Icaurs
Icaurs
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The problem with this, is that the survivor meta exists for a reason. Let's say you disabled BT/DS/unbreakable. What would happen is mass camping, tunnelling and slugging. Without the fear of these things, killers will increase in this playstyle. Even DH, if you disabled that killer would get downs, significantly faster.
It goes the same way. If you disabled gen slowdown perks for killers, the survivors will do generators way to fast for them to handle. Even without DH, killers will not be able to keep up, its not possible. Everybody complains about meta, but meta exists for a reason, and if you disable it, you risking breaking the foundation of the game.
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Depends, but if I can, change my perks to something stronger, and if needed equip lightborn. If I am really concerned I equip NOED. I then play the game normally, so long as their not toxic.
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Its just a bad healing perk. To get maximum value you need everybody injured. First of all that is a terrible position to be in, and as a player you should avoid all being injured at any cost. Second its only 14%, that is terrible .You need 3 people injured to have a faster healing speed of botany knowledge and this speed decreases with each survivor you heal. So even if you had 4 injured survivors, its only 56% for the first heal, and it decreases from there. The developers actually realised this was not enough which is why they threw on the unhook ability as well. Which is extremely rare to have any meaningful value because the base unhook speed is really fast allready. It is purely a joke perk, unless cobined with somehting like bottnay or BT.
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@dugman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2936296#Comment_2936296
Well unless it was their fifth hit in a chain they don’t down you with a Feral Frenzy hit, so one thing you can try is don’t drop pallets when you’re healthy. If you’re injured go ahead and drop them, that will force Legion to either try and loop it normally or break it by kicking it or going into Frenzy and vaulting it, but none of those will immediately get them a down. Basically against Legion your best bet is split up, stay injured and try and force Legion to down you with basic attack chases which can take a little while.
Note that the five-hit Frenzy chain down is an option for them, but even when it work it takes them quite a long time to actually do, up to 50 seconds with base kit and up to 100 seconds with Never Sleep Pills. Yes, they can get downs this way, but getting one down per minute isn’t really overpowered, even taking into account the mending involved.
@lesgo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2936296#Comment_2936296
Just assume that legion is gonna put you in injured state because that's his power, and keep pallets for when he isnt in frenzy. Is so easy, just do this with that combo addons or without. Legion is so countereable if you use your brain just a little...
Can you please read my post before responding. Seriously at no point did I even address the strength of this build and immediately you start trying to explain how easy it is to beat it. The title of this post is "Legion rework is only leading to more and more players quitting." The point, that I made was that as I explained, how his power works, its barely avoidable and once hit, he just leaves. I then explained how with this build no matter what I do he can quickly break the pallet whenever he needs and can get his power back automatically. There is no way for me to use any form of skill to outmanoeuvre or even minimise his ability to hit me with his power. As you yourself stated, am I getting hit, it is unavoidable. So at that point, I am just playing against a 115 killer with no power, except that I am injured for most the match. That is terrible. As I stated the best way to counter legion, and to counter this build specifically is to run to the corner of the map when he is chasing me. RIP interesting chases I guess oh but don't worry because he is super easy to beat apparently. Even if I agreed to that, congratulations you won. However some people believe that is it is more significant as to how a match ended rather then the outcome itself.
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Bill was a partner with left 4 dead. I believe behaviour got it for free or incredibly cheap which is why Bill is a free character. He is also highly recognisable, popular character. An old woman survivor would be just fine, but that's why Bill exists, but not an old woman.
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@colley94 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2936244#Comment_2936244
Yeah this is correct and point being even if you think you can outdo the mechanics, you have no chance on small / medium maps where can can run around the middle and see killer instinct.
Ultimately legion is not fun to play against and that alone ruins the game. A real shame the makers cannot see obvious things like this costing them more and more players each month.
So I just played against a legion with this combo and it was disgusting. Iridescent button: This addon breaks in pallet that he vaults over. Combined with Suzie's mixtape, which refills his power gauge when stunned. So every loop played like this.
I drop the pallet, he vaults over it, breaking the pallet in the process and hitting me. Or I successfully stun him, once the stun wears off his power is fully restored and then vaults over it hitting me? What even is that? Not even bother going to talk about strength, just how is that even a power at that point? He vaults anything, breaks every pallet, and stunning him is useless.
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The issue with the rework is that it does not address the main problem, legion is boring to go against.
How a chase goes is legion sees you and runs at you with his feral frenzy. You try to run but vaulting a window is useless, running for distance is useless, and your only real defence (a pallet stun) is fairly easy to dodge. In theory they should hit you 99% of the time with their power. Once hit they do not continue the chase, but rather leave to go after somebody else. A good survivor knows this, and instead of trying and ultimately failing to loop them, they instead run to the corner of the map, for the best chance of the legion's power failing to reach a teammate. Once hit, said survivor begins healing. It is long and gets repetitive quickly. After they have finished mending they are now injured. Most legion's will run one if not multiple slow down perks, (sloppy, thanataphobia) to make this process even longer. Now they are injured, these players must make a choice, do they waste time healing, knowing they will inevitably be hit fairly soon again? Or do they play risky and play a large portion of the match injured? The answer is kind of both.
While most killers have a question of when and how are they going to use their power legion's question is do I heal or not? Its a really important question, don't heal and you can't stealth around him at all and will go down very fast. Heal and you may find yourself injured only a few seconds later. Its not very interesting. The hit and run strategy is the only way to play him and even then its only kind of effective. Play against a few of these in a row, and anyone would feel like giving up.
After a few weeks, killers will go back to their mains, some may start playing them more regularly, but I don't think he will played as much as he is now.
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The Hamburgurler.
He will do anything for a chicken sandwich.
Anything
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Behaviour has
nerfed windows and pallets
decreased map sizes
fixed loops
introduced one new meta perk in 4 years (COH) which has been nerfed massively.
Added a tone of new strong killer perks, pain resonance, dead nan's switch, hex plaything.
Most changes of killer have been buffs. The reason why gens go so fast now is because they need to. I remember when the average downing speed for a killer was between one minute- one and half. Now its constantly around 30 seconds. If survivors did not refine the game as it well as it has they would lose constantly.
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Some players play to win, its just a fact. I may want to play less competitive, however there is nothing wrong with wanting to play to win. However when you play against players way bellow your skill level, all you are doing is dominating a match, its fun to an extent to see how far you have come, but its not really a match.
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Toxicity spreads toxicity. Its a really unfortunate aspect of online games, but as a player it is on you to be the bigger person. It is really unfortunate when people are genuinely toxic to you and I completely understand that you want to lash out. However if you choose to be toxic in response to somebody else, that does not make you any better. From the perspective of the person whose the victim of your toxic attitude, all they see is another toxic player. The fact that you were also victim of this behaviour does not justify it.
Imagine being bullied and instead of trying to overcome it you instead choose to bully somebody else who is smaller and weaker then you. Its actually worse when you do it, because you understand what is like to be a victim of toxic behaviour, and to then turn around give that same attitude to somebody else is pretty bad. As a community we should try harder to be more positive and understanding, instead of immediately lashing out every match.
Please try to be les toxic and more positive, even if others aren't, that makes you the better player.
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@Crowman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2933913#Comment_2933913
Camping, Tunneling, and Slugging are strategies that have valid use cases. I had a match on Ormond where the last 3 gens where in the Shack, by the hill right next to the shack, and a gen in front of that hill. It was an insane 3 gen given how close the 3 gens were to each other and I had just downed a Claudette and hooked her on the hook next to shack in between all 3 gens. So I camped the hill watching the 3 gens and forcing Claudette to hit 2nd state. Saying that "killers shouldn't camp" is complete bs as not camping in that situation is 100% throwing.
Which is exactly why I said I don't want strict rules in place to punish players for doing that. In that situation you are forced to go to an area of a map with no generators and likely no survivors to simply give a free unhook, then there is no issue with that. But if we don't at least acknowledge that using this playstyle as the general playstyle of DBD, then players will have an all around less enjoyable experience.
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There is such a thing as etiquette in online games. They aren't necessarily official rules of the game but rather things people should not do to best ensure everybody has the most fun. A general consensus is that killer should not camp, tunnel and slug. The reason is that camping and tunnelling punishes one players, removing their ability to participate in a match. Its not fun. Same as for slugging, as being forced to sit on the ground for a full bleedout timer is really boring and drags the game. If I experience a few matches a night like that I'm usually done and won' play for a while.
The same goes for killers, don't taunt at the exit gate, don't click with the flashlight, don't jump in and out of lockers. These things cause killers to have a worse time in general.
I do not want the developers to put in rules to completely remove these things as camping and tunnelling is needed sometimes (endgame). Same with slugging, and remaining in the exit gate makes the killer take the time to force them out to give their teamates time to open the other door. So I do not want these strict rules in place. But if we don't acknowledge that certain things ruin the fun for others and have a (I don't care, I will play how I want) mindset, the only people who will have a good time are those who play exclusively to win.
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The problem with all of this is you do not address the core of the issue with the twins, they are boring. All of these buff, even fi they went through would not change this. Victor is uninteresting as there is no incentive for long range lunges. With no terror radius it its easy to hit survivors, and said survivors are then marked for charlotte to find. This is not too strong, but rather there are little opportunities for one to demonstrate their skill.
Charlotte herself is just a 115 killer with no power, making her awful in chases, but with Victor good to go, these same chases are ended fairly quickly.
The best way to play the twins is to slug, camp and tunnel. They excel at this. regardless on your stance, these strategies are not interesting. Camping and tunnelling, while affective is generally not considered fun. Slugging with the twins slow the game down to such an unnatural degree, that each match takes 20 minutes. What's worse, is because they are slugging, they still often lose. Imagine playing regular 20 minute matches and you still lose a significant proton of it. The twins are just badly designed.
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The twins don't need a buff. She is actually fine as she is, not he strongest but certainly not the weakest. She is however, one of the most boring killers in all of DBD. In a chase, she is a base 115 killer with no actual power, this is really boring. Before you say "ok she needs a power in the chase." This would actually make her massively oppressive. Victor is near unavoidable and you should not be missing often. So you send him out, throw him on a survivor who is now marked and basically run him down. Now you run him down charlotte stands near the hook waiting for the save. You send him back out and and repeat.
What is worse is the best way to play the twins is to down somebody and then send victor out. Slugging is a massive part of the twins power. Where you stand on slugging does not matter, but it always does one thing, massively slow the game down. Every match played by good twins players can slow the game down to an unnatural degree that it just drags. Even the killer gets bored at a certain point, because they just want to move onto the next match. Imagine playing a 20 minute match of twins and still losing? That sounds miserable, now imagine doing that multiple times. She does not need a buff, and she certainly does not need a nerf, she needs a complete redesign.
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Something I would like to see is a better updated post game statistics.
Who the killer spend the most time in a chase with
Who did the majority generators
Who used the most pallets ECT.
This would be really good for post game evaluation, so players can look at these and better reflect on their matches and improve. Showing who was SWF would also be valuable, so that killers can make similar evaluation on matches.
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That would be a pretty fair buff.
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@Mooks said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2931334#Comment_2931334
They didn’t change a character.
also, I am speaking about in-game inclusion where they have been excluding anything LGBTQ+ related with the statement they want to leave out anything sexual BUT they literally have had multiple heterosexual relationships mentioned and continually added regardless. They have revised their stance and apologized for this mistake. They didn’t do it intentionally either and I do believe them on this.
people just like to use this ‚forced‘ argument thinking it doesn’t have any counterarguments. But in fact it’s not even an argument to begin with. No it doesn’t feel forced, you just want to have an excuse to be against inclusion.
i wasn’t around when WraithxNurse was revealed, but well. That’s one example and it’s related to two in-game characters/killers which is something a little different than backstory of a character before being taken by the Entity.
i can guarantee you all these threads would have popped up either way. If there wasn’t an announcement many people claiming they just don’t like how they announced it would now make arguments against it because the devs tried to make it as silent as possible and they wouldn’t even stand behind this and it’s not genuine. Not saying all of them would of course, but many just try to grasp at any argument against inclusion that won’t directly show their actual reason.
Yes they mentioned relationships in the lore which is fine. No different then the David instance. However they didn't make a big tweet about it for attention. But yes they did change his sexuality. Which BTW is the reason they had to do the tweet in the first instance. So let's say the never made the tweet. Now without the tweet, whose to say David had one instance of homosexuality and then never again? Without the tweet you could say he is homosexual and I could say he was straight, and neither one of us would have any way to prove this. They had to make a tweet to force the David change.
Also please don't just say I'm anti inclusion, A that's not an argument and B you know nothing about me.
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@Mooks said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2931238#Comment_2931238
You are completely ignoring the fact that BHVR explicitly excluded LGBTQ+ topics from DbD and them now adding representation is therefor something that’s worth to point out.
and nothing in the lore is ‚needed‘ but that’s also an argument only ever used against LGBTQ+ inclusion and nothing else.
LGBTQ was not banned from forms. Discussions on sexual topics were. Which included LBTQ yes. but also all sexual topics. It also didn't help that LBTQ is a social movement and they likely did not want to get involved. Now said social movement is far more accepted, they have now flipped on their stance and changed an existing character so they can say they were on this side from the start. As you said they originally did not want to discuss this topic in a game that had nothing to do with it, which is fine but have now flipped on this stance for publicity. Thus I said weird and forced.
Also you say that nobody has taken issue with any previous relationship but that is not actually quite true. When the wraith x nurse cosmetics were first introduced there were many discussions like this one, with people opposing the idea of sexualising killers in this game. This is not something new with David. The reason why some people took issue the wraith x nurse and David is because they drew attention too it on social media.
They should have added the lore and left it.
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No... until leatherface is fixed I'm just going to opt out of the match thanks
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@Mooks said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2931116#Comment_2931116
Were you speaking out when they forced to not include anything LGBTQ+ related while including heterosexuality though? Or is this argument only being used when it’s about supporting LGBTQ+?
and having had a heterosexual relationship doesn’t imply someone is heterosexual. As you said, actually MANY homosexual people have had heterosexual relationships in their past. This is actually making the story more believable and relatable.
Don’t focus too much on one tweet, or are you analyzing every one of their tweets like this? You are the one concentrating on this topic while BHVR has tweeted many other things since then, eg a concept artwork of the twins because they also have a tome story in this rift.
Yes... if a tweet was made celebrating a non LBTQ+ characters sexuality I would also call it weird and awkward?
In a game based around one person one person killing another it is unneeded.
Yes the tweet does matter, otherwise they could have just put it in the lore and we wouldn't even be having this discussion. It was a marketing decision to draw attention to how much they care about representation. Representation is good, which is why I take no issue with men women of all backgrounds ect. However when they use people's identities for a publicity stunt, I take issue with that.
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@ThatOneDemoPlayer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2931079#Comment_2931079
A God loop can also consist of Windows entirely, just like nearly every house of Haddonfield
Ok fine. You got me.
We will have maps that consists of infinites and dead zones. That way there will be places that if survivors go the killer auto wins and places that if the survivor goes they auto win. You said it yourself dead zones are great, amazing game design.
So are you happy with that or will you now take issue with this?
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@Mooks said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2930895#Comment_2930895
straight relationships are actually mentioned way more often than people give it credit for:
Nurse and her husband
Frank and Julie in their tome lore (which was on the edge of being disgusting and definitely being shoved down our throats)
David having had a girlfriend (turns out he is not straight, but that was still a heterosexual relationship in the lore)
Felix and his pregnant wife
Oni is the direct ancestor of Spirit thus implied to have had a wife
Dwight having a crush on a female coworker (though admittedly this one is pretty low on the list)
Ace referred to as womanizer no some cosmetics
Wraith and Nurse having (romantically) implied cosmetics/texts
other characters in lore:
multiple parents explicitly stated as father and mother (Jake, David, Spirit, Trapper (not sure about his mother mentioned), Hillbilly, Meg (pretty sure her father is mentioned), for others I guess it’s mostly one parent mentioned and thus not explicitly heterosexual)
Pretty sure other relationships in tome/background stories (shout out to the one gay relationship in one of Haddies story’s i think - which didn’t get any further announcement by BHVR)
keep in mind many of these were added while BHVR stated they want to leave sexuality completely out of the game - while actually including heterosexuality and excluding only anything LGBTQ+ related.
Right: so including even just a mild implication of of a relationship, including Wraith/ nurse which purely cosmetic, and Oni which does not even mention a partner. You listed 10 examples. One of which is Nurse who you used twice and the second is David, who is now homosexual. Which is exactly what I said. Out of the 10 you listed only one had his sexuality publicly celebrated (David). The developers wanted David to be gay, and they wanted to make sure everybody knows it. Which is why I said forced and awkward.
What makes it so awkward is that as you yourself stated it was already implied that he was straight. They then changed it. Now I understand that there are plenty of people who have dated one gender, and later felt more comfortable dating another, his lore makes sense. However it is hard to get an understanding of characters if you imply one thing and then change it years down the line.
You said it yourself Behaviour wanted to keep sexuality out of DBD and I fully support this. Which is why I am not interested in the lore but rather the tweet that Behaviour sent out to draw attention to this. Everything about this situation is forced and unsortable.
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@ThatOneDemoPlayer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2931047#Comment_2931047
I don't think we're talking about the same type of loops.
Getting hit at a God loop is nigh impossible, unless you're bad.
Yes, Cowshed is a Map based around being constantly safe. It's littered with God loops.
I'm sorry you can't loop effectively but God loops are structures where Survivors are 100% safe
A god loop requires either a pallet or breakable wall. Once said pallet or breakable wall is used it is no longer a god loop. So now you are arguing that survivors should be able to add pallets as the match progress correct. Or was this just poorly thought out?
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@ThatOneDemoPlayer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2930959#Comment_2930959
Do you know how a good Killer plays like?
They never chase a good Survivors around a God loop/Pallet/Window (unless they're Nurse), which leads to them leaving chase, or what you call it: Survivors escaping 100% of the time
Yeah.. you're not really in any position to discus what a good killer is.
I asked for a area in maps where if I a survivor reach I will escape 100% of the time, assuming.
Your first example was to say cowshed. That is not what I said at all. Unless you meant main building. Which would be just wrong.
Your second example to say "good killers hit survivors and leave." That does not address my point at all.
Really can you at least try to answer my question. Or even better, reflect and maybe consider that I might have a point. Or will you change the goalposts a third time?
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@ThatOneDemoPlayer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2930414#Comment_2930414
Play on The Game, Badham, Fractured Cowshed, any Crotus Penn Map, even New Haddonfield has a bunch of God loops
Yeah... I have. Where are these 100% guaranteed safe zones. A good loop can be broken by killer so... not guaranteed safe.
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Who are these straight characters? Can you please tell me where it is stated in their lore they are straight?
Off the top of my head less then maybe 10 out of a full roster of close to 50 I think are even mentioned to have a partner. I cannot think of anyone else (besides David KIng) too have their sexuality directly mentioned. If somebody can tell me which character and show me what lore that would be great. However there is not many. Instead of adding it into the law they felt the need to make a big public tweet about it to make sure everyone knows. Its forced, awkward, and in unnatural.
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@Valik said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2929788#Comment_2929788
You have half a dozen of what are some of the strongest structures in the game stacked back to back with pallets and now it's all tears and water works about the single-pallet playground and crossing the street.
The map is almost unwinnable with many M1 and mobility constrained killers if the middle generators are prioritized. So long as you deny the 4/3 gen and split the last few, there's precious little that could be done by all but the most mobile and deadly of killers - such as Nurse and Blight.
Sure, a Bubba may catch you out if you run into a street, but with god vaults and so many pallets around the houses, is it really so hard to force a killer to chase you for that long?
My solution to maps is to create tiles that allow for input for both sides to demonstrate their skill.
Your solution is creating places in maps for killers to auto win chases to both artificially inflate their rank and ego. Which is why so many killers are struggling.
If your beating survivors not due to skill but because the map is giving you an auto win, your not really skilled are you?
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Oh massively. Its largely because new killers don't understand what toxic is. For example doing generators really well is not bullying or toxic its just playing the game well. Yet they will do that and turn around and say "well you genrushed." Its also part of the mindset of if the doesn't say its a rule then its fine. As if the idea of just general etiquette does not exist.
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@Crowman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2930414#Comment_2930414
Haddonfield has reuseable vaults in the houses with long fences that are really strong on top of having many strong pallets. It's fine if there are areas of the map that don't have anything to use since the map already has a lot of strong resources for survivors to take advantage of.
No. Balanced would be if an area of a map exists where survivors go down 100% of the time. Then an area where they escape 100% exists.
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@ThatOneDemoPlayer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2929788#Comment_2929788
Those areas already exist
Really?
There are areas of a map where if I a survivor reach I will escape 100% of the time. What are they called? Can you give me an example?
@Crowman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2929788#Comment_2929788
It's fine for not every single tile on the map to contain safety. Especially when the map is already filled with many strong tiles.
If not every area of the map has anything to use then players are forced to use the shift w technique. Which is boring for both sides. Also killers do not improve as they did not beat the survivor, they just followed behind until the map killed them.
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Blood echo'
mindbreaker
certain addons
Killers have tools to counter anything in DBD.
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No... the map has basically no loops. Pallets are the only thing survivors have in it. It sounds like you just want an open map with nothing in it. That's awful game design.
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They are toxic. Unfortunately a lot of players are.
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You can only spin a lunge attack, if you are close enough for a base M1 you need to do more of a zigzag.
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@Basement_Bubba420 said:
BHvR is a small indie company. They are trying their bestest.
Behaviour is not as small as it once was. They have been working on DBD for 6 years now (not including design pre release). It should take less then a month to add a search bar option for PC. Its attitudes like your which is why it took them 5 years to add a colour blind option. Which they only added (not because they needed too) but because a viral video went public of one of the developers, scoffing at a question about a time expectation for said feature. It is not difficult, they are lazy.
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What makes DBD extremely awful is how it has be been balanced. Survivor perks use to be insane and extremely strong. They are mainly perks that are available any player starting off and they are the best perks in the game. That's not to say the new survivor perks are bad, but the they are more balanced. By comparison the new killer perks are far stronger then the survivor perks, as killer perks have been getting stronger over time. So new killers will need to buy a lot of DLC to get the better perks, which will require far more time commitment the survivors.
So yeah the New DBD player experience is weird and awful.
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So just having portions of the map with noting for survivors to use to defend themselves is fair? Also fun?
Can we have areas of the map that killers will always lose survivors in then? Or is that unfair somehow?
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@Notretsam said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2929505#Comment_2929505
doesn't matter what perks I consider skilful, this is about head-on and it doesn't require skill but more importantly, it's an abusable perk that survivors use to bully killers, it should be disabled and redesigned as its meant to be fun for everyone.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2929480#Comment_2929480
that is generally true what you say, everyone does have a different definition of what is fun for them but clearly, head-on is not fun in how it's used. Personally, I play in a way that I believe is fun for everyone and I think head-on takes the fun out of a match for killers, so therefore it needs to be redesigned into something that is less abusable.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2929512#Comment_2929512
the fact you played along with it tells me you be a survivor who would use head-on in an abusable way and confirms that Head-On needs to be disabled and redesigned, you may be fine with it but that doesn't mean every player in-game should be fine with it and they aren't.
The game is meant to be fun for everyone and how Head-On is being used is not fun for most killers, also, my suggested Lock-In perk is actually stronger than head-on as it is more guaranteed.
First of your definition of abuse is extremely loose. You could call just about call anything abuse. So let's give it a definition.
Abuse is to use a perk, not as intended. A perfect example is boil over, with the RPD library.
So what was intended use of head on. Well its to stun the killer. The merit of this is too either A save yourself or B save a teammate. Your situation involved survivors luring you to lockers too then hit you with head on. Thus saving them from you. Not abuse is it? Secondly is it too strong? Well its a 3 second stun and can be baited out (if you don't know how I suggest you watch some killer tutorials. so not exactly strong is it? Lastly just because you struggle as killer, does not make everting automatically abuse.
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@Notretsam said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2929431#Comment_2929431
lol if you think using head-on is a skill, then that is hilarious to me as there is no skill in using Head-On, you wait for a killer to go past a locker they don't know you in and rush out to stun them.
Yup, that is as skilful as a survivor blinding you at a pallet when you are stuck in animation breaking pallet, this was sarcasm encase it not clear :)
Yes... it is. If it wasn't you would be grabbed by the killer. Or you would never get a chance to hit them with it. Being able do that is uncountably skilful. What perks would you consider skilful?
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I said this before on another post and I will say it again.
I would be willing, to let killers see SWF in the pregame lobby so they can adjust their build or dodge if they want. However, only if survivors get to see which killer and what addons they are running, so they can adjust or dodge as well. This fix would mean that sweaty survivors should only go against sweaty killers, and if they don't, it means one side didn't care.
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Dead zones are balanced???
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Dang survivors... using a perk well. Better disable it because... its unfair.
DBD is the only game ever created where the community gets upset because people play well.
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@GoshJosh said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2926483#Comment_2926483
Are you telling me they released a reworked map to live.. with inaccessible totems?!
Again....
LMAO
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DBD does not have a massive playerbase for an online game. The reason that crossplay was introduced to begin was an attempt to artificially decrease que times. PC has the ability to remove cross play and when you do the wait times are long. Yes PC players typically do play better for various reasons but behaviour prioritised fixing massive wait times.
The reason why a second game mode or even a rank and causal game mode is the same. They cannot afford the split the player base.
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Sure, and you like survivors to move at 10% movement speed and start the match of in the dying state? Great meme. Basekit Corupt, XD.
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@GoshJosh said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2924941#Comment_2924941
He is somewhat weak, outside of camping (especially facecamping) and finding survivors in dead zones. Doesn’t excuse him being the only killer in the game that can guarantee a kill by standing still.
Ranking killers is a rather iffy subject, as personal opinion plays a big role. However the fact that most people in the community seem to consider him towards the top, at worst maybe middle tier shows there seems to be some general consensus that he is certainly not weak. His anti loop is extremely strong and his ability to insta down gives him one of the fastest downing speeds in the game. Where his sits on a tier list, is not really important TBH but if you can't at least recognise him at minimum an average killer means you don't play or verse experienced leatherfaces.
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@AndyKuky said:
Bubba is a very weak killer. Against decent survivors, sometimes camping is the only option unless you want an eight minute match where all four escape.
Yesterday I had a match on Blood Lodge where a survivor had three pallets in the middle of the map. Two safe, one 50/50 where I was able to bloodlust and get a hit. But those pallets were right next to the basement, and on their left was the fun bus. Any time I chased three of the survivors, they ran to this area. Imagine how long I would have to chase in order to wear down just this one part of the map. Well you don’t need to imagine, I did it, they did three gens while I chased a Laurie around all of that. And after those three pallets, the fun bus, running the shack window and the god pallet, the fun bus was close to an LT tike with another pallet, and then they dead harded to the main two story building with a window and another 50/50 pallet and that’s where I finally downed her. Literally the only two places where counterplay and mind games were possible, and I succeeded at both, but still lost three gens (basically four) because the tiles are so strong and Bubba is so weak.
The basement was in the main two story building so you bet I hooked her there and camped her to death. And guess what? Survivors are so overly altruistic, they popped the fourth gen soon after the hook but then they stopped doing gens so try and save and I got a 3k 😆
The fact you unironically called him weak is very telling.
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@ArchAbhor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2923740#Comment_2923740
None of this disproves that coms gives a heavy advantage. You are only stating that better players will play better. Which is obvious and im not disputing. You are try to use it as a strawman for some reason. I'll bring most of these in to a different light so you can understand it better. The currency in this game is time spent in the match. Which the killers time is 4x as valuable since there are 4 survivors. So anytime spent doing something other then gens is invaluable for balance. This is about time here not player skill in both scenarios swf on coms and solo q of equal skill. coms win matches because of everything I stated.
- This is about time here not player skill. Skill has nothing to do with gaining information. you still have to traverse the map or have eyes on each gen or the killer. You spend time doing this, swf on comes does not, or at the very least way less time. Once again back to the time currency thing. Assuming that the survivors are all efficient on gens, them gaining the info needed during the match will be time not on gens. More likely then not they wont all be skilled or have other motives then what a coordinated swf would the swf still haveing lower skill and all. They could be prioritizing a challenge or greeding things that other team members could do or get easier. Like saves, the call that you are going for the save or if you are being chased saves the team on hook states or time on gens. One example is in solo q if more then one player hops off a gen they are both going for the save 2 people not on gens when only one was needed. So the one that didnt get the save will run until the unhook happens or sees the other player. Another is that they prioritize gens, no one goes for the save in time and the survivor on hook gets to second stage. All of which can be done more efficiently with coms. This gives you zero perspective at my skill level as killer. Stop acting like you know how good i am and keep to the arguments. Maybe if you did that you'll bring better ones.
- Once again you basically agreed with me that a swf on coms breaks up a 3 gen better. It is an indisputable fact that holding down a 3 gen wins games for killers. When if they were split its an automatic loss. A 2 gen 2 gen split is almost always a loss against a good team who slammed gens. Where as a locked down 3 gen can spin into the favor of the killer. You act like holding down a 3 gen requires you to just be there and not go anywhere else in the match. I decide when i need a 3 gen but i will always take note of where they are that way i can shift my tactic. Once again a swf on coms wins more times then a solo q in this situations because they know what gens to pressure and when faster. Time is currency. You offered no good counter arguments to this.
- Very rare or not my argument still stands and I already said that meta team is worse then this. You didnt counter my argument about them being able to not use a bunch of perks to make way for the meta ones. My argument is coms make this much more doable because they can coordinate it. Not that its rare or not. That its a thing period. It proves how powerful a swf with coms can be. You have no arguments here and you are still trying to gaslight me. You do not get to claim to know my experience with this game or my bias. The only thing that I let you in on in the previous comment is I play solo q. I show no bias and I'm only stating facts which you cant even counter properly. So my bias is showing? For what solo q? You're just butthurt that I'm making better arguments and cant counter them. Thats why in every section instead of bringing any good arguments you take tiny jabs, with no evidence to give them any kind of weight.
- You are still going on about bias's as if it matters in a well made argument. I favor no side here, I want balance for solo q and killer. Swf breaks this. Camping tunneling and slugging are valid tactics and the killer doesnt have to abide your imaginary rules. So yes back to your previous statement. You are giving me that coms make this easier then solo q. Once again you offer no arguments here. I dont like when killers are doing these tactics early in the match it makes it miserable for the survivors but its still a valid tactic. I think something should be done about camping and tunneling at 5-3 gens, but swf is a much bigger issue that throws a wrench in balance. Once thats sorted, sure implement a mechanic so that it is not as favorable to do for the killer. As for right now the killer has no idea what the team is. SWF or solo q, good or bad, So for a killer to do these thing because if they play "nice" swf will punish it. Swf exclusively creates this scenarios outside of killers who would do this anyways. Which not knowing if its a swf or not will make some killers play more scummy, and the ones who feel this the most are solo q. So inadvertently the swf is hurting solo q here too.
- In a high level game where a killer mistake can cost you the game. Getting that one hit you wouldnt normally get can be a deciding factor in a match. This by itself tells me a. you are survivor main or b. do not play high level killer. A good player still does not have the ability to prep for every tactic in chase. The reason why lo pro are brought up is because you treat billy differently at a pallet based on whether or not they have it. Which will either grant a hit or down or take it away. Once again time is currency for the killer especially against good teams swf or not, and swf have that advantage in chase faster in the match. So why at top level do you see mainly Nurse and Blight? You still havent disproven this. It still stands as an argument that coms completely change the game in the favor of the swf regardless of skill.
You still havent disproven any of my arguments and all of my points small or big are indeed advantages that coms give and theres a lot. In a game where at high level one mistake by the killer can cost you the game. You take all that efficency that coms give and you are acting like it isnt enough to sway games. You are either doing this because you arnt experienced enough at the game or for malicious/selfish reasons. If you are Malicious, you are gaslighting people and are taking little jabs at me now. You dont want your edge taken away from you because when you arn't playing with other players you cant a. bully people. or b. win reliably. You are butthurt because I called you out on your bias and just trying to throw it back at me with no merit. When in fact I've said nothing but facts that you still havent countered in any way. I've said nothing that favors either side in any particular way. In fact its solo q thats hurt most by this. Not killer.
Yes it does. My point has been from the beginning that SWF does not offer the advantage that everybody wants it too, so they can justify their losses. You are clearly a low skilled buthurt killer that wants to throw all of the blame on his loss on SWF. The fact is, there is now way to figure out how many SWF you face every game. Yet anytime a killer goes up against an efficient team it's just (SWF) dang communication, because its an easy excuse. You want to remove the individual skill of each player so you can find something to blame your losses. "If only they didn't have communication, then I would have won for sure." I never said communication doesn't offer an advantage because it does in literally every online game, however in DBD it matters far less, because of how DBD is less a teamwork based game and more an individual based game. The fact is you have no idea what goes on SWF, and I find it sad when killers like yourself throw a tantrum because me and my friend want to play DBD together. We just want to chat about week while play some game in the background. YOU ARE NOT VERSING ELITE SURVVIORS. Everybody wants all SWF to be some pro team with callouts but most players just want to chill and have fun. The few that are the "Elite teams" are so skilled they don't need the callouts because all the information is accessible to those who pay attention. Guess what I can figure out what addons a killer is running without my friend telling me, its called "experience."
Your arguments are so weak, your first point is basically "Callouts are unfair" completely ignoring that the initial post I made I outlined that most killers have no issue is solo q getting in game macros for the same thing. So not really an advantage.
Your second is 3 gen "you agreed with me that swf makes it easier to break 3 gens." Yes.... I never said it didn't. What I said from the beginning is that experienced survivors don't need it, I can figure out where the gens are without my SWF, it's called learning the game. Maybe your new to this concept? So not a real advantage. Also your lack of understanding of why 3 gen strategy falls apart against skilled survivors, is really telling of yourself.
Your third "SWF can pull off sabo strategy." THAT'S YOUR ARGUEMENT. That is the big issue with SWF, that they can pull of a sabo strategy? You really base your entire mindset off survivors always running the same perks don't you? Killers always say "another 4 man meta perks" you would think that if SWF allows you to run weaker but different builds you would rejoice. YES FINNALY SWF, because there is at least a chance they might run something weaker and more interesting. Survivor run meta, killer unhappy, survivor run non meta, killer unhappy. Your bias is so blatant is suffocating. You will never be happy unless survivors are perk less and run at 10% movement speed.
Your 4th is just disgusting. Killer's can do whatever they want, no matter how strong, how abusive, how unfun and how toxic. Because it's their objective. But when survivors respond in kind you just about cry. That comes from your own words "You are still going on about bias's as if it matters in a well made argument. I value fun more then anything else, and I want that for survivors and killers. You on the other hand could not care less unless you have your easy victory. By your own words you consider SWF a bigger issue then camping and tunnelling. Not allowing players to play the game is less important then people playing really well. You have such a toxic mindset and could not care less about fun.
And lastly your point about robbing some hit or something, which you have no idea if t hat's the case. You don't know what they were running half the time, you have no idea what they saw, or how observant they are. But you tell yourself this to inflate your ego. I would have gotten that hit, if they didn't tell their teammate I had lo pro chains. Except they watched you break pallet a long time ago and is in solo Q. But you want to tell yourself this so you can tell yourself you are better then you actual are.
My initial post was asking for specific examples on what benefits players have other then the vague fallback point of "Communication." When I point out I don't need SWF for that, you say "but its easier with SWF, I say yes... but I don't need it. All that means is your going against survivors that need SWF to play then you are versing bad survivors and if you can't deal with this, then you are not as good as killer as you think you are. You want to impact on SWF because they are good, so that you can artificially feel like your better then you are. Whether SWF or solo, if you cannot learn to deal with this level of skill, that's fine, but that does not mean the entire game needs to be lowered to your level.
You do not need to respond. You clearly have this entitled mindset, and want to surrounded by a bunch of equally unskilled players telling each other how hard it is. If SWF was gone, you would complain about shack or main building ect. You are here to be validated, not make an argument. This conversation is dead.
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@CluelessWanderer said:
That's not so bad. I usually get stuck with the Wraiths that slug me as the last survivor, and even though they could easily hook me, just ring their bell over and over for the entire 4 minutes of me bleeding out just because.
That's genuinely toxic. My situation was not more not exactly toxic, but extremely sweaty and unfun.