thesuicidefox
thesuicidefox
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I don't like it because most killers are bad and will take the easy route whenever you give them the chance. I've seen too many No Mither's get tunneled to death because it just puts a target on your back. I'd rather just play without perks.
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@Boss said:
That last part is subjective, i like the looks of both cosmetics.No he is right, the survivor cosmetic is actual garbage. It's Kate's normal shirt with a different decal on the front. Probably took an artist all of 30 minutes to make.
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@Tsulan said:
This game is terrible on Xbox. If enough salty survivors report you, they can ban you from playing any multiplayer games.Never should have released it on Xbox.
Survivors are toxic on every platform.Just FYI they don't ban you from multiplayer for reports alone. Reports for anything other the profile or comms only affects your rep, which used to block you from playing games but AFAIK they removed that feature. It's also based on a ratio of players encountered online vs. number of reports, which is why it's easier to lose rep on a new account than an older one. I've had mine for 13 years, currently have maybe 30 reports against me for stuff like "cheating" but no impact to my rep because I've played with thousands of players over the years. In fact the only time my rep ever dipped was for about a month back when Xbox One first came out and they introduced the new rep system (which at the time was broken AF).
But you can't get banned from this game for reports. The worst that happens is you get a rep of "needs work" or "avoid me" (which as killer I do if I see that on your profile, but that's by choice). You could a year ago but not anymore.
If you want to stay out of "needs work" or "avoid me" play games like Fortnite, PUBG, Minecraft, etc., that have a lot of players in a game that won't report you. Once you build up that list of players encountered then it's a lot harder for salty players to bomb your rep.
It's also a bit entitled to say they should have never released the game on Xbox. From what I've seen, PC and PS players are just as salty, if not moreso, than Xbox players. Moreso only because you can be more toxic on those platforms and get away with it, where on Xbox actual toxic players get punished pretty quick. I mean I had a buddy that got a comm ban mid-game while we were in a party because he sent an angry message to a killer a few days earlier. If a message gets reported and it is indeed toxic, MS does something about it. It's actually one of the best things about Xbox, because to me it looks like no other company will punish toxic players.
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@Zarathos said:
Honestly the reason this happens is so survivors can't duplicate items. Like if a killer frankie's you and another survivor takes your item you could share items with other players. If an items is white warded you could make it so no survivors could pick it up and it would disappear on your death but item duplication has to be dealt with in someway.This is honestly the only legitimate reason for WW to not protect from Franklin's. What should happen is that if the item is picked up by another survivor, the WW effect is removed. Just give that player an icon when they walk over the item so they know you have a WW on it, and then they can choose to leave it for you or be a dick and take it anyway.
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Shadowborn is great for her, but keep in mind the fact that she's a bit like the Nurse in that you need to practice and learn how to aim with her, and Shadowborn can mess with that. If you start off using it then take it off later it will really screw with you. You are better off learning her without it, then putting it on later.
Whispers is good on her, but has the same effect. You should learn how to find and track survivors without it first, then equip it once you know how to do that. If you start off using it and later take it off you will have a hard time finding people.
BBQ and Nurse's Calling are probably the 2 best perks for her that won't screw with you if you take them off, as they can help you line up long range shots. Even though she has a lullaby, her actual terror radius is small (20m) meaning people will usually heal very close to you.
Ruin is Ruin. It's great for every killer. Same for Agitation, Brutal Strength, and Enduring.
Of the Huntress's own perks, Territorial Imperative is amazing on her. It's considered a low tier perk, but Huntress is a monster in the basement. Whenever I run this perk on her my basement becomes a death trap. And no one ever expects it either.
Bamboozle is pretty good on her as it can help you break some key loops like pig tree and the shack. She's slow and being able to break loops can make a huge difference. However it won't help you on some spots like Ironworks, Storehouse, Rancid Abattoir, or Lery's (the whole map).
Deerstalker is good for her because you might end up slugging people a lot especially if you hit long range shots often.
I heard the effects of Sloppy Butcher apply to her hatchets, though I haven't tried it myself. If that's true then this would be a great perk for her.
Also when it comes to her add-ons Bubushka + Braid is the best combo, followed by Iri Heads + Belt. However, like with Shadowborn and Whispers, using the fast wind-up add-ons when learning her will mess with you later. Learn to play her without anything that buffs wind-up/cooldown until you learn to throw hatchets. Once you do, you can equip them and see your gameplay improve significantly. I also recommend using Deerskin Gloves, as faster reloads can make a huge difference sometimes. It's one of her most underrated add-ons. And Begrimed Heads are really nice too since they slow down gen repair, allowing you options over using Ruin all the time.
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@CakeDuty said:
It happens if a survivor has been healed a bit and then found in a locker/grabbed from vaulting and then hooked. As he technically hasn't been downed, the game still saves the healing progress for once he gets unhooked.No idea if it's a glitch or intentional, most likely a glitch though.
Didn't even think of that. I was so confused. Seems like a glitch though just because if he was healthy and found in the locker he would have to be fully healed.
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@Tsulan said:
Maybe not used to play Huntress and got a daily.
Happens to me all the time.So you are saying they are using it to make up for a lack of skill.
That's a crutch.
@douggie123 said:
Stop whinging for Christ sake noed and ds etc they are all part of the game and if you lost to noed then that's your fault. I use noed tier 3 on my leatherface and in some matches especially when I have been pallet slammed, pallet looped etc it's been really helpful.So you use it to make up for the fact you failed or played poorly (or were outplayed by players better than you)?
That's a crutch.
@only1biggs said:
Even a broken clock is right twice a day.No it isn't LOL. Is this some BS Chinese proverb you are just parroting?
My power went out the other day and the clock on my microwave said 1:00 when it was actually like 7:00. 12 hours later, the clock will still be wrong. SMH
@Dr_doom_j2 said:
Here's a philosophical question for you; If NOED didn't exist, would survivors ever bother doing dull totems?Yes because it's still free points. I do dull totems even when I can be sure the killer doesn't have NOED. Do I do them all? No because it's a waste of time. Will I do the few I happen across? Most likely if I can spare the time.
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@Tsulan said:
I don´t agree. All the survivor has to do to use DS is getting downed. Aka failing.
All the killer has to do to use NOED is track the survivor down and hit him. If he hits more than one, the survivors are cocky or dumb.To get that ability to down them, the killer failed at stopping gens. Again any argument you make for DS I can make for NOED.
Also it's not that hard to find survivors if there are only 2 locations they can go to escape. Also again not hard to chase them when you get an additional speed boost on top of a OHK.
@Tsulan said:
NOED is a lategame tactic like Blood Warden and Remember Me. Those 3 together can be a bitter surprise for survivors. Killer wasted 3 perks for the whole duration of the match, to have a strong endgame. This is a gamble. Because if he plays against SWF, he has to make sure he kills no one before the gates are powered. Otherwise the team can work around it.NOED being a "late game tactic" doesn't absolve it of being a crutch because there is NOTHING you did to earn it. BW and RM require the killer to actually do something to get the effect, they don't just get it for free (and especially don't get it if they fail).
Putting on DS is a gamble if the killer has obsession perks to punish your team for you being an obsession. See how I can keep doing this?
That's besides the point that putting on a perk isn't a gamble in the first place. A gamble is to do something like slug a guy that was hard to catch in the first place because you want to get the last guy too. Or trying to go for a basement hook when it looks a tad far because doing that will give you a huge advantage. Using a perk that might not be used is not a gamble because if you never use it then it's moot. Plus the fact that you can easily play 1 perk short all game if your other 3 perks are solid (eg. BBQ + Ruin + Nurse's).
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I would just report and block them. Engaging with them in any way just opens the door for a comm ban. If they message you report the message along with their profile. Stay AFK until they leave, they did it to themselves.
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It's because the Entity is a chubby chaser.
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I honestly don't see the big deal. I've played about 30 games as survivor in the last 3 days and I'm already sitting on about 60/90 gens. Haven't done killer yet but I'm not worried I can punch out 50 hooks in a few days which I plan to do after the weekend.
Just keep playing, they pile up after a while.
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@Tsulan said:
NOED isn´t comparable to DS because it doesn´t qualify as crutch.
If a good killer has NOED, the survivors won´t even get to power all gens. If a bad killer has NOED, he gets 1 kill at most with it.If a good survivor has DS, he can initiate another long loop or even play cocky once the gates are open. If a bad survivor has DS, he wastes it on the first down and disconnects.
1) Good killers use NOED as a safety net "just in case" they fail. That is a crutch.
2) If a bad killer has NOED they will more often than not get more than 1 kill with it. They get something they didn't earn (even if it's just 1 kill). That is a crutch.
3) NOED rewards the killer for doing nothing. Literally nothing, you can just stand around and wait for it to proc if you want. That is a crutch.
4) NOED is a comeback mechanic, something purposely put in a game to offset skill (eg. Blue Shell). That is a crutch.Also in theory, I could argue that a good survivor may never use their DS just like a good killer may never use their NOED. Doesn't change the fact that it's there as a safety net. That's what a crutch does for the player, it makes up for some failure on their part. It also helps bad players to appear as average players as it makes up for a lack of skill.
Add everything together = DS and NOED are crutch perks.
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Yea I had a game earlier against a rank 16 Myers. I'm rank 1 surv, and the other survivors were like 12, 16 and 18. I was solo, made no sense. Also the Myers used a purple mist which made no sense to me until I saw his rank.
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@pauloandrade22 said:
Pro tip. When he has tombstone his palm is open. When he does not have it his fist is clenched-Did not know this. Just checked the Wiki though and it only has this listed for trivia for Judith's Tombstone. Is it the same for Tombstone Piece?
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@Cetren said:
And if the offering worked it'd defeat the purpose of the perk. One has to trump the other.No because the purpose of the perk is to prevent someone from using an item in your trial. If they got the item back after the trial was over it has no effect on you.
I agree 100%, a White Ward should prevent you from losing an item you brought into the trial, with the only exceptions being it was used up or you put it down yourself.
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@MrChills said:
He used to play sports. He learned how to endure.Or maybe he just imagines Meg running around like a giant grilled cheese samich. For a fat guy like him that's some strong motivation.
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He's built like a linebacker, and those guys aren't exactly slow. Being super tall he has a long stride. Also wouldn't be surprised if he was a meth-head too.
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@Eninya said:
@thesuicidefox said:
DL is a different kind of perk though. TP rewards the killer for injuring survivors, DL rewards the killer for killing the obsession. I personally enjoy using TP because it has a psychological effect on survivors to make them more altruistic, but when it comes to it's impact on the speed of the game it's very negligible otherwise. If it were something all survivors have to take seriously, instead of something only less skilled survivors take seriously, it would be a lot more viable.
The new Sloppy Butcher is a better Thanatophobia in nearly every way. It won't affect gen repairs, but it makes splitting your hits far, far more effective than Thanatophobia, as survivors will universally heal before attempting repairs or saves.
I'm not disagreeing with you about SB, but that doesn't mean that TP should stay the way it is.
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@The_Manlet said:
NOED isn't comparable to Decisive Strike. There is no real counter to Decisive Strike, while you can counter NOED by not being found by the killer at the end of the game, or breaking the totem, or breaking all the totems beforehand, or just opening a gate in 20 seconds and getting out.Stop saying this kind of bullshit. It's completely comparable, watch...
"You can counter DS by not picking up the obsession and just slugging them, saving them for the end of the game, making them waste it early in the game, using Enduring, using Remember Me/Dying Light to reward you for going after the obsession, using PWYF/STBFL to reward you for avoiding your obsession, using Unnerving/Doc to make the skill check harder."
There are plenty of ways to counter DS, that doesn't make it any less of a crutch perk. NOED having counters doesn't make it any less of a crutch perk either. And if you are going to come in here and say that these counters are unreasonable I will just counter by saying it's unreasonable to expect survivors to destroy all 5 totems before the last gen pops, or that it's unreasonable to get away from the killer when it procs as the killer moves faster and there are only 2 places you can go to. Anything you say about DS I can say about NOED. They are ultimately the same.
All you are doing by saying it's not comparable is dismissing the fact that it is there to help bad killers. Both perks are for bad players, and when a good player uses them it breaks the game.
I've made this exact point before in Gears of War 3 with the Retro Lancer. When you take a really good player and give them an crutch that is normally there to help bad players, the integrity of the game falls apart. I made a whole video about that weapon, which was seen by the developers and likely a big reason why the Retro in Gears 4 is a pickup weapon and far more balanced (to the point it's now one of my favorite weapons when before I considered it cancer).
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@Eninya said:
I see nothing wrong with Thanatophobia when Dying Light is a perk in the game. Nothing is shittier than loading in, being the Obsession (I don't use any Obsession perks), and then getting tunneled and camped/mori'd.I'd rather see Thanatophobia made baseline in its current form, or receive a slight buff. Also, the debuff should probably become permanent if the survivor dies.
DL is a different kind of perk though. TP rewards the killer for injuring survivors, DL rewards the killer for killing the obsession. I personally enjoy using TP because it has a psychological effect on survivors to make them more altruistic, but when it comes to it's impact on the speed of the game it's very negligible otherwise. If it were something all survivors have to take seriously, instead of something only less skilled survivors take seriously, it would be a lot more viable.
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Only if he farts when he uses DS.
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@Russ76 said:
I could be wrong, but I think they are trying to keep it from being way to strong. Pair Thanatophobia with Hex Ruin, and it is very strong, and then have a no mither in there and the survivors are seriously hurting. (BTW I am a survivor main and I HATE when I look up and see someone running no mither. I just want to slap them)But as a standalone perk it's not at all that great. Even when you pair it with Ruin it's not that great.
6% of a gen is a measly +4.8s with no other buffs/debuffs. For healing with SC it adds just +1.44s. That's nothing. If the effect doubled for each survivor you hit, and if you had 4 injured then you would get a -24% debuff, which comes out to +19.2s for a gen and +5.76s for heals. Considering that you need to injured 4 people to get that strong of a debuff it's actually not that great. Chances are you can only juggle 2 injured survivors at any given time, adding +9.6 gen and +2.88s heals on average. These figures are baseline too, meaning if they have a toolbox/medkit it will be faster.
What I'm saying is if it were a -6% debuff per survivor TP would be much better but definitely not too strong. Currently a -6% for the first and -3% for each thereafter is just not at all worth it in the long run.
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It's ugly. Fast and effective. But ugly AF.
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@TheLegendDyl4n1 said:
so if i dont want to go against a michael with tuft curl of hair and tombstone with play with your food so he goes faster than normal i should be able to know that and dodge the killer cause i dont feel like going against a toxic add-ons (survivor items) and the michael with bloody clothing that i dont see unless im in game. check my other reply for the fix to this and make it to wherre your locked in so people cant change characters in lobbysSorry, you don't have that luxury as a survivor. You are already at an advantage in numbers, you don't need to know the killer too. BTW killer's have no idea where perks your are using, which level of item you have (yellow flashlight? who cares... purple flashlight? let's use Lightborn), or which add-ons you are using. They just get to see your character and an item class, which is completely reasonable.
You obviously have never played in a game tournament. There's a thing called counter picking in some games, where a player is allowed to select things to counter their opponent (usually after a loss in best of X games). DBD doesn't have best of X and is asymmetrical, meaning killers should have some options when it comes to counter picks.
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@Nickenzie said:
Here's the thing, survivors are getting REWARDED for farming now since it has no real punishment. They just SB away or DH pass you, additionally the exhaustion reset wasn't necessary since you recover while on the hook. I think the new unhook animation was okay since it allowed a mind game but now with the other stuff, expect to see more cocky survivors. Sorry about the rant
No they don't get rewarded. How do you come to such a conclusion? The guy can still be downed within 10 seconds. The ONLY difference now is that the guy has a chance to act, that's it. You make it sound like it's 100% a free escape when that's just flat out not true. It's a fair chance to escape, where before there was no chance to escape.
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@pauloandrade22 said:
@thesuicidefox said:
@Visionmaker said:
There's no skill or strategy needed on behalf of the killer with the camera flips. And whether it screws you as a survivor is completely up to luck. This is the only part of her kit that is zero skill and unfair feeling.As someone that plays Hag I can agree to this. The camera jerk isn't necessary when she can place traps super fast. Maybe if one of her add-ons had that effect, but now that she's really good I don't think it should be in her base kit.
I have to hardcore disagree . its a thing that used with knowlegde it is really powerfull. Its super good and makes her the skillfullest killer out there.
But it also takes away control of your character, which is something the devs have said they don't want to do. It's janky from a survivors perspective and quite unnecessary when she can play traps as fast as she does. The value you get from the 'mindgames' of it is outweighed by the negative impacts on controls.
@Runiver said:
The camera flip is on PURPOSE and has very likely been tested in KYF, if you play against a proper Hag. It has NOTHING to do with LUCK.
Optimal trap placements have been researched and found.I'm willing to bet most Hags traps jerk your camera when the Hag didn't intend for that. Yea sure, sometimes they plan it, but not for every trap and that's where the problem is. She gets that mindgame for free in those situations where it wasn't planned.
Again I play Hag and I don't think the camera jerk is needed now that she places traps faster. If it were an ability of an add-on or something that's fine, because that indicates the Hag is indeed planning it for most traps. But I would rather it is taken out of the base kit considering how good she is now.
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@ChesterTheMolester said:
He comes across as a guy so full of himself that the thought that someone might not know him gets him triggered. Calling it a joke doesnt make that seem better at all.You realize you're replying to the guy you're insulting right? marth88gaming
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@akbays35 said:
I don't get it, I actually make suggestions for fixing the timer issue that killers have and they don't see great skill checks as a problem. In low ranks survivors can barely get gens done in 8 mins, in high ranks they can get them done pre 5 without any toolkits. Making gens take longer would hurt balance for low skill players, but removing great skillcheck boosts would remove a lot of power from high skill players.Removing great skill checks or their rewards just removes any bit of skill left in doing gens. It's just not a reasonable solution. Gens themselves don't need to take longer, there just needs to be something in the game to force them to be done at a reasonable pace, one that only affects the most optimal players. Your suggestion would hurt survivors at all ranks, not just the best ones.
Survivors should be spawned in random almost bad places in the map, if one guy gets spawned in the basement that might add to the spook factor pretty quick, hell survivors should randomly spawn in lockers so they have to waste animation frames just to get out, the maps are so big why the hell survivors are just spawning on top of gens?
Pallets, jungle gyms, loops, should not spawn right next to each other, there needs to be at least a 20m distance from these types of objects. The devs have this power in their capacity when they nerfed pallet spawn. I do notice some updates to it but it feels really random on the spawns and not tested enough.Again it's just not possible. I want you to take 10 sheets of paper (tiles), get a few coins/Chess pieces to represent gens, totems, hook, chests, survivors, and the killer. On the sheets of paper draw out each tile (1 for shack, 1 for main building, some jungle gyms, some double L walls, etc.). Now arrange the tiles in a way where no 2 jungle gyms/double L walls are next to each other. Don't forget that main structures MUST be in the middle. Now put down the items for gens, totems, hooks, and chests. Make sure each tile has a limit of 1 of each. Now step back and take a look at your masterpiece. Where can you put a survivors AND the killer in such a way that they aren't right on top of SOMETHING. Also take note to the fact that no matter how you arrange the tiles, you will have some stuff right next to each other. This is why your suggestion wouldn't work. It's just not physically possible to separate all of this stuff evenly in a random sequence. You might come up with a few arrangements, but that removes randomness from the equation leading to very stale and predictable maps.
Like I said, they just need to put totems in better spots, where they aren't visible from gens and aren't clear out in the open. That's the only problem.
I think killers need more control over the game, it doesn't make sense that survivors have every tool to stop a killer but a killer has no tools to stop a survivor.
More control =/= total control. Letting killers destroy pallets before they are used will just lead to a meta where a killer spends 60 seconds destroying every pallet on the map which survivors frantically rush gen. That's not good. You want killers to have total control, which is to say that you want them to be able to completely nullify all survivor tactics. That's not a fair solution, it's a completely lopsided one.
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It's an interesting idea but I think it would just be way WAY too powerful.
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Check your NAT. If it's anything but 'open' people will have a hard time connecting to you. You can do this through your modem/router's admin. If you're not sure about it, just reset everything on your network that usually resets the NAT to 'open'. Also your region and time of day can affect how quickly your lobby fills.
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@ChesterTheMolester said:
Im not sure if i should post the links but there was this lolcow who showed some excessive hatred for her after he claimed that Not_Queen said he had a small dick which didnt happen He also claimed she is condoning toxicity by allowing camping, threw the same few insults to everyone and used Ochidos ######### vocabulary while at it.LOL
"For the record I have a big dick. A HUGE DICK. Big and veiny, with abs too. Big fat MEATY dick. I totally don't have a small dick."
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@Tsulan said:
@thesuicidefox said:
If I had a nickel for every time I heard a really good player say they "quit" playing a game only to come back, I'd be able to pay off my student loans. Happens all the time in eSports, but it never lasts.People can change their mind. I know some alcoholics which sweared to stay sober...
No most players do it for attention TBH. It's always the same thing "game is broken, I'm not playing". 6 months later they show up at a tournament and get top 8. Seen it plenty, and I have been involved in multiple eSport communities and ran tournaments for almost 10 years.
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@Tsulan said:
@thesuicidefox said:
@Tsulan said:
Please don´t compare me to anti vaxxers. Or are you one of those Flat earthers?LOL OMG don't even get me started on those lunatics.
I mean really, if Earth was flat cats woulda pushed everything off by now. Simple logic.
9gager detected.
No I don't do that either.
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Check your NAT too. If it's not 'open' then people won't be able to connect to you. This is a common issue in a lot of games people never seem to realize. Most of the time, resetting your modem and router will fix it.
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@Tsulan said:
Please don´t compare me to anti vaxxers. Or are you one of those Flat earthers?LOL OMG don't even get me started on those lunatics.
I mean really, if Earth was flat cats woulda pushed everything off by now. Simple logic.
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If I had a nickel for every time I heard a really good player say they "quit" playing a game only to come back, I'd be able to pay off my student loans. Happens all the time in eSports, but it never lasts.
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@Tsulan said:
So skill checks are hard now.No I'm saying they are easy LOL. Like hitting someone once and getting a free kill out of it.
@Tsulan said:
Was that before the emblem system?
I can proof it by presenting you a screenshot. But then you probably say that's because I used add-on X and offering Y and that it doesn't count, bla bla.Before and after. I wouldn't doubt it happens sometimes in extreme circumstances (so yes, you using specific add-ons or a mori might make it happen) but in 95% of games where you get a 4k with 5 gens you will pip or double pip. I've had several in the past week like that. One game in particular (again as Freddy) this group was all running around like chickens without heads and being way WAY too altruistic to the point there were almost sandbagging each other. Game was over in less than 5 minutes and I was even trying to give some of them chances because it was just so sad. Double pip while the best survivor barely got 3k BP.
"A screenshot" won't cut it, especially when I've had plenty of experiences that contradict that. You'd have to show me a lot of screenshots from back-to-back games for me to even take you seriously. Don't act like me dismissing your one isolated example proves you right. It's like those anti-vaxxers that point to this one (bogus) study that says vaccines cause autism, when there are HUNDREDS of other studies and years of scientific/medical data that say otherwise. That's called selective bias.
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The one that adds 2 blinks should be pink. The other should make her blinks silent.
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- Yes.
- LOL no.
- Ideal, but not physically possible. There are 7 gens, 5 totems, 5 chests, 4 survivors, and 1 killer. Only so many tiles per map (I think the average is 10? not sure). There would be very few spots where you would be able to spawn survivors. They just need better totem placement so your Ruin isn't in LOS of a gen or spawns next to a survivor.
- No. There are only a few spots that need fixing, and they need to adjust the cover around every pallet tile to allow for mindgames. Too many "safe" pallets when there should only be at most 3 (shack, 1 or 2 for main structures).
- Again no. Killers would just go around destroying every pallet at the start of a game then survivors have nothing to fight back.
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You realize the i-frames are only for the animation where you are being unhooked and stop the moment you gain control of your character right? You act like they are going to be invincible for seconds after an unhook, which won't be the case. You just can't be downed before you can do anything, which was stupid and just rewarded campers way too much. Now at the very least you will have to time your hit correctly.
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@Tsulan said:
NOED requires the killer to track down, chase, and hit the survivors he supposedly didn't hit during the whole match.DS requires a skill check. Wow, look it's so hard to do either of these things!
@Tsulan said:
DS requires the survivor to fail at hiding, fail at juking but to hit a skill check to get a free out of jail card.Just love the hypocrisy here. "DS requires survivors to fail, but NOED doesn't require killer to fail". SMH
@Tsulan said:
Ohh and the way the devs want this game to be played, is spending as much time as possible in a match. 4k with 5 gens? A black pip.Bullshit. I've 4k'd with 5 gens in games that lasted less than 5 minutes and easily pip or double pip as killer. Good job trying to make up nonsense though, maybe if I never played a single killer game in my life I'd fall for it.
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Tried for about 30 minutes and finally got into the game. I'm scared to turn off my Xbox now.
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@Tsulan said:
So letting survivors make points and pip is now failure.Letting the other side win is a failure. You shouldn't just let it happen, you should be trying to kill people. Also, most bad killers don't "let" it happen, it happens because they are bad, hence they failed. NOED rewards failure as much as DS does.
A strategy for end game should involve some skill on the killers part. That's why Remember Me and Blood Warden aren't crutch perks because they require you to do something for them to have an affect. NOED doesn't, it just requires you fail, making it a comeback mechanic and a crutch. If your strategy is "let them win" then you shouldn't be rewarded for that. If your strategy is "use early/mid game to prepare for end game" that is something to reward.
Also, DS can be considered a "gamble" by your logic, as you failed to escape the killer then need to hit a skill check. A much lesser gamble, but still a gamble. You are also betting that the killer isn't running an obsession perk. If they run Remember Me or Dying Light you are gambling your team's ability to escape, since you getting caught/dying will punish them. Does any of that still make DS okay? No, so then why is NOED okay when it's basically the same thing for killers?
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I have been trying to get in for 3 whole days (Xbox). This is one of the errors I keep getting.
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@Delfador said:
Games are just so fast for most of the killers. There are 2 ways to prevent this. Killers will either take the chance to run hex:ruin and hope that survivors won't find it in the first 10 seconds of the game so that they can have a little bit chance to win or they use NOED and get all of their kills at the end of the game.Again, I'm not saying the game doesn't need fixes in other places. What I am saying is that crutch perks are not the solution. They just ruin the experience, remove skill from the equation, and ultimately piss off the player base.
Furthermore, killers that don't get a single kill until endgame, even if the others rush gens, are flat out just bad killers. Besides the fact that you don't even need to kill people to pip as killer (it's almost laughable how easy it is to pip as killer with emblems), any decent killer will be able to catch/hook most survivors and get someone before end game. The problem is that majority of killers that use NOED aren't even that decent at the game, they literally rely on NOED to carry them to get kills. THAT is the problem, that bad killers are rewarded way more than they should be.
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@SovererignKing said:
Orion said:
Because otherwise Survivors would have to admit that NOED even triggering is their fault, and that late-game builds exist.
Rewarding failure in the premise of not protecting and stopping Gen progress. “Who cares if they do the Gens? I’ve got NOED!” Just like DS “Who cares if I get found and caught, I’ve got DS!”Its the same premise that Survivors use to justify DS. “It’s the Killers fault for catching me. Should have chased someone else.” When we all know that’s a load of bullshit.
”LULZ should have broke the totems!” = “LULZ should have chased someone else!”
Yes exactly. Just because NOED can be nullified doesn't make it any less of a crutch. DS can be countered too, but no one here will argue that it's not a crutch because of that.
Not to mention, where other totems only require you to destroy 1 totem, NOED requires you to destroy 5. Sometimes that's not an option, especially if you play solo. You have no control over how fast your team does gens, you have no way to know how many totems they broke, and on top of it all there is always ALWAYS that 1 totem that well hidden somewhere on the map that you may never find. Saying players should destroy all 5 totems is as reasonable a counter as saying "juggle every survivor to every hook, every time".
@KillingInstinct said:
EDIT: Yes I also play Freddy without Noed in rank 1, but if there's 3 people in the endgame with exit gates open, then Freddy can't do ######### so noed is needed right nowA lot of killers can't do much when gates are powered and 3 survivors still alive. At this point, any killer would be happy to get 1 more kill. Expecting a killer to win in this situation is like expecting a lone Dwight to finish 2 gens with Ruin and Dying Light active so he can hatch.
Also I guess you missed the part where I said I play Freddy at rank 1 without NOED right? It's not at all NEEDED, and if you think that but don't consider it a crutch you are a hypocrite.
@Nickenzie said:
3.) NOED isn't DS, don't compare them two when DS has no easy counter and when NOED does.I love this argument. "DS and NOED do different things DURRR so they aren't the same DURRR". Look at the end result.
DS: Does a survivor escape when they shouldn't have? Yes.
NOED: Does a killer get a kill when they shouldn't have? Yes.That's what makes it a crutch. It rewards bad play, it's a comeback mechanics for unskilled players, it comes at no cost to the player and is just given to them.
Do they have counters? Yes. Doesn't make their results any less damning.
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@Tsulan said:
Suddely everyone got to rank 1 as Freddy. Is this a new trend i started?LOL don't flatter yourself. I've been playing Freddy since he came out.
@Tsulan said:
The game isn´t over until you see the point screen.
Until then everything goes. If the killer wastes a perk slot to have a chance to one hit survivors after the gates have been powered, then thats a strategy. Survivors can easily avoid NOED, if they can stop their gen rush and do some totems.You can easily avoid DS by not picking up the obsession. You can also run Enduring and just eat it. You can also run Remember Me or STBFL if you wanna punish the group for having someone using DS. DS has counters, but that doesn't make it any less of a crutch. NOED is the same.
@Runiver said:
The main issue with NOED is, if a survivor gets caught early and hardcamped, the killer can easily earn 2 kills by usually grabbing another one with NOED as the gates are getting opened.Yes, this is the common scenario with NOED. Sometimes they get more than 2 and all because a perk carried them. That is the definition of a crutch. I have almost never faced off a killer using NOED their either 1) was complete garbage and could barely catch one person all game even when you don't gen rush, or 2) did exactly what you talk about here. I've also never faced a GOOD killer that used NOED. It's always ALWAYS the most unskill killers that use it, and you can immediately tell they are bad when they chase you and fall for every mindgame, get looped at unloopable pallets, and swing 10 times before landing a hit.
@Skorpanio said:
I'll add you to my 'Kill camp and mori' list now.Ask me if I care. Not to mention I don't play the game on PC.
@Tsulan said:
Why is NOED considered "rewarding failure"? Game is not finished until you see the point screen.
I mean there are perks specifically for the endgame like Remember Me and Blood Warden.You failed to kill anyone before the gates were powered. That's failure on the killers part. They did NOTHING to earn it. At the very least with DS you have to hit a skill check. NOED is just given to you if you played poorly. The difference between NOED and other endgame perks is that it takes some SKILL to activate those perks. RM requires you to find and hit your obsession 6 times, then kill them. Blood Warden requires you to hook someone after the gates are open. NOED... you do nothing and get it. That's why it rewards failure.
"Game is not finished until you see the point screen" is like saying "Giants lead the Jets 1000-2 but the Jets can still make a comeback". No if the exit gates are powered and all 4 survivors are alive that's basically a loss. If the killer expressed some SKILL during the game then they wouldn't be in that situation, and if they used skillful end game perks they can extend the game in their favor. By that logic if a killer goes around and slugs everyone with 5 gens left, and no one has Unbreakable, "OMG we can still win this guys!" No there are some scenarios where it's just a loss waiting to happen.
@Freudentrauma said:
A game mechanic that seems to reward failure isn't bad by design. There is an interesting video about feedback loops in game design on youtube. It explains how and why so called negative Feedback Loops exists. It kinda prevents games from beeing boring or the winning side snowballing the other one.The thing with negative feedback loops, or "comeback mechanics" is that they are SPECIFICALLY designed to circumvent skilled play. The Blue Shell in Mario Kart is there to help bad players get ahead of good players. That doesn't mean it's healthy for games to reward players that are bad. It's the reason items are banned in Smash Bros, because they are there only to help bad players. Case and point, Ken vs. CPU in the Nintendo's sponsors Brawl tournament. Ken, literally the best player in the world, lost to a nobody kid that just spammed items on a really lame stage. Ken didn't use items and lost specifically for that reason. The pokeballs and assist trophies did all the work for him. If you're goal is to create a fun, competition-free game then yes, comeback mechanics are great. But when it comes to competitive games, which DBD gameplay arguably is as the devs have stated they wanted a "tug of war" type of gameplay when they introduced emblems, it just ruins the game. Marvel vs. Capcom 3 is another great example of bad comeback mechanics in a competitive style game. X-factor is the comeback mechanic in that game, and some players completely rely on it with a powerful anchor character to just plow through the enemy. When they are on the brink of losing, legit losing because they got outplayed, they just land 1 opener, pop X-factor, and completely demolish 3 characters in a row because of how strong it was on the last guy. None of these mechanics are acceptable to top level players. The only ones that accept them are the bad players than can't win any other way.
Snowballing isn't something that should be stopped. If a player/team is that good that they just wipe the floor with you then that's how it should go. You shouldn't get a boost because you got bodied. Imagine any sport that had a comeback mechanic. OMG Yankees lead Redsox 50-1, so last inning the Redsox get a bonus "homerun derby" round where they can score more points to catch up. See how awful that sounds? These mechanics are there to remove skill from the equation, which again isn't a bad thing if your goal is to have a non-competitive atmosphere. But DBD is competitive in nature, so these types of mechanics only ruin the experience. NOED/DS are both in this category, hence why they are two of the most despised perks in the game.
@Sarief said:
Populism in it's natural habitatX said so, it means it's true! he's the only one who spoke out!
It is and has been my own opinion that both DS and NOED are crutch perks and don't belong in the game. Tru had the same sentiment, and he is a popular streamer/YT'er that is mostly a killer main where most killer mains defend NOED to the death. This is a case of "from the horse's mouth", which is why all the killer mains are denouncing his statements. Had he said "NOED should be a permanent thing" I bet you anything these same people would be praising his opinion.
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@Hillbilly420 said:
It depends. On the Storehouse it depends on if they heard Bamboozle shut down the cancer window. If you Bamboozle the cancer window and get rid of a pallet or two in that loop spot you have a pretty decent chance at getting them.No it really doesn't help. Bambo usually lasts just until they get to the window again, I ran it a few times on that map with Huntress and they just kept going around like it wasn't even there. It helps with the shack, pig tree, jungle gyms, and double L walls but for some major structures it does nothing. Torment Creek is another map where it fails. Bambo is also completely useless on Lery's because of the sheer amount of windows, and is mostly useless on Game because of severe lack of windows that can be looped (most of the windows on this map are a 1 time use, prolly the only one that you can use to loop is the freezer window).
I personally find Brutal Strength to be more reliable overall compared to Bambo just because there's never a spot where it's not that great to use.
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@imjjc said:
One thing not often brought up is that if there is a poor connection or poor graphics performance, reliably hitting the check is impossible. And some hex locations are well hidden/ protected. So doing the tap is the only way sometimes.You realize that skill checks are done client side right? That means they are unaffected by the killers connection. If you are talking about frame drops, that can affect it but that's a stability issue with the game, not the design of the mechanics.
"Tapping is the only way sometimes" ... NO. Hitting great skill checks isn't that hard to do somewhat consistently if you really focus. If you can hit more than 75% of great skill checks then Ruin basically doesn't exist to you. I don't even bat an eye to Ruin, I just plow through it and finish the gen anyway, unless I'm playing like crap then I go looking for the totem.
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@Visionmaker said:
There's no skill or strategy needed on behalf of the killer with the camera flips. And whether it screws you as a survivor is completely up to luck. This is the only part of her kit that is zero skill and unfair feeling.As someone that plays Hag I can agree to this. The camera jerk isn't necessary when she can place traps super fast. Maybe if one of her add-ons had that effect, but now that she's really good I don't think it should be in her base kit.