Sonzaishinai
Sonzaishinai
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Yes and no.
We should be allowed to say what's wrong with the game. Feedback is important for a games growth.
I just wish the community wouldn't start a riot for every little thing they believe is wrong with the game.
The devs don't really listen to us but when 95% of the community delivers their feedback like a tantrum throwing 5 year old would i can't really blame them.
Maybe if we didn't resort to review bombing in the past or if there weren't channels whose sole content was bashing the devs they would be more inclined to care
Truelly they are not the devs we wanted but the devs we deserve.
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@ZaKzan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1951763#Comment_1951763
Determining strength off of higher skill levels creates a fair playing field in which the difference between two players isn't some stupid gimmick or mechanic, but skill, effort, and dedication.
As humans, we psychologically feel a loss much more acutely than a win. This is an issue with imbalanced games. You can win most of your games, and only lose a few, but the problem arises in how you lose those few games. This is what makes losing in DBD so horrible, because you tend to lose very badly. That loss leaves a much more potent impact on you psychologically.
It's actually not a silly way to look at a pvp game, it's actually the GOLD STANDARD for pvp game design. Generally speaking, pvp games that follow this formula are pvp games that last a long time as they have a healthy playerbase. When you lose in a balanced game, you go 'that person was so good.' When you lose in an unbalanced game, you go '(insert gimmick here) is so stupid, I would have won without that.'
You have to balance around things that break the game. Things that break the game are usually best exploited by the best players in the game. This also has the added benefit of giving the devs a logical reason for changing things, and there is pretty much no counter argument to it.
Fair enough, I can't argue with that logic. Still feels weird to call Clown or Legion weak when there are people that can just dominate match after match with them.
If you take what you said and the video into context of dbd it would be more a case or survivors being overtuned as oppose to Legion or Clown being undertuned right?
Idk dbd is just such a weird case with it being assymetrical and the matchmaking being what it is.
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@ZaKzan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1951691#Comment_1951691
The vast majority of survivors are so bad that it's hard to get any data from games with them. If it was 1v1, it would be a lot better, but because there's 4 survivors the odds of having one or two bad survivors in a game to swing it in the killer's favor is higher than getting 4 decent survivors.
The issue is that the game coddles survivors and holds their hand all the way, so there's absolutely no incentive to get better as survivor, and you can easily get to high ranks without even interacting with the killer. You will escape at least half of your games if you do nothing but do gens and hide from the killer, you don't need to interact with the killer in any way. If the killer finds you, you can just sit there and let them hook you. You will still win about half your games if you do this method.
In determining the strength of a killer, you have to take a skilled and knowledged killer and put them up against a skilled and knowledged survivor. A skilled and knowledged survivor team will absolutely mop the floor with any killer player playing any killer at the highest possible skill level in the game. So using a metric like vs a whole team of skilled survivors is pointless in determining the strength of a particular killer as survivors are collectively many times stronger than any killer in the game.
What makes legion a bad killer is that they have to adhere to the rules of the game, and the rules of the game are severely survivor sided. This means having to actually chase survivors and catch up to them, allowing them to loop and get to pallets and windows. Legion's power isn't strong enough to interrupt survivor pathing. The strongest killers in the game have the ability to reach out and touch survivors to interrupt their pathing, to get them before they can make it to a pallet, or to circumvent the injured state entirely with a one hit down.
I have always found that a silly way of looking at the strengt of a killer. You can beat 95% of survivors but when you face one swf group with 10000 hours combined and get bodied the killer is obviously bad and should never be played.
The problem with looking at it like that is that the vast mayority of players aren't skilled and knowledgable. Judging killers strengt like that is only usefull for those who are skilled and knowledgable. It just gives the wrong idea to those who don't have 3k+ hours.
If you can reliably win against avarage survivors the killer isn't weak. And if you get dunked by the best of the best survivors for most people that's more that they aren't the best of the best of killers. They would have lost regardless of playing to some tierlist
Looking how viable killers are in tournament levels of play is only usefull for tournement level of play players.
For the rest we really need to rank them against what you actually go up against when you play the game at home. And concidering that. Neither Clown nor Legion is weak.
Not the best ofcourse. But certainly not a handicap like people want you to believe
Most people ofcourse don't want to admit when they get destroyed by the navy seals swf group that maybe they were just better then them and rather blame it on the killer they are playing
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Inb4 "doesn't count, survivors were pota... ow too late already happened.
This is why people don't bother with video evidence of things being better then people think.
I once showed a 4 hour video of somebody winning 20 games in a row on rank 1 as Legion to show they aren't that bad and apperently all 80 of those survivors were potatoes
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Using teleports to mindgame a chase is pretty neat. Outside of that. Idk
I miss old freddy. He was terrible but fun
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I'm just going to fruitlessly hope for chucky again.
I wouldn't even mind if it was the robot remake version
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I would find it hilarious if Chucky's pick up animation was him voodooing survivors to make them hook themself
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@trokx said:
@Sonzaishinai why are you triggered by something I said to someone else? Snowflake alert geeeeez can’t be so sensitive man
I'm not triggered. Just informing you.
I see your new to the forums so i want to let you know that if you formulate your topics like that you're going to get nasty responses.
No hard feelings
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He doesn't reverse the controls but he does mess with your vision so that could be what happened.
Not that the controls were reversed but that you couldn't see where you were going
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@trokx said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1951350#Comment_1951350
Ok thanks for explaining and doing so in a CIVIL manner lmfao can all killers move without facing a direction bc I don’t play as a killer whatsoever
You probably would have gotten your civil answer sooner if you asked the question in a civil manner.
Also play killer. You can only learn so much from playing one side.
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@Dwight_Fairfield said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1950056#Comment_1950056
Myers main here. Most killers can be looped into oblivion, Myers is no different from most in that regard. But at least in tier 3 he has a faster vault speed and the biggest lunge in the game.
Getting tier 3 is not difficult. Heck even getting to tier 2 in the beginning is not hard. I don't understand people who say it is. Unless you're facing the most immersed survivors in the world its not a struggle. Yes there is a limit to how many times he can get to tier 3, but if you've reached that limit, and you still have survivors left alive then you are playing him really badly. By the time I've juiced out the survivors most if not all of them are dead.
Its not a case of not wanting to see something, its a case of it not being a reality for some people, myself included. I don't experience these setbacks people like yourself say you experience playing him. That's not me saying he's a top tier killer. I rate him a solid mid tier killer. But he is not even a contender for worst killer, in my opinion. Not even close.
Don't get me wrong. I don't think he's bad.
No killer in this game is really bad. It's just when i play him and stare at people. all i can think of is i could be feral frenzying right now. Or chainsawwing them. doing anything. It's not difficult to get to tier 3 but it is time doing absolutly nothing
Even best case scenario you stun yourself 6 seconds before becoming a normal killer
I am being a bit hypocritical right now as i don't play him very often. Guess it's just that extreme passive playstyle i don't like.
Just my opinnion. nowhere near fact
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@Phasmamain said:
This may be unpopular but I’ve always thought pig was the worst killer.
Bad antiloop
Bad stealth
Rng heavy slowdown
How people think she’s good is beyond me
Personally I always thought Myers was and is the worst killer. And I never really understood how not more people think this.
Zero antiloop
Negative slowdown as he has to stun himself to become a standert killer.
Then he has to stun himself some more just to get the expose status effect. For 60 seconds. And to make matters worse there is a limit to how many times you can get the exposed status effect.
Like he's iconic and i guess that's why people don't want to see this but at a pure mechanical point of view he is miles below other killers
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As a Legion main i understand your pain.
It also frustrates me to no end when i see countless people calling Legion the worst killer in the game.
The people who call killers the worst are also ussually the people that never play them.
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@Irisora said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1948951#Comment_1948951
That doesn't take away the big quota of negligence they committed this time in several aspects. They never ######### it up this much and i hope they learn for once that releasing an untested product will always end like this.. PTB should be a real thing to hear the community and fix stuff, not some early preview of what they are doing.
Didn't say it takes that away.
Just saying that because they are fixing it on hotfix 2 and not 1 doesn't mean they are postponing it like some people are thinking.
Let's be angry for the right reasons and not the dumb ones
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@IsJustMe said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1948950#Comment_1948950
this i have not written dear
and anyway..... with my "wisdom of programming" like you say i fed my family
No offence but i'm sceptical that someone who programs for a living does not comprehend that they can release fixes while fixing something else and does not understand that the 3th digit in the version number of the game are reserved for hotfixes.
Also they can't do 3 day patches. Each patch has to be approved by sony and microsoft which takes longer then 3 days. Something a programmer should know as well
Not to mention that the whole hitbox issue is a desinc problem so there is no "saying ######### as killer" cause on the killer screen everything look normal
If you are programming something, it certainly isn't games
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You use them both.
Purple bottles allows you to chase 100% faster then usual for 2 seconds + how much time the survivor was in the cloud.
Yellow bottles allows you to chase 75% faster for 5 seconds + how long you were in the cloud
Combined they allow you to chase 175% faster. Add 25% when you run bleach
The fastest way to catch a survivor now is to throw a yellow bottle and a purple one while you walk through the yellow gas
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@lav3 said:
Ikr. They mentioned hit registration as priority issue.
And they are leaving it till 2nd hotfix. So disappointed...
That it comes in the second hotfix does not mean it's not a priority
If it takes 2 weeks to fix the hitboxes but they can fix some other stuff in the first week why would they postpone those fixes for no apparent reason
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What would you rather have?
a 4.5.1 that fixes some of the issues in a week and then a 4.5.2 that fixes the hitboxes in 2 weeks
Or have the 4.5.1 in 2 weeks and leave a couple of issues in the game a week longer for no reason whatsoever.
I get it, they messed up and we are angry but can we keep reasonable please.
They are not postponing the hitbox fix. They are just fixing things while working on the hitbox fix
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"I’ll do my best to try and get them back on their feet and away from the killer"
This is the mistake you make. You can be 95% sure the killer will be around the slug. Just don't come anywhere near them. You can walk away faster then they can crawl so as long as your not right there it shouldn't be a problem that they crawl in your direction.
I feel that not having aura reading will hurt way more regular survivor then it will punish troll survivors
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I mean it's not fine. It doesn't need to happen constantly to be an issue.
Are people overreacting? Yes, welcome to the community.
Does that mean there is no issue? No, getting hit from miles away sucks even if it only happens once every other game
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@Ryuzaki said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1947323#Comment_1947323
At this point they may as well rollback this broken update, it's the only viable solution I can see.
They can't roll it back. Every patch needs to be approved by sony and microsoft and that takes time. They would have to wait untill the roll back is approved and then wait again untill the actual fix get approved. That would just delay the actual fix
By the time it gets approved they might as well have fixed it. Not to mention how that would be a finiancial disaster.
As for the op why would they not fix the things they can before releasing the hitbox fix?
Would you rather get fixes for some stuff in a week and then the fix for the hitbox in 2 weeks or would you rather they all fixed it in 2 weeks and just let some stuff be broken for another week without reason?
Like i get it. They messed up big time but it's not as easy as just pressing ctrl+z a couple of times to get it back to what it was
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People have been talking about devour undying the second it was revealed it kept the stacks.
You would have seen it a ton even if there weren't youtube video's off it. Atleast we change our meta once in a while.
Calling killers predictable is hypocrisy to the max
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Dead hard for distance still does what it's suppose to. so useless is not the word i would use.
But yes being exhausted on the floor is beyond frustrating
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Simplest advice i can give you is to learn how to run in a straight line when your uninjured.
Never try to spin a nurse attack. Just prepare to use the speedboost from getting hit to get as far as possible.
Same princliple when she misses an attack. Try to have a los blocker if you can but the simplest thing you can do is just create distance.
Long distance blinks are hard so most nurses will just blink to reduce the distance and then start chasing again. This is very time consuming so that's one simple thing you can do to make the nurses life harder.
Not always the best thing you can do but it will never be a bad thing to do vs nurses
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Seeing how clown chooses where the gas goes and usually goes there himself the survivor generally should never get the speedboost without getting hit in the process.
And even if you mess up you still benefit from it slightly more then the survivor.
In general getting the speedboost and slowing survivors at the same time is the fastest way to catch them right now.
It does require some setup though but it is worth it. Clowns who ignore the sonic tonic are really handicapping themselfs
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People really underestimate how much difference a small distance like deadhard matters.
The only way to beat deadhard for distance is to always catch people of guard and never let them loop.
Which just isn't reasonable against survivors with decent map awareness.
Honestly it wouldn't be so bad if the exhaustion timer was a bit longer. Survivors bassicly have it available every chase.
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There are huge desync issues going on with the update. From your view you saw stunning the clown right before he hit you.
From the clowns view he hit you right before you threw the pallet.
I would hold off to playing survivor or play supersafe. imagine the killer being a bit closer to you then you can see
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Treatening with mori's just isn't the same anymore man
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The point of deep wounds is to stall. every deep wound you apply is a survivor not working on a gen for atleast 12 seconds or 8 if another survivor mends
That's 15% of one gen progression you deny. or 17% in case of another survivor doing the mending
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It's strong but inconsistant.
It also has a huge tell now sadly. just walk next to a dull totem. If you got cursed Undying is in play and with that most likely Devour too.
Once people figure that out it's going to drop in effectiveness really hard
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I'm personally very happy with the clown rework and i find him a blast to play now. It added so much depth to his kit now.
I also believe the clown is way better then people give him credit
Some things to clear up maybe. Nobody here is argueing that clown is the next nurse or spirit. We are saying he's not weak. we are not saying he's the strongest thing in this game
People asking for video evidence is a moot point for this community. Show any video of you doing well and you'll just get the "the survivors were just bad" excuse. Not realising that when you do good as killer you make the survivors look bad.
After playing with him more and doing some math on the sonic tonic Clown is very much a threat now if the player knows how to use him. He will probably fall slightly below deathslinger in terms of power. very strong chase power. little to no map pressure.
Clown needs you to perform well and do so as soon as possible. He's quite unfriendly to learn because messing up means not getting downs means not getting pressure. And i guess that's why people say he's so bad.
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They both do things differently so it's a bit hard to say.
Clown attemps to blitzkrieg survivors with his high chase power, creating pressure by getting downs fast
Legion gathers information and stalls the game while keeping everybody vulnarable.
Neither was ever the worst killer in the game. Especially after clowns rework they both can compete if you are willing to learn to be good with them.
I'd probably still give it to Legion but I'm biased
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"oh get off your soapbox! It’s a game, people can play it however they want! If occasionally I want to farm afk while on a conference call I have every right to. I didn’t sign some imaginary contract for playing an online game."
... yes you did. You signed a very real contract when you bought this game. In which you agreed they can ban your account if you don't follow their rules.
An adult that goes on conference calls should really know that
As far as AFKing goes it isn't a bannable offence unless you get reported for it a very large amount of times. So it's not actually a real issue unless you go overboard with it.
But people are having a point though
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Killers can avoid flashlight by looking up or down. You should only flashlight them when they are stuck in a animation such pallet breaking.
The saves are tricky to pull of but they it's one of the most powerfull thing a survivor can do. It's bassicly a free ds when you pull it of. Completly denied the last chase the killer had.
In the avarage match it indeed doesn't come up always but they are pretty good boldness farmers and houdinni builds with flashlights and iron will are just so fun.
They are in a pretty good place now. Has it's uses without being overbearing
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1942404#Comment_1942404
Or you just throw on flask of bleach and you don't need to bother with that nonsense.
The flask of bleach allows you to chase 125% faster as opposed to the purple's gas normal 100% faster
Sonic tonic+purple gas allows you to chase 175% faster, it's a clear winner
That said nothing is stopping you from putting flask of bleach and combining them anyway to chase 200% faster
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As others said Survivors don't typically get to use the yellow gas unless they want to walk right into clowns arms so this bassicly reads as free aura reading for you. It's very strong actually
Cigar box: for the giggles. It would have been interresting if it actually switched the gasses along with the color. So that the yellow gas with the 2.5 seconds delay slows and the purple one gives you the speed boost without delay. Would be a interresting other way to play.
Pinky finger is indeed a shame. but it's not that bad. I'm way more afraid of clowns using their bottles actual effect then the clowns that try to fish for that exposed status.
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The yellow bottles should not be used for mobility alone as they make little to no difference. The only exeption to this rule is if you are going somewhere where you know a survivor is as reducing the distance between you before a chase even starts is very much worth a bottle
Purple gas makes you chase 100% faster, yellow gas 75% faster but a longer duration and if you have them combined you chase 175% faster then normal.
So you want to try to use them both as much as possible. as a bread and butter throwing a yellow gas at the survivor and then a purple gas as you run through the yellow one is the fastest way to catch up to someone.
It all does depend on situation from situation sometimes it's not worth it to use the yellow bottles if the pretty long start up time makes it awkward in confined spaces.
One thing you got to give it to this rework. It really makes the clown a lot more interesting to play.
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Predropping pallets is the big one. And with predrop i mean dropping them before the chase even starts.
When in close to medium distance you can't react to the shot so it will be a case of wether or not deathslinger misses. But that doesn't mean you can't make it harder for him. running in a SMALL serpentine motion and randomly alternating between right and left can be the difference between a missed shot and a sure hit.
Do note small serpentine motion. I see survivors all the time trying to dodge deathlingers needle like they were huntresses beachballs. You don't need to do full 90 degree turns to dodge deathslingers shots. Just small 10ish degrees turns can make it a lot harder for deathslinger.
Other then that always try to keep as much line of sight blockers as possible and remember that you don't need 5 minute chases vs deathslinger. Deathslinger is slow in everything he does so a 1 minute chase for him is almost as bad as a 2 minute chase for other killers
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Also next time you play clown, look down
Thank me later
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I really like the clown rework. I'm happy they didn't just pull a freddy and slapped on some strong mechanic abilities and called it a day.
Trying to figure out where to place which gas is really fun and the payoff is there for the most part.
The rework didn't really make him that much stronger though. It improved his already strong chase game but left his weakness of map presence intact.
For some people that will probably be a bummer but personally i prefer fun B tier killer to strong but boring A tier killers.
If i would change something i would like to see how it would be if when the gasses are placed on top of eachother that they create a chemical explosion instead of just cancelling eachother out
Would probably be too strong but it sounds cool
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@Terro said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1936853#Comment_1936853
Then your direct comparison doesn't quite reflect that and you'd have to calculate if the speed gain vs reload time vs reloading more often is worth it overall. Just remember all it takes is using 1 bottle and you're back to 1 bottle per second reload time and chances are you're reloading more often. If it's yellow that one bottle gained you about 2.3m over 5 seconds, which is a time save of 0.5 seconds, which is kinda why the antidote is so meh.
I think it's just the placebo effect and the fact that the change feels more interactive.
You did make a good point about losing the initial slowdown so let's rewind the 10m distance scenario a bit
It takes 2.5 seconds for the tonic to activate so the distance between killer and survivor when the bottle hits is 10+(2.5 times 0.6)= 11.5 meters
You can probably keep the survivor slowed for the whole duration so with 2 bottles of purple gas you catch up in 9.6 seconds
With the combination you have the 2.5 seconds before the tonic kicks in + the 6 seconds for the last 10m =8.5 seconds
So the combination still comes out ahead but not as much as i initially thought. The numbers will also be slightly closer cause the tonic doesn't last 6 seconds
Also worth noting that with 2 purple bottles the survivor was able to make 32,5 m distance (3.4m/s times 9.6)
While with the combination they are able to make 10m for the first 2.5 seconds and 20.4m for the last 6 for a total of 30.4 meters.
Which is indeed half a second saved. So i guess we are both right. The combination is better but it is pretty meh.
I still think it's worth to use the tonic but it's not as big of a difference then i first thought.
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@Terro said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1936778#Comment_1936778
You're not including the time loss of not hitting the survivor right away with just the purple gas when throwing the yellow gas instead. You lose out on about 2.5 seconds of slowdown, which places that 6 seconds much closer to the 8.33 seconds. The problem is the time it takes to set things up, bottles used and reloads tends to minimalize the gains of the rework. Sure it's new and slightly stronger than not using them if you use them correctly but it's not exactly monstrously improved, which is why the 1.3m over 5 seconds difference I mentioned matters. 1.3m is about 1/3 of a second of distance for survivor or in other words that's the hit window you've managed to shrink. 1/3 of a second.
The yellow gas is used mostly for loops and in case LoS blockers stop you from hitting the survivor with purple gas.
In my experience using both gasses is massivily more effective then just using the purple one.
That said it is only out for 2 days so who knows
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If I'm not mistaken you can hit the survivor to stop the screaming after a hook
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God i only see the same killers in top rank we should be able to ban them.
60 minute queue into a rank 16 trapper game
surprised pickachu face
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@Terro said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1933999#Comment_1933999
You gain about 1.3m extra distance over 5 seconds compared to just using the gas by itself... A lot of people aren't saying purple gas is better. They're saying that the chances of failure vs the gains made by using both isn't really worth it and the gains of using the antidote isn't much if anything.
Normal chasing: 4,6m/s clown minus 4m/s survivor= 0.6 meters/second distance gained
Purple gas: 4,6m/s minus 3,4m/s= 1,2m/s so you catch up twice as fast
Yellow gas: 5,06m/s minus 4m/s= 1,06m/s about 75% faster
Purple gas + yellow gas= 5,06 m/s minus 3,4 m/s= 1,66m/s gained
Thats 275% faster chases for the time both gasses are in affect.
Like i said using it to gain distance is a waste. But dbd isn't a race game. The amount of distance traveled doesn't matter as much as how fast you close the distance between you and your prey
As an example 10 m distance means
Normal chases: about 16,5 seconds
Purple: 8.33 seconds
Yellow: 9.4 seconds
Both: 6 seconds
It makes a difference. And a pretty big one at that
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I don't mind the new UI. I'm loving the clown changes and outside of not being able to buy Yui with shards i haven't seen any mayor bugs.
So if the next chapter is looking good i will probably buy it. Personally i see no reason not too
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I kinda like the new one too tbh. Took me one game to get used to it.
That said i am used to letting my eyes dart around searching for information.
Apperently some people are getting eye strains and headaches because of it.
So yeah. there are legitimate complaints but it really didn't deserve this outburst
Hook state counter seems kinda pointless though. I thought it would track how many hooks you actually got so you could keep track of your emblem but when a survivor goes through hook states it also updates
so it's more of a "Look at you champ, you're doing great" thing rather then an actual usefull thing
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I would prefer the option.
Cause while the old UI was more effective at what it had to do. I do like the freshness the new one gives
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It would help if there was some noise indicator. these things are quite hard to find.
The ones i found were all in loops though so you probably don't need to look around every nook and cranny
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Personally i got used to it after 1 match.
Apperently it causes headaches for some people cause of how much eyemovement they have to do now