DodoSwarm
DodoSwarm
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no, he needs to be gutted and reworked. if you don't want to experience people holding W and Prerunning everything then don't play a killer with zero interaction. its just an autopath AI following them and yelling, the only counterplay is hold W. They need to make his power interactive and then you will see variation of counterplay.
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@HexSlugged said:
if you get tunneled out at 5 gens, you are either really bad at the game (and there is no rule or expectation beyond entitlement to demand you have a certain amount of guarenteed time in the match in an elimination game and just need to get better if you go down so fast and/or your team is all bad at the game and not touching gens whatsoever or being rpoductive. )there is no way you should be on death hook at 5 gens. thjere should (well should just referencing the reality) be 1 -2 gens popping before the first hook in most games if your teams actually playing the game right.
i know that being quickly eliminated in every other game isnt fun either but its an elimination game and i feel its a bit childish(in general not saying you are childish) to demand that in an elimination game your not allowed to be eliminated until X point and thing has happened.
matches go for 7-10 minutes. sorry but you need to be eliminated, not all teams decide not to touch a gen the entire time someone is able to be 2 or 3 hooked and killers dont have the luxury of knowing ahead of time if its a group of survs who dont know how to press m1 when they spawn next to a gen or survivors who do actually know how to play the game and can finish a gen before the killers even gotten their first chase.
at the end of the day 2 opposing teams are trying to beat the other and not liking that one team employs a strategy with which there is a plethora of tools to asisst with and ignore how your own team allowed you to be in that situation invalidates any real complaint about being tunneled at 5 gens.
Yeah because getting off hook and immediately chased by a nurse while already missing a health state when you don't have second chance perks is always a skill issue and not because its the strongest killer in the game bullying someone out so the rest of the game is free for them.
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as a solo queue player, end the game. its not even a matter of "Knowing How it Ends" its just so immediately boring that I don't want to be in the match anymore. oh man the killer is ignoring everyone but one person so we all just sit on gens and run the clock down (the 5gen tunnel happens mostly because people would rather altruism bomb than just idle on gens and go next).
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For me its knight just because its literally just gameless, its an AI that follows you and makes annoying sounds that denies loops and pallet stuns, and really anything except exhaustion perks, even if knight is worse now than he was its just not a good experience to face him ever.
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I think its a poor design that they forced the game to be so linear, its an awesome concept but they refuse to make the killers truly unique likewise the gameplay loop has gotten stale and easier to lose at (for both sides) as the game goes on because so much newer stuff breaks what the game used to be.
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@coldflame said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4108436#Comment_4108436
plenty of other games address this behaviour with lengthy bans in response to report, no other game of this size has me experiencing this this frequently
yeah I understand what you are saying but its a problem of Behaviour being overly lazy in general. the game itself is in a horrible state right now and ultimately you can just cut off chat if its a problem. I would rather them fix issues that are actually affecting the gameplay than bother with chat, i don't care what people call me at all, I can just go next. ultimately the chat is useless as it is anyway, the only time in DBD you really don't need to communicate is after a match, they could just strip it to a system of a visible thumbs up, thumbs down system.
Edit: its not a good thing at all, but I definitely experience toxicity like that in other games, I play Dota a decent amount and the things that come through voice comms can be considerably worse, but maybe Behaviour could solve the problem for DBD the same way DOTA has, a communications score from 0 to 12,000 that goes up and down based on how you choose to act in games, the lower it is the more communication functions are locked out for you. -
@Oputeev_Stas said:
I don't think it'll happen that quickly, it's hard to rework her power into something fun for both sides without completely overhauling her from scratch.
this is the root of the issue. once a killer comes out with a kit that is totally unfun for people to deal with even if they aren't good or if they are adjusted later, it kills them especially in the eyes of consistent players. Knight is still hated, Skull merchant is hated, Kaneki is hated and it would take a total rebuilding for a chance of them not being hated. BUT that comes from the initial design being lazy and unintuitive. I wish behaviour would just stop adding killers left and right and address that the framework of the game is collapsing and people are getting tired of lazily designed killers and perks being released at regular intervals. I wish killers were actually unique and not pushed down a narrow avenue. theres no reason at all the objective even needs to be the same against all killers, its an Asymmetrical game, they could provide a much higher level of differentiation between maps and killers powers and they don't.
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Way too many people see this game as entirely competitive, its too out of wack to be an actual competitive experience… maybe people like playing pyramid head in 2v8 because they like playing Pyramid head…
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@drag27 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4108080#Comment_4108080
how is he boring?
DBD is starting to have the same problem with games that introduce too many characters in too quick of a succession where older characters are typically more straight forward and simple such as Huntress throws a hatchet or The Trapper places Traps, even the higher tier old killers like Nurse and Blight are pretty straight forward even though there's a ton of things that can be done with them if you have experience on them but The Ghoul is a prime example of a character being added with way too much going on that's way too easy to accomplish. people hate the knight for the same reason imo. The Ghoul gets a basically free deep wound with very little penalty for distance as he can just cross the map on a pretty low cooldown and thats already annoying, it also doesn't take much practice to jump in front of someone and block them from vaulting or a pallet. likewise even though the Knight isn't actually that high on the killer tierlist he's annoying because he has a very high reward, very low risk and low effort style that is annoying to face. Kaneki is worse because he has a very high playrate as well.
So he is boring because he has too much going on that is hard on your average survivor to deal with and remember while also being extremely easy to play as a killer. -
For Me its because the game is extremely stale and nobody can seem to agree on how to move it forward at all. I think at the end of the day the killers individually do not add very much and the survivors are all reskins of a null person that can equip 4 perks (many of which are basically locked behind DLC unless you play an obscene amount of the game). the game is in limbo between it being so samey it has to be playable entirely based on its competitive nature but also being so disjointed, unbalanced, buggy, and just generally too unplayable in a competitive sense so it feels like the playerbase is entirely at odds on whether the game is competitive or not. for me personally, I would prefer more variety and a deeper focus on it being a horror game rather than a streamlined PvP experience but the game committing to neither is making it a bad experience
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Honestly I think this topic needs to be seen by more people. I have no idea where the idea of "I need a 4k" or "We need a 4 out" to win came from. the game has no official rankings and is too bizarre and unbalanced to be reasonably competitive, it feels like that is what leads to a ton of the toxicity in the game too.
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@Domicci said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4106391#Comment_4106391
Slugging and tunneling are viable strategies because the decks have made the alternative for killer objectively worse to do. Why would I hook survivors when they get a ton of perks turned on and why would I spread hooks when all it does it make my pressure weaker. The devs encourage slugging and tunneling with how the design perks and maps. Its the devs fault for slugging and tunneling not the killer just like its the devs fault that gens and healing can be done so fast. On "impacts gameplay" everything impacts game play is pallet stunning toxic is using your power toxic is hooking toxic all things that take or change survivor or killer "agency". And not agency no its a game your agency was signing up for the match you joined the match knowing all the posible out comes you were not forced to play the game so no slugging you doednt take away your agency. You had the agency to bring anti slugging perks but didn't because you didnt think it was a big enough problem to bring just like your not losing agency on killer when gens get done fast but you brought no gen slow down.
You're just echoing what I said: The Devs are at fault, and people need to stop endorsing that fault by calling extremely bad mechanics "parts of the game". DBD Feels worse to play every year because the same lasting problems persist, there's tons of new content and there definitely have been QOL stuff that I appreciate but they have handled the most consistently problematic aspects of the game by just pretending they should be exactly what they are and nobody at all likes it. it's devolved into Survivors complaining and not wanting to play the game at all as soon as someone is tunneled and killers that go out of their way to slug and tunnel more because they know it makes survivors angry.
the "Solution" to this has been to solve the problem by doing anything except actually addressing the problem. IMO Dbd has absolutely not been constructed in a way that warrants high level competitive play, its just impossible, there's no Ranked system besides the monthly bloodpoint rankings which you can get to Iri 1 extremely easily, MMR is bizarre and unreliable, Solo Queue give no way for survivors to even communicate, the same core perks are constantly relevant while a vast amount of perks for both killer and survivor are either niche or totally useless most games, and the main objective hasn't changed or improved at all for either side. there's absolutely no reason to try and force every game to be a 4k either under that system, which presents its own problem that plays into the never ending outcry against tunneling and slugging: People playing for fun are forced into lobbies with people who believe the game is supposed to be entirely competitive and the devs have not split the two up or genuinely clarified what even is considered a win.
its Lazy and its a horribly stagnant state of the game. Why are killers all relatively the same? why can't objectives shift per killer to add some level of replay ability to the game? why aren't there even preassigned chat options after all of these years for survivors? why are we surprised DCs happen so often? you know what else is crazy… in nearly every other team based PvP event there is no penalty for people to DC after someone else DC's, in Dead by Daylight there is. so you have people being immediately angry that they are the target of being tunneled, they DC, the entire game is ruined but people have to play it anyway just to load into the next game where its most likely either the same thing or a teammate/teammates are doing useless nonsense around the map instead of working to win in any capacity
more people need to speak up about the state of the game needing to change, rather than it being a war over obviously bad game functions are bad. -
@HexSlugged said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4107377#Comment_4107377
in a competitive game no one likes to lose or to struggle and feel you ar at a disadvantage or that other people are playing better than you.
this game has always been designed with these features. this not hidden nor suprising. if you do not like this aspect of gameplay, go play a game where thats not part of the gameplay loop.
its not fun for killers to get destroyed in a match and its not fun for survivors to die super fast.
its part of the game. doesnt matter if you like it. the only thing that matters is to attempt to try and keep one specific playstyle from dominating match types (tunneling does not dominate match types in the na servers anyways, i cant speak for any other region but i find it doubtful)
its like going into a match of fortnight and thinking your entitled to not get killed in the first 30 seconds of the match. thats not fun but thats part of the game design regardless of whether you like being murked the second your feet touch the ground.
its the same with dbd, slugging and tunneling are intentionally allowed as part of the design and games identity even if you dont personally enjoy it. but thats what dbd is. yopu want the game to be something its not so that you can feel less bad about being eliminated quickly in an elimination game.
I really cant think of any other elimination game where the games playerbase is so adamant on not being eliminated first or for some arbitrary amount of time before you opponent is allowed to eliminate you.
ill never respect that perspective because its irrational.
This is, again, you doing exactly what I already called you out for "If You Don't Like it, Play another Game" is the worst most abysmal justification for anything in any game regardless of PvP or not. It isn't a matter of me not liking it. NOBODY likes it, thats why these posts are always going around. and it isn't a "ah man nobody likes to lose" scenario at all. its actually that people like to play the game and therefore are upset when a persistent mechanic ruins the entire gameplay loop from the very outset of the game.
also, note that you call DBD a competitive game yet the balancing is horrible, there is no hardline ranked system, theres no valid communication of any kind for Solo Queue, there's nothing at all to signify that DBD should be fiercly competitive. People play MOBAs because they want to play a very competitive game, people play Team Shooters because they want to play a very Competitive game. A majority of people who start playing DBD are playing it because they want to play a game where they have to flee from a killer. Which is where we find our issue: Tunneling removes the entire game from someone. It isnt fun, it isnt scary, it isn't an experience people want more of, it just ruins the game because unlike other competitive games DBD puts a singular player at a high advantage over other individuals and one on one 90% of people are going to lose pretty quickly to any decent killer player, Which means it is totally within the power of that one person to stomp someone into the ground and that shouldn't be a viable strategy at all, it's certainly not one you see in any other game. "just get better" is also not helpful in any means at all considering people who get tunneled most often are the weakest link and cannot loop killers well, you know what absolutely stunts your ability to learn to play a unique game? Being run down and repeatedly thrown onto hook.
Tunneling is Toxic for the gameplay loop as a whole, its toxic for the sake of new players, its boring for the sake of people who have been playing the game a ton and now know that they either have to just sit on gens and never help their teammate and then just leave without really enjoying the gameplay loop or in the case of Solo Queue, the whole team divebombs and throws the game with altruism attempts because there's no communication.
"its an elimination game so my goal is to get you out as fast as possible" yeah okay lets endorse moving the game in the direction where we just prevent people from playing it then. its not a Battle Royale, and you are not playing on an even playing field with the one other person you chose to force out of the game. what you're trying to pass as a good game idea is literally just tell people to be okay with being immediately removed from a game they want to play and then telling them that if they don't want that to happen they should not play the game that they want to play. that's how backwards the logic is. -
@HexSlugged said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4107097#Comment_4107097
its only a negative situation in some extreme cases.
at the end of the day this is a game that doesnt last for 3 minutes. games are over usually in less than 10 minutes. whether its a 4k or a 4 out.
to be mad that you were eliminated in an elimination game where people HAVE to be eliminated and its nonsensical to say that for a solid chunk of that time the killer isnt allowed to eliminate a player is rather insane to me.
Now i understand its not fun to be eliminated fast or to be slugged (frankly the slugging thing beyond a slug for the 4k is stupid. you have even less agency on hook and you bleed out slower and can move out of the killers view.
this game was never designed to not have these as functions even if there have been other flavors of those functions. you cant take them out of the game, doing that breaks the game.
the game has no rules or requirements that say you should be guarenteed to last X amount of time in the match.
if you do not like being eliminated and you cant handle being eliminated quickly once every 5-dozen plus gam,es or so (because if your being tunneled every match when there are 4 people to be tunneled then you are not very good at staying up and that is something you should self reflect on in regards to why your being eliminated so fast. You also are not being hard tunneled every single match and if you think you are, then you do not understand what tunneling is and you are misattributing misplays or bad luck to an action that was not done as is done constantly by people.
you also have access to a bunch of perks that counter and mitigate what those tactics can do. if these behaviors are truly that horrible then use the plethora of tools the game gives you.
or dont play elimination games that only last 10 minutes or less where every second matters in a game with 2 different groups trying to win the game.
no, its almost always a negative situation. you and tons of other people are just purposefully refusing to acknowledge that something obviously detrimental to gameplay is exactly that. the point I was making is that those mechanics currently are viable and sometimes are needed for killers in the current state of the game. but they're absolutely loathed mechanics. when a game features mechanics that literally nobody likes to deal with, then the game needs to change, and it needs to change so that the game is still fair for killers.
it is not a matter of me being tunneled every other game, its that someone is being tunneled nearly every game. admittedly slugging is less of a problem at large and more of a situational problem, also something survivors can more easily combat. but Tunneling, especially in Solo Queue is almost always the collapse of a game. MMR is and has always been janky and expecting a team to know how to play against tunneling never works out, even when it does the games are boring. it has to change. -
Agree with this, i think it should mostly come from the killer side as well. I think the monotony of killers is a problem where they are too worried about balancing them down a middle line of chase potential / pressure / power and its a shame because its an Asymmetrical game and if the killers were more unique and put forward more to a match than do gens and get out I think it would be refreshing for everyone. I think theres so many killers and survivors in the game right now that they can easily work towards breaking up the samey feeling of the game instead of more skins and halfbaked killers/surv perks
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@HexSlugged said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4107084#Comment_4107084
having you incapacitated on the ground and not incapcitated on a hook (both are game states where you arent engaging with the game) is objectively not "griefing" nor is proxy camping nor is tunneling.
the irony of complaing about how a group of people should not be toxic while having one of the most toxic posts you can see on these forums.
as far as im concerned, tbag me all you want, im still going to down and eliminate you and you can complain about in in end game chat
edit: just realised in your rant you admitted to reporting people for non reportable behaviors which behavior has explicitly told you not report people for. so you can report all you want but it aint doing anything buddy
he's right though, a little on the extreme side but he's right. Tunneling and Slugging are negative mechanics for the game. people aren't going to ever appreciate them because they are very often the immediate catalyst to games that are very boring and very one sided. people being tired of this will lead to more toxicity. the mechanics have to go away. and, as an extension of that, its important to say that its really not a surprise, nor is it seriously killers fault for utilizing mechanics encouraged by the developers, its the developers fault for vaulting the game into a never ending balance trap of trying to rework perks around already bad functions of the game instead of just changing the game to remove the functions and make both sides happy. people are much more likely to be positive about the game when they feel they have lost due to an actual skilled play or a competitive match rather than if its just an endless cycle of someone being tunneled at 5 immediately making for slow and boring games that usually end the same way, especially in solo queue.
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are we serious rn.. if a survivor crouches I need them to be sentenced to divine justice lol… just kill them.
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@Elan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4106732#Comment_4106732
It's fine. :) I don't expect positive feedback from community mainly consisted of survivors mains.
its not even about killer mains VS Survivor mains, I play a good bit of both. its about how insane all of these changes are… a 10% bonus across the board for almost all survivor caused interactions is absolutely nuts. Pain Res, Lethal, BBQ, and Deadlock in basekit? you lost your mind
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@HoodedWildKard said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4106631#Comment_4106631
Yeah thing is devs could go hard aginst tunneling and make it completely unfeasible then they could nerf gen speeds or tweak chase to make things easier for killer and make the game more chase based and not this current tunnel or lose meta that makes the game so unfun at the moment.
exactly. so many people just rooting for the downfall of the game by saying extremely bad and toxic mechanics are just a skill issue and acting like they shouldn't change. both killers and survivors would have more fun if this happened.
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no matter how many of these I read through it always impresses me how unwilling people are to admit things are unhealthy for this game… its just a minor tweak being suggested and rather than consider it people are just acting like you're an idiot for not wanting a killers power to make the endgame feel like a drag…
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April Fools is in April buddy
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Especially for leveling survivors. I am P100 on Nicholas Cage and just keep playing him because I have a large amount of everything on him, it makes me not want to start playing other survivor characters because I won't have very many of the less common items
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@SpyUA said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4106638#Comment_4106638
That crows are removed when you go into a locker is absolute bs, she is only B tier (so not very strong as you say she is), this feature makes her less appealing for players to learn how to play her (very low pick rate) and she has a high skill floor to not have trouble downing the survivors (even that doesn't really help in high MMR) so she does need a buff, many killers have better chase power than her (take less time to down the survivor and much easier to use) and some of them also have mobility unlike her so her getting a small buff shouldn't be an issue, she is not going to go up to A tier after this.
why are we trying to balance killers around "Above Average Tier" BTW Artist has always sat around A to A- on most tierlists. regardless of that if you admit she is Above average, (B, A, S Tier) There's no reason at all to buff her.
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@Memesis said:
Lights out is not meant to be taken seriously/ competitively. It's just a fun deviation from the regular queue. It's ok to have variety
its just get tunneled and camped simulator actually, its just a concentration of things that already suck about the game with the added bonus of no information…
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Because of the way BHVR has encouraged playstyles for killers that are very derogatory to the gameplay loop in general you're going to get flamed pretty often no matter what. by nature PvP games are already toxic and DBD is among the worst, if you're seriously affected by peoples opinions of you in post game chat just turn it off or take it with a grain of salt…
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@BloodBehemoth said:
Tunneling at 5 gens is not "toxic". Just because you can't loop for ish doesn't mean it's morally wrong. If you wanna argue slapping on hook, W/Sing, teabagging at exit gates/windows/pallets, flashlight clicking and gesturing from safety, sure why not, I won't defend those because they have no direct effect on gameplay.
Nothing wrong with slugging, camping, genrushing or body blocking either. These actions impact gameplay.
"impacting gameplay" has nothing to do with whether or not something is toxic. actions (whether done by survivors or killers, or heck literally anyone in any video game) that remove a player or players ability to experience the game they are trying to play are Toxic in a literal sense of the word. they are bad for the game in question. this is why Slugging and Especially Tunnelling will always be bad for DBD, right now they are a viable strategy but they should never be. which is why it is at the fault of the Devs that it is. I have no idea why it would be an argument or why some people can't see that something which is very obviously detrimental to the gameplay experience is exactly that. someone said it earlier, Spawntrapping/Camping in FPS games was a super massive problem for years and it was possible to do that within the confines of the game, and it was also extremely toxic and ruined everyones experience and so it was made impossible in many newer FPS games. DBD needs the same type of adjustments.
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@Domicci said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4105720#Comment_4105720
So is it toxic to make the killers match shorter then their queue time? Because 4 people with gen build can do gens un under 4 minutes making it so the killer basicly didnt get to play the same way the survivor didnt get to play. And you cant remove tunneling with out ru8ning the game for killer sense like we have seen twice now if you punish killer for tunneling swfs will just weaponize it. Immagin if survivors got punished for gens popping to fast. That would feel horrible and killer would weaponize it the same way survivors still weaponize free bt.
This never happens by the way, maybe one in every hundred games if we're being extremely generous. Tunnelling happens every other game. and regardless, that isn't even the same level of issue, thats a patch/hotfix level issue where things are tweaked to make it not possible to do that. Tunnelling is an actual problem ingrained in the game and cant be fixed by just throwing another perk/rebalance at it.
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@GentlemanFridge said:
Idk, in my experience, genrushing is rarely something that is achieved intentionally. There are genrushing builds, which are their own topic regarding “toxicity”, but genrushing on its own is too vague a concept to be (or not be) described as toxic.
Tunnelling is a choice the killer makes, however. And regardless of the killer’s intentions with it, another player’s gonna be affected by that choice. Said effect is typically a boring match for at least 1 out of 5 players, likely more than that if the killer is succesful. That match may as well be called a waste of time for those players. That’s not a good thing, no matter how you slice it.
Whether it’s “toxic” hardly seems relevant. It just sucks to face. Simple as.
its this, I do not understand why so many players are absolutely unwilling to see how removing a persons ability to play the match that they queued up for is a toxic mechanic from the outset. not even referring to the players doing it, its available to them so they will do it, but that doesnt make the mechanic itself any less bad. its awful and it needs to be entirely phased out as viable and until then people will continue to do it at different levels.
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first the survivor issue:
Survivors completing their objective quickly isnt toxic, "Genrushing" is just their only way to play the game, if anything I would consider prerunning and avoiding contact with the killer more toxic than genrushing. (not to mention bully squads, although they usually suck and end up losing)
second the killer issue:
If we're unbiased, Slugging is way more practical than picking up and hooking in some situations, some killers kind of need to do it for pressure as much as its annoying to deal with, meanwhile Tunnelling is blatantly toxic when its done from the start of the match, and the reason for that is that endorsing a game mechanic that effectively prevents somebody from playing the game is extremely toxic. I understand that sometimes there is a direct reason to tunnel and as some other people have said when you are down to three gens and the game is going bad for you as a killer tunneling becomes a valid and important part of the game. this again falls on the shoulders of the Devs to make strategies which harm the gameplay experience unviable. they do not do this, instead they release endless bandaid perks to make a problem seem "not as bad" when the problem lies with core gameplay.
It seems like these issues are always going around and both sides of the argument have valid points, if you are a killer it is efficient for you to tunnel and slug sometimes and it isn't your fault that the game has been designed this way. If you are a survivor it is efficient to rush gens because there is no other way out of the game. what needs to happen, though its extremely unlikely, is Behavior needs to fundamentally alter the game to where ruining it for someone from the beginning is bad for the one doing it, and avoiding confrontation while gaining objective progress or excessive altruism builds are unviable and harmful to survivors. the problem is they dont consider it, because those changes are hard for them to implement, they would rather just release another perk that solves a niche problem that people very rarely encounter while terribly balancing the frontrunner perks. -
This is the most killer sided event in the game. survivors are entirely perkless save for a lantern which provides you with windows and some limited aura reading AND THEY DROP THEM when hit by the killer. meanwhile killers have no terror radius and survivors have no recourse to a survivor being tunneled out of the game or losing VIA slugging as there are no perks for altruism or anti tunneling options. if you removed every perk from the game you would have the fact that Killers are just better than survivors, that is how the game works to begin with. all Lights out does is make the map dark and remove perks. there are killers that can and do run over survivors in regular gameplay if survivors cannot access common perks, and killers who gain extreme advantages when they are able to tunnel and slug / force survivor interaction without any counterplay. every killer is faster than survivors, every killer benefits from having no terror radius. if you cannot catch survivors then its your fault. of course there are killers that really do not transfer well to lights out because of the nature of the game, mainly projectile killers, just don't play them unless you want a challenge on purpose. I don't even know what you mean by "yet another" when the event immediately before this was also killer sided.
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Yeah I came here to say this, Chaos Shuffle is already killer sided badly and most killer players just continue to abuse tunneling and slugging more since survs cannot choose perks to defend against it, but Lights Out is HORRIBLE, unplayable even in the new form, I'll skip it.
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@cogsturning said:
Things that are in the game by design shouldn't be bannable. They need to be fixed in the game. And this is something that should be fixed.
True, that is an alternative but there are valid reasons to slug like when people are trying actively to prevent you from picking up or hooking a survivor or certain situations in the game that not slugging a survivor or two will lose you the game, im talking mostly about bleeding out, where multiple times per game survivors find themselves on the ground bleeding to death when the killer could easily have hooked them
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@Anti051 said:
If you play a killer character that has weak chase potential, you're not helping your pressure by hooking.
then the Killer needs to be tweaked so they don't have to do this.
also, this is definitely not true in most cases of people being bled out, people are just doing it because they can a lot of the time -
@ThePromethean said:
The problem is when we ban people for not hooking we have to then look into banning people that don't unhook. Being slugged is no different to being on hook, you can't get yourself back into the game without the aid of someone else, you are stuck in that situation until you die or someone helps.
If you are on hook and 3 random people each think someone else will go for the unhook and no one does then should survivors be banned for leaving you in a position where you cant do anything until you die?
It sounds like you have an issue with the core concept of a survivor being prevented from playing the match which both slugging and hooks both do.
Also we have tried the whole "pick themselves up" many times and survivors abused it by making it impossible to hook them.
I recently had a match where 3 people had full anti hook builds, I didn't want to slug but they forced my hand..... Slugged the lot of them
The Real problem is that DBD is descending further into having tons of now overlapping issues that the devs don't do much in the way of working to fix, even the recent gameplay survey regarding characters was mostly about whether people do or dont want to play a character because of the way they look… I understand what you are saying but at the same time something HAS to change, the game isnt going to get less toxic if these problems with the core gameplay don't change.
There should definitely be competitive VS a more casual arcade mode always available in DBD because as we all know SWFs can absolutely abuse things that are totally fine in Solo Queue. a more arcade like Solo/Duo queue exclusive mode with the continued non-impactful monthly rankings and less balance would be fun complimented by a more competitively minded balance focused mode that does allow 4man groups and a real ranking and more robust MMR system and I think would resolve a lot of issues. but its undeniable that gameplay mechanics which create a very real and constant sense of "This Sucks" aren't good for any game, much less so when the person experiencing them has no way out.
Hooks and Slugging are definitely much different. for starters hooks have anticamp now and many perks to assist a survivor on the hook and to give information to the team when you are on hook. Killers can actually stand directly on top of you and not experience any form of negative interaction for doing that, and your death timer slowly counts down with no way for your team to help effectively, remember I am talking about Solo Queue, its nearly incomparible to SWF gameplay and the lack of information survivors get in Solo Queue is staggering and leads to people diving hooks and not doing objectives when people are being slugged which ruins an entire game. -
@Rapid99 said:
Game is actually just insufferable to play lmao. Just pallet, into pallet, into pallet, into window, into shack, into T and L, into pallet, into shack. Leave chase for the 50th time because gens are popping left right and center since every chase is guaranteed to lead into 53 pallets, most of them you can't even attempt a mind game because they can just straight up see you. I mean seriously you don't even need to work to have a long chase anymore.
The game practically plays for you with the amount of pallets and it's just time waste central.
The maps have always been bad but this is a new level of just woeful. Unless I'm playing against the equivalent of a bot who goes down in 20 seconds because they have zero idea how to do a chase, it's just cooked.
The problem with this part of the game is that they are introducing too many mechanics that encourage survivors to just pre drop and hold W rather than playing pallets. most pallets are just filler and most survivors get hit around them, but the most annoying thing for me playing killer is that people just pre run and pre drop everything because the game encourages them to do that. especially with killer reworks like Myers and general new killers like the ghoul, why would I try to bother playing around a pallet when so many killers are so oppressive on one pallet. The Artist encourages you to hold W, the Knight encourages you to hold W, the Nurse encourages you to hold W, and the price of this is that M1 killers or killers with fun mind game oriented powers suffer greatly and become unfun to play when going against competent survivors and force killer players to tunnel and proxy because there's no guarantee they are even going to get another good chase
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@Rokku_Rorru said:
Honestly I'd love killer bans simply because I am really tired of Ghould/Blight games but I know it's not really ideal, plus the idea of denying people their fav killer sucks.
That said they should BALANCE them properly.The game no longer has so few killers that it is unacceptable to have killer bans, likewise there are so many perks that perk bans within reason make sense as well. it wouldn't meddle with the actual matchmaking process to add even soft bans to the game before queuing similar to how DOTA does it now where you can select five heroes you do not want to see and there is a CHANCE the game will not allow them into the game but you can still encounter them. as for denying people their favorite killers, it wouldn't… it would just not match people who have that killer banned (or in the case of soft bans probably not match) into a game with that killer. and it would actually be good data for Behavior, whichever killers are getting ban selected overwhelmingly probably have an issue that needs to be resolved, same with the perks.
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I agree, I do not play the trickster but playing against them now feels like playing against The Huntress with less skill factor (and on the contrary much more counterplay) rather than the Trickster…