Reinami
Reinami
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- Reinami
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@dance said:
Update 7.6.0 brings The Unknown into The Fog. With three new Perks and a Killer Power, UVX, we would love to know how it feels to play, or against, The Unknown.
The only thing i'd change is:
- Make it so the survivor has to keep looking at the killer, you shouldn't be able to remove weakness from behind a wall. It's weird that looking for a split second removes like 3 seconds of weakness.
- Make it so direct hits don't go through the survivor anymore, and explode. Guaranteeing that they get both the hinder and weakness or damage. Right now its just too hard to hit sometimes and direct hits feel really underwhelming especially given how hard they are to land.
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The general point here is, make it so if you don't take gen defense perks, you don't feel so helpless as killer, but if you stack the common 4 slowdown perk build we have now:
- Corrupt
- PainRes
- Pop
- Grim
Instead of getting 100% regression on pain res, and another probably 100-150% on total pop uses, plus 120 seconds early of having to patrol less gens plus having 88 seconds of all gens blocked from grim, you end up more with:
- 60 seconds of blocked gens early
- 60% regression with pain res
- 30-45% regression with pop
- Some regression with grim
- and 40 second blocking with grim.
Significantly weaker, but then you have a much better basekit.
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@Valuetown said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3673530#Comment_3673530
Again, you aren't reading what I'm writing. Working as a team vs team sport like you mentioned are two different things. If the devs want survivors to work as a team in more ways than just existing on the same map as one another, add methods for them to do so in the base game.
Also your comment about killing a single survivor is quite humorous, considering that proxy camping and tunneling (which is killing a single survivor to win the game) is the most popular thing to do on killer right now, even in comp dbd. I'm honestly curious if we're talking about the same game or if you're just trolling me 😂
I am reading what you are writing, sure team sport, work as a team. I used "team sport" there in quotes, i wasn't being literal. The point being that the point of the game is that survivors are supposed to work as a team.
Now in terms of "the devs need to add things" they do. There are tons of aura perks that show your teammates what you are doing, show you what your teammates are doing, there are items that allow you to mark locations on the map, there are tons of coordination things. Yeah they aren't voice chat, and this is precisely why i think they need to separate the queues so that SWF get their own queue, because it IS an entirely different game.
As for your last bit, i think you and i would both agree that camping and tunneling aren't fun things right? So why should those existing justify the game being unbalanced? I think things would be in a much better state if we eliminated those things entirely and balanced the game around hooks and chases instead of kills and made camping and tunneling completely impossible. Wouldn't you agree?
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@Valuetown said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3673520#Comment_3673520
Did you read anything that I wrote? I'm going to guess no, because if you did, you would have noticed that I said: "add what most every other team sport has: communication during the match." Do you know what LoL, CS, AND OW have? That's right!! Communication during the match!! Text chats, contextual pings, voice chat!! All of which dbd has nothing of by itself to help non-4 man swfs communicate during a match. So yet again, no dbd cannot be considered a team sport until a feature like that is added.
I also never said that the survivors should be stronger than the killer. I said killers can make more mistakes to illustrate the point that just because "average" survivors are paired with an "average" killer, doesn't mean somehow the killer forgets how to play. They still know what they're doing to get downs and hooks, and can make more mistakes vs a survivor (which all survivor skill comes down to is macro and looping) all of which an average player lacks skill in vs high mmr, meaning it's even worse in the disparity of skill level the more average you get in mmr.
Sure, they do. But it is still a team game. The devs have even stated as much before, that survivors are a team. if they balanced the game so that a single survivor is as strong as the killer, then a killer should win if they kill a single survivor. But they don't. So that logic is flawed still.
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@Valuetown said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3673409#Comment_3673409
This whole comment is fundamentally wrong on every level imaginable.
Sure, survivors need to work as a team, but calling survivor a team sport? Do you think everyone queueing up as survivor is a 4 man swf with full discord comms and clock callouts? I'm sure killers would love to blame their losses on 4 man swfs every time but come on😂 Even as a duo queue, which most survivor groups are, you are only communicating with 1/3 of your teammates. You want to call survivor a team sport, add what most every other team sport has: communication during the match. I'm not saying go so far as to add voice chat, but add contextual pings or pre-recorded survivor voice lines that can be used to coordinate. And no, seeing someone on a generator with the new UI, and hoping your teammates can infer and guess who's going to go for the unhook or take chase is not communication in the way you're thinking it is. It would also help to shrink the gap between the solo q and swf experience for both survivor and killer, and help make meaningful perk adjustments that feel fair no matter what size of group you're queueing up as.
With a nurse profile pic, I'm sure you're aware that most good nurses, blights, spirits, weskers, etc. can absolutely get downs within 30 seconds of hooking someone. The issue with you comparing "power levels" in the way you are is that 1) the mmr system is not doing what it should be doing, so that is a moot point anyway, but also, 2) killers are able to make 10 times more mistakes than survivors, and still win the match. If a survivor makes one mistake, that has essentially sealed the fate of the rest of the team. For one mistake. A survivor who is "average" that can't loop a tile, gets stuck on objects, and doesn't know what half the killer roster does vs an "average" killer who just holds w, doesn't mind game, and presses m1 when they're close enough isn't as even as you think it is.
The only thing I will agree with is sure, the top 0.000000001% survivor players (who are 4 man swfs) can escape almost every game no questions asked. But comp dbd vs high mmr are miles apart in terms of skill level and coordination. To equate comp dbd (high level), where the 4 man swf eats, sleeps, and breathes dbd (and can still lose by the way!) vs a high mmr match, which can have people who shouldn't be there with under 80 hours with the way the mmr system works, is something I can't say anyone with any sort of intellectual honesty would use as a valid argument to say the survivor experience is in a good place.
By literal design, survivors are 4 players and the killer is 1. By DESIGN the killer should be stronger than an individual survivor. Otherwise the game may as well just be a 1v1. So therefore it stands to reason that survivors are TEAM. Yeah, solo queue exists. But do you think that other team based games ONLY have queuing as a 5 man? LoL has solo queue, CS has solo queue, overwatch has solo queue, and those are team-based games.
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@Valuetown said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3672918#Comment_3672918
I have no control over my teammates. But that's besides the point because killer has received so many passive buffs and maps have been adjusted to favor killer for the past two years since 6.1.0, making it harder for an average survivor player to survive. If you genuinely think that an average survivor lasts longer that 25 seconds in chase, I don't know what to tell you. Just because you and I can last more than a minute in chase, doesn't mean the average player can, and a single perk shouldn't be able to carry a killer player just by doing their main objective of hooking survivors.
Right, but playing survivor by design is a "team sport". If your teammates do badly, your team should lose. If you don't like the team aspect of survivor, then you probably should try playing killer instead where its all on you without having to worry about a team.
And you talk about the "Average" survivor player. But at the high level this game still heavily favors survivors, as comp games often show. But you may point out "average" survivors. But "average" survivors are going against "average" killers. So you don't have to worry about the high level killers who are benefitting from a 0.3 second difference in landing a hit, which realistically isn't affecting things much at that "Average" level.
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@Mercês said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/RCTQKUZHH0YY/aaa.png
I mean, if they are going to allow me to unhook, can we at least have a fair range? This way the killer can stay at a safe distance and only get close to hook when chasing a survivor.
I just wish I had a perk to pause my struggle. Problem solved. Anti-camp perk. Balanced. Healthy.
The feature is not "Anti-camp" it is "Anti-Facecamp"
By design, it is doing exactly what it is supposed to here, by preventing the killer from facecamping. Additionally, it does look like your AFC bar is filling, but slowly because another survivor is nearby.
Also, i'd argue here that the killer is actually throwing the game here for your team. You are on second hook, so thats 60 seconds before you die. The killer is camping here there are 2 gens. Your team could probably finish at least 1 of those gens, and potentially both of them if there was any previous progress and get 1-2 of them out. Yeah you'd probably die, but camping here is actually probably not a good idea. But your team is making it work here by not playing against the camping properly.
They also could slam 1 gen together, then do a hook trade since it looks like neither of them are on death hook and do the same thing again if the killer continues to camp if you all wanted to try to get 3 out, but its very risky.
Now, i know you'll say, "we can't know they are camping" and i agree with that, its personally why i think kindred should be basekit, but that's a different discussion.
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@jonifire said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3673323#Comment_3673323
This would be unnecessary. It still does only activate once and you aren‘t guaranteed to get to the endgame. If you manage to get to the endgame you should get something by this perk.
The Freddy wake up can be removed.
It would be similar if NOED for example worked after the fact. Imagine you hit a survivor, and then the last gen pops, then that survivor just drops. It doesn't make sense that it "stores" the effect, especially since when it does it has little counter. You hook the survivor, then if they get unhooked they are guaranteed to get out, because they get both the heal and the speed boost, plenty of speed to get from one corner of the map all the way to the opposite corner if they need to.
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@KaTo1337 said:
Live in the livestream its added to the roadmap.
My wish: You dont wake up when the perk triggers.
;-)
I suspect they'll keep the effect relatively strong, it'll still heal and give a sprint burst (potentially it will no longer be tied to exhaustion) in return, they'll make it so if you are being carried or on a hook, it doesn't "bank" the effect, then you get it after you are unhooked. As well as making it so it doesn't remove killer powers like freddy.
That would strike a pretty good balance i think.
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@Valuetown said:
All I'm going to say is if a match is at a point where the killer needs to hit through a heal tech at the exit gate to potentially get another hook, they've already lost the game. Giving them a free pity hook because "they should have the authority to pick up" is not where I want this game to go. Not only is it wasting time for everyone involved, but if the killer didn't gain enough pressure to avoid a heal tech scenario with multiple people, they shouldn't get a potential free kill out of it. And for the inevitable "well 4 adrenalines," the killer let 4 survivors get to endgame, and the perk that a survivor has to earn by making it to endgame, that only triggers once, was awarded to them.
But that's not a free hook, if anything its a free escape. The killer had to work for and earn that down.
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@Valuetown said:
If everything else about the game stays the same (because I'd prefer to have other changes than what I'm about to suggest, but we can only expect so much) I'd rather have the scourge hook logic adjusted so that multiple scourges can't spawn right next to each other. Keep 4 scourge hooks, adjust spawn logic, and also make the regression 25% of current progress on the most progressed gen.
For the spawn logic, make it so that when scourge hooks are selected, unless there are no other hooks available, prevent an additional hook from spawning within 32 meters of another. Killer carry speed is 92%, and at 16 seconds to carry, the killer can almost travel 59 meters in that time. It would help solve not having a scourge available at all parts of the map as killer, and it would also benefit sabo builds if a survivor so chose to run one, as sabo'ing a scourge would be an actual meaningful play, since another hook cannot spawn right next to the one that got sabo'd.
For 25% regression of current as opposed to 25% regression of max, there is nothing more annoying on survivor than when the killer snowball starts because pain res exists and just carries the game for the killer. Once one person is hooked, the game essentially enters a standstill with pain res (and/or pop) in play. 25% of a gen is 22.5 seconds for one survivor. Once a survivor is hooked, another survivor is being chased, another survivor is getting the unhook, and that leaves only one survivor that can work on gens. In your average game of dbd, that next person being chased is going down within 30 seconds, and getting hooked on another scourge hook. Within that time, that one survivor has barely made any progress on the gen that was scourged initially, and guess what, it's getting scourged again, putting the gen progress right back to where it was after it was scourged initially. I personally don't think this is fun for anyone involved, killer or survivor.
The survivor and killer experience is nose-diving, and I'd argue that this is one of the perks to blame. It's a band aid solution to bhvr's refusal to iterate on their base game mode, and the gen regression meta has always been the most stale experience I've ever had in any game. I've been a strong advocate of multiple win conditions for killer and survivor that don't involve hooks or escaping through exit gates, but considering PC doesn't have loadout previews in lobby after almost 7 and a half years, I'm not holding my breath that those changes are coming any time in the next decade.
If you are having survivors go down every 22.5 seconds, painres or no, you are gonna lose. You should still be able to outrepair the painres.
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@NAERUUU said:
I will do it.
The map is good.
The killer is fine, funneh, creepy with good power, nice skill cap (don't care about the tier list)
Survivor is nice.
Nice perks overhall (don't care about the tier list)
I buy every chapter. Only one i didn't buy was twins in protest for how broken of a state they were in when they came out.
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@DyingWish92 said:
You solo queue players know exactly what I'm talking about. Game starts. Killer is chasing a teammate. You've got 75%-90% of a gen done. Your teammate goes down after an okay chase. The hook happens, bam pain res on your 90% done gen. All of a sudden you've got a teammate on a hook, 5 gens still left, and the killer is now chasing someone else while you have to do a good chunk of your gen all over again, or the killer comes for you and that gen regresses all the way and you GET NO PROGRESS and you're whole team is now way behind.
This exact scenario plays out in like 40-50% percent of my solo queue games it is literally demoralizing seeing that first pain res hit before you get that first gen done. It seems to start the domino affect of pain. I play both sides equally and I'd equate it to 2-3 gens being done before your first hook when playing killer.
Every once in a while you get a start where 3 survivors start on separate gens and you can bypass this, but that's rare in solo queue for survivors to stick gens early like that.
Right, and as killer you lose 2-3 gens during your first chase. It's basically how this game is designed, the first chase dictates what happens 90% of the time assuming everyone plays well. If the killer gets a fast down, its gonna be an uphill battle. If they don't, they lose 3 gens in the first chase and its a tunnel/camp scramble fest.
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@concubined said:
DS does not need a buff, it shouldn’t be a sure 100% guaranteed escape from a tunnel like it used to be. With its current version, strategic approaches is required to get value, like the location of your down and pick up, is it somewhere you can keep prolonging your next down after you proc DS? Taking your killer to a safe zone where after you DS stun them you can make it to a safe/god pallet. It shouldn’t be a free get out of jail ticket specially when Off the Record is already a thing, basekit BT along with its haste (a pain for 110% killers), Anti face camping ect… survivors have been spoon fed one too many times to deserve DS back to or close to its former glory, which was obviously problematic without say. Making it such a threat where killers are scared to pick survivors up again, counting the 60 seconds like before (which I still see people do) is just silly and makes killers look weak.
I would like to compare DS to Eruption, but my point has been made and you’re free to stop reading here. When Eruption was nerfed into the ground, completely changing it’s purpose which was to apply the very rare incapacitation effect that now is only applicable by Victor, killers have accepted the perk is rendered useless and moved on. Now imagine the last DS nerf changed the perk in a fashion similarly to Eruption, “60 seconds after you’re unhooked, if the killer picks you up hit this skill check and now your teammates can see the killer’s aura as they’re carrying you to the hook.” … that’ll be understandably a complete joke right?
I understand this post has no persuasion to the Devs decision, the buff is inevitably coming. I’m using discussions more as a way to get people talking and to express my thoughts and prayers. Good day.
You are right but for the wrong reasons.
DS does not need to be buffed because tunneling shouldn't be fixed with a perk that forces all survivors to just run the same perks again. It should be fixed at a systemic level by balancing the game around hooks and chases instead of kills.
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@[Deleted User] said:
I think everyone should take a step back and address the obvious: should a player drop a health state from being scanned by a passive rotating beam in a PVP game? Like, at least Plague has to aim something. SM is such a bad power design. It's auto pilot.
But that's where we disagree. Not every thing in the entire game needs to have some complicated mechanical skill. Sometimes, it is ok for things to be simple and require strategic skill. The SM there has tons of things to consider.
- Can the drone actually scan the survivor in the spot they are in or are there abunch of LOS blockers
- Do i even have a drone or did i use them all, if i used them all i have to spend time calling one back, and by the time i turn around and do it, the survivor might run away while i'm not paying attention.
- Again you keep missing the point, you have to scan them 3 times, its not just a passive "guaranteed scan" so you still have to work at it.
- The survivor has to mess up multiple times to get in this state, why are you ignoring that fact?
And lastly, with your logic there, there are many killers here that you would see the same way, do you see the same for:
- Trapper just puts down a trap and doesn't have to aim anything. Its passive
- Wraith doesn't have to aim anything, he just gets free stealth
- Myers doesn't have to aim anything, he can just instadown you without needing any mechanical skill
- Hag doesn't aim anything, she puts down traps and survivors just run into them and she hits them for it, no skill there
- Bubba doesn't aim anything, he just insta downs you with his saw while running.
- Pig doesn't aim anything, she just dashes forward quickly.
- Spirit doesn't aim anything, she just goes invisible and runs really fast no skill there
- Legion doesn't aim anything you just are injured for free, no skill there.
I could go on but you get my point, there are many killers in the game where they aren't about some hefty MECHANICAL skill. STRATEGIC skill is still a valid way to have the game work and create interesting killers around. If you want something with heavy mechanical skill you are playing the wrong game. You probably want an FPS or something, probably something like CoD where its about twitch reflexes and aiming rather than something a bit more on the strategic side like said CS2.
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@mikewelk said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3671042#Comment_3671042
We can assume those tokens were built passively by stealth drones as well which is the most likely scenario. They were at the most unsafe pallet probably because they had no time to react (possibly due to eight seconds of undetectable) and stair loop shouldn't be dropped at five gens since it's like the equivalent of shack pallet. Nevertheless, they got the stun with the pallet so this is all irrelevant.
They couldn't do anything about the two lock on stacks, they didn't get pushed into a corner, and they didn't get knocked. Did you even watch the video?
But there it is right there, you are making assumptions that you do not know the answer to. The point was there were plenty of mistakes that led to the survivor being put INTO this situation that was nearly unwinnable for them. Not every situation needs a counter, sometimes the counter is to avoid the situation.
Like, should a survivor have some way to get away from the killer in a dead zone where all the pallets have been dropped? The problem there isn't the dead zone, it was the fact that the dead zone was created, or that the survivor ran there. There are tons of situations that exist in the game that are unwinnable for one side or the other, and the counter to it was to not be put in that situation to begin with.
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@mikewelk said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3671022#Comment_3671022
Well this was one of those situations and it seemed laughably easy and took very little skill. I don't see the skill aspect at all. Her counterplay is interactive for sure, doesn't make it good though.
That's because you are talking a 10 second clip out of context. Look at all of the factors:
- They already had 2 stacks, do you know how long it took or what was done to get those 2 stacks? No you don't
- They were at one of the worst most unsafe pallets in the entire game, let alone the map.
- Why is that pallet so bad? Because literally right next to it by the stairs, is probably the strongest pallet in the entire game, why didn't they drop that one?
- Were they trying to save that god pallet? If so, they got outplayed here by getting to greedy.
- Was that pallet already gone? If so they got outplayed here because they used that god pallet too early, or someone on their team did, or they ran to an area where they knew there wasn't a pallet.
- The pallet that they were out would have been a "guaranteed health state" for probably 90% of the killer in the whole game.
- The reality is, sometimes you got to take the hit, this a 1v4 game, not every situation is meant to have a counter to it. Sometimes the "counter" to a situation is to not put yourself in that situation to begin with.
There is a difference between mechanical skill and strategic skill. Think like playing a fighting game. The clip you are looking at, is someone who is at half health, against someone with full meter, and knocked down in the corner. They guess the 50/50 wrong, and then lose the round, and then you are complaining that the 50/50 is OP. When the problem there wasn't the 50/50, it was they they failed multiple times. They:
- Let their opponent build full meter
- Got to half health
- Got pushed into the corner
- Got knocked down in the corner
- Then lost the 50/50
They failed multiple times to get themselves into a situation where their opponent would win.
Or imagine chess, where you blunder your queen early, then complain about some move the other player did with their queen to win. The mistake wasn't "queen OP" it was that you lost your queen to begin with, and put yourself into that bad situation.
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@mikewelk said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3670998#Comment_3670998
So you're explaining that Skull Merchant just has to do that three times for a guaranteed injure or an M1? Doesn't seem to difficult.
Yes, skull merchant has to use her power as it is literally designed and the survivor has to stay in the area and get hit by the scan 3 times for it to do damage. That is literally the power, what exactly are you on about? Is suddenly myers some massive problem because you get downed for letting him build up to tier 3? Is nemesis suddenly a problem because you can do damage to them if they are already infected and you aren't able to cleanse it anymore? Is ghostface suddenly a problem because he downed you instantly before knew he was there because you let him expose you? Is trapper suddenly a problem because you walked into a trap?
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@mikewelk said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3670994#Comment_3670994
You can remove Wesker's infection, the lock-on stays permanently until you get injured.
Yes, but it still wasn't FREE which is what you are implying. They had to work at those first stacks to get them to the point where they got the hit. How long did that take? Probably a non-zero amount of time where the survivor was being chased.
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@mikewelk said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3670990#Comment_3670990
I'm asking how it's avoidable but yeah okay
I explained how its avoidable. The survivor there already had 2 stacks. So they already were building up to this hit. Yes, in that single instance, getting a single stack there was unavoidable, but that's still 1/3 of the stacks needed to get a hit.
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@mikewelk said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3670987#Comment_3670987
If they crouched they would've got M1'd, as I mentioned, due ot the fact that there aren't many pallets in the area. And yes you are correct, any killer can get stunned by the weakest pallet in the game but they don't get rewarded for it.
How does crouching there do anything different other than standing still there? Its the same thing. He got the pallet stun.
But i edited my post there and it looks like he got it at the tail end and the standing still actually didn't add stacks. The problem was this:
"Also further, it looks like this guy already has 2 stacks. So this isn't a free health state, this is a "free" health state that has built up over the course of that same chase, or a previous one where they already received a few stacks. Like, this would be thinking that wesker gets a "free down" because you are fully infected. When there was obviously multiple misplays that happened that resulted in you getting fully infected."
So again, this wasn't a "free health state" this was a health state that the SM has worked on getting previously through a previous chase or earlier in the same chase.
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@mikewelk said:
https://twitter.com/g0rejira/status/1766161396339786066?t=nQ6glDsmHuQXifofkip-DA&s=19
I just don't understand how people enjoy facing Skull Merchant when stuff like this happens so often. They got outplayed at the most unsafe loop on RPD and got rewarded for it??? Yes, the survivor could've crouched, but they would have got M1'd anyways since you need to compensate for server lag and crouch for longer than necessary due to it. Can you even argue that it's avoidable?
I mean, that pallet is pretty garbage anyway. Just about any killer can do that.
Also, the big problem there is he could have crouched in order to avoid the stacks. So if he crouched then did the pallet stun he would have gotten away without injury.
Also further, it looks like this guy already has 2 stacks. So this isn't a free health state, this is a "free" health state that has built up over the course of that same chase, or a previous one where they already received a few stacks. Like, this would be thinking that wesker gets a "free down" because you are fully infected. When there was obviously multiple misplays that happened that resulted in you getting fully infected.
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@ratcoffee said:
quick, 2-question, true-or-false pop quiz for killer players - this may seem a bit rude by means of sarcasm and condescention, but I promise there's a point to it
1) True or False: If a survivor leaves a gen uncompleted, a killer is able to revert all the progress that survivor has done until it's back at 0% progress
2) True or False: If a killer leaves a survivor only partly sacrificed, a survivor is able to reverse all the hook state progress they've taken until they're back at 0 hook states.
Obviously, I don't need to tell you the answer to these two questions, they are rhetorical. I ask them to make the point that as long as survivors have no way of "locking in" gen progress the same way killers can "lock in" hook states (through their own actions - I'm not counting the anti 3-gen mechanic because that depends on the killer playing into your plan of getting the generator regression-blocked), tunneling a survivor and "tunneling a generator" will never be comparable.
While i get your point, #1 isn't as profound as you think it is. Base regression is 1/4th the rate at which survivors progress a gen. So lets say you hit a near complete gen with pain res and a survivor never touches it, it will still take that gen 270 seconds to fully regress. There is a reason every killer runs tons of gen defense, and thats because the "basekit" gen defense numbers are so pitiful you might as well ignore them completely.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
Have you ever considered that you might need to improve? 50-60 seconds chases are not good. Especially if we consider that usually people over- or underestimate the time they take. E.g. Survivors think their chases were longer than they were and Killers think their chases were shorter than they were.
And well, losing 2-3 Gens for 1 Hook is pretty normal and should not really mean anything. It is just natural that the first Gens are the fastest, but Gens take longer the more the game progresses. And the last Gen can take longer than all 4 Gens before combined.
Losing a few Gens early is not really a good argument.
50-60 second chase for both hit is pretty standard. If you are playing an m1 killer and the survivor just shift+w without using pallets, windows, loops or anything and just shift+w to furthest corner of the map it'll take the killer about 60 seconds to down and hook that survivor. Now you have to factor in that the map is full of pallets as this is the first chase, and all it takes is a predrop of 1 or 2 god pallets (every pallet break adds 18 seconds to a chase) and you'd see that it's pretty standard.
Granted this is against m1 killers, but that defines probably over half of the killers in the game at this point, as there are so many anti-loop powers now that survivors don't even bother looping.
Also for context, the devs balance around 45 second chases. So saying your chase lasted 50 seconds is only about 5 seconds longer than what the devs consider an "average" chase.
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@OneGoodBoyDemo said:
When I play survivor, the amount of times that my teammates bring Gideon offerings is insane and let's be realist, Gideon is not even that good. It's a 50/50 map.
If we face a killer who eats pallets, we're doomed and l know that many of these survivor who bring this offerings just want a free win but this is not the case.
When I see Gideon offering I start to get scared because you don't know which killer you're going to face so stop using it please.
Unless its like a leatherface or hillbilly, a forced pallet break adds 20 seconds to a chase. So there really isn't any need other than to just go from pallet to pallet immediately pre-dropping them. After your first couple of pallets, your team should be popping gens, then just repeat until the game is over.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
I am curious if it is working with No Mither. If it does, then it will be fairly decent combo. High risk but high reward.
I don't think it would be very good in that case. The killer would suspect you are running the perk because they will know you have no mither. So they'll likely check the basement, and if you are injured in the back of the basement you are done.
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@sinkra said:
I have never encountered any other pvp game where it's possible for even the best players to win hundreds of games in a row. There are killers going on these win streaks even while using no addons or perks.
Is it only a problem when killers do it? Or is it also a problem when survivors do it?
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@RhysVMT said:
nurse flair
"survivor op"
Seems like bait? You highlighted a clearly strong 2 tiles stacked with 2 pallets and 2 back to back vaults with a gen on it. As a killer player, you know what I do when I see a crappy tile like that? Sell the gen and play somewhere else. Sooner that area becomes a dead zone for survivors the better. Any survivor tries to take a chase over there later in the game when the gens done? Drop chase and pressure elsewhere. It really isn't hard. Plus you're on Legion in this particular game, ykow the killer who can.. fast vault windows and pallets (break them in the process with Iri button)
I don't keep it a secret that my killer main is nurse. I don't disagree that she is a problem, but i believe she's the only viable killer at the highest level.
I do end up playing most killers in the game though. Like, in a given night if i play say, 15 games, i'll play maybe 3-4 nurse games and 1-2 of various other killers.
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@TheArbiter said:
Seeing as BHVR clearly wants to diminish Pig's slowdown and buff her anti loop instead, how would people feel about removing her roar?
I think i would have agreed with you before on this, but at this point with the increased duration and crouch speed now, the "leave the loop" playstyle is much weaker, and removing the roar just removes that option from survivors entirely. I think it should stay now. If they hadn't done what they did already, i would say it should start when she actually starts ambushing rather than charging it. But definitely a 1 or the other type situation and not both.
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@Rokku_Rorru said:
I personally think Pain Resonance is too snowbally in it's current state and when paired with Grim Embrace + DMS (not all together mind you, one or the other) it's a bit infuriating and makes the snowballing far worse. Do I think they are an issue on standard m1 killers? No, but on high mobility killers its a huge issue.
That last sentence there that you wrote though highlights the problem. Yeah, its probably too oppressive on blight/nurse. But someone like legion actually NEEDS that kind of thing to compete. Which is why i think they should nerf the perks, and buff the basekit like they often do with addons for killers that feel required.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
Most games are GE + PR + Corrupt and Pop.
Sometimes Deadlock in and one of those perks out. Or sometimes it's just not regression build, instead it's blocking build which means GE, PR, DMS and Corrupt.
Pretty much those perks are in almost all games.
So question is that, how you are feeling with facing with those perks?
@Reinami said:
Its unfortunately necessary in the current world. You simply do not have enough time to not hard tunnel or camp if you aren't running gen defense (and even in that case its still usually not enough). If you put together a match for example, where you had a top tier survivor team go against any killer that isn't nurse (even blight couldn't do it in this case) where the rules were, no perks, no items, no addons, no offerings? I'd bet the survivors would win nearly every time.
I think that the buff to the basekit gen kick was a step in the right direction, but in general i think they should do 1 of 2 things:
1) Do with gen defense perks what they often do with killer addons that feel "required" buff the basekit, then nerf the addons. In this case, buff the basekit, and nerf the perks.
- Maybe buff the gen kick up to 10%
- Buff basekit regression to 200% (old CoB)
- Maybe some sort of basekit corrupt that lasts a shorter amount of time then change corrupt to be a longer version/increase gen block times like lethal does for auras
- Then go through and heavily nerf all the gen perks so that relatively speaking they are about as powerful as they are now when combined with basekit changes.
- This would make it so you don't feel required to take these perks as the basekit actually has ways to slow the game down and would significantly open up the number of perks you see killers run. Yeah you'd still see killers run gen defense the same way because relatively speaking the power is probably about the same, but more things become viable at that point so you'd at least start to see variety.
- You could easily test this by tweaking basekit numbers and see how it goes.
2) Lean heavy into the gen defense being required and rework how it works
- Turn gen defense into the killer version of exhaustion.
- Figure out how much gen defense you think should be in the average game. I.E. gen defense when totaled up should result in survivors having to repair one extra gen of time, or maybe 2, or half a gen, whatever feels appropriate.
- Create a 5th perk slot that all of these gen defense perks go into that can only have these gen defense perks and no other perks can go there.
- Buff/Nerf every gen defense perk so that, over the course of a large amount of games played, they will on average increase the amount of time survivors have to repair gens by whatever amount you chose per game.
- For example: If we decide that survivors should have to repair one extra gen, then pain res is probably fine, unless it doesn't get 4 charges every game, maybe it needs to be buffed to say 30% so one average it hits 1 extra gen per game over the course of thousands of games played.
- Maybe ruin isn't very good because it gets cleansed too early, so it needs to be buffed up big by increasing it to 300% or something
- Maybe surge isn't meeting the mark due to it being so low, so the % is increased, or maybe the range is increased.
- You get the idea.
- Create 1-2 new gen defense perks that are basekit and not tied to a killer (so that killers always have a gen defense perk regardless of what DLC they have)
- The way i would probably do this is run a test where all gen defense perks are disabled, then put everyone into matches. See how the basekit feels. Probably too fast. Now increase the time to repair all the gens by 18 seconds (1 extra gen) how does it feel now. Does it feel right? Too much? Try 9 seconds. Not enough, try 27 seconds. Once you get it feeling right, now you know how much time that gen defense should add to a game, then you can start adjusting them on a perk by perk basis.
- The best part of this is that you don't need to worry about gen defense stacking anymore and each perk can be really strong on their own because gen defense becomes unstackable.
- So now its more about what KIND of gen defense you want as a killer. Which could change based on the killer you play, or your playstyle, etc.
Also, i would be willing to record some matches and put it to a test.
Give me a killer to play, and a build that you see as "an anti-gen meta build" i can even do the one you mentioned. I'll play a few matches, maybe 10 or so with that killer and build. We can record the matches and see how it does. Then give me another build that doesn't use any gen defense perks that you think would be viable on that killer and i'll play 10 more matches, and see how it goes. See if we get a similar result.
We can also put in some parameters as well like "If someone DCs it doesn't count, if someone kills themself on hook before 6 hooks it doesn't count etc." to remove more variables.
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@felipesegatto1 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3667708#Comment_3667708
all reworked maps have less pallets and more deadzones, you cant lie about this. “anti 3gen” is just a nerf because it is useless and buffed basekit regression and removes gen tapping. I dont give a damn about perks that deactivate in endgame, is just waiting a perk slot.
you can lie all you want, I play this game as survivor for 3 years, and I can firmly say that the game got unfun and unbalanced with all these changes
Reworked maps are definitely a toss up. Sure sometimes we get something like the coldwin farm where the main building is heavily nerfed. But for each of those we have a garden of joy, where somehow they made the damn god window even stronger.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
Most games are GE + PR + Corrupt and Pop.
Sometimes Deadlock in and one of those perks out. Or sometimes it's just not regression build, instead it's blocking build which means GE, PR, DMS and Corrupt.
Pretty much those perks are in almost all games.
So question is that, how you are feeling with facing with those perks?
Its unfortunately necessary in the current world. You simply do not have enough time to not hard tunnel or camp if you aren't running gen defense (and even in that case its still usually not enough). If you put together a match for example, where you had a top tier survivor team go against any killer that isn't nurse (even blight couldn't do it in this case) where the rules were, no perks, no items, no addons, no offerings? I'd bet the survivors would win nearly every time.
I think that the buff to the basekit gen kick was a step in the right direction, but in general i think they should do 1 of 2 things:
1) Do with gen defense perks what they often do with killer addons that feel "required" buff the basekit, then nerf the addons. In this case, buff the basekit, and nerf the perks.
- Maybe buff the gen kick up to 10%
- Buff basekit regression to 200% (old CoB)
- Maybe some sort of basekit corrupt that lasts a shorter amount of time then change corrupt to be a longer version/increase gen block times like lethal does for auras
- Then go through and heavily nerf all the gen perks so that relatively speaking they are about as powerful as they are now when combined with basekit changes.
- This would make it so you don't feel required to take these perks as the basekit actually has ways to slow the game down and would significantly open up the number of perks you see killers run. Yeah you'd still see killers run gen defense the same way because relatively speaking the power is probably about the same, but more things become viable at that point so you'd at least start to see variety.
- You could easily test this by tweaking basekit numbers and see how it goes.
2) Lean heavy into the gen defense being required and rework how it works
- Turn gen defense into the killer version of exhaustion.
- Figure out how much gen defense you think should be in the average game. I.E. gen defense when totaled up should result in survivors having to repair one extra gen of time, or maybe 2, or half a gen, whatever feels appropriate.
- Create a 5th perk slot that all of these gen defense perks go into that can only have these gen defense perks and no other perks can go there.
- Buff/Nerf every gen defense perk so that, over the course of a large amount of games played, they will on average increase the amount of time survivors have to repair gens by whatever amount you chose per game.
- For example: If we decide that survivors should have to repair one extra gen, then pain res is probably fine, unless it doesn't get 4 charges every game, maybe it needs to be buffed to say 30% so one average it hits 1 extra gen per game over the course of thousands of games played.
- Maybe ruin isn't very good because it gets cleansed too early, so it needs to be buffed up big by increasing it to 300% or something
- Maybe surge isn't meeting the mark due to it being so low, so the % is increased, or maybe the range is increased.
- You get the idea.
- Create 1-2 new gen defense perks that are basekit and not tied to a killer (so that killers always have a gen defense perk regardless of what DLC they have)
- The way i would probably do this is run a test where all gen defense perks are disabled, then put everyone into matches. See how the basekit feels. Probably too fast. Now increase the time to repair all the gens by 18 seconds (1 extra gen) how does it feel now. Does it feel right? Too much? Try 9 seconds. Not enough, try 27 seconds. Once you get it feeling right, now you know how much time that gen defense should add to a game, then you can start adjusting them on a perk by perk basis.
- The best part of this is that you don't need to worry about gen defense stacking anymore and each perk can be really strong on their own because gen defense becomes unstackable.
- So now its more about what KIND of gen defense you want as a killer. Which could change based on the killer you play, or your playstyle, etc.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3667483#Comment_3667483
And yet, I've yet to see a post from them about that.
This is about Survivors potentially beating them. They didn't, and they likely won't in the future, but they COULD and that seems to be what matters.
I genuinely enjoy when survivors outplay me at tiles that fair, but busted setups like this are as brainless as killers hard tunneling and you know it.
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@Brimp said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3667421#Comment_3667421
I mean one simply thing could be done.... in game comms. It wouldn't 100% fix that because not every one is willing to listen to their team but it would be a major MAJOR step forward in terms of closing that gap.
The devs have already said they wouldn't want to do that, it also doesn't solve the problem because then you have the "i always get solos who don't have a mic" problem. Its still going to be divided.
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@Sandt1985 said:
I keep hearing that solo que players still need more help in DBD, but I got to ask..........Really??
I'd like to point out how many buffs solo que got in the past 2 years. Anti face camp, basekit BT, the new gen regression rework to prevent three gens, nerfs to gen regression perks across the board, a way for all survivors to see when another survivor is in chase, showing all survivors what specific action another survivor is doing at all times, the visual heartbeat, STBFL was nerfed, mangled is being gutted in the next update, solo que has gotten a lot of help over the years. The one other thing they tried was basekit unbreakable, but that PTB it was tried in showed why that should never be attempted again.
I gotta ask, what more do you want?? Basekit 5 second DS? Basekit Kindred? When will it be enough? At what point will they be satisfied?
Solo queue does need some help, but the problem is adding all of these basekit things won't do it.
The reality is, the gap between solo and SWf will never be closed. If you look at all of the perks in the game, over half of them are simply about giving information about what your teammates are doing in one form or another. Discord with a SWF gives you all of those perks for free basekit. It also gives you a level of coordination that could never be achieved with any kind of perk.
Until the devs break down and admit that they need to separate SWF from solo, it'll never get fixed. The best solution would be to tie this into a "ranked mode". You create a "ranked mode" where MMR is present, your rank is shown to everyone, and its killer vs 4 man SWF ONLY. Then you balance the mode around that through whatever perk restrictions on teams/killers, or item restrictions, or gen times, or map generation or w/e you want.
Then you create a casual mode that is solo (or potentially 1 duo) only, and just remove MMR from it entirely and balance the same around that through basekit mechanics, perk restrictions, gen times, map generation etc.
Gives the casuals what they want. Gives the hardcore players what they want, gives the solos what they want, and gives the swfs what they want.
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@Nebula said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3667370#Comment_3667370
I can get behind that, I think most maps would benefit from having a shack like Dead Dawg’s or just more mindgameable tiles in general.
It just worries me that we’ll end up having “The Game” but instead of having a bunch of safe pallets that aren’t really chainable, there will be 20 unsafe, unchainable, and low skill expression resources.
And in the nicest/most constructive way possible, if you framed your discussions in a more neutral tone, you’d get less name-calling towards you and more actual discussion which I know you’re trying to go for. Naming this discussion “this is why survivors are OP” instead of something along the lines of “this is what is wrong with maps” will lead to healthier discussions for you and others. Because at the end of the day, survivors have no control over map RNG like this and they’re going to take advantage of the resources they’re provided, as they should. Resources are the only thing between them and the hook after all.
I intentionally made the thread title provocative, but i get it.
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@Saiph said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3667341#Comment_3667341
We see the results of BHVR balancing for high-level players -> player count at an all time low, casuals are dropping the game, and imo the game has become unfun on BOTH sides because you're constantly facing hardcore players.
That has less to do with balancing, and more to do with MMR. I am in favor of them creating a ranked mode that has these hardcore things in place that shoot for that "50% win rate for both sides" and having a more casual mode that is meant for people to chill. I would personally make it so that ranked mode is a forced SWF match, and the casual one is solo queue only (maybe a single duo is allowed) to reflect that.
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@Nebula said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3667341#Comment_3667341
I see your point, but at the same time, if you balance around the top level players in this game, what does that look like?
No connecting tiles? Jungle gyms reduced to 4 lanes? The terrible new pallets on maps like Farm, Macmillan and Autohaven everywhere? What does the game look like to the rest of the 99% of the playerbase that's not top level? Why would a game with no inherent competitive scene balance around competitive level players?
IMO this would just further dampen the already poor new player experience and the average player would have a harder time than they already have in the majority of their matches.
I already explained it though, you can nerf these structures because low level survivors don't know how to abuse them. And they are also going against low level killers who don't know how to do complicated mindgames that would hurt those survivors at that level without having those OP structures anyway.
Like, imagine shack, for example. Shack at a low level feels like a dangerous place for a survivor, usually it has basement, and you don't always know how to loop the structure. So often what ends up happening, is that the survivor just predrops the pallet early, "wastes" it, and moves on.
But at a high level, those survivors will do everything they can to never drop that shack pallet, and there are various check spots (many of which are not mindgamable due to random holes in the wall for some reason) that can be used to basically guarantee that the killer has to vault 3 times to block the window in order to force the pallet to be dropped.
There are mindgames that can be done to help with this, but again, really good survivors won't be fooled by them because they use the proper "check spots" where it doesn't matter what the killer does, they always are able to make the optimal decision based on what the killer is doing.
Now, imagine you nerfed shack, to perhaps be like the dead dogs one, where there is a breakable wall that significantly reduces the power of the structure. Would that hurt these low level survivors? No, because they are predropping the pallet anyway. But, it would significantly nerf the structure at a high level, and make mindgames viable on the structure again, making it so that its not just a guaranteed safe spot for the survivor.
When i talk about "nerfing survivors" this is the kind of thing i talk about, when i talk about survivors being OP, this is the kind of thing i'm talking about. Good survivors can be literally uncatchable (again, not including nurse in this discussion) at these types of structures, and nerfing them would not hurt these low MMR survivors to begin with.
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@Saiph said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3667316#Comment_3667316
Yes, against the top 0.01% best players in the world, Legion is not viable, but you aren't facing these players at all, otherwise you could have at least recorded a clip where you don't 4k at 4 gens. Or even better, record a clip of YOU playing survivor and looping Legion for 5 gens.
And yes I know you can sometimes find great loopers in pub that will make this kind of setup a nightmare, that can occasionally happen, but this is what you sign up for when you play Legion and you know it. 80% of players won't be able to exploit this setup properly and if you want to ignore strong loops, you always have the option to play Nurse. Meanwhile, survivors playing against Nurse don't have any option.
Link to the No Limit tournament: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8Z8lP_gBJE
We shouldn't make balance decisions around average level players, if we do, then that means that nurse needs massive buffs.
Do you think we should balance around average players or the top level?
I post this video frequently, but its definitely the highest level players. It makes sense. Here is a youtube video that describes exactly what i'm talking about, they are talking about team fortress, but the point still is extremely relevant:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X1p42KtZOCw&t=205sIn our case, we are talking about this OP structure right? So, if they made it so such a structure/setup never spawned (I.E. nerfed it) does it hurt low level survivors? No, because low level survivors aren't abusing this type of thing to begin with, it won't impact them even a little bit. But it will make a big difference in high level play.
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@Saiph said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3667288#Comment_3667288
Otz and Hens hosted a tournament with no restrictions for both sides, and killers still had 60% killrate on average. So no, you're wrong again.
I give you that killers in this tournament weren't playing Legion, but they were facing tournament 4-man SWFs with 4 syringes every game, and you aren't facing that. At least, based on this video.
Would love to see it, but i'd guess that every match was nurse/blight/spirit etc. top tier killers. Which is not what i'm talking about when i discuss these things. I'm talking about the OTHER 30+ killers that aren't viable at that level.
Also, a single tournament does not a data set make. You would need to look at thousands of matches at this level to get any relevant data.
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@xEa said:
Hello there,
While on the first look this questions seems to be easy to answer, it is actually not - at least for me. Lets assume this scenario:
DS will be buffed to 5 seconds as it used to be.
Many survivors will run DS because of that, and to counter slugging, survivors will also bring Unbreakable. Even tho not every survivor is running DS, killer will most likely assume, everyone has it. Therefor it is a constant threat, a spirit protecting the survivors, so to say.
Now comes the part where i am unsure: What will killer do in response to that more or less unbeatable meta?Slugging wont work very well, because anti slug perks will be meta. Tunneling would not work because DS. So normally, the next best strategy is gen pressure.
When killers are "robbed" by their best and second best strategy, wouldnt it be possible, that killrates drop down? Sure, MMR is there, but lets assume the majority of killers drop down all together in MMR, this would eventually lead to less kills, right?
And aren't the devs seeking for a way to instal 60% killrate? When killrate significantly drops, wouldn't that mean they have to
- Increase Gen time?
- Lower pallet count even more?
- Make maps even smaller?
I know how bad Tunneling is, but would it be really better to play on a map with 2/3 size, 7 pallets and 100 second gen time (all exaggerated of course!)??
Throw in your thoughts please.
PS. i am not a killer main, who wants to sneak away from the DS buff, i only want to have a discussion about a topic that might be more complex then it seems to be.
It will continue to be as is, just with DS, you just won't tunnel your obsession because they are likely to have it. The other problem is tying anti-tunnel to a perk to begin with. It should be handled at a systemic level not via bandaid through perks.
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@OmegaXII said:
I know this is a very good perk. I've experienced it many times with survivor that honestly I feel like it's a bit too OP. That's why I would like to get it LOL.
But I heard it's gonna get nerf soon, is it true though? I would hate to see it nerfed right after I bought it LOL. :(
My opinion is going to be the minority, and i really don't understand it.
I do not use this perk. Its a bad perk imo. The reality is:
- You have to open a locker, something that is a waste of time and you don't want to be doing anyway.
- Screams are inherently not a good indicator of where someone is. They give you a rough idea where, but they don't tell you exactly where.
- If survivors scream and then simply WALK away from the direction of the killer, assuming a 32 meter terror radius, they can walk 15.5 meters away, that's HALF a terror radius. Plenty of distance to get somewhere, or even hide.
- Blindness is useless against survivors who are good and not using a crutch WOO. (especially useless against SWF who use discord)
- The cooldown on it is much longer than you realize. It is not a 30 second cooldown it is a 1 minute cooldown. Because you use it, then it lasts 30 seconds, then AFTER that 30 seconds, the cooldown goes down. This means its 1 minute between uses. This means in an average game, if you use it literally on cooldown, you are gonna be able to use it, maybe 10 times tops in a game.
- Calm spirit is a hard counter that has no way to be dealt with.
Now, look at something like Lethal Pursuer, with any kind of aura perk, maybe BBQ for example.
- Lethal is going to allow you to start a chase within 10 seconds, no need to waste time looking for a locker and unreliable screams.
- BBQ gives you significantly more information by showing you EXACTLY where the survivor is and where you need to go next. And, if you don't see anything, then you know there is likely a survivor nearby you waiting for you to leave for the unhook, giving you an opportunity to fake leave, then come back for the hard tunnel to snowball the match out of control.
- There is no cooldown on BBQ, its about chases, so if you end chases quickly you can get a ton of value.
- Because aura reading is more exact, it tells you where all the survivors are. Whereas with screams its hard to know where everyone is at any given movement.
- Distortion is a soft counter, because it is somewhat limited. With something like nowhere to hide for example, you can easily burn through distortion stacks. And lethal makes them start the game with 1 charge effectively.
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@sinkra said:
This post is a good example of what the 60% target kill rate has led to, killers feeling entitled to get a 3k/4k most games and any kind of challenge is seen as unfair.
Incorrect.
I play both sides, so that argument is invalid. There's a reason tournaments have heavy restrictions on survivors, because at the highest level killers simply are not strong enough to deal with them when they bring their best.
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@TheSaltySaloon said:
I don't even know what to say that hasn’t been said 1.3 billion times before but almost EVERYONE is tunneling and I’m sick of dealing with it.
combine that with this current insufferable killer meta of Scourge Hook, Deal lock, dead man’s switch etc and this has become one of the most unbearable era’s of this game ever.
it’s so bad that the first 2-3 minutes of matches now are just survivors crouch walking everywhere for fear of being the first one seen.
something has got to change…
And i have said it also 1.3 billion times. The game would be in a much healthier state if they stopped balancing for kills and instead balanced around chases and hooks.
The problem is, that the current state of the game means that it is not POSSIBLE at a high level to win without some degree of tunneling. (I.E. focusing 2 survivors out). Because the game is simply not balanced in a way that allows 4 survivors to be alive for anything more than a few minutes, or the killer will not be able to outpace the survivors on the gens, no matter how much pressure they exert. With the exception of nurse and blight, who can end chases extremely quickly.
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@Brokenbones said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3667228#Comment_3667228
To call it censorship is misguided, censorship implies somebody made it and then an external force came in and censored it. In actuality, BHVR likely looked at some complaints regarding the icon and decided it's better to change it than to leave it be
The problem I have is with the lack of consistency, I.E Hangman's trick being left as is. I feel like if there was a genuine care about this issue, they wouldn't have forgotten about it but they did.
It could be argued that the "complaints" themselves were an act of forcing censorship. I.E. "cancelling" someone or something.
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@CompleatBeet said:
This chapter has got to be the best marketed original chapter we've ever gotten, the teasers and the hype of a creepypasta Killer had the entire community on edge. Now that the hype has mostly settled down, does the new Killer live up to the hype in your opinion?
Killer's power is okaish. Not quite what was marketed but still not horrible.
The power itself is relatively mid. The biggest problem is that direct hits don't infect, or whatever the effect is called. If they made direct hits explode and infect instead of just going through them the killer would be in a much better state. There's also the fact that, unlike say ghost face if you just look at the killer for a fraction of a second, it counts as looking at the killer for "3 seconds" so you don't have to actually LOOK at the killer constantly to remove it, you just have to swing back for a bit, which makes it so you can often lose your infection after you have already gone around a corner, which feels really weird.
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@GannTM said:
Bro you killed three of them with 4 gens remaining. Why are you complaining?
Read the post.
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@MaTtRoSiTy said:
You have already won at 4 gens with a weak as piss killer like Legion, so how did this actually negatively affect your gameplay at the end of the day?
This is a dirty setup if survivors know how to use it for sure but 90% of survivors would go down at a God pallet lol.
Read the post.
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@Gabe_Soma said:
Bro procedeed to spend his time by recording and posting here the only good tile on the one of the most killer-sided map of the game, when everyone died at 4 gen as if it were the fault of OP survivors such a spawn, completely forgetting that at least 70% of the maps are drenched in deadzone everywhere.
Smart move man.
I'm guessing you didn't read when i said someone immediately killed themselves on hook as soon as they saw i was legion and the rest of the team basically gave up after that? Which is pretty much the sole reason kill rates are where they are, because with SM being so high, they obviously include hook suicides as part of the kill rate. I'd bet if you removed that the numbers would be significantly different.