hit on unhook, take advantage of the reduced cooldown from a chainsaw to down the unhooked through BT, and maybe down whoever tries to heal the unhooker with a new chainsaw dash.
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Edit: I'm a tart and missed the past where you increased Legion's speed. Ignore the below.
Assuming you don't change Frenzy's base speed...
Frenzy currently has an effective range if 12m. Meaning, if a survivor holds W, you'll still get them if they were within a 12m range.
5.3 Legion would have an effective range of 13m
5.4 would be 14m
5.5 would be 15m
Let's compare this to duration.
11 secs of 5.2 is 13.2
11.5 is 13.8
12.5 (sketchbook) is 15
14 (Double) is 16.8
While the two best of each give you a nice range of 17.5m, I think this points to a problem of Legion's basekit. His base effective range is too small, essentially since he's meant to chain hits and has a massive 40m TR-based Detection tool.
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@ShinobuSK said:
Roll back Stridor nerf since spirit is getting changes and that perk was nerfed only because of her
Incorrect.
Spirit had nothing to do with the Stridor nerf. It was countering perks like Bite The Bullet that's supposed to mute you completely, and they decided to make volume levels multiplicative to remedy that.
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@H1GHLVND3R said:
How u imagine nerfing that perk? It can only be deleted from the game because the whole point of it is in muting grunts completely. If it will mute 99% its a fn garbage who will be used only by my garbage team, cuz u can still be heard. Its pretty balanced right now, cuz it doesnt help u win the games. If u want better gameplay ask devs to fix DESYNCS and their garbage net code, so we wont recieve hits 100m away from window
Switch the values it has with No Mither. Make the latter silence grunts completely, while IW makes grunts 25/50/75% quieter. That's how I would, personally.
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@TacitusKilgore said:
I cannot imagine an iron will nerf would be well received by the community. By the virtue of that, it will likely never happen. BHVR are not the type to take big risks like nerfing a very popular perk. Whether or not it should or should not be nerfed is wholly irrelevant when we consider BHVR's track record. Before we discuss or advocate for a nerf, we must first think as to if the developers would even bother nerfing the perk. Which in the case of iron will, is likely not the case.
I mean... they nerfed DS, arguably the most popular survivor perk in the game. At least back then.
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It's using an add-on to its fullest potential. If it's active, then they can see it. It's on them.
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Here's a better idea... remove the cooldown. Overcharge doesn't have one. It's not like you can repeatedly kick a gen without a survivor tapping it first. It doesn't apply immediate regression like surge/pop. Just make the tiers have it so it hits 1/2/3 other gens
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@Dino7281 said:
Yay, copy-paste time again, because my opinion didn't change.
Changes I would do:
QoL changes:
- The Legion may see the blood pools of injured Survivors during Feral Frenzy.
- Feral Frenzy begins to replenish at the start of the fatigue state.
- The depletion of Feral Frenzy pauses while performing the break, damage and search interactions.
Buffs:
- Feral Frenzy’s movement speed is increased to 6 m/s after applying Deep Wound.
- Feral Frenzy’s fatigue state is 3 seconds and a missed Feral Frenzy attack prompts a 4 second fatigue state.
Do this and I am happy Legion main.
Maybe some add-on rework would be nice too. His add-ons are not bad overall imo, but there are some that need to be changed:
Defaced Smiley Pin - doesn't support play-style
The Legion Pin - doesn't support play-style
Stab Wounds Study - useless
Frank's Mix Tape - useless
I agree with most of these.
Becoming 6m/s *after* stabbing someone seems needlessly complicated. I get it, a reward for getting a hit, but seems more like leaving an opportunity for something to break.
Defaced and Legion pin are fine. I use them with perks like Thana or Blood Echo where they shine pretty well
Everything else? Yeah, I'm with you.
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Haddonfield would like a word...
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Obsidian Goblet - Simple change. The effect now lingers for 15 seconds and refreshes whenever you stand within the Rite's of Judgement.
Crimson Ceremony book - Added effect: Survivors hit by the Punishment of the Damned now suffer from the Mangled status effect.
Seal of Metatron - Survivors hit by Punishment of the Damned are now inflicted with Torment. Slightly Increases cooldown (2.25 --> 2.75)
Lost Memories - Survivors suffering from Torment now suffer from Oblivious
Rust Colored Egg - A survivor rescuing another from a Cage of Atonement now have their aura revealed for 12 seconds.