Vetrathene
Vetrathene
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@Alphaphalt said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/866081#Comment_866081
Base kit change is only really an issue if you were bad at her. There are issues with Spirit and we knew that before 'stats' said so.
The base kit change is an issue as it affects her ability to get around the map and apply pressure. She's already last over 10% of her kills since the nerf, so thats a significant percentage.
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@Alphaphalt said:
Take the stats with a grain of salt. Nurse under performs because she's harder to play and as you can see she's played a decent amount. Freddy over performs because there are specific loadouts that are the issue, which should be addressed, such as Forever Freddy and Snarelusting which can get some fast downs.
What's going in is that they're averages and don't represent real matches.
I know this, but these stats are often used as the reasons for why they make decisions in regard to the game. They stated Spirit was over performing. And she is getting nerfed because of it. But why aren't killer getting buffs based on under performing then? Why was nurse nerfed, and especially so hard. People thought her add ons where the problem, so they changed those, and made her base power far far worse.
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Hard to say the reason behind how the stats play out. That would require a more in depth study that would be difficult to maintain as the game is in a constant state of flux. I would say more likely that its because as people play the game they buy more killers, and those people have access to Legion while the lower ranks often don't.
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They aren't taking the game hostage. They already lose points for staying close to the hook. Its fine. GO do gens and leave. Thats the counter.
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I miss when there was no post game chat.
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NO more killer nerfs. Yes more killer buffs. But BHVR won't do that, they don't want to make Survivors have to work very hard. Just killers.
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Yeah, I really hope BHVR sees this thread and uses it as a basis for a Legion rework. Though I admit I don't have the largest hope for it.
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I like it
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@Sign_Spinner said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/863948#Comment_863948
It's not free, they need to do gens in order to proc it and run with only 3 perks during most of the match.
I'm not talking about it procing in general, thats fine, its when they've been hooked they shouldn't be giving it after being caught by the killer. Then it is rewarding failure.
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Yeah, I don't know what BHVR is even trying to do, they are nerfing the worst killer in the game. He needs a rework like freddy got. Too bad it will take over a year to get it done if it is even on thier radar.
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My best is Pig. I play Legion for fun.
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I just think they need to revert the change where it waits for you to be unhooked to proc. It makes no sense in terms of how adrenaline works in real life, and is just giving another free thing to a survivor that got caught.
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@NoShinyPony said:
Honestly, I would prefer it if they stopped with new chapters after the current roadmaps ends and instead focussed on game health.
This. Please this.
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My two killer babies
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@Peanits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/852853#Comment_852853
If you mean to say that we wouldn't show the survival rate between SWF and solo players:
How about a breakdown of that by rank?
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@John_Doe said:
If you don't tunnel you won't get stunned
Incorrect. I have downed multiple survivors and hooked them and still gotten DS when I stumbled across the other survivor. It is not an anti-tunnel perk, it is 60 seconds of near immunity.
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I agree they do need to change maps. Many many many of them have abusable loops and bad over all gameplay design. Many people here are bitching at you to just accept it, but the game is not in the most acceptable of state. And while in many ways it is better then release, there are things that are worse. Such as smaller survivor hit boxes that created looping, and double the time it takes for a survivor to die on hook while only making gens take 10 seconds longer each. SWF is also a problem, and one that can't be fixed; but it would be nice for the killer to get some recompense for having to go against them. I was thinking about this last night, and while I don't think I would quite want to go back to release, I do miss some things back then that survivors can abuse now.
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You see, because they thought two of the Legion's add ons where a problem, they decided the best solution was to change mending times (instead of the add ons), and buff BT and nerf Legion at the same time. Because....flawed logic?
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Legion needs a complete rework. Something to do with using the other members of the Legion so it makes sense with the lore, and is more fun for everyone.
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@supersonic853 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861837#Comment_861837
Nemesis makes it so whoever stuns you with a pallet/locker or flashlight blinds you becomes the obsession. After becoming the obsession they're oblivious for a minute so the terror radius doesn't exist. So as a legion you can chase someone, get stunned and then stab them with you ability which applies the deep wounds effect (like borrowed time). The deep wounds timer only stops when you're in the killers terror radius so you can chase someone with deep wounds after they activate nemesis and die while in chase due to that effect. Beast of prey does the same thing and only requires you to get bloodlust 1 instead of getting pallet/locker stunned or flashlight blinded.
Technically Beast of Prey is Undetectable, so it applies against all survivors. Just a small thing and not really important for Legion, but I thought it merited clarification for the question.
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I like the idea of making struggling automatic so people can't just suicide on hook, it would at least save some greifing from happening.
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@John_Doe said:
What does nemisis do?
When you get stunned by a pallet or a locker, or blinded by a flashlight; the person who did it to you becomes your obsession and are oblivious to you.
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@supersonic853 said:
*pats back* there there i know how you feel. i liked those builds to but for some reason legion is the weakest killer but still needs to lose access to like 6 perks that made him niche at best.
Its all in the name of consistency, which I can respect, but they really aren't getting enough to compensate for that loss. They really need a complete rework of thier power, maybe make it have something to do with being a Legion?
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@Boss said:
Not impossible, we got fricking 4 knife wielders as well.
I require more knife wielders. Maybe a dual knife wielder.
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No.
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I'm a huge fan of it personally, once it gets going the heal on it becomes ridiculous.
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I have a great time playing against Oni as survivor. He actually makes me frightened as he roars and stomps around the map like a Sexual Tyrannosaurus.
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Yeah, Legion just needs a reworked power. There was a really good one about using the other members of the legion as traps while applying a debuff to survivors you hit that slows down action progress until healed. I thought that one was really good.
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@madds said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/894/81IVZAEUT4EF.png
Some people have fun with new Nurse. Some people don't. That's okay. Personally, I believe the place she's in is healthier for the game because it gives survivors more counterplay to her fundamentally BROKEN ability. She can completely ignore survivor defenses. Her old basekit was more fair than 5 blink or omega blink, but it was still ridiculously strong. Super good Nurse players did NOT need anything more than her base to completely decimate an optimal survivor team. Even bad Nurse players sometimes got rewarded because they constantly got a second chance at landing their blink.
Not everyone is going to agree with the changes, but a lot of people like them. The devs are not going to change anything unless they see that the Nurse is underperforming in matches. I understand that there are a lot of people around here who aren't satisfied with the Nurse changes, but you cannot say that she is criminally unfun for every killer player. She's still one of the best killers in the game, and the changes aren't so drastic that she feels like a different one either. I hate saying this to people, but please, for the love of god, just adapt to how she is now.
And yet when survivors are told to adapt they would rather cry to the devs, the devs will check if they are 'over performing' (By kills, not by actual emblem progress), and then tend to overnerf.
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@DelsKibara said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/858022#Comment_858022
Three killls usually is either a safety pip or a pip, getting a 4k isn't always a guaranteed double pip though. You also need to millk the survivors dry of emblem points.
Like I was saying, its just harder to pip as a killer.
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It does suck to be slugged while the killer looks for the other person. But its also the killer wanting to insure a pip, as its far more difficult for the killer to do that then the survivor. The emblems need to be altered is the main thing, especially with the Devs wanting two survivors to escape and two to die, and yet the emblems do not match that expectation.
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I agree there has been nerfs and buffs on both sides, and its coming closer to be balanced on both sides. It has been a rough road over the years. While it was rough for killers at the start, and they did get some buffs and changes; it became very worse once teleporting pallets and the reduction of survivor hotboxes lead to looping. It took a very long time to remove the telporting pallets, but looping is a still a problem. They added blood lust, but its not really a solution so much as a mitigating factor. Where I'm going with this is it hasn't been a straight line of nerfs and buffs. But From ym perspective, its still takes more skill and concentration to play a killer then it does a survivor. And I think killers need to be more powerful to make up for that drawback. Honestly if behavior would focus on designing new maps that weren't as exploitable, that would help more then any killer buffs they could give. And while they are at least looking at it, with most things that involve making killers stronger, they take their time. When they add things that make survivors stronger, they tend not to spend as much time on it in my opinion. There is also the comments that the devs do not play thier own game, and I have to agree with it. They are always spending time on making new content, so it is hard for them to see how the game actually plays. So they rely on data. And supposedly take input from the fog whisperers. But they don't seem to take thier opinions into account as much as I would like, on both killer and survivor main streamers. Data is thier main focus, and the problem with data is, it can be flawed, especially in a game where the power needs to be balanced for higher ranks, and you're taking data from across all ranks to make their decisions.
tl,dr The devs are trying to balance for everyone, but over reliant on game data.
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BL is just being brought in line with other exhaustion perks, calm down. It was the only one to still give a benifit while exhausted, and allowed infinite loops on some maps. Its still a fine perk.
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I approve of this idea. It would make the Legion into a fun, threatening killer that is an actual Legion.
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Legion and Wraith for sure. Poor legion. Getting nerfed as one of the worst killers in the game.
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Oni is the most badass looking killer out of the bunch to me.
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You all realize that blood echo gives hemorrhage and not mangled right? Or is there something I am missing?
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@Almo said:
We did not change Deep Wound time just to "fix" Legion. It was an idea we came up with that could help with the Legion frustration problems, but then we evaluated it and the other ramifications it would have. We decided that it was a good idea for several reasons and went with it.
You said the add-ons where the problem though. Why didn't you just change the add-ons?
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@twistedmonkey said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/853582#Comment_853582
Not all keys allow you to open the black lock either
One key does not.
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@Science_Guy said:
He's wrong, anyway. The idea that the community 'forced' SWF into the game is just a myth.The devs always planned to have an SWF feature at some point; which is common sense, because no one could possibly not expect friends to want to play together, or that people wouldn't try to find a way to play together without a dedicated feature.
And to the OP, no, the devs take any community feedback with a grain of salt. As you can see after every patch goes live and this forum generally erupts in a chorus of whining "You didn't listen to us!!!"
They sure did. It was called KYF. And then SWF was added latter because people where screaming and crying to be able to play with smaller groups of friends without caring how it would unbalance the game. And the devs went along with it, because back then they gave into every survivor demand as quickly as possible.
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I just think killers need some kind of recompense if they are going against an SWF, even if they aren't a tryhard squad, for what is an advantage and play mode that was never intented to be in the game in the first place.
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No killer is over performing with the current emblem system.
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@thesuicidefox said:
A crazy mofo that is more concerned with being scary than they are being accurate.
Not sure why the entity chose them then
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@Monlyth said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/853541#Comment_853541
Yet every Killer, on average, gets more than two kills per game, even in the red ranks. Thus, even the worst killer in the game wins more than they lose.
Survivors are only the power role if you give them room to take control of the game. You ultimately have most of the control over whether a survivor lives or dies; if so inclined, you can play Insidious Bubba and facecamp a survivor to death, and assuming you can end at least one chase before the exit gates are open, then the survivors can do nothing to prevent their teammate's death. Or if you're not satisfied with one death, you can bring an Ebony Mori and get multiple kills, quite easily.
Doing well as a survivor is never an easy task; if it was, then there would be a lot more survivors at the red ranks.
I'm not saying survivors are brain dead, they take some skill and concentration. Just not nearly as much as killer, nor are they punished as hard for making mistakes as a killer is. Also the pace of the game is dictated by the survivors and how well they play and how much presence the killer can place on the map. So without that ability, the game becomes mainly in the survivors hands.
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@twistedmonkey said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/853463#Comment_853463
A mori by design cuts down the overall objectives needed to reach a sacrifice.
The exact same statement above applies to keys if you exchange the word mori for key and sacrifice for escape.
They are equivalent as they allow both sides to reach the end goal without fullfilling the overall objective.
Both aslo have no counter unless you count not being caught or hooked or killing before they can use it.
Its only equivlanet for the ebony mori. The other two are not.
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@Monlyth said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/853399#Comment_853399
Well, I think Peanits has an excellent point here. Playing killer will always be more stressful, because it all depends on you. Nobody has your back if you mess up. It's why many of the most-played videogames are all team games; it really makes the game less stressful when you have other people to back you up if you make a mistake.
Unless you were to make killers a faceroll-easymode that can just stomp the survivors with minimal effort. But then, nobody would want to play Survivor, and a lot of killer mains would get bored if there's no challenge to it.
I think killer needs to be the power role. Sure it might be more stressful going alone no matter what, but right now the power role is the survivor. And that goes against the whole modus operandi of the game. Survivors should have to struggle to do well. Killers should too, just not as much as they currently are for a majority of them.
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@Peanits said:
It's to remove hatch standoffs. At the same time, we added the ability for the killer to close the hatch. Now that the killer can close the hatch, whoever gets there first wins.
The tooltip about the entitity being amused by hatch grabs is still there in the loading screen tips.
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@Peanits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/853332#Comment_853332
Pallet vacuums were never added, they've always been there. If you go back and watch any footage of the game at release you'll see people warp right to the far side of the pallet.
Having played since the start, I've gotta' say that it's never been easier to play killer. Even going back just a little over year ago, I used to have to deal with people teleporting to the far side of the pallet, Borrowed Time that protected both the unhooker and the person who was unhooked, DS that worked the first time you downed someone with no way to avoid it, and the list goes on.
That's not to say that it's perfect now, but to deny that it has gotten way better since would require a very selective memory. It'll likely always be more stressful just by the nature of the role; it all depends on you. You are the only one facing the four survivors. There's nobody to watch your back if you mess up.
I agree killers have gotten better. But my statement that they are far more stressful to play then survivor still stands. You make a mistake as a killer, and thats not only amplified four times, its usually a far worse punishment then when a survivor makes a mistake. So why isn't it that killers have more power to compensate?
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@Peanits said:
I would say that looking at it that way at all is the wrong way to go about it. You should never view it as "nerf killers" or "buff killers". To look at killers as a whole and make a blanket statement like that would show that you aren't really putting any thought into it. You should always consider things on an individual basis, whether that's a killer, a perk, an item, or anything else.
e.g. "Mettle of Man OP" isn't a reason to nerf survivors across the board.
Its not, but there are many other justifactions for making survivors less powerful. The main one being...they should not be the power role and currently are. Secondly in this upcoming path, TWO killers are getting nerfs, right after nurse was overnerfed. Third, it took over a year to get a reworked Freddy, so that dosen't inspire confidince that the dev team is working on trying to fix weaker killers quickly to at all. Third, map design continues to be pretty but imablanced in terms of gameplay. The new yamoaka map, while at least smaller, is still a playground for survivors to run and hide in easily.
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@AkimboJEsus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/853307#Comment_853307
Survivors have gotten some huge nerfs to perks and pallet vacuums. I would say it's a lot easier to be a killer right now.
Then you don't play killer much to at all I would wager. Killer is far more stressful then playing survivor, I can tell you. As a survivor you only need to keep track of yourself really, unless the killer is using certain perks you will know where your team is when they need you. Second they did nerf vacuum pallets, but that was after they where added into the game in the first place.