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@adsads123123123123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3442320#Comment_3442320
Camping is a strategy. As I said, camping is the best choice in some situations and for some killers.
Standing still and waiting for the timer to go down. Sounds like doing gens?
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3442439#Comment_3442439
False. The camping changes were implemented because it wasn't fun for survivors and caused "frustration". The change was made to improve enjoyment for survivors and was not a balance change. Therefore, any changes to the games balance must be accounted for. See https://deadbydaylight.com/news/anniversary-gameplay-updates.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3442564#Comment_3442564
If you've read that comment, it clearly explains why it's a nerf. Though, I'll repeat myself. There are many situations where camping is better but the most common situation is camping a survivor that is nearly dead. Between camping for 30 seconds to kill a survivor and potentially get an additional down compared to chasing another survivor, which can take 30-60 seconds for a down, the first option is vastly superior. The camping changes prevents the vastly stronger first option and therefore, is a nerf.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3442616#Comment_3442616
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3442739#Comment_3442739
Camping isn't a guaranteed kill. I just said it was since the odds of it getting a kill is extremely high.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3442743#Comment_3442743
If I was, I would be arguing to cancel the camping changes. My post is neither for or against the change. I am just saying if killers get nerfed due to it, a buff is needed to offset it.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3442797#Comment_3442797
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3442813#Comment_3442813
Ever heard of https://www.twitch.tv/sethgameon? This guy has over 6k overs on Bubba and recently attempted a 50 win streak on Bubba. He never camps. After several weeks, he gave up because it was impossible.
Yes camping is a strategy. But one that is unfun for the survivor, and is used by standing still and doing nothing. Its boring for both sides, and this is a game after all so it should be fun. It's only ever truly necessary in endgame, at which point the new system deactivates entirely. No killer relies solely on camping to get kills, all being able to consistently rack up hooks throughout the game and eventually kill. Bubba is effective out of camping because of his instadown and speed boost, hes probably low B-tier. Not the best, but an honorable spot to be in. Not even trapper relies on camping, even though basement trapper is phenomenal.
Yeah, both gens and camping involve waiting for the timer to go down. The difference there is that you, as the killer, can patrol the gens and keep survivors off of them via hooks etc. A survivor cant just run up and instantly stop you camping, meanwhile a killer can do that to someone repairing. A survivor going to save someone being camped is going to get hooked themselves if the killer isnt dumb, trading themselves for the hookee. Normally this is done when one stage is about to end, so that the hook is spread between the two instead of one person being dead/deathook.
Except against a bubba, you cant trade. If you go for the save, you will go down despite your health state or skill level. It was so broken that it was a better strat to just leave the hooked guy to die and do gens. Which of course, isnt fun for the hooked guy at all. Why should he be guaranteed to die because he lost one chase? There are 3 hook stages, so it should take around 3 chases in an evenly matched, fun and fair game. But a bubba only needs to win one chase, and he gets a kill. If he gets another down he gets another kill. It doesnt matter if all 3 survivors rush the hook, if you are literally the best dbd player or if the bubba has 2 hours on the game. If he knows he can just stand there, that survivor is dead no matter what. Which isnt fun or fair gameplay. A camping bubba is a guaranteed kill.
On other killers yeah you can trade, but why should someone just standing there guarantee multiple hooks? Typically, a hook requires some sort of skillful play in chase that leads into a down. And while camping may be a smart strategy to use, that doesnt make it skillful. Its as skilled as doing generators, like you said. Therefore it shouldnt be so effective at securing kills as actual skilled plays.
Camping may not be guaranteed but its very boring and unskilled on the killer end, while being boring and uncounterable on the survivor end. The things a survivor can do against a regular m1 camper are:
- Trade (let yourself get hooked to prolong the time the killers not patrolling)
- Do nothing and go do gens (let someone die so the rest can get out)
- rush the hook with multiple teammates, one taking a hit and the other unhooking. (have multiple people off of generators to deal with one hook, and have the coordination thats impossible in soloQ outside of endgame. In endgame its just human nature to rush the hook ig)
- bring reassurance to enhance option 2.
- Bring deliverance so your trade doesnt also need to be traded out, ending the camp cycle.
These solutions are all either bring a specific perk, let someone die, or purposefully get hooked to prevent the death. Something should never require bringing a perk to counter, letting someone die isnt fun so it shouldnt be optimal in any scenario, and trading a camper is unfun and needs you to also be traded out. Even in a trade chain, eventually someone is gonna die if nobodies got deliverance or smth of the sort. Essentially a longer version of option 2, with the hope the killer will either get bored and leave or make a mistake.
None of this applies to instadown killers, or killers exceptional at shredding through health states. Trickers a pretty good camper because of how good he is at tearing through health, huntress as well. Not to mention how good huntress, artist, slinger, bubba, and many more are at defending the basement.
Camping is boring and unskilled for both sides while promoting unfun gameplay with few counters, all of which are either unreasonable or unfun. As a game designed to be fun, camping should not be optimal in most scenarios and should instead be a last ditch effort to secure a kill. Thats what this change does; if you are chasing regularly most of the game, hooks will be spread pretty well. In endgame, you can pretty easily camp someone to secure one last kill. And since the new anti-camp basekit doesnt work after all the gens are done, that method of play still works just as well. The only real issue I could see this being is the range. 16 meters seems too much, maybe 8 or 10. But outside of that this is a positive and welcome addition to dbd.
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@adsads123123123123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3442248#Comment_3442248
Yes but it's still a very large nerf. Camping allowed Bubba to guarantee kills.
Which was unfair. You shouldn't be able to just camp someone and guarantee they die with nothing the survivors can do.
What if a survivor could just sit on a gen all game with nothing you could do to stop it? No chasing, no downing, they just stay on it forever. Not fair.
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BNP maybe, but not syringe. it destroys the med kit and takes the normal time to heal. its only slightly op when its got like 30 boosts behind it, like idk botany with CoH and desperate measures 4 stacked with we'll make it level. And it takes longer to heal yourself anyways. The timer means the counter is to just down them before then.
BNP does 22.5 seconds of progress in 5 seconds. 22.5 x 4 = 90s to regress something done in 5.
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yes please. just played a garden of joy game with 7 CONNECTING LOOPS. 3 of which were safe, the other 5 either being window loops or regular pallet loops.
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@Spare_Them_Mori_Me said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3441495#Comment_3441495
Oh its far from dead, sir. Killers like you are why I still bring it: You never see it coming, and sometimes its an instant d/c.
oh Im well aware that its far more consistent now lol. I get hit with DH without even realizing it sometimes, where im just like "wait where'd they go- GOD DAMMT". People still use it relatively often, maybe 5% pickrate or smth. As long as i dont have to deal with it every single god forsaken chase its fine with me.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3441510#Comment_3441510
Maybe pre-healing nerf. Not now.
Only self healing got nerfed, altruism is stil fine. Why do ppl keep acting like the ptb went through-
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@Trollinmon said:
Underrated: Deliverance
The perk is kinda crazy how strong it is and I rarely see survivors use it. The only thing keeping this perk in check is the fact you can't get it every game. Every proc is very impactful and it doesn't seem that rare to get the perk to activate. I've gotten players out of basement by trading and then using Deli to get myself out, which is super strong. Killers hook and leave and you can unhook yourself which basically removes the tempo they just gained, and pairs insanely well with OTR.
Overrated: Prove Thyself
If you double a gen at 50% this perk barely does anything. If you don't hit the breakpoints the value of the perk is meh(just finishing a gen the killer is about to stop you from doing). Multiple players running this perk makes it have terrible value since the situations you want to co-op gens is low and the perk doesn't stack. I've seen killers act like this perk is the boogieman and 4 survivors running the perk are really sweaty.
You are so right about deliverance! My build rn is SB, OTR, Reassurance, and deliverance. I basically just cant be tunneled bc I just unhook myself and run away with SB, and even if they catch up I get OTR. That combo is very powerful separately while off hook while being insane together, making for whats basically adrenaline off hook. THAT YOU GET TO TRIGGER.
Deliverance is so crazy, but for some reason survs like using boil over more 🤔
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@Sonzaishinai said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3441496#Comment_3441496
If thana was 10% per survivor gens would take 150 seconds if everybody is injured...
LMAO YOUR RIGHT OOPS. Ran the numbers HOLY. If it were 7.5%, it would add 36s if everyones injured. Seems fair enough considering healing is all it takes to nullify it.
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@some_guy1 said:
didn't expect flip flop to be complained about on this forum
badham main building basement is notorious for it's extreme difficulty to get survivors hooked out of it if the hook basement doesn't spawn there, just because such map design flaws exist doesn't mean you should obliterate entire perks that work in niche scnearios, address the long standing map designs instead
Yeah sorry man I had just gotten out of a real frustrating game lol, was kinda on offense. You are right though, its more a map design issue than a perk issue. Though I'd argue that if these perks only really work in niche situations they should be reworked.
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thana sucks. we know.
Besides, for the 24% bonus combo you need another survivor with prove near you while you are injured with resilience. Takes 2 people with 2 specific perks.
Thana is just one perk. I think it should be a 10% bonus per surv, because even when it was 5 it wasnt great.
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Dead hard is the one perk in this game that NEEDS to STAY DEAD. It was a relic from when dbd was a party game. The idea of "click button, win game" will always be bad. Thats why its so disgustingly limited now, even in its current state landing a DH is a chase resetter. Im so happy this perk is finally gone and dead in the water, hopefully it stays there.
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Decisive isnt bad though, its just outshined by OTR. Why pick DS when you could pick OTR? theres no reason to. But that doesnt make DS bad, I think that reflects more on OTR.
Basekit BT lasts 10 seconds at base, ignoring the speed boost that means you'll reach any pallet within 40m of the hook. Worst case scenario, you spends the full 10 just barely reaching that pallet. Dropped, onto the next loop. About 50s left, but injured so will prob go down before then. So, you go down, hit the DS, keep looping. the fact its 2 seconds of distance doesnt matter if you went down at a loop, which you most likely did considering basekit and just good pathing.
Even if you didnt, non mobility/range killers will still take a decent chunk of time to reach you again. I'd say roughly 60% of the roster is heavily impacted by a DS. Granted nurse and blight give jack all about it and just down you, but only nurse could do that if you went down looping.
Caught in a deadzone? Yeah DS is useless, but why should it provide you a get out of jail free card if you couldnt use a full 10 seconds of invulnerability to get somewhere meaningful?
edit: out of curiosity I checked Otz's tier list, and to my surprise hes got it in A-tier. I thought It'd be B lol.
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@not_requested49 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3437741#Comment_3437741
It's amazing how many killers complain abt genrushing when rancor + game afoot is a thing
Pair it with NWO and Remember Me it's a completely braindead strategy, like tombstone Myers but on any killer
I ADORE using this build lmao. just go afk and hit one basic attack and all the sudden you have a kill its ridiculous. But combining with nwo or remember me wouldnt really work as well bc it has to be longest chase time. If you got a bunch of stacks of both you've probably had one or two long chases, long enough that someone can pop the exit gates and get more out than if you just brought meta.
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They arent bad, their just very unfun for both sides.
Getting genrushed is frustrating because you feel powerless to stop it, knowing you will probably lose despite your skill level.
Being tunneling is frustrating because after the first chase, you get hooked. Being hooked is boring you cant do anything. Then you get unhooked, but the killer comes straight for you because its smartest to get an early kill. Since you are injured you will likely go down fast. Basekit BT only guarantees you reach a loop, after its gone you are just chasing injured. Go down, get hooked, get bored bc ur hooked, get frustrated bc you cant do anything about it, get unhooked, downed, killed. Out of the game extremely fast with little to do about it.
Their making a good play, just at your expense.
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I see your point, and I half agree. If we're talking hard meta, winning is all that matters type players, then doing gens ASAP while being tunneled is very important. If if the killers playing someone good, and are using full meta, AND are hard tunneling etc etc gen rushing is one of very few things you can do about it.
I also disagree about chases. Chases are extremely effective, even with tunneling. A tunneler still has to down you, something you can prevent as long as possible. its not DH was all that kept chases valuable, SB and Lithe are both very consistent and valuable. Plus, SB also has some semblance of anti tunnel because it activates off hook. One gen takes 90s, so even holding a chase for 30 means theres plenty of progress. If you are the one being tunneled, slapping on an OTR and SB makes tunneling much harder. THose two slots left over could be a prove thyself and resilience, to genrush while the killers out tunneling someone else. Genrushing isnt the only thing you can do. Granted countering tunneling relies on perks, but countering gen rushing does as well. Both of which are strategies effective against one another. I'd say the optimal meta build would go as such: Chase Perk, Anti Tunnel Perk, Generator/Team Perk, free slot (idk toss in adrenaline if your feeling fancy). With that kind of build, you counter most of the things a killer can do to you other than camping, which against a smart team is effectively throwing just for 1 kill.
Healing didnt get nerfed though it was just OP self heals, sloppy could always do this. Besides people who run sloppy play hit and run because thats really all its good for. You arent gonna run sloppy if your tunneling. But about reworking items, I think only keys and maybe med kits should see full reworks. Keys are supposed to be info and chase, but fail at both mostly. And med kits used to be for self healing and are now for team healing, but are terrible at it. other than that items are fine w me.
I dont really think that buffing items would really stop gen rushing. Like I said gen rushing doesnt happen because there arent any alternatives, it happens because gens are how you win. The faster you do all 5 the fewer time killers have to hook and kill people (which is why is good against tunneling), the faster everyone makes it out. So if everyone stacks BNP with stakeout hyperfocus on a decked out commodius toolbox any non blight or nurse is gonna lose that game. With basekit BT, anti tunnel perks, and coordinated team efforts though tunneling is significantly less effective. Still very good but a lot less. But killers dont really have much to do against gen rushing.
Most gen regressing perks are terrible now, pretty much just pain res and surge are left. One of which punishes tunnelers, the other working best on m1 killers. Deadlock is really the only counter the gen rushing as a whole, directly preventing multiple gens from popping simultaneously. I have no idea if killer should be buffed or gen rushing should be nerfed though, but if neither happens it will continue to be an issue. Besides, gen rushing doesnt only happen against hard tunnelers. People who play fair get punished for doing so by survivors who genrush, being forced to tunnel if they want to win. The difference between tunneling and gen rushing though is that one is something that can be done at any time and the other requires certain perks and/or items to do. Meaning that if a survivor loads up with a gen rush build, they are gonna gen rush. theres no going back after the lobby. ANd because of that the killer is encourage to tunnel if they want to win. Just like gen rushing is one of few counters to tunneling, the reverse applies. Beyond just equipping deadlock and pain res tunneling is the only in game play that can be made against it. Gen rushing is also just unfun for the killer, no matter how much you pressure the gens or hook the survivors generator progress will stay and grow.
Gen rushing wasnt really an issue before because the gen kick meta was grossly OP. Just as fast as someone could toolbox it, one overbrine kick would stop that gen in its tracks. But since the only 2 reliable REGRESSION perks left require winning chase, you can't just find the genrushed gen and go "well stop that" and be fine. Surge's regression does not counter genrushing at all, only being strong due to effecting many generators. Pain res has very, VERY good regression but only works once per surv and deactivates soon into the game if you arent tunneling. Meaning, gen progress that occurs is likely to remain. So your only counter is to keep people off the gens... or get kills.
Tunneling encourages gen rushing --> genrushing encourages tunneling. Both should be looked at so games can be fun.
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@Kirarozu said:
Except fov for killer being limited is an integral part of the game. I guess you just want the game to be unplayable?
Saying this is like saying visual TR is unbalanced. Oh no, optional basekit spinechill whatever will I do.
FOV is only "integral to game" for certain techs. Most of which are completely doable with a high FOV. FOV window tech would still work because FOV only effects HORIZONTALLY. 360 is already very inconsistent an only really works on not super great killers or if you get suprised.
But no, these VERY integral parts of the game would be ever so slightly more limited. That makes the game unplayable ig.
Fun fact: people with motion sickness issues quite literally cant play killer because of the field of view. This is a very common accessibility issue for probably thousands of players. Their locked out of half of the game because the FOV is too small.
So actually, the low FOV is unplayable.
Even if some techs would get removed, its stupid to argue that those are worth more than accessibility. If it was really that big a deal then shadowborn would be meta.
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I think after like, 5 noises within a 3 second span they should mute until nothing happens for that span
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3440533#Comment_3440533
To be fair, you get a Prestige-Symbol for P100. So there is not really a need for a Charm or anything, because you already get something to show off that you are P100.
I know, but it takes so long I'd just like somethin extra.
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had to get prestige 3 before 6.1.0 , which overhauled prestiging. I think that you should at least get a little star for getting P-100, or a cool charm or smth.
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@Caiman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3440024#Comment_3440024
I don't love him. I find him super annoying because they only do it on indoor maps and they always hook-camp.
then is that an issue with the addon or the players? In my experience nearly all jumpscare myers just go to leris and run around scaring people. Its really the one thing in this game thats actually kinda scary
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@KateMain86 said:
An example of a killer having too much late game power is the Artist when 2 survivors have been eliminated. I had a match where there was 1 generator left to do and half my team had been eliminated. Because killers can see generator auras the Artist was able to constantly keep us off the generators simply by using her power from long distances targeting all of the generators. This went on for about 5 minutes and I realized that this situation was hopeless. I didn't realize the Artist could use her power this much. The situation felt completely unfair, even with me and the other survivor working on gens that had good distance from each other.
In the time I've played this game I have noticed that situations like this happen often. You'll get this far just to find yourself in an unwinnable situation simply because of the killer's power being able to do something different. The Artist shouldn't be able to spam her power at generators as much as she can right now. Survivors need breathing room after a big onslaught from the killer. There was no trading in this situation. It was simply work on generator for a few seconds, repel birds, run from the killer or try to hide and eventually get hooked. This cycle went on until we were both eliminated.
I think killer's powers need to be looked at and balanced around situations like this. Too often are survivors thrown into a big disadvantage against killers simply because of the uniqueness of their power. I understand giving killers new and unique powers makes them different from each other but when their power scales too much in their favor then it becomes problematic.
It looks to me more like the killer played well. They used their power in a fundamentally smart way that led to a victory. If gens are how you win, and your power is how to defend them, its only logical to do just that. Plsu when it comes to artist if the gens were really that spaced out you could just hop off of it when you hear the caw/count down the cooldown.
I see what your saying though, there are some scenarios that seem unwinnable. But most of those scenarios happen because one side played better than the other. Should adrenaline be nerfed because it makes an endgame chase unwinnable? Should artist power be nerfed for being able to pressure gens really well at 2 kills?
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@Nos37 said:
The devs allow him to cheat because they love seeing jumpscare clips and compilations.
It's been 7 years. Have they had enough?
Blight addons should absolutely be the priority (even though I see Blight 1 in every 60 matches at my MMR)
bro if you are losing to a scratch/vanity mirror myers than its a skill issue. everyone loves jumpscare myers, its just an objective fact. Oh nooo, the killer has no power and is moving at 105% speed. but they can find me easier? pls remove.
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When genrushing becomes a strategy that makes a game into a free escape.
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@Luckyfer said:
I made this post just after I played about 2-3mins getting tunneled by a Nurse.
I don't think...I KNOW she has to get nerfs.
The easiest nerf would be to make her second blink not beign able to blink through objects,if Wraith can't go through objects with an uncloacking speed penalty,neither this failure known as Nurse should.
But we could also make her after reappear or while she is blinking for all scratch marks to not be visible or blood pools,maybe make her the only killer in existence to not get notified when an unhook happens.
Or maybe just let people that have to face her face no DC penalty,because as much as Nurse mains like to say she belongs to this game,she belongs to beign disabled indefinetly until a healthy rework happens.
I dislike that idea because it destroys the core of her kit. And also, landing a secondary blink through a wall means you predicted correctly so it does take skill to do.
Nurse is hard to nerf without making her unplayable or unfair because of how straightfoward her kit is. Hold button=go fast through walls. I think that maybe (heavy maybe) they should get rid of her lunge after a blink. WOuld increase he skill required while leave less margin for error.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3438815#Comment_3438815
What failsafe stops sweaty players from entering casual lobbies? I can think of at least two active players in this forum (not this specific thread) who would abuse the hell out of this. And they’re not alone.
theres not. Like in any game with a ranked and unranked mode, comp players could just load into casual lobbies and stomp. Point is though, most players would go to their respective mode based on playstyle. Keeps many many sweats from ruining casual games and vice versa. besides a better MMR system would mitigate this.
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@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3438812#Comment_3438812
To be fair though, she doesn't have an addon like C33. I'll take an insta mori over that any day.
i mean, she is getting an addon pass soon. hopefully Mother's Beak doesnt get buffed. I'd rather not see all palllets instantly break every time she lands peckening, that'd be crazy
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@Orthane said:
I either get completely stomped and barely have 2-3 hooks by the time they get 5 gens done, or I completely stomp them and they only finish 2. There is almost never an inbetween. Having an actual good game is super rare. I've had a few where I didn't have to tunnel and still got 2-3 kills and those feel good. But having to hard facecamp and/or Tunnel because I have 2 hooks and they're on last gen, and they spread them out so I can't 3 gen is so unfun. I hate tunneling but I HAVE to do it in most games or I won't even get 1 kill. Gens pop so extremely fast that every regression perk is completely unviable and useless. 125% of normal Regression whoopy doo that means it'll take survivors 22 seconds instead of 20 seconds to repair 1 whole minute of regression! The only useful one is Jolt, and that's just because on pretty much every M1 killer there's no better options.
Idk what it is about the games I've been having lately but it truly feels like tunneling is a requirement if I want to get even just 2 kills most of the time. With how fast gens fly by when 2 people have boxes, Prove Thyself, and maybe a few other tools for gen speed, and God forbid one of them has a BNP. Which means you are forced to take someone out of the game as quickly as possible or before you know it all gens will be done. And if you injured everyone too bad, because Adrenaline is picked by over 25% of all Survivors, and if that pops not only can you not catch them, but they've also healed instantly. Incredible.
I've started playing Survivor with a No Mither build and even when I'm basically exposed all the time I have so much more fun than as Killer. When I'm playing Killer it's a constant battle with frustration while I desperately try to get 1-2 kills and getting annoyed when 2 gens pop in a minute when I'm on first chase. But with Survivor, I can genuinely just have fun. Maybe I'm just bad at Killer, but playing Killer is just so demoralizing in so many games.
been saying this for YEARS. ADD A COMPETITIVE MODE.
Let sweaty killers and survivors duke it out with full meta loadouts, while the silly casual lil scrumbly bumbly players use lithe+QaQ for the funnies.
im ready for the inevitable trapper to radiant videos
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@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3438803#Comment_3438803
Damn, just I when I started maining the rooster others have found out about her strength as well.
ikr its crazy man. I know that dbd players have been aboslutely begging for a farmland-avian-bodyhorror-dreamcore-horror type killer (like from attack of roostothicles) but lethal makes her too op man.
i miss the nurse and blights every game, now its just rooster rooster rooster
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@UnknownKiller said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3438800#Comment_3438800
What I mean is basically if you are a surv and u are facing lady bird or any antiloop killer you have two options:
Play om the loop or run to a new tile and get hit.
yeah I get that. On unsafe loops, artist places bird, walks around the tile and profits. Theres not much that can be done about it other than just assuming it'll happen and preemptively W-keying.
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well duh, The Rooster is the best killer in the game. I mean, we thought nurse was bad but then her power, the peckening, was able to just... one shot you from across the map and insta mori you through walls, floors, cielings and other survivors. My whole swf got insta moried bc we were running in a straight line and didnt know the was the rooster yet, so she killed us al with one shot bc she had lethal.
bhvr pls nerf pig
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Im not exactly sure what this post is saying, but I'll throw in my 2 cents:
if their holding w pallet to pallet, just break like 2 or 3 then leave them. Actual loopers will be caught in deadzones, and once that survivor is all out of pallets they will be wasy pickings.
If this post is about simple anti loop powers leaving you with too few options, I agree. I feel artists birds shouldn't have that close range injury thing, instead buffing her in other regards while keeping that away. But at least that can be baited/missed/W-keyed, the real issue is stuff like knight where he drops the guard and not only must you leave the loop but you have a silly goober chasing you along with the big goober. mid merchant etc that kind of stuff. The devs should make killers that encourage shift+W as little as they can.
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@BlueHorkew said:
I don't understand how this keeps happening. Most of the time new survivor perks are really bad, but for some reason every time a PTB comes, there always an outrage about some survivor perk being OP or game breaking. And they never are, they are always niche, ok or just terrible.
In the past year, all of this perks were said to be broken:
- Hyperfocus
- Wiretap
- Reassurance
- Fogwise
- Quick Gambit
- Potential Energy
- Friendly Competion
- Blood Rush
- Cut Loose
Maybe we should wait and see if the perk is really OP instead of seeing niche scenarios on PTB and just asking for nerfs.
None of this perks turned out to be OP, some of them turned out to be really bad.
Maybe the new survivor perks are OP, but honestly with the majority of new survivor perks being so bad, i would like for them to atleast try them out before nerfing them if they are too much.
The devs said they would do quicker balance changes if necessary
Because worst case scenarios hold the most ground in our heads. Hyperfocus+stakeout vastly boosted genrushing especially with bnp, so people got scared that combo would become meta and called for nerfs. But turns out hyperfocus equires a build around it to be worth bringing over other perks, so its completely fine.
wiretap was thought to make looping way too easy bc some gens have tiles around them, but survivors try to loop AWAY from the generators with progress so they get completed. This worry ignored how survs actually play, looping with wiretap is throwing unless totally necessary.
Reassurance, while not overpowered, is INCREDIBLY good. It cuts killer pressure in half for 30s, bc 2 ppl normally need to be off gens when someones hook but with reassurance it cuts down to 1 for 30s. Very strong, and also very strong anti camp. On the ptb though, everyone could bring reassurance and a survivor on hook wouldn't die. But that got removed so its all good.
Fogwise - crossmap aura reading for 1 skillcheck. People thought it'd provide way too much info, especially to swfs. but rng and the fact its gen exclusive makes it less useful.
Bloodrush - old sprintburst flashbacks, click f to go speedge? ppl were terrified lmao, but it has so many activation conditions that its useless.
Potential energy- instant 20% is scary, what else can I say?
quick gambit, friendly competition, cut loose, are all TERRIBLE. people afraid of these are either bad at the game or dont understand why they suck.
Most killers look at "OMG 3% BOOST??" and think, "well huntress is gonna suck now, effective 107% killer." and stuff like that forgetting lower speed killers have ways to go nyoom or down survivors quicker. as a killer player I was actually afraid of fogwise on the ptb, but after a while I saw people stop using it because there were just better perks to bring. lots of times on ptbs the perks are actually insane and need nerfs (looking at you ptb reassurance) or are straight up unhealthy.
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it was fine then because gen kick existed so genrushing died as long as you got there first. But now that regression is dead gen progress stays practically forever, so the faster you gain progress the more permanent progress stays. BNP does 25% in 5 sec, an effective 500% repair speed (roughly). 22.5s completed in 5 seconds. 22.5x4=90s. It takes 90s to completely degrade one 5s BNP. Thats excluding the extra charge, prove, other addons, other perks all that jazz. All of it put together is uninteractive and unfair for the killer, because being able to complete a gen solo in less than 30s isnt fair.
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@[Deleted User] said:
I don't think Hag has basekit Spirit Fury, though.
Wowie, 10 whole seconds of being good after a teleport. A teleport that will never happen bc emps are busted, and will never get you value because you get stunned like crazy anyways.
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@AssortedSorting said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3435863#Comment_3435863
Or by the Killer consolidating where they patrol?
so the killer strategizes for the long game, but thats a bad thing even though 3 gens can be broken with a little teamwork? Its not like regression is a thing that exists anymore. Progress stays on the gen, so just split up on the gens and spread progress. Eventually its bound to pop. 3 genning is barely a problem anymore, people just mald so much that its getting looked at.
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@D34D_B34TB0X said:
Feel free to comment your reasonings below.
Whether it's awful changes, awful characters, bugs/hacking, jealousy towards DBD Mobile, the idea of never being able to play as your favorite licensed character (or at least in the way you wish. i.e. Freddy.), toxic behavior, the fact that there's no real change to the game itself in the past 7 years, or just the fact that you just really miss old Dead by Daylight those 7 years, and you're burnt out. Whatever the case may be, feel free to share your thoughts and feelings.
Knight and beyond have been completely useless or broken 3 genners. Especially singularity, completely useless and unfun power with built in mechanics for survivors to remove any semblance of pressure.
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it was also changed for balance reasojns, but yes after the VTR got added it should receive of rework.
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@MrPeanutbutter said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3433107#Comment_3433107
I agree there’s no way to prevent it. My whole point is that it’s very unfair to killers yet most players accept it and survivors who use it simply tell killers to deal with it.
Given the fact killers have to deal with an incredibly unfair advantage that SWF get, they should be able to play however they want to. Yet here we are yet again nerfing tactics that the devs have said for the past 7 years are fair and legitimate parts of the game.
people don't accept that comms is really good though? Its just harder to change than face camping. You cant nerf swf without nerfing solo q, so you need to buff up to swf then buff killer accordingly. and if you havent noticed, the new hud changes and the leaks lobby hud shows thats exatly what their doing. In a year or two swf will be a lot less strong.
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it might make little logical sense, but if wesker lands his power them he should get value. Wouldn't be fair to him, hes one of those best designed in the game. Like, blight and nurse make sense to be less good in the gates but wesker? nah.
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@Nicholas said:
This is a big pain point in the game. The EGC often feels hopeless. There should never be a circumstance where The Killer can watch both gates with little to no effort and movement. The gates need some placement changes, or obstacles around the exit gate or limit the viewing distance of the indication lights on them. Make the lights only visible within a small distance of the gate, so that The Killer has to get close enough. There hasn't been much talk about exit gates and a few times the devs have indicated it's a conversation for the future. When is that future?
Its so 50/50. Blight has no issue no matter what, so if we make them closer for slow killers he becomes even stronger. But if we keep them as is then the slower ones still suck.
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@Pulsar said:
How can you even list anything when we know nothing about the system?
we can at least show what they shouldn't do so they don't do it. We know about the ranges distance, and that survivors nearby will slow the timer in some way. So we can make assumptions on the timer and show how those times would be bad so they can build off of it.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3433068#Comment_3433068
isn’t nightlight that website people insist isn’t reliable b/c it’s user-reported data?
in any event my point is that Reassurance is hardly worth running for a number of reasons. It isn’t a good anti-camp perk. Really, Kinship is better. And that isn’t good either.
Reassurance is an amazing anti camp perk wdym. 30 seconds for one one button, and if the killer just sits there thats 33% more gen progress. Repairing is the best counter to camping so the fact that reassurance lets you do that even more is really good. It also has unlimited uses, just once per hook which is very reasonable. Otherwise survivors just wouldn't die, regardless of camping.
kinship is absolutely worse for all the reasons I mention. activates on one survivor only, needs a teammate to do something. If you are being camped and that weird grab mindgame is happening then yeah kinship gets you some value, until you realize that survivor is just gonna stand there and try and unhook you instead of doing gens. That 30 seconds slows the camp value but doesnt increase team value at all. Meanwhile reassurance activates on 3 survivors, can being activated whenever you want, doesnt require teamplay (press f, go do gens) and signals to your team that they have reassurance so gens can get done (white glow).
nightlights pretty accurate, they get like 3,000,000 eligible perk appearances every month. its not perfect but its pretty good. WoO has 32% pickrate on nightlight, 32% chance for every survivor. 32% x 4 = 128% chance at least one will appear in a game. Seems accurate to me, I see at least one every match, sometimes two. Same goes for all the other perks on there, especially accurate for pre nerf dh.
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Never got why bloodlust is controversial, of all things. It never activates and only serves to fix bad map design/rng or help bad killers get at least one hit. you need to spend like, a whole minute chasing someone for bloodlust 3 which makes you move at 130%. I can see that some might think that its bad because if your looping super well, the killer goes speed and downs you but if they got bloodlust you already got so much timer for your team bc you're cracked. Any good killer will at most see bloodlust 1 once or twice a match, considering it goes away if you swing.
But then the exposure part kicks in, and the goes-away-on-a-swing is meaningless. ALL of the aforementioned points are meaningless against this. Looping super duper hard? Yeah, didnt get hit for a whole ~60s but now you go down instantly. Thats true punishment for success and reward for failure. Not a great idea. I'd like to see the idea another guy mentioned on a diff post, where killer basic attacks break stuff if you have charge.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3433058#Comment_3433058
It’s so good that it’s a rare perk. Like Kinship.
According to nightlight, reassurance has a roughly 3.5% pickrate and kinships got about a 0.5% one. Pickrate doesnt determine value anyways, reassurance isnt as fun to use as other perks so people use it less. Plus reassurance is a kinship that you get to trigger, automatically making it way better. Kinship is way less good because it relies on teammates knwoing you have it, something hard with soloq, and playing around it. Reassurance requires 2 things 1. equip 2. press f. All things triggered by the user, allowing for it to be used in scenarios its needed most instead of relying on teammates to do it for you. Kinship can also only activate on the user, meaning only one survivor can get value. Reassurance can be triggered on all survivors except yourself, with the control completely in the users hands. reassurance is goated.
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If the range goes through floors like reassurance, then killers will get punished for existing. Also, 16m is is large enough that a survivor could lead you to the hook and loop a nearby pallet. You either give up chase or the survivor self unhooks. And if you give up chase, they are for sure getting that unhook. It removes a lot of the risk of being near a hook while chased as survivor, because it now rewards you for looping near them.
Theres a hook in RPD for example. Main hall, if your standing inside the main door then its on your left. The hook in there often spawns with a pallet next to it. Right now, looping it while a surv is hooked is a bad idea because the timer will tick down and someone has to trade while the killers near, or you leave and hope a teammate handles it. With this system, looping that pallet now guarantees an unhook. I am aware that the self unhook meter slows if a survivor is near. But I'd take a guess that the base amount would be ~15s and go up like 15 every survivor nearby. So loop for 30s and that survivor jumps off. Obviously this scenario could never happen depending on how the timer changes based on nearby survivors. But in my opinion, it should just not happen when survivors are near. With this system theres no reason to go for a facecamped hook outside of endgame when you could just do gens and wait for them to unhook themselves. Having it stopped completely would encourage more efficient gameplay, rather than prolonging an unhook. This suggestion would also keep the aforementioned risk of looping near a hook that gets removed with this change, because looping near the hook would remove the system entirely.
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@Ayodam said:
It’ll probably function like Reassurance with the same restrictions, so fret naught. It’ll be just as useful as that perk. And killers can continue camping to their merry little heart’s content.
I hope it does, reassurance is a very good perk even with all its restrictions. It both counters camping and removes pressure at the click of a button, really good. Hook pressure is good bc it gets 2 of gens, hooked and unhooker. So reassurance gets you 30 seconds of 3 people repairing instead of 2 while coutnering camping. Reassurance is great game design, they really should take a page from its book with these changes.
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@AssortedSorting said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3432702#Comment_3432702
Move trash pallets to god pallet spots, at least in optimal play. Not sure how I feel about that.
better than having trash pallets stay while you get extra pallets.
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3433045#Comment_3433045
would be unfun for the face.camper yeah, for maybe 5 second and then everybody can get back to the game.
The suggested teleport happens even if the killers not camping. And even if it only happens like 5 seconds after face camping, what if a survivor just runs toward the hook? The killer cant wait to grab them for going for such a dumb unhook mid chase because they get teleported. So their only choice is to back up and let it happen. Its just bad game design.
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@Emeal said:
the flaw of the system is, they are going to be tunneled off the hook anyway.
I dislike that Idea because it would just be so unfun for the killer. Facecamping is tough to change without breaking the game and I'm surprised that they got so close to fixing it.
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@ARTRA said:
First of all, yes we all hate basement bubbas, ok with this anticamp.
Now, my fear is more about spaguetti code that BHVR have.
What happens in Game/Midwich if someone is hooked in the middle? Or just above you.
That still count as ""close"", so i just hope that new auto-unhook is good enought at close but bad enought at some distance.
It will not affect in bigger maps, my worries are more in small /2 floors maps.
Just wanted to comment it. Have a good day.
I think 16m is way too big. It should have the same range as applying reassurance, without the verticality. I see what their trying to do and I'm all for it, but this aint it chief.