NuclearBurrito
NuclearBurrito
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@GrootDude said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/630925#Comment_630925
A setup of course takes time but if you setup around certain gens then they won’t have nearly as much area to run. So killer actually being efficient=survivors are bad?
No wonder people think survivors are OP.
No. The issue isn't that survivors hit traps.
The issue I'm bringing up is that if the strategy only works on certain survivors then it follows that good survivors can just not act like the certain survivors it works on and thus can counter the strategy.
If it doesn't depend on that sort of thing and instead depends on for example the outcome of a mindgame then you shouldn't need to change targets. You can just do whatever your strategy is on the first survivor.
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@GrootDude said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/630906#Comment_630906
They can’t always run to areas that became difficult, plus who’s to say I didn’t trap where they ran?
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/630907#Comment_630907
I didn’t include nurse because she is going to get a slight nerf.
If you trapped where they ran then just chase the initial survivor to that spot in the first place.
Situations where that isn't possible also involve more than 30 seconds of setup for the first hit, let alone a down.
If you got a hit this way it was because you found a weak link, not because the strategy itself is effective.
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@Madjura said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/630890#Comment_630890
A rank system that isn't worthless
Camping gives less pips, but pips are worthless so it doesn't matter
What about ingame rewards? Ranking systems don't exist to judge you as nice or a dick but in terms of how good you are at the game.
Say what you want about the requirement of execution but if a strategy is effective then Good players should use it.
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@GrootDude said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/630896#Comment_630896
I am able to stop others from finishing their gen, if I had taken that first chase with someone I knew I’d struggle to catch then the other survivors would’ve gotten many more gens done.
You're missing the point. Survivors are functionally identical. If you are struggling with 1 survivor then whatever they did to make you struggle the other 3 survivors can do too.
So you ought struggle with all 4 survivors. The only reason why this wouldn't be the case is if one or more of the Survivors is just bad by comparison, and relying on that is no good way to craft a strategy.
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Heh
I run Thrill of the Hunt and Haunted Grounds. Get wrecked.
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@GrootDude said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/630883#Comment_630883
It has been a winning strategy for me for awhile, I can often down people in 30 seconds even faster with Hag.
Explain. How does letting someone go help you down someone.
The time between letting someone go and chasing someone else is time that no one is being pressured. The person you were chasing can just hop on a gen immediately. And when you start chasing the next person then you are now yet again chasing and thus only pressuring a single survivor. You are thus worse off than if you just kept chasing the 1st survivor to begin with.
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So what rewards for not camping do people have in mind? Since clearly the existing ones aren't enough does anyone have suggestions for additional ones?
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@GrootDude said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/630874#Comment_630874
If you can’t down anyone is less than a minute then I’m not sure what you want.
A strategy that speeds up chases. Giving up chases doesn't speed up chases.
Downs are a requirement to get gen pressure unless you're doctor. And someone on a gen doesn't have any reason to not be watching for you in order to be ready to run if you chase them.
Letting a Survivor go to chase someone else is the equivalent of throwing away the time you just spent chasing them. It's a losing strategy since the next person you chase will just do the same thing the first one did (or should anyways) leading you right back where you started. You have to eventually commit to a chase in order to get anywhere.
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@GrootDude said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/630849#Comment_630849
A 2 minute chase won’t get you pressure.
Neither will 2 minutes of giving up chases
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You can't get gen pressure by giving up chases. You need to get downs to get pressure, because unless you have thanataphobia anyone you aren't chasing isn't being pressured until you get a down.
Once someone is downed you can start to snowball and the game can properly begin.
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Adrenaline: It's rewarding success rather than mitigating failure which makes it unique among second chance perks. It's also somewhat self-balancing, since if the Killer's can stop the gens from being completed by being better at the game (AKA: If the game is otherwise balanced) then whatever counts as good play in general also counters Adrenaline and thus ensures that Adrenaline will only proc if the Killer messes up.
NOED: Fine for completely different reasons. The effect by itself while overrated is still very strong. However the fact that you can stop it from procing at the endgame before you even are close to that point keeps it in check, and you can cleanse it during endgame if you really want to.
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NOED DOES NOT REWARD FAILURE!
It mitigates it. There is a difference. You are always better off not letting the 5th gen pop even if you are running NOED.
This is like saying Iron will rewards getting hit. It's mitigating the punishment of getting hit but it is still a punishment.
In the case of NOED, the final gen poping removes all of your pressure and prevents you from getting any meaningful amount of it back.
NOED doesn't give you the pressure back by itself, but it does give you the power to rebuild that pressure quickly.
Compare that with Remember Me which mitigates the initial pressure removal.
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Bring a medkit ffs. It's way faster.
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You guys are all missing the point.
SWF all can know where each other are. So this mechanic only hurts Solo's thus further widening the gap between them.
Saying something is fair does not make it so.
The only reason I see for the mechanic working this way is consistency. Which to be fair is a surprisingly good reason but still.
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Because he has so much lost potential.
Killers like Leatherface or Trapper are arguably worse. But they don't feel like "This Killer should be amazing yet somehow isn't ". Legion however on paper has everything you could every want in a Killer: Speed, Agility, Fast attacks, Tracking. Yet somehow is just a weak Killer in spite of that
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Addons as buffs is a terrible idea to begin with.
It would be much better to have addons be for sidegrades so you can customize your power/item without necessarily increasing it's overall effectiveness.
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Injured is more dangerous than exposed. But generally exposed perks have additional benefits or trigger in situations where it is disproportionately effective.
EX:
Haunted grounds also gives decoys for other Hex perks thus slowing the game down
Devour hope also comes with extra movement speed (technically) and a Mori
Rancor comes with information and a Mori (technically)
NOED comes with a movement speed increase
MYC procs in the situation where a Survivor is the most likely to be out of position and thus too far from a loop to outlast it. Otherwise it's one of the weaker exposed perks on M1 Killers
Iron maiden... no ######### this perk
The 2 Killer powers that apply exposed also have additional effects that make it more dangerous
Myers: Faster Vaults and longer lunges
Ghostface: He is still in stealth and thus might be able to down you before you can initiate a proper chase (in theory)
Billy has additional utility on his saw besides an instant down as well:
- Mobility for map pressure
- Chainsaw flicking for burst movement in a chase
- Breaking pallets faster
Plague meanwhile has amazing perk synergies with things like Thanataphobia and M&A
Meanwhile Legion and Leatherface who also use their powers to injure exclusively or instadown are considered to be bottom tier because they DON'T get additional utility.
Legion I consider to be higher tier (than leatherface) because he does get tracking from it, but unlike Plague they can still heal if you are running thanataphobia and M&A in order to counter them and he doesn't have addons to capitalize with either.
And of course Exposed on M2 Killers like Nurse and Hag are great.
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@AzdrubaelVect said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/627480#Comment_627480
Top X doesn't mean much in this game when even somebody as mediocre as truetalent is considered TopX I'm sorry.
The TopX experiment was done by the depip squad already and not THAT much has changed since then except for maps being even more of an RNG fest than before. (You literally cannot win against decent survivors on temple of purgation if you're a regular M1 killer because of the unmindgameable-huge loop safe pallets there) not to mention maps like Haddonfield in combination with balanced. If you play absolutely optimally as survivor with no fun in mind you will escape 90% of the time.
The issue is not with casual play, no killer complains about unorganized solosurvivors running funbuilds. The issue becomes when you get matched against teams stacking second chances above second chances above second chances. The survivor ones are WAY harder and more timeconsuming to counter than the killer meta.
BBQ? You Can hide.
Nurse? Don't heal in TR (it's no heal meta anyways so Nurses only works on stealth killers who can be looped way to long anyways).
RUIN is not a huge deal for survivors who put thousands of hours into mastering skillchecks.
NOED will get you 1 kill in endgame because optimal survivors don't run around clumped up and will not do altruistic plays unless NOED is cleansed.
Enduring+Spirit Fury? Survivors will drop the pallet early which is not an issue since there's around 20 on each map buying you enough time for 5 gens to pop if you tell your mates where the pallets are used up.
Pop Goes the weasel is a snowball perk, you won't down topsurvivors fast enough and great survivors will do multiple gens spread out.
Bloodwarden is countered by 99ing gates.
DS on the other hand buys you at least 60 seconds or may give you a free escape if you go down near the exit after a BT rescue in endgame and SWF teams will pick up the slugged guy during the match, if you guard him you waste too much time and lose gens. That's a lost hook there on top of BT mending being a minor nuissance.
BT should be reverted to it's former state where survivors rescued by BT go down after a while if outside of the killer's terror radius.
Nerf Selfcare but buff healing times in general. Selfcare should be 75% slower healing at least, currently there's no difference between getting healed by another survivor or the other survivor simply spending his 16 additional seconds doing a gen. If Sloppy butcher is used there's no point in even healing at all so I'd suggest buffing the time it takes to heal other survivors to 8 seconds (making it 10 with sloppy) and nerfing Selfcare to counteract this healing buff. Ontop of that buffing Autodidact to work with selfcare but at a 50% worse rate when healing yourself of course, to counteract sloppy butcher. Survivors would also have a perk to counter slugging more effectively with my improved autodidact.
Pallets should become safe again but looping them should not be a thing, this would buff weaker survivor players in general who rely on pallets way more than highrank survivors, for this the devs would have to fix killerhitboxes so they don't de-accelerate during pallet loops and keep their 15% advantage.
If you made all these changes then the devs could also finally look at camping and tunneling since killers would have no reason to sweat as hard as they currently need to to get kills.
Like for example a survivor not regressing for X seconds after hook to de-incentivize camping but also slow down gen-progression while at least 1 survivor is hooked.
I'm not saying survivors are OP in general, I'm saying that the optimal playstyles need to go.
Nerf stuff that the majority of your playerbase isn't using anyways. (DS, BT, Adrenawin, optimized exploiting of the killer hitbox) and buff survivors in other areas.
I am not contesting your conclusion. Just the idea that statistics can't be used.
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@Atrushan88 said:
Exposed actually does make sense. Other games use that as a form of "armor pierce". However I did at first think it meant it was aura reading because I was thinking of the other meaning of exposed. Vulnerable doesn't really translate well either honestly though. If you were new you'd be like "Vulnerable to what?. Exposed definitely sounds better as well. Broken honestly sounds the best but that's already a status effect. If it were me I would change Broken to Cursed and Exposed to Broken. It'd make a little more sense with Plague as well being cursed over being broken.
Vulnerable in a game like this pretty much always means attacks.
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@AzdrubaelVect said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/627460#Comment_627460
Rank 1 is not automatically competitive play. If I can run around the killer on temple of purgation for 3 minutes even as a mediocre survivor then something's wrong. Does that mean I'll survive? No because the others are having fun on discord with me sweating like crazy but if you have a full team of sweat then the devs fully well know it's impossible for m1 to kill them
Now now. YOUR the one who brought up rank. I never said anything about specifically rank 1. There are other more reliable ways of tracking that sort of thing.
For example the average survival of the top X Survivors vs the average kill rate of the top X Killers
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@AzdrubaelVect said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/621515#Comment_621515
Depip squad, nuff said. If you watch optimal survivors you'll realize that m1 killers don't even have enough time to get more than 2 kills unless they tunnel like crazy.
Almost nobody plays like that? Yes, that's a fact but it also doesn't matter because balancing in competitive games is done by using the highest possible value and skill ceiling, not the mediocre or lowest.
the stats don't matter if most people don't play competitively.
What about specifically the stats of the people that DO play competitively?
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@LordGlint said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/627374#Comment_627374
Did you watch Tru3s video today where he does that ALOT?
I did. It was super satisfying to watch. New Freddy might be viable.
I'm only using uncertain terminology because I don't actually have Freddy so I can't try him out for myself.
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I don't see how that could be implemented.
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@Remy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/627321#Comment_627321
The problem with the old Freddy was that 8 out of 10, at least the ones I encountered, were Campers. If they caught you, you get hanged...they wait til someone unhangs you, and you take a few steps and sure enough, he's right behind you. Hang, and he'll just wait there until someone frees you and chase you again until you die. After I die, I watch the game, and he does the same thing to next player. Rinse and repeat.
so I'm actually glad about the Freddy's new powers. I've yet to encounter a camper Freddy since the upgrade.
New Freddy seems awesome. The snares look surprisingly useful and the gen teleport is unexpectedly good in a chase (but very clearly bad for initiating a chase).
Basically, his lullaby doesn't tell you how far away he is unlike the terror radius which does. So if someone is asleep then you can gen teleport to the other side of them while LoS is broken without them knowing.
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Not a QoL change. Please stop misusing that term, using it like that defeats the point of the term.
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Clearly you needed 8 gens remaining and 15 hooks. Otherwise you're clearly a Noob.
Also your chases need to last -5 seconds and you need to hit everyone 4 times per down, and you can't ever let them heal at all.
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I chuckle and stab them in the back
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@Locker_Monster said:
@Peanits Maybe I'm going at it wrong. It does not have to be a hit protection.
'For every Safe Unhook you make, gain a token up to 2/3/4 Tokens. Every Token increases Altruistic Action speeds by 1/2/3%. Failing a skillcheck of any kind removes a token. Getting hooked removes half (rounded down) the tokens.'
You're still showing the mettle of man; that they will not be kept down & will help each other no matter what.
..Failing that; it's still an idea for a future perk! 😀
a 3% action speed increase is tiny for these kinds of actions.
Spine chill alone is 6% and works on more things and has a crap ton of utility outside of that. And botany is 33% towards healing which is by far the most common Altruistic Action you preform in the game and also works on self healing.
And at max stacks that's 14.2857143 seconds per heal down from 16. All of that work for less than 2 seconds faster healing.
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Plague is better than Legion due to how the final effect is more impactful.
Legion injures you and slightly slows you with the 15 second mend. The Plague however both injures you for the entire trial unless you cleanse, but also means you will be even easier to track thanks to infecting objects.
Now the REAL reason Plague is better than Legion is because of her perk builds. Specifically, she can use thanataphobia + Monitor in order to heavily capitalize on the injured Survivors properly. They suddenly start doing gens much slower and have to deal with a 24 meter TR 115% Killer.
Yes Legion can do this too, but this has the obvious counterplay of just healing. You can't really do that against the Plague, so she's dangerous enough to be high tier.
Also her addons let her be very good. Yes addon dependency doesn't qualify a Killer as being properly viable like Spirit, Nurse, Hag or whatever are but it's still far better than most Killers.
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@Judgement said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/626156#Comment_626156
Technically pizzas are pies though.
Real men call Pizza a cake
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I had this exact confusion when I first started playing
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I hope oblivious is a 3rd seal buff.
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@immortalls96 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/625478#Comment_625478
Botany alone increases heal speed by 33 percent with no cost or setup...
Botany doesn't increase repair speed while fully healed.
Thanataphobia's counterplay is healing. If it slows that down too much then it becomes OP due to always slowing the game too much in combination with certain other effects such as Legion.
Healing with thanataphobia would take over 20 seconds with another survivor or a medkit. Combine that with sloppy and it takes even longer.
I know that doesn't really sound like too much, but compare that too the no heal meta and it's clear that having both long heals and big punishments for not healing at the same time with just 1 perk is too much.
2 perks for it is a different story of course.
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@immortalls96 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/625446#Comment_625446
I'd personally shoot for 6/12/18/24..but I'd take any improvements rn -_-
With it effecting healing that might be too much.
If it didn't effect healing then totally.
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I would love for it to be 5/10/15/20
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David. We gonna live forever after all.
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If you literally just have it start at 5 and count both hex and dull totems at the same time then it will have literally no impact on ANY of these perks besides NOED sort of.
Or if you don't want to crowed the UI then make a unique map wide noise that only survivors can hear whenever anyone breaks a dull totem.
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@TheUnendingNightmare said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/622495#Comment_622495
More bp ? You could use it to get survivors to the basement and make use of the perk Hook basement whilst also getting points towards chase a downing survivors.
No. Making it easier to struggle out of your grasp is strictly worse than hooking someone even with this perk. And if you want to farm then drop them and pick them up.
And the way deep wounds work means you are extremely unlikely to get a down with it. Remember, the timer doesn't go down when in your terror radius and he can easily mend when outside of it unless you are Ghostface/Myers/Wraith/Pig.
With the changes I suggested you would be using it mainly to get extra gen pressure off of unhooks while you are chasing someone else not at the Hook, and not for when they struggle off you since that part is useless except in the case of DS.
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Just making sure <3
Whats the benefit of using this perk exactly? People aren't very likely to get off your shoulder so just making it easier feels like negative utility even with the deep wounds effect. Maybe just have the effect always proc when struggling off your shoulder or being unhooked outside your terror radius (even if it's someone else who does it) with no struggle drawback?
Also please have the description actually say deep wound status instead of mending status, cuz that's not the right name.
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shouldn't it be for 40/30/20 seconds?
The deep wound status ending means they are in the dying state.
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You know, hitting multiple survivors who know what they are doing is not as likely as you think with only a 1.2 M/S gain on survivors. A 3.5 second cooldown just isn't good enough to follow up with, I'd make it a 3 second base.
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how about this:
- Start the trial with 1 token. Whenever a survivor is killed or escapes gain a token up to a maximum of 2/3/4. The endgame collapse lasts 30 additional seconds per token.
Yes I deliberately worded it so it would effect trials that don't end in a 1v1. Yes you can gain more tokens after the EGC starts and yes that would add on time mid collapse. Yes this stacks with itself and no I don't think that spending 4 perk slots (between all 4 survivors) to get a practically endless time during the EGC is a problem. It's a maximum of 5 minutes total or 10 minutes if someone is downed the entire time.
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@ElusivePukka said:
As long as people recognize that tryhard!=toxic, we good fam.
Playing optimally, efficiently, and with the meta is different than being a dick about it.
This^
As annoying as these strategies can be (gen rush, looping, tunneling ect), I will continue to defend that using said strategies is EXACTLY what I'm hoping everyone is doing in spite of that.
Your job as a survivor is to make the Killer have as hard of a time Killing you as possible and I'll be damned if I don't encourage people to do their job effectively. It may be painful AF to deal with as the Killer, but that's not your problem and besides, I'm playing Spirit so I should be able to handle it by being optimal right back.
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@YoYoFreakCJ said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/617480#Comment_617480
While carrying a hex all effects related to it should be disabled. To stay true to this you can only move one of the two Haunted Ground hexes at a time. While moving one the other becomes unlit and "parked", and once you place the hex down the parked hex lights up again. If the survivors cleanse the parked unlit totem in the meantime they won't trigger the effect (cleansing an unlit totem and having something happen is bad). In this situation something has to be done with the parked hex when placing down the carried hex. I see two options:
- It just disappears (so you effectively only have one haunted grounds hex left - the one you were carrying).
- It transfers to another random unlit totem upon placing the hex.
I prefer option 1 because I dislike the idea that something random happens with the totems while tingering with them.
If I were to run both Haunted grounds and NOED, and then pick up Haunted, then every totem besides the parked totem is cleansed, will NOED override it?
And if there is 2 totem spots, both taken by HG and then one of them is picked up and put into the dull totem after NOED activates what happens to the 2nd totem spot?
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Just have a unique sound effect play when a dull totem is cleansed that Survivors can hear. This is along with a location indicator.
The Killer can only hear this if they are running thrill of the hunt.
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@Karltastisk said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/619902#Comment_619902
That is exactly what i intended with this idea, a totem counter will completely just kill NOED since everyone will know there are X amount of totems left at 1 gen and just cleanse them before the last gen or camp it until it's lit.
That is why i like my idea so much because it does exactly what we want. And that is bridging the gap betwen solo and swf without breaking the game.
Heres 2 scenarios to explain why this is a good change.
Scenario 1:
You are playing swf and find a totem with one gen left. You ask your teammates how many totems they have done. You now know how many totems are left.
Scenario 2:
You are playing solo and find a totem with one gen left. You look at the skull and see X amount of scratches on it. You now know how many totems are left.
BAM! Bridge has been gaped ;P
Scenario 3:
You don't see any totems and you have no idea if you should be looking for any. SWF can just ask their team if all 5 totems are cleansed, but Solo's cannot and thus don't know whether or not there is a totem.
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@Mad_Toe said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/579585#Comment_579585
Why would Sloppy Butcher be good on Spirit? I don’t see the significance with the Spirit having that perk
Because Spirit relies on sound. If someone is injured they make a loud noise which can be used to track them, this reduces the number of potential jukes they can potentially pull off significantly.
Plus, Killers like Spirit, Nurse ect are particularly dangerous to face if you're 1 shot.
So thus having them be injured for Longer increases the amount of time they are forced to be loud and easy to down, and also slows them down when they try to heal in order to remove those disadvantages.
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Yes I often see Survivors being toxic. But I also see other survivors call them out on it. And I've seen countless survivors get through the game quietly without issue.
For every game you remember someone calling you a tunneling camper, there are 3 that you forgot about where nothing happened.
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You see 4 times as many survivors as Killers. And being a Killer main means you see even less Killers because you see yourself instead.
From there it's just statistics. This is exactly what we would expect even with both sides being roughly as toxic as each other.
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But yeah. Teamwork itself is fine, the issue is unfair access to raw data they wouldn't otherwise have.
In Deathgarden where this information is accessible to everyone I never have a problem with parties, because they don't just magically know everything when they shouldn't have otherwise, they can just use the mechanics to keep everyone informed anyways.
As proof, if you get a team and then shut off your coms only having communicated the plan beforehand you can still have a very coordinated experience with almost as much teamwork as if you were coordinating in real time, since so long as everyone know's their role before hand, understands the game, and has the raw data, they can make meaningful team plays on a regular basis.
Anyone can understand the game, that just comes down to skill. Determining your role generally just happens naturally (Killer finds you first so you're the agro now. Everyone else gen jokey's) but can also be determined in the pre-game chat which doesn't require SWF.
That just leaves raw data, in Deathgarden everyone has all the data and this isn't an issue. In DBD they do not and guess what one of the games biggest issues has been.