List every...
Survivor mains : list every second chance perk you have. And then give a justification as to why its balanced
Killer mains : list every "crutch" or extremely stong perk you have and justify why they're balanced
I personally main hag and think that M&A is a very strong perk with next to no counterplay because its a perk made to only help the killer not hider survivors . It reduces her terror radius to 16m and I love it. Allows me to play a little sneaker and there's next to no complaints about it.
M&A is in a decent place and can be used by all killers while some get a little more use out of it.
Umm... And I'm having a hard time thinking of why anbody would want to nerf it
Sloppy butcher :
Free mangled. That's it. Does things to healing and brought about the no heal meta
Why it shouldn't be nerfed : everyone just rushes gens anyway and has adrenaline
Etc etc
Comments
"next to no counterplay"
Spine Chill has entered the chat
Enduring & Spirit Fury:
Can give you a free hit and waste a pallet
Why it shouldn't be nerfed: takes half of your perk slots to be effective, and survivors can reach another pallet or window with dead hard if they're lucky enough.
*stealth_killer. Mp4 has left the chat*
*Phases out of chat*
Anyways, BBQ on Spirit. Perfectly balanced...
...as all things should be.
I also use DS on Jake. It's balanced and a powerful anti-tunneling tool.
False, I go towards gens with discordance and aproach them without directly looking at the gen, it activates when you look towards the survivor's direction, not when you're close to them. I've got post game messages saying "my spinechill was bugged, it never showed when you were comming"
What if i never run 2nd chance perks?
Then give your opinion on second chance perks. And list what perks you run
I don't know exactly what perks are considered crutch
NOED: JuSt ClEaNs DuLl ToTeMs
BBQ: Powerful only on high mobility killers, basically necessary to reduce grind, has counterplay.
Enduring & Spirit Fury: Powerful combo, but takes half perk slots to be effective
Mad Grit: "It's not glitched ye dumb ######### "
Deliverance? You mean Discordance? Just don't team up on gens.
And the range is pretty wide. If you look in my direction at all I will know you are nearby. Plus I have eyes and ears.
@thesuicidefox LOL! I edited it, my bad, LOL! And I don't know , it has worked for me, or maybe they're just dumb enough not to run away or hide?
The moment you show up near me and my Spine Chill wasn't lit for an extended period prior I will know you are moonwalking, so I will just play as if I'm not using Spine Chill.
Calm Spirit will counter it too and there's nothing you can do about it unless you are Wraith. If you run Calm Spirit you never disturb crows, meaning anytime a crow goes off near you it's 50/50 that it's the killer. Play with Bond or in SWF and you will know 100%. The moment I hear crows go off I know what direction you are coming.
Also Premonition.
NOED on Cannibal. I don't care that he already has an instant down, because he is trash and NOED helps him to not get rekted too hard by good survivors and NOED also has counter play, so you can't call it a crutch on Cannibal.
DS: is fine because you can avoid it.
Dead hard: also easy to counter.
Deliverance: fine too, but i don't like it since it can become useless if you are the first one on being hooked.
MoM: i think no one has a problem with that perk anymore.
As solo survivor i run Kindred, Bond, Small game and Spine chill (before i used to run open handed)
With friends: Adrenaline, Resilience, Small game and Borrowed time (yeah, 2nd chance perk but not for me)
I don't rely on 2nd chance perks because my main goal is to not be found and, if they find me, i usually can loop the killer for long enough to make it worth without using exhaustion perks (i'm not counting adrenaline because it works in a different way). I run Kindred, which implies i need to be found first, because the information it provides to others it's just too good.
Isn't that the point of saying "next to no"?
Adrenaline: It's rewarding success rather than mitigating failure which makes it unique among second chance perks. It's also somewhat self-balancing, since if the Killer's can stop the gens from being completed by being better at the game (AKA: If the game is otherwise balanced) then whatever counts as good play in general also counters Adrenaline and thus ensures that Adrenaline will only proc if the Killer messes up.
NOED: Fine for completely different reasons. The effect by itself while overrated is still very strong. However the fact that you can stop it from procing at the endgame before you even are close to that point keeps it in check, and you can cleanse it during endgame if you really want to.
BBQ & Chili: lockers exist
Hex: Ruin: survivors can battle it
Nurse's calling: go away from the killer to heal
Franklin's Demise: no item, no use
Pop Goes the Weasel: can be hard to find a gen sometimes
Dead hard: easy to bait
Balanced landing: needs a hill to activate
Deliverance: getting hooked first makes it useless that game
DS: requires being tunnelled
Borrowed time: requires getting the other person farmed
That's all I've got :)
You can keep noed in check. How do you keep adrenaline in check? Besides gen pressure?
I do this with the wraith, its op funny
Anything that counts as skillful play also counts as countering Adrenaline. In other words, normal play alone is enough to handle Adrenaline.
The thing about the perk is that it lets you get more out of slight advantages, but for it to help you need to get an advantage to begin with. Since if the Killer can win in time Adrenaline won't help.
TLDR: If you balance the game as a whole then Adrenaline is balanced. Thus changing the perk directly is unnecessary.
Also depending on how you define gen pressure you may as well have just said:
"How do I stop all the gens from popping besides stopping all the gens from popping?"
So you are going to have to be a bit more specific there
Ok so basic gameplay helps curve it that's good to know. I really don't use adrin or noed I don't like ither one but it's more annoying when the player with adrin is being toxic.
eating hope : cleanse le totems
no one enjoys death:cleans le totems
spoopy grounds: don’t cleanse le totems
blood wizard ( blood warden): l e a v e
chili: stay near le hooks
slow the game down just a lil bit: cleans le totems
donezo kiddies
DS: because the one thing I really hate to go against are tunneling killers.
Killers often complain about genrush and that they want a game that lasts longer than 5 minutes. I completely understand this. But so do I.
If I get unhooked and the killer comes back and goes after me while ignoring the unhooker, who literally run into his face, he deserve to get a DS. That's the only perk which can help you if you get tunneld and to stay longer in the game than just a couple of minutes.
Counterplay is simple: just don't tunnel.
Lmao spine chill Is easy yes it's god tier but breaking SC is what stealth killers do well
Tier 1 Myers is typing...
Ruin - add extra 10-60 seconds to the game so you can start applying pressure before you get genrushed. Plan A.
Noed - Plan B.
GF main.
Survivior second chances: old decisive, old MoM, current DH. Unbreakable. Any other perk considered second chance is limited in use or earned.
Killer crutches: Noed.
On my killers I usually run Nurses Calling, Ruin, MYC, and Sloppy Butcher (sometimes I swap Ruin and Sloppy for Devour and Thrill).
On my Surviviors I run Urban, Decisive, Balanced Landing, and Adrenaline.