Kebek
Kebek
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@Jejune said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1721986#Comment_1721986
You are still locked into a 45 degree angle with him... Why?
I have been reeled through wall edges that normally stop you from running.
Not really sure what you mean with the 45 degrees, you can make full turn around him if he's not reeling you walking backwards. If he is then your control is significantly limited and turning isn't really gonna cut it 90% of the time.
The reeling around edges works as long as he's got good angle on them and you can't really change that once you've been speared unless you have some other obstacle to get stuck on along the way. If you're only slightly around the corner then his reeling is almost always going to force your model to slide over it since the angle is usually in slinger's favor since his shot connected.
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The reeling with slinger moving backwards basically forces your survivor model to run towards him with different animation. It's very unlikely that your model will randomly get stuck on something if slinger has clear patch between you and him, it is possible with some weird collision but extremely unlikely.
If he's moving towards you, you have far more control (as you almost aren't pulled towards him at all) so that is the main time to move to sides in attempt to break the chain.
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I think I know what you mean, the second drop of 2750 IS was supposed to be today I'm pretty sure but insted I got 500 IS as well. Maybe I'm just dumb and somehow missed it but I'm almost certain that there was just single 2750 IS drop.
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Same thing you do vs good nurses, spirits, docs etc killers with strong chase powers - predicting. The moment he has LOS on you without obstacles, he can shoot you, if he didn't the first moment (which you can predict too) he's waiting for something, either more distance on you, wants to slow you down with M2 spam or is just looking for more safe shot.
With experince you judge these scenarios and do your best to get into slinger's head to predict his next move (as many call it guessing which I disagree with as it's based of experience). The general counterplay without predicting is gaining distance from each reloding or different mistake, beiing aware to not get stealth shot, using LOs blockes, not staying at unsafe loops while injured and things like that.
There isn't a simple answer really, it comes with experience and is always unceration based off the kind of player (with added map variation) you face.
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Actually yes, I've had quite a lot of 1v3 or even 1v2 games since my teammates decided to randomly hook suicide vs all kinds of random killers for some entiteled reason.
Only a very few of AFK killers though. Not as common.
I count it as bad luck but it would still be nice if devs reworked hook stages so that hook suiciding isn't new way of early DC to avoid the penalty. Even forcing them to just hang there for those 2min making killer think they need to guard them would be better then the instand deaths.
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I mean his kit isn't unhealthy in it's current form so full rework isn't imao warranted. He needs significant changes though either to make him better at chasing (not advised since he's been always mess to balance in chase) or increase in mobility, other pressure tools.
For example making his FF in some way a mobility tool just as a deep wound tool. Maybe something along the lines that FF ticks down at half or even quarter rate while out of chase so that it can be used for mobility and stuff like that.
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Half the killer roster beats you at those loops easily. Even basic M1 killer without chase real power can outplay most of those pretty easily. Not really slinger related issue.
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First off, I don't think any kind of big changes (like these) for slinger are needed. Main things that need to be addressed about him are his M2 zoning spam and terror radious nerfs compensated by some other number buffs. Other then that, he's fine.
Second, this isn't bad idea for a small rework and it's really hard to say how it would turn out without testing it on PTB for example. I don't hate it but also don't particularly like it either. The ADS delay might just get compensated by 115% mms making both changes pointless but as I said hard to tell without playing with it.
Overall if it made people feel better about beiing beaten by slinger with added sound notification + bigger ads while making him 115%, it would be one of the reworks I'd consider acceptable at least on paper. Can't really form strong opinion without testing it really.
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Well no good survivor should throw down pallet when they know they are in the window where the hit connects while the pallet is thrown as well.
If they realise this and still throw it well, they're gambling and as such they will very likely be punished for it. Better to get hit/downed without wasting the pallet then doing killer a favor by giving him both. If they're desperate to not get hit they shouldn't allow killer to get that close in the first place and pre-throw pallets at the last safe loop around the tile.
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I feel that trash teammates are much much worse then having trash killer with good/decent teammates. I can farm off emblem points from trash killer to minimum black pip but I can't do pretty much anything with teammates who first hook suicide.
I'd take trash killer any day of the week insted of trash teammates (in terms of emblem points farming ofc).
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@BillyMain77 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1714078#Comment_1714078
Can you explain what this is please? Ive been playing for almost a year and a half and i have no idea what you guys are talking about lol
Im on xbox if it matters.
I don't know if it works on xbox right now (since it's basically a bug) or the buttoms for it but simply said, it means that as surivor you don't need to hold M1.
If you use this controls QoL bug your survivor will repair gen, crouch, heal, whatever buttom holding interaction that requires you to hold M1 or any other buttom will be done passively without you beiing forced to hold buttoms.
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@OniWantsYourMacaroni said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1714078#Comment_1714078
How?
If i try to go back from the menu it stops the action immediately
I don't know how it works on console etc but on PC it seemed to work for me just fine.
I'll link the discussion on how I find out about it and do it. I did the same way this patch and it still worked for me.
@Kebek said:
I've randomly stumbled on this when playing survivor lately and it's the best bug (I presume it's a bug) I've ever encountered in 4 years of playing DBD. I know posting this endangeres it's existence as I'm raising awerness of it to the devs and even when it's a big upgrade to gameplay they might still fix it anyway. Still I want to share my findings since I've never heard anyone mention this bug anywhere.
What this essentially does is that it makes holding M1 on interactions (such as gens, healing etc) passive without the need of you pressing your M1 buttom.
Anyone who is tired (or even has some health issues with their hands) of holding their M1 on mouse will surely love this.
So this is how you activate it:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/O95KVXZGOIHR/best-bug-ever.png
As explained once you stop holding M1 in the menu any interaction that you're doing will be held passively.
This can be canceled any time by pressing M1 again and it's also fully interactive with skillchecks so it has not flaws that I know of yet.
You can't even imagine how happy I was when I found this since I personally hate the constant need to hold M1 during any interaction and imao this is how interactions should work in the first place - first tap starts the interaction, second stops it.
Please mods don't remove this thread or move it elsewhere since it's a major update to survivor QoL and as many players as possible should learn about this bug that upgrades QoL of survivor gameplay.
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No way, if so that's horrible.
@Almo Can you guys unfix it ? It was much more comfortable then permanently holding M1.
Edit - Just tested it, it's still possible. Still, if anyone on the dev team intends to fix it then please don't. It's wonderfull QoL bug and I would hate to see it gone.
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They have high kill rate wich isn't the same as winning a fair match with players of equall skill.
You as killer can 3k depip or 4k blackpip which results in matches with players of unquall skill as ranking isn't based of kill rate thus ranking will put survivors who die each game as rank 1 as long as they farm enough emblem points while alive. Current ranking system doesn't evaluate survival as very important, actually it's only like 1/4 or even less important when you look at how emblems work.
This create the scenarios where survivors don't fell pressure enough to survive to increase their rank so most players just farm points and then do dumb plays resulting in them dying, boosting the kill rate. Rank 1 is plagued with horrible surviors who die each game yet they are able to farm each other off so they maintaint the rank 1 even when their survival rate is very low.
If ranking system was 100% based of kill/survival rate these statistics would be impactfull for balancing but since that isn't how ranking works they're almost useless in terms of balancing. Survivors don't need to survive to "win" thus surviving isn't something they strive towards and die far more then they should.
Also it's most likely not getting better as devs don't want to reveal anything about new ranking system that's working in the background. Once that comes out we'll know even less about what is considered winning and which statistics are actually important.
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@MeltingPenguins said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1712974#Comment_1712974
A good demo. 'good' being the keyword here. you don't have to be a 'good' freddy to have all these advantages from his powers. That's my train of thought.
Bringing up deathslinger again: a lot of people complain about him that 'hoping he makes a mistake' isn't counterplay, so saying 'hoping freddy decides to engage in a chase etc, aka make a mistake' shouldn't count as counter either
Fair enough, still freddy beiing easy to use while also beiing strong killer isn't anything bad or nerf worthy. Noting wrong with having good easy to use killers as is nothing wrong with having extremely strong & extremely hard to play killers such as nurse.
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@MeltingPenguins said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1712946#Comment_1712946
I don't think you can compare these:
Demo's portals you can actually ignore. They don't do much to hinder survivors unless you run straight over them. Trapper has to go and reset the traps. You can tank clown, sure, but you can't actually weaken freddy.
It's as if in a match against clown you'd get intoxicated automatically after a while.
Good demo with perfectly spread portals (that aren't getting broken) is twice as mobile as freddy is and mobility is generally accepted as very powerfull so yes you can ignore them but they will hinder your progress a lot as you're giving demo a lot of free uncontested mobility.
Trapper's traps injure and possibly instadown you so ofc they can't be as freely spammable as freddy's snares that only slightly hinder your movement, also trappers is really old and will most likely get some further buffs the the future as his current form is considered as pretty weak.
If freddy decides to chase someone who is freshly awoken and that survior is really good looper then he's going to have a bad time as without his dream world he's just powerless M1 killer. Freddy is much weaken when you're awake so you do weaken him by waking up as it makes everything he does harder at the cost of you wasting a bit of your time.
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Tbh that's how it works with most other killers that allow you to weaken their power. With demo you need to waste time breaking portals, with trapper waste time looking and disabling traps etc.
Most of the time you just need to tank their power, with freddy it's the same as clown, you can't really evade his gas if he uses it properly as you can't evade the snares when you're already asleep.
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Lucky break is buffed to have permanent duration like Iron will does.
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They are balanced since you need a ton of stalk before you can use those + be extremely close to survivors to activate the mori which they can counter by using lockers if they're smart. Any good player knows how different is michael's playstyle when he's using tombstones and thus they can play around them.
Only "nerf" they should get is the passive mori hand stance should be applied to both purple and pink tombstone and be active during EW 2 and EW 3 to warn survivors who know what to look for that MM is using tombstone.
Nefing one of the most well designed and unique addons with huge advantages compensated by just as big disadvantages would be horrible choice by the devs especially when they aren't even that strong and can be countered.
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Beiing slugged for 4 min sucks but isn't holding game hostage since you have hard set amount of time you wait that isn't even that long. If survivors decide to perma hide you can wait extremely long times until you find them (if even) when they're good at hiding. I've had a game with 3 survivors holding the game hostage and before I managed to find and kill 2 of them it took almost 90 min (I know I'm crazy but I really hate dcing and didn't want to give them the pleasure of making me quite).
Slugging is nothing compared to real holding the game hostage so there's no comparison between viable strategy and griefing like holding the game hostage with permanent hiding. If you really hate it and your dc timer is lower then 4min the go for a dc otherwise you just need to suck it up.
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Great, threads about balance based of kill rates are already appearing, just great.
I admit the thread is well done but I don't like the fact that the foundation for it are kill rates which only show that feddy is strong and easy to play so that even bad/mediocre players can dominate your average solo survivors very effectively and consistently with him unlike with nurse.
Freddy can probably use some small number nerfs but his kit is overall fine, there's nothing wrong with having strong killer who's basic and easy to play. I wish people stopped focusing on nerfing good killers and focused more on buffing the weak ones so that we have more diversity.
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@Auron471 said:
+60s per safe unhook
I'm getting dizzy already.
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@Artick said:
Where did they say this?
It was mentioned in the latest Q&A stream among the other perks to be updated in the near (relatively) future.
Around 36:30 is where the talk about it.
https://www.twitch.tv/videos/778383647 -
Our complains never were it's OP by itself but that it's extremely unfun to play against (especially as trapping killers) and that its information can be shared through SWF to always let all 4 survivors know of killers location when only 1 survivor should know.
I honestly can't belive they look at survival rate statistics to determine if OoO is problematic when obviously it won't be (as many killers hate the users of that perk to hard tunnel them to the point of throwing the game). Just look at it objectively and you should instantly see they unhealthy design it has on killer gameplay, not chasing the user of OoO doesn't solve the problem that perk creates.
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My main complain is that the serum addon for killers can't be used outside of the event unlike the survivor serum. It's horribly biased design decision and until I hear a good reason for creating it that way I'll be disappointed with the event.
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@ALostPuppy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1692336#Comment_1692336
Specifically were you able to hear the moaning/wailing sounds she makes or the vacuum "wshhh" sound she makes while phasing? Because if it was the 2nd one it's nothing like that, you only periodically hear her wails and they're not entirely directional, but they do give you a rough idea where she is.
I didn't manage to get a game vs spirit yet so I can't really judge. I'm just saying that this bug reminds me of her old self which was pretty bad.
Also I don't remember how it used to be exactly, I just remember you were able to very reliablely tell from which side she was coming and pinpoit where she is while invisible making it pretty easy to beat her phasing. I'm sure there's some old PTB footage if you really want to know.
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Huh, that sounds the same as when she was released, during that time I think you could hear her phasing directionally and she was really bad until she got buffed.
I wonder how long will that take to fix (if it even will get fixed), probably longer then recent DS bug that affected a few killers making DS much worse vs them.
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Mainly PH movement speed nerf/changes
- After cancelling Rites of Judgement:
- PTB - Movement speed is 4.4 m/s for 1 second
- Live - Movement speed is 3.68 m/s for 1 second
Other then that, nothing much except maybe discordance nerf.
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Trapper (tied with hag but her traps at least don't insta-catch me but are equally as annoying)
Also suprised that quite a few people would also delete hag insted of likes of spirit, PH or slinger.
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Yeah that is really unfair. Either enable both and commit to making them work all the time or don't allow neither. I really hope they won't do something so biased as letting one side use their event addon all the time while disabling the other one for almost 99% of the year.
That would really spoil the idea of making unique event addons for both sides.
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At that point it depends how long do you want your game to be. If you want to end survivors fast for whatever reason, just camp the basement and ensure they die. They made huge mistakes to get into that position so you are free to punish them hard for it.
Or if you want longer game with more points, chases, etc you can leave and give a few free unhooks. I usually show a bit of mercy in not punishing all the mistakes they do as long as survivors aren't annoying me or doing too well in their objectives.
The choice is all yours which is one of the nice things about playing as killer, if you get into such spot you're the one who decides how you want your game to go.
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I'm even more happy that we're getting Q&A stream next with any topic we want. It's really amazing to get another one pretty soon after the last one. I'm really happy that devs are giving us more of these.
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@Peanits Is the issue with losing all people on your friends list something that will get fixed or do we need to re-invite everyone again ?
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Even when I enjoy seeing stats I would be against releasing more. Community always uses them as a valid argument for balancing then dismissing any reasoning that conficts with their official stats.
I wish we could get stats without them beiing used by community as balancing argument for following months if not years.
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Praise the cube, PRAISE !
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I would usually say that it's bad idea to add any game changing imput from indiviadual players no matter how good they are since we all are biased towards something we don't like or like no matter how good our intentions are.
But considering some past design choices I don't think there's that much to break. There's a lot good feedback on some of the major isses DBD so, all they have to do is pick one they like and adjust it to suit their view.
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There's nothing really interesting about basic M1 looping. You make baits and hope survivor falls for them other then that you can't do much vs good loopers. Using your power to outplay loops is far more fun and skillful then only using basic M1. If anything combining both is the best you can do.
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@Seiko300 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1675410#Comment_1675410
I don't see how your question has any relevance to the problem that Pyramid Head poses. We KNOW that this is a problem, Pyramid Head frequently puts survivors in situations where almost no counterplay is available to them and survivors are just forced to concede the chase. Your question is nothing but a deflection from what the issue we're discussing actually is.
But for the sake of discussion I'll answer it anyway. Huntress hatchets, much like Demogorgon shred you have an opportunity to dodge, mainly because there's an audible wind up for both. Demogorgon hisses and opens it's mouth changing stance, Huntress makes a noise herself sort of like an intake of breath and the hatchet itself also makes a sound when it's fully charged. More importantly for both killers they are reduced in speed during this time, Demogorgon has an alt. speed of 92% (3.68m/s) and Huntress is slowed even more at a whopping 77% (3.08) meaning both these killers are losing distance while they have wind up their attacks. If either of them miss they will have lost ground and the chase extends for a longer duration than it might have otherwise.
Given the vault hypothetical yes, a survivor does have a choice. A quick juke to the left or right can very well mean that either of those killers miss, and because they lost ground the survivor isn't punished for making the right call and not vaulting. This is especially true for Demogorgon, since if he misses and collides with an asset like a wall he is stunned for a longer duration. In that situation, it might actually be more rewarding for a survivor to gauge the time and distance to see if they actually can make the vault, since Demogorgon will not get the hit if he doesn't catch them at the window and they successfully vault all the way through. On the Huntress side of this if she misses she is down a hatchet, and has fewer chances remaining to injure or down a survivor before she is eventually forced to take the time and restock at a locker, at worst needing to break off chase entirely to find one.
Nowhere is this thoughtful design present in Pyramid Head's kit. He is slowed, but only to that of 110%, a speed which enables him to most certainly maintain a chase, keep up with, and even surpass a survivor (not that killers will be passing survivors up they'll be catching them of course). He is not punished at all for his wind-up, which also serves as area denial if a survivor doesn't want to get tormented, and can quickly transition from wind-up to M1 if the survivor doesn't vault that's where this problem comes from.
Yes I have asserted that PoD can't be dodged considering the alternative is an M1, this isn't something you have ever indicated you'd like to dispute and I don't think I'm necessarily wrong in my belief either. The only reason I can think of as to why you'd believe this isn't worth discussing is because you'd have far too much trouble proving your point (because it's inherently flawed but that is of course just my opinion).
Regardless of whether or not you think it's a lazy solution, at the very least it IS a solution. One that I can assure you I took the time to consider from both sides, and the conclusion I came to is that it's certainly worth the while, anyone who disagrees with me I'm certainly open to discussing with them and hearing out their reason for why. Unlike you.
Ok, I'm sorry for beiing disrespectful before and I admit that your suggestion made me frustrated to the point of making a snappy comment dismissing you. Seeing that you're still putting a lot of effort to answer me anyway I'll do my best to explain my point of view why it's not a good change.
At the demo/huntress comparion I was mostly talking about evading them via vault while their power has enough time to connect if you were to vault. At that point good demo/huntress have enough time to hold their power and react to what survivor will do - if they vault their powers are fast enough to earn a hit during the vault, if they don't they can just aim directly at the survivor and hit since reaching the 8m range of PH's power is both equally possible with them and is the most likely time for both to use their power to punish window/pallet vault. In other words, if they get too close to survivor, they reach point at which missing is purely dependant on killer and survivor can make a prediction and bait their hit but ultimately it's killers decision that will make it a hit or not.
If we were to talk about the actual missing then PH is actually punished equally as much since he's recovery time is 2.75s which is a lot of time to gain ground. But that's besides the actual animation lock comparion at which all these killers earn a hit the same way as long as they're used properly and have reach with their power.
Your belief that PoD can't be dodge isn't necessarily wrong but it's certainly incomplete. All killers chase powers usually revolve around their reach and utility. Once you're in reach of a chase power you're very likely to get hit no matter which killer it is, be it Doc, demo, slinger, huntress, nurse, bubba or anything. Key here is to be as far away as possible and break LOS at any chance which goes the same with PH as well. You need to always evaluate how far you are and if it's a good time to vault, fake, drop pallet, fake drop pallet, double fake drop pallet or any other opportunity that arises. Every killer has as much lose-lose when you're close to them so making the correct read in time to gain more distance is not as far different with PH as with other killers.
As I said I'm not liking your suggestion (which is why I snapped as I did, sorry again) and my belief is that PH does have decent amount of counterplay at least as equal as other chase oriented killers. At the current time of new changes beiing tested, it's very difficult to discuss further changes and best course of action is to wait and see how impactull they will be. If they aren't enough, I'm sure devs will make more chages in the future but rash changes like adding immunity frames exactly the kind of changes that is too fast and too drastic so even when you think it's a possible solution, it's one that devs wouldn't do since they learned from their past mistakes in this regard.
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@not_Queef said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1673365#Comment_1673365
It being more predictable makes it more dodgeable.
Keep up.
Tbh it doesn't make it any more or less predictable once in range, just more limited. Higher windup limits opportunities to shoot which has nothing to do with the actual prediction so it's the same in terms of dodging.
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@Blueberry said:
I think you'd run into some of the same issues and reasons that the moon bouquets were removed. They were removed because it was a lot of extra programming to work every single current map and new map that comes out with those features. Similar to the reason Tinkerer was reworked, it made them have to do a lot of extra programming around all the new addons and killers that came out in the future just for that one perk.
I don't mean it that complex.
More along the lines like you build walls the same way PH does his trails only they have colision and can be broken etc. You release bigger toxic clouds that last longer and have additions effects like clown and maybe spawn some kind of puzzple boxes like pig or something. Things like that but combined into one power.
Nothing that would need major work, only alter already existing assets into new ones that work together with new effects.
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Personally I think variety is the most important thing. We should have a bit of everything and not shame designs we don't personally like since others actually may like them. Only line is that in which killer's power literally breaks the game like old Legion did to chases and old Freddy did to stealth and juking.
We all find fun something different so wanting something removed or significantly changed just to appease the fun of one group is imo wrong. Balancing those things people find unfun is fine but drastic changes to designs that don't need them is uncalled for and shouldn't happen.
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@ALostPuppy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1669211#Comment_1669211
And? Nobody who knows what they're talking about is talking about dodging Deathslinger's shots, they're saying the entire process of him ADSing and shooting is completely unreactable and cheap as #########. Really wish the people who defend Deathslinger would actually understand that and at least show that they understand that even a little.
The thing is, people complain then can't react and dodge his shots but that's the case for almost all other killers who use their power optimally as well. Only thing about slinger that's different is that he's faster at it and does it more often at the cost of having nothing else. That however doesn't stop you from predicting him as he does to you but people just dismiss it since it's hard and more in favor of slinger then them.
Reacting in DBD works mainly on M1 killers in loops with vision who move slowly to the point where you can just react to them. Any killer with power that affects chasing requires you to predict killer's use of it, not react to it with only a few exceptions.
Adding windup to his power won't add anything to his counterplay from side of survivors, he just won't be able to shoot as often making him the worst killer in DBD unless he gets buffs to compenase for such big nerf which leads us again to the point where he has enought time, speed or whatever for the first nerf to not matter since his spears still can't be dodged once you're in their reach. You'll still need to predict him once in range even if you add windup or further cooldowns, slowdowns.
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@WeenieDog said:
I mean, if a killer and survivor are both playing perfectly , then who should come out on top?
The killer right?
If we don't account for predictions or obstacles it's almost always killer's power. From what I've seen here, the few exceptions (in the open while not extremely close) would probably be hillbilly, PH and possibly blight. since their power's either can't turn as easily once they're used or have a delay making them most likely to be reactable.
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@ALostPuppy said:
It's not even the fact that slinger's power is unreactable whilst it's being fired it's the fact that the windup is completely unreactable and virtually nonexistent. You can't react to a Huntress hatchet at point blank but you know she's got it ready because A)there is an obvious noise and B) There is a windup animation. She's also slower whilst aiming. Demo has a small start-up and cooldown, and moves slower than survivors whilst he's charging of the abyss. Pyramid head is just...weird. he has a start-up animation, a reactable ranged attack and a cooldown after, but he's not slower than the survivor during any of these parts of his power which is why he has the whole "hold M2 to outplay" lose-lose playstyle. Slinger has none of this. No startup animation, unreactable ranged attack and no cooldown from faking his power which is why it's so much more annoying.
That's all nice and all but I was asking which killer's power are survivors actually able to dodge. Even the example just point out limits on other killers powers but don't tell anything about the actual dodgine at all.
I never really saw anyone who is able to reliably dodge hatchets from a good hutress with pure reactions nor dodging demo's shred from reasoable distance when it's already used. I don't really care about the limits since those just lower consistency at which power can be used, not the actual reaction based interaction from survivors. You aren't really outplaying huntress's hatchet throws if you're constantly looping high wall loop with a good pallet that forces huntress to guess if you'll pre-throw or keep running, you're abusing her limits to evade the scenario where you would need to dodge.
Slinger pushes the consistency at which he can shoot higher then any other killer in the game but that has nothing to do with how dodgeable his harpoons are, their speed is what makes them extremely hard to dodge, not the windup. With bigger windup, he'll just lose some of the consistency but his harpoons will stay exactly as undodgeable as they were before, like most other killer powers from close to mid range.
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@Heartbound said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1667867#Comment_1667867
Sorry. I guess there really isn't much to say though. You either vault, drop a pallet or try to spin the killer if he's right behind you. Usually at that point you just accept the hit and sprint burst to reset and try again or go down.
I though as much but people like to always make arguments that when they can't dodge something (usually slinger since he's the hot topic when it comes to dodging) by reacting, it means their imput is meaningless so I was wondering if they can tell me what is so dodgeable about other killers. So far, I can agree that billy and PH (possibly blight) when used in the open and in range (but not in M1 range) can probably be dodged via reacting but other then those probably nothing else.
The way I see it, if you allow killer to get close and in range of his power that's used perfectly, almost every single killer will earn a hit with it unless out out-predict them (if it's even possible in that scenario) which is also case for all the killers. I just can't grasp where is this dodging logic coming from, you're either in range of a power or not. If you are, good killer will earn a hit pretty much always.
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@Heartbound said:
Uhhh. I can give you counters for the killers if you want. (Or at least what I do.)
Trapper: Don't step in tall grass and be wary at loops. Don't start hopping windows etc until you're injured because if you go down then well, you were going down anyway if you didn't try to escape.
Wraith: Watch for his shimmer and start a loop to avoid the speed boost he gets uncloaking.
Hillbilly: When he revs his chainsaw for more than 2 seconds press A or S on your keyboard and turn your mouse in the opposite way to spin. That usually throws him off.
Nurse: Dead Hard the second blink when she's on top of you. Failing that use map geometry to your advantage. She has to predict you to land a hit on you, so as soon as you break line of sight pick a different way of going, but mix it up or she'll catch on.
Huntress: You can duck her hatchets and I find it more useful than juking her, but make sure not to run in a straight line away from her or she'll axe you.
Shape: There's two strats. If you're a gen jockey do not let him get stalk on you. Do whatever you can to remain behind cover. If you're the runner let him drain you completely of stalk and keep him busy. If you keep him off your jockeys he can never hit Tier 3.
Hag: When she picks someone up run around and pop as many of her traps as you can. Make sure to hold crouch when you're rescuing someone. High rank survivors will crouch off of hook and hook traps will never be a problem with strong survivors.
Doctor: Know your lockers. A lot of Docs use their static blast off cooldown and it's on a minute cooldown. If you know its been a minute and he hasn't used it and you hear the terror radius, consider getting in a locker. Alternatively run Calm Spirit, but lets be honest its real use is suppressing crows.
Cannibal: If he's on you, know your fundamentals and stay at either a loop or window. Force him to M1 you. Stay calm and don't let him catch you in the open and do not crouch in corners. If he bodyblocks you in one it's over. He can be obnoxious to hook save against but unless he's memeing they usually run BBQ and Chili. You can hide in lockers before he hooks someone to shield your aura.
Nightmare: You need a runner on your team to beat him. If someone contains Freddy and the others do gens he's not a big deal. It's when you let him use his power and run all over the place that he's an issue. Stay calm and just knock out gens. He's an M1 killer in the end.
Pig: Fundamentals. Her traps add RNG. Usually my team finishes gens before I get unhooked at high ranks, but if your team is being slow consider searching 1 box and then doing a gen, then searching the remaining 3 boxes. The idea is to slow down the game, don't let her do that.
Clown: Play liberally at loops. He'll slow you down a lot and chew through defenses faster than other killers. If you're the runner rely on vaults more than pallets, but use what you have to.
Spirit: This one's tough. At easy ranks just loop her like normal. At high ranks she will expect you to try to mindgame her. Play a little stupid and you'll be rewarded, but mix it up. Something I say against Spirit often is "That shouldn't have worked."
Legion: Split up. 99% of the time they're running Discordance and will run over to your generator if you work with a teammate and utilize their power. They can see you in a locker too, so just run away. Otherwise rely on fundamentals.
Plague: Healing yourself highlights the fountain in white to her, so if she's paying attention she'll know where you are and reinfect you. If you only see one or two spots to heal yourself, go ahead and do it because the fountains reset and stops her from saving up corruption (though she will get one charge instantly, but just hide it out) Don't take risks with this killer. Also avoid infecting your generator. If she patrols she'll expect a generator being worked on to have green smoke. If she hits it and pukes on it and you don't touch it til its done being infected, she'll think the gen has been abandoned. She probably won't be back before you finish that generator.
Ghostface: Don't reveal him. It's a trap and it reveals your location. Look down at the ground if you're not on a gen, and keep an eye on your surrounds if you are on one. If he stalks you and makes you one shot...it's not a big deal, just loop him until you outlast it. The biggest time Ghostface is a threat is before you know what killer you're facing. Always assume you're vs. Ghostface and play accordingly.
Demogorgon: He's not that tough. At vaults and windows he will want to use his shred. Juke at the window to make him miss and it'll give you enough time for another circle around. Portals are okay but as long as you keep an eye on it it's not a big deal.
Oni: Don't get hit lol. Okay so someone got hit or you're using no Mither. No big deal. Treat him like Hillbilly. He'll either know how to use his stick or he won't. A lot of them use Infectious Fright. Either stay out of his terror radius or run calm spirit.
Deathslinger: Don't let him get into a position where he can fire at you. Hug walls and always have something between you and him. Pre-drop a pallet if you have to. He can shoot you all he wants but he has to touch you to down you. He didn't wash his hands after using the bathroom don't let him get ya.
Executioner: You know how with Huntress she'll ready a hatchet to hit you as your animation locked in the drop, so you just do another loop instead? Same difference. Executioner is just faster than her with infinite ammo. No big deal.
Blight: If you hear a moth hitting a lamp while you're working on a gen, the Blight is your killer. Run towards him on first charge, run diagonally or into the open on all subsequent charges. If he has nothing to bounce off of then he's locked in one direction. Dead Hard on the last charge and get to a safe loop during his stun.
Calm Spirit, Detective's Hunch and Dead Hard counter 90% of the current meta in this game, but ya didn't hear that from me.
Wow I appreciate the effort but I'm discussing dodging purely based of reactions, not counterplay. Your post isn't really on that topic.
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@lowiq said:
Is this another don't nerf deathslinger thread?
No, I want to know people's opinions on actual dodging with reacting. I'd love to stay on that topic and avoid talking about purely slinger as much as possible. I'm far more interested in talking about all the other killers.
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I think slinger is mostly fine, his power isn't breaking the game, it's just strong chase power that puts more control in killer's hand then survivor's, nothing wrong with having a few killers out of 21 to have strong chase power that survivors can't 100% hard counter.
The fun perspective is extremely subjective. Many don't like him for whatever reason but I love facing him due to the different chase mechanics then all other M1 killers.
Also he is fair overall, he exchanges very strong chase power for lack of map control, snowballing, tracking etc. If he had mobility or strong slowdown/tracking he would be unfair and possibly even OP but he doesn't have any of that so in that aspect he's fair. His chase is as unfair as survivor positioning and map RNG allows it. If survivors loop open tiles or are in the open and then yell unfair when the get downed for free that's on them, don't loop killers in positions that favor them.
DCing for any reason then emergency or severe bugs is very pathetic and should be discouraged/punished more (for example matching DCers with other DCers, give them taste of their own medicine).
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So the individual power of a character on both sides should be equal in a 1v4 game ?
Sounds balanced.
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Tbh DH is one of the second chance perk I don't mind. Yes it can be very strong and in some cases even game losing to erase a mistake leading into critical down but that's (at least for me) not even half as annoying as other second chance perks like DS, BT, Unbreakable etc.
I like the skillful uses about it, you can do some very nice mindgames with it and use it in creative ways. Yes, dead harding for distance is braindead and cheap but some killer can deal with it. Other exhaustion perks can erase mistakes without much survivor imput as well, that's their core design.
I think it doesn't need changes, it's really cool perk that can (as one of the very few) be used skillfully which is something I support. There are conditions to it and downsides as well so if anything, more viable perks that cause exhaustion should be added so people who dislike them can counter them.