Predated
Predated
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Billy's chainsaw sound being global instead of directional already kinda makes him stealthy, I've been instadowned by a charging billy more than once simply because he didnt come from the direction I last saw him in and he moved too fast for me to react. So if you gonna add that, then billy's normal sounds need to be directional again.
With proper practice, you can already steer Billy over 90 degrees. Which is why a lot of people say that Bubba is simply a very weak Billy. Billy can do the same things Bubba can, adding even easier steering to the point where he replaces Bubba fully leaves no reason for people to even want to touch Bubba.
Besides, his current addons are already very good, adding those ones would simply be overkill.
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I dont think they will, at least not for some time(remember, Dweard used to be event exclusive only and now everyone owns Dweard by default). However, you can bet your ass that they will have a similar reskin of that model in a future rift. Probably not in the exact same colors, but its likely to reappear.
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@InsidiousSmartfaceLF said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1258629#Comment_1258629
Woah, that's a spooky triple post. Yeah I guess that makes sense, but I don't think it's really Freddy's fault but a lot of people are wanting Freddy nerfs because he's strong and popular.
Yeah, its not freddy's fault, its the devs fault.
The only reason Freddy is popular is because he is literally the strongest killer in the game. Even with Huntress and Nurse, you'd want to try and aim for a 3-gen if possible. With Freddy, all gens are 3-gens. Then he also has one of the strongest looping counters in the game. The only downside to Freddy is that IF you finish all 5 gens, Freddy loses all his map pressure. Which is why people are pretty much forced to run NOED on Freddy to compensate for that weakness, and you have a killer that has massive map pressure, can easily break loops and has a strong lategame. Ofcourse you could argue "do totems", but any second not doing gens against a Freddy is giving Freddy more time to kill people. That is the problem. Nurse has the issue that even though she cannot be looped, she still needs to move distance to apply pressure. Huntress has the issue that even though she can prevent some loops, she either needs massive skill on hitting far gens or needs to move closer. Billy can have massive map pressure, but in close corners with a strong window, he can be looped for quite some time. Freddy? If he thinks a chase is taking too long, he simply teleports to the generator on the opposite side of the map that he think is being done to prevent it being finished and chase someone else. Map size doesnt affect Freddy. There is no real way to counter his ability other than to constantly wake each other up, and even: "Every second not doing a gen is giving Freddy more time to kill people". I played Freddy twice, I consider myself quite an above average killer for my rank(I'm getting 3-4k's relatively consistently while in redranks, only times I get 2k's or less is because I was too obsessed with chasing 1 specific survivor that obviously was too good at looping me) while playing trapper, pig, doc, spirit and sometimes even bubba. Yet, when I play Freddy, I always feel disgusted at the end of the match, because no matter how good the other players are, I get an easy 4k while basically just ######### around. Only the first time I ever played Freddy, people managed to escape(2 people who managed to wake each other up consistently using skillchecks, which is the best way of waking up and preventing Freddy from teleporting). And after 10 total games of Freddy, all 5 gens have been finished twice, and a total of 3 people have escaped. Not even with Spirit could I do that, as Spirit at least requires you to learn how to listen to breathing and grass moving while phasing, which takes 5 games before you get accurate. Freddy is literally just a killer you play because you have to do a Freddy related challenge, thats it. That's how boring he is to play and to play against.
How they should nerf Freddy? Perhaps allowing the fake pallets to actually stun Freddy for 55%(5% with enduring), or giving someone who got tricked by a fake pallet/blood pool to be in a mending state, so that while injured, Freddy doesnt get an easy down. Or perhaps Freddy's teleport timer to deplete massively while channeling for a teleport. Or simply allowing survivors to wake each other up faster, even while in the dreamstate. Or simply not slowing down people in bloodpools as much while they are in a chase(5% instead of 15%).
I get that he earns the powerup kinda, as old Tier F killers literally were named after Freddy, with Freddy being the sole killer in that Tier. But Freddy is now the only Tier S killer as there is no other killer to compare with his strength. Huntress and Nurse used to be S-Tier killers, but they cant, because they are weak in comparison to Freddy.
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@Peanits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1256801#Comment_1256801
I don't that that's so controversial. It seems pretty reasonable to me, honestly. Granted, it would have to be high enough such that someone who is playing normally with a good connection without a server nearby doesn't have any issue playing, but I don't see anything wrong with a high limit (say, 250ms). It is an online game, after all. While I do empathize with people who are having connection issues, it is on you to get that fixed, not everyone else's responsibility to deal with it for you. Those are real people you're playing with, not bots.
Although that's just one way to deal with it. There are other ways to handle it, such as by taking away hit authority and instead handling it on the server. That way if you have a terrible connection, you're the one that feels it, not the other people with good connections.
True, while I am not certain how to relay survivor ping back to the killer, but survivor pings during that game were anywhere between 140-220, making regular chases still managable, but any projectile calculation was(quite obviously, hence the post) done with killer priority. If it were just me, then obviously I got connected to the wrong server, but everyone except the killer had issues, as if it was way back during the Beta when hillbillies could down a survivor even though the survivor was nowhere near the killer.
It's honestly too bad that there are only 3 projectile based killers, otherwise it would be nice to display ping and if it were a projectile killer or not. With the obvious problem with the ping being people dodging anything thats higher than 50, even though, in my experience, projectile based killers dont really start getting dedicated hits untill 100+ ping.
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@TheRockstarKnight said:
How about we let players play who they want to play and instead let Survivors see the Killer's ping pre-game, so they can dodge the lobby if it's too crazy for them.
And practically have some people never being able to enter a game because their ping is higher than 50, even though games up to 100 ping are just fine as they are? No thanks, I rather have 1 specific killer being temporarily locked than having to wait 1 hour in matchmaking because people dont like the 60 ping that I currently have due to folding covid proteins and uploading data to research centers in the background(and I am certain I am not the only one doing that), which practically has no effect on the connection and gameplay, but connection elitists will try to dodge regardless. Let alone that you'd have to apply that same rule to survivors too and killers who see 50+ ping will dodge aswell.
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@BunnyTheHutt said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1243060#Comment_1243060
A: some maps do still have infinites, like Lery's. B: Breakable walls are only in one map, just because they are going to be in other maps doesn't mean they are. C: Just because killers have powers doesn't mean they can all stop chases. Trappers power only stop chases if the survivor is running into a trap, Michael can only stop chases if he's in tier 3 for insta downs, Legion's power almost works against them at this point, and so one and so one. D: Second chance perks aren't a myth, don't be ignorant lol. DS is the most heavily contested one of them all. Dead hard, though easily baited, can still extend chases when used right. Unbreakable is amazing when paired with DS, etc.
As I said, in the future when the game is more balanced I could see the game without bloodlust, but at the moment it's kinda needed because of the reasons I stated.
A: Leri's whole Schtick is the windows, but they are all mindgame-able, so even though its technically an infinite, there is no infinite route.
B: "just because they are going to be in other maps doesn't mean they are" What? Because they are going to be added they arent going to be added? Doesnt make any sense. And yes, they are going to be implemented. Possibly where currently walls are removed from godloops. So that the godloop initially exists, but can be broken.
C: yes, they can. Trapper is all about trapping a place and pushing survivors in that direction. A good trapper wont be in a chase for long. Especially if you early set up for a 3-gen. Myers can only really hit in t3, but you're ignoring the fact that he can vault faster than other killers, allowing him to vault-mindgame a lot more effectively than other killers. Legions power can easily be used to gapclose and bodyblock. If you vault a pallet and then bodyblock the pallet while hitting the survivor, the survivor is forced to run away from that loop. So no, your point is moot.
D: Yes they are:
DS doesnt work unless you pick a survivor up within 60 seconds of unhooking, this can easily be avoided, by simply ignoring them for 60 seconds. It's only strong during the EGC when you down them in front of the exit gate, but that is because the exit gate is simply overpowered, not because of DS.
Dead hard can extend chases when used right, but so can head-on, flashlights, 99% sprintburst, balanced landing, lithe, quick&quiet, Dance With Me, Pallets, Windows, Self-Care(even though self-care is one of the shittiest survivor perks atm), For The People, Alert, Urban Evasion, Diversion, Hope, Mettle of Man, Windows of Oppertunity, Small Game(vs trapper and hag), Iron Will and even Lightweight can even do that when used right. Sure, using deadhard for a pallet vault can buy someone a lot of time, but many, MANY perks can buy you time. Yet none of those are something you consider second chance. Dead Hard allows you to force a killer to miss when otherwise he would hit. Congratulations, you just described doing a 360.
Unbreakable is strong with DS, yes. Just as Quick&Quiet is strong with Lithe and/or Dance With Me. Other than that? Again, that combo doesnt work if you ignore them for 60 seconds. If you had a 40 second chase and tunneled them, then you can simply leave because it takes 30 seconds to pick yourself up with unbreakable, and a slugged survivor cant do ######### otherwise.
Basically this argument is "I cant bruteforce my way through these perks, so they shouldnt exist". This game isnt just mindlessly hitting survivors, you have to consider some things. If you can slug someone early game and they are forced to use unbreakable early game, great, then they cant use it later. I've only been hit with a DS once in my entire killer career, because I was in a 2v1 and the exit gate was opened nearby. I literally had no choice. Did he deserve the escape? Yes. I would have gotten a 4k if his friend didnt go for the hooksafe, and he knew that, so he risked his own life to ensure an escape.
I didnt mention Adrenaline? Well, if you want that gone, then NOED needs to go too. Adrenaline only works when all 5 gens are finished. Survivors cant pull off the Adrenaline heal+sprint unless they finish 5 full gens. Just like NOED grants the instadown+haste bonus after all 5 gens are done. The only difference is that NOED can be prevented by doing totems, but that costs a lot of time, time that's wasted if there is no noed and could cost survivors the game. Yet NOED isnt a second chance perk. Even though a terrible survivor with adrenaline tends to die before the 5th gen is finished while a terrible killer with NOED can pull a 2k out of his ass by simply using NOED.
As for BT, it literally only works if survivors are inside your terror radius. If you for some reason have a massive terror radius, then yeah, other than that, simply dont camp a hook and BT will never work.
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@CornMoss said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1251431#Comment_1251431
Ghost face and doctor are a lot easier to use than other killers but they definitely are not EZ mode. Killer IMO takes way more skill than survivor yet I wouldn't say survivor is EZ mode
I wouldnt say playing killer takes more skill. Some killers do, like Huntress, Deathslinger and Nurse, but other than that? It's mainly mindgames, and even with mindgames, killers are moving faster so even if a survivor has better mindgames, they tend to be hit.
For a single survivor to barely get hit by the average killer requires a lot more skill than it is for a killer to get a 4k against the average survivor.
As for ez mode, well, freddy is ez mode. I feel disgusted by how easy he is to play.
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@MetroSlayer_DC said:
@Predated The only man in this site to speak the truth.
Survivors mains like us really know how bad they pandered to killers.
Well, there have been a lot of survivor sided things that have been pandered to aswell. But killer mains are too blind to see both sides.
I really liked the breakable walls being added and cant wait for them to be added to other maps(perhaps on godloops where they now simply put holes) and I'm hoping the next killer gets a perk that allows him to instabreak a breakable wall while exposing anyone on the recieving end. It's a balanced killer sided update. But a lot of killer mains wont be happy untill their average game has a 4k. Which is simply unbalanced AF. My average game has 3,5k because I havent played killer much to rank up, so I'm facing survivors that are far below my killer capacity, even when I'm just screwing around. But when im in redranks, my average killrate tends to be about 2k. Anyone thinking a 0k game isnt acceptable, should also be accepting that 0 survivors escaping isnt acceptable. Yet they want a 4k to be acceptable but a 4 man escape to be impossible.
Killer mains are entitled as #########. Yes, there are entitled survivors, but they are in a minority.
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@gantes said:
Like, between t-bagging, emotes, etc, every single multiplayer game has some sort of "rubbing it in" interaction when you win/want to tilt your opponent, and I've never seen a community more sensitive to this than the DBD community. It's very weird.
Taunting isnt exactly the issue here. Its being able to bodyblock a survivor from midway of the map all the way to the exitgate after opening the exit gates without anyone being at risk from being downed unless you run NOED and they didnt cleanse the bones.
It's too riskless during a period where the killer's pressure should have snowballed to that point. If you destroyed the killer in general, then there wouldnt even need to be a bodyblock like that. If 1-2 survivors heavily outclass the killer, then they can bodyblock the killer to protect 2 survivors, of which at least one would have been downed.
It's not about the tbag, its not about the emotes, its about a game mechanic that should be equal to risking your chance at escape in favor of ensuring 3 other people escape. And if you play it properly and didnt waste resources, you actually get rewarded for that. Just like saving a pallet early game tends to reward you having saved it late game.
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@ClickyClicky said:
Well yeah I see your point it has a number of upsides for killer and the only downside is it bones survivors and robs them of an escape but who cares about them right?
this forum 🙄
There is realistically only 1 scenario where its a downside for survivors. Besides, as I stated later, on first entry, you could apply a 5 seconds endurance buff, meaning it turns into a resource you can waste.
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@Magikazam said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1243152#Comment_1243152
Im more in the situation when you down someone who not yet close enought to the exit then you get body blocked by 3 people. that just anoying. the survivor decided to be cocky for no reason? he should be punished and no comeback should be possible, Killer gameplay relly only on survivor mistake and face 4 of them who got built in way to trivialise their mistake as a team (body blocking ,flashlight save, sabotage..) but they also got many perks to trivialise their mistake whitout their teamate help.
The killer can't even choose a playstyle anymore. Wanna camp? survivor can just ignore you, and if you do it in a case where they swarm the hook and it acctualy as good time to camp compared to b4. well the game ranking system punish you for it.
Wanna tunnel? Survivor, as a team, can body block and such, that fine. But not they also can bring BT and DS they don't need any kind of strat now...
Wanna slug? No mither, unbreakable that can also be combined with DS.
So what option is left? hook someone and go for another survivor, that your only choice now. You suposed to be the power roll, but survivor decide how the game goes, and if they decided they want to tryhard a do a four man escape, too bad for you.
Well, like I said, if its a resource they can use, then they earned that. 3 survivors can not fully bodyblock a killer, you can eventually walk around them.
Besides, I already commented on why second chance perks are a myth. I've never been DS'd in my time as a killer, because I know how DS operates. I've actually been able to use BT in my favor(its better for a survivor to be mending than fixing a gen while injured with Resillience). Unbreakable doesnt really happen. I actually respect the No Mither and slug them constantly after 2 hooks, because a slugged survivor is better than a sacrificed survivor(untill I have someone else on 2 hooks). Cus even with No Mither, survivors will be trying to save that person unless they are a 4-man SWF.
"So what option is left? hook someone and go for another survivor, that your only choice now. You suposed to be the power roll, but survivor decide how the game goes, and if they decided they want to tryhard a do a four man escape, too bad for you."
That's kinda how the game is meant tho. If you hook a survivor, you're forcing another survivor to go for the rescue, thats 2 survivors not doing gens. Then you chase someone else, 3 survivors not doing gens. Having 2 survivors on the hook and chasing someone else? Great, thats all 4 survivors not doing gens while you gain hooks. Brute forcing your way to a quick 2 hook triggers perks like DS.
FYI: if someone who actually has been really toxic(blinding every possible vault and pallet), then jumps in a locker after being unhooked, simply wait 60 seconds. Their DS cant work after that, they cant have head-on because a crow spawned and unless they are in a very open spot, they cant flashlight save that person either.
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@brokedownpalace said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1243183#Comment_1243183
It is not unbalanced at all lol. Your bias is showing.
I'm actually survivor biased. 1000 hours survivor, only about 200 hours killer. I only use the bodyblocking tactic when the killer is a general #########(aka, tunneling 1 survivor all game, then claiming that its not against the rules so calling him an ######### is out of line. Being right with the rules doesnt make you less of an ######### Kyle). But when the killer is anything but a tunneling #########, he doesnt deserve a bodyblock like that. I might bait him while injured when I have sprintburst. But then its the killers fault for falling for the bait.
It is simply an unfair situation. Do you remember old school hooks? When the killer could bodyblock while facecamping, and due to how the game worked, you couldnt unhook him because the only way to unhook was for the killer to move aside? Yeah, it's that level of unfair. The killer facecamp got fixed years ago, I was there and it was a great moment to bamboozle those asshat killers who didnt read the patchnotes with BT(which at the time would protect both the rescuer and the rescué). So why think the bodyblock camping was unfair, but the bodyblock exit gate isnt? That is a bias.
As a survivor main, it's in my personal interest to not nerf the exit gate, yet, the evidence stacks up to how unbalanced the exitgate is from an outside point of view.
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Okay, lets compare practicality:
- Gens take 80 seconds to fix, 47 with 2, 38 with 3. Working with 3 people on 1 gen isnt practical
- Total hooktime is 120 seconds, but the average game, you get saved within 30 seconds, meaning practical hooktime is 60 seconds, unless you're camping the hook.
- When 1 person is being healed, while you're chasing 1 person, that means at most only 1 person can do gens.
- Second chance perks only work if you're allowing them to work. BT doesnt work if you dont hit the unhooked survivor for 15 seconds, DS doesnt work if you dont go after the unhooked survivor. Borrowed Time doesnt work well if you slug people too long. Basically, for second chance perks to fail, all you need to do is not chase someone who got fresh off the hook. If you can somehow slug all 4 survivors, start picking up in the order that you downed them, rather than picking up the last one you hit. Because by that time, the chance of DS are practically 0.
Self-care sucks, no mither sucks(seriously, if you slug someone with no mither, who is obviously in broken status, and dont pick them up for 30 seconds, its your fault), deliverance is a double bladed sword, you can free yourself, but only after you unhooked someone, and even then you get broken and it doesnt work if you're the last survivor either. The only "second chance" perk I could grant you, is Adrenaline, but even Adrenaline only works when you're injured/downed while the 5th gen starts. An adrenaline play is so rare, that its practically worthless unless the killer slugged you and closes the hatch before picking you up.
And yeah, how much it sucks someone jumping in a locker with DS, it's in your best interest to simply leave them alone. Either that, or camp the locker for 40 seconds+ seconds.
"yet killer get extremly punished by the ranking system for doing it, no matte
r what the situation. My problem with this is, Why punishing the killer? they will lose if the survivor simply rush gens."
Camping is being discouraged by not rewarding it with pips. The same reason why a 4k with Ebony Mori doesnt reward you with pips. It's simply a boring way of playing.
"but why does survivors have SO many perk to counter it. Relly even whitout perks you can sabotage hook, flashlight save, body block. and then even if you still want another safer option there is BT. "
Tunneling cant be punished with removing pips, as there is no real difference between chasing a survivor and a freshly unhooked survivor, so there are perks to discourage that. However: "Why is the killer punished by so many counter cause they try to use the best logical way to slow down the game?" This is not the case. DS doesnt work unless you want to hook someone. BT actually can work in your favour by hitting the unhooked survivor(if they dont have BT, then you slug the unhooked survivor, forcing someone else to heal him up, AKA less people doing gens), while you chase the other survivor. Picking up a person to hook them again, is less logical than slugging them and going for someone else.
"Remove locker+ds combo, make it so it Unbreakable and DS have a shared ''Exhaustion-ish'' coldown so you can create a perfectly safe situation."
You do realise that it takes 2 perk slots for DS and Unbreakable to even work, right? Thats like saying "nerf selfcare and botany knowledge". Or even: dont make Sloppy Butcher and Thanatophobia stack. Would you be okay with Thana and Sloppy being mutually exclusive, when there is no real reason to do so, other than the reason that they have synergy. Or how about Ruin and Surveillance? Or Overcharge and Unnerving Presence? Some strong synergies exist, and again, if someone wastes their unbreakable early in the game, then you know you can slug them late game without them having any means of picking themselves up.
- Nerf survivor second chance perk
- Nerf survivor self reliancer perk (self care and co)
- Buff killer Gens/gate pressure perk.
- Give killer a better way in their base kit to slow down gens.
- Keep survivor perk as they are, but make them die on second hook.
- Keep survivor perk as they are, but survivor each only have 2 or 3 slots.
Lets quickly recap:
- only works when you tunnel in the first place
- self aiding perks actually suck hard. The only reason they are used at all is in case of incompetent survivors(or survival points). We'll make it is 10x stronger than Self-Care.
- Those perks are fine as is. The whole thing about killer is not to tunnel survivors too much, and knowing when to quit a chase. If the perks do all the pressure for you, then survivors should have perks that relieve that pressure, meaning they'd have very strong perks to counter a killer who doesnt use those perks, meaning those perks are basically enforced on killers. Pressure comes from the player, not the perks.
- They already do: go to a gen, kick it, scout out a potential 3-gen and defend that 3-gen.
- Then you might aswell make ebony mori a baseline perk. No, 3 hooks per survivor, otherwise I'd have no reason to not tunnel.
- You do realize that a killer perk is about 3 times stronger than the survivor perk? Meaning that if survivors do not counter a perk, you have a really strong perk, and that it takes 4 survivors using 4 perk slots to overcome a single killer perk? I mean, lets take Sloppy Butcher(one of the stronger killer perks atm), now, survivors can use Autodidact to kinda counter it. However, to get 3+ stacks of autodidact each it requires at least 1 healthstate(if they are lucky) and at most 4 health states. It's extremely strong if everyone has 3+ stacks of autodidact, as it completely counters Sloppy at that point, but leaves less room for other perks. Then if you see people scatter away from a gen before your terror radius even reaches there, then you know they have Spine Chill. Another perkslot gone. Basically, its a game if figuring out perks. If survivors dont suspect a NOED, then you get a free NOED. If they cleanse the easy to spot bones first, that increases the chance of NOED spawning on a hard to spot place.
The game is actually a lot more balanced than most people think or realize. Sure, some maps are super strong for survivors, but some maps are also super strong for killers. Sure, some maps have strong pallet loops, but other maps lack pallets and windows, and the ones they do have are very weak and can only realistically be used once.
As you've obviously seen before, I am of the opinion that the exit gate needs nerfing, but that is truly the only place for survivors that really need nerfing. Some killers actually need buffing, some survivor perks actually need buffing. Hell, I am of the opinion that survivors should have a semi-insignificant passive that only works when they carry their own perks(Obviously in tiers, up to 3 tiers, for example, Meg is an athlete, it makes sense for her exhaustion to go down faster than Bill's, even if its just 1 second difference).
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@brokedownpalace said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1243130#Comment_1243130
Just stop. It's never going to happen. Hit the survivors to force them out and move on with your life like everybody else does. No need for any convoluted "solutions" that cause more problems.
"this part of the game is very unbalanced, but fixing it requires a lot of thinking, therefor we might aswell never try finding a solution"
That's your attitude. And no, it doesnt cause more problems than it fixes. It creates a few problems that are easily fixable by applying a bit of practical thinking. I'm not saying my solution is the best solution, but its the best I can currently think off and leaves the game far more balanced than the current exit gate is.
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@OutcastEric said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1242341#Comment_1242341
Can we at least make it so if I down a survivor at the spike's they dont fall out of the game and escape? Theres a level of toxicity that survivors know they're inflicting after all four of them sit there tbagging waiting to be hit twice after just wrecking you on comms. It's frustrating. Either that or walk around the map while they refuse to leave and let the 3 minute timer run down. I wish I had more of a threatening presence as killer in these situations. Not be a joke to survivors egos
To be fair, thats mostly done to give the killer a final hit. If you're gonna stand around and do nothing, then they're gonna start tbag to taunt you to hit them.
You cant assume toxicity just because youre frustrated.
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@Magikazam said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1243031#Comment_1243031
Except killer should be able to take hostage. Survivors have a extremly gigantic tons of tools to deny any kind of play the killer have and the killer can't do the same. differance is that the killer should acctualy be strong and survivor should acctualy be weaker. there 4 of them.
No, no hostages. I mean, unless you call putting someone on the hook while facecamping them hostage, which is fair, but thats not really a hostage situation.
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@PrettyFaceKate said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1241288#Comment_1241288
The egc is meant to avoid hostage situations and stalemates. It's not meant for the killer to be the most dangerous.
Late game pretty much is meant for both, perhaps its an IMO, but I've always seen the EGC as an incentive to get out ASAP. After the final gen is finished, there should be no incentive to entering the trial when you can escape without an added risk to it.
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@Peanits said:
This has been suggested in the past, but there's a pretty major flaw in this: Say you're healthy. You're running towards the gate and the killer is right on your tail. You get to the gate, and now you have two options.
- Enter the gate area and try to escape. If you do, you're exposed and you'll go down before you can escape.
- Wait for the killer to hit you and use that speed boost to get out the gate. If they're smart and don't hit you, the collapse will kill you. If it hasn't started, they can just open the gate.
The benefit to it? There's not really anything that I can see, other than an indirect buff to Blood Warden as you've mentioned. If they're sitting there teabagging in the exit gates right at the threshold, there's no difference between downing them in one hit and having them fall into the escape zone and downing them in two hits and having them fall into the escape zone. They're still going to escape no matter what. It would punish ordinary people who are just trying to escape more than it would people who are trying to BM. I don't think it's worthwhile when you can already just hit them out.
True, but there is quite an easy fix to that tbh:
On first entry(perhaps even while in chase), get a 5 second endurance buff, that way if you're chased inside, you can still escape, but if you re-enter the trial, you're at risk.
I mean, the whole thing about the EGC is that it should be the most dangerous part of the game. Leaving the exit gates in favor of saving a teammate should bear some risks to it. That way, you could still potentially bodyblock with that 5 second endurance on someone who went back, but it would actually be a resource that can be used, rather than simply an area. Considering it takes about 2,5 seconds to move from entrance to the actual escape, 5 seconds should leave enough wiggle room.
I get that just slapping exposed on that area is gonna create problems, but it's a lot easier to think of a way to nerf the exit gate area too much and then worry on buffing it again, than to leave it as is. I also get that this kind of behaviour only really applies to higher skilled players. But that is a bit of the problem: higher skilled players abuse game mechanics that are fine for the average player. Its why the flashlight is considered toxic, even though as an item its just fine. It's why Ebony Mori is considered overpowered, even though in theory, its fine. I'm just adding in my 2 cents to find ways to practically have no difference for the average player.
Personally, I think its a possibility worth exploring and tweaking. It makes a lot more killers lategame viable without buffing strong late game killers too much.
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@BunnyTheHutt said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/146378/should-blood-lust-be-removed-completely
Im sure at some point in the future DBD could live without Bloodlust, but right now where maps still have massive infinites even after a lot were removed and survivors having so many second chance perks, it would be way too unfair for killers too not have something to catch up too survivors.
You do realize the "massive" infinites have just been broken right? And the fact that breakable walls are gonna be added in other maps.
Second chance perks are a myth, they are easily baitable.
As for catching up to survivors, well, survivors only have windows and pallets, base mechanic wise. All other killers:
Trapper has traps, Wraith is super fast when cloaked, Billy has a super sprint and a relatively quick way to destroy pallets, Nurse has teleports, Huntress has hatchets, Myers has stalking and faster vault speeds, Hag has portal traps, Doctor has his shocks to prevent anything except exhaustion perks, Bubba has a relatively quick way to destroy pallets and on most loops, his crazed boost is fast enough to catch up, Freddy has fake pallets or slows, Pig has an ambush, Clown has a massive slow, Spirit has her phasing, Legion has his feral frenzy to force people to mend, while also being able to vault faster than survivors, Plague has her infection to perma injure survivors to reduce average chase time, Ghostface has instadowns(let alone that both ghostface and pig can silently crouch to a survivor and grab them off gens without them even knowing), Demogorgon has his dash, Oni has practically the same power as Billy, except he has more general control on his instadown, Deathslinger has his pull.
When playing killer(Im a survivor main), I've never gotten a hit thanks to bloodlust, I've always gained bloodlust after the hit(which, actually would be a nice way to rework bloodlust, getting bloodlust everytime you hit someone).
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99% of NOED users, actually uses NOED for the movementspeed and perhaps counter an Adrenaline heal.
I mean, lets do some fact checking:
In about 80% of games, 3 survivors are injured when the last gen is fixed, meaning that NOED's exposed status is only really impacting 1 survivor at most. Yet, the 4% haste is universally applied. Billy's sprint is 4% faster, Amanda's Ambush is 4% faster, Bubba moves 4% faster in his craze, Huntress' hatch charge and Bubba/Billy's rev movementspeed is 4% faster.
So most of the time, NOED is used with the assumption that the exposed status isnt gonna do crap. It's simply a nice addition to when survivors actually heal up, meaning they wasted precious time.
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@GrannyonAcid said:
Very unique. A patch that has no buffs for survivor. Buff killers quite a decent amount... But now killers unplayable? And Demogorgon? Really? I didn't think he was anywhere close to top tier :P
teeeeeeeeeeeeeechnically it buffed survivors by fixing dedicated window hits, but that was never intended anyway. Although, I am not 100% aware of things they changed, did they nerf the window tech? I havent been able to pull it off since the update.
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@Warlock_2020 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/146494/make-the-area-inside-the-gate-an-exposed-area
Stop it, get some help. No. First of all, the concept of tanking the hit for the escape is perfectly in line with the heroic ending to some horror movies. That said, why should survivors be punished for succeeding?
This would like causing the killer to move 10% slower once the 3rd survivor dies. Punished for success is not the right way to go about it.
I hate getting blocked at the exit gate, but I just face facts, I lost and don't deserve a freebie.
"No. First of all, the concept of tanking the hit for the escape is perfectly in line with the heroic ending to some horror movies."
Yeah, and guess what? THOSE HEROIC PEOPLE DIE.
"That said, why should survivors be punished for succeeding?"
They succeed when they escape, staying inside during the EGC should be a bad thing for survivors. They literally have no reason to stay inside other than to aid others to escape, and that should come with a risk.
"This would like causing the killer to move 10% slower once the 3rd survivor dies. Punished for success is not the right way to go about it."
Not the same thing, it would actually be more comparable to slowing the killer 5% when he decides to close the hatch, adding tons of pressure on the survivor while all you need to do then is patrol the exit gates. It basically adds a risk to closing the hatch without knowing where the survivor is.
"I hate getting blocked at the exit gate, but I just face facts, I lost and don't deserve a freebie."
Its not a freebie, they literally risk their life to save a friend instead. And yeah, survivors should be rewarded with a ######### ton of survival points if they take a protection hit. Perhaps even the same amount of points they would have gained for escaping, without giving them emblem points for doing so. Meaning that BP-wise, there would be no difference.
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@Johnny_XMan said:
The exit gate is no more powerful than a basement in which in the right scenario ( just like with the gates) the killer has the upper hand.
Sorry but I’m not digging this suggestion. Way too OP.
No more powerful than the basement? You do realize that hooking 1 person and camping that person does not lead into a 4k? Heck, the upstair hook in Thompsons House is stronger than the basement. Yet 1 healthy survivor in an exit gate can guarantee a 4 man escape by blocking the killer and using that speedboost to escape himself?
Exit gates are the most powerful area in the game and are fully survivor sided. They are riskless during a time in the game where staying inside the match should be risky. Camping inside the exit gate area should have a downside.
And sure, perhaps it shouldnt apply instantly. But so far, considering all possible scenario's, there is no practical difference other than adding risk to altruistic behaviour during the EGC. Which it should.
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@SquirrelKnight said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1235899#Comment_1235899
But they do matter, because for pallets you can still hit the.killed out of bloodlust, heck with certain small loops you can loop the killer almost indefinitely without it being a "godloop" and windows still can be fastvaulted and you are gone, not to mention deadhards and sprintbursts (though sprint burst would be you switching targets to the person who just bursted)
Not really, a decent killer will know how to deal with weak pallets and will actually leave them dropped, as they can lunge faster around the structure than a survivor can vault it. Meaning you have a guaranteed hit if the survivor uses the pallet.
And yeah, some people can loop a killer practically indefinitely on a weak pallet, but those people can loop a killer pretty much anywhere.
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@Deadeye said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1235905#Comment_1235905
Why is it so bad that killers get tools that down you after a decent time? Do you really think "Damn, I could have looped another 5 minutes without that goddarn bloodlust" or rather "Wow, I forced him into bloodlust 2 to get me, yay. That was a 2 genny run"? This is the kind of entitlement that controls the whole community. What is the problem to know "He found me, I'm going down"?
Again: the 5 minute loop on a single structure shouldnt really exist unless you're really good at mindgaming and the killer is being oblivious. All I'm saying is that adding more decent or relatively unsafe pallets to the game, to compensate the removal of bloodlust, allows you to remove 99% of the BS deadzones you encounter as a survivor, and allow for a very small tile that allows a mindgame and buys you up to 30 seconds extra time instead of being downed in a deadzone. The only killer that benefits a lot from bloodlust is huntress.
So the proposition is simple:
- add unsafe pallets(1 car, 3 barrels, 1 pallet) and make them more prevalent.
- remove bloodlust.
- have 1 super strong pallet in the game, outside the killershack pallet.
Hell, you could even have double or even triple pallets in a region, that together are extremely strong, but break 1 of them as a killer and they end up being weak.
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@MPUK said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1234399#Comment_1234399
I don't really care about the ranking system. I am already rank 1, it means very little to me if I lose a pip,safety pip, gain 1 or2 pips. I'm there to play a game and have fun.
If you're double pipping without killing anyone then why are you crying about survivors getting a "free escape" when you have been unable to kill anyone?
You specify healing and unhooking others. You know protection hits are also a thing don't you? The thing you want removed from the exit gate for your participation kill.
As for the gatekeeper emblem that changed recently. It isn't protect all gens for the first 9 minutes anymore. There is an element of stopping the exit gates involved now too, as the devs expect killers to lose gens in early game after the ruin change. I don't really follow the idea of 3 opposing objectives, chase, hit, hook and kill are all the same thing. You have to chase a survivor to hit him, you have to hit him twice to hook him, you have to hook him (up to)3 times to kill him. They aren't opposing, they're very much in line with one another.
Your idea makes no sense, making excuses as to why there are 4 people alive in endgame won't change the fact that ad a killer you failed all of your objectives. All of them. Why should you be handed a kill for playing ######### in a round? The survivor who got "carried" shouldn't die because you want them to. If you want them to die, you have to get that ######### not cry at the devs until they hand you one every round.
I did mention I am a survivor main right? When I escape by other people body blocking the killer, it never feels earned. Its even a bit of a let-down. For the killer, it also doesnt feel deserved either. There were survivors doing something that had 0 risk for them and all the rewards. For that high of a reward, there should be a big risk countering it.
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@LALYTHIA said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1233818#Comment_1233818
You clearly don't know me.
Yeah, that's super relatable..."the killer shouldn't get free downs when chasing people being altruistic to save their teammate after pwning him all game" is definitely on par with "nerf an existing core game mechanic for a killer". 🙄
And this would definitely be fair to the solo survivor on a map who has incredibly limited time/chance to open the door anyway...so when the killer is right on his heels he can get downed INSIDE THE EXIT GATE and die.
Don't be an idiot. This is a stupid idea that only advantages Killers.
yeah, but do you realize how strong the exit gate region is? While the EGC is meant for the killer to be the most dangerous. Having a safe loop because you didnt waste it is one thing, but the exit gate is a massive region where survivors are so safe, that you can practically walk and still escape. Let alone the fact that a fully healed survivor can body block a killer with 0 risk, during the EGC, while during the game, body blocking the killer has actual risks. It does NOT make sense for the 2 minute time limit that a survivor is fully without risks.
In spirit of the EGC, it makes sense to remove that safe space and make it the most dangerous space in the game to keep hanging out, as the EGC is literally meant to force survivors out ASAP.
And survivor side, it shouldnt matter too much, there is literally only 1 scenario where it ######### 1 person over. That's it. In all other scenario's, it prevents riskless situations that shouldnt be riskless.
As for the 1v1 matter, I've actually stated before that the exit gates need adapting, like only 2 bulbs when they spawn close(meaning you can prep the gate more than with 3 bulbs without the killer knowing its been prepped) and 4 bulbs when they spawn very far away. That the EGC itself should speed up the opening of exit gates(which isnt really bad for killers, as the EGC only starts when an exit gate has been opened or the hatch has been closed).
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@Deadeye said:
Just as @DawnMad said, survivors are meant to go down. If you expect something different, then all of your games must suck unless you go against incredibly bad killers. And I expect that most survivors currently expect to easily escape regarding all the complaints about how killer sided the recent patches have been (and what you get called a tunneler for)
Going down and getting bloodlust are different things tho. I have matches where I never get any bloodlust at all, bloodlust isnt needed to down survivors. The only reason bloodlust still has a place, is because of godloops, because godloops dont require skill or mindgames, just mindlessly going from A to B untill the killer gets bloodlust 2, and bloodlust 2 alone is enough to utterly destroy a godloop.
With all the godloops being taken away, bloodlust lost its place.
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@SquirrelKnight said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/146378/should-blood-lust-be-removed-completely
Because pallets and windows are still a thing. Maps with large open areas with plenty ti rub through are still a thing. So basically, yes, looping is still a thing
Pallets and windows dont really matter tho. STRONG pallets and windows matter. You can add 20 okay pallets to Backwater Swamp and have the same outcome.
Bloodlust is meant to counter strong loops. But bloodlust shouldnt happen in deadzones. Since the strongest loops are getting destroyed, there would only be mindgame and skill based loops. Loops that can be countered by mindgaming without needing bloodlust.
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@MPUK said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1233969#Comment_1233969
You have everyone hooked once at the end of the game. You have 33% of your hook objective completed and the survivors have done 100% of their objectives and you class them escaping as "free" and "unfair". Wow....
Thats not how the game works. I can get a double pip as survivor while dying and only doing 1 gen. I can get a double pip on killer with 0 survivors dead. I can lose a pip while fixing all 5 gens and escaping, and I can lose a pip by hooking survivors 12 times(aka, a 4k) Hooking isnt the main and only objective, fixing gens isnt the main and only objective. There are 4 main objectives for each side. Only doing 1 of them and escaping while the killer and other survivors do all 4 objectives equally, then that 1 survivor doesnt deserve the body block escape.
As a killer:
- protecting gens for as long as possible, at least 9 minutes
- Chase and hit survivors
- hook survivors
- kill survivors
As a survivor:
- fix gens asap
- self-heal/self-unhook/break free from struggle/escape
- being chased
- healing/unhooking others
Yeah, fixing gens is the one way to escape, so 50% of survivor objectives are related to fixing gens and the other 2 are related to that objective. Killers have 2 opposing objectives, and once they start hooking, they have 3 opposing objectives.
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@thrawn3054 said:
No. There's no reason to give the killer free downs in the gate.
Nor is there a reason for the gate to be a secure safe haven for survivors.
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@MPUK said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1233944#Comment_1233944
Because they have completed all of their objectives. It doesn't matter whether someone has been carried or not the team has worked together and completed their objectives. You on the other hand have failed to protect gens, you have failed to repeatedly down/hook people and you have failed to stop the exit gates opening. You have failed at all your objectives every step of the way in the game but you think you should be handed a participation kill at the exit gates and you'd be happy with that?
Oh, lets say I got everyone at least hooked once, but they had 3 brand new parts and fixed 3 gens in a very quick and strategic way, preventing any 3 gen from being formed while also running DS, Unbreakable, BT and Adrenaline. Then they unhook their bad teammate and body block me during the way, switching over and over again. Do you really think that bad teammate deserved the escape after being protected? All it takes is 1 survivor being better than the killer to protect 3 bad survivors.
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@OtakuBurrito said:
It's called NoED.
No, NOED isnt dangerous because of the instadown, as I said before, many people are injured once the gates are powered. NOED gives movementspeed and a counter to Adrenaline. Thats not the same as an incentive to leave ASAP.
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@Exerlin said:
Sure, let's just follow one healthy survivor until they make the mistake of walking into the exit gates. Fair and balanced game mechanic with a lot of counter-play!
Sure, lets hope they dont have syptic agent or mettle of man, lets hope they dont have for the people and dead hard when someone body blocks the killer and has a cooldown on his hit. <- tons of counter play, a lot more counter play than DS, Adrenaline and slugging combined.
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@MPUK said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1233830#Comment_1233830
If there are 3 people at the exit and you're chasing the other who is injured and people come to take a hit? What was free about this escape? They have done all 5 gens, they have possibly got both exit gates open, if you had NOED they have done all totems, what part of the escape has been free? What you're asking for in being exposed in the exit gate is a free kill. You've done ######### all round and now they are all going to escape but if they were exposed you would be able to get one. The hits you get handed to you for free by body blocking at the exit should be enough free points for you. Try again next round.
That one person could have ######### up all game and basically been carried by his team. The only other way to go about it was to tunnel and facecamp earlier in the game, but that behaviour shouldnt be encouraged. If someone is gonna be downed otherwise and people come to walk in the way, they should be at risk. An unhook around a killer is often a 1 for 1 trade off, healing someone up from being downed while the killer is around is a 1 for 1 trade off. Why should body blocking in the exit gate be any different? Heck, you could even grant them survival and altruism points for doing so.
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@ZoneDymo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1233814#Comment_1233814
NoeD is a HEX perk, one out of 4 they can equipe and has an ez counter for survivors.
Your idea is build in, which is a big difference, also the strat you mention is to make sure people dont know you have NoeD for as long as possible so they dont look for it.
In the idea of the exposed exit gate its just how killer will play from that point on and there is no counter to it for the survivors, it would make unhooks nearly impossible and just means survivors have to leave at the end instead of even attempting to save.
Couple that with bloodwarden and I feel it would be really unhealthy for the match.
Again I agree the exit gate area is too strong, but this is just a very problematic change.
Again, people focus too much on 1 aspect of the game that actually happens very rarely in the first place. Besides, it actually gives the killer a reason to open the exit gates, as starting the EGC has no meaning for the killer other than to show one of the gates is open.
As for counters:
- there are 2 doors, 4 survivors. A killer camping 1 door just makes the survivors prep the other door and escape. You can gain enough distance from a killer between gates, with ease. Especially since one person can body block.
- With less survivors, its a bit more of a risk, sure, but still, 2 doors.
Basically, the amount of survivors that is guaranteed to escape, is the amount of survivors minus one. You have no idea how good of a deal that is. Have 3 friends playing with you that are generally bad at the game and never escape? Risk your own life. Borrowed Time would actually recieve a buff and Syptic Agent actually has a use again. Mettle of Man would be a bit more reliable to use, you could even buff Mettle of Man to be easier to gain stacks while in the EGC.
Then you have the fact that most skilled survivors already play around being injured, as there isnt much to gain from being healthy at all. A lot of survivors remain injured and still are able to protect other teammates by some cheekyness, like either saving up a dead hard, pulling a 360 or leading the killer away by "accidentally" making a mistake, drawing the attention away from someone else, especially if you know you're a higher valued target for the killer(I rather kill someone who has tried flashlighting me all game while tbaggin than someone who fixed 5 gens).
Yeah, there is a TINY aspect of the game that will truly get affected, especially at the beginning. But players adapt, games are getting balanced. Sometimes you need to overpower something to start nerfing it again. You could make the wall hitboxes larger inside the gate so the killer is more likely to hit the walls. You could give survivors a tiny bit of haste while inside to make it easier to dodge attacks. But all in all, exit gates and instadowns are pretty much the only way to weaken exit gates. Adding more time isnt gonna weaken exit gates, adding a slow inside exitgates, will practically have a worse effect. Adding a cooldown on entering an exit gate again after leaving it, also worse effect. Adding the instadown allows for more room to balance the exit gate.
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@not_Queef said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1233861#Comment_1233861
Easy. Unbreakable just gives faster recovery. No Mither does something else (blanket aura reading immunity would be nice).
Hell, I would run No Mither all the time if they did that.
Honestly, No Mither having no blood when injured and 50% less sound is already pretty good on its own and wouldnt need the broken status. Sure, No Mither and Iron Will would be very strong together, but I doubt many current killer mains that will claim its better than people running unbreakable and DS(even though people who play both sides, definitely understand that a lack of blood and sound is much stronger against killers).
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@Deadeye said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1233814#Comment_1233814
Why are you explaining so much with NOED and how it was earlier? This is not really related to exit gate death traps. Or is your suggestion a NOED rework and you forgot to mention that?
No, my whole point is that things change. Players adapt.
Its not a death trap, a 4 escape is as earned as a 4k. If killers granting a mercy hatch escape, then survivors should be willing to give the killer a mercy kill in a 4 escape. And yes, some people will abuse that, just like there are people abusing killer vaulting/pallet animations to blind the killer with a 10 million second blind. But the amount of people that are able to truly abuse that, are people who cant get more than 1k in that match anyway.
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@Deadeye said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1233808#Comment_1233808
It simply wouldn't make sense to hit someone near the gate. That's not hard to outplay. Wait in front of the gate until the EGC runs out or hit them as soon as they cross the line. You cannot get all survivors, which is most likely the case when survivors head for an open gate. But with your change the killer will definitely kill one of them, as soon as the killer is close to the gate and the survivors not already escaping. Body blocks wouldn't work anymore, going in for the save during EGC or with 99ed gates will definitely kill one of the squad.
And killers would open way more gates, when they hook someone near it, to secure a kill
Thats the entire thing tho. If the killer is in a chase of an injured person, he has no interest in going towards an exit gate, as he can get that injured person, then proxy-camp that person to guarantee a kill. If the killer is chasing a healthy person and refrains from attacking untill he reaches the exit gates, then you can still have 3 people body block and in case you have a flashlight, blind the killer and escape all 4. But the EGC is supposed to be dangerous for survivors. It only makes sense for the exit gates to remain more dangerous. And perhaps it should require 2-3 seconds before the exposed status kicks in the first time you enter, the whole reason is to get an idea to make exit gate camping for survivors not a free escape. The killer is supposed to increase in pressure and power when the EGC started.
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@LALYTHIA said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/146494/make-the-area-inside-the-gate-an-exposed-area
Hell-to-the-NO.
Next.
You seem to be like the type of person that would want to nerf Amanda's face masks because they can kill people if they dont search boxes. So your opinion is invalid.
Next
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@ZoneDymo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1233781#Comment_1233781
a killer that knows they will get a one shot once past the gate line will just wait with a hit untill then.
Yeah, just like some killers prevent hitting with M1 when they have NOED unless someone is close to the gate. That's simply a strategy. There are 2 doors and 1 hatch. It only really ######### over a survivor when the hatch is closed. But guess what? When the EGC was implemented, it ######### over survivors a lot because before the EGC, they could fix up all 7 generators for extra points. NOED used to only last for 2 minutes and there was nothing at risk if they decided to remain inside after the doors were opened. Now the EGC made outside the exitgate a bit more unsafe, NOED got buffed and 2 generators get blocked once the 5th is fixed. Games change and players adapt to it. If there are killers camping the gates, I'm certain within 4 days someone found a way to get around that while playing solo.
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@Deadeye said:
The killer could simply camp the exit gate, no reason to hit someone outside of the gate. Then chase if the survivor leaves the gate until he is far enough away or just chase around until the EGC is over. That would cause ridiculous scenes, worse than old hatch standoffs
I disagree, most survivor games, both exit doors are either open or 99'd. They are often far apart enough to make it impossible to patrol both gates unless you have NOED, in which case, it doesnt matter. Besides, there are plenty of reasons to hit someone outside of the gate other than this. The only type of scenario this would suck, if is 3 survivors died and the killer closes the hatch. But in those scenario's, odds are extremely likely that you're injured already, making no difference in the vast majority of cases. There would only be 1 specific case where the last survivor is fully healthy and the killer, not using NOED, is fast enough to catch up. But in most of the cases(from my own experience, about 99% of them), either the killer uses NOED or has an injured survivor, making no practical difference.
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@CashelP14 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/146494/make-the-area-inside-the-gate-an-exposed-area
So imagine if I'm the killer. Wouldn't I just follow you to the door and deliberately not hit you until your inside the exit area. I don't think that would be fun mate.
It would also make trying to escape as the last survivor even worse. If the killer closes the hatch and the doors become active then I already need to be careful. Then after that if the killer gets to my door just as I'm about to open it then I'm guaranteed dead unless I somehow spin him twice.
I understand the intent behind it but I don't think the execution is the best mate sorry.
That is a possibility, however, there are 2 doors and many, MANY ways of creating distance between you and the killer. Exhaustion takes 40 seconds to recover, pallets give you at least a 3 second head start. Most exit gates have a jungle gym either right next to it, or closeby. If you used those resources before the exit gates are powered, thats on you.
As the last survivor, if you're healthy, you still have the jungle gym nearby to create distance, or enough time to reach the other door. If you're already injured, there would be no difference, let alone that, again, you probably have an exhaustion perk thats ready to be set off anyway.
It would make 1 type of scenario harder on the survivor, but it makes 20 types of scenario's a bit easier on the killer. That is a balanced trade-off.
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@Clevite said:
Why tho? I mean what is the purpose, to eliminate the opportunity to take a kit for your friend?
It doesnt eliminate tanking a hit, but it does eliminate 3 people body blocking you near the entrance to protect that one survivor that wouldnt have escaped without the body block. I mean, if I am a rank 3 killer, facing 3 red rank survivors and 1 baby survivor and they start to protect that baby survivor no matter what, then they should take the punishment the baby survivor would have recieved.
Besides, like I said, you can still run out and tank a hit for your friend. You just cant tank a hit inside the exit gate.
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@ZoneDymo said:
while I agree the exit gate area is too powerful and annoyingly so, this is not a fair change imo
Why not tho? You can still pull off the same ######### as before, by simply doing it right outside the exitgate rather than inside it, except now it actually requires some planning to bait a hit.
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@xGodSendDeath said:
NOED is basically the only second chance perk that killers get and it's easily counterable. Delete DS and Adrenaline and I'd be fine with NOED going too
They arent on the same level tho:
- Noed requires survivors cleansing all the totems before finishing all gens, or running around cleansing totems after all gens. They actively have to interact while buying enough time to do everything.
- DS literally requires the killer to not pick up a freshly unhooked survivor.
- Adrenaline isnt that good. It's only really good when you get off the hook or were downed right before. 9 out of 10 times, people who use adrenaline actually dont benefit from it at all, yet 9/10 times, you benefit from NOED, be it the speedboost alone.
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The game should be balanced around solo play, but that doesnt mean SWF is incredibly strong.
Basically, solo play needs to be buffed to the levels of SWF play. OoO cant really be nerfed without making the perk useless, but it can be buffed to the point that 1 OoO will show the killer for everyone. Why do that? Because then killers can be buffed accordingly. You could make OoO backlash that everyone who is injured will hear the Terror Radius constantly, basically being almost like Dark Devotion or Doctor's iridescent addons.
Basically, some things need to be buffed, so that they can be nerfed.
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@ohheyitsbobcat said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1213390#Comment_1213390
- Combining points 1 and 4 I think you are really over exaggerating here. You don't really see them in a America because we don't have any kind of other swastika that is easily recognized as you said besides maybe the Manji symbol but even then, a lot of people might not know it. Fair enough. So yes, of course when people see a swastika they'll instantly think of the most recognizable one and then they'll make a connection that the one they're seeing is not the bad one. It's the entire First Thought Second Thought thing. Where the first thought is your initial reaction and the 2nd thought is what you really think about it. Anyone who would equate all swaticas to Nazi's are frankly idiots or are incredibly ignorant especially if they're given context. If those kind of people exist in this game and then leave, it's frankly better off. When I was in school some 20 years ago learning about Nazis, I also learned about other variations of swastikas. I obviously can't speak for the entire country but I would hope people are educated enough that they know more than one type of swastika exists.
- Looking at steam stats, the game goes up and down but has been rather consistent for a couple years and averaging around 20000. It certainly gained popularity because of the Corona and when this all dies down, it'll go back to being around 20000 again. I don't think the game is losing players or gaining them. People just takes breaks and then come back when there is new stuff.
- And what exactly is the issue if some no name journalist bad mouths the game? People already can and do badmouth the game a lot and having some game journalist add on to that won't do anything. The only people who listen to them are generally people who don't even play the game or facebook moms. Your normal dbd gamer or even gamer is general isn't going to see an article on DBD nazism, look at the article and then the proceeding picture and go "Damn! This game supports Nazis!" and then proceed to bail. Hell, if anything it would only bring more attention to DBD and it might gain players from it. All PR is good PR and DBD isn't exactly big enough to see a negative outcry from it.
Let's look at the worst case scenario. Some journalist on an off day picks this story up and it somehow gains traction and goes viral. People who have never heard about the game will come flocking to it to see what's up which would probably cause a temp boom in playerbase and then everyone will be talking about. The majority will mention how people are being stupid while extremists will call for death! DBD will see what's going on, probably not want to deal with it, issue an apology and say it was never their intention, change the symbol and then it becomes yesterday's news as everyone stops caring. It'd probably end up getting memed to hell and back if this happened. Like I can already see that anime/butterfly meme using the doctors face and the picture above going, "Is this nazism?"
There was a literal nazi dude at a presidential thing a couple months ago and he was simply escorted out. Facebook moms were mad, some people defended his right to do it if he didn't hurt anyone and most people joked about it thinking the guy was an idiot. Literal nazism and most people just don't care and you think this case of a Manji symbol that isn't even that easy to spot on first glance is going to somehow take off and hurt the game? It's ridiculous man.
Honestly, that meme was great. Anyway, my point all in all was that the game itself isnt exactly in its healthiest state. Balancewise, playerbase wise(seriously, I encounter less salt in Overwatch, it really is a problem). All in all, it doesnt need any more drama added to it. Some perks need fixing, some killers need fixing, some offerings need fixing. Adding a neo-nazi dramapalooza where the devs have to make official statements etc isnt going to help anyone.
I might overexaggerate a bit, but I'd personally say it's because im a bit overprotective really. I like this game and really like its potential. I met my gf because of this game and really wish this game would still exist for at least till we tie the knot. Having any drama over it that might have some players move away for the fear of being labeled nazi's for just having the game installed isnt any kind of drama you'd wish ontop of any game. Gamers are already a bit of paria's of society, often linked with tons of bad things. It wouldnt be the first time that people found excuses to call gamers nazi's.
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its about 1/5th of the full picture. So not really small. You could find it on https://dbd.onteh.net.au/archives
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@emptyCups said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1204852#Comment_1204852
Hostage...
Funny it used to mean hiding in lockers for 15-45 minutes with the exit gates open with no way for the killer to end the match. Killers can not hold anything hostage, survivors can.
If the survivors do nothing the game cannot end. If the killer does nothing survivors can walk out.
Calling slugging or all the other nonsense you listed hostage is dumb. I guess every time on the hook is hostage too... is the lobby hostage when you dont ready up ? This post Is hostage because you cant read anything while you read this... oooh look I'm taking hostage call me a new killer "the typewritter"
"Hostage is keeping someone from doing anything... with no outside aid"
You can crawl out hatch, heal 90%, hide from killer telling teammates where u are, spin under a hook to entice sacrifice, crawl out exit gates.
Outside help includes perks that get you up and survivors picking you up... and the killer picking you up. Or simply waiting the bleed out timer out while you play on ur phone for a minute or you can make this post.
"If the survivors do nothing the game cannot end. If the killer does nothing survivors can walk out."
If survivors do nothing, they die on hook.
"Calling slugging or all the other nonsense you listed hostage is dumb. I guess every time on the hook is hostage too... is the lobby hostage when you dont ready up ? This post Is hostage because you cant read anything while you read this... oooh look I'm taking hostage call me a new killer "the typewritter""
No, because being on hook has a base escape rate and you can opt out whenever. Being downed doesnt have a rate of you being able to pick yourself up and doesnt allow you to opt out.
"You can crawl out hatch"
Nope, hatch is closed in a 2v1, and killers tend to know where the hatch is. And guess what? Once you dead hook someone, the hatch doesnt open untill that 10 second animation finishes. Meaning the killer has 10 seconds to move from the hook to the hatch to close it. Killer has priority, making it impossible for the survivor to escape.
"heal 90%"
In a 2v1, this is practically useless. You either end up switching or both being downed. The only reason this could ever be a clever idea is if the other person has unbreakable. If you could heal 99% but not that final 1%, meaning you'd be a 1 tap, then there is at least some chance you can get enough distance from the killer to pull that off. But no, healing someone up is basically letting the killer know where the other person crawled to.
"hide from killer telling teammates where u are"
Teammates can literally see you, and considering Iron Will doesnt work while downed, you cant really hide unless you're an Ace.
"spin under a hook to entice sacrifice"
On a killer that slugged?
"crawl out exit gates."
You do realize that 2v1 slugging only happens when there are still gens left right? It never happens otherwise, because if someone is slugged, it will take a lot more time and risk to pick them up, which is why killers hook the other as bait. Slugging 2 v 1 never happens during the EGC.
"Outside help includes perks that get you up and survivors picking you up... and the killer picking you up. Or simply waiting the bleed out timer out while you play on ur phone for a minute or you can make this post."
Right, just like a killer could, back in the day, use perks that would help him find survivors that were keeping the game hostage, or wait for the survivors to get bored and leave, all the while you play on your phone, watch a show or even make this post.
So how about we dont use the excuse of "use perks or do something else"? Because back in the day, you could use perks to find those survivors as locker aura's werent. Stridor applied to people hiding in lockers too. You could literally build around hostage keeping survivors. But was that really a solution? No? Then dont claim the same for 2v1 slugging.