Reinami
Reinami
About
- Username
- Reinami
- Joined
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Comments
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@MikeStev said:
You need to look in the mirror, you have a huge bias against survivors and that's not healthy.
I am biased when i relatively equally play both sides? Wake up and look at tournaments, why do tournaments place HEAVY restrictions on survivors?
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@Bran said:
We still calling exploits tech?
Na, its only a tech when its a survivor thing. But killer techs are definitely exploits.
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@The_Krapper said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3664838#Comment_3664838
We have more than 4 viable killers people just refuse to play those other killers or change the same ######### build they run every match and then wonder why they lose, survivors have been so trash for the past six months I'm starting to believe all the really good players are gone now, ive been playing who people call the weakest killers and winning most of my games, how is that possible if there's only 4 killers viable? I'm nowhere near the best at this game if what you're saying is true I couldn't do that.
When i say viable, i mean in top tier mmr against the best survivors. There's a reason that every comp match and tournament has heavy survivor retstrictions.
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@Bloodwebs said:
I'm sorry but am I missing anything here? I wholeheartedly disagree with this post.
In all due respect, the only thing she is still viable for IS three genning. If she actually chased survivors then she would not have the highest current %70+ kill rate as per the statistics.
Literally out of the 10 SMs i've faced today none of them chased survivors after their instantaneous 3 gen set up from the start of the game. She is a flawed killer with the worst design who is rewarded for practically clicking m2.
There is legitimately no enjoyable way to verse her if she is playing with the 3 gen strat and it is definitely not eliminated at the moment at all. She is as bad as her release and I will never enjoy playing her or against her. Had to disagree with this post, but then again, we are entitled to our different opinions. :)
Her power gives her way too much value with no work made to get it at all. And on top of that, she can just blurt out her drones after they've been disabled with zero to no speed delay consequences whatsoever. She is still needing a complete 360 change in her power.
They nerfed 3 genning. The perks that enabled it are completely dead, and even now they have the 3gen system in place. And on top that, they adjusted her power specifically so that it sucks in a 3 gen.
So what exactly are you on about?
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@Pulsar said:
Wesker effect.
Billy is fun to play against.
Billy isn't fun to play against twenty times in a row.
This will continue to get better as BHVR seems keen on finally making more than 2 killer viable. The billy buffs have finally brought him to that point, now we have 4 viable killers instead of 2.
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@apathyinc said:
Maybe they DC'd because they are tired of being found right away with Lethal and saw spammed, then having to do 6 gens due to Pain Res, and and then be locked out of doing gens due to Grim Embrace. Just a theory.
Projecting. There was no possible way they could have known i had pain res or grim embrace when i started the match. It could be argued that they could have assumed i had lethal since i got there so fast.
Bu what exactly is your point? Killers are gonna use good killer perks? I could say the same thing to the survivors i see every other game who run the same 6 perks too. I'm also tired of seeing:
- Adrenaline
- Resilience
- FTP+Buckle Up
- Hyperfocus
All while running the same cracked toolbox or medkits with insta heals and sending me to garden of joy.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3664439#Comment_3664439
Man, you really seem to just write to disagree.
But I will bite:
That there is no direct interaction between Killer and Survivor should be pretty clear, if you dont TRY to not understand it. As Skull Merchant, outside of standard M1-Killer gameplay, you dont interact with the Survivors AT ALL, you only interact with the Drones. And as Survivor, you also dont interact with the Skull Merchant (again, outside of standard M1-Killer gameplay), but only with her Drones.
Meanwhile, when you face other Killers which are even stronger than her like Billy, Wesker or Blight, you actually have to interact with their power and the Killer also can use the Power to directly interact with the Survivor. Juking a Billy/Wesker/Blight is fun and actual skill expression. Getting hits with Chainsaws, Bounds or Rushes is also actual skill expression. Placing a Drone on a Loop while just chasing the Survivor is not.
My point regarding only interacting with Drones while they are next to Gens - those are the most common places of Drones. Next to Gens and in Loops during the chase. And you cannot sabotage a Drone while in chase, this is just impossible and you know that.
How is not directly interacting with her due to the "m1" nature any different than:
- Trapper
- Myers
- Freddy
- Legion
- Plague (because lets be real nobody actually cleanses)
- Pinhead
- Sadako
You mention billy, but billy has 0 interaction outside of directly chasing a survivor, same with wesker and even blight. All they can do outside of chase you with that power is map traversal, which isn't really interacting with the survivor. In a chase, skull merchant is likely setting up drones, so again, you ARE interacting with her power there.
Yes, you can't sabo a drone in chase that is true, but you can avoid it, it spins around and is obvious to see where it is, and you can always "leave the loop" Putting drones near gens is actually bad, because they don't do anything if the survivor is repairing anymore, or did you not read her rework?
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@xEa said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3664118#Comment_3664118
SM is very problematic and it has nothing to do with her past. I am the living proof for that, since i dont even knew chess merchant neither did i play a single round against her due to inactivity.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3664365#Comment_3664365
The first video explains why she is hated so much:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vOliDIQxQlE&t=
The second video explains her "counterplay"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-6oxf7BkDo
What i dislike about her the most is a combo of this:
- Stealth
- Random drone hits
- Drones slow you down while SM gets faster
- A million status effects
All at the same time basically.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3664402#Comment_3664402
It is strange how experiences are different. I play legion quite a bit, and DC's are close to never happening in my game. I say close, but if i am honest i can not remember a single DC i had since i came back about a year ago.
I'd say in probably 30-40% of the games i play as one of those killers, someone immediately gives up and kills themself on hook or DCs.
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@xEa said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3663501#Comment_3663501
Legion is a prime example that after a proper rework, the community would accept or even like a certaint killer. They just messed up now twice (thanks for correcting me, it would be indeed a re-re-rework). Time to make it right.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3663488#Comment_3663488
Agreed. SM is misserable to play against and i dont even care what anyone else says about her, which is really rare. She feels exactly like the old Legion. Only hate for that killer, sorry.
That is entirely untrue, people usually give up immediately when i play legion.
Survivors will never like a killer if they have any kind of mechanic that forces them to do anything other than hold m1 on a generator as fast as possible. This is why people hate
- Stealth killers (can't stay injured)
- Skull merchant
- Legion (mending)
- Plague
- Spirit (cant stay injured)
- sadako
- Pig
etc.
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@ArkInk said:
It feels like there's a lot of negativity around here, so why don't we all share something fun that reminds us why we keep playing?
It could be a survivor escape, Killer play, silly hijinks, etc. Anything so long as it put a smile on your face.
My story is from a Wesker match I had a few days back. I'd just managed to find and kill the best survivor on the team as the final gen popped. Using FttE I managed to track down and instadown the next best looper relatively easy (I caught him at a dead spot in Autohaven), he was on death hook and I was pretty content to take the tie, since it had been hard fought until that point. At this point one exit gate has been opened, and Mikaela already left through it.
That just leaves Wesker and good ole Leon, a player I hadn't even seen all game. I make my way to the exit gate, and he's t-bagging like we're in the middle of a rave. I put my controller down and stood still, trying to bait him away from the edge, my thought process was to try throwing him farther into map and downing him as he ran back. The strat worked, he ran right up to me, but I fumbled the angle and threw him into a wall right near the exit.
This is where it gets good. He gets even more excited that my plan failed, and starts dancing around the gate. I stopped again, since he decided leaving was never an option. Pulling a first aid spray out of nowhere, Leon got cocky, and that was my que. I still don't know why he didn't cancel the animation when he saw me pull out tentacle, but slamming a virtual character into in a suddenly forming Eldritch tentacle wall has never felt so good. I walk him down into the basement, toss him on a hook, and the last thing we both get to hear before the match ends is my boy Wesky saying "I tire of wasting my time with you."
Good times. Any matches that give you the same fond memories?
What you are gonna get is 1 of 2 things:
1) A match where someone (or a teammate) made the other side so miserable that people DC'ed: "So funny lolololol"
2) A match where both sides just trolled intentionally and all 4 survivors escaped
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3662488#Comment_3662488
But thats just bad killer play, if you need aura perks to find survivors. - Here is a free hint -> Try looking near gens, especially the ones that have progress
"Using perks makes you bad"
Alright, so why don't you play survivor without perks then?
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@Nun_So_Vile said:
Killers: *Running 2 to 3 aura perks every game*
Surv: *Puts on Distortion because they are tired of constantly being found so quickly in the match and (probably) tunneled out*
Killers: Stop that
Survivor: Puts on distortion
Killer: I just hooked a guy and i don't know where to go now, guess i'll just proxy camp because i can't find anyone
Survivors: ######### why you camping?
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@Huge_Bush said:
Removing all risk from being removed from the match at any point in time would kill the game. It would get stale very quickly.
Dbd at its core is an elimination game. It’s designed to be frustrating in order to make the wins feel great and get your brain addicted to the endorphins that are released from that emotion. Without the struggle, things wouldn’t feel as good and we’d likely quit sooner than later.
Asking to remove the killers agency and to punish them for making the best choice (usually) is asking for a different game that isn’t Dbd.
It would be more fun for BOTH sides if that game was balanced around hooks instead of kills. You can also keep that element in place. My proposal has always been simple. Survivors share the FIRST hook state. Meaning that each survivor gets 2 hook states that are their own, but the first 4 are shared. Then, if you hard tunnel someone out, you have to hook them 6 times.
This means that you still can be "eliminated" but it won't start happening to the later half of a match. Then you balance chase times, gen speeds, pallet strength, killer strength, etc. Around this idea that you probably are going to have 4 survivors in the game for 60-70% of a match.
This would also have to come with removing the 4% mechanic, which is dumb anyway. It also means survivors can't just "give up" and remove themselves from the game super early screwing over everyone else in the process.
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@Caiman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3662394#Comment_3662394
"I'm sick of touching generators all the time."
"Okay, here's something else to do."
"No, I don't want to do that, I want to touch generators."
I don't envy BHVR, not one bit.
Indeed. Survivor mains perplex me. They often complain about killers. Remember how much "fun it was to go against billy"? and suddenly you are seeing people complaining about billy? Because they didn't like going against billy because he was "fun" they liked going against billy because he was bad.
I'd be curious to see a poll of strictly survivor mains voting who their favorite killers are to go against. I'd guess they'd all be the worst ones, while any one of them perceived as good is ranked really low.
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@Supernaut said:
It saddens me that these don't get stickied any more. Thank you for doing them, they are truly appreciated!
I'm not sure why that's the case. My guess is that someone higher up said they can't do it anymore.
But, that's why i put up the webpage, however rudimentary it is. So you'll always be able to see the updates there.
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@Caiman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3662368#Comment_3662368
And it waters Pig down to another dull anti-loop killer whose power is "go fast and hit someone" while the actual interesting part of her power that affects the match the most is reduced to a mild inconvenience.
Every time the devs release a killer whose power is about map control: I.E. sadako anyone? Pinhead with his box and the franklins build? Old skull merchant? Survivors complain. Anytime that a killer has a way to force survivors to not hold m1 on a gen, suddenly its the worst thing in the world and "terrible design" so the devs are literally just giving people what they ask for.
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@Alice_pbg said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3662004#Comment_3662004
you know... you both say "with the ambush buff a nerf to compensate is in order" or something like that...
but why? she could have gotten the buffs with no nerfs and it would have been perfectly justified. hell she could have got buffs to the rbt aswell. alongside a nerf that actually deals with the scream builds ofc.
Its actually quite smart.
If you look at the data, it shows that pig is actually one of the higher killers in terms of kill rate.
However, i'd bet that her kill rate in low mmr is significantly higher than her kill rate in high mmr. She probably does well against newer players, but poorly against top tier players. So the question to that is, why? Well the traps probably confuse newer players. They don't understand how they work, they can't figure out when they are active vs not, and they generally get headpopped way more often than they would in high mmr.
In high mmr, pig struggles heavily to get a down because her ambush is horrible in chase and survivors can easily "leave the loop" and it leads to hear not being good. On top of that, the traps don't really do much in terms of headpops, because the survivor knows what to do, but what they are good at is delaying the game.
When you take these things into account, it makes sense.
- You buff the ambush in small ways that is going to make her much better in high mmr. But in low mmr, adding 0.3 seconds on ambush duration, and 0.2 m/s faster movement speed on crouch and 0.3 seconds off of crouch time isn't going to really change anything. But in high mmr its a massive massive buff, just take a look at scott jund's videos on her. She is much more viable as an anti-loop now.
- You nerf the trap game a bit, this is going to nerf her significantly in low mmr, where the traps make a huge difference. But in high mmr games, it won't effect them really at all, because high mmr pigs aren't using traps to get kills, they are using them to slow the game down. So the pig doesn't care if she can't see the box auras, or if the timer is slightly longer. Because you aren't getting kills with traps, you are forcing that survivor into a "timeout" of sorts off of gens and healing, giving you more time to chase other survivors.
These are actually the types of changes that are the perfect example of good balance decisions that BHVR should be making. You buff bad killers in high mmr, while nerfing them in low mmr where they are much stronger.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3661448#Comment_3661448
They conducted that test of hiding prestige on random players so long ago and they can't even give us a report on the outcome of that! Not sure what the hold up is.
Probably because the experiment showed that it didn't increase the likelyhood of a dodge in any significant amount, so there's nothing really to report other than, nothing changed.
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@HerInfernalMajesty said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3661819#Comment_3661819
That’s the problem isn’t it? That sense of superiority of exclusivity is the thing of value that people get from this. They do feel that the value decreases based off of other people having it.
But like you I don’t agree with it. In fact I also believe that the “superiority” shouldn’t be a thing of value in the first place when it comes to Dbd cosmetics. Developing a system like this grooms and encourages players to think and feel this away. I’m firmly against that.
I suppose i should say the "REAL" value of the skin does not decrease. It's still the same skin, and costs the same for everyone. Just making it exclusive creates a superiority complex for the person who owns it, allowing them to think they are "better" than other people.
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@HexHuntressThighs said:
I always liked the idea of having to be there at the time a skin released to get it so that way I can actually stand apart from other people and have a very rare and unique cosmetic! Like the 4th year anniversary crowns for example! You had to be playing at the time to get them and you couldn't get them ever again.
Why don't people like that? I genuinely don't get it. Im not talking seasonal limitations either, I'm talking if you didn't buy it then; you'll never be able to get it again. I also think the upgradeable skins idea is sick also! Hopefully that comes to the game soon.
Because it is gatekeeping.
The value of your skin does not decrease just because someone else has it. Someone else having it, does not take anything away from you. All you are doing with these types of things is creating a sense of superiority over others because "i have it and you don't"
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@xEa said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/406433/why-is-4-self-unhook-necessary
Because those mechanics keep the game exciting and winnable till the end. With those i mean Kobe and Hatch.
Think about MOBAs. Giving up after 15 minutes is not an umcommon thing there. Often times one team is so far behind, that a chance of come back is pretty much zero.
In DBD, while it is rare, the 4% stands for hope. Imagine if there would not be Kobe and Hatch, survivors would give up super quick if things are going wrong. It is important to leave some extra hope in the game to create a more positive and more active mindset.
Also, dear killer mains, EMBRACE those elements. Without Hatch and Kobe, survivor would sit on 30% winrate, guaranteed. I highly doubt, maps would be that small, pallets would be that less and survivor perks would be that weak without kobe and hatch.
This would be true if the killer wasn't also a player. How do you think it would feel on the survivor side if every time the killer hooked you, you had a 4% chance to just immediately die?
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@Rulebreaker said:
Because it can completely swing the game.
That is precisely part of the reason the mechanic is poorly designed.
- It allows survivors a way to expedite to second hook to kill themselves and get out of the game avoiding the DC penalty and screwing over their team (something that should be bannable imo)
- At its best, the mechanic allows you to turn a game around, but its completely RNG. Remember, the killer is not an NPC, it is a real player. How do you think it feels on the receiving end to be doing really really well and having "won" a game, only for someone to 4% and turn it around. The 4% had 0 skill involved, it was complete RNG, and the game decided to just hand you a win.
It doesn't feel good even in its best situations.
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@Iron_Cutlass said:
How do you feel about the following structure:
- 2 Windows.
- Walls in the shape of an L and T placed adjacent from one another.
- Rated as a weak structure for map generation.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/4EOFKKVCH6YD/n7vbzap.png
Its one of the best designed structures in the game, because it is a true 50/50 and based on skill. No predropping a god pallet here.
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All jokes aside, i think they should make a 5th perk slot for both sides, and have that be like an "ultimate" perk that is super strong and are like, build defining, then they can change/tweak some perks we have now to being "ultimate" perks.
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@Vladik4529 said:
delete this achivment, now unreal to get
Achievements that are impossible get changed. Since this achievement would quite literally be impossible, it has been changed already.
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@sinkra said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3657519#Comment_3657519
At high MMR nurse is probably stronger because it has a high skill cap but that's not what the average survivor experiences.
So do we balance around average players, or high mmr players?
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@Nebula said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3657545#Comment_3657545
That’s totally beside the point and has absolutely nothing to do with his post.
I think it totally makes sense. He is claiming that these changes make huntress OP. I'm stating that, the PTB is a horrible judge of balance because MMR and matchmaking doesn't exist on it. Then he said "justify this" so i posted my "justifications for it"
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@mikewelk said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3657545#Comment_3657545
Another one to the count! Point flew right past you...
How about instead of being snarky you explain it then?
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@mikewelk said:
It's not to skew the data, they just realized how busted Huntress is and there's no denying it. I would do the exact same because I didn't play the PTB to experience huge buffs to an already balanced killer that came from some random void that no one asked for until now apparently.
https://twitter.com/RNIN_St1v1/status/1759992506056425727?t=YZtjl7BtrgqQfmgcCkML9w&s=19
Try to justify this video.
The PTB is a horrible judge of balance though because matchmaking/MMR is non-existent on it. I basically go against the babiest of babies when playing on the PTB, as both sides too. I can usually loop the killer for 5 gens (if my teammates actually did the gens) and survivors are lucky to get a single gen done if i play pretty much any kill with no perks.
As for the video, i can justify it by multiple things. First of all, in a real game, if a survivor is letting you get that close, your movement speed while holding a hatchet doesn't matter (hint: huntress i still slower than a survivor while holding a hatchet)
Secondly, MMR exists, so good huntress players will go against good survivors, and bad huntress players will go against bad survivors. So the bad huntress player can barely hit hatchets as it is, so giving them a couple more and increasing the movement speed isn't going to change much for them when they barely understand what is going on. Meanwhile in high MMR games, where huntress struggles because survivors just loop 50 times around a rock she can't throw over and being 110 means that those rock loops take way longer to catch a survivor. And she has 0 map control, she'll be able to hang much better.
Lastly, just release the changes, and see how it goes. I don't understand why everyone always thinks everything has to be absolutely perfect. You seem to think that if they release it, and its too much, that they will never change it again.
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@sinkra said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3654980#Comment_3654980
Are you aware that with an addon SM can have permanent undetectable?
First of all, that's not actually true, because the duration of the undetectable even with that addon is still less than the cooldown.
Secondly, you still haven't answered my question. Do you honestly and truly believe that SM is more powerful than Nurse and that is why her kill rate is 70%?
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@C3Tooth said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3655595#Comment_3655595
No, the Devs want 60% kill rate, even if I dont like, I have to accept that survivors should get 40% escape rate.
But many killers, you for example, thinking about win rate, not kill rate. Mentioned 1 kill, is a lost like something that should not count toward to that 60% kill rate because killers lose that match.
So I brought that 1 escape should not count toward 40% escape rate because survivors lose the match.
You're suppose to have 12 kill over 20 survivors. It doesnt matter the win rate, its the acceptable kill rate.
0K, 0K, 4K, 4K, 4K so 3 wins out of 51K, 2K, 3K, 3K, 3K so still 3 wins and 1 tie out of 52K, 2K, 2K, 3K, 3K so there is 0 lose out of 5
Doesnt matter how the result is, the losing rate never beat the win rate, unless some killers count tie as lose, and 3K as lose.
The devs have stated multiple times that kill rate is a proxy for winning. Its precisely WHY mmr counts an escape for the survivor as a win and 0-1 kills as a loss for the killer 2 a draw and 3-4 a win for the killer. What matters here is what mmr thinks is a "win"
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@C3Tooth said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3654479#Comment_3654479
Devs want kill rate, not win rate.
1 kill is counted toward the rate. If what you mean 1 kill should not count as a "kill"
Then 1 escape should count as 4 death.
That's not what i'm saying.
The devs have actually stated "win rate" is the goal, but kills are defined as what a win or a loss is.
Survivors win or lose on their own, to them, the game is effectively a 1v1 + 1v1 + 1v1 + 1v1. So if they die, they individually get a loss, if they escape, they get a win, if they escape through hatch, they get a draw.
Killer is a bit different, but getting 0-1 kills is a loss, 2 kills is a draw, 3-4 kills is a win.
So you would THINK that means that you want a 50% kill rate right? Because, if you played 1000 games, and every game was 2 kills 2 escapes, then the killer gets a draw every game. But its not like that for several reasons:
- The 2 survivors that escape that game actually win, they didn't lose.
- If you get 1 kill, then statistically speaking your are more likely to get a second kill.
Because of those facts, 60% actually brings it closer to a 50% "Win" rate as a whole when you look at thousands of matches.
Think of it like the monty hall problem: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monty_Hall_problem
From the game show "Lets make a deal" you've heard of, where the host gives you 3 doors, 1 door has like $1000 prize, 1 door has a new car, and another door has nothing. Lets say you pick door number 1. Then the host says are you sure? And you say "Yes" then they show you that behind door number 3, is nothing. So now you know that you either picked the $1000 prize, or the new car. But NOW, the host gives you the option to switch your choice to door number 2. So the question is. Do you switch?
And the reality is you should ALWAYS switch, because when you picked Door number 1, you had a probability of 1 out of 3 of getting the car. But once they showed you what was behind door number 3, you still have a probability of 1 out of 3 of getting the car. But if you SWITCH your choice, now you have 2 out of 3 chance of getting the car, because you already know what's behind one of the doors.
A similar thing holds true here for DBD due to how statistics work.
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@Reinami said:
The problem isn't the number of pallets, there's actually not many of them anymore. The problem is the number of them that are simply safe pallets that MUST be broken and cannot be mindgamed.
Most maps will have aroudn 12-15 pallets. Of those.
- 1 will be shack
- 2-3 will be jungle gyms (must be broken)
- 2-3 will be in a main building, usually main buildings are strong.
This means that of the 12-15 pallets in the map, 5-7 of them MUST be broken and can't be mindgamed. Each broken pallet adds 20 seconds to a chase, so do the math and you'll see all it takes is to predrop 2 of these pallets and the killer loses 3 gens.
@graveyard_7777 said:
When I'm playing killer it feels like 90% of the match I'm just breaking pallets
To clarify also, i would like to see a situation where the game (dbd, not the map) actually had MORE pallets, but they were all 50/50 mindgamable pallets. Such that, if you don't stun the killer with them, you have a bad time. Pallets like this would be like the ones near the outside gen in the racoon city policy station map,
There's that one pallet near the exit gate, where its JUSSSST long enough, that you can loop it, but also short enough where you can mindgame it. But if you predrop the pallet, the killer is put in an advantageous position, but, if you stun the killer with it (with you on the outside part) then you get a nice escape while the killer has to go all the around it, or break it. This is how i would imagine the ideal pallet structure would be.
Then in that world, you can add tons of pallets on maps, because they are all mindgamable, or you could even allow pallets to respawn to remove the whole idea of creating "deadzones" which lead to just unfun situations where the survivor runs to an area and they just get hit because there is just no pallet there.
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@rvzrvzrvz said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3654980#Comment_3654980
honestly ? nurse is kinda hard to play I don't mind losing to skilled player, me I tried hard and I'm still very mid at nurse so I can respect skilled ones, losing to SM isn't interesting most ppl just dc nowadays, it's quicker
Ugh. So you think we should balance around average level players then?
Alright well, where are my MASSIVE, and i mean MASSIVE, nurse buffs. Because they nerf her like every 6 months, but her kill rate still is one of the lowest in the game. They should bring back omega blink nurse then, that ought to bring her kill rate more in line with some of the strongest killers in the game, like pig...
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@rvzrvzrvz said:
I like doctor buffs but that's it, everything else will be trash in pub games especially huntress buff is wild, not only hatchet count but move speed .. ?
Buffing blight/huntress ok sure why not but skull m deserved some nerfs imo, her 70% killrate was supposed to go down but it's not, too much haste effect and map control. Weird changes overall, as usual most of it doesn't make any sense
You can't possibly think SM needs nerfs to fix her 70% "kill rate" right? You can't possibly think she is the best killer in the game, and nurse is one of the worst. Right?
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@KatsuhxP said:
Well they aim for 60% killrate and the killers getting buffed don't have that except hag and pig. While I'm gonna admit that blight doesn't need a buff, i still don't see anyone run this addon, the downside ist just way to bad.
The difference there too, at least in the case with pig, is that they are doing this much more intelligently than they have in the past. For pig, they correctly identified why she has such a high kill rate in low skill games, but a low kill rate in high skill games. So they buffed the part of her power that makes her better in high skill games, while nerfing the part of power that makes her OP in low skill games.
The perfect type of change TBH.
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@graveyard_7777 said:
When I'm playing killer it feels like 90% of the match I'm just breaking pallets
The problem isn't the number of pallets, there's actually not many of them anymore. The problem is the number of them that are simply safe pallets that MUST be broken and cannot be mindgamed.
Most maps will have aroudn 12-15 pallets. Of those.
- 1 will be shack
- 2-3 will be jungle gyms (must be broken)
- 2-3 will be in a main building, usually main buildings are strong.
This means that of the 12-15 pallets in the map, 5-7 of them MUST be broken and can't be mindgamed. Each broken pallet adds 20 seconds to a chase, so do the math and you'll see all it takes is to predrop 2 of these pallets and the killer loses 3 gens.
This also doesn't factor in junk tiles, or rocks where, unless you are playing a top tier killer like blight, spirit etc. You also MUST break those because you can't mindgame them if you can literally just see the killer.
The game would be in a much healthier state if the mindgame was "will they drop the pallet or not" not, "they dropped the pallet, is this mindgameable" so that way you play this mindgame on if you should respect the pallet or not, and if you do, that usually gives them the distance they need to get to a window and get back around the loop. But if they do drop the pallet, now the pallet is mindgameable so if they don't stun you, its risky.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3654281#Comment_3654281
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3654284#Comment_3654284
I can’t answer why they’ve decided on a 60/40 split beyond it somehow creates a near 50/50 win rate. And don’t ask me to explain how that works (I believe it has something to do with the game being a [1v1v1v1] v 1). Frankly, I don’t think it’s a good strategy. It killed games like Death Garden, VH1, Evolve, Evil Dead, and other asymmetrical games. But I’m sure the devs have a reason I just can’t see.
@coco_shotz said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3654277#Comment_3654277
It's sad that they would rather make the killer impossible to escape from than to make the game balanced enough to where player skill actually came into it, but alas these forums wouldn't need to exist if they did that. I often wonder if the supposed 60/40 split is truly accurate or if it's just a statistic that's been manipulated simply by only looking at certain games or players that would help fit the narrative
It's statistics really.
The way the game is designed is such that. If you get one kill. The probability that you get another kill is significantly higher than just getting 2 kills. And same for 3 and 4 kills.
This basically means that games are usually 4 escapes or 4 (3 kills 1 hatch) kills.
So going for 60/40 actually means either side in theory. Wins half the time.
You also need to remember that 1 kill/3 escape counts as a loss.
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@crogers271 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3653053#Comment_3653053
No point in continuing if someone won't do so in good faith.Are you going to recognize that you are confusing me with other people in the thread? Because if we're going to accuse others of bad faith that would seem to be the absolutely basic level of a good faith argument would be recognizing that actual arguments of the person you are engaging with.
I've given you the page number where all of my replies to you exist. Before you accused me of attacking a strawman there's two of them. But you bring up things like skull merchant that was never in the conversation between us.
If you want to do a reset, that's the reset you need to do. Until then, your entire argument is bad faith and a strawman.
Hey, i'd appreciate at this point if you would please stop tagging me, i'd rather not have to use the block feature as i really don't want to be blocking people in the community. Again, would be happy to continue discussion if you reset and answer my question. Thanks!
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3653646#Comment_3653646
So why Nurse is not getting her justice? Because i am sure most people would put Nurse higher tier than old medkits and self-heal.
Oh, so now nurse needs to get her justice? Ok, she'll get her justice when they massively nerf survivors as a whole again. Maybe increase gen times another 15-20 seconds.
Obviously i'm being ridiculous on purpose and i don't think that should happen.
But the point still stands, nurse is, per the data, one of the worst killers in the game. So now you have to reconcile this belief:
- Do we balance the game around high level players or average players?
- If we balance the game around average players, you'll need to explain why nurse who has nearly 10% less kill rate than the devs are balancing for needs any kind of change other than MASSIVE buffs.
- If we balance the game around high level players, you'll have to explain why nurse and blight are the only viable killers in the game and why that is not a problem.
Unless of course your belief is that we should only balance the game around high level KILLER players, but average level SURVIVOR players. In which case you are extremely biased. And at that point, you may as well just remove the killer role entirely and make it a bot.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
Nah, it needed. They nerfed healing and medkits to ground. Anti-heal needed some justice nerfs, yes? It's easy and free slowdown after all. Hitting survivors is your job, why game should give you free slowdown for this
They didn't "nerf healing into the ground" they nerfed medkits SELF-HEALING, which were in fact OP.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
We are getting new fun killers ( Chucky, Xeno, Larry ). UW and Friends Until End are good and fun perks. GE also buffed and now it's meta too.
Billy also buffed to very fun level. Sadako is in good spot right now, she is really so fun after her last rework.
I am not complaining about killer content. But we are getting nothing but garbage for survivors.
Ellen got bad perks, there was amazing suggestions for make them viable. But no. Ignored. And now nobody uses them.
Gabriel got MfT and it nuked to ground. This perk deserved to be nerfed tho but still Gabriel did not give us any good perk. Non of his perks are seeing in trials.
Alan Wake got with amazing bad perks. If i would rank survivors by their perks Alan Wake would sit on F tier. And sad thing, there was really good suggestions for his perks as well but nothing happened ofcourse. Even his first week, i did not see anyone uses his perks. Even Champion of Light.
There was chance to make Quick Gambit viable but no, we only got meh number tweaks and called it a day. Ofcourse this perk is still dead as before.
Survivors are getting bad and bad content, nothing good. Tomorrow is PTB and we all know new survivor will have another 3 garbage perks nobody will use.
We are getting tweaks for few killers for next update and some of them are really excited. But what survivors are getting? Nothing.
Again, i am not complaining about killers are getting good content. But problem is that, survivors are not getting enough content. It feels like BHVR is just don't care about survivors.
What content exactly are you expecting? Survivors are all just skins and just add perks. I wouldn't even agree that perks are "content" because realistically, they could easily add a half dozen perks every week if they really wanted to since they are really just simple modifiers most of the time.
The "content" that survivors get, is new killers to play against.
You mention perks not being "viable" so in that realm, then all the killers you just mentioned also are not viable either at a high level, so killers have gotten 0 content too.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3653053#Comment_3653053
Isn't the answer to that question a pretty obvious "both, and also people who are below average too"? What's the discussion that comes from that?
Genuine question, to be clear.
Ok, so now,
- You have something that is super overpowered in the hands of a high level player, but super underpowered in the hands of a low level player what do you do?
- You have something that is super overpowered AGAINST low level players but super underpowered AGAINST high level players. What do you do?
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@crogers271 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3652121#Comment_3652121
I brought up the stats are bad, you said they are good. So i asked you if you believe the conclusions the stats lead you down, that skull merchant is the best killer in the game, and nurse is one of the worst. Then you brought up a hypothetical. I mentioned why that hypothetical won't exist.This never happened with me.
I've been in lots of discussions with you and this is a frequent occurrence where your responses feel like they are to an entirely different argument. If I was being generous I'd say its because you take all of the arguments of people disagreeing with you and lump them together.
The Skull Merchant conversation is one that happened with @radiantHero23 and @JeanGreyarea - You dropped out of the conversation with radiant when he pointed out, accurately, that you were saying things he had never said.
Hypothetical - I have no idea what you are talking about. I did a quick search of the thread and can't find it.
Stats - I think pretty much everyone recognizes that there are other things that influence the stats and we can disagree over what has caused them to look the way they do. I'd say the stats are useful.
And now you are arguing against that hypothetical. So my point is. You are strawmanning. So. Lets get back on the actual topic instead of the strawman you have built up.I've posted three times before this post. Unless this post starts a page 5, all my posts have been on page 4, and one was to @Pulsar.
My initial post I disagreed with your assertion that NOED kills somehow shouldn't count. That's it, I didn't jump on any other conversation.
To my first post you countered that it wouldn't be fun if every game was like that.
I then responded that no one ever said every game, you jumped to that. I then talked about how those matches are critical to the playstyle of the game and can be very fun.
I can reset this conversation by asking you a simple question which will lead us to down the path of trying to find out what you believe.Simple.Should this game be balanced around high level players, the best of the best high MMR. Or should the game be balanced around average level (the vast majority) of players?I'll save you the time because we've been down the road before and I've seen you do it with others. You treat it as a trump card that exposes hypocrisy when its really a bad argument.
First, its a false dichotomy. That is you are presenting a question as if there are only two options when there are many more.
Most people say around the middle or the average, which is a general statement that you then treat as an absolute. You set up the question with a 'simple' implying a basic answer, but you then treat responses as if they've made an overarching statement that can never be deviated from. There also becomes disagreement about what it means to 'balance around the middle' where you've made arguments that I thought exactly fall into that definition.
From there you either post the TF2 video or ask where are the Nurse buffs. The TF2 video is fine, but what its discussing usually doesn't apply to DbD.
On the Nurse buffs there are three responses - you are confusing game balance with game design, that many people just want a Nurse rework, or that Nurse should be evened out (buffed and nerfed).
I've never seen you respond to any of those issues, but its possible I missed it. So if you just want to jump to that point we can.
I'm going to disengage from you at this point since you want to continue arguing against a strawman and not have discussions in good faith. If you would like to reset the conversation and continue talking, you can answer my previous question
Should this game be balanced around high level players (top mmr) or average players (where most players are)
If you aren't willing to go on that route and want to continue arguing with a strawman then i'll just move on from this discussion. No point in continuing if someone won't do so in good faith.
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@CrypticGirl said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3652474#Comment_3652474
Sure you can make them "stay," but can you make them participate? No. They'll just doom their team in other ways. So if they want to leave that badly, let them. There's no reason to force people to stay if they've already decided they're not going to participate.
Games where Killers give up are usually much shorter than the ones where Survivors give up. Even when the Killer doesn't DC, they can just go afk. Survivors bust out the gens and then leave in less than five minutes.
"Why is this loophole allowed?" Because the 4% is an important mechanic that shouldn't be touched. You can't disallow it without ruining its intended purpose, or the acceptable scenarios (such as throwing on hook to give last person hatch, or you have no choice but to 4% because all your teammates are dead/slugged/hooked).
If they want to discourage throwing on hook, they need to put a cap on the DC penalty stacks. That's the main reason why people take the hook suicide route to leave matches. The fact that the DC penalty can stack to 24-48 hours or even more is just nothing short of absolutely insane.
Yeah, you can, in those exact same games, they harshly do the same punishments for people who:
- Troll
- AFK
- Feed (killing themselves on purpose)
- Griefing teammates (body blocking?)
- etc.
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@SOULWARRIOR71K said:
If you’ve kicked a gen 8 times, that’s a minimum of 40% regression before accounting for any perks or regression time after the kick. How many times do you really think you need to kick 1 gen in a match?
I think the point is that it "feels bad" like, here i am being told by the game to "stop winning so hard" basically.
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@concubined said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/J6VA0T4NMSAP/img-7220.jpeg
I was very reluctant to try this build because of the obvious inconsistency, I like solid perks that gives value no matter the circumstance and situations.
But so far I haven’t lost a game (less than a 4k) and I would say I get Starstruck value around at least once or twice every match. I would love some advice on maybe how to better the build somehow? I bought Wesker today just for it
No gen defense means you are gonna lose most games against any decent team. Also its one of those builds that, as soon as survivors know what you are doing, it is super easy to counter.
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@Shroompy said:
Title, ever since the beginning this has been one of the worst parts of Solo Q and there hasnt been any hint of the devs doing anything about it. Worst part is it goes around the disconnect penalty, and doesnt even leave the rest of the team with a bot which is without a doubt better than nothing.
Making it reportable would not only deincentivize people from dcing, but also punish repeat offenders. I cant see how this is a bad thing
Now before you all say "but there are certain times where its the correct play!!" and to that I say bodyblocking. It is also a punishable offense, but only if it holds the game hostage. It is VERY clear when it is used strategically and to hold the game hostage. Killing yourself on hook is also VERY obvious when it is done to throw the game.
If its not made to be reportable, then come up with a solution.
The answer i always get is:
"You can't make people play a game they don't want to" To which my reply is, actually yes you can. Look at games like DotA which SEVERELY punishes leaving games, such that you get 1 free leave PER WEEK. If you leave more than 1 game a WEEK, you start getting punished and punished SEVERELY. And the part about that i don't get? Games of DotA can last well over an hour. So in that game, where matches can last over an hour, they manage to get people to stay till the end of the game. But for some reason someone can't do that for an 8 minute game of dead by daylight?
The other aspect of it that people fail to address. Lets say i buy your premise that "you can't keep people in the game" So why can't killers end the match early too? Why is it only survivors that are afforded this "luxury" where they can leave the match.
Lastly, there already is a system in place that punishes you for disconnecting. So why is this loophole allowed? The point of the DC penalty is to discourage it, so obviously the devs don't like it when people DC, or the penalty would be removed. At least when you DC, your team gets a bot and can continue on, at least a little bit. But killing yourself on first hook means you basically doom your team to a guaranteed loss. So why is it allowed?
IDK. I think that people who do this kind of thing are in the same vein as people who don't put their carts back at the grocery store.
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@ChuckingWong said:
Starting to believe more and more that people just repeat what someone says, rather than actually approaching it themselves.
Originally, the people who say hes a meme are extremely high tier content creators that, in every shape or form of the game, are more experienced at the game than... 99% of DBD's active player base. So people take what those players say, repeat it, and apply it to themselves when it comes to killers like Freddy or Pig.
Personally for me,
I have never seen a series of games where Freddy is just this huge meme that everyone seems to make him out to be. He has okayish antiloop with his slow, can pressure the map quite well with teleport, and force out pallets so he can fake them later. You are also at somewhat of a disadvantage on survivor with the undetectable part and relying on his lullaby to tell if hes getting close.
Seems like all the tools that are there for a pretty decent killer. He doesn't move slow or anything, normal movement and all...
If we look at stats and then try to derive anything as simple as "well I guess Low MMR must carry" then we have to also acknowledge things that might conflict with theories like this.
For example: Nurse, arguably the strongest killer in DBD, seemingly has now TWICE been on the LOW end of general kill rates. If she was so "strong" shouldn't she be much higher in the kill list?
How is low MMR carrying Freddy/Pig, a meme apparently, but not Nurse?
Surely without a doubt, if Freddy is such a meme the community makes him out to be, shouldn't Nurses kill rate, ESPECIALLY overall, TWICE NOW, be far ahead of him?
Its just not consistent with the data released. And it makes me more and more skeptical when people try to downplay what a killer is capable of because of something they took out of context from a content creator.
He is a meme, his power slows down the same as clowns, and yet can't be used unless the person is dreaming and only covers a specific tiny spot that is easy to avoid. He was nerfed in a way that makes it so he can only set 5 traps, so he can't setup a web of traps anymore. So his slowdown power is literally just a significantly worse version of clown there. Then there is his teleport. He can teleport once every 45 seconds to a generator with each survivor that is asleep reducing the cooldown by 15%, to a maximum of an 18 second cooldown.
Now factor in that unless he's running the iri addon. he has to land a hit on someone or wait 60 seconds before survivors fall asleep. All while playing literally without a power because he starts with a cooldown on his power, and survivors can't be affected by the snare.
I can't imagine that even if his teleport was just baseline 18 second cooldown all the time, that he was still any good as a killer.
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@crogers271 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3651450#Comment_3651450
Because if ever single game where the killer won ended up like that, do you think that would make the game fair and balanced? And thats not a gameplay loop that is fun for either side.Well that's moving the goalposts a lot. We've gone from not counting to every game.
Is it fun as survivor to be playing well the whole match, and lose simply because the killer hit you with noed at slightly the wrong time?Um, yes? That's what makes survivor fun in the long run.
Is it fun in the moment? No, its agonizing to die when the escape is so close. But that's what makes survivor exciting, the knowledge that the situation can be turned around on you at any moment. Escapes as survivor feel much more rewarding than victory in other games because the intensity stays until the end of the match.
It's what makes DbD appealing. If I'm playing a team deathmatch style symmetrical game and my team jumps out to a significant lead, we're going to win. The game becomes uninteresting. DbD doesn't work like that, just because the survivors are outplaying the killer doesn't mean they are safe.
Is it fun as the killer to get completely stomped the entire game until noed carries you?If you don't find it fun the solution here is easy as you don't have to take the perk. But if you have the perk and plan around it, then yes, it can be quite a bit of fun. Snatching victory away from the survivors is exactly the thing many killers are looking for.
But at this point you are arguing against a point i shouldn't have even brought up because it isn't really relevant to the discussion.The reason I spent time on the other posts is that I think a lot of people want DbD to be something its not. We all have things we don't like about the game and wish we could change, but a personal dislike is different from it not working.
I'd like to stick actually on topic and talk about how the stats are useless.Stats aren't useless. As BHVR has said, they don't tell the whole story. A stat alone might also have multiple reasons why it might be true, but they certainly aren't useless.
My point is you are arguing with a strawman at this point.
I brought up the stats are bad, you said they are good. So i asked you if you believe the conclusions the stats lead you down, that skull merchant is the best killer in the game, and nurse is one of the worst. Then you brought up a hypothetical. I mentioned why that hypothetical won't exist. And now you are arguing against that hypothetical. So my point is. You are strawmanning. So. Lets get back on the actual topic instead of the strawman you have built up.
I can reset this conversation by asking you a simple question which will lead us to down the path of trying to find out what you believe.
Simple.
Should this game be balanced around high level players, the best of the best high MMR. Or should the game be balanced around average level (the vast majority) of players?